How much does hardmaxxing actually ascend?

[iblameacne.]

How much does hardmaxxing really ascend someones facial structure, both in 2D and 3D perception?
Are the observed gains based on actual structural improvement (forward growth, facial harmony, soft-tissue enhancement) or mostly frauding (lighting etc) and posture changes post-op?

In other words, how much of the “ascension” after surgical or orthodontic work is visible in neutral lighting and expression, and how much is projection / angle-based?
Is there any reliable way to gauge the visual return of each type of procedure (bite correction, bimax, trimax, implants, etc.)?

My case/question:
i’m around mmtn–hmtn depending on conditions.
Good eye area (except for weak infraorbitals caused by flat maxilla/recessed), decent skull overall, but flat midface caused by recessed maxilla / infras + short lower third caused by a Class 1 deep bite - upper front teeth fully cover lowers, but molars are aligned normally.

I'm working with my ortho to get self ligating braces to fix my deepbite (seemingly best solution, made a previous thread discussing that). Once the deep bite is fixed, the lower third should lengthen and balance the facial thirds more evenly.
Question is: does this kind of correction improve midface projection at all, or does it only elongate vertically without changing the z-axis? I am faily sure this will not change anything, and I plan to hardmax.

Since after correction i suspect my maxilla will still be fucked, would bimax or trimax be the only proper route to achieve forward projection and better midface ? And for people with otherwise good features (eye area, skull, hairline, etc.) but a flat midface - would infraorbital or paranasal implants actually correct the appearance of flatness, or do they just add surface area without fixing the underlying structure?

TLDR; DISCUSSION ON HARDMAX RESULTS (HOW MUCH IT CAN ASCEND ) + PERSONAL CASE, HOW MUCH WILL BIMAX / TRIMAX ASCEND IF I HAVE GOOD FEATURES AND GOOD RATIOS OTHER THAN FLAT MAXILLA (also slightly short lower third due to deepbite tbut being corrected with ortho)

Thanks for reading chuds

 

[mixedpersonalities]

How much does hardmaxxing really ascend someones facial structure, both in 2D and 3D perception?
Are the observed gains based on actual structural improvement (forward growth, facial harmony, soft-tissue enhancement) or mostly frauding (lighting etc) and posture changes post-op?

In other words, how much of the “ascension” after surgical or orthodontic work is visible in neutral lighting and expression, and how much is projection / angle-based?
Is there any reliable way to gauge the visual return of each type of procedure (bite correction, bimax, trimax, implants, etc.)?

My case/question:
i’m around mmtn–hmtn depending on conditions.
Good eye area (except for weak infraorbitals caused by flat maxilla/recessed), decent skull overall, but flat midface caused by recessed maxilla / infras + short lower third caused by a Class 1 deep bite - upper front teeth fully cover lowers, but molars are aligned normally.

I'm working with my ortho to get self ligating braces to fix my deepbite (seemingly best solution, made a previous thread discussing that). Once the deep bite is fixed, the lower third should lengthen and balance the facial thirds more evenly.
Question is: does this kind of correction improve midface projection at all, or does it only elongate vertically without changing the z-axis? I am faily sure this will not change anything, and I plan to hardmax.

Since after correction i suspect my maxilla will still be fucked, would bimax or trimax be the only proper route to achieve forward projection and better midface ? And for people with otherwise good features (eye area, skull, hairline, etc.) but a flat midface - would infraorbital or paranasal implants actually correct the appearance of flatness, or do they just add surface area without fixing the underlying structure?

TLDR; DISCUSSION ON HARDMAX RESULTS (HOW MUCH IT CAN ASCEND ) + PERSONAL CASE, HOW MUCH WILL BIMAX / TRIMAX ASCEND IF I HAVE GOOD FEATURES AND GOOD RATIOS OTHER THAN FLAT MAXILLA (also slightly short lower third due to deepbite tbut being corrected with ortho)

Thanks for reading chuds

Really no limit if you have the money. Hardmaxxing can make sub5s into CL+ easily

 

[comebotd]

How much does hardmaxxing really ascend someones facial structure, both in 2D and 3D perception?
Are the observed gains based on actual structural improvement (forward growth, facial harmony, soft-tissue enhancement) or mostly frauding (lighting etc) and posture changes post-op?

In other words, how much of the “ascension” after surgical or orthodontic work is visible in neutral lighting and expression, and how much is projection / angle-based?
Is there any reliable way to gauge the visual return of each type of procedure (bite correction, bimax, trimax, implants, etc.)?

My case/question:
i’m around mmtn–hmtn depending on conditions.
Good eye area (except for weak infraorbitals caused by flat maxilla/recessed), decent skull overall, but flat midface caused by recessed maxilla / infras + short lower third caused by a Class 1 deep bite - upper front teeth fully cover lowers, but molars are aligned normally.

I'm working with my ortho to get self ligating braces to fix my deepbite (seemingly best solution, made a previous thread discussing that). Once the deep bite is fixed, the lower third should lengthen and balance the facial thirds more evenly.
Question is: does this kind of correction improve midface projection at all, or does it only elongate vertically without changing the z-axis? I am faily sure this will not change anything, and I plan to hardmax.

Since after correction i suspect my maxilla will still be fucked, would bimax or trimax be the only proper route to achieve forward projection and better midface ? And for people with otherwise good features (eye area, skull, hairline, etc.) but a flat midface - would infraorbital or paranasal implants actually correct the appearance of flatness, or do they just add surface area without fixing the underlying structure?

TLDR; DISCUSSION ON HARDMAX RESULTS (HOW MUCH IT CAN ASCEND ) + PERSONAL CASE, HOW MUCH WILL BIMAX / TRIMAX ASCEND IF I HAVE GOOD FEATURES AND GOOD RATIOS OTHER THAN FLAT MAXILLA (also slightly short lower third due to deepbite tbut being corrected with ortho)

Thanks for reading chuds

Are you talking about other people or yourself? Like how likely is someone to notice?

 

[ascend.exe]

Really no limit if you have the money. Hardmaxxing can make sub5s into CL+ easily

Yep, just look at clav

 

[Aqualad]

Really no limit if you have the money. Hardmaxxing can make sub5s into CL+ easily

Couldnt be more incorrect

With proper surgical planning and a decent base most people will go up 1 ranking (MTN -> HTN)

A lot stay in the same ranking but improve nonetheless

 

[mixedpersonalities]

Couldnt be more incorrect

With proper surgical planning and a decent base most people will go up 1 ranking (MTN -> HTN)

A lot stay in the same ranking but improve nonetheless

There's virtually no limit to how much one can improve with modern day technologies

Your sentiment is valid in the sense where people may be limited by external factors (health, money, personal preference, partners , etc)

Hardmaxxing really has no limit

 

[iblameacne.]

Are you talking about other people or yourself? Like how likely is someone to notice?

Both other people and myself - i referenced my personal experience at the bottom, but my father hardmaxxed and claimed gymcelling so yes I can larp and jester to make people believe its natty, but i'm asking how much you think I can acsend with these surgeries and in general how much could someone ascend with just a handful of procedures

 

[iblameacne.]

Yep, just look at clav

clav hasn't hardmaxxed. hardmax is surgical operations

 

[comebotd]

Both other people and myself - i referenced my personal experience at the bottom, but my father hardmaxxed and claimed gymcelling so yes I can larp and jester to make people believe its natty, but i'm asking how much you think I can acsend with these surgeries and in general how much could someone ascend with just a handful of procedures

a lot, just look at salludon case

 

[Aqualad]

There's virtually no limit to how much one can improve with modern day technologies

Your sentiment is valid in the sense where people may be limited by external factors (health, money, personal preference, partners , etc)

Hardmaxxing really has no limit

send me ONE example of a LTN ascending to chadlite please. If you actually find one that’s a groundbreaking discovery never seen before.

You joined 1 month ago so I will cut you some slack ofc, but hardmaxxing has a very strict limit to the point pretty much anyone is lucky to go up one ranking. It’s not nearly as magical as you think. If hardmaxxing had no limit then it would be extremely popular to get cosmetic surgery

 

[hej1377]

Would need to see a pic,very hard to know since it depends much on how bad a feature sinsince it determines the roi and also what hardmaxxes are really needed

 

[seven?]

look at @Amnesia

 

[iblameacne.]

Would need to see a pic,very hard to know since it depends much on how bad a feature sinsince it determines the roi and also what hardmaxxes are really needed

I already know what is needed ive consulted giant and asked many org users, they recommend bimax or trimax to fix my recessed midface (under eyes lack support) and some have said implants but that would be after bimax or trimax.

i have a stereotypical flat midface/cheekbones where i have nasolabial folds, itachi lines / tear troughs, but my jaw is not recessed (chin is slightly recesed but this will be fixed with orthodontics, already had consultation + expected results) i have a strong side profile except the recession in the upper maxilla, and you can not really tell from the front profile except for the wrinkles + less prominent cheekbones even though they protrude laterally.