Facial Thirds is stupid

[NuclearGeo20]

In facial thirds, people use the middle of the brow bone as the seperator of the top and middle third. This makes the brow bone a confounding factor, and we can't tell if the forhead is truly ideal or not. We can eliminate it all together by using these measurements instead.

Top Third- Hairline to Pupil
Middle Third- Pupil To Subnasal
Lower Third- Subnasal to Pogonion

Me personally I use facial fourths in my analysis, where I seperate the lower third into 2 parts. The top half is fropm the subnasal to mouth. Bottom half is mouth to pogonion. This way I eliminate philtrum and lip length as a variable because some races have bigger lips which means there philtrum will be shorter.

 

[everyone]

So in your formal whats the ideal facial fourths?

 

[NuclearGeo20]

So in your formal whats the ideal facial fourths?

i averaged 26 models. Don't take it as the ideal ratios though because I am still trying to figure out how to calculate facial harmony and which proportions are truly ideal.

Forehead Height/Nasal Height Average- 1.386
Nasal Height/SubNasal to Mouth Average- 2.2808
Subnasal To Mouth/Mouth to Pogonion- .4903

 

[CD34]

Definitely a secondary ratio compared to the others I've always thought so, but it explains some facial harmonies when other ratios (like midface fwhr) are fucked up

 

[everyone]

i averaged 26 models. Don't take it as the ideal ratios though because I am still trying to figure out how to calculate facial harmony and which proportions are truly ideal.

Forehead Height/Nasal Height Average- 1.386
Nasal Height/SubNasal to Mouth Average- 2.2808
Subnasal To Mouth/Mouth to Pogonion- .4903

Okay, well I still dont see why facial thirds are obsolete.

fwhr

What do you think the is problem with fwhr?

 

[NuclearGeo20]

Definitely a secondary ratio compared to the others I've always thought so, but it explains some facial harmonies when other ratios (like midface fwhr) are fucked up

yea fwhr is stupid. There are 3 adjacent features (eyebropw setness to pupil, nasal height, philtrum length) and one horizontal feature (bizygomatic width). It's unrealiable because there are 4 features that all change in different huumans. For example if a person with ideal bizygo width, nasal height, philtrum height has high set eyebrows that could affect his percieved dominance, even if he has the ideal face width for a male. Overall I think the 1 to 10 rating system for attractiveness is kind of baseless. I think we should be rating faces using words like dominant, cute, intense, uncanny instead of using a singular number toi define somebodies facial sexual market value

 

[NuclearGeo20]

yea fwhr is stupid. There are 3 adjacent features (eyebropw setness to pupil, nasal height, philtrum length) and one horizontal feature (bizygomatic width). It's unrealiable because there are 4 features that all change in different huumans. For example if a person with ideal bizygo width, nasal height, philtrum height has high set eyebrows that could affect his percieved dominance, even if he has the ideal face width for a male. Overall I think the 1 to 10 rating system for attractiveness is kind of baseless. I think we should be rating faces using words like dominant, cute, intense, uncanny instead of using a singular number toi define somebodies facial sexual market value

Overall fwhr has a correlation but isn't a one to one cause and affect

 

[CD34]

Okay, well I still dont see why facial thirds are obsolete.



What do you think the is problem with fwhr?

I'm just saying that sometimes the faces seem to be harmonious even when the fwhr is off, and in that case if the thirds are right it would explain why

 

[charliewillascend]

In facial thirds, people use the middle of the brow bone as the seperator of the top and middle third. This makes the brow bone a confounding factor, and we can't tell if the forhead is truly ideal or not. We can eliminate it all together by using these measurements instead.

Top Third- Hairline to Pupil
Middle Third- Pupil To Subnasal
Lower Third- Subnasal to Pogonion

Me personally I use facial fourths in my analysis, where I seperate the lower third into 2 parts. The top half is fropm the subnasal to mouth. Bottom half is mouth to pogonion. This way I eliminate philtrum and lip length as a variable because some races have bigger lips which means there philtrum will be shorter.

I disagree,
The chin has to be with the philtrum, when someone has a long midface it looks way more balanced their philtrum is a large factor.

Proof of this is Ian Somerhalder,
His middle third is so short, and his chin is average height, but his philtrum is so long that it adds lower third height and helps dwarf his middle third making his face actually look compact.

Mirin effort though,
Good upcoming grey

 

[charliewillascend]

I disagree,
The chin has to be with the philtrum, when someone has a long midface it looks way more balanced their philtrum is a large factor.

Proof of this is Ian Somerhalder,
His middle third is so short, and his chin is average height, but his philtrum is so long that it adds lower third height and helps dwarf his middle third making his face actually look compact.

Mirin effort though,
Good upcoming grey

@pfl ,
@druiglooksmaxer ,
@maxlooksmax ,

thoughts????

 

[CD34]

yea fwhr is stupid. There are 3 adjacent features (eyebropw setness to pupil, nasal height, philtrum length) and one horizontal feature (bizygomatic width). It's unrealiable because there are 4 features that all change in different huumans. For example if a person with ideal bizygo width, nasal height, philtrum height has high set eyebrows that could affect his percieved dominance, even if he has the ideal face width for a male. Overall I think the 1 to 10 rating system for attractiveness is kind of baseless. I think we should be rating faces using words like dominant, cute, intense, uncanny instead of using a singular number toi define somebodies facial sexual market value

Cap bro fwhr is top 2 most important harmony overall ratio … bad fwhr = your face look goofy even with good features

 

[CD34]

I disagree,
The chin has to be with the philtrum, when someone has a long midface it looks way more balanced their philtrum is a large factor.

in that case 90% of the time is chin to philtrum that is off ratio tho not thirds

 

[NuclearGeo20]

Okay, well I still dont see why facial thirds are obsolete.



What do you think the is problem with fwhr?

The reason why dacial thirds are bad is because it changes due to eyebrow setness. For example Jon Erik Hexums top third is 33 percent and his middle is 30 percent. But his forehead isnt big by any means. It's just his low set eyebrows that affect the facial thirds. There fore we should use my version of facial thirds/fourths for measuring if the forehead is ideal, then we should use another ratio to measure if the eyebrows are lowset or not

 

[druiglooksmaxer]

@pfl ,
@druiglooksmaxer ,
@maxlooksmax ,

thoughts????

Masculine facial third is law

 

[NuclearGeo20]

Cap bro fwhr is top 2 most important harmony overall ratio … bad fwhr = your face look goofy even with good features

You are not accounting for indivisual features when using one number to measure dominance. For example a person with ideal low set eyuebrows, ideal bizygomatic width, and ideal midface height, but he has a long philtrum. Does that mean his face isn't "dominant" or "ideal" anymore because of one feature. FWHR has too many confounding variables to be considered a good ratio to use in facial analysis

 

[NuclearGeo20]

I disagree,
The chin has to be with the philtrum, when someone has a long midface it looks way more balanced their philtrum is a large factor.

Proof of this is Ian Somerhalder,
His middle third is so short, and his chin is average height, but his philtrum is so long that it adds lower third height and helps dwarf his middle third making his face actually look compact.

Mirin effort though,
Good upcoming grey

I disagree and his philtrum doesn't make his face look more compact. He has the ideal chin length from what I can see also. The reason his face is compact is due to his wide face and short nasal height. If his philtrum was shorter it would make his face appear even more compact. Facial harmony is more complex than you make it out to be

 

[everyone]

For example Jon Erik Hexums top third is 33 percent and his middle is 30 percent

I do agree with that.

then we should use another ratio to measure if the eyebrows are lowset or not

There is a measurement like that created by @6'5 HTN

 

[NuclearGeo20]

I do agree with that.


There is a measurement like that created by @6'5 HTN


View attachment 3691232

That ratio is good. But my overall point is that faical thirds and fwhr are useless in facial analysis due to the many factors that affect the final number.

 

[NuclearGeo20]

I do agree with that.


There is a measurement like that created by @6'5 HTN


View attachment 3691232

For example my face is 1.9 fwhr which is ideal. But I have medium set eyebrows, with close set eyes that make my face appear cute instead of dominant

 

[everyone]

That ratio is good. But my overall point is that faical thirds and fwhr are useless in facial analysis due to the many factors that affect the final number.

Now your saying fwhr is useless?

 

[charliewillascend]

I disagree and his philtrum doesn't make his face look more compact. He has the ideal chin length from what I can see also. The reason his face is compact is due to his wide face and short nasal height. If his philtrum was shorter it would make his face appear even more compact. Facial harmony is more complex than you make it out to be

You didn’t understand what I said.

Of course his face would look more compact if the philtrum was shorter,
But because it’s the philtrum adding height to the midface it doesn’t look as bad as for if it where the nose.
It’s because the philtrum adds height to the lower third, which as we know good facial thirds fraud a long MFR.
This proves that they are facial thirds not whatever you’re saying.
Atleast for the middle third and lower third anyway.


and of course it’s more complex then I’m making out to be, same applies for you aswell.
We will never know the depths of facial harmony

 

[everyone]

For example my face is 1.9 fwhr which is ideal. But I have medium set eyebrows, with close set eyes that make my face appear cute instead of dominant

literally every feature that affects your orbits trend to feminine. maybe your dense brows trend masc that about it.

 

[maxlooksmax]

For example my face is 1.9 fwhr which is ideal. But I have medium set eyebrows, with close set eyes that make my face appear cute instead of dominant

close set eyes trend masc no?

 

[PolisCommov]

High IQ contribution

 

[NuclearGeo20]

close set eyes trend masc no?

In my case, round orbitals and negative canthal tilt, make me look like prey rather than hunter

 

[NuclearGeo20]

High IQ contribution

thx