navagraha
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@PrinceLuenLeoncur
Navagraha
If God is the greatest greatness, it is a being that can be conceived so that nothing greater can be conceived, but not be greater than anything conceivable, however, if it existed only in the intellect, its actual existence would be greater. If God is, by definition, that which is beyond the scope of human capabilities, technology is God.
If the self is the thinking subject, God cannot have a self because thinking is an action, and actions are time-dependent, which would limit God. God cannot be the greatest greatness that would be greater and have a self.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
This is retarded logic, and parameters that Orthdooxy does not subscribe to hence I’m not beholden to nor limited by such base idiotic philosophical jargon. God is greatest, God is greatest for he is above all, God isn’t separate from his mind, his personhood and his being and energies, they are distinct but not separate. The trinity unironically refutes this nonsense by its own conception. As created beings we cannot conceive of God that’s why we only know of God through his energies that he uses to interact with us, his being is ineffable and beyond he is Asea. His word is how we come to interact with him via Christ who took on a human nature of flesh to dwell with us. So no you cannot “conceive of God” but we as humans can understand the concept of superiority jsut not to its fullest extent which is what God at his very level is. With Muslims and other dumb gay religions you’d have an argument but with us you get rkt
Infact is there is no Knower than even your statement is irrelevant and meaningless as nothing has a meaning therefore every predicate loses its content and thus reasoning logic and rational cease to exist and hence your entire argument is just gobbledegoooop and meaningless
See, you fail by default as your arguing against the existence of an being that is the grounding and neccecity for reason logic and other transcendental categories to deny his existence is to deny knowledge at all leaving you with your pants down
Navagraha
(1) Something greater that would be greater is not particularly conceivable by definition. Technology is not known either in the same conception in the God your imagining.
(2) Yourself is the knower.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
You cannot conceive of Gods greatness to begin with the Bible even states this. How are you the knower what circular argument shit is this?? To know anything requires prerequisites that you yourslef already assume to be true as I statued before which you cannot verify as the case if there’s no coherent justification given for your sense data being accurate. Everything you see are just random haphazard neurotic firings which just tell you what helps you survive but that doesn’t necessitate truth infact you don’t even know if everything your seeing and feeling is just an psychological projection of falsehoods. Remeber the senses we have if there’s no god aren’t there for deciphering truth but are there for survival so once again YOU CANNOT SAY YOU KNOW ANYTHING AND JUSTIFY SHIT THIS COLLAPSES EPISTOMOLOGY, ETHICS, LOGIC ETC
Navagraha
How do you account for sense perception then on purely materialistic grounds? Does external matter strike you body in specific locations, setting off a chain of various oscillations acoording to the laws of mechanics, and senstion is just how you experience motions in the brain? That it means to experience, if there is no such thing as the mind nor why we only experience these motion in the brain be not elsewhere is left entirely unclear, which is a bit of a problem.
If reason is invalid through process of thought, you cannot justify the premise that justified this. This is total epistemic suicide.
You can conceive of the essence of god. You would be saying you reject that you cannot conceive of God's essence, and thereby even worship such a being for that matter.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
Exactly and you subscribe to epistemic suicide as you cannot ground anything in something that’s necessary. As a GAYtheidt You use reason, truth, and meaning — but your worldview cannot justify them.
As I said before regarding EPISTOMOLOGY
Why should your thoughts correspond to reality:
Your brain is shaped by survival, not truth
Evolution selects for:
Pure physics → describes motion, particles, forces
But experience (qualia) → first-person reality
Mind is not reducible to matter. Humans are body + soul, not just biology
In order to argue against God, you are already using things that only make sense if God exists.
"Exactly and you subscribe to epistemic suicide as you cannot ground anything in something that’s necessary. As a GAYtheidt You use reason, truth, and meaning — but your worldview cannot justify them."
A positive case is failing against a negative should not have another positive to compete against the former positive until the former positive and negative are addressed. So I will not yet assert my personal positive case; doing so would be counterproductive. All that there is to recognize currently is the positive and negative, not to introduce another positive yet.
"As I said before regarding EPISTOMOLOGY
Why should your thoughts correspond to reality:
Your brain is shaped by survival, not truth
Evolution selects for:
Pure physics → describes motion, particles, forces
But experience (qualia) → first-person reality
Mind is not reducible to matter. Humans are body + soul, not just biology"
(1) If evolution drives man rather than reason, this would also be true for God's conception.
(2) You did not respond to my argument on the necessary conception of god.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
Nope because Gods a necessity not a contingent being. If Gods real then content and other trancendetal categories can be answered. If not then your just speaking jibberish and nothing has any meaning beyond what you personally subscribe to it and thus therefore is bullshit.
I don’t need to answer your bullshit arguments beyond this and I don’t even know what you mean to “conception of God” I don’t get what you mean very broad term could mean anything, not that it matters. Provide a justification for transcendental categories, if you’re unable to do so (which you will because GAYtheism leads to Overt skepticism and nihilism) then you have failed and there’s nothin to discuss here.
Navagraha
"Nope because Gods a necessity not a contingent being. If Gods real then content and other trancendetal categories can be answered. If not then your just speaking jibberish and nothing has any meaning beyond what you personally subscribe to it and thus therefore is bullshit."
I never argued for athiesm; I've argued that technology is God with the necessary definition of God. This definition of God does not align with your God.
"I don’t even know what you mean to “conception of God” I don’t get what you mean very broad term could mean anything, not that it matters"
It absolutely matters. If my case is true, your God is false.
God is defined by being the greatest thing that would be greater because to say that a thing is not the greatest thing that would be greater would mean that it is not the most powerful. By definition technology is God.
"Provide a justification for transcendental categories, if you’re unable to do so (which you will because GAYtheism leads to Overt skepticism and nihilism) then you have failed and there’s nothin to discuss here."
Saying you want a justification for a positive case means that you have considered that there are possible other positive cases. That your belief in God solely based on your fear of nilihism, rather than true faith. Christian faith is what makes a christian a christian. Reasoning has been to shield this fear.
Objectivity regards the world, whereas subjectivity regards the person. Objective knowledge advancement is to secure the resources to let the subjective allocate the resources to their desires. Objective and subjective ability are equally important. The function of spirituality, then, is to discern better subjectivity. Dogmatic spirituality, religion, in inverse to non-dogmatic spirituality, is necessarily parasitic. It prevents you to do what want with your person. Religion distorts reality.
Praxeology is the study of purposeful behavior founded by Mises in the book Human Action. An axiom of praxeology is that man acts to reduce unease. For example, a Christian might not sin to because they believe they will go to Hell, and Hell is unpleasant. All human action works toward pleasure. Pleasure cannot be unpleasurable; by definition contradiction.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
This word salad retardation jargon “God with the necessary definition of God. This definition of God does not align with your God.”
No by no fucking means is this the case dude just stop you’re outta your depth my nigga
Technology cannot be god as it’s not the highest conceivable thing not only that but it didn’t fit the concept of God in a theological Philopshical standpoint.
Necessary (cannot not exist)
2) you make category errors
God == ultimate metaphysical reality the true Axiom of you will.
Technology is a tool, artefacts utilising material things. Literally like saying maths is God it’s a catagory error and jargon
YOUR CASE ISN'T TRUE BECAUSE JT RELIES ON CATEGORY ERROES WHICH I ALREADY POINTED OUT IN MY FIRST MSG TO YOU. Your argument falls apart when it begins and ends with a fallacy making it illogical by default. Your argument requires God to be redifined, which I told you already I WONT DO I do not subscribe to your retarded Paradigm. You have yet to make an account for EPISTOMOLOGY and you have yet to prove tech is the ultimate metaphysical reality leading to a NON SEQUITUR yet another fallacy
I don’t believe in God out of fear but because it’s true. That’s a fallacy yet again a genetic fallacy, even if I belived due to my psychological report the fact is that doesn’t determine what’s true or false
Now you go on to make other outlandish claims and assertions about RELGION not worth my time combatting just jargon idiotic shit with no substance.
Subjective optimisation?:
Once again if that’s the case then no truth claims == no knowledge as knowing requires there to be truth and false hence you can’t argue as now you cannot add content to sentences and words etc.
Best part is you contradict calling relgions parasitic is an objective claim which by your own bullshit logic you already refuted yourself like an idiot. Reality is you’ll never be able to redefine God, nor reducing Truth to psychology and pleasure, what idiocy.
You tried to make your argument sound philosophical but it failed very test and ended up commiting numerous fallacies in the process. It’s truly remarkable people like you exist
Navagraha
If something is the greatest greatness that would be greater, that would not necessarily mean we could effectively determine or if there is a difference in the powers beyond human comprehension; that there may be multiple gods.
Why must god be necessary, eternal, uncaused, immutable, and ground all beings and in what sense?
I think it is self-evident that a person does not need to consider God for them to be logical. They simply suppose things for sake if analysis, and those suppositions are profitable. Suppositions do not require the dogma as in religion.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
You’re borrowing from the very worldview you’re trying to reject—logic, causality, and intelligibility only make sense if they’re grounded in an absolute, necessary mind; otherwise they’re just arbitrary assumptions. And ‘multiple gods’ doesn’t solve anything, because the ultimate ground of reality must be one, not many—otherwise you’ve got competing absolutes, which is a contradiction. So the issue isn’t whether you use logic without God, it’s whether your worldview can actually justify it—and without a necessary, eternal, uncaused source of all being, it can’t.
And this is why you look retarded in every comment and why I’m running circles around you and mocking you. Because your beliefs are fucking absurd
Navagraha
I did not derive these suppositions in themselves. These suppositions are derived from the fundamental quality of man acting to reduce unease, and each supposition is based on it fulfilling that end. All reason is for this purpose, and any that does not fulfill this end is pointless.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
If all reasoning is just a tool for reducing psychological unease, then your own argument isn’t about truth—it’s just about what makes you feel better. That collapses into self-defeat, because you’re asking me to accept a claim as true while simultaneously redefining reason as something unconcerned with truth. You’re also reducing universal, invariant laws of logic to subjective human drives, which can’t account for their necessity or binding nature. In other words, you’re not grounding reason—you’re psychologising it, and in doing so you’ve undercut the very argument you’re trying to make.”
Navagraha
I absolutely agree; however, I don't believe there is objective truth outside of a supposition from a subject, so this goes for all reason, not just reason to this end. The most optimal supposition for man is base reason to reduce unease.
My argument for technology being god was a negative case supposition for demonstration.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
If there is no objective truth outside of subjective supposition, then your claim itself isn’t objectively true—it’s just your preference, which gives me no reason to accept it over any other. The moment you argue, explain, or justify anything, you’re already appealing to real standards of truth, logic, and coherence that go beyond your own mind. Reducing reason to ‘what best eases unease’ collapses into relativism where even contradictions could be ‘true’ if they feel useful. So again, your position is self-defeating—you’re using objective logic to argue that objectivity doesn’t exist, which undercuts the very possibility of your argument meaning anything at all.
Navagraha
I agreed with you already; however, my argument says this goes for both of our positions. Due to this, I argued that my suppositions / framework is more preferable than yours for the individual necessarily since you also are acting to reduce unease, just with necessary omission of this fact for the existence of your framework.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
That doesn’t level the playing field, it collapses yours entirely. If both our views are just unease-reduction strategies, then ‘preferable’ has no objective meaning, so you’ve given no reason why anyone ought to choose yours over mine. You’re still sneaking in normativity (‘more preferable’, ‘better framework’) while denying any objective standard that could justify it. In contrast, my position grounds truth, logic, and value in something real and universal, whereas yours reduces them to personal comfort, so it can’t account for why truth should matter at all. You’re not exposing a hidden assumption in my view; you’re undercutting the very possibility of rational comparison in yours. You have also yet to give me an account for how you know ANYTHING and on that basis alone this convo has ended I’ll take my W as I always do in philosophical engagements here and you’ll take your L and go to the quiet corner
If this is the peak of your understanding despite all I have said then your beyond help and this will be my last msg to you. I don’t waste my time with idiots and the mentally challenged. Continue your hedonistic pursuits of idiocy in peace
Navagraha
If God is the greatest greatness, it is a being that can be conceived so that nothing greater can be conceived, but not be greater than anything conceivable, however, if it existed only in the intellect, its actual existence would be greater. If God is, by definition, that which is beyond the scope of human capabilities, technology is God.
If the self is the thinking subject, God cannot have a self because thinking is an action, and actions are time-dependent, which would limit God. God cannot be the greatest greatness that would be greater and have a self.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
This is retarded logic, and parameters that Orthdooxy does not subscribe to hence I’m not beholden to nor limited by such base idiotic philosophical jargon. God is greatest, God is greatest for he is above all, God isn’t separate from his mind, his personhood and his being and energies, they are distinct but not separate. The trinity unironically refutes this nonsense by its own conception. As created beings we cannot conceive of God that’s why we only know of God through his energies that he uses to interact with us, his being is ineffable and beyond he is Asea. His word is how we come to interact with him via Christ who took on a human nature of flesh to dwell with us. So no you cannot “conceive of God” but we as humans can understand the concept of superiority jsut not to its fullest extent which is what God at his very level is. With Muslims and other dumb gay religions you’d have an argument but with us you get rkt
Infact is there is no Knower than even your statement is irrelevant and meaningless as nothing has a meaning therefore every predicate loses its content and thus reasoning logic and rational cease to exist and hence your entire argument is just gobbledegoooop and meaningless
See, you fail by default as your arguing against the existence of an being that is the grounding and neccecity for reason logic and other transcendental categories to deny his existence is to deny knowledge at all leaving you with your pants down
Navagraha
(1) Something greater that would be greater is not particularly conceivable by definition. Technology is not known either in the same conception in the God your imagining.
(2) Yourself is the knower.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
You cannot conceive of Gods greatness to begin with the Bible even states this. How are you the knower what circular argument shit is this?? To know anything requires prerequisites that you yourslef already assume to be true as I statued before which you cannot verify as the case if there’s no coherent justification given for your sense data being accurate. Everything you see are just random haphazard neurotic firings which just tell you what helps you survive but that doesn’t necessitate truth infact you don’t even know if everything your seeing and feeling is just an psychological projection of falsehoods. Remeber the senses we have if there’s no god aren’t there for deciphering truth but are there for survival so once again YOU CANNOT SAY YOU KNOW ANYTHING AND JUSTIFY SHIT THIS COLLAPSES EPISTOMOLOGY, ETHICS, LOGIC ETC
Navagraha
How do you account for sense perception then on purely materialistic grounds? Does external matter strike you body in specific locations, setting off a chain of various oscillations acoording to the laws of mechanics, and senstion is just how you experience motions in the brain? That it means to experience, if there is no such thing as the mind nor why we only experience these motion in the brain be not elsewhere is left entirely unclear, which is a bit of a problem.
If reason is invalid through process of thought, you cannot justify the premise that justified this. This is total epistemic suicide.
You can conceive of the essence of god. You would be saying you reject that you cannot conceive of God's essence, and thereby even worship such a being for that matter.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
Exactly and you subscribe to epistemic suicide as you cannot ground anything in something that’s necessary. As a GAYtheidt You use reason, truth, and meaning — but your worldview cannot justify them.
As I said before regarding EPISTOMOLOGY
Why should your thoughts correspond to reality:
Your brain is shaped by survival, not truth
Evolution selects for:
- Utility
- Not necessarily accuracy
Pure physics → describes motion, particles, forces
But experience (qualia) → first-person reality
Mind is not reducible to matter. Humans are body + soul, not just biology
In order to argue against God, you are already using things that only make sense if God exists.
- Logic → requires immaterial universals
- Truth → requires absolute grounding
- Knowledge → requires trustworthy cognition
- Meaning → requires purpose
- These are grounded in:
- The Logos (Christ)
- A rational, personal God
"Exactly and you subscribe to epistemic suicide as you cannot ground anything in something that’s necessary. As a GAYtheidt You use reason, truth, and meaning — but your worldview cannot justify them."
A positive case is failing against a negative should not have another positive to compete against the former positive until the former positive and negative are addressed. So I will not yet assert my personal positive case; doing so would be counterproductive. All that there is to recognize currently is the positive and negative, not to introduce another positive yet.
"As I said before regarding EPISTOMOLOGY
Why should your thoughts correspond to reality:
Your brain is shaped by survival, not truth
Evolution selects for:
- Utility
- Not necessarily accuracy
Pure physics → describes motion, particles, forces
But experience (qualia) → first-person reality
Mind is not reducible to matter. Humans are body + soul, not just biology"
(1) If evolution drives man rather than reason, this would also be true for God's conception.
(2) You did not respond to my argument on the necessary conception of god.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
Nope because Gods a necessity not a contingent being. If Gods real then content and other trancendetal categories can be answered. If not then your just speaking jibberish and nothing has any meaning beyond what you personally subscribe to it and thus therefore is bullshit.
I don’t need to answer your bullshit arguments beyond this and I don’t even know what you mean to “conception of God” I don’t get what you mean very broad term could mean anything, not that it matters. Provide a justification for transcendental categories, if you’re unable to do so (which you will because GAYtheism leads to Overt skepticism and nihilism) then you have failed and there’s nothin to discuss here.
Navagraha
"Nope because Gods a necessity not a contingent being. If Gods real then content and other trancendetal categories can be answered. If not then your just speaking jibberish and nothing has any meaning beyond what you personally subscribe to it and thus therefore is bullshit."
I never argued for athiesm; I've argued that technology is God with the necessary definition of God. This definition of God does not align with your God.
"I don’t even know what you mean to “conception of God” I don’t get what you mean very broad term could mean anything, not that it matters"
It absolutely matters. If my case is true, your God is false.
God is defined by being the greatest thing that would be greater because to say that a thing is not the greatest thing that would be greater would mean that it is not the most powerful. By definition technology is God.
"Provide a justification for transcendental categories, if you’re unable to do so (which you will because GAYtheism leads to Overt skepticism and nihilism) then you have failed and there’s nothin to discuss here."
Saying you want a justification for a positive case means that you have considered that there are possible other positive cases. That your belief in God solely based on your fear of nilihism, rather than true faith. Christian faith is what makes a christian a christian. Reasoning has been to shield this fear.
Objectivity regards the world, whereas subjectivity regards the person. Objective knowledge advancement is to secure the resources to let the subjective allocate the resources to their desires. Objective and subjective ability are equally important. The function of spirituality, then, is to discern better subjectivity. Dogmatic spirituality, religion, in inverse to non-dogmatic spirituality, is necessarily parasitic. It prevents you to do what want with your person. Religion distorts reality.
Praxeology is the study of purposeful behavior founded by Mises in the book Human Action. An axiom of praxeology is that man acts to reduce unease. For example, a Christian might not sin to because they believe they will go to Hell, and Hell is unpleasant. All human action works toward pleasure. Pleasure cannot be unpleasurable; by definition contradiction.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
This word salad retardation jargon “God with the necessary definition of God. This definition of God does not align with your God.”
No by no fucking means is this the case dude just stop you’re outta your depth my nigga
Technology cannot be god as it’s not the highest conceivable thing not only that but it didn’t fit the concept of God in a theological Philopshical standpoint.
Necessary (cannot not exist)
- Eternal
- Uncaused
- Immutable
- The ground of all being
- Created
- Contingent (depends on humans, materials, laws of physics)
- Changing constantly
- Limited
2) you make category errors
God == ultimate metaphysical reality the true Axiom of you will.
Technology is a tool, artefacts utilising material things. Literally like saying maths is God it’s a catagory error and jargon
YOUR CASE ISN'T TRUE BECAUSE JT RELIES ON CATEGORY ERROES WHICH I ALREADY POINTED OUT IN MY FIRST MSG TO YOU. Your argument falls apart when it begins and ends with a fallacy making it illogical by default. Your argument requires God to be redifined, which I told you already I WONT DO I do not subscribe to your retarded Paradigm. You have yet to make an account for EPISTOMOLOGY and you have yet to prove tech is the ultimate metaphysical reality leading to a NON SEQUITUR yet another fallacy
I don’t believe in God out of fear but because it’s true. That’s a fallacy yet again a genetic fallacy, even if I belived due to my psychological report the fact is that doesn’t determine what’s true or false
Now you go on to make other outlandish claims and assertions about RELGION not worth my time combatting just jargon idiotic shit with no substance.
Subjective optimisation?:
Once again if that’s the case then no truth claims == no knowledge as knowing requires there to be truth and false hence you can’t argue as now you cannot add content to sentences and words etc.
Best part is you contradict calling relgions parasitic is an objective claim which by your own bullshit logic you already refuted yourself like an idiot. Reality is you’ll never be able to redefine God, nor reducing Truth to psychology and pleasure, what idiocy.
You tried to make your argument sound philosophical but it failed very test and ended up commiting numerous fallacies in the process. It’s truly remarkable people like you exist
Navagraha
If something is the greatest greatness that would be greater, that would not necessarily mean we could effectively determine or if there is a difference in the powers beyond human comprehension; that there may be multiple gods.
Why must god be necessary, eternal, uncaused, immutable, and ground all beings and in what sense?
I think it is self-evident that a person does not need to consider God for them to be logical. They simply suppose things for sake if analysis, and those suppositions are profitable. Suppositions do not require the dogma as in religion.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
You’re borrowing from the very worldview you’re trying to reject—logic, causality, and intelligibility only make sense if they’re grounded in an absolute, necessary mind; otherwise they’re just arbitrary assumptions. And ‘multiple gods’ doesn’t solve anything, because the ultimate ground of reality must be one, not many—otherwise you’ve got competing absolutes, which is a contradiction. So the issue isn’t whether you use logic without God, it’s whether your worldview can actually justify it—and without a necessary, eternal, uncaused source of all being, it can’t.
And this is why you look retarded in every comment and why I’m running circles around you and mocking you. Because your beliefs are fucking absurd
Navagraha
I did not derive these suppositions in themselves. These suppositions are derived from the fundamental quality of man acting to reduce unease, and each supposition is based on it fulfilling that end. All reason is for this purpose, and any that does not fulfill this end is pointless.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
If all reasoning is just a tool for reducing psychological unease, then your own argument isn’t about truth—it’s just about what makes you feel better. That collapses into self-defeat, because you’re asking me to accept a claim as true while simultaneously redefining reason as something unconcerned with truth. You’re also reducing universal, invariant laws of logic to subjective human drives, which can’t account for their necessity or binding nature. In other words, you’re not grounding reason—you’re psychologising it, and in doing so you’ve undercut the very argument you’re trying to make.”
Navagraha
I absolutely agree; however, I don't believe there is objective truth outside of a supposition from a subject, so this goes for all reason, not just reason to this end. The most optimal supposition for man is base reason to reduce unease.
My argument for technology being god was a negative case supposition for demonstration.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
If there is no objective truth outside of subjective supposition, then your claim itself isn’t objectively true—it’s just your preference, which gives me no reason to accept it over any other. The moment you argue, explain, or justify anything, you’re already appealing to real standards of truth, logic, and coherence that go beyond your own mind. Reducing reason to ‘what best eases unease’ collapses into relativism where even contradictions could be ‘true’ if they feel useful. So again, your position is self-defeating—you’re using objective logic to argue that objectivity doesn’t exist, which undercuts the very possibility of your argument meaning anything at all.
Navagraha
I agreed with you already; however, my argument says this goes for both of our positions. Due to this, I argued that my suppositions / framework is more preferable than yours for the individual necessarily since you also are acting to reduce unease, just with necessary omission of this fact for the existence of your framework.
PrinceLuenLeoncur
That doesn’t level the playing field, it collapses yours entirely. If both our views are just unease-reduction strategies, then ‘preferable’ has no objective meaning, so you’ve given no reason why anyone ought to choose yours over mine. You’re still sneaking in normativity (‘more preferable’, ‘better framework’) while denying any objective standard that could justify it. In contrast, my position grounds truth, logic, and value in something real and universal, whereas yours reduces them to personal comfort, so it can’t account for why truth should matter at all. You’re not exposing a hidden assumption in my view; you’re undercutting the very possibility of rational comparison in yours. You have also yet to give me an account for how you know ANYTHING and on that basis alone this convo has ended I’ll take my W as I always do in philosophical engagements here and you’ll take your L and go to the quiet corner
If this is the peak of your understanding despite all I have said then your beyond help and this will be my last msg to you. I don’t waste my time with idiots and the mentally challenged. Continue your hedonistic pursuits of idiocy in peace
