Oldcels that cope with positivity

[New Poster]

Shoot these people into the sun. Kindly old man maxing should be considered harassment and be punishable by exile. Put all these guys onto an island where they can’t pretend be chummy with each other and beam smiles 24/7. Just leave the rest of us alone. There’s no reason for these people to barge into your conversations or ask you for your life story. They just abuse everyone’s pity. You gotta accept it’s over at some point and gracefully exit the social scene. Once I can’t get jb, I’m just going to careermax and focus on hobbies because I have the basic common sense to recognize my social uselessness.

 

[LancasteR]

Yeah and then acting like they didn't ruin the economy, dating and the social contract for everyone.

 

[New Poster]

Yeah and then acting like they didn't ruin the economy, dating and the social contract for everyone.

All that is kinda based. Just leave me and my gf alone while we’re trying eat French toast

 

[LancasteR]

All that is kinda based. Just leave me and my gf alone while we’re trying eat French toast

What's based about that nigga?
Hope some old fart with a big ass smile tells you and your gf his life story, while you're out for French toasts and coffee next time.

 

[dnrwarrior11]

All that is kinda based. Just leave me and my gf alone while we’re trying eat French toast

why r u on here if u have a gf clearly u have escaped

 

[New Poster]

What's based about that nigga?
Hope some old fart with a big ass smile tells you and your gf his life story, while you're out for French toasts and coffee next time.

Raping the planet so you can have 1% more enjoyment sounds pretty dope tbh. I just don’t want to listen to your bullshit when you’re 65.

 

[New Poster]

why r u on here if u have a gf clearly u have escaped

I have a long refractory period

 

[piec]

peak of life satisfaction is shown to be very high at the end of your life, beaten only by childhood

 

[New Poster]

peak of life satisfaction is shown to be very high at the end of your life, beaten only by childhood

Probably because of low expectations — not actual quality of life

 

[piec]

Probably because of low expectations

i dont think some cope like this has anything to do with it, i assume the body just recognizes its end. similarly to the fact you apparently are in the biggest peace imaginable few moments before death

 

[New Poster]

i dont think some cope like this has anything to do with it, i assume the body just recognizes its end. similarly to the fact you apparently are in the biggest peace imaginable few moments before death

I doubt you feel better as your body is breaking down and you feel fatigued all the time. It’s probably just nice to be released from the expectations of the normie grind

 

[piec]

I doubt you feel better as your body is breaking down and you feel fatigued all the time

you underestimate the effect of neurotransmitters, if only a cope was at place then such big data about life satisfaction constantly showing the same outcome wouldnt be possible

 

[New Poster]

you underestimate the effect of neurotransmitters, if only a cope was at place then such big data about life satisfaction constantly showing the same outcome wouldnt be possible

No, I’m saying your neurotransmitters are probably worse in old age. What’s better is the lower expectations. It’s like how people feel relief when diagnosed with a disability. It’s a get-out-of-expectations card. It makes one feel better even when they should feel bad about being disabled.

 

[lifeless]

There’s no point in being negative.

 

[piec]

No, I’m saying your neurotransmitters are probably worse in old age

your argument is a cope you made up in your head, my counter argument is large amounts of data

 

[New Poster]

There’s no point in being negative.

I’m not saying be miserable. I’m saying don’t be annoying.

 

[New Poster]

your argument is a cope you made up in your head, my counter argument is large amounts of data

You didn’t present any data. You said old people are happier and then speculated it was from neurotransmitters because your body knows it’s the end. I presented an alternate speculation that it’s from lowered expectations.

 

[piec]

You didn’t present any data. You said old people are happier and then speculated it was from neurotransmitters because your body knows it’s the end. I presented an alternate speculation that it’s from lowered expectations.

 

[New Poster]

View attachment 3516902

We’re not arguing about “life satisfaction.” We’re arguing about what causes life satisfaction. Is it neurotransmitters from your body telling you it’s the end? Or is it from lowered expectations? Your chart doesn’t answer that question.

 

[piec]

We’re not arguing about “life satisfaction.” We’re arguing about what causes life satisfaction. Is it neurotransmitters from your body telling you it’s the end? Or is it from lowered expectations? Your chart doesn’t answer that question.

my argument to that is what you present for the reason is a cope. a sole cope wouldnt be able to produce massive data like this, obviously there must be a biological reason at play

people are also brainwashed into believing being bald is masculine and good and so on, yet there is clear data life worsens from being bald. copes, as in words and expectations dont produce reliable outcomes, thats part of the reason they are copes

 

[New Poster]

my argument to that is what you present for the reason is a cope. a sole cope wouldnt be able to produce massive data like this, obviously there must be a biological reason at play

people are also brainwashed into believing being bald is masculine and good and so on, yet there is clear data life worsens from being bald. copes, as in words and expectations dont produce reliable outcomes, thats part of the reason they are copes

We’re both calling each other’s argument cope. That doesn’t solve anything here. You didn’t produce any data that shows higher life satisfaction is caused by neurotransmitters from your body knowing it’s the end. You showed data that indicates that life satisfaction is higher in old age. THIS IS NOT THE POINT IN CONTENTION. I agree with you already that life satisfaction is higher. We disagree about WHY that is. I think it’s because of lower expectations.

 

[piec]

We’re both calling each other’s argument cope. That doesn’t solve anything here. You didn’t produce any data that shows higher life satisfaction is caused by neurotransmitters from your body knowing it’s the end. You showed data that indicates that life satisfaction is higher in old age. THIS IS NOT THE POINT IN CONTENTION. I agree with you already that life satisfaction is higher. We disagree about WHY that is. I think it’s because of lower expectations.

i acknowledge your argument, i think you dont understand what im saying

im not saying your argument is cope, im saying your argument for that is a solely psychological one, implying no or negative change in bodily chemistry, based on what the person thinks of as "societal norms".
this can be classified as the person coping with the fact there are no societal norms or things like that on him anymore, even though hes becoming an old shit unable to hold his piss - i refer to this with the bald argument

 

[superpsycho]

cant fucking stand old people because i grew up around manipulative and narcissistic ones who used their age as an excuse to get whatever they wanted and they just put on a positivity mask while grinning ear-to-ear, i sincerely think people over 65 just need to check out of fucking society at that point

a little off topic but since this is a thread about oldcels, i think it would suck to live that long, western soyciety is deteriorating and i dont wanna stick around for 50-60 more years to see what becomes of our world anyway, there’s no point to life past 30 because after that point theres nothing to look forward to and nothing else to doand ur just gonna be another goyim wageslave cuck until the day u retire and die from shit health. life past 30 is a cope if u arent giga rich, talented, famous, or good looking

 

[New Poster]

i acknowledge your argument, i think you dont understand what im saying

im not saying your argument is cope, im saying your argument for that is a solely psychological one, implying no or negative change in bodily chemistry, based on what the person thinks of as "societal norms".
this can be classified as the person coping with the fact there are no societal norms or things like that on him anymore, even though hes becoming an old shit unable to hold his piss - i refer to this with the bald argument

You can play semantics with the word cope all you want, but it doesn’t change my position. I don’t think nearing the end causes the rise in life satisfaction. I think it’s lowered expectations.

Your bald example confuses life satisfaction with life quality — which is my whole point here. You’re saying bald people trick themselves into being happier but their lives are objectively worse. That’s what I’m saying is happening to oldcels. Their life satisfaction goes up while life quality goes down.

 

[piec]

You’re saying bald people trick themselves into being happier but their lives are objectively worse

they can trick themselves all they want but that wont make them happy and thats the point. data shows bald people are NOT happier, very large drop of happiness comes with being bald, its very clear they have higher depression rates and so on

yet old people are happier despite becoming wrinkly, weak, and having sagging skin with 0 collagen, making many of these things worse than simply being bald.
yes you are right that their life quality is objectively worse, but yet they are happy, i cant possibly disprove further your argument as it is something you only specualte about and there is no data about your "expectations".

point is if only an "expectations" factor would be at play, then you wouldnt have such results of these studies. yes most of them probably have the relief of lower expectations at this point, but that doesnt mean much, considering how many people think being bald is a good, masculine thing etc, yet their lives are all becoming worse

 

[looksmaxxed]

old people come from a high trust white society where 95% of all people they ever encountered was white, married with children. in fact telling someone politely that you want to be left alone with your meal or wife was not some big social faux pas and was commonly done, and people understood and could read this behavior. op lives in a reality where 90% of people he encounters is non white potentially violent or mentally ill criminal, and they're all trying to grind up and steal his girl(unmarried)

this can create a very different mindset and attitude in life

i long for the days of my childhood where everyone was exactly like me, thought like me, enjoyed the same things, and we shared an almost telepathic understanding of what to do in social situations. today, i can never predict the behavior of the random black brown or yellow person that wants to sit across from me

 

[New Poster]

they can trick themselves all they want but that wont make them happy and thats the point. data shows bald people are NOT happier, very large drop of happiness comes with being bald, its very clear they have higher depression rates and so on

yet old people are happier despite becoming wrinkly, weak, and having sagging skin with 0 collagen, making many of these things worse than simply being bald.
yes you are right that their life quality is objectively worse, but yet they are happy, i cant possibly disprove further your argument as it is something you only specualte about and there is no data about your "expectations".

point is if only an "expectations" factor would be at play, then you wouldnt have such results of these studies. yes most of them probably have the relief of lower expectations at this point, but that doesnt mean much, considering how many people think being bald is a good, masculine thing etc, yet their lives are all becoming worse

You're equivocating between two versions of the word cope. I'll label them Cope 1 and Cope 2:

Cope 1: A psychological/social belief

Cope 2: An ineffective strategy of dealing with adversity

Most people on the forum use cope to mean Cope 2, but you've introduced this concept of Cope 1 into the conversation. The problem is you want to flip back and forth between Cope 1 and Cope 2 when it serves your argument.

When you want to argue that lowered expectations are cope, you will refer me to Cope 1. But, when you want to say that lowered expectations can't lead to better life satisfaction, you want to use Cope 2. The bald example works for you because it blends Cope 1 and Cope 2. Bald people who delude themselves are tricking themselves psychologically (Cope 1), but ultimately they will get tons of negative social feedback, too, so it will also become Cope 2. This breaks down, though, when discussing my argument about lowered expectations. Lowered expectations are not Cope 2. They don't lead to negative social feedback.

Lots of things that are Cope 1 do make you happy. You can watch porn where you're psychologically recreating the experience of sex and you will feel good. Social status is Cope 1. It exists purely in the mind, but it makes people happy. Cope 1 can make you happy. And lower expectations may be Cope 1, but they are not Cope 2. They absolutely will make you happier. Being a 20 year old not getting laid feels like shit because you feel like you should. Being 70 and not getting laid probably doesn't feel that bad. No one expects you to be a player at that age. This is what lowered expectations does for you.

 

[piec]

You're equivocating between two versions of the word cope. I'll label them Cope 1 and Cope 2:

Cope 1: A psychological/social belief

Cope 2: An ineffective strategy of dealing with adversity

Most people on the forum use cope to mean Cope 2, but you've introduced this concept of Cope 1 into the conversation. The problem is you want to flip back and forth between Cope 1 and Cope 2 when it serves your argument.

When you want to argue that lowered expectations are cope, you will refer me to Cope 1. But, when you want to say that lowered expectations can't lead to better life satisfaction, you want to use Cope 2. The bald example works for you because it blends Cope 1 and Cope 2. Bald people who delude themselves are tricking themselves psychologically (Cope 1), but ultimately they will get tons of negative social feedback, too, so it will also become Cope 2. This breaks down, though, when discussing my argument about lowered expectations. Lowered expectations are not Cope 2. They don't lead to negative social feedback.

Lots of things that are Cope 1 do make you happy. You can watch porn where you're psychologically recreating the experience of sex and you will feel good. Social status is Cope 1. It exists purely in the mind, but it makes people happy. Cope 1 can make you happy. And lower expectations may be Cope 1, but they are not Cope 2. They absolutely will make you happier. Being a 20 year old not getting laid feels like shit because you feel like you should. Being 70 and not getting laid probably doesn't feel that bad. No one expects you to be a player at that age. This is what lowered expectations does for you.

i generally agree with what you said, but things you refer to as cope 1 are very fragile and can fall apart really fast, like crippling porn addiction or your business position starting to fail leading to less status which in turn causes very harsh psychological backlash

you also base your expectation argument like large majority / all old people have only good sentiment of being old - just chilling and so on. life that long leaves you with a giant space for errors and thus regrets, many are probably very remorseful of decisions they took; not having a family, having a family, bad choices in career and so on. plus they are on one way to death with nothing that can be done about things, barely walking and shitting their bed.

if you think about this logically its not all sunshine and rainbows and there are way more negatives of being old than positives, such as "lower expectations"

 

[New Poster]

i generally agree with what you said, but things you refer to as cope 1 are very fragile and can fall apart really fast, like crippling porn addiction or your business position starting to fail leading to less status which in turn causes very harsh psychological backlash (when coping with status for example)

you also base your expectation argument like large majority / all old people have only good sentiment of being old - just chilling and so on. life that long leaves you with a giant space for errors and thus regrets, many are probably very remorseful of decisions they took; not having a family, having a family, bad choices in career and so on. plus they are on one way to death with nothing that can be done about things, barely walking and shitting their bed.

if you think about this logically its not all sunshine and rainbows and there are way more negatives of being old than positives, such as "lower expectations"

Yes, all of this is "fragile." In fact, so is your biology. Everything we've talked about can change. But lowered expectations as you age are about as stable as it gets. The expectations just keep going down as you get older. You can be more and more useless as you age and most people around you will just accept it. This is going to be a relief to anyone. All the shit you had to worry about as a middle-aged normie slips away. You don't need to care whether you're hot, getting laid, climbing the career ladder. It's all over. No fuss. Kids feel the same way. There's low expectations. Here's some data that proves my point:

 

[piec]

Kids feel the same way. There's low expectations

kids arent even sentient for the most part and as you can see from the moment you are, the satisfaction drops dramatically, up to age 10 they are not even on the same iq level as an orangutan. it also mostly comes from having youth and having everthing provided to you while not being capable of larger-scale rational thinking

Yes, all of this is "fragile."

this is why they are copes, looks (a not cope) in itself arent fragile, as long as you look good you will mostly feel great, no matter 14 or 60. your biology is fragile because you lose looks which that graph encapsulates very well. old people defy this, which is why i believe there is bodily action in play. i base that mostly by the fact of near death experiences and brain activity - which is shown to induce great peace in those moments

 

[New Poster]

kids arent even sentient for the most part and as you can see from the moment you are, the satisfaction drops dramatically, up to age 10 they are not even on the same iq level as an orangutan. it also mostly comes from having youth and having everthing provided to you while not being capable of larger-scale rational thinking

this is why they are copes, looks (a not cope) in itself arent fragile, as long as you look good you will mostly feel great, no matter 14 or 60. your biology is fragile because you lose looks which that graph encapsulates very well. old people defy this, which is why i believe there is bodily action in play. i base that mostly by the fact of near death experiences and brain activity - which is shown to induce great peace in those moments

You're still blurring Cope 1 and Cope 2. Just because something is Cope 1 does not mean it's Cope 2. Plenty of things that are social/psychological are stable. Legal codes against murder go back thousands of years, but they're social/psychological constructions. Just because it's in people's minds doesn't make it any less real or less stable. You have to keep Cope 1 and Cope 2 as separate categories or you won't be able think straight. You will constantly confuse your own thoughts.

Also, looks are fragile. Most people become oldcels in their 30s. It's fragile like anything else. It has a strong correlation with happiness, but so do expectations. It's almost by definition that expectations play a role in life satisfaction. The word "satisfaction" means that some need or expectation is satisfied. If your expectations are low, then you don't need as much to reach satisfaction. This creates an even stronger correlation to happiness.

 

[piec]

You're still blurring Cope 1 and Cope 2. Just because something is Cope 1 does not mean it's Cope 2. Plenty of things that are social/psychological are stable. Legal codes against murder go back thousands of years, but they're social/psychological constructions. Just because it's in people's minds doesn't make it any less real or less stable. You have to keep Cope 1 and Cope 2 as separate categories or you won't be able think straight. You will constantly confuse your own thoughts.

Also, looks are fragile. Most people become oldcels in their 30s. It's fragile like anything else. It has a strong correlation with happiness, but so do expectations. It's almost by definition that expectations play a role in life satisfaction. The word "satisfaction" means that some need or expectation is satisfied. If your expectations are low, then you don't need as much to reach satisfaction. This creates an even stronger correlation to happiness.

ok but that is not my base argument on it, you just completly ignored this, again providing narrative that being old is some kind of paradise just because the expectations are low, and maybe you dont have to work

you also base your expectation argument like large majority / all old people have only good sentiment of being old - just chilling and so on. life that long leaves you with a giant space for errors and thus regrets, many are probably very remorseful of decisions they took; not having a family, having a family, bad choices in career and so on. plus they are on one way to death with nothing that can be done about things, barely walking and shitting their bed.

if you think about this logically its not all sunshine and rainbows and there are way more negatives of being old than positives, such as "lower expectations"

 

[New Poster]

ok but that is not my base argument on it, you just completly ignored this, again providing narrative that being old is some kind of paradise just because the expectations are low, and maybe you dont have to work

You don't have a core argument. You have two claims: 1) that old people have greater life satisfaction (we agree on this) 2) that this life satisfaction somehow comes from their bodies knowing they're going to die and flooding their brain with happy chemicals.

I think a better explanation is that the elderly have lower expectations. You don't think lower expectations could cause higher life satisfaction because it's purely psychological/social. I think that's a stupid counter-argument. Lots of things that are psychological/social have profound impacts on life satisfaction -- social status and social expectations being a couple of examples. But you just keep repeating the same counter-argument over and over again that psychological/social beliefs can't be the cause of the increased life satisfaction of the elderly. I disagree. We just keep going in circles.

 

[optimisticzoomer]

Rare miss from my favourite Norwood 5 poster

 

[piec]

think a better explanation is that the elderly have lower expectations

i think that lower expectations are a good reason for greater happines, but as i and even you said, their life quality objectively gets worse.

are lower expectations enough to compensate for all the basic human needs that looks provide + shitting your bed, having a shit physical and mental condition, suffering from diseases or simply back pain and things like that? I dont think so - and so that is my base argument here and why i think neurotransmitters are of great significance in this case, you havent refered to any of those things and just decide to ignore them.

or perhaps you imply that it is in fact enough to overpower all of those things, but then the argument really just ends there

 

[New Poster]

i think that lower expectations are a good reason for greater happines, but as i and even you said, their life quality objectively gets worse.

That applies to your speculation, too. You're trying to argue that the elderly feel better because their body knows they're about to die. Their "life quality' is still getting worse. So this applies to both of our arguments. We're both claiming that the elderly are becoming happier -- even when "their life quality objectively gets worse."

are lower expectations enough to compensate for all the basic human needs that looks provide + shitting your bed, having a shit physical and mental condition, suffering from diseases or simply back pain and things like that?

Is the sense that you're about to die enough to compensate for these things either? Again, you're doing nothing to support your argument over mine. I can say the same things back to you.

i think neurotransmitters are of great significance in this case, you havent refered to any of those things and just decide to ignore them.

I'm not ignoring neurotransmitters. Every feeling is tied to neurotransmitters, so, if we accept the elderly are more satisfied (which we do), then their neurotrasmitters must reflect that. What we're arguing about is why that's happening. You're claiming it's because their bodies somehow know they're going to die. I think lower expectations make them feel more satisfied with their lives -- which undoubtable has an effect on neurotransmitters. You need to build a case that their bodies knowing they're going to die is what's specifically causing this shift in neurotransmitters.

 

[piec]

Is the sense that you're about to die enough to compensate for these things either?

people can get shot, stabbed, beaten up, have their face cut half open and still run at biggest capacity they were ever able to for hours because of them without feeling a thing, as i said i think you greatly undervalue their potency

You need to build a case that their bodies knowing they're going to die is what's specifically causing this shift in neurotransmitters.

a biological clock is a very real thing, which is why most women also experience menopause at around the same time, same with puberty. its a very basic function of human body, i dont think its very improbable that it doesnt know when its reaching its end. i believe also the more it senses that the greater the satisfaction, which is reflected by the chart. i dont think it suddenly just turns on like "oh fuck im about to die, time to feel good", but more of a gradual spectrum

and why i think its a positive shift is because, as i said, near death experiences are regarded as the greatest peace you will experience, and simply by the fact it becomes more satisfactory

 

[edodalic29]

lmao
u cant be out with a hot girl without some old fart mirin and starts feeling the need to yap , its like he is trying to live through you even tho his life ended a long time ago