# Final decision: Getting my midface implants revised/enhanced in March



## SurgerySoon (Oct 26, 2019)

I had custom midface and chin implant surgery back in March 2019, and some of you may recall that over the last few months, I've been debating back-and-forth over whether I should go back to Dr. Y to have the midface implants either enhanced with an additional 2-3 mm-thick layer of silicone or revised completely. I know that most of you have told me to just leave well enough alone and focus on fixing my eye area, but I have decided to go back in March 2020 to have my midface implants enhanced with an additional layer of silicone. I will also be having the rest of the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me placed as well.

While I definitely think my midface looks improved as compared to what it looked like pre-surgery, I just want a more noticeably chiseled appearance. At 3.5 mm of augmentation and 5.5 mm of augmentation, respectively, on the left and right sides of the face, there's just not enough forward projection to really make the implant work stick out. I also want a bit more lateral projection on the zygomatic arches.

To provide some photo-based justification of why I want the midface implants to be further augmented, see the series of photos below that I just took tonight:



As you can see in the first photo with zero frauding whatsoever in natural lighting, you can see the slightest hint of malar definition in the upper-midface region, but it's just not quite there. At the same time, I think it's easy to see how just a few more mm of forward projection would bring out the (currently slight) degree of definition that's there already and really make it "pop."

Also, in photos two and three, I'm grasping the soft tissues that lie over my zygos and pulling them forward by maybe 3 mm at the most to give you an idea of how a bit more augmentation could create a more angular, chiseled look.

Yes, I know that the eye area is very subhuman, but it's important that I leave the eye area surgeries for last since any surgeries that are performed via a lower eyelid incision (such as midface implant surgery) are likely to compromise the results of any eyelid procedures that Dr. Taban will perform.

Also, I realize that this is an autistic thing to fixate on, but I've wanted this surgery for WAY too long (since 2012) to not be fully satisfied with the results. Another way to look at it is like this -- since a few more mm of augmentation would really make my face look more masculine and chiseled, it's almost like I'm leaving a lot of looksmaxxing potential on the table to NOT go back and have the implants touched-up. And since I'll be getting the rest of my jaw implant placed anyways, it shouldn't be too expensive since it will technically just be an add-on procedure.

Anyways, I realize this is one of those tl;dr outpourings, but I just had to get this off my chest. Most people I know IRL (including those who know I've had surgery) honestly tell me they can't even tell the difference except when I'm in certain lighting conditions and/or after I've lost a bunch of temporary water weight.

Have a good rest of your weekend

(BTW, the redness/irritation above my upper lip is from Retin-A use)


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## Deleted member 1862 (Oct 26, 2019)

@cocainecowboy we need you now more than ever


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 26, 2019)

aut0phobic said:


> @cocainecowboy we need you now more than ever



I'm not getting my implants augmented to try and get some sort of unnatural look that won't fit my face -- it's basically a case of me recognizing that I would objectively look better with a bit more projection of the implants themselves. In other words, I think the morphology/design of the implants is solid -- they just don't push forward enough. I'm also not expecting a bit more midface definition to turn me into a slayer. It's just that I've wanted this for so long that I personally want to be able to look in the mirror and say "Damn, I finally got what I was going for."


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## Deleted member 2227 (Oct 27, 2019)

What is really wrong in your face is 



EYES


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

OwlGod said:


> What is really wrong in your face is
> 
> 
> 
> EYES



I agree, but I also want to get the results I was originally going for in the first place with my midface implants. Then I'll be heading to CA to see Taban, without a doubt.


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## Deleted member 2527 (Oct 27, 2019)

bro... this is coming from me of all people (almost 10 surgeries now)... your midface implants are perfect right now.

dont do this.

edit: arent you in debt and paying for this on credit too?


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## Gosick (Oct 27, 2019)

lol wtf so your delaying your eye area overhaul for midface revision wtf man. I dont think adding 3mm to your zygos or w,e when they already look more then fine will improve your chances with women, but im very much sure fixing your eyes will.


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## KEy21 (Oct 27, 2019)

Not noticing = good surgery 

Because you look better but nobody can put their finger on it. You don’t want it to be extremely obvious that you have cheekbone implants in.

It’s very obvious you have a mentalcel fixation on it and I know how that is; so you probably won’t be able to stop thinking about it until it’s done.

How much is the revision going to cost? You may be paying disproportionately more than you should for a small enhancement if the revision is expensive. 

Anyway good luck, takes a lot of guts to get multiple surgeries and put thousands of dollars down taking risks regardless.


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## Gosick (Oct 27, 2019)

cant you just inject slight filler into your zygos instead of going for revision?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

facemaxxed said:


> bro... this is coming from me of all people (almost 10 surgeries now)... your midface implants are perfect right now.
> 
> dont do this.
> 
> edit: arent you in debt and paying for this on credit too?



Yes but I will be graduating in May (technically done with school in March, but won't officially graduate until May), and then I will start working and making pretty good money ($100k+) by this summer or early next fall. Also, if I went to Taban instead in March, I would be putting that on credit cards/loans as well, so that point is kind of irrelevant anyways.

Did you see the photo I posted of me standing in the mirror? Do you really not think my midface implants would benefit from a few more mm of projection? Look at photos of Henry Cavill, prime Tom Cruise, random MM's, etc. and notice how they have more midface definition than me. It might be hard for you to imagine it, but trust me, having a bit more definition will look good. As it stands now, my midface hardly looks any different from before. The reason I'm having the implants augmented is because I know it would actually look GOOD to get a bit more projection, not because I just want more projection for the hell of it. In other words, it will be a legitimate improvement over how I look now.




Gosick said:


> lol wtf so your delaying your eye area overhaul for midface revision wtf man. I dont think adding 3mm to your zygos or w,e when they already look more then fine will improve your chances with women, but im very much sure fixing your eyes will.



Yes, I have no choice but to delay the eye area overhaul, because once I get the eye surgeries, I won't be able to do any other midface procedures since future surgeries that involve making an incision in the lower eyelid could ruin whatever Taban does for me. Also, this isn't about improving my chances with women. I just want to have more definition/angularity to my cheeks. That's the goal I set out to achieve when I first decided to get midface implants, so IMO this is simply going one extra step and achieving what I originally set out to achieve.


KEy21 said:


> Not noticing = good surgery
> 
> Because you look better but nobody can put their finger on it. You don’t want it to be extremely obvious that you have cheekbone implants in.
> 
> ...



@KEy21 Thanks. This is how I look at it -- sure, the results are "fine" right now, but at the same time, multiple people have pointed out to me that I actually have the type of face/skull that would look even better with more defined cheeks than I have now (this is what I think as well). If you look at the photo I posted where I'm wearing the green shirt and standing in front of the mirror, you can sort of slightly see some enhanced project around the upper-malar/zygo region. Now imagine if this looked maybe 30-35% more defined and more noticeable. Don't you agree that it would make my face look even better and yet still not look overdone or obviously surgical?

I honestly think it's one of those improvements that most people won't recognize until it's actually been done. Check out these photos below:














Do you notice how even the old-ass, post-prime Tom Cruise on the right has more lateral zygo projection than I currently have? It's nothing crazy, but at the same time, I think you'll agree that you can look at my photos and imagine how another 2 mm (maybe 3 mm) of lateral zygo projection would make me look similarly handsome, in addition to a bit more forward projection as well to make the implants more noticeable but not unnaturally so.

Now imagine that additional angularity and projection around my midface area with a dramatically improved eye area, lower jaw angles (as well as a less-rounded jawline), and maybe a bit more flare-out at the jaw angles, and tell me that my overall appearance wouldn't benefit from additional midface projection. I really think that it will contribute to making my face look more handsome and attractive overall, especially in tandem with everything else I'm going to have done.

Another way to think about it is like this -- I really feel like I'm leaving a lot of looksmaxxing potential on the table by NOT having the midface implants tweaked a bit, especially since I think it's easy to see how they could be changed to improve my appearance even more.

To answer your question, I'm not sure how much the surgery will cost; I'm planning on getting in touch with Dr. Y this week to get more details. Apparently Dr. Y can take an additional layer of generic silicone and place it over the implants, which will avoid the issue of me having to pay for a full revision that involves re-designing and manufacturing totally new implants. However, it might make more sense to just have totally new implants created if it wouldn't be that much more expensive. 

At least I'll also be getting the rest of my jaw implant placed during the same surgery, which will save on costs to an extent. 

BTW, you hit the nail on the head with what you said about it being a mentalcel affliction -- I'm either going to have to get the implants augmented and/or revised, or it's something that's going to bother me forever. I definitely don't want to go to Taban, get a stunning eye area overhaul, and then succumb to my insecurities in a year or two and risk compromising what Taban did for me.


Gosick said:


> cant you just inject slight filler into your zygos instead of going for revision?



Probably, but I really want something permanent. The only issue I have with filler injections is that they're a waste of money in the long run.


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## Dutcher (Oct 27, 2019)

facemaxxed said:


> bro... this is coming from me of all people (almost 10 surgeries now)... your midface implants are perfect right now.
> 
> dont do this.
> 
> edit: arent you in debt and paying for this on credit too?


Hey man i had a question. I am suppose to go with jaw surgery. My lower jaw is recessive. However my upper jaw is the norm and so no one wants to advance it. My question is as follows.

Did the paranasal implant eppley gave your jaw projected look? (Ante face)

Did your chin stay behind?

Was it worth it?


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## Deleted member 2846 (Oct 27, 2019)

wtf ur skin is so good @SurgerySoon skin routine??


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## Deleted member 2581 (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Yes but I will be graduating in May (technically done with school in March, but won't officially graduate until May), and then I will start working and making pretty good money ($100k+) by this summer or early next fall. Also, if I went to Taban instead in March, I would be putting that on credit cards/loans as well, so that point is kind of irrelevant anyways.
> 
> Did you see the photo I posted of me standing in the mirror? Do you really not think my midface implants would benefit from a few more mm of projection? Look at photos of Henry Cavill, prime Tom Cruise, random MM's, etc. and notice how they have more midface definition than me. It might be hard for you to imagine it, but trust me, having a bit more definition will look good. As it stands now, my midface hardly looks any different from before. The reason I'm having the implants augmented is because I know it would actually look GOOD to get a bit more projection, not because I just want more projection for the hell of it. In other words, it will be a legitimate improvement over how I look now.
> 
> ...


You and Tom Cruise have the same zygo projection jfl


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> wtf ur skin is so good @SurgerySoon skin routine??



Thx; I started applying Retin-A (0.1% -- highest strength available) in July 2018 but took a break for about a month this past March after I underwent my first rounds of surgeries. During the summer I injected a round of GHK-Cu (I think 50 mg total over the course of several weeks? Need to go back and review how much I ordered). I have also been doing 20 - 30 minutes of red light therapy directly on my face for maybe 3-ish weeks now, although I don't do it on certain weeknights when I have to get up early. On 10/21, I started applying a hyaluronic acid-based serum with very high concentrations of two peptides (matrixl 3000 50% and argireline 10%), although I'm not sure if it's too early to notice a difference yet.

I also took those photos after running in extremely humid weather, so I sweated a lot during the exercising. Not sure how much that influences how my skin looks in the photos.

At my age I have to do everything I can to collagenmaxx, even if it means potentially risking my health. For example, I ran a cycle of HGH (4-5 IU's/day) for several months starting back in the spring that ended a couple months ago, and I'm planning on ordering more soon.

The day I can no longer pass for "hmm late 20's?" is the day it truly is over for me, regardless of how GL my bone structure ever becomes.

BTW; in the close-up photos, you can see that my skin is actually peeling/shedding a little bit, and my philtrum has been ravaged over the last week by Retin-A (that's why it looks like a rash).


Bobbu flay said:


> You and Tom Cruise have the same zygo projection jfl



I'm telling you, TC has at least several mm more projection than me. He also has more forward projection than I do. Trust me, I was watching Vanilla Sky last night, and I actually paused the movie several times during the scene at the beginning when he was running through the streets so that I could walk up to the TV screen and get an up-close look at his bone structure.


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## Deleted member 2846 (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thx; I started applying Retin-A (0.1% -- highest strength available) in July 2018 but took a break for about a month this past March after I underwent my first rounds of surgeries. During the summer I injected a round of GHK-Cu (I think 50 mg total over the course of several weeks? Need to go back and review how much I ordered). I have also been doing 20 - 30 minutes of red light therapy directly on my face for maybe 3-ish weeks now, although I don't do it on certain weeknights when I have to get up early. On 10/21, I started applying a hyaluronic acid-based serum with very high concentrations of two peptides (matrixl 3000 50% and argireline 10%), although I'm not sure if it's too early to notice a difference yet.
> 
> I also took those photos after running in extremely humid weather, so I sweated a lot during the exercising. Not sure how much that influences how my skin looks in the photos.
> 
> ...


what do u ppl use your age is? and ur skin is god tier. damn, it halos u hard. 

how hard is it to inject ghk-cu. don’t u have to make a serum and shit?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> what do u ppl use your age is? and ur skin is god tier. damn, it halos u hard.
> 
> how hard is it to inject ghk-cu. don’t u have to make a serum and shit?



Over the last few months, most new people I've met IRL have guessed it at either 27 or 28 (I would say there have been an equal number of guesses of both ages). There are occasional outlier guesses, though; one girl in her early twenties guessed my age at 26, and some old ass guy guessed 38. A girl in my class from South America guessed 38-40. Those are probably the two most brutal age guesses I've ever gotten. Luckily for me, the vast majority of people guess 26-28.

LOL when you say it halos me hard, do you mean everything else really does look like shit?

You can actually buy GHK-Cu as either a sterile preparation or as a non-sterile (cosmetic) preparation. The non-sterile preparation is used exclusively for making serums, but the sterile preparation is safe to inject. You just reconstitute the vial with bacteriostatic water, let the solution dissolve, and then do a subcutaneous injection. I guess you could do an IM injection as well, but I just did subcutaneous injections back when I was running it. Planning on ordering more and injecting like 10x as much per day and for a longer cycle.


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## Deleted member 2846 (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Over the last few months, most new people I've met IRL have guessed it at either 27 or 28 (I would say there have been an equal number of guesses of both ages). There are occasional outlier guesses, though; one girl in her early twenties guessed my age at 26, and some old ass guy guessed 38. A girl in my class from South America guessed 38-40. Those are probably the two most brutal age guesses I've ever gotten. Luckily for me, the vast majority of people guess 26-28.
> 
> LOL when you say it halos me hard, do you mean everything else really does look like shit?
> 
> You can actually buy GHK-Cu as either a sterile preparation or as a non-sterile (cosmetic) preparation. The non-sterile preparation is used exclusively for making serums, but the sterile preparation is safe to inject. You just reconstitute the vial with bacteriostatic water, let the solution dissolve, and then do a subcutaneous injection. I guess you could do an IM injection as well, but I just did subcutaneous injections back when I was running it. Planning on ordering more and injecting like 10x as much per day and for a longer cycle.


nah when i say it halos you i mean it makes u look good in general. it’s a positive thing.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

@Bobbu flay Check out the photos of TC below; my zygos don't have nearly as much lateral projection as his:




'






In the second picture, do you see how his zygos project forward more than mine? You can actually see that he has strong cheekbones underneath his skin, whereas it basically looks like I have nothing underneath my skin.


PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> nah when i say it halos you i mean it makes u look good in general. it’s a positive thing.



I appreciate it but I know where I stand. I know I still have a long ways to go.

... And at the same time, every morning I wake up and the first thought that hits me is the question of whether the collagen reaper is going to force-feed me the agepill today, tomorrow, next week, next month, 2 years from now... because I know it will happen eventually, even in spite of my best efforts to ward him off. And what's even scarier is that I have no idea what I'm going to do when I wake up, look in the mirror, and realize that I'm looking at the face of a definitively old guy. I most likely will truly rope at that point.
Can you believe that this is one of the photos I showed to Dr. Y during my consultation?:






I mean, I guess he still did a good job overall, but WTF was he thinking giving me only 3.5 mm and 5.5 mm of projection? Why not 5.5 mm and 7.5 mm?


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 27, 2019)

Honestly, you're going to get a decent paying job and you'll have no problem paying them off so just go for it
I'm not sure about the amount of projection though. Will 2mm more really suffice?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> Honestly, you're going to get a decent paying job and you'll have no problem paying them off so just go for it
> I'm not sure about the amount of projection though. Will 2mm more really suffice?



I'm not sure, that's the million-dollar question (how much additional projection to get). Do you agree with what I wrote in my previous posts, though? That some additional forward/lateral projection would make me look better in a more chiseled, stand-out kind of way?

Even if it takes me years to pay all this shit off, I'm still moving forward with all my surgeries (I will probably eventually end up getting more shit done than facemaxxed tbh). I'm not going to get married or have kids so I shouldn't have a hard time paying for all these surgeries.


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I'm not sure, that's the million-dollar question (how much additional projection to get). Do you agree with what I wrote in my previous posts, though? That some additional forward/lateral projection would make me look better in a more chiseled, stand-out kind of way?
> 
> Even if it takes me years to pay all this shit off, I'm still moving forward with all my surgeries (I will probably eventually end up getting more shit done than facemaxxed tbh). I'm not going to get married or have kids so I shouldn't have a hard time paying for all these surgeries.


Yeah i agree. I think you should get something bold like 3.5mm of additional projection. If that becomes too much just revise it one final time.


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## 2peasinapod (Oct 27, 2019)

you will NEVER look close to looking like Cruise or Cavill mate, i dont know why you keep posting him

also you look mid30s imo


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> Yeah i agree. I think you should get something bold like 3.5mm of additional projection. If that becomes too much just revise it one final time.



Hmm, not sure if 3.5 mm might be too much? I really wish Dr. Y had listened to me when I told him the after the initial implant design session that I'd like a few more mm of projection. The only issue with too many revisions is that more scar tissue builds up with every revision. The only reason that's an issue is because Taban said that the more scar tissue that's present, the less dramatic of a result I'll be able to get with my eye area overhaul surgery.


2peasinapod said:


> you will NEVER look close to looking like Cruise or Cavill mate, i dont know why you keep posting him
> 
> also you look mid30s imo



The mid-30s age estimate sucks as I'm not even that old yet. I honestly hope you're kidding. And I'm not saying that I think I can actually look like Cruise or Cavill; I'm just posting their pictures to give more of an idea of the kind of definition I'm going for. Even if I won't look like Cavill or Cruise, you don't think some extra projection would look good?


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 27, 2019)

Oh so scar tissue is the problem. Then most likely play it safe with 2-2.5mm of projection.

If you could plot it into a function, would amount of projection to the results it gives be exponential or linear?

Of course, the best idea is just to consult with him and tell him EXACTLY how you feel


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> Oh so scar tissue is the problem. Then most likely play it safe with 2-2.5mm of projection.



Well, I don't think it's necessarily the amount of projection that's the problem, but moreso the number of additional surgeries. In other words, I don't want to go back for a third surgery if my implants end up being too big after the revision, because then there will be so much scar tissue that my eye area overhaul surgery with Taban would probably be a hopeless endeavor. As it stands now though, it basically looks like I had nothing done.


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## 2peasinapod (Oct 27, 2019)

i think you must be off your nut to even consider another surgery, but you gotta do what you wanna do

all id say is, its very evident you will never be satisfied with your face, you have some deep psychological trauma


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

2peasinapod said:


> i think you must be off your nut to even consider another surgery, but you gotta do what you wanna do
> 
> all id say is, its very evident you will never be satisfied with your face, you have some deep psychological trauma



So first you tell me I'll never be GL like Cruise, Cavill, etc., but then you tell me that I'm insane to consider more surgeries? What am I supposed to do, be satisfied with looking average/below average? 

If surgeries can make me better-looking (even if not Cavill-tier obviously), then why wouldn't I want that for myself?


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Well, I don't think it's necessarily the amount of projection that's the problem, but moreso the number of additional surgeries. In other words, I don't want to go back for a third surgery if my implants end up being too big after the revision, because then there will be so much scar tissue that my eye area overhaul surgery with Taban would probably be a hopeless endeavor. As it stands now though, it basically looks like I had nothing done.


I find it odd that scar tissue can have that much of a different but I'm not a surgeon

Have you tried fillers?


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## 2peasinapod (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> So first you tell me I'll never be GL like Cruise, Cavill, etc., but then you tell me that I'm insane to consider more surgeries? What am I supposed to do, be satisfied with looking average/below average?
> 
> If surgeries can make me better-looking (even if not Cavill-tier obviously), then why wouldn't I want that for myself?



becasue you have already gotton multiple surgeries and dont look any better to the general public, mainly becasue your phenotype hasnt changed in the slightest. you 100% should accept yourself and get on with your life. you wernt born to be a hollywood movie star boyo not many of us are

also i am a huge believer in invasive surgery being a looksmin, for reasons i will not discuss here. i turned down medical surgery in 2017 and treated myself for this reason.


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## Deleted member 2933 (Oct 27, 2019)

Fix eyes mane, those implants are fine.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> I find it odd that scar tissue can have that much of a different but I'm not a surgeon
> 
> Have you tried fillers?



No, the value proposition just sucks too much. It's literally throwing money away. If there was a filler that lasted for maybe at least 5 years I would consider it, but otherwise I can't bring myself to spend the money on something that will be gone in a year.


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> No, the value proposition just sucks too much. It's literally throwing money away. If there was a filler that lasted for maybe at least 5 years I would consider it, but otherwise I can't bring myself to spend the money on something that will be gone in a year.


I meant more to simulate a revision (to some degree)


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

2peasinapod said:


> becasue you have already gotton multiple surgeries and dont look any better to the general public, mainly becasue your phenotype hasnt changed in the slightest. you 100% should accept yourself and get on with your life. you wernt born to be a hollywood movie star boyo not many of us are
> 
> also i am a huge believer in invasive surgery being a looksmin, for reasons i will not discuss here. i turned down medical surgery in 2017 and treated myself for this reason.



I only have midface implants and a chin implant; I haven't gotten any other surgeries. You're obviously entitled to your opinion that it isn't possible for me to become any better-looking through surgery, but obviously I disagree with your assertion and am going to do what I can to improve my looks. Someone doesn't have to be "Hollywood movie star good-looking" to become a better-looking version of themselves.


SirGey said:


> Fix eyes mane, those implants are fine.



I want a better result than "just fine." I didn't spend all this money and subject myself to ~3 months of swelling so that I could get extremely subtle results.


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## 2peasinapod (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I only have midface implants and a chin implant; I haven't gotten any other surgeries. You're obviously entitled to your opinion that it isn't possible for me to become any better-looking through surgery, but obviously I disagree with your assertion and am going to do what I can to improve my looks. Someone doesn't have to be "Hollywood movie star good-looking" to become a better-looking version of themselves.



i assumed so, all the best mate

ill await your thread in a few months regarding your next snip, while begging for 15 year old indians to validate you


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> I meant more to simulate a revision (to some degree)



That could be a good idea, but I still think I'd just like to go for a revision since I'm fairly certain that more projection will be an improvement. Can you believe that 5.5 - 6 mm of augmentation conferred such a subtle result? I guess I must've been really recessed


2peasinapod said:


> i assumed so, all the best mate
> 
> ill await your thread in a few months regarding your next snip, while begging for 15 year old indians to validate you



I'm not here to get validation from anyone; if that was the case I would simply be doing my best to post flattering photos (obviously that's not the case) and asking random people to rate me, hoping for a good rating.

Me and you obviously just have starkly conflicting opinions on the value and utility of getting surgery to improve our looks. Obviously the fact that you don't even think I should get surgery to overhaul my eye area seems to suggest that we have a totally different philosophy on the matter, where you're probably the kind of person who is generally content with looking average (or worse) and I'm the kind of person who isn't content with settling for that. I'm just surprised that you don't think surgery has any possibility whatsoever of improving someone's looks, as there are plenty of dramatic before/after examples online of patients who not only improved their looks, but who overhauled their entire phenotypes as well. Money isn't really going to be an issue for me, so if my midface implant revision + jaw implant + eye area overhaul surgeries don't get me where I want to be, I'll consult with maxfac surgeons and see what my options for osteotomies are. (Obviously, if a total phenotype change is what it's going to take, then that's what osteotomies have actually been shown to accomplish)


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## ritalinredemption (Oct 27, 2019)

It seems like you wont be able to stop fixating on this, so you should do it if it makes you happy. You have to live with yourself 100% of the time, so you need to do what you can to be happy.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

ritalinredemption said:


> It seems like you wont be able to stop fixating on this, so you should do it if it makes you happy. You have to live with yourself 100% of the time, so you need to do what you can to be happy.



Exactly; part of the issue is that I've wanted to start getting these procedures done YEARS ago, and after seeing how subtle the results of my midface implants are, I don't think I'll ever able to stop thinking about them unless I get them revised or augmented. I'm pretty happy with the chin implant, though.

TBH, once I start making money next summer I'll probably end up getting so many dramatic surgeries that I make facemaxxed look like a bluepilled coper.


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## tryingtofindsolution (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I had custom midface and chin implant surgery back in March 2019, and some of you may recall that over the last few months, I've been debating back-and-forth over whether I should go back to Dr. Y to have the midface implants either enhanced with an additional 2-3 mm-thick layer of silicone or revised completely. I know that most of you have told me to just leave well enough alone and focus on fixing my eye area, but I have decided to go back in March 2020 to have my midface implants enhanced with an additional layer of silicone. I will also be having the rest of the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me placed as well.
> 
> While I definitely think my midface looks improved as compared to what it looked like pre-surgery, I just want a more noticeably chiseled appearance. At 3.5 mm of augmentation and 5.5 mm of augmentation, respectively, on the left and right sides of the face, there's just not enough forward projection to really make the implant work stick out. I also want a bit more lateral projection on the zygomatic arches.
> 
> ...



Honestly you look good even now,not chadlite but higher than a normie I think.The only thing you need to "fix" is the eye area that would take you at Chadlite at least.Also you give off a nerdy and strange vibe,maybe you need to work on that after you finish school.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

tryingtofindsolution said:


> Honestly you look good even now,not chadlite but higher than a normie I think.The only thing you need to "fix" is the eye area that would take you at Chadlite at least.Also you give off a nerdy and strange vibe,maybe you need to work on that after you finish school.



Thanks for the compliment. Yes, a lifetime of inceldom has corrupted my psychological development (more specifically, lack of validation, affection, etc. from girls during my developmental years) and I am simply not a normal human being. I'm not sure if I will be able to completely alter my vibe, personality, etc., but I will try to do what I can to change these elements. Also, I know that most people wouldn't recommend getting more implant work done, but I don't think I'll be able to live with myself if I don't improve all the aspects of my looks that could possibly be improved. BTW, how old would you guess me to be?


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## tryingtofindsolution (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thanks for the compliment. Yes, a lifetime of inceldom has corrupted my psychological development (more specifically, lack of validation, affection, etc. from girls during my developmental years) and I am simply not a normal human being. I'm not sure if I will be able to completely alter my vibe, personality, etc., but I will try to do what I can to change these elements. Also, I know that most people wouldn't recommend getting more implant work done, but I don't think I'll be able to live with myself if I don't improve all the aspects of my looks that could possibly be improved. BTW, how old would you guess me to be?


I am in the same boat like you,cause I come from a nerdy background and getting with girls has not been easy,although I look worse and i am balding hahah.But I thought I would never get a girl to be honest,but I have even managed to get one night stands.Do not underestimste grolming and clothes,they make a ton of difference.Anyway work on your personality and be more outgoing and friendly.Also I would think you are under 27,but anyway seeminh older is not a disadvantage as I get that too,looking bad is,and with an eye surgery you could be Chad.I would advise you not to revise your implants but hey it is your choice


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

tryingtofindsolution said:


> I am in the same boat like you,cause I come from a nerdy background and getting with girls has not been easy,although I look worse and i am balding hahah.But I thought I would never get a girl to be honest,but I have even managed to get one night stands.Do not underestimste grolming and clothes,they make a ton of difference.Anyway work on your personality and be more outgoing and friendly.Also I would think you are under 27,but anyway seeminh older is not a disadvantage as I get that too,looking bad is,and with an eye surgery you could be Chad.I would advise you not to revise your implants but hey it is your choice



Appreciate the advice, which is always welcome. Also, congratulations on being able to get one night stands; I hope that I can actually become good-looking enough to have an experience like that one day, assuming the agepill doesn't bite me in the ass before I get there.


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## tryingtofindsolution (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Appreciate the advice, which is always welcome. Also, congratulations on being able to get one night stands; I hope that I can actually become good-looking enough to have an experience like that one day, assuming the agepill doesn't bite me in the ass before I get there.


Thanks,although now I would like to get a stable relationships than one night stands but if they are what you want even now yku could get them easily


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

tryingtofindsolution said:


> Thanks,although now I would like to get a stable relationships than one night stands but if they are what you want even now yku could get them easily



I wish! Unfortunately, women here in the US have raised their standards significantly when it comes to how selective they are when choosing men to hook up with in nightclubs/bars. Maybe my eye area really is holding me back more than I think, but I honestly think that I just don't have the capacity to become attractive-enough as a hookup candidate for most girls.


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## Deusmaximus (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Appreciate the advice, which is always welcome. Also, congratulations on being able to get one night stands; I hope that I can actually become good-looking enough to have an experience like that one day, assuming the agepill doesn't bite me in the ass before I get there.


You spend so much effort and money, but still cant get a ons with a 3-4psl girl? I think its to late for you. Just focus on a career and visit a hooker 2 times a week. Forget about females, and try to be successful with something you have real chances. Even if you do more surgeries, the only girls you can get, are old or fat ones. Just think about all the young, goodlooking, stylish, social media, low inhib and gym maxxed guys that you have to compete with. Girls dont wait for you, they have millions of options.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Deusmaximus said:


> You spend so much effort and money, and still cant get a ons with a 30+ girl? I think its to late for you. Just focus on a career and visit a hooker 2 times a week. Forget about females, and try to be successful with something you have real chances. Even if you do more surgeries, the only girls you can get, are old or fat ones. Just think about all the young, goodlooking, stylish, social media, low inhib and gym maxxed guys that you have to compete with. Girls dont wait for you, they have millions of options.



Yeah I know. That's why I said in a previous post that at this point, I'm basically doing this for myself. I simply have never liked how I look and I realize that I CAN become better-looking through surgery, so at the very least I'll be able to be happy with my looks for the first time ever, even if I still remain terminally unattractive to girls. If I didn't think that surgeries had the potential to make me better-looking, I wouldn't be spending money to undergo them. At this point I simply want to be happy with my appearance, and if I somehow get a lifestyle benefit from making these improvements, then that will simply be a nice bonus. BTW, being more attractive could also help me with getting better jobs in the profession I'll be entering soon.


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## yagen (Oct 27, 2019)

I will do these before new implants

- lip lift
- bichectomy
- filler in gonial angle
- Fat graf or filler upper eyelid.
- 10% BF


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## KEy21 (Oct 27, 2019)

yagen said:


> I will do these before new implants
> 
> - lip lift
> - bichectomy
> ...


Those implants looking amazing if that pic is real.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

yagen said:


> I will do these before new implants
> 
> - lip lift
> - bichectomy
> ...



I definitely agree with you that a lip lift would be a good idea since I have a somewhat long philtrum. I'm not sure about the cheek fat removal (bichectomy) though, since I'm afraid of doing anything that might make my face age faster. I actually am planning on going back to Dr. Y to have the rest of a wraparound jaw implant placed that was previously designed for me (so far, I only have the chin portion of it). I may do fat grafts to the lower eyelids when I go to see Taban later next year.


KEy21 said:


> Those implants looking amazing if that pic is real.



@KEy21 The photo is real, it's actually the second photo in the series of three photos that I posted in my OP of this thread. The purpose of the photo is to show what it might look like if I had an additional 2-3 mm of augmentation to the malar implants, which I'm trying to demonstrate by grabbing the cheek tissue and pulling it forward by a few mm. Do you see what I'm going for here by pulling the tissues forward a little bit more? Do you agree that it would be worth it to get a few more mm of forward projection if that's what it would look like (but on both sides of the face, obviously)?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

@KEy21 Also, do you agree that my face would look better with lower jaw angles so that the body of my jaw itself doesn't look so steep?


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## KEy21 (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I definitely agree with you that a lip lift would be a good idea since I have a somewhat long philtrum. I'm not sure about the cheek fat removal (bichectomy) though, since I'm afraid of doing anything that might make my face age faster. I actually am planning on going back to Dr. Y to have the rest of a wraparound jaw implant placed that was previously designed for me (so far, I only have the chin portion of it). I may do fat grafts to the lower eyelids when I go to see Taban later next year.
> 
> 
> @KEy21 The photo is real, it's actually the second photo in the series of three photos that I posted in my OP of this thread. The purpose of the photo is to show what it might look like if I had an additional 2-3 mm of augmentation to the malar implants, which I'm trying to demonstrate by grabbing the cheek tissue and pulling it forward by a few mm. Do you see what I'm going for here by pulling the tissues forward a little bit more? Do you agree that it would be worth it to get a few more mm of forward projection if that's what it would look like (but on both sides of the face, obviously)?



Those implants how they are with vertically narrow, low UEE blue eyes = slayer


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## justanothergymcell (Oct 27, 2019)

You aren't going to listen to us anyways and will get more implants despite having an abhorrent eye area that every single person agrees you should focus on first.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

KEy21 said:


> Those implants how they are with vertically narrow, low UEE blue eyes = slayer



Did you see the first photo in the series I posted, though? Maybe the lighting is just shit, but it looks like there's hardly any definition at all:



You seriously don't think that more projection and a bit more of a chiseled, angular look to my midface would benefit my looks? @KEy21


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## Short Ugly and Brown (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I had custom midface and chin implant surgery back in March 2019, and some of you may recall that over the last few months, I've been debating back-and-forth over whether I should go back to Dr. Y to have the midface implants either enhanced with an additional 2-3 mm-thick layer of silicone or revised completely. I know that most of you have told me to just leave well enough alone and focus on fixing my eye area, but I have decided to go back in March 2020 to have my midface implants enhanced with an additional layer of silicone. I will also be having the rest of the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me placed as well.
> 
> While I definitely think my midface looks improved as compared to what it looked like pre-surgery, I just want a more noticeably chiseled appearance. At 3.5 mm of augmentation and 5.5 mm of augmentation, respectively, on the left and right sides of the face, there's just not enough forward projection to really make the implant work stick out. I also want a bit more lateral projection on the zygomatic arches.
> 
> ...



your whole face is good besides eyes

worry about eyes

u mog me to the moon


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

justanothergymcell said:


> You aren't going to listen to us anyways and will get more implants despite having an abhorrent eye area that every single person agrees you should focus on first.



I agree that the eye area is beyond unattractive. The only reason I'm putting off the surgery to get it overhauled is because Taban himself told me that if there's ANYTHING else I want done that involves making a lower eyelid incision (e.g., midface implant revision/augmentation), then I need to get that done first and then go back to him for eye work. He said this is because any lower eyelid incisions that are made after I get my eye area surgery could ruin the results of what he (Taban) achieves. 

So in other words, once I get my eye area overhaul surgery, there's no going back and doing any other procedures on my midface. I'm going to have to accept and live with the results I have now (or waste money getting fillers for the rest of my life). 

Besides, I'm not talking about delaying it for years or something. At the most, I'd be having to delay the eye area surgery to early next fall. I'll be finishing grad school in May, getting licensed, and then finding a job. Starting salaries in my field range from $90k-$130k+, so it's not like I won't be in a position to be afford to get all this stuff done. If I play my cards right, there's a chance I'll be getting a gov't. job paying $100k+ with 30 days of PTO to start and full federal benefits, so it will actually be easier to afford to go to Taban and whoever else if I wait a few months.


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## Lux (Oct 27, 2019)

Didn't read all the comments following the post- sorry I'm a little ADHD

Looking good though. Sounds like you got a good handle on the surgeries so I can't give any advice on that.
Should hairstyle max w/ something like this:








I'm guessing it might not work out though cause you probably have a high paying job that won't let you.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Short Ugly and Brown said:


> your whole face is good besides eyes
> 
> worry about eyes
> 
> u mog me to the moon



Thanks for the compliment I guess, but if you had paid thousands for custom midface implant surgery, wouldn't you want more chiseled, noticeable results?


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## SHARK (Oct 27, 2019)

Your midface is good enough if you fix your eye area. If you feel you still have time to ascend, go with your plan. Heck if you're still single at 31 what difference does it make waiting until 33. Either way I think you will have mental problems that will never go away, with or without a girlfriend. The mental damage has been done, so might as well maximize your looks potential.

@SurgerySoon can you post that morph of yours with blue eyes


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Bronze8 said:


> Didn't read all the comments following the post- sorry I'm a little ADHD
> 
> Looking good though. Sounds like you got a good handle on the surgeries so I can't give any advice on that.
> Should hairstyle max w/ something like this:
> ...



I appreciate the hairstyle suggestion. Ironically enough, other people have actually suggested that I get a similar haircut, or maybe a variation of the "fuckboy" haircut (short/faded on the sides, long top). I actually don't have a high-paying job yet, but I'll be finishing graduate school this May and should be starting my career by early next fall. Depending on where I end up working, I've been told that those types of haircuts would probably be considered unprofessional, which sucks.


SHARK said:


> Your midface is good enough if you fix your eye area. If you feel you still have time to ascend, go with your plan. Heck if you're still single at 31 what difference does it make waiting until 33. Either way I think you will have mental problems that will never go away, with or without a girlfriend. The mental damage has been done, so might as well maximize your looks potential.
> 
> @SurgerySoon can you post that morph of yours with blue eyes



@SHARK I agree that a lifetime of getting zero validation, affection, or even the slightest indicator that a girl was attracted to me during my developmental years has inflicted permanent, irreversible psychological damage. I also agree that at this point I might as well maximize my looks potential. The way I see it is, while other guys in their 30s are starting families, developing dad bods, and becoming just generally "blah" and unattractive, I'll be putting my money and efforts towards becoming as attractive as I can realistically become for a guy in my age bracket. This is going to sound kind of sad, but it kind of gives me something to look forward to in life -- like something to look forward to making constant progress with.

BTW, I actually won't even have to wait until I'm 33 to get my eye area overhaul surgery with Taban. The delay would actually only be maybe 3-6 months, so I should be in a position to get it done sometime next fall or possibly even late summer. If I can cuck the few family members I still keep in touch with to send me graduation money this May, the delay might be even shorter.

Here's the morph; I have to give credit to Lookism user SansDopamine (anyone been in touch with him since the forum coup?) for creating it. He not only morphed the eyes but also lowered my gonial angles and made my nostrils just a bit narrower:






@KEy21 @Amnesia what do you think of the morph? I showed it to Taban and he said that even though he probably can't make me look "exactly" like that, he can probably get me pretty damn close


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## Autoact (Oct 27, 2019)

Bro fix your eyes and don’t fixate on augmenting an already successful surgery and running the risk of infection and having to remove your existing implants

Imagine going back to your pre surgery midface with a mountain of debt - the marginal potential benefit is not worth the risk

Also, you may be able to augment your zygos or whatever in the future through an incision in your mouth

What you think would look objectively better now might not matter to you at all when you see how much better you look after going to Taban


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Autoact said:


> Bro fix your eyes and don’t fixate on augmenting an already successful surgery and running the risk of infection and having to remove your existing implants
> 
> Imagine going back to your pre surgery midface with a mountain of debt - the marginal potential benefit is not worth the risk
> 
> ...



Those are valid considerations to keep in mind, but this is how I look at it -- imagine how much better I'd look after going to Taban AND getting some additional augmentation from Dr. Y. Besides, I'm going to be going back to him to get the rest of my jaw implant placed, so I think it would be sort of a missed opportunity to not add the extra bit of augmentation to the implants that would really make them look perfect. 

BTW, I don't think the implants can be augmented via intraoral incisions because of the lateral arch component.
Also, FWIW, even my family members (who were originally against the notion of me getting ANY surgeries) agreed that I didn't really get a worthwhile result and that it wouldn't hurt to consider going back to get the implants touched up.


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## Short Ugly and Brown (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thanks for the compliment I guess, but if you had paid thousands for custom midface implant surgery, wouldn't you want more chiseled, noticeable results?


I think if u touched ur mid face anymore it would look worse

your eye area and rounded hairline are the only 2 flaws I see off hand


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Short Ugly and Brown said:


> I think if u touched ur mid face anymore it would look worse
> 
> your eye area and rounded hairline are the only 2 flaws I see off hand



Unfortunately I have always had a rounded hairline with a strong widows peak (even since I was a kid). Will be getting eye area fixed after finalizing the midface.


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## Autoact (Oct 27, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Those are valid considerations to keep in mind, but this is how I look at it -- imagine how much better I'd look after going to Taban AND getting some additional augmentation from Dr. Y. Besides, I'm going to be going back to him to get the rest of my jaw implant placed, so I think it would be sort of a missed opportunity to not add the extra bit of augmentation to the implants that would really make them look perfect.
> 
> BTW, I don't think the implants can be augmented via intraoral incisions because of the lateral arch component.
> Also, FWIW, even my family members (who were originally against the notion of me getting ANY surgeries) agreed that I didn't really get a worthwhile result and that it wouldn't hurt to consider going back to get the implants touched up.



You should ask Dr. Y if they can be placed orally

I went to Taban for almond eye + infraorbital rim implants and am going to see Eppley for wraparound jaw + zygomatic arch/malar implants soon

He is placing the zygo implant through an intra oral incision

If it’s possible, I’d go to Taban first, you will see a significant improvement in your face whereas the implants will be marginal in comparison. So much so that you might just not want any further surgery after Taban


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 27, 2019)

Autoact said:


> You should ask Dr. Y if they can be placed orally
> 
> I went to Taban for almond eye + infraorbital rim implants and am going to see Eppley for wraparound jaw + zygomatic arch/malar implants soon
> 
> ...



Good luck with your surgeries. I'm surprised that Eppley said the implants can be placed via an intraoral incision; my midface implants had to be placed via a lower eyelid incision (I think this has also been the case for several other guys who have gotten cheek/zygo implants with Eppley). Hopefully he's able to follow through on that. My eyes were stitched shut for 5 days after my surgery, which sucked. 

I agree that I'll get the most improvement from the procedures I'll have done with Taban, but I'm the kind of person whose mental afflictions over this sort of thing are so significant and relentless that I don't think I'll ever be satisfied until I get at least a little more definition and angularity (maybe 20-30% more) from my midface implants.

Are you happy with the results of your almond eye surgery with Taban? Do you have any pics you can share?


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 28, 2019)

Jesus Christ this is beyond pathetic, you need to watch some RSD videos and work on the inner you lmao no surgey is going to fix how mentally fucked You are, responding with 5 paragraphs essays, you look facially decent (don’t know
Body and height) but the second you talk or the way u carry yourself must dry up alll vaginas within a mile radius


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> Jesus Christ this is beyond pathetic, you need to watch some RSD videos and work on the inner you lmao no surgey is going to fix how mentally fucked You are, responding with 5 paragraphs essays, you look facially decent (don’t know
> Body and height) but the second you talk or the way u carry yourself must dry up alll vaginas within a mile radius



Regardless of personality, I want to look better than "facially decent." It's not even about girls at the heart of it TBH

Edit: And most of my "5 paragraph essays" are responses to multiple posts that were automatically merged into one post


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Regardless of personality, I want to look better than "facially decent." It's not even about girls at the heart of it TBH


Well guess what, it’s not possible to have elite facial aesthetics through surgery maybe 100 years from but not now, elite facial aesthetics are born not made by a surgeon. Be happy you look decent


SurgerySoon said:


> Regardless of personality, I want to look better than "facially decent." It's not even about girls at the heart of it TBH
> 
> Edit: And most of my "5 paragraph essays" are responses to multiple posts that were automatically merged into one post


I’m just saying the 5 paragraph essays are indicative of ur obbesive personality. You should get therapy not surgey other wise you’ll never be happy. If you were ugly I would totally understand your obsession but this is just sad


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> Well guess what, it’s not possible to have elite facial aesthetics through surgery maybe 100 years from but not now, elite facial aesthetics are born not made by a surgeon. Be happy you look decent



Maybe it isn't possible to get elite facial aesthetics through surgery, but it's definitely possible to get better than "decent" facial aesthetics through surgery. 

BTW, it is actually possible to get close to elite facial aesthetics through surgery; it just takes extremely invasive procedures such as osteotomies (which I'm not opposed to getting).

Just out of curiosity, how are you so certain that I fit the profile of someone who somehow doesn't have the potential to become better-looking through surgery? Maybe you'll end up being right, but I'm always curious to hear about the reasoning behind those statements. How can you or anyone else honestly know what is or isn't achievable via surgery?


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Maybe it isn't possible to get elite facial aesthetics through surgery, but it's definitely possible to get better than "decent" facial aesthetics through surgery.
> 
> BTW, it is actually possible to get close to elite facial aesthetics through surgery; it just takes extremely invasive procedures such as osteotomies (which I'm not opposed to getting).
> 
> Just out of curiosity, how are you so certain that I fit the profile of someone who somehow doesn't have the potential to become better-looking through surgery? Maybe you'll end up being right, but I'm always curious to hear about the reasoning behind those statements. How can you or anyone else honestly know what is or isn't achievable via surgery?


Can you show me one legit example of a person getting movie star good looks through surgery? No , elite facial aesthetics is about ratios and is more complex than i for sure know. So ya give me one example of a person who was average and became elite looking


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> Can you show me one legit example of a person getting movie star good looks through surgery? No , elite facial aesthetics is about ratios and is more complex than i for sure know. So ya give me one example of a person who was average and became elite looking



Check out Dr. Raffaini's before/after photo gallery:






galleria casi di chirurgia, maxillofacciale, ortognatica, rinoplastica e chirurgia estetica facesurgery







www.facesurgery.it





Other maxfac surgeons such as Dr. Sailer have very impressive before/after photo examples of me -- and the kicker is, almost all of these patients had WORSE starting points than me. 

... So yeah, the fact that "elite facial aesthetics is more complex than you for sure know" isn't the same thing as definitively knowing what can or can't be achieved via surgery. The whole point of invasive osteotomies is to correct functional issues AND alter the fundamental ratios/proportions of the face, depending on the individual surgeon's philosophy.


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Check out Dr. Raffaini's before/after photo gallery:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not one movie star was seen. Since you like quoting “all of these patients have WORSE starting points than me”. Yes that’s my point, going from ugly to decent is possible, decent to elite is not


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> Not one movie star was seen. Since you like quoting “all of these patients have WORSE starting points than me”. Yes that’s my point, going from ugly to decent is possible, decent to elite is not



In my opinion, those people ended up looking better than "decent" post-surgery.

Ok, I get it, you don't think I have the potential to become any better-looking than simply "decent." That's your opinion and you're entitled to it... and yet at the same time, you have ZERO evidence that indicates that I have no capacity whatsoever to become better-looking (not necessarily "movie star elite").

It's almost funny that half the forum is utterly convinced that I don't have what it takes to become anymore attractive WHATSOEVER than I already am, and yet at the same time, nobody can actually point to any features/elements of my face and say "this/that is why you will never be anymore attractive than you are now."

It's really an interesting proposition for a thought experiment if you think about it


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Actually, I just took another look at Raffaini's before/afters -- patient #3 ascended from straight ugly to literal Stacy, and the male patient either became a Chad or, at minimum, a Chad-lite. The other female patients also became above-average attractive (aside from the fact that patient 5 is "old").


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## Looksmax25 (Oct 28, 2019)

Problem is with surgery after surgery you can degrade the tissue and run into complications... it's not like swapping out speakers in a car or something. I would just fix your eye area as your bones look above average already.


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## wristcel (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> galleria casi di chirurgia, maxillofacciale, ortognatica, rinoplastica e chirurgia estetica facesurgery
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Can't get over them before/afters. Don't know if they're massively cherry-picked, but most of them turned into very good looking people indeed! If only I could have gotten that surgery when I was young!


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Looksmax25 said:


> Problem is with surgery after surgery you can degrade the tissue and run into complications... it's not like swapping out speakers in a car or something. I would just fix your eye area as your bones look above average already.



That's a good point; I'll be sure to ask Dr. Y about it. Also, I don't want the revision surgery to result in so much scar tissue build-up that it results in Taban not being able to do as good of a job with overhauling my eye area. Still, though, I don't think I'll ever be able to stop thinking about it until I get the revision surgery. 

Here's another way to look at it -- when you've wanted something for years, you sort of start seeing a certain desired outcome in your mind prior to surgery. In fact, I used to hold the tissues of my face in certain ways so as to simulate the changes I'd hope to get from the implants. So it's not necessarily that the results don't look "good" as they are now... it's more an issue of not getting the results I wanted in the first place. I just remember how excited I was a year ago that I had finally scheduled the surgery, and I was simply expecting a more noticeable and dramatic look than this. 

I'll put it like this: even my family members (who were originally steadfast opposed to me getting surgery) agree that it's at least worth looking into what a revision could accomplish. It's like my results are almost, but not quite there.


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## Elijah1083 (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> That's a good point; I'll be sure to ask Dr. Y about it. Also, I don't want the revision surgery to result in so much scar tissue build-up that it results in Taban not being able to do as good of a job with overhauling my eye area. Still, though, I don't think I'll ever be able to stop thinking about it until I get the revision surgery.
> 
> Here's another way to look at it -- when you've wanted something for years, you sort of start seeing a certain desired outcome in your mind prior to surgery. In fact, I used to hold the tissues of my face in certain ways so as to simulate the changes I'd hope to get from the implants. So it's not necessarily that the results don't look "good" as they are now... it's more an issue of not getting the results I wanted in the first place. I just remember how excited I was a year ago that I had finally scheduled the surgery, and I was simply expecting a more noticeable and dramatic look than this.
> 
> I'll put it like this: even my family members (who were originally steadfast opposed to me getting surgery) agree that it's at least worth looking into what a revision could accomplish. It's like my results are almost, but not quite there.


I’m not sure if you spoke on this, but do you plan on having the rest of your jaw implant inserted during the same surgery? Also, can I ask what the design looks like for the jaw implant, how many mm of width on each side?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Elijah1083 said:


> I’m not sure if you spoke on this, but do you plan on having the rest of your jaw implant inserted during the same surgery? Also, can I ask what the design looks like for the jaw implant, how many mm of width on each side?



Yeah, I am planning on having the rest of the jaw implant placed during the same surgery. I'll pictures of it below. Remember, I already have the chin portion of the implant in my face already (it was placed during my first surgery), so I'll just be getting the remaining two halves of the jaw implant placed. 

I don't have pics on my computer that include the measurements, but I do have them on my phone, so I'll post them in about 5 minutes when I have my phone on me...
Here are photos of the implant. A lot of people think that the amount of width that the implants will add (8 mm and 9 mm on each side) is a bit much, but Dr. Y said he can carve off some of the lateral projection from the implant at the time of surgery. I do think that the height the implants are going to add to make my angles lower will look good, as I have relatively high jaw angles naturally.






@Elijah1083


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## Elijah1083 (Oct 28, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Yeah, I am planning on having the rest of the jaw implant placed during the same surgery. I'll pictures of it below. Remember, I already have the chin portion of the implant in my face already (it was placed during my first surgery), so I'll just be getting the remaining two halves of the jaw implant placed.
> 
> I don't have pics on my computer that include the measurements, but I do have them on my phone, so I'll post them in about 5 minutes when I have my phone on me...
> Here are photos of the implant. A lot of people think that the amount of width that the implants will add (8 mm and 9 mm on each side) is a bit much, but Dr. Y said he can carve off some of the lateral projection from the implant at the time of surgery. I do think that the height the implants are going to add to make my angles lower will look good, as I have relatively high jaw angles naturally.
> ...


Thanks for sharing. As you mentioned, I would recommend you have him carve the implant as that’s a lot of width considering your jawline is already pretty good. I know someone in real life who had 4mm of width on each side, in hindsight he would only add 1mm to make it 5. Even just the 4 gave a decent improvement.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Elijah1083 said:


> Thanks for sharing. As you mentioned, I would recommend you have him carve the implant as that’s a lot of width considering your jawline is already pretty good. I know someone in real life who had 4mm of width on each side, in hindsight he would only add 1mm to make it 5. Even just the 4 gave a decent improvement.



Yeah, my understanding is that he usually errs on the side of adding too much as opposed to too little width since the implants can always be reduced in size. Also, I like how the implant straightens out the body of my jawline, which is a bit curved now and makes my face look kind of round, especially from farther away. 

Also, he said the effects of the jaw implant should make my midface look more hollowed out and defined, so I guess it will complement my midface implants in a way.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

@Amnesia @KEy21 what do you guys think of the design/dimensions of the jaw implant that was designed for me (keep in mind I already have the chin component in my face)? Do you agree that a few mm of width should be shaved off?


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## Amnesia (Oct 28, 2019)

First off, there's a shockingly large amount of blue pilled garbage advice itt I would expect from reddit not a PSL site, muh work on inner confidence, muh watch RSD. Fuck off faggots, hes already invested into surgery hes asking for surgery advice if you have none to give gtfo.


So there's a few issues I see, lets use this pic as reference






Your zygos are already wider than your jawline, going for anymore lateral projection would be bad and look uncanny. I think the main issue is that Cavill and Cruise have higher set zygos than you do and so you are never going to get the look they have with yours. We both have low set zygos so I know how it goes. Honestly it's just cause you're holding fat in your face, you need a leaner malar region and buccal region dude. If those areas were leaner the skin would fold in and reveal the zygos better. That is what a natural gl midface region would do, if you compensate by just trying to get more projection with implant its gunna look unnatural IMO.

Dunno if I am articulating it well enough heres a pic to try and show what I am talking about where the malar region is so lean you see the anterior projection better simply cause it's so lean.











I could be wrong but that's how I see it, just need a leaner face somehow. 

The pic where you're pinching your skin to give the illusion of zygos is unrealistic cause again, that requires your zygos to literally be higher set then they are man.


Your face below the eyes all looks good


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> First off, there's a shockingly large amount of blue pilled garbage advice itt I would expect from reddit not a PSL site, muh work on inner confidence, muh watch RSD. Fuck off faggots, hes already invested into surgery hes asking for surgery advice if you have none to give gtfo.
> 
> 
> So there's a few issues I see, lets use this pic as reference
> ...



Appreciate the feedback. Actually believe it or not, the area of skin I'm grabbing and bringing forward is exactly where the implants are LOL. I know it looks like I'm grabbing skin that's higher up than the zygos, but it's literally right where the implants are. Also, the ogee curve is kind of subdued/conservative from the 3/4, perspective, so that's another reason why I think maybe a few more mm of projection could look good (I could be wrong though).

To give you an example of what I mean in terms of my zygo placement, check out this photo where I'm putting my finger right below the zygo:






As you can see, my finger pushes in right below the area where I pushed the skin forward in the other photo. Maybe I'm off base here and it isn't possible to get more forward projection, but I'll see what Dr. Y says at least.

I agree that I'm carrying too much fat in my cheeks, but even though I do lots of cardio and working out at the gym, it never goes away. Obviously buccal/perioral fat removal is the answer here, but I'm just afraid of looking older as a result of removing fat from my face. 

I agree that too much width is a bad idea, but don't you think it would look good to lower the jaw angles a little bit so that the ramus isn't so steep? I also feel like this would allow the midface tissues to naturally "sink" in more and create more of a hollow look. Also, haven't you noticed how steep my jawline is from the side? Don't you think it would look good to lower it by maybe 5 mm?


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## Amnesia (Oct 28, 2019)

Do you have a profile pic you can send over again, dunno if I have one on hand from you or at least a pic showing your ramus/gonial angle? 

You need leanness man, I know its super autistic but look at these starvation victims, malar leanness is key for you to get that hollow look, look at these two guys I circled, thats what we all need, but its genetic, I mean look at that guy in the mid, hes starving too yet has a bloated chubby face, it's a fucking crapshoot





Also Im not kidding when i say your facial structure reminds me of Cruise in this interview


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> Do you have a profile pic you can send over again, dunno if I have one on hand from you or at least a pic showing your ramus/gonial angle?
> 
> You need leanness man, I know its super autistic but look at these starvation victims, malar leanness is key for you to get that hollow look, look at these two guys I circled, thats what we all need, but its genetic, I mean look at that guy in the mid, hes starving too yet has a bloated chubby face, it's a fucking crapshoot
> 
> ...




@Amnesia I will definitely take any comparison to Cruise as a compliment, although I honestly don't see it LOL. 

I agree 100% with you that leanness is key to getting the hollow look. The issue for me is the fact that I am genetically pre-disposed to holding lots of fat in my cheeks (like the middle guy in the photo you posted). In fact, even back when I was lean as hell during my Anavar cycle last summer, I still had fat ass cheeks. I guess I'm just going to have to decide whether or not it's worth risking making myself look older in order to get more chiseled cheeks. 

Here is a profile pic I just took of myself in the mirror:






Do you see how the jaw line is kind of steep as it goes from the chin to the jaw angle? On the other hand, Cruise's jawline is less steep but without looking blocky. That's basically what Dr. Y said he was going for -- lowering the jaw angles, making the jawline itself less steep, but not going so low with the angles that it makes my head look blocky. I feel like my head looks sort of unbalanced/disproportioned by having such a steep jawline, almost like a huge portion of my skull didn't develop.

Also, you can kind of see the hollows under my eye, which is another reason I want more forward projection (not just for the malar/zygo area).

BTW, you've seen the morph that SansDopamine from Lookism created for me where he overhauled my eye area and lowered my jaw angles, right? Here is a side-by-side comparison of the morph next to the post-surgery photo it was made from:






Do you see how it kind of balances out my whole face and skull better to have the lower jaw angles? (Obviously the eye area looks 1000x better too LOL)

Also, here's another morph that SansDopamine made for me about a year ago (this was pre-surgery):






He morphed three things in that photo: my jaw angles (made them lower), my zygos, and my eyes. Again, don't you think it balances out my face better to have lower jaw angles? Also, look at how sharp the additional zygo width makes my face look. Now do you see how another few mm of zygo projection could be an improvement as long as it's not overdone? (both in the forward and lateral directions)


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## Amnesia (Oct 28, 2019)

How do you create that steep look though? Do you have to lengthen the ramus?


Also have you ever posted on jawSurgeryForums at all to get their perspective?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 28, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> How do you create that steep look though? Do you have to lengthen the ramus?
> 
> 
> Also have you ever posted on jawSurgeryForums at all to get their perspective?



Yeah, I did post on JawSurgeryForums but got spewed with a bunch of bluepilled BS nonsense ("you already look pretty good, you're crazy for getting surgery!" "what a joke!" "you should be thankful for what you have!" blah blah blah). Those morons actually tracked down my Lookism account and branded me as a troll because of my motives in life.

To answer your question about how to create the steep look, I think it mostly comes from lowering the jaw angles as well as the body (I.e., jawline) of the jaw. I'm not sure if you saw it, but a few posts up I posted the jaw implant design that Dr. Y created for me with measurements included:

https://looksmax.org/threads/final-...-revised-enhanced-in-march.56792/post-1023207
As you can see, he'll be lowering one side by 5 mm, and the other side by 7 mm. I could be wrong, but it seems like it would be lowering my jaw angles by just enough to make my face look more masculine and balanced but without looking too square or blocky. So maybe it will give me more of a Tom Cruise head shape? Maybe like a poor man's TC? 

Also, I watched some of the interview you posted with Tom Cruise. Do you notice how he has way more lateral projection of the zygos than me, but it doesn't look weird or unnatural? Don't you think I would benefit from maybe 2 more mm of lateral projection at least? 

I'm trying to stay positive here, but I honestly think there's no way around it.... I was simply underdone.


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## Amnesia (Oct 28, 2019)

Lighting can play a huge role in how zygos look too though, bathroom lighting which is only frontal vs studio which is multi angle.

I dunno man. I do think that that morph does look good with the jaw being steep but in terms of the zygo projection I just don't know it's hard to say whether you're trying to create hollowness from a lack of projection or lack of low bf, I think it's the latter.








Im kinda hopping on the train of you just need to fix your eyes man, I mean it's the most important component of your face, O Pry himself lacks lateral zygo projection completely and achieves a hollow look from leanness alone


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> Lighting can play a huge role in how zygos look too though, bathroom lighting which is only frontal vs studio which is multi angle.
> 
> I dunno man. I do think that that morph does look good with the jaw being steep but in terms of the zygo projection I just don't know it's hard to say whether you're trying to create hollowness from a lack of projection or lack of low bf, I think it's the latter.
> 
> ...



In terms of the jaw, I just feel like by having such high jaw angles, it makes my skull almost look too short and gives me an overall cuck vibe, like sort of a naive, innocent, unassuming aura. It's hard to explain but I think that by having lower jaw angles, it just makes my head look more "complete," like I have an overall more assertive look or something. Maybe it's just more photogenic in general.

I agree that lighting makes a big difference when it comes to making cheeks look hollowed, but even in that photo you posted of Tom Cruise in the side-by-side comparison with my photo, his zygos look better due to having a few more mm of lateral projection. I mean I know it's a hyper-autistic thing to worry about, but think about how much more masculine and assertive it would look if I had even just 2 mm of additional lateral projection. It sounds like a petty thing to worry about, but I look at it like this... if I'm going to spend the time, money, and risk to undergo surgery, then I'm going to get the goal I set out to achieve originally, not settle for a result that "looks good enough."


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## Amnesia (Oct 29, 2019)

I dont think Tom Cruises are THAT much wider if at all, he just is leaner in the face under the zygos which makes them look like they pop more.


Heres a better comparison pic since they are similar angles (picture taken from a lower angle looking up at the face)

But yes his jaw is a bit steeper


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> I dont think Tom Cruises are THAT much wider if at all, he just is leaner in the face under the zygos which makes them look like they pop more.
> 
> 
> Heres a better comparison pic since they are similar angles (picture taken from a lower angle looking up at the face)
> ...



Yeah, I see that Cruise's face is leaner. I still can't help but think that just a little more lateral (as well as anterior) projection would look good though, LOL. I guess I'm the kind of person who has to learn the hard way about this shit, LOL. Also, do you see the hollowness under my eyes (especially the right one)? I think that's another indication that I need more forward projection of the implants.

Even if I tell Dr. Y to shave off most of the lateral projection, I'm definitely getting the rest of the jaw implant put in. My whole skull just looks too cuck-y as it is, like a little bitch skull.

Also, HOLY SHIT, I need a lip lift as well. My philtrum is just way too long. It may even be worth looking into getting a nose job to make my nose a little narrower (this was done in the morph for me as well).


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## Amnesia (Oct 29, 2019)

That undereye hollowness is due to your fat pads breaking off and moving down your face, the same thing has happened to me recently now that I am older


Unless you have pics of when you were a lot younger and it looks completely diff I dunno


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> That undereye hollowness is due to your fat pads breaking off and moving down your face, the same thing has happened to me recently now that I am older
> 
> 
> Unless you have pics of when you were a lot younger and it looks completely diff I dunno



Damn, so the fat pads are only going to move lower as I get older, right? Wonder if it's too early for a blepharoplasty


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## Amnesia (Oct 29, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Damn, so the fat pads are only going to move lower as I get older, right? Wonder if it's too early for a blepharoplasty










Yeah but also bathroom lighting highlights undereye hollowness more than any other form so I wouldnt worry about it


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> Yeah but also bathroom lighting highlights undereye hollowness more than any other form so I wouldnt worry about it



I think that's another reason why my implant results are so underwhelming. I originally consulted with Dr. Y back in 2015 and sent him photos that were taken at that time, so apparently he designed implants with the 2015 version of how I looked in mind. In other words, if I've lost 2-3 mm of soft tissue projection since then, that would explain why the implants seem to lack 2-3 mm of projection -- because he designed them to look good in a younger version of my face, back before I had lost some soft tissue thickness.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

@Amnesia Someone just posted this guy's pic (not sure of name) in another thread:






He's another example of someone who has more lateral zygo projection/flare-out like I'm going for


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## kota (Oct 29, 2019)

Hey man,

Your coming eyelid retraction surgery may help with the undereye hollows as it is a form of midface lift of the undereye tissues. It did help me quite a bit in that regard.

How long is your philtrum in mms btw? I agree you could benefit from a conservative lip lift and it's quite a simple procedure.

I already told you before what I think of this midface revision think and it seems you're only looking for someone to confirm what is already in your mind and won't listen to anyone else. But the eye surgery is really the only thing you should focus on, anything else is irrelevent next to it. Your midface projection, both lateral and forward, is already on par with Cruise as far as I'm concerned, I don't personally see how more projection would make a significant difference on the positive side.


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## Looksmax25 (Oct 29, 2019)

kota said:


> Hey man,
> 
> Your coming eyelid retraction surgery may help with the undereye hollows as it is a form of midface lift of the undereye tissues. It did help me quite a bit in that regard.
> 
> ...



This is true... most good looking guys IRL don't have super sharp zygos they just have good eye area and non-recessed lower third. Your bones look great in the pic above just fix your eye area.


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## Amnesia (Oct 29, 2019)

Bottom line, what's more important to you, what's the purpose of all this, to achieve your ideal look or to up your slaying potential? Even amongst the top men who fuck hella girls, only a small percentage of them have flanged zygos like what you're going for, it's not by any means necessary for sex appeal.

Strong jawline, width and good/striking eye area is what is attractiveness. There are countless examples of real life slayers with little to no zygo arch or ogee curve



No zygo projection, yet this is a very attractive artist rendition of a man, _why_, *striking eye area* with facial width wide jaw, wide neck wide zygos but not flanged or even creating hollowness.









Increasing your sex appeal is gunna all come down to your eyes not another 2mm projection of zygos.




Edit: another thing, there are plenty of ppl with more hollowing than your cheeks with less pronounced zygos than you have, it's a facial fat thing with you man, you have way stronger zygos than I do btw


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## Amnesia (Oct 29, 2019)

Edit 2: Do what you wanna do, but imo its not gnna increase your attractiveness


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## Sweboy (Oct 29, 2019)

Why dont u just try using fillers first?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 29, 2019)

@kota @Amnesia @Looksmax25 @Sweboy Sorry for the delay in responding to everyone; unfortunately I've been busy working on an assignment I have to present at my internship site tomorrow, so I'll respond to all you guys in detail by tomorrow evening


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## Looksmax25 (Oct 30, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> Edit 2: Do what you wanna do, but imo its not gnna increase your attractiveness


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## nastynas (Oct 30, 2019)

man im rooting for you since the first day of your thread in lookism but you are acting childish here for a grown man.e
everyone knows and says you are fine just get your eyes done but you act like a kid saying "but i wanna get it doooooneeeee" well if you want it that much just leave and get it done while knowing it wont make THAT much of a difference or change your eyes to make a radical change on your face. 

your choice.


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## Deusmaximus (Oct 30, 2019)

You need a fade haircut, and some fashionmaxxed clothes to look more stylish and young. Go for eye surgery. Look at Mt2 for tanning, and maybe also something to get a hardcore body. Lower gonial angle would also not hurt.


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## OCDMaxxing (Oct 30, 2019)

Don't fuck with your current implants, but focus on the following:
- Eye area
- Getting tan (melanotan II)
- Getting ripped (roids)
- Thick neck
- Tattoos
- Leg lengthening if you are under 6 feet


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## CarlSagan96 (Oct 30, 2019)

OCDMaxxing said:


> Don't fuck with your current implants, but focus on the following:
> - Eye area
> - Getting tan (melanotan II)
> - Getting ripped (roids)
> ...


What if I’m 5’11.5”?


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## OCDMaxxing (Oct 30, 2019)

CarlSagan96 said:


> What if I’m 5’11.5”?


Go get leg lengthening. Anything below 6'4'' is unacceptable in 2019 and will only get worse in 2020.


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## Amnesia (Oct 30, 2019)

re take that 3/4 angle without pinching your face I wanna see your ogee curve or post a 3/4 pic view from somewhat close up


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## KEy21 (Oct 30, 2019)

Go get your eye area fixed next month and never visit this site again


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

kota said:


> Hey man,
> 
> Your coming eyelid retraction surgery may help with the undereye hollows as it is a form of midface lift of the undereye tissues. It did help me quite a bit in that regard.
> 
> ...



I'm hoping that the eyelid retraction surgery does help with my undereye hollows, as I feel that those (along with my nasolabial folds) are pretty much the only clues that give away my age as being 30+. I already had one midface lift during my first round of surgery with Dr. Y, and even though it did a good job of mostly diminishing my fold on the left side, it didn't do much for my right fold since the eye bulges out more on that side and prevented the tissues from being able to be lifted as high.

Not sure how long my philtrum is. I don't think it's long enough for people to look at and say, "damn, what a philtrum," but at the same time it is a bit longer than average. The only thing is, I don't want to make it too short since my chin has naturally always been on the longer side.

For me, getting a revision of the midface implants is largely a case of me getting what I was going for when I first decided to get the surgery. I've wanted to get this done since around 2013, so after waiting 6-7 years and now that I've finally gotten it done, I'm not willing to settle for a result that is less than what I was aiming for in the first place. I'm just not able to be satisfied with a result that is "good enough," especially when it's easy to look in the mirror or at photographs and recognize that it IS realistic and possible to get the results I wanted originally.

If I knew I was aiming for a result that wasn't really possible to achieve, I wouldn't worry about revising the implants, but the fact that I know I can get more of the "look" I was going for makes the prospect of getting a revision impossible to ignore. If I'm going to live the rest of my life with these implants, why should I force myself to settle for a result that will always have me looking in the mirror and saying, "It looks pretty good now, but if only I had a bit more protrusion here and there..." for years and years?

Another thing to keep in mind is that there are only a handful of surgeons who are regarded for knowing what they're doing when it comes to male facial implant work: Dr. Y, Dr. Eppley, and maybe Dr. Binder. Otherwise, though, there are literally no surgeons whose names are tossed around as being the go-to guys for facial implant work for male patients. Dr. Y is 70, Eppley is only a few years younger, and I believe Binder is in his 70's as well. If I wait too much longer, all three of those surgeons will be either retired or dead, and then I'll be in an EXTREMELY difficult position should I decide (after fixing my eye area) 5+ years down the road that I want to have them revised anyways and none of those guys are practicing anymore at that point.

Also, I know we've been talking about midface implants here, but on a related note -- it would only cost $8500 to get the rest of my jaw implant put in. If I decide in a few years (after Dr Y. is most likely retired) that I want the wraparound jaw implant after all, I'll have to go to Eppley or Binder (assuming they're both still practicing) and pay $18k+ to have a totally new one designed. So basically, if I'm going to make ANY tweaks to either my midface implants or if I want to get the rest of my jaw implant put in, the time to do it is now.

Random question -- let's say that I had just gotten eye area overhaul surgery and still wanted to get my midface implants revised. Assuming the surgery could be done without compromising the results of the eye surgery, would you still be against it? The reason I ask is because it seems like people are more against me getting the midface implants revised BEFORE I get my eye surgery than they are against me getting the midface implant revision in general.


Amnesia said:


> Bottom line, what's more important to you, what's the purpose of all this, to achieve your ideal look or to up your slaying potential? Even amongst the top men who fuck hella girls, only a small percentage of them have flanged zygos like what you're going for, it's not by any means necessary for sex appeal.
> 
> Strong jawline, width and good/striking eye area is what is attractiveness. There are countless examples of real life slayers with little to no zygo arch or ogee curve
> 
> ...



I get what you're saying, but like I said in my response to kota above, this is something I've been wanting since 2013, so it's actually not just about increasing sex appeal to women. Of course I want to be more attractive, but at the same time, when I first decided I wanted to get surgery years ago, I had originally decided to do it for myself because I wanted to look a certain way. So as long as getting more zygo projection won't actually make me look uglier, I'm pretty sure I won't ever be satisfied until I can look in the mirror or at photographs of myself and say "ok, NOW I look how I always envisioned myself to look."

Someone posted a photo of this guy's ogee curve in another thread. Look at how much prominent and defined his is compared to mine:






BTW, I know you asked me to post another photo of my ogee curve without me propping it up with my fingers or whatever, so here you go (it's a series of two photos -- left and right sides):



You may say the implant results look "good enough," but I think you'd agree that they look at least a little underdone and that a few more mm would look really sharp. I'm not saying it would have some sort of dramatic effect on my overall attractiveness, but like I said, this is more about me getting the results I set out to achieve in the first place, rather than me trying to become more attractive by revising the implants.

As it stands now, when I look in the mirror, the first thought that comes to mind is that they look pretty good, but also that I really wanted to get more out of the procedure. And I honestly don't want to spend the rest of my life thinking that every single time I look in the mirror or see a photo of myself, so I'm going to get the implants revised/augmented before the few surgeons who are capable of skillfully doing male facial plastic surgery work are dead or retired.


Sweboy said:


> Why dont u just try using fillers first?



Just not cost effective; the whole reason I went for implants in the first place is because the results are permanent.


nastynas said:


> man im rooting for you since the first day of your thread in lookism but you are acting childish here for a grown man.e
> everyone knows and says you are fine just get your eyes done but you act like a kid saying "but i wanna get it doooooneeeee" well if you want it that much just leave and get it done while knowing it wont make THAT much of a difference or change your eyes to make a radical change on your face.
> 
> your choice.



I appreciate the support (and still regret the fall of Lookism), but it's like I said in my responses to kota and Amnesia -- me getting the revision is more about satisfying myself and getting the results I wanted in the first place, and less about me getting the revision because I think it will make me more attractive to girls.


Deusmaximus said:


> You need a fade haircut, and some fashionmaxxed clothes to look more stylish and young. Go for eye surgery. Look at Mt2 for tanning, and maybe also something to get a hardcore body. Lower gonial angle would also not hurt.



Thanks, I'm looking forward to making some fashion/grooming changes when I get closer to graduating from school this May. As things are now, my days pretty much revolve around getting up, going to work for free at the hospital as part of my school internship, working out at the gym or running at the park in the evenings, and then going out to eat afterwards. So taking into consideration how my routine is now, there isn't much of a point in making those kinds of changes yet since they wouldn't really make much of a difference when taking my "lifestyle" (or lack thereof) into consideration. However, I'm looking forward to making a big move next summer/fall, so I'm hoping to have all these changes in place by then (both surgery and softmaxxes, like fashion/grooming).

I definitely agree that the lower gonial angles would be a good idea; in fact, that's what the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me should achieve.


OCDMaxxing said:


> Don't fuck with your current implants, but focus on the following:
> - Eye area
> - Getting tan (melanotan II)
> - Getting ripped (roids)
> ...



Appreciate the tips. I agree with all the changes you suggested but am apprehensive about leg lengthening because of the long-term adverse effects on lifestyle and mobility.

BTW, I think your suggestion to get tattoos is an especially good one; in fact, a girl I know who, by all accounts, would be considered a megalowhore (50+ laycount) said that tattoos and fade haircuts (I.e., bad boy-ish look) are some of the elements she looks for when determining whether she considers a guy to be hookup material or not.


KEy21 said:


> Go get your eye area fixed next month and never visit this site again



No offense man, but why don't you think I should make any changes other than getting my eye area fixed? You even agreed in another post that a bit more augmentation on my midface implants could look good (although the amount of improvement might be disproportionate to the financial cost) along with the lower gonial angles I'd get from the jaw implant, so I don't get why you're against me getting anything else done besides eye surgery. After all, you've had way more stuff done than me and have had great results so far, so why is everyone so convinced that I won't get solid results as well?

Edited to add: I'm almost 32 years old. I need to do anything and everything I can to looksmax and become more attractive, whether it's via surgery or through "soft" methods like using Retin-A, red light therapy, astaxanthin, etc.


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 30, 2019)

What surgey are u gonna get for ur eyes and with who?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> What surgey are u gonna get for ur eyes and with who?



Lower eyelid retraction surgery w/spacer grafts, orbital decompression, lateral canthoplasty. Possibly fat or filler injections to upper eyelids. Going with Dr. Taban


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## Gosick (Oct 30, 2019)

gl


I scheduled my rhinoplasty as well in 2 months from now.


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 30, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Lower eyelid retraction surgery w/spacer grafts, orbital decompression, lateral canthoplasty. Possibly fat or filler injections to upper eyelids. Going with Dr. Taban


That will ascend you, If you get good results from the eye surgey you will look really good but I don’t really know what ur end goal is, this is a group of the most black pilled “negative” people and pretty much everyone agrees that’s all you need


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

Gosick said:


> gl
> 
> 
> I scheduled my rhinoplasty as well in 2 months from now.



Cool, good luck. After I do my midface revision + jaw implant with Dr. Y, I'll be going to Taban for the eye work, hopefully by early next fall. At that point I hope to be doing with hardcore surgery-based looksmaxxing.


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 30, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Cool, good luck. After I do my midface revision + jaw implant with Dr. Y, I'll be going to Taban for the eye work, hopefully by early next fall. At that point I hope to be doing with hardcore surgery-based looksmaxxing.


You should get on testerone lol I think it would help u


SurgerySoon said:


> Lower eyelid retraction surgery w/spacer grafts, orbital decompression, lateral canthoplasty. Possibly fat or filler injections to upper eyelids. Going with Dr. Taban


Question do you have any fear of surgery complications?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> That will ascend you, If you get good results from the eye surgey you will look really good but I don’t really know what ur end goal is, this is a group of the most black pilled “negative” people and pretty much everyone agrees that’s all you need



Thx; the thing is, I don't just want to correct failos, I want to ascend literally everything that could use improvement. Ideally, I will come out of all this looking like a totally different person.


Looksmax305 said:


> You should get on testerone lol I think it would help u
> 
> Question do you have any fear of surgery complications?



Actually I ran a cycle of test prop + 1-testosterone cypionate + Anavar back during the spring and summer. Looking forward to doing another cycle before my revision surgery


Looksmax305 said:


> Question do you have any fear of surgery complications?



Not really. Nothing to lose at this point. Your situation may be different from mine


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 30, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thx; the thing is, I don't just want to correct failos, I want to ascend literally everything that could use improvement. Ideally, I will come out of all this looking like a totally different person.
> 
> 
> Actually I ran a cycle of test prop + 1-testosterone cypionate + Anavar back during the spring and summer. Looking forward to doing another cycle before my revision surgery
> ...


U should go on trt ur old enough. Damn bro that’s sad to hear, hope everything goes well for u brother. Brothers in looksmaxxing lmao 😂


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> U should go on trt ur old enough. Damn bro that’s sad to hear, hope everything goes well for u brother. Brothers in looksmaxxing lmao 😂



LOL thanks, you too. Might consider going on TRT eventually depending on how my next cycle goes. Also going to start running HGH every day again.


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## Looksmax305 (Oct 30, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> LOL thanks, you too. Might consider going on TRT eventually depending on how my next cycle goes. Also going to start running HGH every day again.


Another question do you have to go under for these surgery’s or can you elect to just be sedated, that’s honestly what holds me back . Anesthesia is kind of scary to me, and if I were to die from looksmaxxing that would the ultimate fail lmao


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 30, 2019)

Looksmax305 said:


> Another question do you have to go under for these surgery’s or can you elect to just be sedated, that’s honestly what holds me back . Anesthesia is kind of scary to me, and if I were to die from looksmaxxing that would the ultimate fail lmao



I'm pretty sure you have to go under for most surgeries. Anesthesia is pretty safe these days so I wouldn't really worry about it


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## SHARK (Oct 30, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> First off, there's a shockingly large amount of blue pilled garbage advice itt I would expect from reddit not a PSL site, muh work on inner confidence, muh watch RSD. Fuck off faggots, hes already invested into surgery hes asking for surgery advice if you have none to give gtfo.
> 
> 
> So there's a few issues I see, lets use this pic as reference
> ...


I have low set, recessed cheekbones. Is it not possible to get zygo implants placed high up to simulate high cheekbones?


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

SHARK said:


> I have low set, recessed cheekbones. Is it not possible to get zygo implants placed high up to simulate high cheekbones?



I'm not sure TBH; I would get in touch with a surgeon who has lots of experience doing cheek implant procedures on male patients like Eppley or Yaremchuk, or maybe even Binder in CA.


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## fukmylyf (Oct 31, 2019)

SHARK said:


> I have low set, recessed cheekbones. Is it not possible to get zygo implants placed high up to simulate high cheekbones?


crying will improve ur cheekbones so keep doing it


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## OCDMaxxing (Oct 31, 2019)

Everything except eye area in your face is pretty perfect. Also, you look older than 30, which is bad, so think about youthmaxxing methods. I'm surprised you are incel tbh. My face is way more shit than yours, but I'm 6'2'', roided and tanned and I get foid attention and have sex.


SurgerySoon said:


> You may say the implant results look "good enough," but I think you'd agree that they look at least a little underdone and that a few more mm would look really sharp.


No, I fucking don't agree you delusional OCD coper.

Fix the eyes, lengthen legs, roid, tat, tan and go slay pussy and stop being such a mentalcel.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

OCDMaxxing said:


> Everything except eye area in your face is pretty perfect. Also, you look older than 30, which is bad, so think about youthmaxxing methods. I'm surprised you are incel tbh. My face is way more shit than yours, but I'm 6'2'', roided and tanned and I get foid attention and have sex.
> 
> No, I fucking don't agree you delusional OCD coper.
> 
> Fix the eyes, lengthen legs, roid, tat, tan and go slay pussy and stop being such a mentalcel.



I appreciate the compliments and advice, but I find it worrisome that you say that I look older than 30. Most people I ask who I meet IRL tend to guess my age at 27-28, so every time I talk to someone who says I look significantly older than that makes me apprehensive that my current collagenmaxxing strategies may be ineffective. I started applying 0.1% Retin-A back in July 2018 (took a break for a month after I got my first round of surgeries back in March) and have been doing red light therapy on my face for at least 5 nights per week for several weeks now. I also started applying a topical peptide product containing Matrixyl 3000 and Argirelene a little over a week ago and am planning on ordering a dermapen soon so I can start dermaneedling my face.

Just curious, what is it about my face that makes me look 30+? Is it the nasolabial folds? Dry skin?


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## Deleted member 2486 (Oct 31, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Just curious, what is it about my face that makes me look 30+? Is it the nasolabial folds? Dry skin?


stop the cope. you dont look a day younger than 30. you look your age, literally. if i didnt know how old you are and had to guess i'd say ur 33 and ur 32 so its w/e. this is why i said time is a big factor for you so stop dicking around and start your life already


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## wristcel (Oct 31, 2019)

If most people IRL think you look 27, then just take that
People here are obviously gonna be as mean as possible lol


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## Deleted member 2486 (Oct 31, 2019)

wristcel said:


> People here are obviously gonna be as mean as possible lol


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

cocainecowboy said:


> stop the cope. you dont look a day younger than 30. you look your age, literally. if i didnt know how old you are and had to guess i'd say ur 33 and ur 32 so its w/e. this is why i said time is a big factor for you so stop dicking around and start your life already



WTF, I said in one of my previous posts that I already felt like it was over for me (largely because of age) and you argued with me and said it wasn't. 

I'm actually not even 32 yet (will be in a few months), so apparently I look even older than my actual age. Why is it "coping" for me to want to know what specific factors are responsible for making me look old?

And I also wasn't coping when I said that people IRL tend to guess my age at 28. I try to get as many data points as possible so that I can get a fairly reliable "average" age (or maybe most frequently guessed age is a better way to put it).

And age is part of the reason why I'm not worried about pursuing girls anymore. Here in the US, there are countless males (even in my small city) that are significantly better looking than me AND a decade younger than me, so why would an attractive female in her 20's consider hooking up with me at a club/bar when she could just as easily get a guy who is more attractive and also younger looking?

... Hold on, I just randomly remembered something -- back when another forum user did a Tinder experiment using a couple of my photos, wasn't it you who said that I looked 28 in those photos? Or was that another user with a similar username?


wristcel said:


> If most people IRL think you look 27, then just take that
> People here are obviously gonna be as mean as possible lol



LOL, I'm just trying to get as many data points (I.e., age guesses) as possible. If everyone here thinks I look 33+, it doesn't necessarily bother me (although it's obviously not what I would hope to hear), but I would like to gather as much objective information as I possibly can regarding the visual factors that make me appear to be at least that old.

FWIW, a few people IRL have guessed my age to be between 38-40, so 33 isn't the most brutal guess I've received. All I was saying in my previous post is that over the last 6-7 months, most people IRL have guessed either 27 or 28, but if everyone here truly thinks that I look to be 33 or older, then those are valid data points to take into consideration as well.


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## OCDMaxxing (Oct 31, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Just curious, what is it about my face that makes me look 30+? Is it the nasolabial folds? Dry skin?


Your nasolabial folds I think, but also general appearance of skin. You need to exercise more, get tan and get better skin.

I don't see your age being a problem though, since you look good overall.
Men can get women 5-10 years younger than them, so where is the issue?

Just work out, get buff, get a facial scar and neck tattoos and slay.

You sound ultra high inhib.


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

OCDMaxxing said:


> Your nasolabial folds I think, but also general appearance of skin. You need to exercise more, get tan and get better skin.



I hope that Taban can get rid of the NL folds and undereye hollows when he does my lower lid retraction surgery. Also, when I go back to Dr. Y to have my midface implants revised and to get the jaw implant placed, he will do another midface lift, which should hopefully help get rid of the folds (at least for a few years).

When you say to exercise more, are you referring to cardio or weight lifting? B/c I already lift weights 3 days/wk (have a rotator cuff tear and labrum tear so can't go too crazy) and run 4 days/wk, so I'm not sure if doing even more exercise would benefit the appearance of my skin.


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## OCDMaxxing (Oct 31, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I hope that Taban can get rid of the NL folds and undereye hollows when he does my lower lid retraction surgery. Also, when I go back to Dr. Y to have my midface implants revised and to get the jaw implant placed, he will do another midface lift, which should hopefully help get rid of the folds (at least for a few years).
> 
> When you say to exercise more, are you referring to cardio or weight lifting? B/c I already lift weights 3 days/wk (have a rotator cuff tear and labrum tear so can't go too crazy) and run 4 days/wk, so I'm not sure if doing even more exercise would benefit the appearance of my skin.


Cardio. I dunno, you will get more healthy looking, vibrant skin I think. You just don't look too healthy right now. Maybe it won't help, but you can try. Ideally you should do MMA, but with implants that route is closed. I honestly think implants for men are a very bad choice, because it makes you extremely high inhib and afraid to get into altercations, which is extremely unsexy. Women want low inhib men that can beat other males up. Your high inhibition will show off in micro-mannerisms and expressions, sending signals that you are an unworthy mate and not a risk taker. I'd really like to see before-after of your implant procedure to determine if it is all worth it. Can you show it please?


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## Amnesia (Oct 31, 2019)

Good ogee curve, high set sharpish rather than roundish like Andreas Eriksens who look primitive and feminine


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

OCDMaxxing said:


> Cardio. I dunno, you will get more healthy looking, vibrant skin I think. You just don't look too healthy right now. Maybe it won't help, but you can try. Ideally you should do MMA, but with implants that route is closed. I honestly think implants for men are a very bad choice, because it makes you extremely high inhib and afraid to get into altercations, which is extremely unsexy. Women want low inhib men that can beat other males up. Your high inhibition will show off in micro-mannerisms and expressions, sending signals that you are an unworthy mate and not a risk taker. I'd really like to see before-after of your implant procedure to determine if it is all worth it. Can you show it please?



Here is a link to a post I made in a thread back in September where I posted a set of pre-surgery photos as well as a set of post-surgery photos that were taken immediately after running 8-9 miles in extremely humid, hot weather. IMO my skin looks a lot better in those photos. I live in a region of the US that is EXTREMELY humid for about half the year, and then it gets very dry and cold beginning in Oct/Nov. The climate started becoming really dry over the last few weeks, so that may be one reason why my skin looks worse now. I'm also still peeling some from the Retin-A. Anyways, here's the link to the post in the thread:

https://looksmax.org/threads/about-...ppley-what-should-i-ask-him.39525/post-727987
Here is another series of post-surgery photos that were taken in mid-September when I was working at a hospital:

https://looksmax.org/threads/should-i-get-a-revision-of-my-midface-implants.43663/post-784708
Also, here's yet another set of post-surgery photos I took in mid-September after working out at the gym (no cardio); the last photo in the series is actually a gif of me in motion:

https://looksmax.org/threads/should-i-get-a-revision-of-my-midface-implants.43663/post-794850
The thing is, I like the overall design/morphology of the implants (both cheeks and chin) -- I just want the cheek implants to look more noticeable. If you notice, in the post-running photos, the ogee curve on the left side doesn't project very much. Like I said to Amnesia below, it's basically just a matter of keeping the same implant design and simply boosting the projection. Also notice how my midface looks more defined and hollowed out in the gif when I clench my masseter muscles. That's one reason I want to get the rest of my jaw implant put in (aside from lowering the gonial angle).



Amnesia said:


> Good ogee curve, high set sharpish rather than roundish like Andreas Eriksens who look primitive and feminine



Thanks. I agree 100% that the overall design of the implants is solid -- I just want them to project a bit more. In other words, it's simply a matter of keeping the design the same, but having implants of the same design be a bit more noticeable. In addition to a few mm of more lateral and anterior projection, I would also like for the ogee curve to project a bit more, especially on the left side.


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## Amnesia (Oct 31, 2019)

just looked over these pics



looks great man for real. 

I agree, in this pic from the viewer perspective the left zygo looks less prominent 





But even though you look great


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> just looked over these pics
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thanks. IMO it's not just the left zygo that is less prominent -- I think both the left and right sides need more projection. Also, in those post-running photos my implants might look more noticeable than they normally are because of the water weight I lost during the exercise. 

Another point I wanted to make is that even though lateral zygo flare-out isn't really necessary to be GL as a male (like you pointed out), I feel like I have the kind of face/skull shape that would be benefit from having that extra definition. IMO there's no way around it -- the issue is that he designed implants with solid morphology that are simply too small. They could've done so much more for my face (eyes notwithstanding), but he just didn't quite make them big enough. If you think about it, it would really be leaving a lot of potential aesthetic improvement on the table to NOT get them revised. 

BTW, do you agree with the other guys that I look to be 33? I was planning on getting a collagen-boosting laser treatment like Fraxel anyways, but if I really am aging that rapidly to the point that there's no way in hell I can pass for late 20's anymore, I need to get it done ASAP.


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## kota (Oct 31, 2019)

Yes, to answer your question I would advise against implant revision even if you had your eyes done first. Reason is your infraorbital/zygo projection is already perfect so there would be nothing to gain from it, while running the risk of complications and/or looking uncanny.

Some models just have less facial fat ie more hollow cheeks than you which make their zygos pop a bit more visually. I don't think trying to compensate for this by going overboard with the implant size is a good idea.

I hear what you're saying about wanting to get the results that you were going for etc but messing with an already top tier feature is not going to improve your looks, it's just a mental fixation at this point.


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## Amnesia (Oct 31, 2019)

ive had over 15 fraxel and ipl laser therapies, biggest waste of money ive done. u cannot cheat age genetics i dont believe in any of this stuff for looking younger. u look ur age not older, your eye area gives a huge failo for how old u look cause the droopy eyes make u look older plus the side effects from retin a.


u look rlly good in those exercise pics thats what i think, id be more than happy if i had ur ogee curve its what i wanna get fillers for to see how much better i look since my right zygo is not as prominent as my left


obv u need to get the revision cause nothingg we say is gunna matter, just do it but i wouldnt spend a nickel on any of that laser crap to look younger, if ur gunna get lateral projection which u are gnna end up cause lets be honest u wont be happy till u do, then ur gnna have to also get that jaw work done to balance it out


u mentioned the more revision u get the more scar tissue u create making it harder for taban to do eye area possibly? thats concerning since all this is for nothing if u cannot fix ur eyes, this would be all sunken cost if u cant dramatically change ur eye area man, remember u will probably have to get revision for ur eyes too since they are almost literally deformed state



(writing this in the dark so not caring about grammar capitalization etc)





edit, u also made a comment that u didnt think there was a big difference between before after ogee curve and how it looks, i have to disagree, u look dramatically better and different


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 31, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> ive had over 15 fraxel and ipl laser therapies, biggest waste of money ive done. u cannot cheat age genetics i dont believe in any of this stuff for looking younger. u look ur age not older, your eye area gives a huge failo for how old u look cause the droopy eyes make u look older plus the side effects from retin a.
> 
> 
> u look rlly good in those exercise pics thats what i think, id be more than happy if i had ur ogee curve its what i wanna get fillers for to see how much better i look since my right zygo is not as prominent as my left
> ...


How old are you? Last pics I've seen you look 24 I'd say


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## Amnesia (Oct 31, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> How old are you? Last pics I've seen you look 24 of say


31


also bee using tanning beds 3x a weeks since i was 18 so muh stay out of the sun theory btfo
i attribute it go being on a gluten free iet, that shit destroys my skin quality when i eat it, i had bad skin issues psoriasis flakly dry skin, a naturopathic dr said to go gluten free for a month and see how my skin reacted and it was a miracle


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## wellthatsucks (Oct 31, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> 31
> 
> 
> also bee using tanning beds 3x a weeks since i was 18 so muh stay out of the sun theory btfo


Lifefuel I guess. I mean my parents looked good for their age so that's one less thing I have to worry about that


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## Amnesia (Oct 31, 2019)

wellthatsucks said:


> Lifefuel I guess. I mean my parents looked good for their age so that's one less thing I have to worry about that


yeah my parents look rlly good for their age too so u might be golden, life doeesnt end at 30 bruh, stay lean and keep ur hairline and u will be 99 percentile for ur age n ur 30s the competition is a joke for my peers when i see fellow 30 smthings lmfao


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## SurgerySoon (Oct 31, 2019)

kota said:


> Yes, to answer your question I would advise against implant revision even if you had your eyes done first. Reason is your infraorbital/zygo projection is already perfect so there would be nothing to gain from it, while running the risk of complications and/or looking uncanny.
> 
> Some models just have less facial fat ie more hollow cheeks than you which make their zygos pop a bit more visually. I don't think trying to compensate for this by going overboard with the implant size is a good idea.
> 
> I hear what you're saying about wanting to get the results that you were going for etc but messing with an already top tier feature is not going to improve your looks, it's just a mental fixation at this point.



IDK, I guess it's like Amnesia said in his post below... it's just one of those situations where I simply won't be satisfied until I get more of the look I was going for in the first place, so I'll probably just have to end up getting it done and seeing what happens. What is your opinion on getting the rest of my jaw implant put in to lower the height of my jaw angles? If you recall, in the morph photo that someone made for me a few months ago back on Lookism, they didn't just dramatically improve the eye area, but they lowered my jaw angles as well and it really improved the overall balance of my face IMO.


Amnesia said:


> ive had over 15 fraxel and ipl laser therapies, biggest waste of money ive done. u cannot cheat age genetics i dont believe in any of this stuff for looking younger. u look ur age not older, your eye area gives a huge failo for how old u look cause the droopy eyes make u look older plus the side effects from retin a.
> 
> 
> u look rlly good in those exercise pics thats what i think, id be more than happy if i had ur ogee curve its what i wanna get fillers for to see how much better i look since my right zygo is not as prominent as my left
> ...



I guess it pretty much comes down to what you said in your post -- I'm not going to be satisfied until I get the revision done, so I might as well go ahead and do it. What makes it really hard to not want to get it done is that I can see how my face would look better with more angularity and definition in the midface area, so it's like the benefit is clear to me.

Also, I was planning on getting the rest of the jaw implant put in anyways, even if just for the benefit of having the lower jaw angles so that my skull doesn't look so short at the back (and to get a sharper, more straight jawline as well), so I guess all these enhancements will kind of all go along with each other.

It sucks to hear that the Fraxel treatments didn't do much for you, but are you sure they aren't the reason why people are guessing your age to be early-mid-20s? LOL

It's just disappointing to hear that they didn't do much for you because I was hoping there was SOMETHING out there that I could do in order to not look as old, or at least to not age as fast. Because if there isn't, then it sounds like I'm pretty much aging at my natural rate, which means that next year I'll look 33, the year after that I'll look 34, and so on. Do you honestly think there's anything I can do to try and get a late 20's look? Because if not, then my visual age is obviously going to make me have a hard time with attracting girls in pretty much any setting from here on out, regardless of how well my eye surgeries turn out. This is one of the reasons why I said in a response posted in another thread that I honestly don't think it's going to make any sense for me to pursue girls at this point in clubs, bars, etc. and that I'd honestly be better served just seeing an upscale escort a few times a month. Regardless of how much more attractive I become from all these surgeries, being a GL guy who looks noticeably older than other GL guys in pretty much all social settings puts me at an inherent disadvantage when it comes to attracting girls, and to insist otherwise is simply coping.

BTW, do you think the ppl IRL who guess my IRL to be 28 are just lying to me to be nice? I mean it sounded like they were making honest guesses but I could be wrong. I'm not trying to cope here; I was honestly just trying to gather as many honest data points (in terms of age guesses from ppl) as possible, so I'm not sure why they'd like to me. Also, it's not like I'm randomly sperging out and asking random ppl to guess my age out of nowhere; I usually ask them to guess it after we've already gotten into a conversation on aging, finishing school and starting our careers, etc.

@wellthatsucks @kota @PrettyBoyMaxxing Do you agree with everyone else here that I pretty much look solidly 31-32 at minimum? What's weird is that when someone ran the Tinder experiment using my photos about a month ago, people guessed my age at 28-ish, but now everyone's saying 32-33, so I guess I'm just curious as to how old I really do look and whether there's anything I can do to try and look younger, skincare-wise.


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## kota (Nov 1, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> IDK, I guess it's like Amnesia said in his post below... it's just one of those situations where I simply won't be satisfied until I get more of the look I was going for in the first place, so I'll probably just have to end up getting it done and seeing what happens. What is your opinion on getting the rest of my jaw implant put in to lower the height of my jaw angles? If you recall, in the morph photo that someone made for me a few months ago back on Lookism, they didn't just dramatically improve the eye area, but they lowered my jaw angles as well and it really improved the overall balance of my face IMO.
> 
> @wellthatsucks @kota @PrettyBoyMaxxing Do you agree with everyone else here that I pretty much look solidly 31-32 at minimum? What's weird is that when someone ran the Tinder experiment using my photos about a month ago, people guessed my age at 28-ish, but now everyone's saying 32-33, so I guess I'm just curious as to how old I really do look and whether there's anything I can do to try and look younger, skincare-wise.



Yea hopefully doing it will give you piece of mind on the matter at least. 

Yes, I agree you could benefit from slightly longer ramus / lower jaw angles.

I think you look slightly younger than your age.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 1, 2019)

kota said:


> Yea hopefully doing it will give you piece of mind on the matter at least.
> 
> Yes, I agree you could benefit from slightly longer ramus / lower jaw angles.
> 
> I think you look slightly younger than your age.



Thanks for the feedback. Assuming I'm able to get rid of the undereye hollowing and nasolabial folds (for a few years, at least), do you think I could at least somewhat convincingly come across as 28?


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## zq336 (Nov 2, 2019)

I've been following all your posts, I agree with many of the others here that you should not get the revision. The midface implants may be too small in your mind, but I think they look excellent and are very prominent, way more than the average guy. If you get them revised, the best case outcome is that you look a bit different, but not better. The worst case outcome is that they end up too big, and out of sync with the rest of your face, which will actually drop you a few points in looks, because uncanny/overdone is probably one of the things people will notice the most. 

I know that your goal is to improve your looks as much as possible, but getting bigger implants will not help you in that goal. If you want your cheekbones to pop out more, I would try to get to 10% or less body fat, which you are definitely not right now. Just focus on eye surgery/hair/body, and you'll be fine. 

And also, peace of mind or mental satisfaction is not a good reason to get a surgery... it just means that you are being obsessive. Your implants are fine, you just need to stop thinking about it. 

DId you see any eye surgeons besides Taban? Might be worth getting a few different opinions.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 2, 2019)

zq336 said:


> I've been following all your posts, I agree with many of the others here that you should not get the revision. The midface implants may be too small in your mind, but I think they look excellent and are very prominent, way more than the average guy. If you get them revised, the best case outcome is that you look a bit different, but not better. The worst case outcome is that they end up too big, and out of sync with the rest of your face, which will actually drop you a few points in looks, because uncanny/overdone is probably one of the things people will notice the most.
> 
> I know that your goal is to improve your looks as much as possible, but getting bigger implants will not help you in that goal. If you want your cheekbones to pop out more, I would try to get to 10% or less body fat, which you are definitely not right now. Just focus on eye surgery/hair/body, and you'll be fine.
> 
> ...



As always, I appreciate advice and input from other users, but I'm afraid this is one of those things I'll pretty much have no choice on getting done for myself in order to finally be satisfied. I think that one of the primary reasons I'm so motivated to have the midface implants tweaked/revised is because it's pretty easy to see (IMO) how a bit more forward projection would actually be an objectively attractive change. In other words, I'm just not making the implants bigger and more noticeable just to satisfy my own obsessive compulsions; I think they would legitimately make me a bit better-looking overall to be a little bigger.

Also, I think that by making them a little more noticeable it could potentially confer something of a halo effect by giving me the ability to more effectively fraud myself as one of "those guys" with a stereotypically chiseled/masculine face, even if the fundamental elements of my face (e.g., ratios, proportions, FWHR, etc.) won't ever allow me to actually be a legitimate Chad. Does what I'm saying here make sense? In other words, the hope would be that to certain girls (e.g., those who are tipsy or aren't using to pulling traditionally GL guys), they'll look at me, see a highly above-average chiseled midface, and register me as a stereotypical decent-looking club guy with a few a stand-out features. 

I feel similarly about getting the jaw implant as well, because as it stands now, even though my jaw looks decent, the ramus is so steep that it prevents me from being perceived by people as having a generic "hot guy" jaw. It's kind of hard to explain, but it's basically that while it looks pretty good on my face, it's not a run-of-the-mill photogenic "model" jaw at this point. 

So in other words, both the midface implant and jaw implant surgeries are largely aimed at giving me isolated model-ish features to help me at least fraud a few of the traits that really GL guys have.

To answer your question, I haven't consulted with anyone besides Taban for my eye surgeries. I have talked with Dr. Y (who did my midface and chin implant surgeries) and he basically suggested the same plan as Taban. 

However, at this point, I am strongly leaning towards not doing any other plastic surgeries, simply because I recognize that my looks ceiling is so low compared to what legitimately GL/hot guys look like (as well as constraints related to my age) to the point that I now realize I'll never become GL like I had always hoped to become. So at this point, I honestly don't know if I'll be moving forward with getting anything else done.


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## Kade (Nov 2, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> yeah my parents look rlly good for their age too so u might be golden, life doeesnt end at 30 bruh, stay lean and keep ur hairline and u will be 99 percentile for ur age n ur 30s the competition is a joke for my peers when i see fellow 30 smthings lmfao


31 isn’t even old but jesus christ, go to your next highschool reuinion and species mog every guy in existence


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## kota (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thanks for the feedback. Assuming I'm able to get rid of the undereye hollowing and nasolabial folds (for a few years, at least), do you think I could at least somewhat convincingly come across as 28?


Yeah you could already get away with that no problem IMO.

When you say you're 'strongly leaning towards not doing any other plastic surgeries', are you talking about not even doing the eye surgery any more?


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## Deleted member 502 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I had custom midface and chin implant surgery back in March 2019, and some of you may recall that over the last few months, I've been debating back-and-forth over whether I should go back to Dr. Y to have the midface implants either enhanced with an additional 2-3 mm-thick layer of silicone or revised completely. I know that most of you have told me to just leave well enough alone and focus on fixing my eye area, but I have decided to go back in March 2020 to have my midface implants enhanced with an additional layer of silicone. I will also be having the rest of the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me placed as well.
> 
> While I definitely think my midface looks improved as compared to what it looked like pre-surgery, I just want a more noticeably chiseled appearance. At 3.5 mm of augmentation and 5.5 mm of augmentation, respectively, on the left and right sides of the face, there's just not enough forward projection to really make the implant work stick out. I also want a bit more lateral projection on the zygomatic arches.
> 
> ...










Gosick said:


> lol wtf so your delaying your eye area overhaul for midface revision wtf man. I dont think adding 3mm to your zygos or w,e when they already look more then fine will improve your chances with women, but im very much sure fixing your eyes will.


What eye surgery will improve his eyes?


Gosick said:


> lol wtf so your delaying your eye area overhaul for midface revision wtf man. I dont think adding 3mm to your zygos or w,e when they already look more then fine will improve your chances with women, but im very much sure fixing your eyes will.


What eye surgery will improve his eyes?


SurgerySoon said:


> Thx; I started applying Retin-A (0.1% -- highest strength available) in July 2018 but took a break for about a month this past March after I underwent my first rounds of surgeries. During the summer I injected a round of GHK-Cu (I think 50 mg total over the course of several weeks? Need to go back and review how much I ordered). I have also been doing 20 - 30 minutes of red light therapy directly on my face for maybe 3-ish weeks now, although I don't do it on certain weeknights when I have to get up early. On 10/21, I started applying a hyaluronic acid-based serum with very high concentrations of two peptides (matrixl 3000 50% and argireline 10%), although I'm not sure if it's too early to notice a difference yet.
> 
> I also took those photos after running in extremely humid weather, so I sweated a lot during the exercising. Not sure how much that influences how my skin looks in the photos.
> 
> ...


Where can I buy HGH?


SurgerySoon said:


> It's almost funny that half the forum is utterly convinced that I don't have what it takes to become anymore attractive WHATSOEVER than I already am, and yet at the same time, *nobody can actually point to any features/elements of my face and say "this/that is why you will never be anymore attractive than you are now."*


About ten posters have told you to fix your eye area. You seem a bit dim.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 3, 2019)

kota said:


> Yeah you could already get away with that no problem IMO.
> 
> When you say you're 'strongly leaning towards not doing any other plastic surgeries', are you talking about not even doing the eye surgery any more?



Yeah, possibly. I'm just not sure that any type or amount of PS will be enough to obtain the substantial degree of improvement and revamping of my overall look that I originally set out to get when I first started planning surgeries last year. Just not sure if any of it will be worth paying for in the end. I may schedule a consultation with one of the well-known maxfac surgeons who is regarded for doing astounding, identity-changing work with osteotomies, such as Dr. Sailer in Switzerland.


VirtueSignaller said:


> View attachment 154979
> 
> 
> 
> Where can I buy HGH?



Alibaba.com


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## Deleted member 2846 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> IDK, I guess it's like Amnesia said in his post below... it's just one of those situations where I simply won't be satisfied until I get more of the look I was going for in the first place, so I'll probably just have to end up getting it done and seeing what happens. What is your opinion on getting the rest of my jaw implant put in to lower the height of my jaw angles? If you recall, in the morph photo that someone made for me a few months ago back on Lookism, they didn't just dramatically improve the eye area, but they lowered my jaw angles as well and it really improved the overall balance of my face IMO.
> 
> 
> I guess it pretty much comes down to what you said in your post -- I'm not going to be satisfied until I get the revision done, so I might as well go ahead and do it. What makes it really hard to not want to get it done is that I can see how my face would look better with more angularity and definition in the midface area, so it's like the benefit is clear to me.
> ...


you look good for ur age. 28ish seems good. eye area work would halo your age hard (from what i’ve seen in the morphs).


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 3, 2019)

PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> you look good for ur age. 28ish seems good. eye area work would halo your age hard (from what i’ve seen in the morphs).



Thnx but I think it's all just cope and wishful thinking. Besides the people on here rating my visual age as looking pretty old, two ppl I asked IRL guessed 38-40.


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## Deleted member 2846 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thnx but I think it's all just cope and wishful thinking. Besides the people on here rating my visual age as looking pretty old, two ppl I asked IRL guessed 38-40.


honestly a lot of people look either 28 to 40. it’s reallt hard to tell the difference at that age. it can go either way


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 3, 2019)

PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> honestly a lot of people look either 28 to 40. it’s reallt hard to tell the difference at that age. it can go either way



The other issue is soft tissue descent as the ligaments/muscles of the face weaken. Once that occurs, even having thick skin/good collagen from Retin-A/Tazorac abuse won't allow someone to fraud their age anymore


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## KEy21 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Yeah, possibly. I'm just not sure that any type or amount of PS will be enough to obtain the substantial degree of improvement and revamping of my overall look that I originally set out to get when I first started planning surgeries last year. Just not sure if any of it will be worth paying for in the end. I may schedule a consultation with one of the well-known maxfac surgeons who is regarded for doing astounding, identity-changing work with osteotomies, such as Dr. Sailer in Switzerland.
> 
> 
> Alibaba.com


Could I become a vendor there within a day or two if I signed up?


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## Deleted member 2846 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> The other issue is soft tissue descent as the ligaments/muscles of the face weaken. Once that occurs, even having thick skin/good collagen from Retin-A/Tazorac abuse won't allow someone to fraud their age anymore


when does that occur? mid 30’s?


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## KEy21 (Nov 3, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> The other issue is soft tissue descent as the ligaments/muscles of the face weaken. Once that occurs, even having thick skin/good collagen from Retin-A/Tazorac abuse won't allow someone to fraud their age anymore


You already got a mid face lift and now your almond eye surgery will delay aging further. Possible fill in volume loss with restalyn as well


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 3, 2019)

KEy21 said:


> Could I become a vendor there within a day or two if I signed up?



Not sure how all that works TBH, I've only ever bought products there (never sold anything)


PrettyBoyMaxxing said:


> when does that occur? mid 30’s?



Not sure TBH, I think I've read it can start happening by late 20's/early 30's but probably depends on genetics as well. There's a guy who works at the hospital I'm doing my internship at who is 43 y/o, yet he doesn't look any older than 31-ish. He's half white, half Hispanic. Face looks almost but not quite fat (like he has natural fillers injected into his face 24/7 or something)


KEy21 said:


> You already got a mid face lift and now your almond eye surgery will delay aging further. Possible fill in volume loss with restalyn as well



On a related note, I wonder how long the effects of a midface lift last. On RealSelf, some of the surgeons say they can last for decades (so much longer than standard facelifts) because of the fact that midface lifts are performed at a deeper level of tissue (the periosteum). Also, Dr. Y's variation of the procedure involves stitching the midface tissues to the implants themselves. For the first few months, this made it feel weird, like there were sharp pieces of chicken wire that poked into my skin every now and then


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## Amnesia (Nov 4, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Thnx but I think it's all just cope and wishful thinking. Besides the people on here rating my visual age as looking pretty old, two ppl I asked IRL guessed 38-40.


You're asking dumb normies IRL who look at your eye area and see droopy eyes that's why they say that, you have better skin quality than me and less pronounced naso folds as I do


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## kota (Nov 4, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Yeah, possibly. I'm just not sure that any type or amount of PS will be enough to obtain the substantial degree of improvement and revamping of my overall look that I originally set out to get when I first started planning surgeries last year. Just not sure if any of it will be worth paying for in the end. I may schedule a consultation with one of the well-known maxfac surgeons who is regarded for doing astounding, identity-changing work with osteotomies, such as Dr. Sailer in Switzerland.


Come on man, your mind is jumping from prioritizing debatable revision surgeries to not doing anything at all? You're missing the key to your ascension which is fixing the eyes.


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## reptiles (Nov 4, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I had custom midface and chin implant surgery back in March 2019, and some of you may recall that over the last few months, I've been debating back-and-forth over whether I should go back to Dr. Y to have the midface implants either enhanced with an additional 2-3 mm-thick layer of silicone or revised completely. I know that most of you have told me to just leave well enough alone and focus on fixing my eye area, but I have decided to go back in March 2020 to have my midface implants enhanced with an additional layer of silicone. I will also be having the rest of the wraparound jaw implant that was designed for me placed as well.
> 
> While I definitely think my midface looks improved as compared to what it looked like pre-surgery, I just want a more noticeably chiseled appearance. At 3.5 mm of augmentation and 5.5 mm of augmentation, respectively, on the left and right sides of the face, there's just not enough forward projection to really make the implant work stick out. I also want a bit more lateral projection on the zygomatic arches.
> 
> ...






Remeber you from lookism


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## justanothergymcell (Nov 4, 2019)

Your plans are ALMOST as ridiculous as below. The guy practically has a thyroid condition or Graves diseases but decides to blow thousands on fillers instead.


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## Deusmaximus (Nov 4, 2019)

Get a cat eyes brow lift surgery. This will bring your down tilted eye arches and brows up.


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## justanothergymcell (Nov 4, 2019)

Deusmaximus said:


> Get a cat eyes brow lift surgery. This will bring your down tilted eye arches and brows up.



Lol what a bad suggestion from mr obsessed over eyebrows himself.


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## kota (Nov 5, 2019)

Deusmaximus said:


> Get a cat eyes brow lift surgery. This will bring your down tilted eye arches and brows up.



Angle frauded result


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## Deusmaximus (Nov 5, 2019)

justanothergymcell said:


> Lol what a bad suggestion from mr obsessed over eyebrows himself.



Once again, its not about the eyebrows. The eyelid arches are to heavy and making the eye look nct. When you push this skin up with the lifting, the eye looks totally different.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 5, 2019)

reptiles said:


> Remeber you from lookism



Yep, that's where it all started for me. It's a shame all that content was destroyed


Deusmaximus said:


> Get a cat eyes brow lift surgery. This will bring your down tilted eye arches and brows up.




I agree that the eyebrows and eyes look better in the post-surgery photo. I would just be apprehensive about getting brow lift since it seems like a lot of results end up looking uncanny/overdone.


justanothergymcell said:


> Lol what a bad suggestion from mr obsessed over eyebrows himself.



Why do you think it's a bad suggestion? I had actually thought about getting Botox injected into the medial parts of my eyebrows to make them look flatter and more masculine


justanothergymcell said:


> Your plans are ALMOST as ridiculous as below. The guy practically has a thyroid condition or Graves diseases but decides to blow thousands on fillers instead.




To make a comparison to myself and my own goals, while I agree that he needs to fix his eyes, why does that also have to mean that he shouldn't get work done to any other aspect of his face? In other words, if he had gotten his eyes done first, would you say that he wouldn't benefit from fillers/implants to improve the other aspects of his face? (Although I do think the filler results were way too subtle in general)

It seems like a lot of the people who post here are of the opinion that only severe failos should be addressed via surgery. That's where my mentality differs -- even though I agree that failos should be fixed, I don't see why people shouldn't improve other features that aren't disastrously bad as well as long as they have room to be improved. 

And like I've said a million times already, the only reason I would consider getting my midface implants revised before going to Taban for my eyes is because I won't be able to have anything else done to my midface once I have had eye surgery. 

However, in recent weeks, I have strongly considered abandoning all future surgery plans, partially because of reasons we've talked about before via PM. I realize that at my age and with my starting point and looksmaxxing ceiling, I'm never going to become as physically attractive as I'd like to be, and considering how much all of this is going to cost ($20k+ for the eye surgeries alone), I honestly think I'd rather save the money for escorts and whatever else I'd like to do in life.

With my proximity to a local military base, I see legit Chads and gigachads on a daily basis. Not only are these guys insanely better-looking than me, but they're also a good 5-10 years younger than me in most cases. So if a girl can have her pick of guys who are on that level of attractiveness, why would she ever bother with settling for a guy like me, unless she's just looking for a betabuxx to take advantage of in a relationship (which is something I'm not interested in)?

So basically, I agree with what you said before about it mostly being over for me (possibly to even more of an extreme than you tried to convince me of) due to various factors (age, starting point, etc.).

So like I said, at this point in my life, I think the money that it's going to cost to fix my eyes and any other features only to still be marginally attractive (at best) would be more wisely spent on escorts, savings, etc. The only possible exception is if I was to consider having dramatic face-restructuring surgery with someone like Raffaini or Sailer.


kota said:


> Come on man, your mind is jumping from prioritizing debatable revision surgeries to not doing anything at all? You're missing the key to your ascension which is fixing the eyes.



See the response I posted above to @justanothergymcel regarding why I'm leaning towards not getting anything else done.


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## Looksmax25 (Nov 5, 2019)

Might as well fix eye area you have already came this far...


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## WannaBeA6 (Nov 5, 2019)

OP, tell me you have your surgery scheduled with Taban

It's literally the only thing left you need


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## Brandon10 (Nov 5, 2019)

justanothergymcell said:


> Your plans are ALMOST as ridiculous as below. The guy practically has a thyroid condition or Graves diseases but decides to blow thousands on fillers instead.



Lol that's the dumbest shit I've ever seen, substituting orbital decompression with fillers and even worse, fillers not injected into the inner orbit. Some fucktards MDs should just never practice.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 5, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> You're asking dumb normies IRL who look at your eye area and see droopy eyes that's why they say that, you have better skin quality than me and less pronounced naso folds as I do



Trust me, my skin quality and NL folds are both way worse than yours, especially in certain types of lighting


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## Kade (Nov 5, 2019)

Deusmaximus said:


> Once again, its not about the eyebrows. The eyelid arches are to heavy and making the eye look nct. When you push this skin up with the lifting, the eye looks totally different.



how can you not see that this result is terrible


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## Traxanas (Nov 5, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Trust me, my skin quality and NL folds are both way worse than yours, especially in certain types of lighting


I think one of the reasons why you look older is your coloring, very bland and single color


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## Unknownjpg (Nov 5, 2019)

Thankfully read the whole thread on lookism a while back, I do think you should go to Taban and leave it at that imo. You’ve came so far and I think getting eyes will help a ton if not for “slaying” then for your own confidence, it’s crazy what eyes can do to a face, I really need to fix mine also. So let’s say after you get the eyes done you can’t do anything with Zygo implants/midface ?


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 5, 2019)

Traxanas said:


> I think one of the reasons why you look older is your coloring, very bland and single color



Maybe so. I think soft tissue descent is part of it as well


Unknownjpg said:


> Thankfully read the whole thread on lookism a while back, I do think you should go to Taban and leave it at that imo. You’ve came so far and I think getting eyes will help a ton if not for “slaying” then for your own confidence, it’s crazy what eyes can do to a face, I really need to fix mine also. So let’s say after you get the eyes done you can’t do anything with Zygo implants/midface ?



Well, I could, but getting the midface implants revised after getting the eye surgeries could ruin the results of the eye surgeries since incisions would have to be made in the same area (lower eyelids) as the incisions for the eye surgeries.


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## Amnesia (Nov 6, 2019)

You guys have difference structures but in terms of facial width this selfie of cavill made me think of you








Spoiler: uncensored eye area


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 6, 2019)

Amnesia said:


> You guys have difference structures but in terms of facial width this selfie of cavill made me think of you
> 
> View attachment 157913
> 
> ...



I'll take that as a compliment but Cavill is insanely better-looking LOL (not just different facial structure). Also, I was frauding in that photo by biting down to flex my masseters LOL. But do you see how his jaw angles are lower than mine? That was one reason I wanted to go back to get the rest of my jaw implant put in, since it would lower my jaw angles by 0.5 cm and 0.7 cm on each side. Also, Cavill still has more lateral zygo projection than me in that photo.


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## forwardgrowth (Nov 10, 2019)

Has anyone suggested that you have zero eyelashes.. makes your eyes look very bad, fix that and your philtrum bro too long, makes you look older if your goal is slaying and such, i suggest lip lift, neck training to make your jaw width, eyebrow+eyelash transplant, double jaw for your mouth area/maxilla

btw whats ur ipd?


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 10, 2019)

forwardgrowth said:


> Has anyone suggested that you have zero eyelashes.. makes your eyes look very bad, fix that and your philtrum bro too long, makes you look older if your goal is slaying and such, i suggest lip lift, neck training to make your jaw width, eyebrow+eyelash transplant, double jaw for your mouth area/maxilla
> 
> btw whats ur ipd?



Not sure what my IPD is, never measured it. I have considered doing a lip lift but don't want to make my philtrum too short since my chin is naturally somewhat long and don't want to throw off the ratios. I might look into something for my eyelashes as well as double jaw surgery in the future if I do decide to pursue getting additional surgeries.


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## forwardgrowth (Nov 10, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Not sure what my IPD is, never measured it. I have considered doing a lip lift but don't want to make my philtrum too short since my chin is naturally somewhat long and don't want to throw off the ratios. I might look into something for my eyelashes as well as double jaw surgery in the future if I do decide to pursue getting additional surgeries.


Your super high 65mm+ ipd, lack of bone, and zero eyelashes make your eye area look unhealthy, thats a smart idea consideration on the lip lift I would srsly look into your philtrum falios the fuark out of u, I would prioritize double jaw after eyelid stuff


If you really just want to slay though body is king


SurgerySoon said:


> I'll take that as a compliment but Cavill is insanely better-looking LOL (not just different facial structure). Also, I was frauding in that photo by biting down to flex my masseters LOL. But do you see how his jaw angles are lower than mine? That was one reason I wanted to go back to get the rest of my jaw implant put in, since it would lower my jaw angles by 0.5 cm and 0.7 cm on each side. Also, Cavill still has more lateral zygo projection than me in that photo.


Have you ever considered a malar fat pad lift? it could show off your midface implants better, by age 30 the malar pad sinks drastically


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 10, 2019)

forwardgrowth said:


> Your super high 65mm+ ipd, lack of bone, and zero eyelashes make your eye area look unhealthy, thats a smart idea consideration on the lip lift I would srsly look into your philtrum falios the fuark out of u, I would prioritize double jaw after eyelid stuff
> 
> 
> If you really just want to slay though body is king
> ...



The only problem with the lip lift is that it could make my chin look too long, so I will have to be conservative with it. I have a chin implant too so I don't want to have to take it out if my philtrum gets shortened too much. I technically had sort of a malar fat pad lift when I had a midface lift performed during my surgery (bot sure if this procedure accomplishes the same thing).

If I do decide to get more surgeries I will be going to Taban to get orbital decompression, correction of lower lid retraction, and lateral canthoplasty. IDK if there's anything that can be done for my IPD aside from orbital box osteotomy which probably isn't a realistic surgery to get.
Btw, at my age, I don't think it is realistic to expect to be able to slay or be attractive to most girls in their 20s since they will also have guys who are 10+ years younger than me and way better-looking than me competing for them as well.


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## Deusmaximus (Nov 10, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> The only problem with the lip lift is that it could make my chin look too long, so I will have to be conservative with it. I have a chin implant too so I don't want to have to take it out if my philtrum gets shortened too much. I technically had sort of a malar fat pad lift when I had a midface lift performed during my surgery (bot sure if this procedure accomplishes the same thing).
> 
> If I do decide to get more surgeries I will be going to Taban to get orbital decompression, correction of lower lid retraction, and lateral canthoplasty. IDK if there's anything that can be done for my IPD aside from orbital box osteotomy which probably isn't a realistic surgery to get.
> Btw, at my age, I don't think it is realistic to expect to be able to slay or be attractive to most girls in their 20s since they will also have guys who are 10+ years younger than me and way better-looking than me competing for them as well.


Then why are you even doing this big and expensive surgery procedure? Just to slay some 30+ year old hags? Btw i think your temple area does not fit correctly with the lower face width. Maybe you should get some temple fillers.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 10, 2019)

Deusmaximus said:


> Then why are you even doing this big and expensive surgery procedure? Just to slay some 30+ year old hags? Btw i think your temple area does not fit correctly with the lower face width. Maybe you should get some temple fillers.



Even before I decided I wanted to be more attractive to girls, I wanted to get these surgeries to become better-looking in general (this was back in 2012). Even though I'm too old to be attractive to decent-looking girls anymore, I still want to get these procedures done because I realize I won't be personally satisfied with how I look until I do. BTW I might consider getting temple fillers to correct hollowing.


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## forwardgrowth (Nov 10, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Even before I decided I wanted to be more attractive to girls, I wanted to get these surgeries to become better-looking in general (this was back in 2012). Even though I'm too old to be attractive to decent-looking girls anymore, I still want to get these procedures done because I realize I won't be personally satisfied with how I look until I do. BTW I might consider getting temple fillers to correct hollowing.



you can def slay 20yrs srsly, what is your height are you bodymaxing? slaying 20yrs not crazy hard and your white psl 5 rn a 1000% possibility


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 10, 2019)

forwardgrowth said:


> you can def slay 20yrs srsly, what is your height are you bodymaxing? slaying 20yrs not crazy hard and your white psl 5 rn a 1000% possibility



Height is bordering on manlet status (5'10"). Currently gymmaxxing and will be running a steroid cycle in a few months. IMO it's not worth spending $$ to get more surgeries if I can't break PSL 5.


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## Kade (Nov 10, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Height is bordering on manlet status (5'10"). Currently gymmaxxing and will be running a steroid cycle in a few months. IMO it's not worth spending $$ to get more surgeries if I can't break PSL 5.


You literally can go past 5 tho 

just fix your eyes ffs and you’re there man


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## forwardgrowth (Nov 10, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Height is bordering on manlet status (5'10"). Currently gymmaxxing and will be running a steroid cycle in a few months. IMO it's not worth spending $$ to get more surgeries if I can't break PSL 5.


Honestly if you frauded 2inches and roided you could slay 20yrs with your current face, you have to realize even the gl guys you are competing against aren't actively appoarching, bc nobody has balls to approach in 2019 irl, and attraction is irrational, if trying to slay via tinder that will be harder, but I swear the amount of normies and psl 4 guys I see with the hottest girls at college bars was lol tier last weekend puts looks theory to shame

once your psl 5, masculinity height, frame, etc is all that matters, imo women aren't looking psl perfection as much as pheno/masc traits in men


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 10, 2019)

Kade said:


> You literally can go past 5 tho
> 
> just fix your eyes ffs and you’re there man



Thnx, I hope so. Just have to have faith in Taban being as good as ppl say he is


forwardgrowth said:


> Honestly if you frauded 2inches and roided you could slay 20yrs with your current face, you have to realize even the gl guys you are competing against aren't actively appoarching, bc nobody has balls to approach in 2019 irl, and attraction is irrational, if trying to slay via tinder that will be harder, but I swear the amount of normies and psl 4 guys I see with the hottest girls at college bars was lol tier last weekend puts looks theory to shame
> 
> once your psl 5, masculinity height, frame, etc is all that matters, imo women aren't looking psl perfection as much as pheno/masc traits in men



Yeah, I think it's important to try and obtain as many sexually dimorphic traits as possible for a male. I agree that it will be a lot harder to slay via Tinder, but with hookup apps becoming more and ubiquitous in western society, I still think it's critical to improve as many elements of my looks as possible, especially those that matter in terms of influencing how photogenic someone is. I feel like I would stick out pretty badly at a college-aged bar though LOL


forwardgrowth said:


> Honestly if you frauded 2inches and roided you could slay 20yrs with your current face, you have to realize even the gl guys you are competing against aren't actively appoarching, bc nobody has balls to approach in 2019 irl, and attraction is irrational, if trying to slay via tinder that will be harder, but I swear the amount of normies and psl 4 guys I see with the hottest girls at college bars was lol tier last weekend puts looks theory to shame
> 
> once your psl 5, masculinity height, frame, etc is all that matters, imo women aren't looking psl perfection as much as pheno/masc traits in men



Yeah, I think it's important to try and obtain as many sexually dimorphic traits as possible for a male. I agree that it will be a lot harder to slay via Tinder, but with hookup apps becoming more and ubiquitous in western society, I still think it's critical to improve as many elements of my looks as possible, especially those that matter in terms of influencing how photogenic someone is. I feel like I would stick out pretty badly at a college-aged bar though LOL


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## imuglymomadmitit (Nov 11, 2019)

your aim shouldnt be to look younger but to look good for your age. right now you look your age and not a year younger. and thats okay. you just dont belong to the gifted 10-20% percent who age very good (thanks to supreme genetic) and no skin routine will change that.

mentally youre not in a good position right now. i mean you are a 30 + year old MAN but you have the insecurities of a teenage girl. thats not a good thing.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 11, 2019)

imuglymomadmitit said:


> your aim shouldnt be to look younger but to look good for your age. right now you look your age and not a year younger. and thats okay. you just dont belong to the gifted 10-20% percent who age very good (thanks to supreme genetic) and no skin routine will change that.
> 
> mentally youre not in a good position right now. i mean you are a 30 + year old MAN but you have the insecurities of a teenage girl. thats not a good thing.



Oh well, sucks for me. I figured it was over for me anyways

Might not bother with the Retin-A and Tazorac if it doesn't seem to be making much of a difference in a few months


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## imuglymomadmitit (Nov 11, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> Oh well, sucks for me. I figured it was over for me anyways
> 
> Might not bother with the Retin-A and Tazorac if it doesn't seem to be making much of a difference in a few months



i wouldnt say that. you wont be able to relive your tweenties as a chad no matter how many surgeries you get but you will be able to have decent thirties given you fix your eye area, get that high paid job and let the past (wasted youth) go.


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 11, 2019)

imuglymomadmitit said:


> i wouldnt say that. you wont be able to relive your tweenties as a chad no matter how many surgeries you get but you will be able to have decent thirties given you fix your eye area, get that high paid job and let the past (wasted youth) go.



I'm not interested in being cucked in an LTR so it's probably over for me unless I resort to escortcelling. I'm not going to be cucked by girls who are interested in me just because I'm earning a good salary


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## nastynas (Nov 11, 2019)

you are underestimating your outcome after eye surgeries by shitty copes, you know that you will look like a whole different person yet you still fuck around with your midface implants and stuff. just move along


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## SurgerySoon (Nov 11, 2019)

nastynas said:


> you are underestimating your outcome after eye surgeries by shitty copes, you know that you will look like a whole different person yet you still fuck around with your midface implants and stuff. just move along



I want to agree with you wholeheartedly, but I honestly just don't think that any surgeon (not even Taban) has the ability to deliver the dramatic changes I'm looking to get. And besides, even if they could, I'd simply be looking at going from being an average guy with a noticeably below-average feature to being an average guy with average features all around. So in other words, I'm looking at paying $20k+ just to look decidedly average.


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## nastynas (Nov 11, 2019)

SurgerySoon said:


> I want to agree with you wholeheartedly, but I honestly just don't think that any surgeon (not even Taban) has the ability to deliver the dramatic changes I'm looking to get. And besides, even if they could, I'd simply be looking at going from being an average guy with a noticeably below-average feature to being an average guy with average features all around. So in other words, I'm looking at paying $20k+ just to look decidedly average.


whatever floats your boat man, just know that having average to above average features all around is good enough to be goodlooking


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## Lonenely sigma (Saturday at 8:08 PM)

SurgerySoon said:


> I want to agree with you wholeheartedly, but I honestly just don't think that any surgeon (not even Taban) has the ability to deliver the dramatic changes I'm looking to get. And besides, even if they could, I'd simply be looking at going from being an average guy with a noticeably below-average feature to being an average guy with average features all around. So in other words, I'm looking at paying $20k+ just to look decidedly average.


hey man, wanted to check out, how did those surgeries turn out to be? Did you change your zygos in the end?


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