Double jaw surgery vs facepulling

[wagbox]

For a recessed maxilla / deep bite / overbite can facepulling theoretically give better results than BSSO / lefort I?

Lefort I seems counterproductive because you are fracturing just a small part of the maxilla and bringing only that forward.

This is a discussion i have been having with @nelson

 

[maxmendietta]

How old r u. results depend on the maleability of the bones in case the sutures aren't broken with other sort of device.

 

[brutal_blackpill]

No. Lefort I is basically the god of all looksmaxxing surgeries srs.

More importantly, I’d rather trust a procedure that has a pile of strong evidence behind it to improve your life than some internet fad where studies haven’t been done on it.

 

[wagbox]

How old r u. results depend on the maleability of the bones in case the sutures aren't broken with other sort of device.

18

No. Lefort I is basically the god of all looksmaxxing surgeries srs.

More importantly, I’d rather trust a procedure that has a pile of strong evidence behind it to improve your life than some internet fad where studies haven’t been done on it.

Fucking thank you

 

[BigNigga69]

If there is extreme recession, both. Fp then LeFort 1.

 

[Cope]

BSSO and Lefort I are completely different, dafuq

 

[wagbox]

BSSO and Lefort I are completely different, dafuq

Yes, I'm referring to getting both vs just facepulling and having the mandible come forward.

 

[Deleted member 3962]

You can fraud the rest of the maxilla forwards with implants\fat grafts. Lefort 1 + Infraorbital implants+zygo implants = lefort 3 lite without the risk of choking on your own blood and dying horribly.

facepuller has no info

 

[Deleted member 3259]

Stupid question, but, how does one have recessed maxilla and overbite? I thought overbite pretty much meant that your maxilla is where it's supposed to be, while your mandible is underdeveloped

 

[Deleted member 3962]

Stupid question, but, how does one have recessed maxilla and overbite? I thought overbite pretty much meant that your maxilla is where it's supposed to be, while your mandible is underdeveloped

Downwards growth, short mandible, etc.

 

[Deleted member 3259]

Downwards growth, short mandible, etc.

Downward growth I would understand, but does short mandible have anything to do with the maxilla? lol. Or did you mean that just in general response as the reason to overbite.

 

[Cope]

Yes, I'm referring to getting both vs just facepulling and having the mandible come forward.

The mandible won't come forward with facepulling, atleast not directly anyways

 

[brutal_blackpill]

Stupid question, but, how does one have recessed maxilla and overbite? I thought overbite pretty much meant that your maxilla is where it's supposed to be, while your mandible is underdeveloped

Recession of an upper or lower jaw is not just in reference to the other jaw but rather to the rest of your face as well, such as your nose. So your maxilla could be recessed compared to your face but your lower jaw could be even more recessed causing an overbite.

An overbite just means your lower jaw is more recessed relative to your upper jaw. It does not imply that your upper jaw is not recessed. By the way, I have the same exact problem, although my maxilla is only slightly recessed (that is atleast according to my surgeon).

 

[Gosick]

I heard anything over 7-8mms advancement of the jaws during double jaw is more likely to cause nerve damage/numbness

 

[Deleted member 1106]

You can fraud the rest of the maxilla forwards with implants\fat grafts. Lefort 1 + Infraorbital implants+zygo implants = lefort 3 lite without the risk of choking on your own blood and dying horribly.

facepuller has no info

could you get lefort 1 with bssdo and then later down the line mod lefort 3 that doesnt touch the upper jaw area? I heard modified lefort 3 is less invasive but I'm not sure which are the "safe areas"

 

[Deleted member 3962]

could you get lefort 1 with bssdo and then later down the line mod lefort 3 that doesnt touch the upper jaw area? I heard modified lefort 3 is less invasive but I'm not sure which are the "safe areas"

View attachment 240087

Get high lefort 1 with ccw rotation and bsso+genio

Much less risk, very high reward.
If you need to bring forwards your under eye area just do it via implants.

 

[superhans]

Get high lefort 1 with ccw rotation and bsso+genio

Much less risk, very high reward.
If you need to bring forwards your under eye area just do it via implants.

They also usually do multisegment lefort (to widen palate instead of SARPE) with zygo implants (or zygo bone grafting) in one surgery. This is why it is 7 hours long. A friend of mine who is a dentist training to be a surgeon told that double jaw surgery aims at reconstructing your whole face and make a decent harmony, it is not only about jaws.

 

[Deleted member 3962]

They also usually do multisegment lefort (to widen palate instead of SARPE) with zygo implants (or zygo bone grafting) in one surgery. This is why it is 7 hours long. A friend of mine who is a dentist training to be a surgeon told that double jaw surgery aims at reconstructing your whole face and make a decent harmony, it is not only about jaws.

Mirin iq

u should make posts bro

 

[OOGABOOGA]

They also usually do multisegment lefort (to widen palate instead of SARPE) with zygo implants (or zygo bone grafting) in one surgery. This is why it is 7 hours long. A friend of mine who is a dentist training to be a surgeon told that double jaw surgery aims at reconstructing your whole face and make a decent harmony, it is not only about jaws.

Bet bro, I’ll get msdo first then do all that so I can skip mse

Get high lefort 1 with ccw rotation and bsso+genio

Much less risk, very high reward.
If you need to bring forwards your under eye area just do it via implants.

Do you know for sure if ccw is possible with the high cut since it’s not a straight line?

 

[Deleted member 3962]

Bet bro, I’ll get msdo first then do all that so I can skip mse

Do you know for sure if ccw is possible with the high cut since it’s not a straight line?

I dont

 

[superhans]

Bet bro, I’ll get msdo first then do all that so I can skip mse

Do you know for sure if ccw is possible with the high cut since it’s not a straight line?

I am getting double jaw (upper jaw split between canines and laterals) with ccw rotation / genio / zygos. Invisalign and upper jaw segments will widen upper palate because second premolars were extracted previously when i wore braces. I can't wait for everything to be done. Good luck mate.

 

[Luke LLL]

You can fraud the rest of the maxilla forwards with implants\fat grafts. Lefort 1 + Infraorbital implants+zygo implants = lefort 3 lite without the risk of choking on your own blood and dying horribly.

facepuller has no info

Lefort 3, facepull, mse with face mask, or rope. This is what I’ve been telling @wagbox. Why would you cut your maxilla in half and leave half of it recessed?

Does anyone have any good ascension pics for a Lefort 1 + bsso?

Facepull transformation pic:

 

[softLoverr]

Ive been facepulling for the past 3 months with an apliance and what i can tell for sure is that i have more volume in my midface area, below the eyes and next to the nose, my maxilla didnt seem to "move", like many people think it does. Seems like im getting either growth or remodelling at the suture but no actual movement. And how do i know im just not fatter, with more water retention, well my buccinators are still small , and i still have hollow cheecks, yet my zygos seem bigger,i gained 1-2kgs(over the past 1-2 months while weightraining heavily) but that does literally nothing for my face since i barely get fat there.

 

[Golden Glass]

I heard anything over 7-8mms advancement of the jaws during double jaw is more likely to cause nerve damage/numbness

Source?

 

[superhans]

Lefort 3, facepull, mse with face mask, or rope. This is what I’ve been telling @wagbox. Why would you cut your maxilla in half and leave half of it recessed?

Does anyone have any good ascension pics for a Lefort 1 + bsso?

Facepull transformation pic:

View attachment 240380

Source?

i got numbness after my lower wisdom teeth removal. I can guarantee you will get numbness after djs, but it will recover.

 

[Golden Glass]

View attachment 240391View attachment 240392

Needs undereye support from implants in the afger

Lefort 3, facepull, mse with face mask, or rope. This is what I’ve been telling @wagbox. Why would you cut your maxilla in half and leave half of it recessed?

Does anyone have any good ascension pics for a Lefort 1 + bsso?

Facepull transformation pic:

View attachment 240380

I love that before and after since we know how that kids dad looked like.

@wagbox Unless you’re like 14-15, facepulling with MSE won’t ever give the degree of change a Lefort III will. Maybe it can give the same movements, but never to that degree that only a Lefort III is capable of.

I’m personally going to do MSE with lower arch expansion through MSDO or an appliance (likely just a hyrax appliance because my chin and gonial width is already good), and then get Bimax (BSSO plus either high Lefort 1 and then a Sinn-style mod Lefort III to bring the rest of the upper midface forward, or just get a straight Lefort III, I know if three docs who do Lefort IIIs in nondeformed patients).

 

[Luke LLL]

Unless you’re like 14-15, facepulling with MSE won’t ever give the degree of change a Lefort III will.

Why?

 

[Golden Glass]

Why?

Because your bones aren’t as malleable as they were at that age. How old are you and @wagbox ?

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

Lefort 3, facepull, mse with face mask, or rope. This is what I’ve been telling @wagbox. Why would you cut your maxilla in half and leave half of it recessed?

Does anyone have any good ascension pics for a Lefort 1 + bsso?

Facepull transformation pic:

View attachment 240380

Incel to chad lmao

 

[Gosick]

Source?

Reputed User on Lookism said this.

I think he might have meant the upper jaw only though

 

[Deleted member 3962]

Lefort 3, facepull, mse with face mask, or rope. This is what I’ve been telling @wagbox. Why would you cut your maxilla in half and leave half of it recessed?

Does anyone have any good ascension pics for a Lefort 1 + bsso?

Facepull transformation pic:

View attachment 240380

I do have pics ill show after school.
You can bring the other half forwards with implants instead of risking blindness

facepullinf worked cuz he like 12

 

[Deleted member 4209]

unlikely u can use enough pressure to get lefort like results

 

[Golden Glass]

unlikely u can use enough pressure to get lefort like results

@varbrah got like 4mm protraction. Some Lefort Is are done for that amount.
^^he did it anchored to MSE, not a removable appliance.

 

[OOGABOOGA]

Ive been facepulling for the past 3 months with an apliance and what i can tell for sure is that i have more volume in my midface area, below the eyes and next to the nose, my maxilla didnt seem to "move", like many people think it does. Seems like im getting either growth or remodelling at the suture but no actual movement. And how do i know im just not fatter, with more water retention, well my buccinators are still small , and i still have hollow cheecks, yet my zygos seem bigger,i gained 1-2kgs(over the past 1-2 months while weightraining heavily) but that does literally nothing for my face since i barely get fat there.

How old are you? And how much time and force are you using?

 

[curryslayerordeath]

@varbrah got like 4mm protraction. Some Lefort Is are done for that amount.
^^he did it anchored to MSE, not a removable appliance.

How exactly do you anchor to MSE? Wouldn't that be very painful too bc ur pulling screws that are directly in your bone?

If he was able to get 4mm protraction, that would be very significant because its of the whole maxilla bone. The rest jaw area aesthetics can be fixed by leforts.

 

[softLoverr]

How old are you? And how much time and force are you using?

Just turned 23, 18hrs+/ day, no clue about the force, sadly does nothing for the mandible thou, maybe my chin implant could be blocking movement but i highly doubt it. It could also be that it takes years for the mandible to catch up.

 

[MaxxedOut]

Just turned 23, 18hrs+/ day, no clue about the force, sadly does nothing for the mandible thou, maybe my chin implant could be blocking movement but i highly doubt it. It could also be that it takes years for the mandible to catch up.

I doubt your implant is blocking movement. And it definitely takes time for the mandible to match. Which device are you using for facepulling?

 

[Deleted member 3962]

Just turned 23, 18hrs+/ day, no clue about the force, sadly does nothing for the mandible thou, maybe my chin implant could be blocking movement but i highly doubt it. It could also be that it takes years for the mandible to catch up.

Bro force is very important

 

[GetThatBread]

Needs undereye support from implants in the afger


I love that before and after since we know how that kids dad looked like.

@wagbox Unless you’re like 14-15, facepulling with MSE won’t ever give the degree of change a Lefort III will. Maybe it can give the same movements, but never to that degree that only a Lefort III is capable of.

I’m personally going to do MSE with lower arch expansion through MSDO or an appliance (likely just a hyrax appliance because my chin and gonial width is already good), and then get Bimax (BSSO plus either high Lefort 1 and then a Sinn-style mod Lefort III to bring the rest of the upper midface forward, or just get a straight Lefort III, I know if three docs who do Lefort IIIs in nondeformed patients).

I think just facepulling alone without anchoring will yield you better results than your original form but to get a Lefort III level change I would get MSE + MSDO + IMDO + Sandra Ks FacePuller connected to the maxillary suture screws all while hard Mewing and supplementing to generate bone remodeling. So Mega Mewing on super Saiyan god level

 

[sloopnoob]

Stupid question, but, how does one have recessed maxilla and overbite? I thought overbite pretty much meant that your maxilla is where it's supposed to be, while your mandible is underdeveloped

bimaxillary protrusion and recessed maxilla can do that for you, I have it.