Face matters, height only a little bit if you are not a dwarf.

[OneTwoThree]

If you reach some height then only face matters. Most guys I know from school, high school, university have good looking face and average or just above avarage height (5'9-6'1). I have 3 friends who are very tall 6'5-6'6 and they do not have attention from girls because they are like LTN facially (two of them have horse face).

I am barely and even less than 6 foots and skinny af and had 9 girlfriends in my 22 years of life due to fact girls have been complimenting my lips, eyes, hair.
If I had been taller I would have had even more attractive in girls eyes but combo tall height and good looking face are very rare in daily life.

I still do not know why many users here cope about height and muscles if enormous part of attractiveness comes from face. Being tall is only beneficial if you have good looking face.

 

[OneTwoThree]

*most slayers I know from school, high school, university have good looking face and average or just above avarage height (5'9-6'1).

 

[Deleted member 22190]

If you reach some height then only face matters. Most guys I know from school, high school, university have good looking face and average or just above avarage height (5'9-6'1). I have 3 friends who are very tall 6'5-6'6 and they do not have attention from girls because they are like LTN facially (two of them have horse face).

I am barely and even less than 6 foots and skinny af and had 9 girlfriends in my 22 years of life due to fact girls have been complimenting my lips, eyes, hair.
If I had been taller I would have had even more attractive in girls eyes but combo tall height and good looking face are very rare in daily life.

I still do not know why many users here cope about height and muscles if enormous part of attractiveness comes from face. Being tall is only beneficial if you have good looking face.

Dumb thread, even if a 5'8 Chad doesn't show it, he is and will always be envious of the 6'4 LTN

 

[DoctorLooksmax]

Yes face is the main thing, height and body are multipliers for a good face, but without a good face they dont help

 

[Deleted member 22190]

Also mods MOVE THIS SHIT TO OFFTOPIC

 

[OneTwoThree]

Dumb thread, even if a 5'8 Chad doesn't show it, he is and will always be envious of the 6'4 LTN

Not really, 6'4 LTN does not have a chance to get a girlfriend (or illusory). Chad does not need a good height to be attractive.

 

[OneTwoThree]

Also mods MOVE THIS SHIT TO OFFTOPIC

Sorry.

 

[Deleted member 22190]

Not really, 6'4 LTN does not have a chance to get a girlfriend (or illusory). Chad does not need a good height to be attractive.

I disagree, a 5'6 manlet with a Chad face will always struggle with women more than a 6'4+ MTN-HTN ever will.

 

[Anasurimbor]

height is just a disqualifier trait nothing more. If you pass- good. no-% of women will disqualify you instantly.
depending on the country that threshold is 5'8-5'11

Im 176cm-5'9.3- tried wearing 7-10cm lifts - nobody give a f....except for males. Current gf from social circle 180cm/5'11. Unironically when i was 20% bf and looked worse she ignored me. when i started to look better, she suddenly started to show interest in me even though i no longer wear them ( although also got rid of depression and social anxiety so cant really determine what caused a significant effect)

 

[twilight]

I disagree, a 5'6 manlet with a Chad face will always struggle with women more than a 6'4+ MTN-HTN ever will.

some women literally treat mtns like gods as long as they are 6”2+…why is jack harlow famous LOL

 

[OneTwoThree]

I disagree, a 5'6 manlet with a Chad face will always struggle with women more than a 6'4+ MTN-HTN ever will.

Agree, but nowadays it is even find a european 5'6 male zoomer

 

[Deleted member 19576]

I always tought that height is the thing but yeah even 190cm people are struggling to get girls.

 

[Deleted member 19576]

i mean 190cm ugly guys.

 

[Hipcel]

If you reach some height then only face matters.

Wrong. A 6' guy with a great face will get mogged by a 6'2 guy with a great face. Also taller means in 3 dimensions

 

[Deleted member 19576]

some women literally treat mtns like gods as long as they are 6”2+…why is jack harlow famous LOL

I dont think it has anything to do with success. There are ugly and manlet rapper and they have became successful. He has popularity status.

 

[Mongrelcel]

good face + good height is rare, but not nonexistent, and women will simply wait for a guy like that

remember, attractiveness does not have diminishing returns, but the opposite - the treatment a HTN gets cannot be compared to the one a true chad gets

 

[Deleted member 21822]

There’s like a million past threads about this topic

 

[sasha777]

why lift when its all about the face

 

[yuyu]

I think the reason why we keep having the same thread every week is because it is not binary and never will be. Why? There will always be multiple factors in such discussions - if one is to understand the blackpill in its entirety then it needs to account for every nuance and every situation relative to other factors with a grounding in looks theory and its elements (dimorphism, averageness, pheno).

Threads as such will always be diminutive in what they are trying to achieve since every factor is not taken into account by every person in these discussions and is hard to do so because there are always pieces of the puzzle that you're trying to learn. Most people tend to orient these discussions towards mogging or slaying

But it can't just be recessed 22% bf 15-year-olds with Maher avis discussing the scope of height vs face in regards to slaying only and then going "height matters", but others with LTR orientation or older users with real life experience, giving their input and then these vague back-and-forths

There are so, so many factors. For example:

• Pheno
• Race
• Pheno/racial biases or stereotypes
• PSL: objective aesthetic rating
• Appeal vs aesthetic
  • For instance, Barrett or DePoot having insanely high PSL but there are guys with less PSL but more appeal. This also is linked with pheno and soft features, etc. PSL scale, someone can be 4.25 PSL but a good pheno which can give them good appeal. Appeal, then, is also amplified by halos (of which a subcategory is height and to an extent, noticeable frame). Exposure effect also increases appeal, as does aura/personality. Exposure effect is also more likely in social circles, which... tends to increase success rate on average if one's NT and such
• SMV vs appeal (vs aesthetic)
  • SMV (usually for slaying) can be high even being 4.25 PSL, think 6/10. Whereas Barrett may be 7 PSL but have an SMV of 9 only. It's not going to be directly proportional. This comes down to pheno/race, halos (including height here + good body etc), status too
  • PSL on average just secures a good base for LTRs or slaying but doesn't give one a directly proportionally higher SMV or appeal than someone who's closer to 4 PSL than to 5.5
• Halos
  • Embrace the Niko smilepill
• LTR or Slaying?
• Status pill
• Frame, muscle insertions
• Facial dimorphism, including adiposity etc.
• Exposure effect (better for LTRs)
  • Social circles
  • NTness and personality
• Type of women you're seeking out
  • How NT are you, how much are you even trying to seek out?
  • What are you trying to seek out? Slays or LTR?
  • Looksmatch range or no?
  • Ethnic or phenomatch?
  • Nichemaxxed?
  • Their personal preferences?
  • Country, region, culture (French = more promicuous, blackpilled etc. EE = girls higher PSL, etc etc.)
  • Personal preferences: biological markers, or dimorphism
  • Impact of personality on them i.e. exposure effect once you meet their looks threshold
• What the woman's own preferences are
  • Culture dependent, again
  • LTR or slays? Degenerate or modest?
  • Depth and LTR-oriented or dates down for ego, thinks she can keep doing better etc.
  • Where she leans
    • i.e. dimorphic men
    • prettier men with dimorphic traits
    • SMV > face
    • appeal > aesthetic
    • cute vs hot
    • average men (self aware of looksmatch) although this is rarer
    • dates down facially for security of mate, but would like a "tall, ugly guy" because she still gets her biological needs met
    • her value placed on face vs. other biological markers i.e. penis, frame, height etc.
      • some value those more than face because of dating down, securing mate for LTR etc. different priorities, y'know
  • Re: LTR - How she was raised and what she finds matters to her based on her values i.e. can compromise some height if personality is good, body/frame is good, face is decent

In some regions or places there are 190cm KHHVs that have 3.75 or 4 PSL faces and meh or shit pheno. In others they are slaying. It's not binary. 4PSL 190cm guy can slay in a decent area with passing pheno or if white, on certain dating apps like hinge

Bottom line? What's important is meeting looks threshold. That tends to be 4.5-4.75 PSL, around 6.25-6.5/10 in normie range with good pheno that could halo and inflate your rating. That should get you a wide range of solid MTBs (w good bodies) and/or ethnics that are slightly higher. Good for LTR success because looksmatched and you're good enough for her to not want to do better. Normie ratings will inflate your rating to a 7 if good height. Similarly height will inflate your SMV too and makes it easier to achieve higher SMV when face is lower

Thereafter meeting looks threshold, height, frame, and an above average dick etc. are just multipliers. I'm biased but I think you will have wider appeal meeting the looks threshold than being average face and having multipliers because only a minority of women are more into pure height + frame etc. > face and most of the time not even for LTRs, just for slaying (slaying is not my interest). That's why blacks can slay even with meh faces because of penile and height, frame halos/reputation, but are harder to LTR

Discussion is nuanced, never ending. Just meet the looks threshold. And if good height, then make use of it and meet the looks threshold as much as you can for it to be a genuine halo on your face. I'm sure you'd not want to slay just because of height, body. Your looks is your life, personality, self-esteem. Improve it, and take advantage of good height for career, and general treatment from men and women alike

As for normie height, where the guy passes the height threshold, then height doesn't matter if they go LTR after threshold. For slaying better face and higher PSL will be needed to compensate with lesser height. More will always be better in women's eyes (think that hinge study where 6'6 was ideal) but it doesn't mean that you can't be happy and she can't be happy with you if you lack these attractiveness/appeal multipliers... so as long as you do what? Meet the looks threshold. Oh, and also going for your looksmatches PSL-wise, appeal-wise, ethnicity or pheno-wise to lock them in. You could get above your looksmatch in an LTR and she could be happy depending on location. Harder for this in the west though...

 

[Deleted member 19798]

I think the reason why we keep having the same thread every week is because it is not binary and never will be. Why? There will always be multiple factors in such discussions - if one is to understand the blackpill in its entirety then it needs to account for every nuance and every situation relative to other factors with a grounding in looks theory and its elements (dimorphism, averageness, pheno).

Threads as such will always be diminutive in what they are trying to achieve since every factor is not taken into account by every person in these discussions and is hard to do so because there are always pieces of the puzzle that you're trying to learn. Most people tend to orient these discussions towards mogging or slaying

But it can't just be recessed 22% bf 15-year-olds with Maher avis discussing the scope of height vs face in regards to slaying only and then going "height matters", but others with LTR orientation or older users with real life experience, giving their input and then these vague back-and-forths

There are so, so many factors. For example:

• Pheno
• Race
• Pheno/racial biases or stereotypes
• PSL: objective aesthetic rating
• Appeal vs aesthetic
  • For instance, Barrett or DePoot having insanely high PSL but there are guys with less PSL but more appeal. This also is linked with pheno and soft features, etc. PSL scale, someone can be 4.25 PSL but a good pheno which can give them good appeal. Appeal, then, is also amplified by halos (of which a subcategory is height and to an extent, noticeable frame). Exposure effect also increases appeal, as does aura/personality. Exposure effect is also more likely in social circles, which... tends to increase success rate on average if one's NT and such
• SMV vs appeal (vs aesthetic)
  • SMV (usually for slaying) can be high even being 4.25 PSL, think 6/10. Whereas Barrett may be 7 PSL but have an SMV of 9 only. It's not going to be directly proportional. This comes down to pheno/race, halos (including height here + good body etc), status too
  • PSL on average just secures a good base for LTRs or slaying but doesn't give one a directly proportionally higher SMV or appeal than someone who's closer to 4 PSL than to 5.5
• Halos
  • Embrace the Niko smilepill
• LTR or Slaying?
• Status pill
• Frame, muscle insertions
• Facial dimorphism, including adiposity etc.
• Exposure effect (better for LTRs)
  • Social circles
  • NTness and personality
• Type of women you're seeking out
  • How NT are you, how much are you even trying to seek out?
  • What are you trying to seek out? Slays or LTR?
  • Looksmatch range or no?
  • Ethnic or phenomatch?
  • Nichemaxxed?
  • Their personal preferences?
  • Country, region, culture (French = more promicuous, blackpilled etc. EE = girls higher PSL, etc etc.)
  • Personal preferences: biological markers, or dimorphism
  • Impact of personality on them i.e. exposure effect once you meet their looks threshold
• What the woman's own preferences are
  • Culture dependent, again
  • LTR or slays? Degenerate or modest?
  • Depth and LTR-oriented or dates down for ego, thinks she can keep doing better etc.
  • Where she leans
    • i.e. dimorphic men
    • prettier men with dimorphic traits
    • SMV > face
    • appeal > aesthetic
    • cute vs hot
    • average men (self aware of looksmatch) although this is rarer
    • dates down facially for security of mate, but would like a "tall, ugly guy" because she still gets her biological needs met
    • her value placed on face vs. other biological markers i.e. penis, frame, height etc.
      • some value those more than face because of dating down, securing mate for LTR etc. different priorities, y'know
  • Re: LTR - How she was raised and what she finds matters to her based on her values i.e. can compromise some height if personality is good, body/frame is good, face is decent

In some regions or places there are 190cm KHHVs that have 3.75 or 4 PSL faces and meh or shit pheno. In others they are slaying. It's not binary. 4PSL 190cm guy can slay in a decent area with passing pheno or if white, on certain dating apps like hinge

Bottom line? What's important is meeting looks threshold. That tends to be 4.5-4.75 PSL, around 6.25-6.5/10 in normie range with good pheno that could halo and inflate your rating. That should get you a wide range of solid MTBs (w good bodies) and/or ethnics that are slightly higher. Good for LTR success because looksmatched and you're good enough for her to not want to do better. Normie ratings will inflate your rating to a 7 if good height. Similarly height will inflate your SMV too and makes it easier to achieve higher SMV when face is lower

Thereafter meeting looks threshold, height, frame, and an above average dick etc. are just multipliers. I'm biased but I think you will have wider appeal meeting the looks threshold than being average face and having multipliers because only a minority of women are more into pure height + frame etc. > face and most of the time not even for LTRs, just for slaying (slaying is not my interest). That's why blacks can slay even with meh faces because of penile and height, frame halos/reputation, but are harder to LTR

Discussion is nuanced, never ending. Just meet the looks threshold. And if good height, then make use of it and meet the looks threshold as much as you can for it to be a genuine halo on your face. I'm sure you'd not want to slay just because of height, body. Your looks is your life, personality, self-esteem. Improve it, and take advantage of good height for career, and general treatment from men and women alike

As for normie height, where the guy passes the height threshold, then height doesn't matter if they go LTR after threshold. For slaying better face and higher PSL will be needed to compensate with lesser height. More will always be better in women's eyes (think that hinge study where 6'6 was ideal) but it doesn't mean that you can't be happy and she can't be happy with you if you lack these attractiveness/appeal multipliers... so as long as you do what? Meet the looks threshold. Oh, and also going for your looksmatches PSL-wise, appeal-wise, ethnicity or pheno-wise to lock them in. You could get above your looksmatch in an LTR and she could be happy depending on location. Harder for this in the west though...

Mirin high effort for just a reply

 

[Xangsane]

I think the reason why we keep having the same thread every week is because it is not binary and never will be. Why? There will always be multiple factors in such discussions - if one is to understand the blackpill in its entirety then it needs to account for every nuance and every situation relative to other factors with a grounding in looks theory and its elements (dimorphism, averageness, pheno).

Threads as such will always be diminutive in what they are trying to achieve since every factor is not taken into account by every person in these discussions and is hard to do so because there are always pieces of the puzzle that you're trying to learn. Most people tend to orient these discussions towards mogging or slaying

But it can't just be recessed 22% bf 15-year-olds with Maher avis discussing the scope of height vs face in regards to slaying only and then going "height matters", but others with LTR orientation or older users with real life experience, giving their input and then these vague back-and-forths

There are so, so many factors. For example:

• Pheno
• Race
• Pheno/racial biases or stereotypes
• PSL: objective aesthetic rating
• Appeal vs aesthetic
  • For instance, Barrett or DePoot having insanely high PSL but there are guys with less PSL but more appeal. This also is linked with pheno and soft features, etc. PSL scale, someone can be 4.25 PSL but a good pheno which can give them good appeal. Appeal, then, is also amplified by halos (of which a subcategory is height and to an extent, noticeable frame). Exposure effect also increases appeal, as does aura/personality. Exposure effect is also more likely in social circles, which... tends to increase success rate on average if one's NT and such
• SMV vs appeal (vs aesthetic)
  • SMV (usually for slaying) can be high even being 4.25 PSL, think 6/10. Whereas Barrett may be 7 PSL but have an SMV of 9 only. It's not going to be directly proportional. This comes down to pheno/race, halos (including height here + good body etc), status too
  • PSL on average just secures a good base for LTRs or slaying but doesn't give one a directly proportionally higher SMV or appeal than someone who's closer to 4 PSL than to 5.5
• Halos
  • Embrace the Niko smilepill
• LTR or Slaying?
• Status pill
• Frame, muscle insertions
• Facial dimorphism, including adiposity etc.
• Exposure effect (better for LTRs)
  • Social circles
  • NTness and personality
• Type of women you're seeking out
  • How NT are you, how much are you even trying to seek out?
  • What are you trying to seek out? Slays or LTR?
  • Looksmatch range or no?
  • Ethnic or phenomatch?
  • Nichemaxxed?
  • Their personal preferences?
  • Country, region, culture (French = more promicuous, blackpilled etc. EE = girls higher PSL, etc etc.)
  • Personal preferences: biological markers, or dimorphism
  • Impact of personality on them i.e. exposure effect once you meet their looks threshold
• What the woman's own preferences are
  • Culture dependent, again
  • LTR or slays? Degenerate or modest?
  • Depth and LTR-oriented or dates down for ego, thinks she can keep doing better etc.
  • Where she leans
    • i.e. dimorphic men
    • prettier men with dimorphic traits
    • SMV > face
    • appeal > aesthetic
    • cute vs hot
    • average men (self aware of looksmatch) although this is rarer
    • dates down facially for security of mate, but would like a "tall, ugly guy" because she still gets her biological needs met
    • her value placed on face vs. other biological markers i.e. penis, frame, height etc.
      • some value those more than face because of dating down, securing mate for LTR etc. different priorities, y'know
  • Re: LTR - How she was raised and what she finds matters to her based on her values i.e. can compromise some height if personality is good, body/frame is good, face is decent

In some regions or places there are 190cm KHHVs that have 3.75 or 4 PSL faces and meh or shit pheno. In others they are slaying. It's not binary. 4PSL 190cm guy can slay in a decent area with passing pheno or if white, on certain dating apps like hinge

Bottom line? What's important is meeting looks threshold. That tends to be 4.5-4.75 PSL, around 6.25-6.5/10 in normie range with good pheno that could halo and inflate your rating. That should get you a wide range of solid MTBs (w good bodies) and/or ethnics that are slightly higher. Good for LTR success because looksmatched and you're good enough for her to not want to do better. Normie ratings will inflate your rating to a 7 if good height. Similarly height will inflate your SMV too and makes it easier to achieve higher SMV when face is lower

Thereafter meeting looks threshold, height, frame, and an above average dick etc. are just multipliers. I'm biased but I think you will have wider appeal meeting the looks threshold than being average face and having multipliers because only a minority of women are more into pure height + frame etc. > face and most of the time not even for LTRs, just for slaying (slaying is not my interest). That's why blacks can slay even with meh faces because of penile and height, frame halos/reputation, but are harder to LTR

Discussion is nuanced, never ending. Just meet the looks threshold. And if good height, then make use of it and meet the looks threshold as much as you can for it to be a genuine halo on your face. I'm sure you'd not want to slay just because of height, body. Your looks is your life, personality, self-esteem. Improve it, and take advantage of good height for career, and general treatment from men and women alike

As for normie height, where the guy passes the height threshold, then height doesn't matter if they go LTR after threshold. For slaying better face and higher PSL will be needed to compensate with lesser height. More will always be better in women's eyes (think that hinge study where 6'6 was ideal) but it doesn't mean that you can't be happy and she can't be happy with you if you lack these attractiveness/appeal multipliers... so as long as you do what? Meet the looks threshold. Oh, and also going for your looksmatches PSL-wise, appeal-wise, ethnicity or pheno-wise to lock them in. You could get above your looksmatch in an LTR and she could be happy depending on location. Harder for this in the west though...

Very good actually. Why don't you make a thread about this?

 

[fruitgunpop]

I think the reason why we keep having the same thread every week is because it is not binary and never will be. Why? There will always be multiple factors in such discussions - if one is to understand the blackpill in its entirety then it needs to account for every nuance and every situation relative to other factors with a grounding in looks theory and its elements (dimorphism, averageness, pheno).

Threads as such will always be diminutive in what they are trying to achieve since every factor is not taken into account by every person in these discussions and is hard to do so because there are always pieces of the puzzle that you're trying to learn. Most people tend to orient these discussions towards mogging or slaying

But it can't just be recessed 22% bf 15-year-olds with Maher avis discussing the scope of height vs face in regards to slaying only and then going "height matters", but others with LTR orientation or older users with real life experience, giving their input and then these vague back-and-forths

There are so, so many factors. For example:

• Pheno
• Race
• Pheno/racial biases or stereotypes
• PSL: objective aesthetic rating
• Appeal vs aesthetic
  • For instance, Barrett or DePoot having insanely high PSL but there are guys with less PSL but more appeal. This also is linked with pheno and soft features, etc. PSL scale, someone can be 4.25 PSL but a good pheno which can give them good appeal. Appeal, then, is also amplified by halos (of which a subcategory is height and to an extent, noticeable frame). Exposure effect also increases appeal, as does aura/personality. Exposure effect is also more likely in social circles, which... tends to increase success rate on average if one's NT and such
• SMV vs appeal (vs aesthetic)
  • SMV (usually for slaying) can be high even being 4.25 PSL, think 6/10. Whereas Barrett may be 7 PSL but have an SMV of 9 only. It's not going to be directly proportional. This comes down to pheno/race, halos (including height here + good body etc), status too
  • PSL on average just secures a good base for LTRs or slaying but doesn't give one a directly proportionally higher SMV or appeal than someone who's closer to 4 PSL than to 5.5
• Halos
  • Embrace the Niko smilepill
• LTR or Slaying?
• Status pill
• Frame, muscle insertions
• Facial dimorphism, including adiposity etc.
• Exposure effect (better for LTRs)
  • Social circles
  • NTness and personality
• Type of women you're seeking out
  • How NT are you, how much are you even trying to seek out?
  • What are you trying to seek out? Slays or LTR?
  • Looksmatch range or no?
  • Ethnic or phenomatch?
  • Nichemaxxed?
  • Their personal preferences?
  • Country, region, culture (French = more promicuous, blackpilled etc. EE = girls higher PSL, etc etc.)
  • Personal preferences: biological markers, or dimorphism
  • Impact of personality on them i.e. exposure effect once you meet their looks threshold
• What the woman's own preferences are
  • Culture dependent, again
  • LTR or slays? Degenerate or modest?
  • Depth and LTR-oriented or dates down for ego, thinks she can keep doing better etc.
  • Where she leans
    • i.e. dimorphic men
    • prettier men with dimorphic traits
    • SMV > face
    • appeal > aesthetic
    • cute vs hot
    • average men (self aware of looksmatch) although this is rarer
    • dates down facially for security of mate, but would like a "tall, ugly guy" because she still gets her biological needs met
    • her value placed on face vs. other biological markers i.e. penis, frame, height etc.
      • some value those more than face because of dating down, securing mate for LTR etc. different priorities, y'know
  • Re: LTR - How she was raised and what she finds matters to her based on her values i.e. can compromise some height if personality is good, body/frame is good, face is decent

In some regions or places there are 190cm KHHVs that have 3.75 or 4 PSL faces and meh or shit pheno. In others they are slaying. It's not binary. 4PSL 190cm guy can slay in a decent area with passing pheno or if white, on certain dating apps like hinge

Bottom line? What's important is meeting looks threshold. That tends to be 4.5-4.75 PSL, around 6.25-6.5/10 in normie range with good pheno that could halo and inflate your rating. That should get you a wide range of solid MTBs (w good bodies) and/or ethnics that are slightly higher. Good for LTR success because looksmatched and you're good enough for her to not want to do better. Normie ratings will inflate your rating to a 7 if good height. Similarly height will inflate your SMV too and makes it easier to achieve higher SMV when face is lower

Thereafter meeting looks threshold, height, frame, and an above average dick etc. are just multipliers. I'm biased but I think you will have wider appeal meeting the looks threshold than being average face and having multipliers because only a minority of women are more into pure height + frame etc. > face and most of the time not even for LTRs, just for slaying (slaying is not my interest). That's why blacks can slay even with meh faces because of penile and height, frame halos/reputation, but are harder to LTR

Discussion is nuanced, never ending. Just meet the looks threshold. And if good height, then make use of it and meet the looks threshold as much as you can for it to be a genuine halo on your face. I'm sure you'd not want to slay just because of height, body. Your looks is your life, personality, self-esteem. Improve it, and take advantage of good height for career, and general treatment from men and women alike

As for normie height, where the guy passes the height threshold, then height doesn't matter if they go LTR after threshold. For slaying better face and higher PSL will be needed to compensate with lesser height. More will always be better in women's eyes (think that hinge study where 6'6 was ideal) but it doesn't mean that you can't be happy and she can't be happy with you if you lack these attractiveness/appeal multipliers... so as long as you do what? Meet the looks threshold. Oh, and also going for your looksmatches PSL-wise, appeal-wise, ethnicity or pheno-wise to lock them in. You could get above your looksmatch in an LTR and she could be happy depending on location. Harder for this in the west though...

Truly the one and only high IQ post I've read in these dumbo height v face discussions

 

[Deleted member 22540]

If you're taller 5'5 you're already can slay. There's a dude in my college who shorter than me and he have same height as his classmate girl (5'2 or something) and he still gets female attention

 

[ToTheTop]

If you reach some height then only face matters. Most guys I know from school, high school, university have good looking face and average or just above avarage height (5'9-6'1). I have 3 friends who are very tall 6'5-6'6 and they do not have attention from girls because they are like LTN facially (two of them have horse face).

I am barely and even less than 6 foots and skinny af and had 9 girlfriends in my 22 years of life due to fact girls have been complimenting my lips, eyes, hair.
If I had been taller I would have had even more attractive in girls eyes but combo tall height and good looking face are very rare in daily life.

I still do not know why many users here cope about height and muscles if enormous part of attractiveness comes from face. Being tall is only beneficial if you have good looking face.

This is why leanmaxxing is #1 looksmax and always will be as it makes your face look it's best assuming you have good bones.

Face will always be first, but that doesn't detract from the fact that other things will boost your SMV (they just don't replace it). If you workout consistently, your physique will make you more attractive, plus your face will look healthier and improve your psl.

 

[Ultravisionary Bism]

If you reach some height then only face matters. Most guys I know from school, high school, university have good looking face and average or just above avarage height (5'9-6'1). I have 3 friends who are very tall 6'5-6'6 and they do not have attention from girls because they are like LTN facially (two of them have horse face).

I am barely and even less than 6 foots and skinny af and had 9 girlfriends in my 22 years of life due to fact girls have been complimenting my lips, eyes, hair.
If I had been taller I would have had even more attractive in girls eyes but combo tall height and good looking face are very rare in daily life.

I still do not know why many users here cope about height and muscles if enormous part of attractiveness comes from face. Being tall is only beneficial if you have good looking face.

Bluepilled cope

 

[ToTheTop]

Bluepilled cope

I literally just said face is the most important factor, read again bro.

 

[Ultravisionary Bism]

Guess what man giga tall Tyrone mogs u by getting hundrets of stacies in just a month.

 

[Ultravisionary Bism]

I literally just said face is the most important factor, read again bro.

Yeah bluepilled cope

 

[yuyu]

Very good actually. Why don't you make a thread about this?

Thanks bhai . Will do actually, soon - after I get somewhere with ascension and can make sense of this all objectively enough i.e. breaking down SMV, appeal vs PSL, halos w/ threshold and IRL treatment etc. to render intellectualizing it fruitful enough compared to real world experiences. Else it's just schizo tales from my mum's basement

Think it should be helpful as a post though especially for fellow graycels because I don't think LTN-HTN scale is accurate enough in ratings sub and PSL overinflation subsequently, or underrating because it doesn't fit PSL etc. Distorts what some guys could get especially because of pheno-centric bias in relation to slaying in the West etc. and some rot here to the point where it outweighs the benefits mentally masturbating surgeries etc. and not maximizing unique softmaxxes or fully understanding their facial structure

Still new here, just been lurking for 6 odd months. Might need an accurate rate from someone but don't know whom apart from @Pakicel (seems nuanced and very good at structure, ratios) and Ravi for all his autism is very high IQ . Apart from that don't really know good raters, lots of half-assed ones in Ratings. Your mum seems a rather good rater of watches on penises though

 

[Tasty17]

L Thread. Tall men get always girls, but short men with nice face not necessary. It's about biology. Women want men who can protect them. Short mfs protecting nobody. Height > face

 

[MakinItHappenReturn]

Yo wigga this is the face rating section dont make me thump your face in

 

[OneTwoThree]

L Thread. Tall men get always girls, but short men with nice face not necessary. It's about biology. Women want men who can protect them. Short mfs protecting nobody. Height > face

Nowadays women want pretty boys who are not tall usually.

 

[OneTwoThree]

Yo wigga this is the face rating section dont make me thump your face in

Sorry bro. You are right.

 

[Verse]

I think the reason why we keep having the same thread every week is because it is not binary and never will be. Why? There will always be multiple factors in such discussions - if one is to understand the blackpill in its entirety then it needs to account for every nuance and every situation relative to other factors with a grounding in looks theory and its elements (dimorphism, averageness, pheno).

Threads as such will always be diminutive in what they are trying to achieve since every factor is not taken into account by every person in these discussions and is hard to do so because there are always pieces of the puzzle that you're trying to learn. Most people tend to orient these discussions towards mogging or slaying

But it can't just be recessed 22% bf 15-year-olds with Maher avis discussing the scope of height vs face in regards to slaying only and then going "height matters", but others with LTR orientation or older users with real life experience, giving their input and then these vague back-and-forths

There are so, so many factors. For example:

• Pheno
• Race
• Pheno/racial biases or stereotypes
• PSL: objective aesthetic rating
• Appeal vs aesthetic
  • For instance, Barrett or DePoot having insanely high PSL but there are guys with less PSL but more appeal. This also is linked with pheno and soft features, etc. PSL scale, someone can be 4.25 PSL but a good pheno which can give them good appeal. Appeal, then, is also amplified by halos (of which a subcategory is height and to an extent, noticeable frame). Exposure effect also increases appeal, as does aura/personality. Exposure effect is also more likely in social circles, which... tends to increase success rate on average if one's NT and such
• SMV vs appeal (vs aesthetic)
  • SMV (usually for slaying) can be high even being 4.25 PSL, think 6/10. Whereas Barrett may be 7 PSL but have an SMV of 9 only. It's not going to be directly proportional. This comes down to pheno/race, halos (including height here + good body etc), status too
  • PSL on average just secures a good base for LTRs or slaying but doesn't give one a directly proportionally higher SMV or appeal than someone who's closer to 4 PSL than to 5.5
• Halos
  • Embrace the Niko smilepill
• LTR or Slaying?
• Status pill
• Frame, muscle insertions
• Facial dimorphism, including adiposity etc.
• Exposure effect (better for LTRs)
  • Social circles
  • NTness and personality
• Type of women you're seeking out
  • How NT are you, how much are you even trying to seek out?
  • What are you trying to seek out? Slays or LTR?
  • Looksmatch range or no?
  • Ethnic or phenomatch?
  • Nichemaxxed?
  • Their personal preferences?
  • Country, region, culture (French = more promicuous, blackpilled etc. EE = girls higher PSL, etc etc.)
  • Personal preferences: biological markers, or dimorphism
  • Impact of personality on them i.e. exposure effect once you meet their looks threshold
• What the woman's own preferences are
  • Culture dependent, again
  • LTR or slays? Degenerate or modest?
  • Depth and LTR-oriented or dates down for ego, thinks she can keep doing better etc.
  • Where she leans
    • i.e. dimorphic men
    • prettier men with dimorphic traits
    • SMV > face
    • appeal > aesthetic
    • cute vs hot
    • average men (self aware of looksmatch) although this is rarer
    • dates down facially for security of mate, but would like a "tall, ugly guy" because she still gets her biological needs met
    • her value placed on face vs. other biological markers i.e. penis, frame, height etc.
      • some value those more than face because of dating down, securing mate for LTR etc. different priorities, y'know
  • Re: LTR - How she was raised and what she finds matters to her based on her values i.e. can compromise some height if personality is good, body/frame is good, face is decent

In some regions or places there are 190cm KHHVs that have 3.75 or 4 PSL faces and meh or shit pheno. In others they are slaying. It's not binary. 4PSL 190cm guy can slay in a decent area with passing pheno or if white, on certain dating apps like hinge

Bottom line? What's important is meeting looks threshold. That tends to be 4.5-4.75 PSL, around 6.25-6.5/10 in normie range with good pheno that could halo and inflate your rating. That should get you a wide range of solid MTBs (w good bodies) and/or ethnics that are slightly higher. Good for LTR success because looksmatched and you're good enough for her to not want to do better. Normie ratings will inflate your rating to a 7 if good height. Similarly height will inflate your SMV too and makes it easier to achieve higher SMV when face is lower

Thereafter meeting looks threshold, height, frame, and an above average dick etc. are just multipliers. I'm biased but I think you will have wider appeal meeting the looks threshold than being average face and having multipliers because only a minority of women are more into pure height + frame etc. > face and most of the time not even for LTRs, just for slaying (slaying is not my interest). That's why blacks can slay even with meh faces because of penile and height, frame halos/reputation, but are harder to LTR

Discussion is nuanced, never ending. Just meet the looks threshold. And if good height, then make use of it and meet the looks threshold as much as you can for it to be a genuine halo on your face. I'm sure you'd not want to slay just because of height, body. Your looks is your life, personality, self-esteem. Improve it, and take advantage of good height for career, and general treatment from men and women alike

As for normie height, where the guy passes the height threshold, then height doesn't matter if they go LTR after threshold. For slaying better face and higher PSL will be needed to compensate with lesser height. More will always be better in women's eyes (think that hinge study where 6'6 was ideal) but it doesn't mean that you can't be happy and she can't be happy with you if you lack these attractiveness/appeal multipliers... so as long as you do what? Meet the looks threshold. Oh, and also going for your looksmatches PSL-wise, appeal-wise, ethnicity or pheno-wise to lock them in. You could get above your looksmatch in an LTR and she could be happy depending on location. Harder for this in the west though...

high IQ response I read half of it

 

[Xangsane]

Thanks bhai . Will do actually, soon - after I get somewhere with ascension and can make sense of this all objectively enough i.e. breaking down SMV, appeal vs PSL, halos w/ threshold and IRL treatment etc. to render intellectualizing it fruitful enough compared to real world experiences. Else it's just schizo tales from my mum's basement

Think it should be helpful as a post though especially for fellow graycels because I don't think LTN-HTN scale is accurate enough in ratings sub and PSL overinflation subsequently, or underrating because it doesn't fit PSL etc. Distorts what some guys could get especially because of pheno-centric bias in relation to slaying in the West etc. and some rot here to the point where it outweighs the benefits mentally masturbating surgeries etc. and not maximizing unique softmaxxes or fully understanding their facial structure

Still new here, just been lurking for 6 odd months. Might need an accurate rate from someone but don't know whom apart from @Pakicel (seems nuanced and very good at structure, ratios) and Ravi for all his autism is very high IQ . Apart from that don't really know good raters, lots of half-assed ones in Ratings. Your mum seems a rather good rater of watches on penises though

I caged at the last sentence.

 

[makeme183]

I have 3 friends who are very tall 6'5-6'6 and they do not have attention from girls because they are like LTN facially (two of them have horse face).

Can confirm this , all my 6'+ friends are virgins

I am barely and even less than 6 foots

how tall are you exactly

had 9 girlfriends in my 22 years of life

wtf are you doing here then ?

Being tall is only beneficial if you have good looking face.

very true,but there's a small minority of girls(like 10%),who will sleep with any guy as long as he is tall(6'4 and up only)
the good thing is,those types of girls are sub 5 themselves

 

[OneTwoThree]

Can confirm this , all my 6'+ friends are virgins

how tall are you exactly

wtf are you doing here then ?

very true,but there's a small minority of girls(like 10%),who will sleep with any guy as long as he is tall(6'4 and up only)
the good thing is,those types of girls are sub 5 themselves

I am 182/183 cm. Tbh I do not know what I am doing here hah. I found this site accidentally.

 

[Deleted member 23530]

4.5-4.75 PSL

4*

 

[Growth Plate]

Dumb thread, even if a 5'8 Chad doesn't show it, he is and will always be envious of the 6'4 LTN

jfl

5'8.5" colton haynes

vs some 6'4" LTN (below average face)

I wonder who gets treated better, lives a better life, gets pretty privilege fucked prime jbs in highschool, and has more sex


obviously coltlon haynes even if the 6'4" guy was a mid tier normie

statistically colton's face alone is much rarer and more special than being a 6'4" average faced guy. just another tall regular looking guy. being beautiful makes a bigger difference to your life than being taller

short cute child = pretty privilege
tall ugly man = seen as a predator

now if we were talking about a 6'4" htn. that's a different story and a good question

 

[Deleted member 22190]

jfl

5'8.5" colton haynes

View attachment 1939344


vs some 6'4" LTN (below average face)

I wonder who gets treated better, lives a better life, gets pretty privilege fucked prime jbs in highschool, and has more sex
View attachment 1939347

obviously coltlon haynes even if the 6'4" guy was a mid tier normie

statistically colton's face alone is much rarer and more special than being a 6'4" average faced guy. just another tall regular looking guy. being beautiful makes a bigger difference to your life than being taller

short cute child = pretty privilege
tall ugly man = seen as a predator

now if we were talking about a 6'4" htn. that's a different story and a good question

The LTN can still do various things to looksmaxx

Airforce shoes/lifts
Gym
Fashion
A few light/non expensive surgeries

I hold by my point tbh.

Who do you think is going to mog harder in a club? While Chad tries to talk to women, the now HTN-Chadlite just shoves him aside and mogs everything he tries to do with his massive fucking height and body.

The Chad is literally going to look like a fucking kid in front of him and kill his sexual dimorphism, and pray to God he doesn't get the reputation as an overcompensating manlet either

 

[Growth Plate]

The LTN can still do various things to looksmaxx

Airforce shoes/lifts
Gym
Fashion
A few light/non expensive surgeries

I hold by my point tbh.

Who do you think is going to mog harder in a club? While Chad tries to talk to women, the now HTN-Chadlite just shoves him aside and mogs everything he tries to do with his massive fucking height and body.

The Chad is literally going to look like a fucking kid in front of him and kill his sexual dimorphism, and pray to God he doesn't get the reputation as an overcompensating manlet either

You can't get surgeries in childhood, middle school and highschool

The way you're treated and oppurtunites you're granted in your childhood, middle school and hoghschool due to your looks determines your brain chemistry for your entire life

Nothing is more special than jb pussy. 6'4" LTN gets rejected by jbs in school. 5'8.5" Colton Haynes is almost average height and jbs get obsessed with him

I wear lifts to school everyday. 5'8.5" colton in hs can reach avg height with them but it's not even necessary since he's not that short and he's chad

Jfl at disagreeing with this

 

[Prettyboy]

No one takes seriously manlets starting from college, even if they have above average faces. And it gets worse with every passing year

You are kidding yourself if you think there’s a shortage of good looking tall guys

 

[Deleted member 22190]

You can't get surgeries in childhood, middle school and highschool

The way you're treated and oppurtunites you're granted in your childhood, middle school and hoghschool due to your looks determines your brain chemistry for your entire life

Nothing is more special than jb pussy. 6'4" LTN gets rejected by jbs in school. 5'8.5" Colton Haynes is almost average height and jbs get obsessed with him

I wear lifts to school everyday. 5'8.5" colton in hs can reach avg height with them but it's not even necessary since he's not that short and he's chad

Jfl at disagreeing with this

Just cause he can't get light surgeries doesn't mean he can't looksmax jfl where are you trying to go with this

He will still be made into a HTN with all of what I said before, and assuming he's still developing he can mew as well.

The 'LTN' will be way more successful than the 5'8 Chad at that point, cuz he still has multiple things he can use.

The 6'4 guy will get accepted by women LMAO. Idk WHERE you live, but the heightpill is law pretty much everywhere.

Who is going to get taken more serious in a job interview? A 5'8 manlet or a 6'4+ muscular mogger?

 

[chadmanlet04]

I'm 5'5 with a HTN face and I get laid every once in a blue moon tbh, takes a lot of effort.

 

[Growth Plate]

He will still be made into a HTN with all of what I said before, and assuming he's still developing he can mew as well.

The stuff you said other than surgeries doesn't improve his face. He still is facially LTN and facially below average. Girls would just try to at least go for a tall average faced guy instead. A below average face is ugly and just that disgusting to girls

Post what you think a LTN is

Bro said mewing jfl. Mewing isn't gonna fix a LTN face

A 5'8 manlet or a 6'4+ muscular mogger?

5'8" manlet chad got jb pussy in his prime years and pretty privilege solely off face. The most important things in life

 

[Growth Plate]

Who is going to get taken more serious in a job interview? A 5'8 manlet or a 6'4+ muscular mogger?

Pretty privilege and height halo are both advantageous in getting hired

 

[Deleted member 22190]

The stuff you said other than surgeries doesn't improve his face. He still is facially LTN and facially below average. Girls would just try to at least go for a tall average faced guy instead. A below average face is ugly and just that disgusting to girls

Post what you think a LTN is

Bro said mewing jfl. Mewing isn't gonna fix a LTN face

5'8" manlet chad got jb pussy in his prime years and pretty privilege solely off face. The most important things in life

Going to the gym and getting leaner does improve your face LOL, and mewing does work, don't cope.

Women would be repulsed by an manlet even with a 'good' face, even if you ascend at 5'6-5'8 women are still going to be avoidant of you because of your terrible height, and WOULD go for a better framed taller man

As I said, who would do better in a club?

Pretty privilege and height halo are both advantageous in getting hired

Who would DO better if you compared the two? An overcompensating manlet, or a 6'6 massive human being? Even if you're a Chad and short, you will never be taken seriously in nearly any category in life.

 

[Growth Plate]

Going to the gym and getting leaner does improve your face LOL, and mewing does work, don't cope.

Yeah if you're a fatass then going to the gym and getting leaner would make an impressive difference to your face jfl but if you're normal weight it's not going to make a LTN's face attractive

Saying that getting leaner would ascend a LTN's face assumes that he doesn't have shit Tristyn lee facial bloating genes and assumes that the facial flaws that make him LTN would get fixed by leaning out

Mewing doesn't work the age most ppl find out about it at least. I started mewing at early 15 (when I joined the forum) and I'm 17 now and nothing changed

Regarding everything else you said, I have to see a pic of your definition of a low tier normie

Regarding the dating success of a 5'8" chad vs a 6'4" softmaxxed MID tier normie, I would rather be a 6'4" softmaxxed mtn to garner both the dopamine of being gl and tall

But I'd rather be a 5'8" chad than a 6'4" ltn. Having an ugly face is just something I can't live with. Being at least average is acceptable

 

[edodalic29]

No one takes seriously manlets starting from college, even if they have above average faces. And it gets worse with every passing year

You are kidding yourself if you think there’s a shortage of good looking tall guys

Ideally you want to be a tall prettyboy (MTN - HTN ) with a lean gymaxxed body for ultimate appeal

 

[tallnegga]

Being tall is just an experience of its own. Can’t be replicated by being a 5’8 chad. You feel confident around a 5’8 chad because you feel like you can turn him into your fleshlight