could a palate expander lead to more prominent zygos?

[Deleted member 78220]

title, since a palate expander expands the maxilla, which the zygomatic bones are attached to, would this cause them to also get pushed out a bit more?

sorry if this is a common knowledge dumb question

 

[asdvek]

Yes

 

[Giorgio]

title, since a palate expander expands the maxilla, which the zygomatic bones are attached to, would this cause them to also get pushed out a bit more?

yes, but only laterally

be careful about this, since for most, lateral expansion is unwanted - it can lead to moonface

only people who will benefit are those that have zygos narrower than temples & gonions

 

[Deleted member 78220]

be careful about this, since for most, lateral expansion is unwanted - it can lead to moonface

what’s the alternative to lateral growth?

 

[SlayerJonas]

yes, but only laterally

be careful about this, since for most, lateral expansion is unwanted - it can lead to moonface

only people who will benefit are those that have zygos narrower than temples & gonions

Do you think you could get a MSE to expand the palate like this?

 

[Giorgio]

what’s the alternative to lateral growth?

well forward growth, and it's the more desirable one, but it's not possible to gain this (other than implants)

there is no convenient suture situated in such a way that it could be split to gain forward growth

Do you think you could get a MSE to expand the palate like this?

no, MSE just widens the palate/maxilla, it does not "lengthen" it

there used to be a ton of discussion on this forum back in 2021 and 22 about face pulling, people have though that they have found the holy grail, by attaching a face fulling device to MSE, and with the mse loosening sutures it supposedly should have made it possible to gain forward growth with reverse headgear

but nothing came off that, MSE does not allow the desired vector of growth (you can't pull upward or even strictly forward, only down-and-forward), so people later came up with the idea of using bollard plates or K2 miniscrew implants to anchor the reverse headgear

I think there even was a study done on a very similar concept

and this works! but you will not find any ortho to actually do this, literally nobody does this
essentially it's like mewing but on steroids, and one that actually works
instead of your tongue creating the force, it's a device pulling your maxilla forward with much much higher force

 

[Murmarize]

well forward growth, and it's the more desirable one, but it's not possible to gain this (other than implants)

there is no convenient suture situated in such a way that it could be split to gain forward growth

no, MSE just widens the palate/maxilla, it does not "lengthen" it

there used to be a ton of discussion on this forum back in 2021 and 22 about face pulling, people have though that they have found the holy grail, by attaching a face fulling device to MSE, and with the mse loosening sutures it supposedly should have made it possible to gain forward growth with reverse headgear

but nothing came off that, MSE does not allow the desired vector of growth (you can't pull upward or even strictly forward, only down-and-forward), so people later came up with the idea of using bollard plates or K2 miniscrew implants to anchor the reverse headgear

I think there even was a study done on a very similar concept

and this works! but you will not find any ortho to actually do this, literally nobody does this
essentially it's like mewing but on steroids, and one that actually works
instead of your tongue creating the force, it's a device pulling your maxilla forward with much much higher force

What do you think about the Alf Appliance for forward growth and development of the upper jaw?

 

[Giorgio]

What do you think about the Alf Appliance for forward growth and development of the upper jaw?

it's not gonna do what you want it, unless you're very young
it's the same issue as with AGG appliance, and that one was controversial because they marketed it as bone-borne, while all it did was push on teeth, and in many people it caused issues down the line (since the teeth got completely pushed out of the alveolar bone)

the appliance you linked looks like a weaker version of AGGA

looking at the promotional material, I only see kids there, so I think it's an amazing device and could transform a face (when used in a young child)

 

[Murmarize]

it's not gonna do what you want it, unless you're very young
it's the same issue as with AGG appliance, and that one was controversial because they marketed it as bone-borne, while all it did was push on teeth, and in many people it caused issues down the line (since the teeth got completely pushed out of the alveolar bone)

the appliance you linked looks like a weaker version of AGGA

looking at the promotional material, I only see kids there, so I think it's an amazing device and could transform a face (when used in a young child)

Can you tell me what I can do? I have been considering Alf to treat tooth symmetries and make jaw development better. I am 16 years old, I have a cross bite and really want to correct my bite and get a beautiful smile like Rodrigo Guirao

 

[Giorgio]

I have been considering Alf to treat tooth symmetries

alf, or even invisalign can work for tooth issues, as it acts on the teeth and the alveolar bone
but it will not give you true forward growth

make jaw development better

at 16 you still can expect your jaw to finish it's last phase of development
I remember when I was starting HS I (and all my classmates) were 16, and when we finished we were 20, and the difference was quite huge, with everyone looking way more masculine after

but also at 16 you unfortunately are behind the age where your bones are soft enough to actually be changed with devices like alf

I have a cross bite and really want to correct my bite and get a beautiful smile like Rodrigo Guirao

based, correcting the teeth is not very hard, most orthodontists deal with cases like these frequently
how many teeth does your smile show now?
in any case, never let them pull any teeth out due to crowding, take your time to find the ortho you feel comfortable with & ask questions like: "will the dental arch be expanded outwards?", "by how much?", find out if your teeth can be expanded outwards safely within the alveolar bone & if not, you can look into procedures such as corticotomies, or maybe even a palate expander (only if your palate is narrow)

 

[Murmarize]

alf, or even invisalign can work for tooth issues, as it acts on the teeth and the alveolar bone
but it will not give you true forward growth


at 16 you still can expect your jaw to finish it's last phase of development
I remember when I was starting HS I (and all my classmates) were 16, and when we finished we were 20, and the difference was quite huge, with everyone looking way more masculine after

but also at 16 you unfortunately are behind the age where your bones are soft enough to actually be changed with devices like alf

based, correcting the teeth is not very hard, most orthodontists deal with cases like these frequently
how many teeth does your smile show now?
in any case, never let them pull any teeth out due to crowding, take your time to find the ortho you feel comfortable with & ask questions like: "will the dental arch be expanded outwards?", "by how much?", find out if your teeth can be expanded outwards safely within the alveolar bone & if not, you can look into procedures such as corticotomies, or maybe even a palate expander (only if your palate is narrow)

Can I send my problem to you in dm? If you are not busy

 

[Giorgio]

Can I send my problem to you in dm? If you are not busy

sure