Is clean/lean bulking a meme? I find it IMPOSSIBLE to go into a 321+ daily calorie surplus without eating lots of processed junk food

[alien]

I gained 14.4 lbs in 166.5 days (23.78 weeks). Without taking much of a hit to my ab definition because of newbie gains and doing ab isolations to make my abs more prominent with higher body fat %. I started out at 126.4 lbs @ 5'6". I'm 140.8 lbs now. That's about 0.61 lbs/week. Or 303 calories above TDEE.
Based on my current weight, I have to eat 321 calories above TDEE to reach my goal of gaining +2% body weight/month as a novice body builder (8 months experience) still in the newbie gains phase.

In the beginning I resorted a lot to mass gainer powder with whey protein isolate, cocoa powder, maltodextrin, oats, sweet potato and quinoa. But then I was only getting 196 calories per Canadian Dollar. Then I noticed it's much cheaper to get your carbs and fats from cookies, snack cakes, potato chips, cheese puffs, etc. A $2.27 300g package of Great Value Fudge Crème Cookies (23) gives you 1,380 calories. 608 Calories Per Canadian Dollar. So I switched to dirty bulking back in Mid-November. There's not much protein in processed junk food like that. But you can get your protein from protein isolate/blend powder for less than half the cost of gainer powder. And you can get your carbs and fats from processed junk food for dirt, dirt cheap.

So my strategy since mid-November has been to pound back whey protein shakes, cookies, snack cakes, cake, potato chips, cheese puffs, donuts, etc. I recently bought some unflavored pea protein to try to bring down the flatulence from the whey, which is a little more expensive. Since I'm bulking, I'm going to use Carnation Rolo cocoa powder (3.6 calories per gram) that I bought over a year ago back when I was a rotter fat ass to sweeten the pea powder. And I would occasionally indulge in takeout on dates or with friends. I didn't get takeout by myself that often because it's expensive. Beef shawarma with fries or lentil rice and garlic and tahini sauce. Cheeseburgers (especially with fatty and carby condiments) with fries, cheesy fries or sweet potato fries. One time I got red velvet cake at a restaurant for dessert after eating a cheeseburger with fries and my stomach wanted to explode. I couldn't finish half my slice of cake. My stomach can't handle food the way it used to be when I was a 160+ lb rotter fat ass. I had All-you-can-eat Asian food with my chubby Korean-Canadian ex-girlfriend back when we were dating in the fall/winter and my stomach wanted to explode. I couldn't keep up with her.

There are cheap, calorie-dense foods that you can buy that provide more micro nutritional value than processed junk food. Like spaghetti pasta is very cheap. $1.17 CAD per 1lb of dry pasta gives you 1,656 calories. But pasta expands after you cook it. I don't think I could eat like 800-900 calories of pasta in a day without wanting to throw up.

Peanut Butter is probably the most nutritious cheap calorie-dense junk food I could see myself being able to binge on. For $6.29 CAD you can get a 750g jar of 100% roasted peanut butter from Kraft. That's 4,500 calories. 715 Calories Per Canadian Dollar.. And the processed unnatural peanut butter is even cheaper than that. And even then natural peanut butter is not THAT nutritious. Though it does have some micro nutritional value. 10% of your Magnesium in 15g. 6% of your Thiamine in 15g. 2% of your Iron in 15g. Since I'm bulking I'd be eating like 150g of peanut butter in one sitting (900 calories). So I would get 95-100% of my daily Magnesium, 55-60% of my Thiamine and 15-20% of my Iron. The irony is that the highly processed chocolate fudge crème cookies I like to buy gives me 14% of my iron across a 120 calorie serving (but only 2% potassium, 1% calcium). Some junk food is not exactly completely deficient in micronutrient value either.

 

[Deleted member 23359]

dnrd but you need to eat big to get big

 

[alien]

dnrd but you need to eat big to get big

I've been figuring that out in the past 5 1/2 months of bulking. Especially recently. It seems like the more tired my muscles get in the gym, the more I need to eat just to prevent losing weight! Just to go into a 321 calorie surplus above TDEE, I have to eat a ridiculous amount of calories. All these people online telling you to get veggies, rice and pasta, nigga how does your stomach fit all that while still hitting your calorie surplus goals? I just ate 775 calories worth of cookies like it was nothing after eating 2 breakfast sandwiches (640 calories) and drinking coffee with 63ml of 2% milk (33 calories). But you can't eat 775 calories of pasta, rice or steak like its nothing after you just ate two breakfast sandwiches. You get full very fast. There's only so much whole food I can eat before my stomach hates me. This is why clean/lean bulking seems like a meme to me.

 

[Orc]

lean bulking is solid if you're in your first or second year of working out, once you're at like 2-3 years you don't gain shit unless you're in a huge surplus which also means you get fat as fuck.

 

[alien]

lean bulking is solid if you're in your first or second year of working out, once you're at like 2-3 years you don't gain shit unless you're in a huge surplus which also means you get fat as fuck.

From what I've seen from bodybuilding articles online, they recommend a larger calorie surplus to novices and a smaller calorie surplus to intermediate and especially advanced bodybuilders because of the newbie gains window and diminishing returns as you build more and more muscle mass.

My gains have really started to stall in the last 3 weeks despite the fact that I have been pounding back calories like a mad man. And I resort to a lot of calorie-dense processed food to get calories. Because I can't get all those calories from whole foods without getting a tummy ache.
On Feb 21st I weighed 139.4 lbs. And this was the lightest I've weighed since Feb 15th so I deliberately cherry picked one of my "light" days as a starting point.
This morning I weighed 140.8 lbs. And I ate more food volume than usual yesterday so I might have woke up a little heavier than usual. I gained 1.4 lbs in 21 days. That's about 234 calories above my TDEE. Short of my +2% body weight per month goal (1.9 lbs in 21 days)

 

[Deleted member 26116]

If I start going to the gym, which I probably will in a few months from now, my goal will be to preserve muscle mass while I lose weight, not to get jacked. Bulking can be dangerous. It may screw your face and make it bloated if you don't know what you're doing.

 

[Orc]

From what I've seen from bodybuilding articles online, they recommend a larger calorie surplus to novices and a smaller calorie surplus to intermediate and especially advanced bodybuilders because of the newbie gains window and diminishing returns as you build more and more muscle mass.

My gains have really started to stall in the last 3 weeks despite the fact that I have been pounding back calories like a mad man. And I resort to a lot of calorie-dense processed food to get calories. Because I can't get all those calories from whole foods without getting a tummy ache.
On Feb 21st I weighed 139.4 lbs. And this was the lightest I've weighed since Feb 15th so I deliberately cherry picked one of my "light" days as a starting point.
This morning I weighed 140.8 lbs. And I ate more food volume than usual yesterday so I might have woke up a little heavier than usual. I gained 1.4 lbs in 21 days. That's about 234 calories above my TDEE. Short of my +2% body weight per month goal (1.9 lbs in 21 days)

if I eat in less than a surplus of 1000-1500 I don't gain shit because I just start fidgeting more unconsciously, brutal.

 

[alien]

If I start going to the gym, which I probably will in a few months from now, my goal will be to preserve muscle mass while I lose weight, not to get jacked. Bulking can be dangerous. It may screw your face and make it bloated if you don't know what you're doing.

I actually started out with a cut when I first joined a gym and starting lifting. And while I was in a calorie deficit, I gained a considerable amount of strength just from improving muscle memory, form, etc. but fuck all in terms of muscle mass. If anything I probably lost some muscle mass. Though I probably wasn't getting enough protein in my diet then. I was just eating whatever my dad fed me for the most part (a diet heavy in carbohydrates) while lifting and doing cardio and I lost a ton of weight in a short period of time.
I was 142.8 lbs on July 11th 2022. That's the lightest weight I ever recorded since junior high/high school before I joined the gym according to my logs.
I cut down to 126.4 lbs on Sept 29 2022. That's -16.4 lbs in 80 days (11.43 weeks). That's about -1.435 lbs/week. 717 calories below TDEE (I was doing a bit of cardio 3-4 times a week too then so that did bump up my TDEE.)
I probably cut too much too fast tbh. I wouldn't cut more than 500 calories below TDEE unless you have no muscle.

Reason why I'm bulking is because I figured out quite quickly that leanmaxxing doesn't get you pussy if you're a manlet. Women don't take you seriously when you are 126.4 lbs. Even on Tinder where I don't put my height in my bio, I have my shirtless selfie from Christmas on there and haven't updated that selfie due to laziness. I was 135.2 lbs back then. And I only got like 90 matches on Tinder with a Platinum account. I have 3 new likes but they are whales/ugly. I'm 140.8 lbs now and have more muscle (but still nothing impressive) but I have to crop my selfies the right way so that it looks good on Tinder and shit. I'm too lazy to update my pic. Having six-pack abs doesn't impress women if you don't have muscles. Getting lean is actually not that hard. It's just most people don't have the discipline to get lean. Most people, even men, are fat. Getting muscle is far, far harder than getting lean.

 

[reputation]

I gained 14.4 lbs in 166.5 days (23.78 weeks). Without taking much of a hit to my ab definition because of newbie gains and doing ab isolations to make my abs more prominent with higher body fat %. I started out at 126.4 lbs @ 5'6". I'm 140.8 lbs now. That's about 0.61 lbs/week. Or 303 calories above TDEE.
Based on my current weight, I have to eat 321 calories above TDEE to reach my goal of gaining +2% body weight/month as a novice body builder (8 months experience) still in the newbie gains phase.

In the beginning I resorted a lot to mass gainer powder with whey protein isolate, cocoa powder, maltodextrin, oats, sweet potato and quinoa. But then I was only getting 196 calories per Canadian Dollar. Then I noticed it's much cheaper to get your carbs and fats from cookies, snack cakes, potato chips, cheese puffs, etc. A $2.27 300g package of Great Value Fudge Crème Cookies (23) gives you 1,380 calories. 608 Calories Per Canadian Dollar. So I switched to dirty bulking back in Mid-November. There's not much protein in processed junk food like that. But you can get your protein from protein isolate/blend powder for less than half the cost of gainer powder. And you can get your carbs and fats from processed junk food for dirt, dirt cheap.

So my strategy since mid-November has been to pound back whey protein shakes, cookies, snack cakes, cake, potato chips, cheese puffs, donuts, etc. I recently bought some unflavored pea protein to try to bring down the flatulence from the whey, which is a little more expensive. Since I'm bulking, I'm going to use Carnation Rolo cocoa powder (3.6 calories per gram) that I bought over a year ago back when I was a rotter fat ass to sweeten the pea powder. And I would occasionally indulge in takeout on dates or with friends. I didn't get takeout by myself that often because it's expensive. Beef shawarma with fries or lentil rice and garlic and tahini sauce. Cheeseburgers (especially with fatty and carby condiments) with fries, cheesy fries or sweet potato fries. One time I got red velvet cake at a restaurant for dessert after eating a cheeseburger with fries and my stomach wanted to explode. I couldn't finish half my slice of cake. My stomach can't handle food the way it used to be when I was a 160+ lb rotter fat ass. I had All-you-can-eat Asian food with my chubby Korean-Canadian ex-girlfriend back when we were dating in the fall/winter and my stomach wanted to explode. I couldn't keep up with her.

There are cheap, calorie-dense foods that you can buy that provide more micro nutritional value than processed junk food. Like spaghetti pasta is very cheap. $1.17 CAD per 1lb of dry pasta gives you 1,656 calories. But pasta expands after you cook it. I don't think I could eat like 800-900 calories of pasta in a day without wanting to throw up.

Peanut Butter is probably the most nutritious cheap calorie-dense junk food I could see myself being able to binge on. For $6.29 CAD you can get a 750g jar of 100% roasted peanut butter from Kraft. That's 4,500 calories. 715 Calories Per Canadian Dollar.. And the processed unnatural peanut butter is even cheaper than that. And even then natural peanut butter is not THAT nutritious. Though it does have some micro nutritional value. 10% of your Magnesium in 15g. 6% of your Thiamine in 15g. 2% of your Iron in 15g. Since I'm bulking I'd be eating like 150g of peanut butter in one sitting (900 calories). So I would get 95-100% of my daily Magnesium, 55-60% of my Thiamine and 15-20% of my Iron. The irony is that the highly processed chocolate fudge crème cookies I like to buy gives me 14% of my iron across a 120 calorie serving (but only 2% potassium, 1% calcium). Some junk food is not exactly completely deficient in micronutrient value either.

clean bulking is not necessary, any type of bulk will achieve the same result which is fat gain.