Will be going on a long break

[Babushkacatlady]

I will be going on a long-term break from this forum after April 21st 2021. Just about everything you need I have already posted in comments or is already elsewhere on here from others.
If you want to expand your knowledge base I recommend reading or looking into:

Essentials of Facial Growth by Enlow and Hans

The Cause and Cure of Malocclusion by John Mew (You will actually have to buy this book, no full pdf available)

The work and research of Arne Bjork and Vibeke Skieller on facial growth

This channel, which talks about treatment plans for some children from a clinical POV

This entire slideshow series on early intervention and what treatment consists of


My posts and comments at The Great Work forum, namely:

Here is why MSE+FM doesn't and won't produce much forward movement in adults​

What Goes Wrong in Growth and How Can an Adult Fix it​

The Principles Behind Biobloc and AGGA Versus What They Actually Do.​

If you still need to contact me for following up with something we have discussed privately, or absolutely must contact me for any other reason, my email is tinman1453@gmail.com. Before you think of doxxing me, the name in this email is not my real name. When sending an email be sure to include in the subject your username here and the topic we were discussing. This is a high clutter email so it may take a while to get back to you.

Finally, I want to say something:

Use this site to understand things you need to improve upon and how to do it and don't dwell on things that either can't be changed or take too much to change. Once you understand the methods to achieve this change, I personally recommend taking a break to improve yourself because this stuff can eat away at you quite a bit.

 

[AscendingHero]

I will be going on a long-term break from this forum after April 21st 2021. Just about everything you need I have already posted in comments or is already elsewhere on here from others.
If you want to expand your knowledge base I recommend reading or looking into:

Essentials of Facial Growth by Enlow and Hans

The Cause and Cure of Malocclusion by John Mew (You will actually have to buy this book, no full pdf available)

The work and research of Arne Bjork and Vibeke Skieller on facial growth

This channel, which talks about treatment plans for some children from a clinical POV

This entire slideshow series on early intervention and what treatment consists of


My posts and comments at The Great Work forum, namely:

Here is why MSE+FM doesn't and won't produce much forward movement in adults​

What Goes Wrong in Growth and How Can an Adult Fix it​

The Principles Behind Biobloc and AGGA Versus What They Actually Do.​

If you still need to contact me for following up with something we have discussed privately, or absolutely must contact me for any other reason, my email is theunknownvoid639@gmail.com. Before you think of doxxing me, the name in this email is not my real name. When sending an email be sure to include in the subject your username here and the topic we were discussing. This is a high clutter email so it may take a while to get back to you.

Finally, I want to say something:

Use this site to understand things you need to improve upon and how to do it and don't dwell on things that either can't be changed or take too much to change. Once you understand the methods to achieve this change, I personally recommend taking a break to improve yourself because this stuff can eat away at you quite a bit.

Bro I fucking KNEW IT YOU WERE @ThaGANGSTA ON TGW

 

[AscendingHero]

I will be going on a long-term break from this forum after April 21st 2021. Just about everything you need I have already posted in comments or is already elsewhere on here from others.
If you want to expand your knowledge base I recommend reading or looking into:

Essentials of Facial Growth by Enlow and Hans

The Cause and Cure of Malocclusion by John Mew (You will actually have to buy this book, no full pdf available)

The work and research of Arne Bjork and Vibeke Skieller on facial growth

This channel, which talks about treatment plans for some children from a clinical POV

This entire slideshow series on early intervention and what treatment consists of


My posts and comments at The Great Work forum, namely:

Here is why MSE+FM doesn't and won't produce much forward movement in adults​

What Goes Wrong in Growth and How Can an Adult Fix it​

The Principles Behind Biobloc and AGGA Versus What They Actually Do.​

If you still need to contact me for following up with something we have discussed privately, or absolutely must contact me for any other reason, my email is theunknownvoid639@gmail.com. Before you think of doxxing me, the name in this email is not my real name. When sending an email be sure to include in the subject your username here and the topic we were discussing. This is a high clutter email so it may take a while to get back to you.

Finally, I want to say something:

Use this site to understand things you need to improve upon and how to do it and don't dwell on things that either can't be changed or take too much to change. Once you understand the methods to achieve this change, I personally recommend taking a break to improve yourself because this stuff can eat away at you quite a bit.

wassup bro we actually had a long convo in dms on tgw forum, why are you leaving the forum btw

 

[AscendingHero]

I will be going on a long-term break from this forum after April 21st 2021. Just about everything you need I have already posted in comments or is already elsewhere on here from others.
If you want to expand your knowledge base I recommend reading or looking into:

Essentials of Facial Growth by Enlow and Hans

The Cause and Cure of Malocclusion by John Mew (You will actually have to buy this book, no full pdf available)

The work and research of Arne Bjork and Vibeke Skieller on facial growth

This channel, which talks about treatment plans for some children from a clinical POV

This entire slideshow series on early intervention and what treatment consists of


My posts and comments at The Great Work forum, namely:

Here is why MSE+FM doesn't and won't produce much forward movement in adults​

What Goes Wrong in Growth and How Can an Adult Fix it​

The Principles Behind Biobloc and AGGA Versus What They Actually Do.​

If you still need to contact me for following up with something we have discussed privately, or absolutely must contact me for any other reason, my email is theunknownvoid639@gmail.com. Before you think of doxxing me, the name in this email is not my real name. When sending an email be sure to include in the subject your username here and the topic we were discussing. This is a high clutter email so it may take a while to get back to you.

Finally, I want to say something:

Use this site to understand things you need to improve upon and how to do it and don't dwell on things that either can't be changed or take too much to change. Once you understand the methods to achieve this change, I personally recommend taking a break to improve yourself because this stuff can eat away at you quite a bit.

Btw I sent u a PM weeks ago on the TGW forum pls check it out bro

 

[lejend]

See you tomorrow

 

[spark]

I will be going on a long-term break from this forum after April 21st 2021. Just about everything you need I have already posted in comments or is already elsewhere on here from others.
If you want to expand your knowledge base I recommend reading or looking into:

Essentials of Facial Growth by Enlow and Hans

The Cause and Cure of Malocclusion by John Mew (You will actually have to buy this book, no full pdf available)

The work and research of Arne Bjork and Vibeke Skieller on facial growth

This channel, which talks about treatment plans for some children from a clinical POV

This entire slideshow series on early intervention and what treatment consists of


My posts and comments at The Great Work forum, namely:

Here is why MSE+FM doesn't and won't produce much forward movement in adults​

What Goes Wrong in Growth and How Can an Adult Fix it​

The Principles Behind Biobloc and AGGA Versus What They Actually Do.​

If you still need to contact me for following up with something we have discussed privately, or absolutely must contact me for any other reason, my email is tinman1453@gmail.com. Before you think of doxxing me, the name in this email is not my real name. When sending an email be sure to include in the subject your username here and the topic we were discussing. This is a high clutter email so it may take a while to get back to you.

Finally, I want to say something:

Use this site to understand things you need to improve upon and how to do it and don't dwell on things that either can't be changed or take too much to change. Once you understand the methods to achieve this change, I personally recommend taking a break to improve yourself because this stuff can eat away at you quite a bit.

what do you think of bollards instead of a FM?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

what do you think of bollards instead of a FM?

My knowledge on this is very limited but Bollards seem better just due to the possibility of longer-term force from compliance of wearing the elastics, along with rigid anchorage beyond the palate and alveolar bone. The only problem I can see with it is it could (maybe) have a negative effect on someone non-growing with excessive vertical development due to their vector, but there's no real evidence for that.

 

[AscendingHero]

@Babushkacatlady Is BAMP better than FM? Thoughts on BAMP?

 

[AscendingHero]

Also @retard says MSE isn't bone borne and in fact it's tooth borne. I hope he doesn't mind me quoting some things from our dm but...

i made another post somewhere, tldr of it was mse has tons of misinformation put forth by orthodontists and won moon regarding it, it doesnt do shit for the sutures, + the facepulling isnt even bone anchored, its tooth borne

it may be able to increase increase, but that is just theoretical there is no evidence atm

mse wire is too flimsy to support the force, it goes directly into the molars or else the molar bands would just bend, all facepulling besides BAMP isn't bone anchored, meaning the force uses the teeth as a medium

@Babushkacatlady Thoughts?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

Also @retard says MSE isn't bone borne and in fact it's tooth borne. I hope he doesn't mind me quoting some things from our dm but...



@Babushkacatlady Thoughts?

Yes this is the big flaw with MSE+FM you are still pulling through the teeth because of the molar bands, so a there is a good amount force lost in this alone. Teeth anchored headgear can work in children, but anyone above 9-12 needs more rigid fixation to the skeletal basal maxilla. One disadvantage is the invasiveness of putting anchorage devices there.

 

[AscendingHero]

Yes this is the big flaw with MSE+FM you are still pulling through the teeth because of the molar bands, so a there is a good amount force lost in this alone. Teeth anchored headgear can work in children, but anyone above 9-12 needs more rigid fixation to the skeletal basal maxilla. One disadvantage is the invasiveness of putting anchorage devices there.

so is MSE cope?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

so is MSE cope?

Nah you still need expansion to disarticulate the sutures that hold the maxilla to the skull.

 

[AscendingHero]

but anyone above 9-12 needs more rigid fixation to the skeletal basal maxilla.

How does one achieve that?^

Also for zygomatic arch changes do you recommend just mewing long term or MSE? @Babushkacatlady

 

[Babushkacatlady]

How does one achieve that?^

Also for zygomatic arch changes do you recommend just mewing long term or MSE? @Babushkacatlady

Bollard plates are an option
MSE can sometimes give you big zygomatic arch changes.

 

[AscendingHero]

Bollard plates are an option

What's that?

MSE can sometimes give you big zygomatic arch changes.

So you'll recommend it for zygomatic arch changes over long term mewing is what im getting at?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

What's that?

So you'll recommend it for zygomatic arch changes over long term mewing is what im getting at?

Yes I'd recommend MSE for zygomatic arch changes. Mewing doesn't seem to change them that much, only muscle action in the area.

 

[AscendingHero]

Is there any way to fix wide nostrils and a boulbous tip or would one need surgery? @Babushkacatlady

 

[Babushkacatlady]

Is there any way to fix wide nostrils and a boulbous tip or would one need surgery? @Babushkacatlady

Surgery

 

[AscendingHero]

@Babushkacatlady What causes hunter eyes?

 

[datboijj]

mirin having 2 different conversations over 2 threads with the same two people
@AscendingHero @Babushkacatlady

 

[AscendingHero]

mirin having 2 different conversations over 2 threads with the same two people
@AscendingHero @Babushkacatlady

JFL

 

[AscendingHero]

Yes I'd recommend MSE for zygomatic arch changes. Mewing doesn't seem to change them that much, only muscle action in the area.

would MSE+Chewing (hypertrophy of the temporalis) and Testosterone maxxing give chad zygos?

 

[AscendingHero]

@Babushkacatlady What causes forward grown malars and deep set eyes (eyes that reside far into the skull protected by bone)?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

would MSE+Chewing (hypertrophy of the temporalis) and Testosterone maxxing give chad zygos?

Possibly

@Babushkacatlady What causes forward grown malars and deep set eyes (eyes that reside far into the skull protected by bone)?

Maxilla and supraorbital and healthy thyroid

 

[AscendingHero]

Maxilla and supraorbital and healthy thyroid

What causes suprorbital growth and prominence?

What causes it to be low and flat? Can neck posture influence the supraorbital?

Maxilla and supraorbital and healthy thyroid

Thyroid.......... Interesting, what does the thyroid affect and how does it affect it?

 

[Babushkacatlady]

What causes suprorbital growth and prominence?

Lung capacity and testosterone during puberty

What causes it to be low and flat? Can neck posture influence the supraorbital?

Probably not

Thyroid.......... Interesting, what does the thyroid affect and how does it affect it?

It affects your health, get enough iodine not too much or little.

 

[AscendingHero]

Lung capacity and testosterone during puberty

Probably not

It affects your health, get enough iodine not too much or little.

how does thyroid affect the orbitals and influence craniofacial development/facial aesthetics?