do not blast test during puberty if u CARE ABOUT UR HEIGHT

[darodiddler]

1. Intracrine Aromatization (Local Estrogen)​

When you take testosterone durig puberty your blood levels of testosterone will be highly supraphysiological Even if you take a high dose of an AI (like Arimidex or Letrozole , aromasin) to keep your e2 LOW youre aromtise enzym still exist directly inside your bone tissue and growth plates and theres no fucking ai or any other shit to counter that its going to fuse ur shit

when Test goes through tissues and converts to estrogen locally and theres nothing u can do to stop that and
Your blood work might show low estrogen (e2) but the local concentration inside your growth plates will still be happning and make ur plates prematruerly close.

theres also a study that shows kids that were used a tiny bit of test during puberty like 16mg a week 45% of them ended up with deformed spines

u gotta be retarded to do that
theres also other stuff like direct androgenic fusion but i dont have any energy to explain that but idk do wtv u want niggas

 

[dragomog]

dnr nothing ever happens on 500 rn

 

[darodiddler]

dnr nothing ever happens on 500 rn

elaborate niger

 

[iwishicouldbediff]

When should it be taken

 

[darodiddler]

When should it be taken

nothing tbh even if u use non aromtizing roids u would still need a test base or even without it its gona cause direct androgenic fusion u should just blast gh and ai during puberty


hgh is also useless tho if ur not ghd but most people ae ghd without knowing it

if u dont care abt ur height go and take it blast 500 test

 

[Orbital1]

1. Intracrine Aromatization (Local Estrogen)​

When you take testosterone durig puberty your blood levels of testosterone will be highly supraphysiological Even if you take a high dose of an AI (like Arimidex or Letrozole , aromasin) to keep your e2 LOW youre aromtise enzym still exist directly inside your bone tissue and growth plates and theres no fucking ai or any other shit to counter that its going to fuse ur shit

when Test goes through tissues and converts to estrogen locally and theres nothing u can do to stop that and
Your blood work might show low estrogen (e2) but the local concentration inside your growth plates will still be happning and make ur plates prematruerly close.

theres also a study that shows kids that were used a tiny bit of test during puberty like 16mg a week 45% of them ended up with deformed spines

u gotta be retarded to do that
theres also other stuff like direct androgenic fusion but i dont have any energy to explain that but idk do wtv u want niggas

What the fuck am i supposed to do then i dont want to be an ugly faggot all my fucking shit ass life

 

[darodiddler]

What the fuck am i supposed to do then i dont want to be an ugly faggot all my fucking shit ass life

how tall are u? u can still blast after ur shit is closed check ur plates

 

[Orbital1]

how tall are u? u can still blast after ur shit is closed check ur plates

6'5 at 16

 

[darodiddler]

6'5 at 16

NIGGER FUCK YOU BLAST ROIDS WTF what are u doing do not wait a single more second 6"5 is crazy

this is ur best chance do not ruin it blast test fuck ur height ur alreday taller than 90 percent of the population it doesnt matter

run 300 weekly for the first month then add it 400 and also use hcg if u want to keep ur fertility and not shrink ur balls

 

[6”3neartyronelite]

Does it change your face if you do it at 18

NIGGER FUCK YOU BLAST ROIDS WTF what are u doing do not wait a single more second 6"5 is crazy

this is ur best chance do not ruin it blast test fuck ur height ur alreday taller than 90 percent of the population it doesnt matter

run 300 weekly for the first month then add it 400 and also use hcg if u want to keep ur fertility and not shrink ur balls

 

[Orbital1]

Does it change your face if you do it at 18

I am 16

 

[Orbital1]

NIGGER FUCK YOU BLAST ROIDS WTF what are u doing do not wait a single more second 6"5 is crazy

this is ur best chance do not ruin it blast test fuck ur height ur alreday taller than 90 percent of the population it doesnt matter

run 300 weekly for the first month then add it 400 and also use hcg if u want to keep ur fertility and not shrink ur balls

I dont care about any more height i care about face mainly but also things like frame, dimorphism and bone density and thickness and all that. Especially facially i am boneless i simply lack bones so i want to fix that and frame and shit you know

 

[darodiddler]

Does it change your face if you do it at 18

not as much as now but it still will change ur face but it will still grow ur brow bridge and lower third like a bigger jaw

 

[Orbital1]

NIGGER FUCK YOU BLAST ROIDS WTF what are u doing do not wait a single more second 6"5 is crazy

this is ur best chance do not ruin it blast test fuck ur height ur alreday taller than 90 percent of the population it doesnt matter

run 300 weekly for the first month then add it 400 and also use hcg if u want to keep ur fertility and not shrink ur balls

Didn't you just say above that you should avoid test?

 

[darodiddler]

I dont care about any more height i care about face mainly but also things like frame, dimorphism and bone density and thickness and all that. Especially facially i am boneless i simply lack bones so i want to fix that and frame and shit you know

yes blast test right now dont waste any more time

 

[6”3neartyronelite]

not as much as now but it still will change ur face but it will still grow ur brow bridge and lower third like a bigger jaw

Do I still take AI’s? Since i don’t really care for height

 

[darodiddler]

Didn't you just say above that you should avoid test?

you should advoid test if u care about ur height brah its gona close ur growth plates but ur 6"5 nigga blast

 

[darodiddler]

Do I still take AI’s? Since i don’t really care for height

if you dont care about ur height yeah take it do test and ai and hcg for fertlity

run 300 -500 weekly

 

[Orbital1]

you should advoid test if u care about ur height brah its gona close ur growth plates but ur 6"5 nigga blast

So if i am looking for things outside height then i should just blast all you said here does not matter for me?

 

[darodiddler]

So if i am looking for things outside height then i should just blast all you said here does not matter for me?

yes u should blast since u dont care abt ur height do it

 

[Orbital1]

yes u should blast since u dont care abt ur height do it

Yeah but it would be great if i grew to 6'7 like my dad or taller than that though

 

[D69mo]

dnr nothing ever happens on 500 rn

primal up and you wouldnt need to pinch test in ur butt

 

[timfa]

that’s exactly why we go from a height stack to closed plates to roids

 

[darodiddler]

Yeah but it would be great if i grew to 6'7 like my dad or taller than that though

shut the fuck up 2 inches of height dont matter to the benifts of the frame / dick size/ voice/ bonemass

would u want that 2 inches that u dont even know ur getting or those other beniefts if i was u i wouldve blasted right away but do ur research

 

[Orbital1]

shut the fuck up 2 inches of height dont matter to the benifts of the frame / dick size/ voice/ bonemass

would u want that 2 inches that u dont even know ur getting or those other beniefts if i was u i wouldve blasted right away but do ur research

Linear height growth usally mostly stops at 16 right?

 

[darodiddler]

n

Yeah but it would be great if i grew to 6'7 like my dad or taller than that though

nigga rep my shit i fucked my post to rep ratio even more like my shits

 

[Orbital1]

n

nigga rep my shit i fucked my post to rep ratio even more like my shits

Yeah will do alright

 

[darodiddler]

Linear height growth usally mostly stops at 16 right?

yeah it is for most people just take test brah ur 6"5

 

[darodiddler]

bump for the greys who bellive anything

 

[darodiddler]

@ZyzzReincarnate @ICL

 

[ICL]

Your blood work might show low estrogen (e2) but the local concentration inside your growth plates will still be happning and make ur plates prematruerly close.

Arent there local inhibitors to add on top of this?

Tamoxefin/Raloxefine are very good at this as well + aromatase inhibitors are systemic they still affect growth plates

theres also a study that shows kids that were used a tiny bit of test during puberty like 16mg a week 45% of them ended up with deformed spines

That has to be an outlier though

16mg a week is like DECREASING testosterone, not increasing, that should make them grow more, less testosterone less estrogen.

theres also other stuff like direct androgenic fusion but i dont have any energy to explain that but idk do wtv u want niggas

Miniscule tho + Most of the effect from that is because of IGF1

Take for instance aromatase deficient people. They have no aromatase, so their aromatase is inhibited to the max, but they literally grow forever without e2 administration

 

[bluebandz]

like saying do not eat peanuts if your allergic to peanuts

 

[darodiddler]

Arent there local inhibitors to add on top of this?

Tamoxefin/Raloxefine are very good at this as well + aromatase inhibitors are systemic they still affect growth plates

nope theres nothing else to add
and yes even u used them true they would stop the aromtization in the growth plates like sarm or other stuff u mentioned but if use blasting test that much ur plates would still fuse from direct androgenic fusion u are correct about the cartilage aromtization part they would still close from the androgenic fusion tho

16mg a week is like DECREASING testosterone, not increasing, that should make them grow more, less testosterone less estrogen.

yes it would but the study on those kids didnt happen because of test itself my bad they got them because the doctors paired the treatment with a heavy aromtase inhibator to purposfully crush thier strogen and extend thier growth to freeze thier bone age and thier e was so low for too long thats why the got deformed from the spine not the test itself it was an outliner i was sleepy

Miniscule tho + Most of the effect from that is because of IGF1

no dude ur moving goalposts igf1 drives the growth of chondrocytes fast it makes u taller unlike the test that will cause ur plates to fuse they dont fuse it

fusion happens when the chondroces undergo senscense and ossify while the estrogen is the main dick of that heavy androgens will abslotuetly and totaly CAUSE direct plate fusion on thier own

wen u blast like almost 200 weekly as little as tat the HEAVY AR ACTUVATION directly accelartes the chondcyte exhaustion and forces ur plates to close even if u keep the aromtizing from happning

Miniscule tho + Most of the effect from that is because of IGF1

ur comparing way 2 diffrent things brah aromtase defcient patiens grow forever because they have a normal hysiological male levels of test and THEY DO NOT BLAST TEST the normal test levels isnt high enough to force deirect androgenic fusion so without estrogen the plates stay open

but WE ARE TALKIN ABT ATleast like 200-500 weekly blasting which will totaly fuck the ar inside the growth plate cartilage there are tons of studies that show supra natrual t levels will directly cause chondrocyte senscense and fuse bones compleatly bypassing estrogen

 

[lmnopq]

1. Intracrine Aromatization (Local Estrogen)​

When you take testosterone durig puberty your blood levels of testosterone will be highly supraphysiological Even if you take a high dose of an AI (like Arimidex or Letrozole , aromasin) to keep your e2 LOW youre aromtise enzym still exist directly inside your bone tissue and growth plates and theres no fucking ai or any other shit to counter that its going to fuse ur shit

when Test goes through tissues and converts to estrogen locally and theres nothing u can do to stop that and
Your blood work might show low estrogen (e2) but the local concentration inside your growth plates will still be happning and make ur plates prematruerly close.

theres also a study that shows kids that were used a tiny bit of test during puberty like 16mg a week 45% of them ended up with deformed spines

u gotta be retarded to do that
theres also other stuff like direct androgenic fusion but i dont have any energy to explain that but idk do wtv u want niggas

Often due to low estrogen it seems in these studies and the deformation is harmless to almost everyone

 

[darodiddler]

like saying do not eat peanuts if your allergic to peanuts

no shit most retards here are blasting test at thier young ages brah the popular threads recomend this shit to them just saying "an ai will fix it brah dont owrry"

 

[darodiddler]

Often due to low estrogen it seems in these studies and the deformation is harmless to almost everyone

my bad true the deformation happned because of the doctors purposfuly crushed thier e2 for a long time not happned bc of test true

 

[bluebandz]

no shit most retards here are blasting test at thier young ages brah the popular threads recomend this shit to them just saying "an ai will fix it brah dont owrry"

i see lmao they don’t even consider other factors fusing their fucking plates
my plates are fucking 95% closed at 5’8 so not a big deal for me it’s over

 

[darodiddler]

i see lmao they don’t even consider other factors fusing their fucking plates
my plates are fucking 95% closed at 5’8 so not a big deal for me it’s over

its okay man mine is almost fused and im bearly 5"7 i have found out im ghd so late my doctor prescribed gh but im not gona grow much im goin to take ai secreatly we should js save up fo LL

 

[bluebandz]

its okay man mine is almost fused and im bearly 5"7 i have found out im ghd so late my doctor prescribed gh but im not gona grow much im goin to take ai secreatly we should js save up fo LL

turkey is calling

 

[ICL]

and yes even u used them true they would stop the aromtization in the growth plates like sarm or other stuff u mentioned but if use blasting test that much ur plates would still fuse from direct androgenic fusion u are correct about the cartilage aromtization part they would still close from the androgenic fusion tho

Arbitrary

yes it would but the study on those kids didnt happen because of test itself my bad they got them because the doctors paired the treatment with a heavy aromtase inhibator to purposfully crush thier strogen and extend thier growth to freeze thier bone age and thier e was so low for too long thats why the got deformed from the spine not the test itself it was an outliner i was sleepy

Retard doctor + a single case study, no hasty generalization

He used AI's on already low E2 kids

o dude ur moving goalposts igf1 drives the growth of chondrocytes fast it makes u taller unlike the test that will cause ur plates to fuse they dont fuse it

fusion happens when the chondroces undergo senscense and ossify while the estrogen is the main dick of that heavy androgens will abslotuetly and totaly CAUSE direct plate fusion on thier own

wen u blast like almost 200 weekly as little as tat the HEAVY AR ACTUVATION directly accelartes the chondcyte exhaustion and forces ur plates to close even if u keep the aromtizing from happning

Tests boosts igf1, so, you may atribute that acceleration to androgen as well, you cant track if you're fused by androgens or igf

Then dont take heavy androgens jfl that is basic knowledge + your logic would be wrong according to this study

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ur comparing way 2 diffrent things brah aromtase defcient patiens grow forever because they have a normal hysiological male levels of test and THEY DO NOT BLAST TEST the normal test levels isnt high enough to force deirect androgenic fusion so without estrogen the plates stay open

but WE ARE TALKIN ABT ATleast like 200-500 weekly blasting which will totaly fuck the ar inside the growth plate cartilage there are tons of studies that show supra natrual t levels will directly cause chondrocyte senscense and fuse bones compleatly bypassing estrogen

They arent blasting test but they have VERY high testosterone levels, getting into supraphysiological [+2000] because they have no aromatase enzymes.

ur comparing way 2 diffrent things brah aromtase defcient patiens grow forever because they have a normal hysiological male levels of test

No they dont bro we got literature on this

 

[darodiddler]

Arbitrary

Retard doctor + a single case study, no hasty generalization

He used AI's on already low E2 kids

it wasnt a single study it was a randomized doublee blind placebo controled clinical trial they ran spinal MRIs on matched cohort of boys for 2 years brah

nigga sayin the kids alr had low e2 shows you dont understand how this works , both goups started with the exact same baseline low e2 because they were all normal pubertal boys if the baseline low e2 was the cause of the deformites the placebo kids would have gotten them too instead the placebo groupgot 0% of defortmies and the 45% were on letro groip

Tests boosts igf1, so, you may atribute that acceleration to androgen as well, you cant track if you're fused by androgens or igf

Then dont take heavy androgens jfl that is basic knowledge + your logic would be wrong according to this study

this is totaly scientifically illiterate, we know exactly what cuases the fusion because igf1 and androgens do the opposite things at the celluar level in the cartilage bone nigga

igf1 drives theCHONDROCYTE profilation and hypertrophy

it makes the cells divide and expand which lengthes the bone and makes u fucking taller IT DOES NOT trigger fusion



and DERICT ART activation from heavy test does the exact opposite it burns through the growth plates finite lifespan acclerates cell exhaustion and forces the bone to ossify faggot

saying you cant track it just means you dont know the diffrence betwen simple shit like cell division and cell burn out, also fuck do u mean bro? that was what i was saying the whole point dont take heay androgens??? how would i be wrong?????? explain? also no its not common knowledge most of the popular threads say to take test during puberty with ai to maximize puberty thinking ai would stop the plate fusioning from test

View attachment 5075682

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They arent blasting test but they have VERY high testosterone levels, getting into supraphysiological [+2000] because they have no aromatase enzymes.

U ARE JUST MAKING UP BS NIGGER WTF MAKING up numbers and ty to save ur argument go open any actual edicla litrature on congential aromase defciet adult males

every single documented case reports shows those men to have normal to mildly elevated test levels like 600 to 1100 ng/DLbecause of slightly elevated LH/fSH from the lack estrogen feedback thier bodies cannot NATRUALY IN ANYWAY PRODUCE 2000NG/DL WTF

BECAUSE THEIR TEST STAYS WITHEN NORMAL HUMAN PHYSIOLOGICAL RANGE IT NEVER HITS THE MASSIVE SATURATION REQUIRED TO CAUSE DIRECT ANDROGENIC FUSION ON ITS OWN.

that is why they grow forever

U CANNOT COMPARE NATRUAL 8-- ng/dL baseline to someone blating 200 -500 mg of exognous steroids weekly . post the link to the link a single peer study reviewed that showed AN UNTREATED AROMATOSE defcient male natrualy at 2000ng/dl YOU CANT BECAUSE THAT DOESNT EXIEST AND U MADE IT UP JFL

No they dont bro we got literature on this

The landmark paper on this (Morishima et al 1995 in The New England Journal of Medicine) a 28 yo aromatase deficient guy who grew to 6'8" because his plates wouldnt close His actual recorded testosterone was 704 ng dl Another case by Carani et al (1995) had the patient sitting right between 700 and 800 ng/dL.

They stay completely within the normal human range of test A normal baseline of 700 ng/dL isn't high enough to trigger direct androgenic fusion faggot which is why they grow forever
You cannot compare that to someone blasting a 200–500mg steroid cycle that completely floods the growth plates receptors
You have no literature, UR MAKIN UP STUFF

 

[Zagro]

nothing tbh even if u use non aromtizing roids u would still need a test base or even without it its gona cause direct androgenic fusion u should just blast gh and ai during puberty


hgh is also useless tho if ur not ghd but most people ae ghd without knowing it

if u dont care abt ur height go and take it blast 500 test

Don’t use fucking chatgpt to design your stack, gh+ai is pretty much the equivalent of running 500 test and “controlling” E2 levels.

Hgh is not useless without GHD

Stop posting about it if you learned what androgens are 3 days ago, which you did because i told you about them and you were clueless

 

[darodiddler]

Don’t use fucking chatgpt to design your stack, gh+ai is pretty much the equivalent of running 500 test and “controlling” E2 levels.

Hgh is not useless without GHD

Stop posting about it if you learned what androgens are 3 days ago, which you did because i told you about them and you were clueless

what stakc niga? hand how the fuck is gh and ai is the equivlant of running 500 test??????? did u read any thing i wrote or did u get what i mean?


it is kinda its just going to acclerate ur final height u were getting

am i wrong even if i learnt abt it not so long ago?? i was saying its gona fuse ur plates ai cannot stop the aromtization happning in ur growth plates please nigger read what i wrote and also about the dierct androgenic fusion explain how am iwrong abt this???

 

[darodiddler]

Don’t use fucking chatgpt to design your stack, gh+ai is pretty much the equivalent of running 500 test and “controlling” E2 levels.

Hgh is not useless without GHD

Stop posting about it if you learned what androgens are 3 days ago, which you did because i told you about them and you were clueless

also please theres no way u said ai and gh is the equivlant of 500 and "controlling e2 levels" ur bein sarcastic right?

500 blast will compelatly fuck the Androgen Receptors directly inside the growth plate cartilage his triggers direct androgenic burnout in the cell senescence and forces COMPLEATE premature fusion completely bypassing estroge thats why ai wouldnt work even if u fixedthe aromitzation from hapning inside the growth plates cartialgee

 

[Zagro]

what stakc niga? hand how the fuck is gh and ai is the equivlant of running 500 test??????? did u read any thing i wrote or did u get what i mean?


it is kinda its just going to acclerate ur final height u were getting

am i wrong even if i learnt abt it not so long ago?? i was saying its gona fuse ur plates ai cannot stop the aromtization happning in ur growth plates please nigger read what i wrote and also about the dierct androgenic fusion explain how am iwrong abt this???

Stop acting like you have even a tiny fucking sprinkle of knowledge about the topic, you prompted artificial intelligence for 15 minutes long and now think you’ve understood it all and started barking at others you fucking stupid fuck, i don’t like insulting people in an argument but pipe down you moron you didn’t know what the word androgen was 2-3 days ago.

Aromatase inhibitors increase your endogenous testosterone levels greatly, letrozole will increase 2-3 fold depending on your levels, and it does this by increasing LH/FSH, aromatase itself is an enzyme that regulates sex hormone production rate, and when blocked your pituitary/hypothalamus doesn’t know whether it’s producing adequate sex hormones or not so it keeps increasing it, the more you inhibit aromatase=the more you increase endogenous testosterone levels.

Like you just fucking said now, your growth plate has it’s own steroidogenesis system where it can synthesise estrogen completely from scratch with cholesterol, de novo synthesis of estrogen completely within the chondrocyte itself or from chondrocyte-to-chondrocyte (autocrine+paracrine). None of your aromatase inhibitor bullshit will work here as it’s all locally done.

There’s a reason why letrozole causes less increase in final adult height compared to anastrozole for example, this is because of the fucking supraphysiological testosterone levels you reach because of how much aromatase you’re inhibiting, and inhibiting aromatase is the fucking goal and low-dosing it will have no use at all.

Whenever aromatase inhibitors are induced, estrogen receptors increase their sensitivity in order to compensate for the inadequate amount of circulating aromatase enzymes, so even a tiny bit of aromatase will have a much greater impact. This is proven by aromatase deficient men treated with estrogen, their plates fuse extremely quickly due to the increased sensitivity they have against aromatase, and on the contrary you have young children with precocious puberty that have been exposed to estrogen levels 2-3 fold greater than their peers and normal levels but still it takes years for their epiphyses to fully fuse as the body once again can get used to the environment, even if you’re inducing it pharmaceutically.

Your body will not work in your favour, it never will.

You can check and see that children with increased GH/IGF-1 levels can be prescribed aromatase inhibitors as it indirectly increases aromatisation, and they can end up stunting their height depending on the situation. On the other hand we also have evidence on prepubescent children on aromatase inhibitors seeing absolutely zero longitudinal growth at all, and with other trials as potency of the aromatase inhibitors increase, you see less and less growth.

Also you being GHD doesn’t mean everyone also has to, and no one here is GHD because they’re short, the world doesn’t revolve around your manlet ass.

Androgen receptor activation in chondrocytes does not cause fusion or hasten it in any way, the word “androgen” is a broad term that includes aromatising-androgens such as testosterone and androstenedione.

Your testosterone levels can reach 1.200ng/dL with letrozole, and this can be higher depending on your baseline genetics. This is the equivalent of 200-300mg weekly for some people, and depending on the esters it can be even higher.

Never speak about things you’ve learned 5 minutes ago by prompting daddy ChatGPT, you’re absolutely CLUELESS. I would delete this thread out of embarrassment if i were you.

 

[darodiddler]

Stop acting like you have even a tiny fucking sprinkle of knowledge about the topic, you prompted artificial intelligence for 15 minutes long and now think you’ve understood it all and started barking at others you fucking stupid fuck, i don’t like insulting people in an argument but pipe down you moron you didn’t know what the word androgen was 2-3 days ago.

Aromatase inhibitors increase your endogenous testosterone levels greatly, letrozole will increase 2-3 fold depending on your levels, and it does this by increasing LH/FSH, aromatase itself is an enzyme that regulates sex hormone production rate, and when blocked your pituitary/hypothalamus doesn’t know whether it’s producing adequate sex hormones or not so it keeps increasing it, the more you inhibit aromatase=the more you increase endogenous testosterone levels.

Like you just fucking said now, your growth plate has it’s own steroidogenesis system where it can synthesise estrogen completely from scratch with cholesterol, de novo synthesis of estrogen completely within the chondrocyte itself or from chondrocyte-to-chondrocyte (autocrine+paracrine). None of your aromatase inhibitor bullshit will work here as it’s all locally done.

There’s a reason why letrozole causes less increase in final adult height compared to anastrozole for example, this is because of the fucking supraphysiological testosterone levels you reach because of how much aromatase you’re inhibiting, and inhibiting aromatase is the fucking goal and low-dosing it will have no use at all.

Whenever aromatase inhibitors are induced, estrogen receptors increase their sensitivity in order to compensate for the inadequate amount of circulating aromatase enzymes, so even a tiny bit of aromatase will have a much greater impact. This is proven by aromatase deficient men treated with estrogen, their plates fuse extremely quickly due to the increased sensitivity they have against aromatase, and on the contrary you have young children with precocious puberty that have been exposed to estrogen levels 2-3 fold greater than their peers and normal levels but still it takes years for their epiphyses to fully fuse as the body once again can get used to the environment, even if you’re inducing it pharmaceutically.

Your body will not work in your favour, it never will.

You can check and see that children with increased GH/IGF-1 levels can be prescribed aromatase inhibitors as it indirectly increases aromatisation, and they can end up stunting their height depending on the situation. On the other hand we also have evidence on prepubescent children on aromatase inhibitors seeing absolutely zero longitudinal growth at all, and with other trials as potency of the aromatase inhibitors increase, you see less and less growth.

Also you being GHD doesn’t mean everyone also has to, and no one here is GHD because they’re short, the world doesn’t revolve around your manlet ass.

Androgen receptor activation in chondrocytes does not cause fusion or hasten it in any way, the word “androgen” is a broad term that includes aromatising-androgens such as testosterone and androstenedione.

Your testosterone levels can reach 1.200ng/dL with letrozole, and this can be higher depending on your baseline genetics. This is the equivalent of 200-300mg weekly for some people, and depending on the esters it can be even higher.

Never speak about things you’ve learned 5 minutes ago by prompting daddy ChatGPT, you’re absolutely CLUELESS. I would delete this thread out of embarrassment if i were you.

genuienly nigga i cant reply right now i have to study for finals tmrw i will respond later on wait "
Androgen receptor activation in chondrocytes does not cause fusion or hasten it in any way, the word “androgen” is a broad term that includes aromatising-androgens such as testosterone and androstenedione." high dose non aromtizing androgens like dht deeratives or heavy supera T directly acclerates the dpelation of resting chondrocytys forcing premature sencence U CANT REALLY deny this one bru

 

[Zagro]

genuienly nigga i cant reply right now i have to study for finals tmrw i will respond later on wait "
Androgen receptor activation in chondrocytes does not cause fusion or hasten it in any way, the word “androgen” is a broad term that includes aromatising-androgens such as testosterone and androstenedione." high dose non aromtizing androgens like dht deeratives or heavy supera T directly acclerates the dpelation of resting chondrocytys forcing premature sencence U CANT REALLY deny this one bru

DHT-derivatives are not the same as DHT you moron, you don’t have oxandrolone (anavar) and drostanolone (masteron) circulating in your bloodstream

DHT is inactivated by 3a-HSD in muscle tissue very quickly, that’s why DHT-derivatives are preferred as they are modified to resist the 3a-HSD enzyme to actually have an effect in muscle tissue.

“Heavy supera T” if we neglect the absolute dyslexic grammar, as I’ve said, aromatase inhibitors also put your testosterone levels at supraphysiological concentrations.

Don’t debate me please i don’t want to refute ChatGPT for hours straight, if you reply back with AI, i will put you on ignore instantly, so don’t be surprised when i don’t reply back, thinking you cracked the code.

AR activation in chondrocytes doesn’t stunt growth or cause senescence, you don’t know what senescence means, it’s the exhaustion of your growth plate’s proliferative capacity, your plates will already fuse normally through aging before you even reach a state like that through AR activation. This can occur if you’re aromatase deficient and use non-aromatising androgens in like 5-10 years i guess

Androgens don’t deplete the resting zone, estrogen does by aromatising from androstenedione/testosterone you moron.

I already put you on ignore as it’s obvious you wont be able to reply without the use of AI.

 

[ICL]

it wasnt a single study it was a randomized doublee blind placebo controled clinical trial they ran spinal MRIs on matched cohort of boys for 2 years brah

nigga sayin the kids alr had low e2 shows you dont understand how this works , both goups started with the exact same baseline low e2 because they were all normal pubertal boys if the baseline low e2 was the cause of the deformites the placebo kids would have gotten them too instead the placebo groupgot 0% of defortmies and the 45% were on letro groip

I was talking about the effect of testosterone 60mg which would supress LH/FSH and cause a decrease in testosterone. Decrease in testosterone would be a decrease in estrogen as well, so it doesn't make sense they supress e2 on already slightly lower e2.

As for the deformity section, I never disagreed with that, I called the doctor stupid because of the giga-suppression of e2, which you proved to be correlated with the deformities.

this is totaly scientifically illiterate, we know exactly what cuases the fusion because igf1 and androgens do the opposite things at the celluar level in the cartilage bone nigga

Fair enough, that is a minor addition, but, androgen usage with aromatase still has significantly slower maturation than just androgen usage.

for instance, androgen is a vague category, hence other androgens like DHT or similar Anabolic/Androgenic ratios can be used which dont impact maturation as mich as testosterone, even tho it's more potent.

igf1 drives theCHONDROCYTE profilation and hypertrophy

it makes the cells divide and expand which lengthes the bone and makes u fucking taller IT DOES NOT trigger fusion

I was talking about the speeding of the maturation, it is not triggered by igf1, just faster with igf1, but we should move on and forget IGF

saying you cant track it just means you dont know the diffrence betwen simple shit like cell division and cell burn out, also fuck do u mean bro? that was what i was saying the whole point dont take heay androgens??? how would i be wrong?????? explain? also no its not common knowledge most of the popular threads say to take test during puberty with ai to maximize puberty thinking ai would stop the plate fusioning from test

So if we're agreeing, what are you currently trying to argue?
Your main point was very weak, arguing about how theres nothing you can do for the e2 in your bones

Idc about those popular threads, most people know "ai test gh" is b.s. already

U ARE JUST MAKING UP BS NIGGER WTF MAKING up numbers and ty to save ur argument go open any actual edicla litrature on congential aromase defciet adult males

every single documented case reports shows those men to have normal to mildly elevated test levels like 600 to 1100 ng/DLbecause of slightly elevated LH/fSH from the lack estrogen feedback thier bodies cannot NATRUALY IN ANYWAY PRODUCE 2000NG/DL WTF

BECAUSE THEIR TEST STAYS WITHEN NORMAL HUMAN PHYSIOLOGICAL RANGE IT NEVER HITS THE MASSIVE SATURATION REQUIRED TO CAUSE DIRECT ANDROGENIC FUSION ON ITS OWN.

that is why they grow forever

U CANNOT COMPARE NATRUAL 8-- ng/dL baseline to someone blating 200 -500 mg of exognous steroids weekly . post the link to the link a single peer study reviewed that showed AN UNTREATED AROMATOSE defcient male natrualy at 2000ng/dl YOU CANT BECAUSE THAT DOESNT EXIEST AND U MADE IT UP JFL

Okay forget about this lol I didn't know what I was saying with the testosterone 2000ng/dl+ point
But can you not apply tamoxefin/raloxefin here as well I mean, if you reach such high T levels, you can use it, many off label usages of tamoxefin/raloxefin has significantly impacted the bone maturation, altho no impact for those with pubertal gyno

The landmark paper on this (Morishima et al 1995 in The New England Journal of Medicine) a 28 yo aromatase deficient guy who grew to 6'8" because his plates wouldnt close His actual recorded testosterone was 704 ng dl Another case by Carani et al (1995) had the patient sitting right between 700 and 800 ng/dL.

These are elevated levels relative to the general population, it's an SD or 2 above average. Think 800ng/dl still has a bigger impact than an average person's testosterone levels, yet, they still have unfused bones. Also, there is usually minimal headway done for these people to fuse their plates

Effect of Testosterone and Estradiol in a Man with Aromatase Deficiency | NEJM

Recent reports of disruptive mutations of the genes for the estrogen receptor or for cytochrome P-450 aromatase1–6 have shed new light on the role of estrogen. In females the lack of estrogen due t...

www.nejm.org

While being 31 this nigga had a bone age of a 14 y/o. Androgens are minimally potent for growth plates

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199707103370204#:~:text=In%20an%20attempt,him%20irretrievably%20infertile.

He was given 250mg of T ethanate, and, his bone age showed no sign of change.
Another article:

Novel treatment of short stature with aromatase inhibitors - PubMed

Estrogens have an essential role in the regulation of bone maturation and importantly in the closure of growth plates in both sexes. This prospective, randomized, placebo-controlled study was undertaken to evaluate whether suppression of estrogen synthesis in pubertal boys delays bone maturation...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The kids that used letzorole, which increased testosterone x5 more than the other group increased their T using low dose T, but the letzorole group had slower bone maturation than those kids who used low dose T. The kids who used letzorole also had an increase of 5.1cm FAH prediction, compared to the kids using T who gained no extra heigh gain, INCLUDING those who didn't use T.

 

[sub3european]

1. Intracrine Aromatization (Local Estrogen)​

When you take testosterone durig puberty your blood levels of testosterone will be highly supraphysiological Even if you take a high dose of an AI (like Arimidex or Letrozole , aromasin) to keep your e2 LOW youre aromtise enzym still exist directly inside your bone tissue and growth plates and theres no fucking ai or any other shit to counter that its going to fuse ur shit

when Test goes through tissues and converts to estrogen locally and theres nothing u can do to stop that and
Your blood work might show low estrogen (e2) but the local concentration inside your growth plates will still be happning and make ur plates prematruerly close.

theres also a study that shows kids that were used a tiny bit of test during puberty like 16mg a week 45% of them ended up with deformed spines

u gotta be retarded to do that
theres also other stuff like direct androgenic fusion but i dont have any energy to explain that but idk do wtv u want niggas

So at what age should i pin?

 

[darodiddler]

@Faustum @PubertyMaxxer @sherry12 @Doom0

Doom0​

sherry12​

PubertyMaxxer​

Faustum

what are ur thoughts?​