facial forward growth is everything

[the BULL]

do you think any type of chewing will make my ramus / mandible wider at 17 years old? or is it cope?

if you got malleability genes is definitely not cope

 

[It'snotover]

Many users are dumb asf

I know that when mouth protrude usually it means bimax protrusion but i'm not sure honestly. One suggested ASO(extractions) to me.

 

[It'snotover]

do you think any type of chewing will make my ramus / mandible wider at 17 years old? or is it cope?

Posture matter a lot too.

 

[Seth Walsh]

do you think any type of chewing will make my ramus / mandible wider at 17 years old? or is it cope?

No. Chewing too much will hypertrophy your masseters if you chew gum or chisell routinely. Ideally you don't want the masseters flared out because you want the gonions to be the widest part of your just since they are bone. Having muscle flared out wider than the bone is a bad look.

Unless your bigonial width falls out of this range 94.8 - 118.4 mm , you should be fine. Bigonial width is one of those measurements you want to be koinophillicly average, ideally with zygos about 11% wider to create a model-esque hollow cheek look.

I don't think it's actually possible to widen the gonions. Maybe a MSDO (mandibular symphyseal distraction osteogenesis). Very unaesthetic and purposeless surgery though. The mandibular symphysis is like a suture and it closes at age 1.

The biggest benefit of chewing hard foods isn't the masseter hypertrophy, it's actually the tightening of the hyoid muscles in your neck which contract naturally as you chew. Mewing, proper swallowing and slow pressure over time is what will help in some form or another. Especially since you are 17? Mewing will definitely not be cope for you, you'll probably see some insane dento-alveolar changes that'll improve you mentolabial and nasolabial angles. You could probably see some skeletal growth like a CCW rotation and slight maxillary advancement and undereye improvements if you just mew consistently, forever. 17 is too late to grow the mandible with mewing but that definitely happens. Usually in kids under 10-12 when the bones in the face are extremely malleable. The mandible is basically a slave to the maxilla and will adjust with it as long as you don't have malocclusions.

Actual mandibular bone growth with just mewing is possible but tbh you gotta be so young to see results like that. I've seen decent results mewing for the past 4 years (21-25).. Dento-alveolar improvements, widened dental arch, palatal vault is flatter so it's easier to maintain the proper posture, also feel like my maxilla moved a tiny tiny bit forward prolly like 1-2mms , and I noticed slight CCW rotation and a better facial convexity angle. Leanmaxxed over that time too so facial changes are more noticeable.

 

[Seth Walsh]

if you got malleability genes is definitely not cope

Yeah some people's bones are just more malleable. Higher RANKL and Runx2 expression for faster bone remodelling. Some people just have luck on their side. That's why you see some legit mewing changes from people in their mid 20s, coz a small percent will just have osteoblast/osteoclast related genes working as if they were 10 years younger.

 

[incel194012940]

then why am i seen as ugly when I am told I have good forward growth?
i think whatr i need is madison beer nose to go from stragith to sloped

recessed maxilla and under eyes relative to the rest of the face

 

[It'snotover]

Yeah some people's bones are just more malleable. Higher RANKL and Runx2 expression for faster bone remodelling. Some people just have luck on their side. That's why you see some legit mewing changes from people in their mid 20s, coz a small percent will just have osteoblast/osteoclast related genes working as if they were 10 years younger.

I'm 16, i mew since 8 months and seen some results. Do you think that at my age vit d is enough for maxxing my bones development or i should take k2 too?

 

[oatmeal]

I don't see how a strong and protrusive browridge contributes to facial appeal in any way.

part of the upper third which facilitates the growth of the rest of the face

partially why gooks look like shiet

 

[Seth Walsh]

I'm 16, i mew since 8 months and seen some results. Do you think that at my age vit d is enough for maxxing my bones development or i should take k2 too?

I think you should just keep mewing. Depends on if you have normal development already or if you're recessed. I haven't seen your face so idk what to recommend. You could be a perfect candidate for IMDO+LF1 or you might just need to keep mewing, or you could benefit the most from an ortho appliance like vivos DNA or a homeoblock.

It all depends. If your occlusion is normal and you dentofacial development is normal, then you just need to keep good oral posture over a long period of time for the best outcome.

I wouldn't bother taking D3+K2 tbh it's kinda cope in terms of mewing, won't speed up the process of anything.

 

[Seth Walsh]

I'm 16, i mew since 8 months and seen some results. Do you think that at my age vit d is enough for maxxing my bones development or i should take k2 too?

You're lucky as fuck being 16 btw

 

[It'snotover]

I think you should just keep mewing. Depends on if you have normal development already or if you're recessed. I haven't seen your face so idk what to recommend. You could be a perfect candidate for IMDO+LF1 or you might just need to keep mewing, or you could benefit the most from an ortho appliance like vivos DNA or a homeoblock.

It all depends. If your occlusion is normal and you dentofacial development is normal, then you just need to keep good oral posture over a long period of time for the best outcome.

I wouldn't bother taking D3+K2 tbh it's kinda cope in terms of mewing, won't speed up the process of anything.

You seem to have a good knowledge man. Can i pm you?

 

[Seth Walsh]

You seem to have a good knowledge man. Can i pm you?

Sure

 

[ChristianChad]

Forward growth is a must have when appearing on camera
You can have a slightly recessed face with good features that is enough for girls to consider you attractive when they see you in 3D because they will be able to see the depth to your face
On camera having any recession is a giga failo since the depth of your face cannot be truly perceived on a 2d screen
Forward grown fucks with disgusting UEE and other shit features rule to roost online simply because the appear more 3D looking on a 2d screen

front and 3/4 are the most important

 

[stamaster21]

FACE IS KING look at this low tier stacy 52 seconds in BONE CHILLING

 

[Stopping@Nothing19]

then why am i seen as ugly when I am told I have good forward growth?
i think whatr i need is madison beer nose to go from stragith to sloped

good to have you back bro, i think you look uncanny since your jaw extends way past your glabella making it look like you have an underbite

 

[Seth Walsh]

good to have you back bro, i think you look uncanny since your jaw extends way past your glabella making it look like you have an underbite

Looks like he is jutting tbh

 

[alriodai]

No. Chewing too much will hypertrophy your masseters if you chew gum or chisell routinely. Ideally you don't want the masseters flared out because you want the gonions to be the widest part of your just since they are bone. Having muscle flared out wider than the bone is a bad look.

Unless your bigonial width falls out of this range 94.8 - 118.4 mm , you should be fine. Bigonial width is one of those measurements you want to be koinophillicly average, ideally with zygos about 11% wider to create a model-esque hollow cheek look.

I don't think it's actually possible to widen the gonions. Maybe a MSDO (mandibular symphyseal distraction osteogenesis). Very unaesthetic and purposeless surgery though. The mandibular symphysis is like a suture and it closes at age 1.

The biggest benefit of chewing hard foods isn't the masseter hypertrophy, it's actually the tightening of the hyoid muscles in your neck which contract naturally as you chew. Mewing, proper swallowing and slow pressure over time is what will help in some form or another. Especially since you are 17? Mewing will definitely not be cope for you, you'll probably see some insane dento-alveolar changes that'll improve you mentolabial and nasolabial angles. You could probably see some skeletal growth like a CCW rotation and slight maxillary advancement and undereye improvements if you just mew consistently, forever. 17 is too late to grow the mandible with mewing but that definitely happens. Usually in kids under 10-12 when the bones in the face are extremely malleable. The mandible is basically a slave to the maxilla and will adjust with it as long as you don't have malocclusions.

Actual mandibular bone growth with just mewing is possible but tbh you gotta be so young to see results like that. I've seen decent results mewing for the past 4 years (21-25).. Dento-alveolar improvements, widened dental arch, palatal vault is flatter so it's easier to maintain the proper posture, also feel like my maxilla moved a tiny tiny bit forward prolly like 1-2mms , and I noticed slight CCW rotation and a better facial convexity angle. Leanmaxxed over that time too so facial changes are more noticeable.

I want to achieve this gonion look, I already have the same look but my gonions aren't as wider as my cheekbones. They're wide but not in line with my projected wide cheekbones/zygos which don't make me look ideal.

One of my other problems is my side profile:
The lower third of my side profile (from nose to chin) is well projected (my maxilla not that much)
and from my orbitals to my forehead, it seems like it's not projected and forwrard grown at all. And it's an insecurity too


Also do you know chewing with a sports mouthguard will probably achieve the best facial forward growth results: All NFL players and basketball players that have a mouthguard since their teens (16/17) have ideal forward growth and they've been chewing on it. What you think?

 

[Seth Walsh]

View attachment 1831511

I want to achieve this gonion look, I already have the same look but my gonions aren't as wider as my cheekbones. They're wide but not in line with my projected wide cheekbones/zygos which don't make me look ideal.

One of my other problems is my side profile:
The lower third of my side profile (from nose to chin) is well projected (my maxilla not that much)
and from my orbitals to my forehead, it seems like it's not projected and forwrard grown at all. And it's an insecurity too


Also do you know chewing with a sports mouthguard will probably achieve the best facial forward growth results: All NFL players and basketball players that have a mouthguard since their teens (16/17) have ideal forward growth and they've been chewing on it. What you think?

Based on western modelling standards, you don't want a 1:1 bizygo/bigonion ratio. It should be more like 1.1:1, so you can get really nice cheek hollows and an aesthetic ogee curve at very low bodyfat (10-11%). A 1:1 ratio always looks bad when very lean.

The guy in the pic just has flared gonions and a more feminine and angular chin with is just morphogenic. There's nothing you can do surgically or with orthotropics/orthodontics. I know his jaw and chin has the Chalamet look but it's simply not possible to achieve that unless you have it already.

You probably do have the ideal bizygo/bigonion ratio, most European people actually do. After that it's just a matter of getting the bones to show through. But that gonion flaring is very rate and not something surgery can even achieve imo (without messing up harmony)...

Also if you did MSDO to widen the chin and gonions, it'd look bad since you wouldn't be able to keep that feminine, horizontally small chin look, since the MSDO literally widens it.

So basically, that look is something unachievable unless you already have a very feminine chin like the guy. But trust me, wider zygos than gonions is ideal. Hardly anyone has gonial flare like the guy in the pic and although it's striking, it may not harmonise with all faces.

There's probably a lot of guys with the same morphology who look like shit, because the the chin and gonion measurements fall outside of the cephalometric range of averageness.

 

[alriodai]

Based on western modelling standards, you don't want a 1:1 bizygo/bigonion ratio. It should be more like 1.1:1, so you can get really nice cheek hollows and an aesthetic ogee curve at very low bodyfat (10-11%). A 1:1 ratio always looks bad when very lean.

The guy in the pic just has flared gonions and a more feminine and angular chin with is just morphogenic. There's nothing you can do surgically or with orthotropics/orthodontics. I know his jaw and chin has the Chalamet look but it's simply not possible to achieve that unless you have it already.

You probably do have the ideal bizygo/bigonion ratio, most European people actually do. After that it's just a matter of getting the bones to show through. But that gonion flaring is very rate and not something surgery can even achieve imo (without messing up harmony)...

Also if you did MSDO to widen the chin and gonions, it'd look bad since you wouldn't be able to keep that feminine, horizontally small chin look, since the MSDO literally widens it.

So basically, that look is something unachievable unless you already have a very feminine chin like the guy. But trust me, wider zygos than gonions is ideal. Hardly anyone has gonial flare like the guy in the pic and although it's striking, it may not harmonise with all faces.

There's probably a lot of guys with the same morphology who look like shit, because the the chin and gonion measurements fall outside of the cephalometric range of averageness.

Therer's a subject that I wanted to touch on too: Why does some chewing results, the after results gives the illusion of wider gonions? Like does it widen the whole mandible or is just super good masseters insertions?

 

[Seth Walsh]

Therer's a subject that I wanted to touch on too: Why does some chewing results, the after results gives the illusion of wider gonions? Like does it widen the whole mandible or is just super good masseters insertions?

Just makes the masseter muscles bigger. Doesn't affect bone at all. But when you get lean and have the masseters wider than the actual gonion bone, it gives a very uncanny look. That's why I don't see much good in blowing up your masseters just to give the illusion of a wider bigonial distance. Bigonial distance is one of those things you want to be in the average range (think I posted the cephalometric range in a post ITT), too wide is uncanny and you definitely want your cheekbones to be 10-11% wider, assuming you bigonial distance is already cephalometricly average.