The belief in death is fundamentally irrational

[neurosis]

If we define death as the eventual ending of your conscious experience, then it's illogical to believe in such a concept as there is literally ZERO proof or evidence for anyone's conscious experience ending EVER.

axiom a) You have only known what its like to be (you), you cannot recollect or fathom what it means to not be alive or nothing
axiom b) You have never experienced what's its like to not be you, thus no proof that anyone other than yourself is conscious or has qualia
axiom c) Your entire perception of reality is the product of your brain + senses, thus there's no way to decipher objective reality from your subjective brain user interface (or objective reality from the imagination or a dream)

Taking all three axioms into account, anyone who you think has supposedly died irl is indistinguishable from your imaginary friend dying in a dream. So what basis can anyone say that you'll (key word: you) die if all you've ever known is consciousness and nothing else.

 

[isis_Bleach]

My dad died and his dad before that

 

[neurosis]

My dad died and his dad before that

 

[neurosis]

bumo

 

[Petsmart]

Consciousness is indeed only observable from the point of view of the conscious being. If we chop the brain open we don’t see some magic box with someone’s experience in there.

Unfortunately it is not a good faith argument to just say “well you can’t see their point of view so how do you know they’re not conscious?”

When you go to sleep you experience unconsciousness or rather realize you were not conscious upon waking up.

Consciousness no doubt stems from the brain, whether or not consciousness itself is the brain is up for debate of course but we NEED the brain for consciousness to arise. Similar to how we NEED electricity for a computer to run.

In the event of the brain ceasing to exist, it is practically a 100% chance that the consciousness also ceases. Maybe there’s a way to synthesize the same conscious experience artificially one day but as of right now if your brain is gone, your consciousness is gone.

We will find out who is right one day though won’t we brother

 

[neurosis]

debate of course but we NEED the brain for consciousness to arise. Similar to how we NEED electricity for a computer to run.

wrong. there are several species who don't have brains and would be considered 'conscious' be your good faith definition.

the brain isn't the prerequisite for consciousness.

 

[Petsmart]

wrong. there are several species who don't have brains and would be considered 'conscious' be your good faith definition.

the brain isn't the prerequisite for consciousness.

Their level of ‘consciousness’ would be equivalent to the brainstem automatically dilating our pupils or slowing our heart rate. Definitely no where near the complexity of active human awareness which certainly requires a brain to exist.

 

[neurosis]

Their level of ‘consciousness’ would be equivalent to the brainstem automatically dilating our pupils or slowing our heart rate. Definitely no where near the complexity of active human awareness which certainly requires a brain to exist.

Do you consider jellyfish conscious?

Yes - Your entire point for the brain being a precondition for consciousness is fundamentally wrong.
No - In terms of the animal kingdom, where does consciousness arise?

check and mate solipsism denier.

 

[Mumbai_HTN]

high iq repping

 

[Petsmart]

Do you consider jellyfish conscious?

Yes - Your entire point for the brain being a precondition for consciousness is fundamentally wrong.
No - In terms of the animal kingdom, where does consciousness arise?

check and mate solipsism denier.

Are all brains conscious? No

Do conscious beings have brains? Yes

When someone is braindead are they conscious? No


This is like comparing a raspberry pi to a NASA super computer, both are computers but one is capable of significantly more complex tasks. In the case of a more complex brain, human levels of consciousness.

It’s all in the neuron density, high neuron density = higher levels of consciousness which is all from the brain.

At this point you’re just trolling nigga

 

[neurosis]

Are all brains conscious? No

Do conscious beings have brains? Yes

When someone is braindead are they conscious? No


This is like comparing a raspberry pi to a NASA super computer, both are computers but one is capable of significantly more complex tasks.

It’s all in the neuron density, high neuron density = higher levels of consciousness which is all from the brain.

At this point you’re just trolling nigga

holy question dodge

Do you consider jellyfish conscious?

yes or no

 

[Petsmart]

holy question dodge

Do you consider jellyfish conscious?

yes or no

No

 

[neurosis]

No

No - In terms of the animal kingdom, where does consciousness arise?

and then define consciousness

 

[Petsmart]

and then define consciousness

Awareness and responding to ones surroundings.

A jellyfish is not aware but it can respond.

 

[neurosis]

Awareness and responding to ones surroundings.

A jellyfish is not aware but it can respond.

keep dodging

No - In terms of the animal kingdom, where does consciousness arise?

 

[Petsmart]

keep dodging

Bad faith arguments after bad faith arguments.

 

[neurosis]

Bad faith arguments after bad faith arguments.

youve completely failed to comprehend axiom a and b in op and no, calling them 'bad faith' arguments is not a rebuttal.

axiom a and b mean that defining any form of consciousness outside of your own is a complete paradox. there's no way of proving im not an empty zombie vessel and exist solely as an extension of your 'awareness'/consciousness.

neither can you state where consciousness arose bc again, the brain isnt a prerequisite for consciousness. literally not one person on the planet knows the precondition (you literally said that yourself), for consciousness so defining the brain and just the brain as the sole input is giga low iq and doesnt have any hard evidence - its a leap of faith analogous to religious people who state their god exists bc x or y

 

[Petsmart]

youve completely failed to comprehend axiom a and b in op and no, calling them 'bad faith' arguments is not a rebuttal.

axiom a and b mean that defining any form of consciousness outside of your own is a complete paradox. there's no way of proving im not an empty zombie vessel and exist solely as an extension of your 'awareness'/consciousness.

No, debating in good faith would have you saying things like

- You literally can’t see the subjective conscious experience of someone’s mind so there’s no way to know.
- Even if you scan the brain and see it light up to different reactions that is still correlation and still not an objective view proving another’s conscious existence.

Instead you try to do gotcha’s or make the other person look retarded while also changing the goal post when your good faith version of the argument is super simple.

You’re also ignoring the obvious passive evidence that brains lead to human consciousness. When they get shot in the head, I guess they just mysteriously fall and never respond for no reason then since according to you the brain =/= consciousness.

 

[neurosis]

No, debating in good faith would have you saying things like

- You literally can’t see the subjective conscious experience of someone’s mind so there’s no way to know.
- Even if you scan the brain and see it light up to different reactions that is still correlation and still not an objective view proving another’s conscious existence.

Instead you try to do gotcha’s or make the other person look retarded while also changing the goal post when your good faith version of the argument is super simple.

You’re also ignoring the obvious passive evidence that brains lead to human consciousness. When they get shot in the head, I guess they just mysteriously fall and never respond for no reason then since according to you the brain =/= consciousness.

dnr

We will find out who is right one day though won’t we brother

see you in the afterlife. you will never die and your consciousness will never end, mark my words.

 

[Petsmart]

dnr

see you in the afterlife. you will never die, mark my words.

Buddy thinks I want to not exist forever, believe me I’d rather keep on existing.

But this is hypothetical cope.