So let's settle this... CAN YOU GET A SHORTER MIDFACE?

[Deleted member 685]

I remember @varbrah somewhere saying MSE+FACEMASK could pull the bones forward and shorten your midface. @LordNorwood also talked about bimax shortening your midface but didn't provide further proof. @Dude420 whos actually had bimax didn't notice much difference and neither did @Norwooder.

It all doesn't add up. So I decided to ask surgeon Andreishchev on Instagram. This is what we had to say:


@Greeicy @Swescension @medialcanthuscel @KrissKross
@Tylermax

 

[DutchPrettyBoy]

belsimpel.nl

 

[Greeicy]

Bro I can make a whole entire “didn’t read” worthy post debunking this pipe dream but to make it short : A midface shortening surgery would affect the cranial base and there’s always the problem of soft tissue. I really wish it was true but unfortunately even if there’s indeed a surgery to shorten the length of the nose, the results would look like shit because the soft tissue above wouldn’t change and you’ll end up with a maxilla that doesn’t go hand in hand with your soft tissue and you’ll look more deformed than before...that’s assuming that the surgeon can get past not affecting the cranial base during the surgery.

 

[needsolution]

You cant get shorter midface but u can create illusion of shoter midface by rotating ur maxilla upwards with Lefort surgery.


Its all about facial width anyways.

 

[Deleted member 685]

Bro I can make a whole entire “didn’t read” worthy post debunking this pipe dream but to make it short : A midface shortening surgery would affect the cranial base and there’s always the problem of soft tissue. I really wish it was true but unfortunately even if there’s indeed a surgery to shorten the length of the nose, the results would look like shit because the soft tissue above wouldn’t change and you’ll end up with a maxilla that doesn’t go hand in hand with your soft tissue and you’ll look more deformed than before...that’s assuming that the surgeon can get past not affecting the cranial base during the surgery.

STOP FUCKING SPREADING THIS BS. YOUR CRANIAL BASE DOESN'T CHANGE FROM THIS SHIT. Don't talk about shit you don't know anything about. @Dude420 already said this

 

[Greeicy]

STOP FUCKING SPREADING THIS BS. YOUR CRANIAL BASE DOESN'T CHANGE FROM THIS SHIT. Don't talk about shit you don't know anything about. @Dude420 already said this

Midface shortening surgery is not an orthognathic surgery like @Dude420 said. It’s not even a real surgery to begin with for it to be classified as an orthognathic surgery but even if it didn’t affect the cranial base, there’s still the problem of soft tissue.

 

[Tylermax]

Mew

 

[Elias]

No
He just wants your money

 

[BonesAndHarmony]

I need to shorten my midface . It's the number one feature that is ruining my harmony. Even something like 3 mm would make a huge difference.

 

[Deleted member 685]

Midface shortening surgery is not an orthognathic surgery like @Dude420 said. It’s not even a real surgery to begin with for it to be classified as an orthognathic surgery but even if it didn’t affect the cranial base, there’s still the problem of soft tissue.

Wym with soft issue? Forward growth etc makes soft tissue more stretched

No
He just wants your money

Prob true

 

[Greeicy]

Wym with soft issue? Forward growth etc makes soft tissue more stretched

Prob true

Well this isn’t forward growth we’re talking about here. This is vertical shortening so the soft tissue won’t get stretched but rather end up looking “saggy” instead. Plus, there’s 0 room for any maxillofacial surgeon to add any forward growth to my face since my maxilla is not recessed but if yours is, then you can try to be that surgeon’s guinea pig.

 

[Deleted member 2769]

@ me in the next midface thread

 

[reptiles]

Bro I can make a whole entire “didn’t read” worthy post debunking this pipe dream but to make it short : A midface shortening surgery would affect the cranial base and there’s always the problem of soft tissue. I really wish it was true but unfortunately even if there’s indeed a surgery to shorten the length of the nose, the results would look like shit because the soft tissue above wouldn’t change and you’ll end up with a maxilla that doesn’t go hand in hand with your soft tissue and you’ll look more deformed than before...that’s assuming that the surgeon can get past not affecting the cranial base during the surgery.

The only surgery that will allow it is cranial vault expansion and quite literally moving entire face forward

 

[BonesAndHarmony]

Well this isn’t forward growth we’re talking about here. This is vertical shortening so the soft tissue won’t get stretched but rather end up looking “saggy” instead. Plus, there’s 0 room for any maxillofacial surgeon to add any forward growth to my face since my maxilla is not recessed but if yours is, then you can try to be that surgeon’s guinea pig.

I'm not exactly familiar with this type of
surgery but in theory midface shortening is not doable because the maxilla underneath your nose would still be long, plus fucking up your nasal airways is not a good idea. However I believe even something like 2 mm would make a huge impact. For exaample I measured my midface to be 5 mm too long. We're basically talking about mere millimeters, so I think midface shortening is not completely impossible, consider that we already have surgeries like lip lift.

 

[Dude420]

Bro I can make a whole entire “didn’t read” worthy post debunking this pipe dream but to make it short : A midface shortening surgery would affect the cranial base and there’s always the problem of soft tissue. I really wish it was true but unfortunately even if there’s indeed a surgery to shorten the length of the nose, the results would look like shit because the soft tissue above wouldn’t change and you’ll end up with a maxilla that doesn’t go hand in hand with your soft tissue and you’ll look more deformed than before...that’s assuming that the surgeon can get past not affecting the cranial base during the surgery.

Midface shortening surgery is not an orthognathic surgery like @Dude420 said. It’s not even a real surgery to begin with for it to be classified as an orthognathic surgery but even if it didn’t affect the cranial base, there’s still the problem of soft tissue.

You are beyond retarded. Do you even know where the cranial base is? Midface shortening (maxillary impaction) is a common procedure for gummy smiles, you can do the same procedure if you don't have a gummy smile but you will need a lip lift.


I have to make the precision that I didn't notice much because my occlusal plane is at a very down trajectory and I had a lot of advancement that followed that trajectory which countered the effect of the impaction in terms of facial height. Secondly, I need a lip lift because my midface got shorter nonetheless, I will probably notice it more after the lip lift. Thirdly, I got CCW impaction with a lot of advancement, you can gain more midface shortening if you go for full impaction.

 

[Deleted member 1849]

I remember @varbrah somewhere saying MSE+FACEMASK could pull the bones forward and shorten your midface. @LordNorwood also talked about bimax shortening your midface but didn't provide further proof. @Dude420 whos actually had bimax didn't notice much difference and neither did @Norwooder.

It all doesn't add up. So I decided to ask surgeon Andreishchev on Instagram. This is what we had to say:
View attachment 370623View attachment 370624

@Greeicy @Swescension @medialcanthuscel @KrissKross
@Tylermax

Improve everything else. Curtains and MSE will help you.

 

[Greeicy]

You are beyond retarded. Do you even know where the cranial base is? MidFace shortening is a common procedure for a gummy smile, you can do the same procedure if you don't have a gummy smile but you will need a lip lift.


I have to make the precision that I didn't notice much because my occlusal is at a very down trajectory and I had a lot of advancement which countered the effect of the impaction. Secondly, I need a lip lift because my mid-face got shorter nonetheless, I will probably notice it more after the lip lift. Thirdly, I got CCW impaction with a lot of advancement, you can gain more midface shortening if you go for full impaction.

You just proved my point bruh. What was reduced was the upper jaw to fix a gummy smile and since the upper jaw is kind of separated than the rest of the skull, it’s easy to cut off the bone as well as the soft tissue. You can see that the middle third aka the nose length didn’t move a single millimeter. You would have to cut off an entire portion of the middle third to make the nose shorter and that would affect the cranial base because you are changing the entire shape of the skull and making it more compact. That gummy smile lefort doesn’t do shit.

 

[Dude420]

You just proved my point bruh. What was reduced was the upper jaw to fix a gummy smile and since the upper jaw is kind of separated than the rest of the skull, it’s easy to cut off the bone as well as the soft tissue. You can see that the middle third aka the nose length didn’t move a single millimeter. You would have to cut off an entire portion of the middle third to make the nose shorter and that would affect the cranial base because you are changing the entire shape of the skull and making it more compact. That gummy smile lefort doesn’t do shit.

I never talked about a smaller nose. I said the midface is shorter and this is correct. Like I told Gudru in private convos, the nose cartilage isn't touched in impaction but it ends up resting at a different position(closer to the teeth) which affects the midface ratio (look at the video again). Moreover, the video clearly shows that the cranial base is untouched.

 

[DutchPrettyBoy]

Mew

tbh ngl

 

[Deleted member 1338]

if your nose is pointing down and it was rotated yes it will be shorter.

 

[Usum]

I need to shorten my midface . It's the number one feature that is ruining my harmony. Even something like 3 mm would make a huge difference.

Sleep while doing a headstand.

 

[medialcanthuscel]

NO

 

[Deleted member 685]

NO

Was your bimax even CCW??

 

[medialcanthuscel]

Was your bimax even CCW??

Yes

 

[LordNorwood]

Surprised at the ignorance in this thread ngl, this was considered basic fact on here even a few months ago.
Take a sheet of paper and hold it perpendicular to your eyes. Rotate the upper half away from you, allowing the front half to come up. Does the paper appear shorter?
Yes. Even though the actual absolute length of the paper is unchanged.
This is what happens when you "upturn the nose" like Andresichev said. Ofc you can't change the absolute length of the maxilla short of an impaction. But if you perform a CCW, your midface will appear shorter from the front. Which is all you care about.
This is also why long midface and downward growth tend to go hand in hand.
There is no way to truly shorten the absolute length of the nose, but it can be made to appear shorter in some scenarios.

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

You cant get shorter midface but u can create illusion of shoter midface by rotating ur maxilla upwards with Lefort surgery.


Its all about facial width anyways.

Ccw doesn't create a illusion

 

[needsolution]

Ccw doesn't create a illusion

It creates, maxilla and midface isnt shorter in itself but it looks shorter from front.

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

It creates, maxilla and midface isnt shorter in itself but it looks shorter from front.

No ask guys that did ccw, no illusion at all

 

[needsolution]

No ask guys that did ccw, no illusion at all

I meant lefort 2/3

Its pipe dream anyways since no one will get it

 

[ScramFranklin]

Moving the maxilla upward through impaction would shorten the lower third. Think about the cut, and think about how the bone will move. Assuming you mean your midface is starting from the bottom of your nose, and going to your nasion, that won't shorten.

edit: the video posted that tries to show that it will shorten, instead shows, that indeed, it doesn't. Although bone from the middle third is removed, the maxilla moves upward taking it's place. However, the nose is not moving up. It's just that the maxilla that was part of the lower third, is now part of the middle third. The length of the middle third stays the same, but the lower third has shortened (due to part of the lower third "filling the gap" in the middle third).

 

[WannaBeA6]

From what I gathered, only on specific situations, like if you have a gummy smile and long philtrum, which is mine tbh

 

[Deleted member 685]

Moving the maxilla upward through impaction would shorten the lower third. Think about the cut, and think about how the bone will move. Assuming you mean your midface is starting from the bottom of your nose, and going to your nasion, that won't shorten.

edit: the video posted that tries to show that it will shorten, instead shows, that indeed, it doesn't. Although bone from the middle third is removed, the maxilla moves upward taking it's place. However, the nose is not moving up. It's just that the maxilla that was part of the lower third, is now part of the middle third. The length of the middle third stays the same, but the lower third has shortened (due to part of the lower third "filling the gap" in the middle third).

Well if we got a rhino after wouldn't it be shorter?

 

[ScramFranklin]

Well if we got a rhino after wouldn't it be shorter?

I don't know much about rhinoplasty's, but I am not aware that they can shorten/"squish" the nose vertically.

A lot of times people mistake a long lower third, or even a long philtrum, for a long midface. Because they have a long face overall. It's illusion. Hence, why there are so many jaw surgery results of people who had downward growing jaws, got surgery with CCW, shortening their lower third. Then they look much more balanced and pleasing to they eye.

An example of an actual long midface is adam driver. His lower third is actually quite good. If his midface is shortened through a morph, he suddenly becomes attractive.

 

[Deleted member 685]

I don't know much about rhinoplasty's, but I am not aware that they can shorten/"squish" the nose vertically.

A lot of times people mistake a long lower third, or even a long philtrum, for a long midface. Because they have a long face overall. It's illusion. Hence, why there are so many jaw surgery results of people who had downward growing jaws, got surgery with CCW, shortening their lower third. Then they look much more balanced and pleasing to they eye.

An example of an actual long midface is adam driver. His lower third is actually quite good. If his midface is shortened through a morph, he suddenly becomes attractive.

I'm definitely downward grown with a long nose and midface in general tho

 

[Inscol]

Unironically buy an iPhone and take pics with it instead of android, it will show your true face while android makes your face longer and more narrow

 

[sandcelmuttcel]

COPE you will end up with pig nose and shorter midface but you will be uglier than before

 

[Deleted member 685]

COPE you will end up with pig nose and shorter midface but you will be uglier than before

That doesn't matter to me cause I'll get a rhinoplasty either way

 

[sandcelmuttcel]

only way you can reduce midface is lip lift and nosejob if you have hook nose.

 

[Deleted member 685]

only way you can reduce midface is lip lift and nosejob if you have hook nose.

But you just said it could be attained by bimax...?

 

[sandcelmuttcel]

But you just said it could be attained by bimax...?

what ???

 

[Dude420]

Moving the maxilla upward through impaction would shorten the lower third. Think about the cut, and think about how the bone will move. Assuming you mean your midface is starting from the bottom of your nose, and going to your nasion, that won't shorten.

edit: the video posted that tries to show that it will shorten, instead shows, that indeed, it doesn't. Although bone from the middle third is removed, the maxilla moves upward taking it's place. However, the nose is not moving up. It's just that the maxilla that was part of the lower third, is now part of the middle third. The length of the middle third stays the same, but the lower third has shortened (due to part of the lower third "filling the gap" in the middle third).

Yea, I think we are conceptualizing the same results,
just that I was referring to this when speaking of midface (when people say they want a shorter midface they are usually referring to their philtrum as well)

while you are speaking in those terms

Well if we got a rhino after wouldn't it be shorter?

In width yes, not in length. You can't cut a quarter of your nose and stitch it back. Get in your head Gudru that you can't make your nose shorter in absolute terms, you can only change the angle and position of the nose which affects his relative length.

 

[Deleted member 3962]

3d affects how 2d looks

if u bring ur maxilla forwards and up ur nose will appeal shorter

 

[KrissKross]

Life petroleum

 

[000]

I remember @varbrah somewhere saying MSE+FACEMASK could pull the bones forward and shorten your midface. @LordNorwood also talked about bimax shortening your midface but didn't provide further proof. @Dude420 whos actually had bimax didn't notice much difference and neither did @Norwooder.

It all doesn't add up. So I decided to ask surgeon Andreishchev on Instagram. This is what we had to say:
View attachment 370623View attachment 370624

@Greeicy @Swescension @medialcanthuscel @KrissKross
@Tylermax

No shit you can