Why Systemic GHK-CU is ass

[skigmamigma]

So currently, the copper peptide GHK-CU has gained alot of fame for it's supposed collagen benefits. But can this peptide actually live up to its hype?

Spoiler: Systemic GHK-CU benefits

So recently a lot of people have been throwing around the supposed "benefits" of Systemic GHK-CU dosed daily from 2-5mg.
(Anti-aging, Improved skin & hair, Skin & collagen improvement)
But when you look into the literature the dose and the benefits simply do not correlate.

Spoiler: Explanation

So you may be wondering why I say this - well, let me explain.

Here for example, we see a study of GHK-Cu being used on mice (like nearly all other GHK-Cu tests), and if you look where I drew the red circle, the study explains that they dosed the mice with 10 µg/g. doesn't sound like much, but that is actually 10mg/kg

And every single GHK-CU study you find out there, every single one dosed the subjects at over 0.5mg/kg for it to be "significant" as for example shown in this study by The Journal Of Clinical Investigation

Spoiler: Half-Life of GHK-CU

And unfortunately GHK-CU has one more major problem about it, that being the half life.
Now we don't actually know a lot about GHK-CU's half-life but it's estimated to be somewhere from 5 minutes to an hour.

Spoiler: My Conclusion On Systemic Usage of GHK-CU

So with that being said, when we actually look at the data instead of the marketing, it becomes clear that systemic GHK-Cu simply doesn’t live up to the hype. But hypothetically let's say we use the copious dose that they used on mice in the studies. The average weight of a man in USA is 199 Pounds / 90 KG.
So as I said earlier the dose at which GHK-CU became significantly effective was 0.5mg / kg.
And if we apply that to the average weight of an American man, You would have to dose 45mg GHK-CU everyday


Just to put that into perspective, it would be more expensive to effectively dose GHK-CU monthly than HGH

Spoiler: Sources

In vivo stimulation of connective tissue accumulation by the tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ in rat experimental wounds - PubMed

The tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ (GHK-Cu) was first described as a growth factor for differentiated cells. Recent in vitro data showed that it possesses several properties of a potential activator of wound repair. We investigated the effects of GHK-Cu in vivo, using...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The tri-peptide GHK-Cu complex ameliorates lipopolysaccharide-induced acute lung injury in mice | Oncotarget

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PubMed

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and glycosaminoglycan synthesis, as well as supports...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Spoiler: Final Note

Thank you for reading, I apologize if the formatting is not ideal as this is my first thread.

 

[Hunter❤️]

So currently, the copper peptide GHK-CU has gained alot of fame for it's supposed collagen benefits. But can this peptide actually live up to its hype?

Spoiler: Systemic GHK-CU benefits

So recently a lot of people have been throwing around the supposed "benefits" of Systemic GHK-CU dosed daily from 2-5mg.
(Anti-aging, Improved skin & hair, Skin & collagen improvement)
But when you look into the literature the dose and the benefits simply do not correlate.

Spoiler: Explanation

So you may be wondering why I say this - well, let me explain.
View attachment 4299178
Here for example, we see a study of GHK-Cu being used on mice (like nearly all other GHK-Cu tests), and if you look where I drew the red circle, the study explains that they dosed the mice with 10 µg/g. doesn't sound like much, but that is actually 10mg/kg

And every single GHK-CU study you find out there, every single one dosed the subjects at over 0.5mg/kg for it to be "significant" as for example shown in this study by The Journal Of Clinical Investigation
View attachment 4299209

Spoiler: Half-Life of GHK-CU

And unfortunately GHK-CU has one more major problem about it, that being the half life.
Now we don't actually know a lot about GHK-CU's half-life but it's estimated to be somewhere from 5 minutes to an hour.

Spoiler: My Conclusion On Systemic Usage of GHK-CU

So with that being said, when we actually look at the data instead of the marketing, it becomes clear that systemic GHK-Cu simply doesn’t live up to the hype. But hypothetically let's say we use the copious dose that they used on mice in the studies. The average weight of a man in USA is 199 Pounds / 90 KG.
So as I said earlier the dose at which GHK-CU became significantly effective was 0.5mg / kg.
And if we apply that to the average weight of an American man, You would have to dose 45mg GHK-CU everyday


Just to put that into perspective, it would be more expensive to effectively dose GHK-CU monthly than HGH

Spoiler: Sources

In vivo stimulation of connective tissue accumulation by the tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ in rat experimental wounds - PubMed

The tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ (GHK-Cu) was first described as a growth factor for differentiated cells. Recent in vitro data showed that it possesses several properties of a potential activator of wound repair. We investigated the effects of GHK-Cu in vivo, using...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The tri-peptide GHK-Cu complex ameliorates lipopolysaccharide-induced acute lung injury in mice | Oncotarget

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PubMed

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and glycosaminoglycan synthesis, as well as supports...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Spoiler: Final Note

Thank you for reading, I apologize if the formatting is not ideal as this is my first thread.

huh? why is systematic worse wouldnt topical be also DNR

 

[GoblinMaxxer]

Good thread

 

[skigmamigma]

huh? why is systematic worse wouldnt topical be also DNR

Topical doesn't have the same form of "Half Life" as the systemic does, because it's applied topically so its localized in your skin and it isn't systemically cleared before it reaches your face in the first place.
Not to mention the cringe dose you need for systemic GHK-CU to be effective, and that's not taking the half-life into account

 

[bddcoper]

idc its so fucking cheap and im too lazy to apply topically

 

[skigmamigma]

idc its so fucking cheap and im too lazy to apply topically

It's not actually giving you any benefits. It's literally cleared from ur system before it gets the chance to do anything positive for ur facial collagen

 

[bddcoper]

It's not actually giving you any benefits. It's literally cleared from ur system before it gets the chance to do anything positive for ur facial collagen

takes months to see benefits, but ive seen solid benefits for skin despite a pretty dogshit start.

btw im already injecting other stuff too so im like might as well just add it in anyway

 

[skigmamigma]

takes months to see benefits, but ive seen solid benefits for skin despite a pretty dogshit start.

btw im already injecting other stuff too so im like might as well just add it in anyway

happy for you but it's not the GHK-CU that's helping your skin out

 

[bddcoper]

happy for you but it's not the GHK-CU that's helping your skin out

hard to say it might be or it might not be. all i can say is the only changes ive made in terms of my skincare before i noticed changes was increasing my cjc no dac + ipa dose and my ghk cu dose by 50% each. so its one or the other im pretty sure i can give more details on my cycle if interested

 

[skigmamigma]

hard to say it might be or it might not be. all i can say is the only changes ive made in terms of my skincare before i noticed changes was increasing my cjc no dac + ipa dose and my ghk cu dose by 50% each. so its one or the other im pretty sure i can give more details on my cycle if interested

Well there's your answer bro, growth hormone promotes collagen synthesis

 

[Zefus]

is topical good then

 

[skigmamigma]

is topical good then

Yes, topical GHK-CU is very great for you because it has the so called benefits of systemic GHK-CU but it actually works.

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PMC

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

^study shows Topical GHK-CU helped with fine lines and wrinkles

 

[Zefus]

Yes, topical GHK-CU is very great for you because it has the so called benefits of systemic GHK-CU but it actually works.

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PMC

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

^study shows Topical GHK-CU helped with fine lines and wrinkles

so is it useless if im 18 and have no signs of aging, or can it still help me

 

[skigmamigma]

so is it useless if im 18 and have no signs of aging, or can it still help me

It's still useful it will promote collagen

 

[Zefus]

It's still useful it will promote collagen

aren't there studies showing it can help with scarring as well? or should i just try and get a laser resurfacing for that

 

[coolman985]

Doesn’t injecting into face mog all of these?

 

[skigmamigma]

aren't there studies showing it can help with scarring as well? or should i just try and get a laser resurfacing for that

There's only so much it can do for scarring and especially depending on the severity

 

[Bolo]

So currently, the copper peptide GHK-CU has gained alot of fame for it's supposed collagen benefits. But can this peptide actually live up to its hype?

Spoiler: Systemic GHK-CU benefits

So recently a lot of people have been throwing around the supposed "benefits" of Systemic GHK-CU dosed daily from 2-5mg.
(Anti-aging, Improved skin & hair, Skin & collagen improvement)
But when you look into the literature the dose and the benefits simply do not correlate.

Spoiler: Explanation

So you may be wondering why I say this - well, let me explain.
View attachment 4299178
Here for example, we see a study of GHK-Cu being used on mice (like nearly all other GHK-Cu tests), and if you look where I drew the red circle, the study explains that they dosed the mice with 10 µg/g. doesn't sound like much, but that is actually 10mg/kg

And every single GHK-CU study you find out there, every single one dosed the subjects at over 0.5mg/kg for it to be "significant" as for example shown in this study by The Journal Of Clinical Investigation
View attachment 4299209

Spoiler: Half-Life of GHK-CU

And unfortunately GHK-CU has one more major problem about it, that being the half life.
Now we don't actually know a lot about GHK-CU's half-life but it's estimated to be somewhere from 5 minutes to an hour.

Spoiler: My Conclusion On Systemic Usage of GHK-CU

So with that being said, when we actually look at the data instead of the marketing, it becomes clear that systemic GHK-Cu simply doesn’t live up to the hype. But hypothetically let's say we use the copious dose that they used on mice in the studies. The average weight of a man in USA is 199 Pounds / 90 KG.
So as I said earlier the dose at which GHK-CU became significantly effective was 0.5mg / kg.
And if we apply that to the average weight of an American man, You would have to dose 45mg GHK-CU everyday


Just to put that into perspective, it would be more expensive to effectively dose GHK-CU monthly than HGH

Spoiler: Sources

In vivo stimulation of connective tissue accumulation by the tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ in rat experimental wounds - PubMed

The tripeptide-copper complex glycyl-L-histidyl-L-lysine-Cu2+ (GHK-Cu) was first described as a growth factor for differentiated cells. Recent in vitro data showed that it possesses several properties of a potential activator of wound repair. We investigated the effects of GHK-Cu in vivo, using...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The tri-peptide GHK-Cu complex ameliorates lipopolysaccharide-induced acute lung injury in mice | Oncotarget

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PubMed

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and glycosaminoglycan synthesis, as well as supports...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Spoiler: Final Note

Thank you for reading, I apologize if the formatting is not ideal as this is my first thread.

Well it works, just look at results. Also DNR

 

[skigmamigma]

Well it works, just look at results. Also DNR

You could go ahead and show me the so called results

 

[skigmamigma]

Doesn’t injecting into face mog all of these?

Injecting into the face mogs just normally pinning SubQ, because it also has a localized effect.
But microneedling + GHK-CU topical is better

 

[coolman985]

Injecting into the face mogs just normally pinning SubQ, because it also has a localized effect.
But microneedling + GHK-CU topical is better

What about pinning into face after microneedling

 

[skigmamigma]

What about pinning into face after microneedling

You still come across the problem that any type of injected GHK-Cu has a short half life while topical binds to your skin and lasts for a long time

 

[Whirr22222]

Yes, topical GHK-CU is very great for you because it has the so called benefits of systemic GHK-CU but it actually works.

Regenerative and Protective Actions of the GHK-Cu Peptide in the Light of the New Gene Data - PMC

The human peptide GHK (glycyl-l-histidyl-l-lysine) has multiple biological actions, all of which, according to our current knowledge, appear to be health positive. It stimulates blood vessel and nerve outgrowth, increases collagen, elastin, and ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

^study shows Topical GHK-CU helped with fine lines and wrinkles

I cant find in there how it says they applied it topically?

 

[GoblinMaxxer]

What about pinning into face after microneedling

 

[Whirr22222]

Well it works, just look at results. Also DNR

U are genuinely a bot where are these so called results?

 

[skigmamigma]

I cant find in there how it says they applied it topically?

 

[Whirr22222]

View attachment 4299410

Sorry, I mean like what vehicle did they use and what dose

 

[skigmamigma]

Sorry, I mean like what vehicle did they use and what dose

It does not state the exact dose for the topical, and doesn't say anything about microneedling. But it still says that topical improved collagen and fine lines. These effects will be even more dramatical if u microneedle

 

[Whirr22222]

It does not state the exact dose for the topical, and doesn't say anything about microneedling. But it still says that topical improved collagen and fine lines. These effects will be even more dramatical if u microneedle

When I asked GPT about the topical application study thats in german it says this, seems pretty advanced:

 

[skigmamigma]

When I asked GPT about the topical application study thats in german it says this, seems pretty advanced:

View attachment 4299432

The study i showed? Because that study doesn't show what the concentration was

 

[Whirr22222]

The study i showed? Because that study doesn't show what the concentration was

No, the topical application study is referenced in that study. Its reference 18.

 

[skigmamigma]

No, the topical application study is referenced in that study. Its reference 18.

Can you show me a picture of the exact text in the reference study saying it ? also rep please ts is making my post to rep ratio even worse

 

[Whirr22222]

Can you show me a picture of the exact text in the reference study saying it ? also rep please ts is making my post to rep ratio even worse

Its all in german, I just asked chat gpt to tell me details about it. The name was: Topische Applikation eines Kupfertripeptidkomplexes: Pilotstudie bei gealterter Haut

I have now realised chatgpt just didnt tell me it couldnt access it. Jfl. But it did read all the places it was referenced and collected these details:

My fault for trusting AI that is just dishonest jfl

 

[Grievous]

Sounds like shit cope to not pin

 

[skigmamigma]

View attachment 4299471
Sounds like shit cope to not pin

Yeah bro it must be because i can't bring myself to bite the bullet and inject an extremely small 30g you literally cant feel. Surely it's not just because its useless

 

[Grievous]

Yeah bro it must be because i can't bring myself to bite the bullet and inject an extremely small 30g you literally cant feel. Surely it's not just because its useless

ok bro u keep going with ur topical ghkcu and we will wait to see results

 

[skigmamigma]

ok bro u keep going with ur topical ghkcu and we will wait to see results

 

[skigmamigma]

Bump

 

[nr1fraudmaxxer]

But hypothetically let's say we use the copious dose that they used on mice in the studies. The average weight of a man in USA is 199 Pounds / 90 KG.
So as I said earlier the dose at which GHK-CU became significantly effective was 0.5mg / kg.
And if we apply that to the average weight of an American man, You would have to dose 45mg GHK-CU everyday

So thats not how converting to human equivelant dosage works. This fails to include the allometric exponent of the conversion of rodent dosage to the human equivelant dosage. The FDA actually wrote a great article about how to do this.
FDA link
If you actually account for human versus fat morphology correctly you will conclude that a dose of 2-5 mg per day is an effective dose.

You say that topical is better is just not true as ghkcu serums have these permeation enchancers, additives, stabilizers to make them more efficacious when using on your skin. But that doesnt stop the fact that when its exposed to the enviroment it starts oxidizing very quickly.

Rigorous RCTS on topical ghkcu dont really exist especially when we’re relying on these properietary formulas.

 

[skigmamigma]

So thats not how converting to human equivelant dosage works. This fails to include the allometric exponent of the conversion of rodent dosage to the human equivelant dosage. The FDA actually wrote a great article about how to do this.
FDA link
If you actually account for human versus fat morphology correctly you will conclude that a dose of 2-5 mg per day is an effective dose.

You say that topical is betyrr is just not true as ghkcu serums have these permeation enchancers, additives, stabilizers to make them more efficacious when using on your skin. But that doesnt stop the fact that when its exposed to the enviroment it starts oxidizing very quickly.
View attachment 4299614
Rigorous RCTS on topical ghkcu dont really exist especially when we’re relying on these properietary formulas.

The FDA’s own Km table (rats = 6, humans = 37) gives:

10 mg/kg (rat) × (6 ÷ 37) = 1.6 mg/kg human equivalent

 

[skigmamigma]

So thats not how converting to human equivelant dosage works. This fails to include the allometric exponent of the conversion of rodent dosage to the human equivelant dosage. The FDA actually wrote a great article about how to do this.
FDA link
If you actually account for human versus fat morphology correctly you will conclude that a dose of 2-5 mg per day is an effective dose.

You say that topical is better is just not true as ghkcu serums have these permeation enchancers, additives, stabilizers to make them more efficacious when using on your skin. But that doesnt stop the fact that when its exposed to the enviroment it starts oxidizing very quickly.
View attachment 4299614
Rigorous RCTS on topical ghkcu dont really exist especially when we’re relying on these properietary formulas.

And I don't claim that "topical PRODUCTS" are better, i claim that topical appliance is better. Get raw powder from china not the serums you see

 

[nr1fraudmaxxer]

The FDA’s own Km table (rats = 6, humans = 37) gives:

No.
HED (mg/kg) = Animal dose (mg/kg) × (Km_animal / Km_human)
Mouse Km = 3, Human Km = 37
0.5 × (3 / 37) = 0.0405 mg/kg
0.0405 × 90 kg = ≈3.6 mg/day

Even if you use the 0.75 allometric exponent method:
Dose₂ = 0.0125 × (90 / 0.025)^0.75 = ≈5.8 mg

 

[Greyascension]

View attachment 4299471
Sounds like shit cope to not pin

Real

 

[skigmamigma]

No.
HED (mg/kg) = Animal dose (mg/kg) × (Km_animal / Km_human)
Mouse Km = 3, Human Km = 37
0.5 × (3 / 37) = 0.0405 mg/kg
0.0405 × 90 kg = ≈3.6 mg/day

Even if you use the 0.75 allometric exponent method:
Dose₂ = 0.0125 × (90 / 0.025)^0.75 = ≈5.8 mg

View attachment 4299680

You're applying HED to local wound site dosing

ghk cu for example will not have any effect on your face simply because of its half life

 

[nr1fraudmaxxer]

HED is not about topical or systemic use. It translates effective biological doses between species. Whether you inject or apply locally, you still need to scale the starting dose correctly.

 

[skigmamigma]

HED is not about topical or systemic use. It translates effective biological doses between species. Whether you inject or apply locally, you still need to scale the starting dose correctly.

If you were right about HED not being topical or systemic use topical and system ghk-cu would have the same potency

 

[Eno]

Fucking nigger stole my thread

there is zero evidence stating systemic ghk-cu injections increase collagen

every study conducted on ghk-cu has either been a topical application or injected locally into wounds at very high doses of around 2-20 mg/kg, so about 160 mg for the average male, ghk-cu has a half life of 6-24 hours in local tissue, but is rapidly degraded in plasma leaving it with a half life...

looksmax.org

This is why I stopped making high iq threads

Kill yourself OP

 

[skigmamigma]

Fucking nigger stole my thread

there is zero evidence stating systemic ghk-cu injections increase collagen

every study conducted on ghk-cu has either been a topical application or injected locally into wounds at very high doses of around 2-20 mg/kg, so about 160 mg for the average male, ghk-cu has a half life of 6-24 hours in local tissue, but is rapidly degraded in plasma leaving it with a half life...

looksmax.org

This is why I stopped making high iq threads

Kill yourself OP

Literally not the same doses at all retard

 

[nr1fraudmaxxer]

If you were right about HED not being topical or systemic use topical and system ghk-cu would have the same potency

HED is not used to compare topical and systemic potency. It translates effective biological doses between species.
Bioavailability is separate. It depends on delivery route, formulation, and stability.
Systemic and topical forms differ in potency and half-life, but interspecies scaling still matters.

 

[Eno]

Literally not the same doses at all retard

Dumb nigger you used the exact same study, fuck you kill yourself