# Ramieri jaw implants



## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

Does Ramieri know how to design good-looking custom jaw implants that fit the patient's face? I ask because I don't really know how to design implants so I would have to trust the surgeon. He's pretty new to implants, right? Not very experienced yet? All other comments about Ramieri are welcome too. 

@Gaia262 @TheLordMadness @politically correct


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## valhalar (May 22, 2022)

He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.

Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).

I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.
> 
> Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).
> 
> I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


Yeah, I'm not writing him off because of his lack of experience. I just don't know much about him so I mentioned everything that I know about him.

I consider Yaremchuk and Ramieri. Dr. Y uses silicone I think, Ramieri uses PEEK. Dr. Y knows how to design implants, but he's a bit old - though he has younger assistant surgeons (or whatever those are called, fellows?). 

What about the post-operation care with Ramieri? What if the implant gets infected, is the removal or revision free?


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## valhalar (May 22, 2022)

Yeah from what I have read Dr. Y's jaw implants are well designed. Defrancq's ones seem average from a few reviews I saw. 

Has Ramieri posted many implant results? I know he is doing infraorbital implants now which is interesting. Apparently Pagnoni is good at implants, at least infra, so you could always consult him too.

I have no idea about revision costs, however it's pretty standard for doctors to charge nothing for revision except for maybe anaesthetic cost (idk how it is in Italy, maybe they would just write that part off)


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> Yeah from what I have read Dr. Y's jaw implants are well designed. Defrancq's ones seem average from a few reviews I saw.
> 
> Has Ramieri posted many implant results? I know he is doing infraorbital implants now which is interesting. Apparently Pagnoni is good at implants, at least infra, so you could always consult him too.
> 
> I have no idea about revision costs, however it's pretty standard for doctors to charge nothing for revision except for maybe anaesthetic cost (idk how it is in Italy, maybe they would just write that part off)


Defrancq isn't very experienced with implants. Also, he has some sketchy history according to some users here. 

Ramieri hasn't posted many results. Here is one of his designs, I think it's @Gaia262 's implant.


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## valhalar (May 22, 2022)

If you are just doing a jawline implant like that I cannot imagine he would fuck you up tbh. My ideal scenario would be to get a plan from Dr. Y and then say I am not doing it. Then I would have a good idea of what I wanted from a surgeon who uses peek.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> If you are just doing a jawline implant like that I cannot imagine he would fuck you up tbh. My ideal scenario would be to get a plan from Dr. Y and then say I am not doing it. Then I would have a good idea of what I wanted from a surgeon who uses peek.


I don't have a strong preference for implant material - implant design (shape and size) and surgeon's skill seem more important than whether it's silicone, medpor, or PEEK. 

Yes, I only want a jaw implant. Actually not a jawline implant ("wraparound") but a jaw angle implant. 

Also tagging experts @RealSurgerymax @Win200


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## Deleted member 18840 (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> If you are just doing a jawline implant like that I cannot imagine he would fuck you up tbh. My ideal scenario would be to get a plan from Dr. Y and then say I am not doing it. Then I would have a good idea of what I wanted from a surgeon who uses peek.


Ramieri is only a lower third surgeon?
No orbital implants?


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## valhalar (May 22, 2022)

Ohh if it's only a jaw implant and not a wrap around then don't even bother with Dr. Y

You will honestly be fine with Ramieri then. They simply recreate the angles and aesthetic from good skulls.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> Ohh if it's only a jaw implant and not a wrap around then don't even bother with Dr. Y
> 
> You will honestly be fine with Ramieri then. They simply recreate the angles and aesthetic from good skulls.


I will ask how much a jaw angle implant from Ramieri would cost. Dr. Y has a proven track record, although some people have had infections. Ramieri is a newcomer to implants.

Yep, it's only a jaw angle implant, not a wraparound.


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## valhalar (May 22, 2022)

Yes, because silicone is more prone to infection. Avoid silicone.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> Yes, because silicone is more prone to infection. Avoid silicone.


Is this true? If I remember correctly some have claimed that infection risk is similar with all implant materials.


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Does Ramieri know how to design good-looking custom jaw implants that fit the patient's face? I ask because I don't really know how to design implants so I would have to trust the surgeon. He's pretty new to implants, right? Not very experienced yet? All other comments about Ramieri are welcome too.
> 
> @Gaia262 @TheLordMadness @politically correct


I had mine put in on monday so I'm currently 6 days post

General thesis is:
- Damn was I not prepared mentally for the extent of the swelling that occurs post jaw implants. Its probably triple what I was expecting which is a big mind game because you have no idea what the result is going to look like for at least a month probably
- Dr Ramieri is clearly a super genuine and smart guy, I have complete trust in him
- While I can't 100% tell you that I'm happy with my result as my face still looks like a balloon, I can tell that what's underneath is in line with expectation and early indications are good
- I don't think its true that he's new to implants. Bare in mind this is not a common surgery globally, its quite a niche thing so most surgeons save a select few dont do this often. But Dr R told me he has done 25-30 of these procedures which relatively is a lot.
- My general instinct is that if you are most likely to be happy if you are not going for an extreme result, as there is way more room for error. The more extreme your design and difference to your underlying bone structure, the more uncertain it is how it will look once your soft tissue is placed on top of the implants.
- He spends a lot of time asking you detailed questions about what you are going for. If you show him examples of jaws you like and jaws you dont like (would highly recommend spending as much time focusing on what you dont want) then he can work out what to do
- Dr R seems very balance and harmony focused which is re-assuring, he's not the kind of guy who would ever perform a surgery that he thinks would look bad
- No matter the doctor or amount of discussion, the result will never look identical to what's in your head, best to accept that


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> I had mine put in on monday so I'm currently 6 days post
> 
> General thesis is:
> - Damn was I not prepared mentally for the extent of the swelling that occurs post jaw implants. Its probably triple what I was expecting which is a big mind game because you have no idea what the result is going to look like for at least a month probably
> ...


Thanks! You had a wraparound implant (from the left jaw angle to the right jaw angle via chin)? It was €10 000?


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Thanks! You had a wraparound implant (from the left jaw angle to the right jaw angle via chin)? It was €10 000?


not wraparound, just extended jaw/mandible, I have a seperate implantech chin implant in


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> not wraparound, just extended jaw/mandible, I have a seperate implantech chin implant in


So left and right jaw angles and that was 10 000 euros?


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> So left and right jaw angles and that was 10 000 euros?


Correct, but this doesnt include cost of medicines such as antibiotics etc

Also just FYI Ramieri does all revisions completely free of charge. He's also great and gives you his personal number post operation and will answer as many of your questions as you want, and if you prefer he will check on you multiple times per week in person, he's great at making time for his patients


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Correct, but this doesnt include cost of medicines such as antibiotics etc
> 
> Also just FYI Ramieri does all revisions completely free of charge. He's also great and gives you his personal number post operation and will answer as many of your questions as you want, and if you prefer he will check on you multiple times per week in person, he's great at making time for his patients


How much is the total cost all included except travel?


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> How much is the total cost all included except travel?


Probs 10.5k EUR, plus hotels etc and food in Rome for 2 weeks.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Probs 10.5k EUR, plus hotels etc and food in Rome for 2 weeks.


You had to stay there for 2 weeks?


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## Gaia262 (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Defrancq isn't very experienced with implants. Also, he has some sketchy history according to some users here.
> 
> Ramieri hasn't posted many results. Here is one of his designs, I think it's @Gaia262 's implant.




Yeah Dr Ramieri isn't the most experienced at iimplants but he is a hidden gem imo, he did an amazing job with my infraorbital malar implants and the other users who had them after look great.

I'm uploading my jaw implant video next month so you can see it's design and I will try to get him to show it on the surgical after table.


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## Boldandbeautiful (May 22, 2022)

Gaia262 said:


> Yeah Dr Ramieri isn't the most experienced at iimplants but he is a hidden gem imo, he did an amazing job with my infraorbital malar implants and the other users who had them after look great.
> 
> I'm uploading my jaw implant video next month so you can see it's design and I will try to get him to show it on the surgical after table.


Gaia after your extractions did you look noticeably worse while your ortho closed the gap? 

And has Dr.Ramieri given you any info on the dimensions of the implant, you have thick skin so it would need to be relatively large and you should ask if he can do lipo of your Submental at the same time.


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## Boldandbeautiful (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I ask because I don't really know how to design implants so I would have to trust the surgeon.


Bring him a morph. That's the least amount of effort you can put it...


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## Gaia262 (May 22, 2022)

Boldandbeautiful said:


> Gaia after your extractions did you look noticeably worse while your ortho closed the gap?
> 
> And has Dr.Ramieri given you any info on the dimensions of the implant, you have thick skin so it would need to be relatively large and you should ask if he can do lipo of your Submental at the same time.



Yes the extractions and retraction before surgery made a significant difference on my face (old man gummy look) . You can see this on my main video when I'm talking. This is then fixed after the surgery and the jaws are moved forward.

He hasn't given me the dimensions of the implant yet. When I consulted with him I did discuss not to be overly large and masculine.

I will ask for the submental lipo but I don't think he does it.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

Boldandbeautiful said:


> Bring him a morph. That's the least amount of effort you can put it...


Yes, I have morph-like pictures.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Also just FYI Ramieri does all revisions completely free of charge.


Do I understand correctly, that for example if the implant is too small (or big), Ramieri will free of charge replace it with a bigger (or smaller) implant? 

The thing that worries me most is the design part. Dr. Y knows how to design implants. He doesn't take patient input in design process, but that's fine because I don't want to give input. I don't know if Ramieri knows how to design implants. I'm not saying he can't: I simply don't know. But some people have had good results with him. 

Maybe I consult with Dr. Y and Ramieri and then compare their designs?


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

O


Wallenberg said:


> You had to stay there for 2 weeks?


Yes so he can monitor you and deal with any possible hematoma or infection


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## Deleted member 7098 (May 22, 2022)

well, what a return, went from promoting trans propaganda in offtopics everday to actually striving to achieve your aesthetic goals. nice to have you back


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Do I understand correctly, that for example if the implant is too small (or big), Ramieri will free of charge replace it with a bigger (or smaller) implant?
> 
> The thing that worries me most is the design part. Dr. Y knows how to design implants. He doesn't take patient input in design process, but that's fine because I don't want to give input. I don't know if Ramieri knows how to design implants. I'm not saying he can't: I simply don't know. But some people have had good results with him.
> 
> Maybe I consult with Dr. Y and Ramieri and then compare their designs?


If you give him the thumbs up on a design, and he implements your decision, then I believe that if you are not happy it will be your own expense to fix it as ultimately doing this type of surgery would be completely uneconomical for him otherwise. It's an art not a science and to an extent its impossible to know exactly what a given design will look like once your soft tissue is placed on top. This is why I caution you not to expect perfection and to have realistic expectations. When I designed mine I showed him my goal, he made the design and then I said to him 'now please make it 10-20% smaller just to be sure that I don't go too far with it'

He will pay for any revisions due to a complication for example

Knowing him though, I think if you were truly unhappy with your designs, he would probably give you a significant discount or charge it to you at cost to fix (although this is an assumption on my part based on my knowledge of him as a guy, he hasnt told me this). If this is the case I would guess that a revision would cost c.2000-3000 euros, because the hospital fee in rome is c.1000, and assume the implants are a couple of thousand to produce


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> well, what a return, went from promoting trans propaganda in offtopics everday to actually striving to achieve your aesthetic goals. nice to have you back


If you would have a jaw implant, which surgeon would you choose? Aren't you interested in jaw implants too?


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> If you give him the thumbs up on a design, and he implements your decision, then I believe that if you are not happy it will be your own expense to fix it as ultimately doing this type of surgery would be completely uneconomical for him otherwise. It's an art not a science and to an extent its impossible to know exactly what a given design will look like once your soft tissue is placed on top. This is why I caution you not to expect perfection and to have realistic expectations. When I designed mine I showed him my goal, he made the design and then I said to him 'now please make it 10-20% smaller just to be sure that I don't go too far with it'
> 
> He will pay for any revisions due to a complication for example
> 
> Knowing him though, I think if you were truly unhappy with your designs, he would probably give you a significant discount or charge it to you at cost to fix (although this is an assumption on my part based on my knowledge of him as a guy, he hasnt told me this). If this is the case I would guess that a revision would cost c.2000-3000 euros, because the hospital fee in rome is c.1000, and assume the implants are a couple of thousand to produce


I understand. Yes, I realize that implants have their limits, and predicting the exact outcome is impossible.

Is the implant making a positive difference in your looks?


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## Deleted member 7098 (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> If you would have a jaw implant, which surgeon would you choose? Aren't you interested in jaw implants too?


Ramieri is well up on my list as i trust his aesthetic eye. Only thing that concerns me with him is that he uses peek, which is a bitch to correct if he doesn't nail it first try, and the relative lack of experience compared to Eppley and Y. He's significantly cheaper than those two though + Eppley produced a bunch of hideous results, so long year experience doesn't necessarily equate to good results imo.

currently looking into a few turkish surgeons doing it, but they are all relatively new to it, but offer significantly lower prices


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I understand. Yes, I realize that implants have their limits, and predicting the exact outcome is impossible.
> 
> Is the implant making a positive difference in your looks?


Right now I look like a chipmunk, I've lost all definition in my face and I have huge puffy cheeks and a fat watery neck

But, I am 6 days post surgery and am totally swollen, type in 'eppley jaw implant swelling' into google, or watch Dr Dhirs implant video on youtube and they both explain that this procedure is a huge mind game as it makes you look a lot worse immediately after surgery and takes weeks/months to see the result

That said, I can feel my implant and see the edge of where the contours willbe once the swelling subsides, and indications are that it will look very good once done

I would like to emphasise that im a somewhat atypical case on this forum as I was good looking before surgery to be honest, and have done bits of modelling over the years (small ticket commercial stuff) so I really didn't need a big implant I just wanted to lower my gonions a little bit and add a few mm of width


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I understand. Yes, I realize that implants have their limits, and predicting the exact outcome is impossible.
> 
> Is the implant making a positive difference in your looks?


To be honest, I'm of the opinion that it's best to just pick a surgeon and go for it. Ultimately its a degree of luck because 1 surgeon might give 6/10 people a better result than other surgeons and a second surgeon might produce a better result for the other 4, but some people will spend forever deliberating and never actually get anything done.

Ramieri is 1) affordable and 2) has a good aesthetic eye and 3) couldn't be a nicer human being, so is a safe bet. Best to go conservative with him, and you almost definitely will look a lot better than you do now even if you dont look perfect

Then at least if you choose to replace the implants say in 2-3 years, you at least have a reference point now of 'here are my old designs, and I'd like a little more here and a little less here, to get me from X to Y'


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> Ramieri is well up on my list as i trust his aesthetic eye. Only thing that concerns me with him is that he uses peek, which is a bitch to correct if he doesn't nail it first try, and the relative lack of experience compared to Eppley and Y. He's significantly cheaper than those two though + Eppley produced a bunch of hideous results, so long year experience doesn't necessarily equate to good results imo.
> 
> currently looking into a few turkish surgeons doing it, but they are all relatively new to it, but offer significantly lower prices


I consider Yaremchuk and Ramieri. Y has a proven track record and knows how to design implants. For example, @Win200 's implant done by Y is great. There have been some infections, but that's a risk with implants.

I haven't really seen results from Ramieri's jaw implants. However, some people seem to like his results.

Then there is Zhang in California, who is a student of Y think. She has written a book on facial implants with Y and has done at least one jaw implant. Younger than Y. But doesn't seem very experienced with jaw implants.

At this point, I don't consider Eppley, at least not now. I trust Y's implant designing skills more. I don't trust Defranq.


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> Ramieri is well up on my list as i trust his aesthetic eye. Only thing that concerns me with him is that he uses peek, which is a bitch to correct if he doesn't nail it first try, and the relative lack of experience compared to Eppley and Y. He's significantly cheaper than those two though + Eppley produced a bunch of hideous results, so long year experience doesn't necessarily equate to good results imo.
> 
> currently looking into a few turkish surgeons doing it, but they are all relatively new to it, but offer significantly lower prices


What do you mean by 'bitch to correct ifhe doesn't nail it the first try'

I only ask because my right-side implant when he placed it was placed perfectly on the corners but shifted 1-3mm (we can feel it through the swelling but not see it) off the mandible at the front. Dr R said he can fix it for me if I want but suggested I wait as he said it basically wont be visible or effect the result aesthetically at all, it just means that if I run my finger along my mandible I feel a little 'lump' or 'notch' where it transitions from bone to implant. He said the only person who will know will be me, but If I want he can go back in, unscrew the implant and tweak it. I decided against this as if it doesnt effect the look I dont care and more surgeries means more recovery and a risk of an infection


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## Deleted member 7098 (May 22, 2022)

politically correct said:


> What do you mean by 'bitch to correct ifhe doesn't nail it the first try'


due to it's structure, peek leads to a significant tissue and bone ingrowth once fully healed, which is not something that would happen with a silicone/titanium implant. The more your tissue grew into the implant the harder and more invasive will it be to remove it for what ever reason later on. Peek has two significant advantages though, it feels like bone and specifically due to the tissue ingrowth it will be more secured in place compared to one just held in place with screws, like silicone/titanium.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> due to it's structure, peek leads to a significant tissue and bone ingrowth once fully healed, which is not something that would happen with a silicone/titanium implant. The more your tissue grew into the implant the harder and more invasive will it be to remove it for what ever reason later on. Peek has two significant advantages though, it feels like bone and specifically due to the tissue ingrowth it will be more secured in place compared to one just held in place with screws, like silicone/titanium.


Isn't tissue in growth problem with medpor, not PEEK?


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## Deleted member 7098 (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Isn't tissue in growth problem with medpor, not PEEK?


it's a problem with both, but you're right, it's a bigger one with medpor compared to peek, but both have ingrowth.
medpor e.g. isn't meant to be removed, ever. gives you a hint of how much of a struggle it is to remove an implant that has tissue ingrowth.


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> it's a problem with both, but you're right, it's a bigger one with medpor compared to peek, but both have ingrowth.
> medpor e.g. isn't meant to be removed, ever. gives you a hint how much of a struggle it is to remove an implant that has tissue ingrowth


Some South Korean surgeons use bone mass, which isn't very common in the west. But they don't doo many jaw implants I think.

I think I will consult both Y and R and check what they think about my implants. Maybe compare their plans then.


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## Deleted member 7098 (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Some South Korean surgeons use bone mass, which isn't very common in the west. But they don't doo many jaw implants I think.


Most of the south koreans choose a jaw narrowing over an implant, retarded sense of aestethic. As they don‘t strive for masculinity


Wallenberg said:


> I think I will consult both Y and R and check what they think about my implants. Maybe compare their plans then.


Sounds like a plan. Keep us updated


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## politically correct (May 22, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> it's a problem with both, but you're right, it's a bigger one with medpor compared to peek, but both have ingrowth.
> medpor e.g. isn't meant to be removed, ever. gives you a hint of how much of a struggle it is to remove an implant that has tissue ingrowth.


I suspect this isn't a huge problem with PEEK, simply because PEEK is completely non-porous and nonreactive, also, whether the bone even has anywhere to 'grow into' depends a lot on how your implant is designed, I don't think mine wrap round the whole mandible so I would assume that they should come off pretty easily, but I may be wrong


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## heighmaxxerxd (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.
> 
> Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).
> 
> I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


what can you do to counter the gonial angle decrease with a chin wing? side wing?


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## heighmaxxerxd (May 22, 2022)

valhalar said:


> He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.
> 
> Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).
> 
> I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


what surgeon would you recommend for bimax and rhino? in europe?


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## heighmaxxerxd (May 22, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Defrancq isn't very experienced with implants. Also, he has some sketchy history according to some users here.
> 
> Ramieri hasn't posted many results. Here is one of his designs, I think it's @Gaia262 's implant.



what is wrong with defranq?


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## Wallenberg (May 22, 2022)

heighmaxxerxd said:


> what is wrong with defranq?


I don't trust his judgment. I haven't seen good results from him. Some people here have reported problems with him.


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## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

politically correct said:


> I had mine put in on monday so I'm currently 6 days post
> 
> General thesis is:
> - Damn was I not prepared mentally for the extent of the swelling that occurs post jaw implants. Its probably triple what I was expecting which is a big mind game because you have no idea what the result is going to look like for at least a month probably
> ...


Can you share your design?


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## TheLordMadness (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Does Ramieri know how to design good-looking custom jaw implants that fit the patient's face? I ask because I don't really know how to design implants so I would have to trust the surgeon. He's pretty new to implants, right? Not very experienced yet? All other comments about Ramieri are welcome too.
> 
> @Gaia262 @TheLordMadness @politically correct


For my case tbh i personally designed the implants. His first design wasn’t that good
Unfortunately he does not saddle infraorbital implants, i really like the zygo but the orbits aren’t that great tbh, jaw is ok but i had masseter dislocation (complication that happen sometimes while doing jaw implants).
Imo he isn’t that experienced with implants, but he is still an ok option, he hardly overdo and botch


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## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> For my case tbh i personally designed the implants. His first design wasn’t that good
> Unfortunately he does not saddle infraorbital implants, i really like the zygo but the orbits aren’t that great tbh, jaw is ok but i had masseter dislocation (complication that happen sometimes while doing jaw implants).
> Imo he isn’t that experienced with implants, but he is still an ok option, he hardly overdo and botch


OK. I'm interested in a jaw angle implant. What were the problems with his first design?


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## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Can you share your design?


See here: https://looksmax.org/threads/opinions-on-my-peek-jaw-implant-design.485427/#post-7983987


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## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

politically correct said:


> See here: https://looksmax.org/threads/opinions-on-my-peek-jaw-implant-design.485427/#post-7983987


nice, thanks


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## TheLordMadness (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> OK. I'm interested in a jaw angle implant. What were the problems with his first design?


Too low gonial angle and weird shape of the gonions, but my case was quite complicated beacuse i had some bumps on the mandible (due to jaw surgery)


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## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> Too low gonial angle and weird shape of the gonions, but my case was quite complicated beacuse i had some bumps on the mandible (due to jaw surgery)


Are you happy with your jaw implants now? Did they improve your looks?


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Are you happy with your jaw implants now? Did they improve your looks?


As the other guy mentioned it’s never 100% as expected. But in general yes i look better especially from 3/4


----------



## Deusmaximus (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> As the other guy mentioned it’s never 100% as expected. But in general yes i look better especially from 3/4
> View attachment 1694438
> 
> View attachment 1694439
> ...


Looks great! Would you mind sharing a before picture?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

for those who want to go with jaw implants / wraparound / gonials just make sure you take this in consideration:

We have more skin/fat/muscle on our jaw angles, whereas we only have a thin layer of skin and not really any fat or muscles lying over your bizygomatic width area so the actual implant gonial can fall a few millimeters shy of being the same width as the bizygomatic and your jaw will still end up looking just as wide as your bizygomatic area. - this in case where you think that the bigonial width its too big in comparasion to your bizygomatic width

i have to revise my implants because i didnt knew this






you welcome


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> for those who want to go with jaw implants / wraparound / gonials just make sure you take this in consideration:
> 
> We have more skin/fat/muscle on our jaw angles, whereas we only have a thin layer of skin and not really any fat or muscles lying over your zygion area so the actual implant gonial can fall a few millimeters shy of being the same width as the zygion and your jaw will still end up looking just as wide as your zygion area. - this in case where you think that the bigonial width its too big.
> 
> ...


Who was your surgeon?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Who was your surgeon?


for me? or for that guy?


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> for me? or for that guy?


I meant you but you can answer for both


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I meant you but you can answer for both


me - pags
that guy - eppley

Pags(like most surgeons do) like to go conservative. Be careful, you need to control the surgeon, not the other way around or you will end up looking with not the results you wanted.


----------



## randomvanish (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> for those who want to go with jaw implants / wraparound / gonials just make sure you take this in consideration:
> 
> We have more skin/fat/muscle on our jaw angles, whereas we only have a thin layer of skin and not really any fat or muscles lying over your bizygomatic width area so the actual implant gonial can fall a few millimeters shy of being the same width as the bizygomatic and your jaw will still end up looking just as wide as your bizygomatic area. - this in case where you think that the bigonial width its too big in comparasion to your bizygomatic width
> 
> ...


so are you saying create a bigger gap to achieve "bigonial distance * 0,9 = bizygomatic distance " ratio?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

randomvanish said:


> so are you saying create a bigger gap to achieve "bigonial distance * 0,9 = bizygomatic distance " ratio?


pretty much, yes. I thought 90% its the best for me at least but it wasnt because I reached that threshold but in reality it was lower than 90% because of the muscle thickness and other things which are in the jaw muscle.

you have to go a little bit above that so you will end up with exactly 90%


also make sure your gonials are not lower than your lower lip, in most cases it doesnt look good, it looks too roblox type, its better and safer to be at upper lip level or even higher a bit


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I meant you but you can answer for both


that's an eppley design


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> pretty much, yes. I thought 90% its the best for me at least but it wasnt because I reached that threshold but in reality it was lower than 90% because of the muscle thickness and other things which are in the jaw muscle.
> 
> you have to go a little bit above that so you will end up with exactly 90%
> 
> ...


i don't get it. where are you supposed to create the bigger gap?


----------



## Deusmaximus (May 23, 2022)

Never get a jaw implant with a small mouth. Thats rule number 1.


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

Deusmaximus said:


> Never get a jaw implant with a small mouth. Thats rule number 1.


just stay incel theory


----------



## Deusmaximus (May 23, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> just stay incel theory


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

Deusmaximus said:


> View attachment 1694630


most retarded implant size I've ever seen. looks like you maxed out the stats on a character designer in a video game


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 23, 2022)

Deusmaximus said:


> Looks great! Would you mind sharing a before picture?















This is before

@Gaia262 @MoeZart @Deusmaximus @Wallenberg @CristianT


----------



## StrangerDanger (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> for those who want to go with jaw implants / wraparound / gonials just make sure you take this in consideration:
> 
> We have more skin/fat/muscle on our jaw angles, whereas we only have a thin layer of skin and not really any fat or muscles lying over your bizygomatic width area so the actual implant gonial can fall a few millimeters shy of being the same width as the bizygomatic and your jaw will still end up looking just as wide as your bizygomatic area. - this in case where you think that the bigonial width its too big in comparasion to your bizygomatic width
> 
> ...


Who's the guy at the top in the image?


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> View attachment 1695037
> View attachment 1695039
> 
> View attachment 1695041
> ...


looked good already, was this after bimax and genio?


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 23, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> looked good already, was this after bimax and genio?


Yes

This is before every surgery:
@Wallenberg
@MoeZart


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> Yes
> 
> This is before every surgery:
> @Wallenberg
> ...


life-fuel. from subhuman birdcel to HTN/chadlite


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> me - pags
> that guy - eppley
> 
> Pags(like most surgeons do) like to go conservative. Be careful, you need to control the surgeon, not the other way around or you will end up looking with not the results you wanted.


What do you think of Pagnoni?

I know what I want, but I don't know about technical details regarding implants. I mean stuff like how many millimeters it should project etc.


----------



## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> As the other guy mentioned it’s never 100% as expected. But in general yes i look better especially from 3/4
> View attachment 1694438
> 
> View attachment 1694439
> ...


This looks good man, how was your swelling experience?

If mine looks somwhat like this I'll be happy, one difference is I asked him for my implant to sort of bend outwards and have concavity whereas yours is more dead straight

I'd be interested to see your designs?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I What do you think of Pagnoni?
> 
> I know what I want, but I don't know about technical details regarding implants. I mean stuff like how many millimeters it should project etc.


I dont even know what to think anymore about him. Im feeling very depressed and i stay all day in bed. Implants were very small, its like nothing changed, very small improvements. I thought he would knew better.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> I dont even know what to think anymore about him. Im feeling very depressed and i stay all day in bed. Implants were very small, its like nothing changed, very small improvements. I thought he would knew better.


Too bad. Are you going to him again??


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Too bad. Are you going to him again??


Probably yes... This time I will lead design measurements...


----------



## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

Deusmaximus said:


> View attachment 1694630


All jokes aside the problem here is too extreme designs not a small mouth

Those cheek implants....wow


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Probably yes... This time I will lead design measurements...


How much it was?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> How much it was?


16,500


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> 16,500


Jaw angles or wraparound?


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Who made this?


A guy from reddit


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Jaw angles or wraparound?


Both jaw angles and infras


----------



## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> View attachment 1695037
> View attachment 1695039
> 
> View attachment 1695041
> ...


You naturally seem to have really thin skin and like 0 bodyfat on your face/neck, is that natural or did you have any form of lipo?


----------



## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

If thats your worry why dont you just get any surgeon to design your implant then get people on this forum to help you tweak it?


Wallenberg said:


> What do you think of Pagnoni?
> 
> I know what I want, but I don't know about technical details regarding implants. I mean stuff like how many millimeters it should project etc.s


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

politically correct said:


> If thats your worry why dont you just get any surgeon to design your implant then get people on this forum to help you tweak it?


I might do that


----------



## politically correct (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> I dont even know what to think anymore about him. Im feeling very depressed and i stay all day in bed. Implants were very small, its like nothing changed, very small improvements. I thought he would knew better.


Can't getting botox to your masseters help you 'uncover' your implants? Could be a cheap workaround?


----------



## Looksmax25 (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Probably yes... This time I will lead design measurements...



Man I feel bad you didn't get a good result with Pags, he did a good job on my bimax and I'm getting zygos with him... but I'm going big on them, 7mm max projection


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I might do that


i wouldn‘t trust the 90% of autistic teenage virgins on here


----------



## Wallenberg (May 23, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> i wouldn‘t trust the 90% of autistic teenage virgins on here


Good point.


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> He’s not charging you full price, correct? Obviously you’ll have to pay the clinic and anesthesiologist fees.


Full price


----------



## Deleted member 7098 (May 23, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Full price


What a dickhead. You‘re getting scammed


----------



## CristianT (May 23, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> What a dickhead. You‘re getting scammed


Yes.. i am.


----------



## Deleted member 19576 (May 23, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> Yes
> 
> This is before every surgery:
> @Wallenberg
> ...



Damn this shit is real ascension.


----------



## heighmaxxerxd (May 23, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I don't trust his judgment. I haven't seen good results from him. Some people here have reported problems with him.


thanks bro i kinda got a bad feeling with him aswell


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 24, 2022)

politically correct said:


> This looks good man, how was your swelling experience?
> 
> If mine looks somwhat like this I'll be happy, one difference is I asked him for my implant to sort of bend outwards and have concavity whereas yours is more dead straight
> 
> I'd be interested to see your designs?


After 3 weeks i was human like but still swollen, now i’m 3 months after surgery and im like 90% done with swelling. I think 2 months is were u start to see the real result.
My design wasn’t straight actually, in fact it’s weird that looks straight, but as i told before implants never look like as the design when the surgery is done, u never know how soft tissue reacts


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 24, 2022)

politically correct said:


> You naturally seem to have really thin skin and like 0 bodyfat on your face/neck, is that natural or did you have any form of lipo?


Yes i have genetic thin skin and low bf. I had no surgery for skin, just retinoids and skin care


----------



## eyebagcel (May 24, 2022)

CristianT said:


> I dont even know what to think anymore about him. Im feeling very depressed and i stay all day in bed. Implants were very small, its like nothing changed, very small improvements. I thought he would knew better.


tbh i don’t think the implant was too small, i think he just didn’t place it correctly in your face. eppley says he doesn’t do intraoral for saddle implants due to how hard they are to place, which makes sense because you can barely see the rim of the orbits when looking through the mouth

look at this video of a cheek implant with an intraoral approach and you’ll see what i mean



https://m.youtube.com. /watch?v=JqpO8UgvjbM&t=706s


----------



## Oberyn (May 24, 2022)

CristianT said:


> pretty much, yes. I thought 90% its the best for me at least but it wasnt because I reached that threshold but in reality it was lower than 90% because of the muscle thickness and other things which are in the jaw muscle.
> 
> you have to go a little bit above that so you will end up with exactly 90%
> 
> ...


I didn't get it if there is muscle/fat why you should go a little bit above? Shouldn't you go below?


----------



## randomvanish (May 24, 2022)

CristianT said:


> I dont even know what to think anymore about him. Im feeling very depressed and i stay all day in bed. Implants were very small, its like nothing changed, very small improvements. I thought he would knew better.


what happened? can you send pre/post-op privately via dm?


----------



## CristianT (May 24, 2022)

eyebagcel said:


> tbh i don’t think the implant was too small, i think he just didn’t place it correctly in your face. eppley says he doesn’t do intraoral for saddle implants due to how hard they are to place, which makes sense because you can barely see the rim of the orbits when looking through the mouth
> 
> look at this video of a cheek implant with an intraoral approach and you’ll see what i mean
> 
> ...



Neah. Infras are put correctly. I am pretty sure. I can feel them in the right spot. Its just to small implants..thats all


----------



## Wallenberg (May 24, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Neah. Infras are put correctly. I am pretty sure. I can feel them in the right spot. Its just to small implants..thats all


I thought you had jaw implants? are you happy with them?


----------



## CristianT (May 24, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> I thought you had jaw implants? are you happy with them?


I had both. And no im not happy with neither.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

CristianT said:


> I had both. And no im not happy with neither.


What's the problem with jaw implants? Are they too small too?


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Eppley uses silicone implants which are notoriously hard to place correctly. PEEK on the other hand is not as hard. It’ll practically click in to the underlying bone.


The truth is completely the opposite. Silicone is softer and easy to place.


----------



## StrangerDanger (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Regarding the saddle, I believe I know why it didn’t work for Christian but out of respect for a friend of mine, I can’t reveal that at this moment.


reveal it


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Who told you this?


Yaremchuk wrote an article where he mentioned it. And besides, it's general knowledge...



https://www.binasss.sa.cr/abr22/19.pdf


----------



## Oberyn (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Regarding the saddle, I believe I know why it didn’t work for Christian but out of respect for a friend of mine, I can’t reveal that at this moment.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Holy shit, you are dense. Notice how in the second index of the table it say ease of removal.
> 
> And then in the article itself it says, “Silicone rubber has a smooth surface and is relatively flexible making implant placement and removal beneath the soft tissue envelope easier.”
> 
> He’s not referring to the ease of ‘*correct* placement’. Of course silicone is easy to place. It’s flexibility makes it possible to fit into the smallest of incisions.


Silicon is easy to place and remove. 

When talking about jaw implant placement, of course they talk about correct placement... 

You were wrong.


----------



## Anchor_Ship (May 25, 2022)

Very based thread on implants unfortunately I need jaw surgery first


----------



## CristianT (May 25, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> What's the problem with jaw implants? Are they too small too?


yeah


----------



## CristianT (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Eppley uses silicone implants which are notoriously hard to place correctly. PEEK on the other hand is not as hard. It’ll practically click in to the underlying bone. I personally prefer the intraoral approach due the adverse scar tissue that can occur with lower lid incision’s.
> 
> Regarding the saddle, I believe I know why it didn’t work for Christian but out of respect for a friend of mine, I can’t reveal that at this moment.


I know why everything failed. 

I already talked with Pagnoni and he agreed with everything I said regarding why I don't like the results.


----------



## Deleted member 16834 (May 25, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> For my case tbh i personally designed the implants. His first design wasn’t that good
> Unfortunately he does not saddle infraorbital implants, i really like the zygo but the orbits aren’t that great tbh, jaw is ok but i had masseter dislocation (complication that happen sometimes while doing jaw implants).
> Imo he isn’t that experienced with implants, but he is still an ok option, he hardly overdo and botch



If you could go back in time and do anything differently what would it be ?


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> I’ve seen more poorly placed silicone implants than I care to admit.
> 
> I’m not going to waste my time with you.
> 
> ...


You are wrong and you simply don't want to admit it.

I trust Dr. Yaremchuk. Ease of placement refers to correct placement. We are talking about implants and correct placement is crucial... It affects aesthetics and improving aesthetics is the goal of plastic surgery.


----------



## politically correct (May 25, 2022)

Seperate question for this thread. I've already had submental liposuction and buccal fat removal, but is there any other kind of facial fat removal you can do (especially on jawline/cheeks)? I've seen pictures of a face that's been opened up to perform a facelift (see image below) where you can see a load of fat. Is it possible to have this removed?


----------



## Gaia262 (May 25, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Seperate question for this thread. I've already had submental liposuction and buccal fat removal, but is there any other kind of facial fat removal you can do (especially on jawline/cheeks)? I've seen pictures of a face that's been opened up to perform a facelift (see image below) where you can see a load of fat. Is it possible to have this removed?
> View attachment 1698539



@deepweb1298 can help with this. If I recall he had work to make his face leaner.

One of the procedures I think it's called morpheous 8


----------



## politically correct (May 25, 2022)

Gaia262 said:


> @deepweb1298 can help with this. If I recall he had work to make his face leaner.
> 
> One of the procedures I think it's called morpheous 8


Thank you sir


----------



## CristianT (May 25, 2022)

eyebagcel said:


> tbh i don’t think the implant was too small, i think he just didn’t place it correctly in your face. eppley says he doesn’t do intraoral for saddle implants due to how hard they are to place, which makes sense because you can barely see the rim of the orbits when looking through the mouth
> 
> look at this video of a cheek implant with an intraoral approach and you’ll see what i mean
> 
> ...



Also, Pagnoni said right after I woke up from surgery - when he inserted the saddle in the surgery he said and I quote: "The infras on the saddle it was a perfect match, I would not even need to put the screws and would stayed fixed; However I did put the screws'.

You don't say that out of the blue if it wasnt true.


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 25, 2022)

alienmaxxer said:


> If you could go back in time and do anything differently what would it be ?


Normal genio rather than minichinwing, infraorbital implants with saddle


----------



## Deleted member 16834 (May 25, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> Normal genio rather than minichinwing, infraorbital implants with saddle



@AscendingHero you were right about genio over minichin wing


----------



## AscendingHero (May 25, 2022)

alienmaxxer said:


> @AscendingHero you were right about genio over minichin wing


*Im right most of the time arent I? *


----------



## RealSurgerymax (May 25, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Eppley uses silicone implants which are notoriously hard to place correctly. PEEK on the other hand is not as hard. It’ll practically click in to the underlying bone. I personally prefer the intraoral approach due the adverse scar tissue that can occur with lower lid incision’s.
> 
> Regarding the saddle, I believe I know why it didn’t work for Christian but out of respect for a friend of mine, I can’t reveal that at this moment.





Wallenberg said:


> The truth is completely the opposite. Silicone is softer and easy to place.



Silicone - easy to put in, hard to put in correctly. Also more likely to move in the jaw angles area under the masséters. Even with screws, the screw will slowly rip through the silicone and the implant will ride up.

Peek - harder to put in, but you either put it in correctly or not at all.

Custom silicone implants dont snap into place or give the tactile feedback that they are placed correctly. 90%+ of all silicone implant are not placed 100% correctly.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

RealSurgerymax said:


> Silicone - easy to put in, hard to put in correctly. Also more likely to move in the jaw angles area under the masséters. Even with screws, the screw will slowly rip through the silicone and the implant will ride up.
> 
> Peek - harder to put in, but you either put it in correctly or not at all.
> 
> ...


Good that you clarified. I was wrong.

Do you have opionion on Yaremchuk vs Ramieri? Yaremchuk uses silicone, Ramieri uses PEEK.


----------



## RealSurgerymax (May 25, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Good that you clarified. I was wrong.
> 
> Do you have opionion on Yaremchuk vs Ramieri? Yaremchuk uses silicone, Ramieri uses PEEK.


Both good surgeons but I’m not doing surgeon rating on a public forum


----------



## Anchor_Ship (May 25, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Good that you clarified. I was wrong.
> 
> Do you have opionion on Yaremchuk vs Ramieri? Yaremchuk uses silicone, Ramieri uses PEEK.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 25, 2022)

RealSurgerymax said:


> Both good surgeons but I’m not doing surgeon rating on a public forum


Yeah, I understand. But is the surgeon or his implant design more important than the implant material? In other words, how much weight would you put on silicone vs PEEK when choosing a surgeon?


----------



## RealSurgerymax (May 26, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Yeah, I understand. But is the surgeon or his implant design more important than the implant material? In other words, how much weight would you put on silicone vs PEEK when choosing a surgeon?


Silicone fine for most places but I don’t think it’s sturdy enough for tight areas like jaw angles and supraorbital 

Both matter. Most run of the mill surgeons can’t so much as place a chin implant correctly.


----------



## CristianT (May 26, 2022)

Eppley strikes again. Its from the reddit guy who went to Eppley recently. He seems to fuck it up so often, you would expect much more to be honest.. SM is right, silicone it can be easily missplaced cause that explains why Eppley has so many cases of misspositioned of the implant.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 26, 2022)

RealSurgerymax said:


> Silicone fine for most places but I don’t think it’s sturdy enough for tight areas like jaw angles and supraorbital
> 
> Both matter. Most run of the mill surgeons can’t so much as place a chin implant correctly.


Interesting. Yaremchuk and Ramieri aren't run-of-the-mill surgeons. But I'm not sure how much Y operates versus his fellows? But then again his fellows are probably skilled surgeons.

I'm interested in a jaw angle implant. I have seen great results from Y. So far Y has been my number 1 choice, but you make me doubt it because of silicone. Right now Ramieri is my second choice. I haven't had consultations yet (I have already sent the consultation fee to Y so I'm waiting until they receive it).


----------



## Wallenberg (May 26, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Eppley strikes again. Its from the reddit guy who went to Eppley recently. He seems to fuck it up so often, you would expect much more to be honest.. SM is right, silicone it can be easily missplaced cause that explains why Eppley has so many cases of misspositioned of the implant.


Link to the topic.


----------



## CristianT (May 26, 2022)

Wallenberg said:


> Interesting. Yaremchuk and Ramieri aren't run-of-the-mill surgeons. But I'm not sure how much Y operates versus his fellows? But then again his fellows are probably skilled surgeons.
> 
> I'm interested in a jaw angle implant. I have seen great results from Y. So far Y has been my number 1 choice, but you make me doubt it because of silicone. Right now Ramieri is my second choice. I haven't had consultations yet (I have already sent the consultation fee to Y so I'm waiting until they receive it).


He is old and rich. Im pretty sure his PhD operates instead of him. Thats why @Adrenochrome doesnt want to go with him, again.


----------



## Wallenberg (May 26, 2022)

CristianT said:


> He is old and rich. Im pretty sure his PhD operates instead of him. Thats why @Adrenochrome doesnt want to go with him, again.


Doesn't his fellows change every 1-2 years?


----------



## politically correct (May 26, 2022)

Word of caution to listen to your doctors. I'm 10 days post and thought it would be ok to eat a really chewy meal right after a cryotherapy session which had tightened up my masseter muscle. Ended up tweaking my muscle which bled and caused a pretty big hematoma which I had to pay 100euros for an ultrasound on and then have it drained with a needle because my face had swelled up to double the size. Not fun...


----------



## ilovelamp08 (May 26, 2022)

valhalar said:


> He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.
> 
> Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).
> 
> I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


If I get bimax it's gonna be with ramieri. He's the best imo


----------



## politically correct (May 27, 2022)

PapiMew said:


> Make sure you do proper aftercare for the hematoma so it breaks down correctly and doesn’t turn into a lump of scar tissue


Such as? Is there a high risk of infection with hematoma?


----------



## TheLordMadness (May 27, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Word of caution to listen to your doctors. I'm 10 days post and thought it would be ok to eat a really chewy meal right after a cryotherapy session which had tightened up my masseter muscle. Ended up tweaking my muscle which bled and caused a pretty big hematoma which I had to pay 100euros for an ultrasound on and then have it drained with a needle because my face had swelled up to double the size. Not fun...


Are you sure is not an infection? I had an infection on my right masseter after implants, my right side of the face was yellow and double swollen than the left side


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## politically correct (May 28, 2022)

TheLordMadness said:


> Are you sure is not an infection? I had an infection on my right masseter after implants, my right side of the face was yellow and double swollen than the left side


No its a hematoma for sure, I out of nowhere got a mad cramping on my right hand size and literally within 30 mins (i'd left Dr Ramieri's office maybe 2 hours prior after a check-in) my face exploded on 1 side and was rock-hard, Dr Ramieri did an ultrasound and said it was hematoma, he drained it

2 days later, my left side is now a bit more swollen than the right but im otherwise back to normal.

When you got your masseter infection, how did you fix/treat it?


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## TheLordMadness (May 28, 2022)

politically correct said:


> No its a hematoma for sure, I out of nowhere got a mad cramping on my right hand size and literally within 30 mins (i'd left Dr Ramieri's office maybe 2 hours prior after a check-in) my face exploded on 1 side and was rock-hard, Dr Ramieri did an ultrasound and said it was hematoma, he drained it
> 
> 2 days later, my left side is now a bit more swollen than the right but im otherwise back to normal.
> 
> When you got your masseter infection, how did you fix/treat it?


1 months or two different antibiotics


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## russiancel (May 28, 2022)

CristianT said:


> pretty much, yes. I thought 90% its the best for me at least but it wasnt because I reached that threshold but in reality it was lower than 90% because of the muscle thickness and other things which are in the jaw muscle.
> 
> you have to go a little bit above that so you will end up with exactly 90%
> 
> ...


u think would I ascend with gonion implants? To me, my bizygo are too narrow and I should choose zygo arch implants since gonion ones would make my face uncanny af


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## russiancel (May 28, 2022)

MoeZart said:


> What a dickhead. You‘re getting scammed


that's why I'm scared of implants. In additional, I'm fcking poorcel and thus imagine save up money for about 2 years and get botched eventually . So literally bones and some fillers on top or nothing unless you are richcel (although there are quite a few of them on here...). Maybe in 10-20 years implants will be kinda better, cheaper, and there will be much more surgeons that perform them. Except some users like @TheLordMadness @Gaia262 (who were somewhat truecels before their surgeries) there are no any well-designed implants


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

russiancel said:


> u think would I ascend with gonion implants? To me, my bizygo are too narrow and I should choose zygo arch implants since gonion ones would make my face uncanny af


Can't lie dude, most people go through surgeries just to get to look like you do now. You have probably an 8/10 lower third as is.


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

General update. I'm 2.5 weeks post. Swelling down massively so I can now get a sense of the result

Result, they look good. Only issue is, I regret massively asking him to make them 20% smaller. His implants look HUGE on the designs he sends but are way smaller in person.

As a result, while it's an improvement I feel like it's only taken me 60% of the way in terms of what I was trying to acheive. I think that I should have:

Dropped the gonion more (maybe 2-3mm)
Has a more exaggerated outsweep at the gonion to give a sharper corner than pushes through the soft tissue
To acheive 2. would also need to maybe add 1-2mm width on each side at the gonion
To summarise 1) and 2) i'd have had it slightly more like thiswhere the gonions are swept out more (maybe 50% of the way between my original design and what you can see in the below diagram) [the below is not my design]





m


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

@Gaia262 did you finalise your designs now? If so I would seriously consider the above before doing so, evenif you have to pay extra to get them re-done. From your pics you have a lot of soft tissue like me, I too wanted a conservative result but even I feel like I've undercooked this even though it does look good


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## Gaia262 (Jun 2, 2022)

politically correct said:


> @Gaia262 did you finalise your designs now? If so I would seriously consider the above before doing so, evenif you have to pay extra to get them re-done. From your pics you have a lot of soft tissue like me, I too wanted a conservative result but even I feel like I've undercooked this even though it does look good



Hi bro this is my design its been sent off to be printed, im quite ok with a smaller design to be honest. I know he made some changes before he sent them off most likely making it bigger then what is below. I honestly feel the smaller designs for jaw implants are the way forward and will have a longer time appeal.

Mines quite similar to yours.






Autodesk Viewer | Free Online File Viewer


Autodesk Viewer is a free online viewer for 2D and 3D designs including AutoCAD DWG, DXF, Revit RVT and Inventor IPT, as well as STEP, SolidWorks, CATIA and others.




autode.sk


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

Gaia262 said:


> Hi bro this is my design its been sent off to be printed, im quite ok with a smaller design to be honest. I know he made some changes before he sent them off most likely making it bigger then what is below. I honestly feel the smaller designs for jaw implants are the way forward and will have a longer time appeal.
> 
> Mines quite similar to yours.
> 
> ...


Yeah totally get your thoughts, I'm just now in 2 minds because I feel like I only got half the result I wanted.


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## Wallenberg (Jun 2, 2022)

@politically correct interesting that you wanted the surgeon to downsize the implant because usually, surgeons tend to be conservative (maybe Eppley is an exception).


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## russiancel (Jun 2, 2022)

politically correct said:


> Can't lie dude, most people go through surgeries just to get to look like you do now. You have probably an 8/10 lower third as is.


look at here bro -> https://looksmax.org/threads/what-implants-could-ascend-my-face.509165/#post-8360121 that's me unfrauded


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## CristianT (Jun 2, 2022)

going small on jaw gonials implants is the worst. its better to look a little bit uncanny in pictures(because IRL this will look normal) than to have a small implant and look pretty much the same as you were before.


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## bogii (Jun 2, 2022)

Gaia262 said:


> Hi bro this is my design its been sent off to be printed, im quite ok with a smaller design to be honest. I know he made some changes before he sent them off most likely making it bigger then what is below. I honestly feel the smaller designs for jaw implants are the way forward and will have a longer time appeal.
> 
> Mines quite similar to yours.
> 
> ...


bro hopefully you'll ascend tremendously, I look forward to the results 😍


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## Wallenberg (Jun 2, 2022)

CristianT said:


> going small on jaw gonials implants is the worst. its better to look a little bit uncanny in pictures(because IRL this will look normal) than to have a small implant and look pretty much the same as you were before.


Yeah when I get an implant I will choose to make it bigger if in doubt.


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## Sir Galachad (Jun 2, 2022)

valhalar said:


> He doesn't have a long history with implants, but I wouldn't write him off because of that. Eppley has been doing them his whole life, is called a "master", and is producing horrendous results.
> 
> Ramieri seems to have a good eye for aesthetics and seems quite ethical and careful. For example, he offered his beautiful chin procedure (a mini-chin wing) which did produce very nice results from the front. However, he quickly stopped offering it because it was creating a step off in the mandible. A lot of surgeons would just keep offering sub-par procedures if it is making them money, (like Zarrinbal and Brusco with the chin-wing which destroys your genial angle).
> 
> I think if a surgeon has a good aesthetic instinct they can produce good implant results. I tend to think the best implants are small ones.


How does a Chin-wing even affect the gonial angle?


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

russiancel said:


> look at here bro -> https://looksmax.org/threads/what-implants-could-ascend-my-face.509165/#post-8360121 that's me unfrauded


You do not need implants.....


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## politically correct (Jun 2, 2022)

CristianT said:


> going small on jaw gonials implants is the worst. its better to look a little bit uncanny in pictures(because IRL this will look normal) than to have a small implant and look pretty much the same as you were before.


I still look improved, so the result is good. As I said it's just '60% of the way there'


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## Pagnonisavemyeyes (Oct 11, 2022)

CristianT said:


> Yes.. i am.


Why don't you just go to another surgeon?


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## Acromegaly_Chad (Yesterday at 3:15 AM)

TheLordMadness said:


> As the other guy mentioned it’s never 100% as expected. But in general yes i look better especially from 3/4
> View attachment 1694438
> 
> View attachment 1694439
> ...


Lifefuel look at these results @Carpediem @Zenturio


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## Zenturio (Yesterday at 5:44 AM)

Acromegaly_Chad said:


> Lifefuel look at these results @Carpediem @Zenturio


I hope I wont need implants for that. TRIMAX needs to be enough


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## madcap88 (Yesterday at 7:00 AM)

Dr. Y is good option


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## Improver (Yesterday at 7:21 AM)

madcap88 said:


> Dr. Y is good option


No he is not unless he doesn’t do the design part


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## madcap88 (Yesterday at 7:26 AM)

Improver said:


> No he is not unless he doesn’t do the design part


He doesn't do it anyway. Most of them don't. They contract out 3dSystems. So does eppley


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## Improver (Yesterday at 9:13 AM)

madcap88 said:


> He doesn't do it anyway. Most of them don't. They contract out 3dSystems. So does eppley


I was referring to the measurements/giving input to the engineers part. Yaremchuk and pretty much all surgeons don’t know/care about that and it can be seen in his website’s designs and results


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## madcap88 (Yesterday at 9:15 AM)

Improver said:


> I was referring to the measurements/giving input to the engineers part. Yaremchuk and pretty much all surgeons don’t know/care about that and it can be seen in his website’s designs and results


Oh yea, what I had to with Dr. Y is prepare/give him a document where I outlined what I wanted to make sure it's all symmetric and what I want.

They have the surgical skill but I have yet to meet a surgeon who is truly an artist.


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