How important is lower maxilla?

[Deleted member 3681]

I will get a bimax and already have a good maxilla but i do have a overbite. What gains Lefort1 will provide?

 

[Deleted member 7776]

Protruding "kissy lips" effect, very important

 

[Good_Little_Goy]

Protruding "kissy lips" effect, very important

there's other factors but maxilla there

 

[Deleted member 7776]

there's other factors but maxilla there

For sure, palate / mouth width. Philtrum too

 

[Effortless]

Less nasal folds, better philtrum, better lips, make cheekbones appear higher.

To see how important it is, just put your tongue between your upper row of teeth and the lip then push your lip up with the tongue.

Look at it from side profile and see how much your cheekbones look like its more prominent because of the skin is more stretched over it.

So yeah, very important.

 

[Kingkellz]

Protruding "kissy lips" effect, very important

Shitty PSL meme
Makes you look like a disgusting effeminate fag tbh

It's more suited for females

Not men

Even in cartoons the "male ideal" never has protruding bitch lips, mouth, or concave philtrum

 

[Deleted member 3681]

Shitty PSL meme
Makes you look like a disgusting effeminate fag tbh

It's more suited for females
View attachment 472058View attachment 472059View attachment 472070
View attachment 472072
Not men
View attachment 472060
View attachment 472062View attachment 472066

Even in cartoons the "male ideal" never has protruding bitch lips, mouth, or concave philtrum

Just be a cartoon theory

 

[Deleted member 7725]

Protruding "kissy lips" effect, very important

What's the cause of protruding kissy lips with a recessed maxilla? Will a Bimax make me unable to close my mouth?

 

[Effortless]

Shitty PSL meme
Makes you look like a disgusting effeminate fag tbh

It's more suited for females
View attachment 472058View attachment 472059View attachment 472070
View attachment 472072
Not men
View attachment 472060
View attachment 472062View attachment 472066

Even in cartoons the "male ideal" never has protruding bitch lips, mouth, or concave philtrum

Giga cope tbh



Females literally prefer fuller lips on guys than guys prefer fuller lips on girls

Comparison of Preferences in Lip Position Using Computer Animated Imaging: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10371428/

"The results indicated a sex-effect, with females preferring fuller lips than males."

 

[Kingkellz]

Giga cope tbh



Females literally prefer fuller lips on guys than guys prefer fuller lips on girls

Comparison of Preferences in Lip Position Using Computer Animated Imaging: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10371428/

"The results indicated a sex-effect, with females preferring fuller lips than males."

Fuller lips =/= protruding bitch lips

 

[Effortless]

Fuller lips =/= protruding bitch lips

Fuller lips are 99% of the time protruded to a degree because of maxilla support.

Plus lips is underestimated for men, its one of the main contrasting feature on your face.

 

[Kingkellz]

Fuller lips are 99% of the time protruded to a degree because of maxilla support.

Plus lips is underestimated for men, its one of the main contrasting feature on your face.

Soft tissue vs bone size and protrusion
Having big plump, protrusive lips is NOT ideal for males.

The philtrum is longer and flatter in males.
Chin should be in line with the subnasale or anterior relative to subnasale.

In females the philtrum curls up and outwards. The chin is non-protrusive and is either in line with the subnasale or posterior relative to the subnasale.

Look at real life Superman and Batman, their philtrum is straight/flat with either a chin (pogonion) that is in line or protrudes anteriorly from the subnasale.
This is very important because it's ideal for males to have a straight/orthognathic facial profile or slightly concave whereas high facial convexity is ideal and more commonly found in females.

Convex

Concave

When women say they want "fuller lips" it just means don't have George Clooney tier thin lips.

Having an alveolar ridge that extremely protrusive relative to the frontal process of the maxilla is not a good look for males.
Idk for sure but if I remember correctly, an anteinclined maxilla gives you and upturned nose and a curling outwards philtrum.

Look at all the cartoons, editors/artists, etc you will never find the "ideal male" having a convex protruding mouth area. Ethnics and females tend to have this trait.

Thick protruding pouty bitch lips are just a PSL meme.

 

[Incoming]

Shitty PSL meme
Makes you look like a disgusting effeminate fag tbh

It's more suited for females
View attachment 472058View attachment 472059View attachment 472070
View attachment 472072
Not men
View attachment 472060
View attachment 472062View attachment 472066

Even in cartoons the "male ideal" never has protruding bitch lips, mouth, or concave philtrum

Agreed

 

[Effortless]

Soft tissue vs bone size and protrusion
Having big plump, protrusive lips is NOT ideal for males.
View attachment 472092
The philtrum is longer and flatter in males.
Chin should be in line with the subnasale or anterior relative to subnasale.

View attachment 472093
In females the philtrum curls up and outwards. The chin is non-protrusive and is either in line with the subnasale or posterior relative to the subnasale.

View attachment 472094View attachment 472095
Look at real life Superman and Batman, their philtrum is straight/flat with either a chin (pogonion) that is in line or protrudes anteriorly from the subnasale.
This is very important because it's ideal for males to have a straight/orthognathic facial profile or slightly concave whereas high facial convexity is ideal and more commonly found in females.

Convex
View attachment 472099
Concave
View attachment 472102

When women say they want "fuller lips" it just means don't have George Clooney tier thin lips.

Having an alveolar ridge/process that extremely protrusive relative to the frontal process of the maxilla is not a good look for males.
Idk for sure but if I remember correctly, an anteinclined maxilla gives you and upturned nose and a curling outwards philtrum.

Look at all the cartoons, editors/artists, etc you will never find the "ideal male" having a convex protruding mouth area. Ethnics and females tend to have this trait.

Thick protruding pouty bitch lips are just a PSL meme.

I agree with some of your points but to say that a feature is better because its more common in males doesn't mean its more aesthetic or ideal.

Using this doesn't prove anything, comparing different typical races skull kinda neglect your point of it being a masculine feature, not to mention comparing good looking white guys to averages blacks and asians.

 

[Kingkellz]

because its more common in males doesn't mean its more aesthetic or ideal.

The question should be why it is more prevalent in males, especially Caucasian male.

Using this doesn't prove anything, comparing different typical races skull kinda neglect your point of it being a masculine feature, not to mention comparing good looking white guys to averages blacks and asians.

It is masculine and ideal for males to have it.
Like I said

Ethnics and females tend to have this trait.

Meaning it's not ideal. In fact it goes to show how subhuman someone is in that particular category for having a trait that females usually have. For example blacks tend to have convex foreheads that lack prominent browridges. This is mostly a feminine trait but commonly found among blacks (even good-looking blacks like Tyson Beckford).
My point is that you don't want those pouty protruding lips. Essentially you are asking for bimaxillary protrusion which refers to a protrusive dentoalveolar position of maxillary and mandibular dental arches that produces a convex facial profile.

 

[Kingkellz]

not to mention comparing good looking white guys to averages blacks and asians.

Go ahead and compare good-looking blacks and asains. You will see this trait you so badly want is most prevalent in ethnic males or females in general

 

[Effortless]

Meaning it's not ideal. For example blacks tend to have convex foreheads that lack prominent browridges. This is mostly a feminine trait but commonly found among blacks (even good-looking blacks like Tyson Beckford).
My point is that you don't want those pouty protruding lips. Essentially you are asking for bimaxillary protrusion which refers to a protrusive dentoalveolar position of maxillary and mandibular dental arches that produces a convex facial profile.

Go ahead and compare good-looking blacks and asains. You will see this trait you so badly want is most prevalent in ethnic males or females in general

Mmmmh you're probably right, maybe I was mistaking protruding mouth area with protruding lips.

Kinda like this...?

It looks like their mouth area is jutting forward or protruding from the cheekbones if that makes any sense

 

[Deleted member 3020]

not important at all son

 

[sloopnoob]

What's the cause of protruding kissy lips with a recessed maxilla? Will a Bimax make me unable to close my mouth?

bad grown alveolar ridge

 

[Kingkellz]

Mmmmh you're probably right, maybe I was mistaking protruding mouth area with protruding lips.

Kinda like this...?

View attachment 472149 View attachment 472156 View attachment 472157 View attachment 472159 View attachment 472162 View attachment 472166

It looks like their mouth area is jutting forward or protruding from the cheekbones if that makes any sense

Yes that was probably your confusion.
Which kinda goes back to what I said earlier:

Fuller lips =/= protruding bitch lips

Here is the side profile of some of the guys you posted above

I'm assuming you find gandy and Chico to have "full plump/good lips".
As you can see the the philtrum is still flat and straight not curling upwards. There is also no bimaxillary protrusion which refers to a protrusive dentoalveolar position of maxillary and mandibular dental arches that produces a convex facial profile.
Also look at the chin especially with Gandy, it's projected and is at least in line or goes past the lips. Look at the relationship between the features of the lower facial plane. They have good "full" lips that protrude from the cheekbones while still maintaining a straight or concave facial profile.

Here's another example:

As you can see he as very plump lips that appear to "protrude from the cheekbones" but as you can see from side profile view his philtrum is straight and not curling. Zero bimaxillary protrusion. Pogonion is anterior relative to subnasale in the sagittal plane giving him a concave facial profile as opposed to a convex facial profile (specifically convex shaped mouth area) which is commonly found in ethnic males and females in general.
I hope this helps you better understand. I'm no expert but I did my best to convey the point.

 

[HurtfulVanity]

Not really that important depending on severity as long as it's notrecessed it's no big deal as o pry has flat mouth area he looks good lachowski does aswell

 

[Deleted member 3681]

Yes that was probably your confusion.
Which kinda goes back to what I said earlier:

Here is the side profile of some of the guys you posted above
View attachment 472170View attachment 472172
I'm assuming you find gandy and Chico to have "full plump/good lips".
As you can see the the philtrum is still flat and straight not curling upwards. There is also no bimaxillary protrusion which refers to a protrusive dentoalveolar position of maxillary and mandibular dental arches that produces a convex facial profile.
Also look at the chin especially with Gandy, it's projected and is at least in line or goes past the lips. Look at the relationship between the features of the lower facial plane. They have good "full" lips that protrude from the cheekbones while still maintaining a straight or concave facial profile.

Here's another example:
View attachment 472174View attachment 472175
As you can see he as very plump lips that appear to "protrude from the cheekbones" but as you can see from side profile view his philtrum is straight and not curling. Zero bimaxillary protrusion. Pogonion is anterior relative to subnasale in the sagittal plane giving him a concave facial profile as opposed to a convex facial profile (specifically convex shaped mouth area) which is commonly found in ethnic males and females in general.
I hope this helps you better understand. I'm no expert but I did my best to convey the point.

Doesn’t a good lower maxilla give you a better smile with better teeth exposure?

 

[Kingkellz]

Doesn’t a good lower maxilla give you a better smile with better teeth exposure?

Yes but you don't need protruding dentoalveolar arches for that. Look at Brett Maverick for example I think you would agree that he has a good smile.

 

[Deleted member 4430]

What is better upturned philtrum, mouth area or flat philtrum?

 

[Deleted member 7725]

bad grown alveolar ridge

That only explains upper lip. I think that "kissy lips" is more of a matter of your lip tissue size itself.