illusion
Forefront of the Anti-Rotter Movement
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The idea for this thread was taken from @SlayerJonas, who has made a lot of high quality posts regarding steroids (although I do personally disagree with his personal stance regarding steroids as he is generally against them and does fearmonger a little.)
You can read his thread here: https://looksmax.org/threads/the-truth-about-steroids-and-peptides-affecting-bones-height.1550764/
While Jonas' thread is very high quality, a lot of framecels, gymcels, and greycels are going to read and say "obviously it doesn't affect facial bones, I already knew this" (they didn't, it's their hindsight bias.) and DNR the entire thread and order 600mg tren in order to grow their clavicles as Jonas' thread does not acknowledge anything past height and facial growth.
Before going in, I'd like to preface that this is not an anti AAS thread, I am fully with taking steroids and I believe they are one of the best ways to give yourself a massive halo granted you know what you are doing (which if you are reading this thread to learn if steroids affect clavicle growth, you clearly do not.)
With no further ado, let's get into this.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The general idea of steroids growing clavicles comes from 2 main ideas:
First is the ginormous amount of steroid results that show huge amounts of gains in the shoulders, which to literally any person, looks like the dude grew 4 inches in their clavicles and clearly got wider as the before is usually a skinny photo of them where they do not have any significant show for having good genetics.
Second is a commonly known fact that the clavicles continue growing until the age of 25, and are the last bone to fully fuse in the body. I will now thoroughly explain why these are either wrong or have significant context behind them that obliterates any chance of any steroid affecting clavicle growth.
#1. The illusion of clavicle gains from steroidal impact on the shoulders
The photo above is Androgenic's before and after, a perfect example of the illusion of clavicle growth from steroids. From viewing it, is is very obvious his frame became massive after steroid use. In reality, his clavicles did not widen.
The reason for androgenic's insane transformation (and all frame transformations while on steroids) is due to biology. The shoulder has the highest density of androgen receptors in the entire body. What this means is that essentially, your shoulders are "flammable" and incredibly sensitive to the explosive mass steroids give, this makes the muscles grow so big that they create a larger bideltoid, which is the deltoid to deltoid measurement.
This is a bideltoid measurement. The bideltoid is subject to change as it measures the deltoid to deltoid, the deltoid is a muscle, and therefore is susceptive to getting larger, therefore increasing the bideltoid width, which is the overall width of your frame.
However, this is not the only way of measuring frame. The actual frame measurement (the one that measures bone to bone) is the biacromial width.
Above is the biacromial width, this does not change as it is bones, not a muscle and therefore having no receptors to receive any orders to grow from anything.
#2. The uninformed context of clavicles growing to age 25
While yes, the clavicles do technically remain open to the age of 21 - 25 years old in men, there is one massive piece to the puzzle that is left out. That effects 100% of all users on this forum. 80% of your clavicle growth is finished by the age of 12. This is majorly scientifically backed - source (unlike bones being affected by steroids.) What this means is that all the growth you experience between 12 - 25 years old is a CRAWL. You barely gain millimeters, between the ages of 12 and 25, your bideltoid growth goes like this:
12 - 15: 5mm per year
16 - 19: 3mm per year
20 - 25: 2mm per year
This means that combined, between the ages of 12 and 25, you will gain an average of 1.3 inches in your clavicle
The average age of a user here is around 16 - 20 years old, this means that most of you barely have a 1/3rd of an inch remaining.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Further destroying any cope for bone growth
I know 90% of you that are reading this to actually learn information aren't going to read Jonas' thread although it is very good because you would prefer to not know and remain blissfully ignorant and coping. However I'll also include one of his best points here.
There is zero scientific study or any evidence that any steroid grows or affects any bone in any meaningful way whatsoever.
The only steroid that really affects the face and causes the illusion of bone growth is Trenbolone, which is known for hollowing out the face, you just can't tell the difference from a person's cheeks being hollowed out and their bones growing, and most people that are trying to sell you a course for this type of stuff are all scumbags anyways.
If you actually want to get hollow cheeks, read my aqualyx thread here: https://looksmax.org/threads/aqualy...ith-pictures-and-video.1899767/#post-26544969
Aqualyx is much better for cheek hollowing and shows significant results.
Just in case you were still coping:
You will not gain a single millimeter of bone from any steroid if you were to do all of them at once at 10g for 100 years. This is not a cope thread on my part, I have 4 years of pubertal growth left as my bone age is 14 and I am more superficial and care more about looks than 99% of the users on this forum, if it worked, I'd be doing it.
Thank you for reading if you did.
Tagging some knowledgeablecels: @Menas @Chad (sorry if you don't like being tagged, let me know if there is anything I have missed.)
You can read his thread here: https://looksmax.org/threads/the-truth-about-steroids-and-peptides-affecting-bones-height.1550764/
While Jonas' thread is very high quality, a lot of framecels, gymcels, and greycels are going to read and say "obviously it doesn't affect facial bones, I already knew this" (they didn't, it's their hindsight bias.) and DNR the entire thread and order 600mg tren in order to grow their clavicles as Jonas' thread does not acknowledge anything past height and facial growth.
Before going in, I'd like to preface that this is not an anti AAS thread, I am fully with taking steroids and I believe they are one of the best ways to give yourself a massive halo granted you know what you are doing (which if you are reading this thread to learn if steroids affect clavicle growth, you clearly do not.)
With no further ado, let's get into this.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The general idea of steroids growing clavicles comes from 2 main ideas:
First is the ginormous amount of steroid results that show huge amounts of gains in the shoulders, which to literally any person, looks like the dude grew 4 inches in their clavicles and clearly got wider as the before is usually a skinny photo of them where they do not have any significant show for having good genetics.
Second is a commonly known fact that the clavicles continue growing until the age of 25, and are the last bone to fully fuse in the body. I will now thoroughly explain why these are either wrong or have significant context behind them that obliterates any chance of any steroid affecting clavicle growth.
#1. The illusion of clavicle gains from steroidal impact on the shoulders
The photo above is Androgenic's before and after, a perfect example of the illusion of clavicle growth from steroids. From viewing it, is is very obvious his frame became massive after steroid use. In reality, his clavicles did not widen.
The reason for androgenic's insane transformation (and all frame transformations while on steroids) is due to biology. The shoulder has the highest density of androgen receptors in the entire body. What this means is that essentially, your shoulders are "flammable" and incredibly sensitive to the explosive mass steroids give, this makes the muscles grow so big that they create a larger bideltoid, which is the deltoid to deltoid measurement.
This is a bideltoid measurement. The bideltoid is subject to change as it measures the deltoid to deltoid, the deltoid is a muscle, and therefore is susceptive to getting larger, therefore increasing the bideltoid width, which is the overall width of your frame.
However, this is not the only way of measuring frame. The actual frame measurement (the one that measures bone to bone) is the biacromial width.
Above is the biacromial width, this does not change as it is bones, not a muscle and therefore having no receptors to receive any orders to grow from anything.
#2. The uninformed context of clavicles growing to age 25
While yes, the clavicles do technically remain open to the age of 21 - 25 years old in men, there is one massive piece to the puzzle that is left out. That effects 100% of all users on this forum. 80% of your clavicle growth is finished by the age of 12. This is majorly scientifically backed - source (unlike bones being affected by steroids.) What this means is that all the growth you experience between 12 - 25 years old is a CRAWL. You barely gain millimeters, between the ages of 12 and 25, your bideltoid growth goes like this:
12 - 15: 5mm per year
16 - 19: 3mm per year
20 - 25: 2mm per year
This means that combined, between the ages of 12 and 25, you will gain an average of 1.3 inches in your clavicle
The average age of a user here is around 16 - 20 years old, this means that most of you barely have a 1/3rd of an inch remaining.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Further destroying any cope for bone growth
I know 90% of you that are reading this to actually learn information aren't going to read Jonas' thread although it is very good because you would prefer to not know and remain blissfully ignorant and coping. However I'll also include one of his best points here.
There is zero scientific study or any evidence that any steroid grows or affects any bone in any meaningful way whatsoever.
The only steroid that really affects the face and causes the illusion of bone growth is Trenbolone, which is known for hollowing out the face, you just can't tell the difference from a person's cheeks being hollowed out and their bones growing, and most people that are trying to sell you a course for this type of stuff are all scumbags anyways.
If you actually want to get hollow cheeks, read my aqualyx thread here: https://looksmax.org/threads/aqualy...ith-pictures-and-video.1899767/#post-26544969
Aqualyx is much better for cheek hollowing and shows significant results.
Just in case you were still coping:
You will not gain a single millimeter of bone from any steroid if you were to do all of them at once at 10g for 100 years. This is not a cope thread on my part, I have 4 years of pubertal growth left as my bone age is 14 and I am more superficial and care more about looks than 99% of the users on this forum, if it worked, I'd be doing it.
Thank you for reading if you did.
Tagging some knowledgeablecels: @Menas @Chad (sorry if you don't like being tagged, let me know if there is anything I have missed.)
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