What to do about my crap lower jaw

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Ok so how to deal with my subhuman recessed lower jaw. I started this journey trying to research my TMJ issues (clicking, popping, crunching, locked jaw etc) and whereas before I wasn't focused on aesthetics at all, finding my way on neurotic autistic forums like this has poisoned my mind and now it's an issue.

Here's a rough profile shot, blurred and B/W filtered in a desperate attempt to disguise me (I don't know how you people are posting full, uncensored shots lol). Anyway hopefully this gives a good idea of my jaw without ID-ing me too much.



As you can see, my skull is a weird combination of high-T development and a mouth breathing/thumb sucking childhood. Skull projection at the back is nerdlike (although I have very thick hair which adds to the bulk). I think I have almost adequate forward growth in some respects, could use some more, but clearly my lower jaw lets me down. Also long philtrum and thin upper lip - although I could always get a lip lift if I reach the kind of aesthetic neurosis this forum is steering me towards.

So here's where I get confused. Even though I clearly have an overbite (top front teeth sit over the bottom front teeth), my bite is otherwise good in that my molars fit nicely together. Have all 4 wisdom teeth, never had extractions or braces. Now if I jut my lower jaw to account for the overbite, my front teeth are aligned but now there's a vertical gap between my molars which are now misaligned. So what exactly would they do to fix my jaw and overbite? Clearly my lower jaw needs moving forward to stop the TMJ issues but how would affect my bite? Would they have to move the maxilla forward as well? I already have monkey face from 3/4 view although that may be a factor of low BF.

Or what about CCW rotation? For some reason I think my profile screams it. The problem is though, although my philtrum is too long, my upper lip is in the perfect position relative to my teeth - nice tooth visibility with no gum show. I'm afraid if they rotated my maxilla up, I'd see no top teeth. Every solution has some problem I can't get past.

And then there's FAGGA - grow the maxilla forward and the mandible catches up, but no upswing. Would that be good for my profile?

Of course I could always just say fuck the bite and fuck the TMJ problems and just get a chin implant, lol. The problem with asking experts is that it costs you a shit load for a consultation, and they're always going to be steering me toward a solution which benefits THEM financially. So I'm kind of paralyzed in a state of confusion and indecision. Any insights? Sorry for the shit photo and I'll probably take it down eventually.

 

[Immoral_virgin]

Chew more gum and tongue chew

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

J

Chew more gum and tongue chew

I already do. Neither is going to fix the problem stated.

 

[bain]

meh imo its not forward growth thats holding you back at all no ccws maxilla shit dont even think you have a very bad overbite or horrible recession tbh its lower third volume and vetical height, its absolutely tiny, no vertical projection no height at all, dont even want to measure thirds tbh thought scares me. mento, chin augmentation/implants or smth idk, vertically lengthening chin implant seemse exactly what you would need tbh but dont find any clean before/afters in a sec. no idea how this would relate to your tmj problems but for cosmetic purely i would really not fuck with anything but chin rly.
how much is consultation? 100-200 or smth? tbh id bite it if i were seriously thinking about surgery, its gonnna cost anyway and youre going to have to do it eventually, maybe for thoughts on aeshetics ppl on sites like these are useful but for specific medical shit related with plastic surgery eventually youre going to have to see someone. those guys are a hundred percent more qualified to talk about your dental medical issues and how they might go together with your cosmetic surgery than any bunch of anxious teenagers on a random internet forum
assume you already researched the standard tmj surgery shit (and other standard stuff)? reading some shit here on arthrocentesis, modified condylotomy, tmj arthroscopy, no idea wtf that shit is tbh but doesnt seem that invasive.
just talk to a doctor first tbh, see what he says

 

[uglykunt]

Ok so how to deal with my subhuman recessed lower jaw. I started this journey trying to research my TMJ issues (clicking, popping, crunching, locked jaw etc) and whereas before I wasn't focused on aesthetics at all, finding my way on neurotic autistic forums like this has poisoned my mind and now it's an issue.

Here's a rough profile shot, blurred and B/W filtered in a desperate attempt to disguise me (I don't know how you people are posting full, uncensored shots lol). Anyway hopefully this gives a good idea of my jaw without ID-ing me too much.



As you can see, my skull is a weird combination of high-T development and a mouth breathing/thumb sucking childhood. Skull projection at the back is nerdlike (although I have very thick hair which adds to the bulk). I think I have almost adequate forward growth in some respects, could use some more, but clearly my lower jaw lets me down. Also long philtrum and thin upper lip - although I could always get a lip lift if I reach the kind of aesthetic neurosis this forum is steering me towards.

So here's where I get confused. Even though I clearly have an overbite (top front teeth sit over the bottom front teeth), my bite is otherwise good in that my molars fit nicely together. Have all 4 wisdom teeth, never had extractions or braces. Now if I jut my lower jaw to account for the overbite, my front teeth are aligned but now there's a vertical gap between my molars which are now misaligned. So what exactly would they do to fix my jaw and overbite? Clearly my lower jaw needs moving forward to stop the TMJ issues but how would affect my bite? Would they have to move the maxilla forward as well? I already have monkey face from 3/4 view although that may be a factor of low BF.

Or what about CCW rotation? For some reason I think my profile screams it. The problem is though, although my philtrum is too long, my upper lip is in the perfect position relative to my teeth - nice tooth visibility with no gum show. I'm afraid if they rotated my maxilla up, I'd see no top teeth. Every solution has some problem I can't get past.

And then there's FAGGA - grow the maxilla forward and the mandible catches up, but no upswing. Would that be good for my profile?

Of course I could always just say fuck the bite and fuck the TMJ problems and just get a chin implant, lol. The problem with asking experts is that it costs you a shit load for a consultation, and they're always going to be steering me toward a solution which benefits THEM financially. So I'm kind of paralyzed in a state of confusion and indecision. Any insights? Sorry for the shit photo and I'll probably take it down eventually.

My lower third is similar to yours
I also have overbite,thin upper lip, long-ish philtrum but I'm a height and frame mogger
High t as well blood test came in at 850ng/dl
P.s im 15

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

meh imo its not forward growth thats holding you back at all no ccws maxilla shit dont even think you have a very bad overbite or horrible recession tbh its lower third volume and vetical height, its absolutely tiny, no vertical projection no height at all, dont even want to measure thirds tbh thought scares me. mento, chin augmentation/implants or smth idk, vertically lengthening chin implant seemse exactly what you would need tbh but dont find any clean before/afters in a sec. no idea how this would relate to your tmj problems but for cosmetic purely i would really not fuck with anything but chin rly.
how much is consultation? 100-200 or smth? tbh id bite it if i were seriously thinking about surgery, its gonnna cost anyway and youre going to have to do it eventually, maybe for thoughts on aeshetics ppl on sites like these are useful but for specific medical shit related with plastic surgery eventually youre going to have to see someone. those guys are a hundred percent more qualified to talk about your dental medical issues and how they might go together with your cosmetic surgery than any bunch of anxious teenagers on a random internet forum
assume you already researched the standard tmj surgery shit (and other standard stuff)? reading some shit here on arthrocentesis, modified condylotomy, tmj arthroscopy, no idea wtf that shit is tbh but doesnt seem that invasive.
just talk to a doctor first tbh, see what he says

Yeah you're right lower third lacks height and volume. Already have a somewhat long face though (huge forehead) so am reluctant to do anything which adds length. Could definitely do with a bigger, more forward chin though. However that wouldn't solve the TMJ issues, which are quite bad. I'm almost guaranteed to lock my jaw chewing on something like a tough bagel.

You're right I need to talk to the experts, however I've been down the rabbit hole of throwing loads of money on multiple consultations before (medical issue) and came out none the wiser. I think part of my problem is that I'm so confused and ill informed going in, I'm afraid I'll either get confused by what they're saying or fail to ask important questions I should be asking, lol. I feel like I should be going into these consultations already clued up to some degree.

 

[bain]

Yeah you're right lower third lacks height and volume. Already have a somewhat long face though (huge forehead) so am reluctant to do anything which adds length. Could definitely do with a bigger, more forward chin though. However that wouldn't solve the TMJ issues, which are quite bad. I'm almost guaranteed to lock my jaw chewing on something like a tough bagel.

You're right I need to talk to the experts, however I've been down the rabbit hole of throwing loads of money on multiple consultations before (medical issue) and came out none the wiser. I think part of my problem is that I'm so confused and ill informed going in, I'm afraid I'll either get confused by what they're saying or fail to ask important questions I should be asking, lol. I feel like I should be going into these consultations already clued up to some degree.

wouldnt worry too much about having a longish face when the alternative is having a comically undergrown chin tbh its about proportions tbh. you have the robustness to pull of a longer face too though i cant fully judge without frontal

hmmm think youre overthinking the medical advice thing, you already know 10x more than avg patient, you think avg joe has any fucking ideas on his bite and maxilla rotation he just goes in says doc i have problem doc says ill fix that tbh. wouldnt insurance cover when its an actual medical problem or am i being very naive here? nothing wrong with reading up in front, you can probably ask about antyhing you want or dont immediately understand it would just add a bit of light to the doctor's life at best annoy him a tiny bit at worst np, especially when youre paying for it. id say trust the guys though, be skeptical afterward think about the shit he says but not upfront if you want to get max out of it tbh

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

wouldnt worry too much about having a longish face when the alternative is having a comically undergrown chin tbh its about proportions tbh. you have the robustness to pull of a longer face too though i cant fully judge without frontal

hmmm think youre overthinking the medical advice thing, you already know 10x more than avg patient, you think avg joe has any fucking ideas on his bite and maxilla rotation he just goes in says doc i have problem doc says ill fix that tbh. wouldnt insurance cover when its an actual medical problem or am i being very naive here? nothing wrong with reading up in front, you can probably ask about antyhing you want or dont immediately understand it would just add a bit of light to the doctor's life at best annoy him a tiny bit at worst np, especially when youre paying for it. id say trust the guys though, be skeptical afterward think about the shit he says but not upfront if you want to get max out of it tbh

Yeah man hopefully I should get at least some coverage from insurance given the TMJ issues. You're right though I need to do some more reading.

 

[uglykunt]

Yeah man hopefully I should get at least some coverage from insurance given the TMJ issues. You're right though I need to do some more reading.

Wats TMJ?

 

[bain]

Wats TMJ?

google bro

Yeah man hopefully I should get at least some coverage from insurance given the TMJ issues. You're right though I need to do some more reading.

lmaao was kinda encouraging the opposite but dw about it im not your mom id say get that shit checked by a doctor though if you are hindered by purely medical problems
youre skeptical and pro-active enough tho thats f sure tbh

 

[Swagwaffle]

blow it off with a shotgun

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

blow it off with a shotgun

Don't think I haven't thought about it

 

[mojopin]

Never put aesthetics before health, especially in regards to breathing. Get the FAGGA and you’ll get pretty great improvements with both the airway and face. Your face is forward grown. At least above average. And I don’t think your philtrum is a problem although I could be wrong considering the absence of a portrait photo. Just look at Jon Hamm. Longer philtrum but high T features just make it work. If I were you I would absolutely change hairstyles to a more classical look which looks suave but allows a little length on the back to hide any skull projection. Also maybe it’s just the way you’re taking the photo but you have slight forward head posture too. Forget about implants. The rate of recession is scary especially for those with breathing problems such as sleep apnea or jaw joint issues.

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Never put aesthetics before health, especially in regards to breathing. Get the FAGGA and you’ll get pretty great improvements with both the airway and face. Your face is forward grown. At least above average. And I don’t think your philtrum is a problem although I could be wrong considering the absence of a portrait photo. Just look at Jon Hamm. Longer philtrum but high T features just make it work. If I were you I would absolutely change hairstyles to a more classical look which looks suave but allows a little length on the back to hide any skull projection. Also maybe it’s just the way you’re taking the photo but you have slight forward head posture too. Forget about implants. The rate of recession is scary especially for those with breathing problems such as sleep apnea or jaw joint issues.

Yeah my plan is to concentrate on function but with a view to maximizing aesthetics wherever possible. Luckily, the two goals have a lot in common.

Definitely less than ideal head posture in the photo. I have real trouble taking profile selfies in a mirror because basically when I can't see myself I have a very warped idea of what my head and neck is doing, lol.

FAGGA has been interesting me for a while now, but I've also recently come across the concept of MSE combined with face pulling: https://the-great-work.org/communit...grail-for-moving-the-maxilla-up-and-forwards/ - this MSE device is a lot more tested than FAGGA, with its resultsseemingly much better documented.

Long philtrum doesn't worry me too much per se, as much as the fact that it's noticeably longer than when I was 21 (going by photos). Makes me paranoid that my maxilla has actually dropped (if that's possible), but I think what's more likely happened is that my top lip has gone to shit, making the philtrum look longer.

 

[mojopin]

Yeah my plan is to concentrate on function but with a view to maximizing aesthetics wherever possible. Luckily, the two goals have a lot in common.

Definitely less than ideal head posture in the photo. I have real trouble taking profile selfies in a mirror because basically when I can't see myself I have a very warped idea of what my head and neck is doing, lol.

FAGGA has been interesting me for a while now, but I've also recently come across the concept of MSE combined with face pulling: https://the-great-work.org/communit...grail-for-moving-the-maxilla-up-and-forwards/ - this MSE device is a lot more tested than FAGGA, with its resultsseemingly much better documented.

Long philtrum doesn't worry me too much per se, as much as the fact that it's noticeably longer than when I was 21 (going by photos). Makes me paranoid that my maxilla has actually dropped (if that's possible), but I think what's more likely happened is that my top lip has gone to shit, making the philtrum look longer.

Interesting. I’m most definitely going to have some form of appliance to expand the dental arch. As much as I want to look good I prefer health over all.

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Interesting. I’m most definitely going to have some form of appliance to expand the dental arch. As much as I want to look good I prefer health over all.

Reading through that thread, the palate expansion that guy has been getting is insane, like almost a mm per day.

 

[Zesto]

You look like Steve McQueen.

 

[mojopin]

Reading through that thread, the palate expansion that guy has been getting is insane, like almost a mm per day.

No matter what device I get, I feel like once my facial development is fixed for the most part that I can live a life true to our ancestors and be free. That’s the way I’ll truly ascend

 

[Nibba]

Don't think I haven't thought about it

Hits too close to home

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

You look like Steve McQueen.

ha ha I wish. That guy was 9/10 from every angle. You'd have to do some serious work on me.

No matter what device I get, I feel like once my facial development is fixed for the most part that I can live a life true to our ancestors and be free. That’s the way I’ll truly ascend

Yeah man. Genetic potential is where it's at. I also want to get Lasik so I can ditch these stupid non-neanderthal non-genetic-potential contact lenses.

Hits too close to home

On the plus side, I might get a totally new $1.5m face.

 

[Tr3way]

Slayer

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Slayer

Like everyone else, with a few mm adjustments of bone here and there.....it's so infuriating

 

[Tr3way]

Like everyone else, with a few mm adjustments of bone here and there.....it's so infuriating

Except nibba, he needs a few feet of bone bruh

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Except nibba, he needs a few feet of bone bruh

I could do with a few more feet of bone......down my pants

 

[Tr3way]

I could do with a few more feet of bone......down my pants

Yeah in your ass

 

[TaCopineEstMoche]

Yeah in your ass

Took your time with that one didn't you. Over 20 minutes!