how to actually ascend naturally and through pharma, according to modern criteria - HIGH IQ THREAD GTFIH

[AtrophicPyra]

Normie side
I found this out the hard way but whether or not u look shittier when ur leaner or not, you should always aim to be very lean, why?

Most kids in this generation r already expressing very low runx2 and more sox9 and downstream growth genes due to the goyim invasion (https://looksmax.org/threads/there-...t-high-iq-thread-gtfih.2177690/#post-29928026) if ur fat as shit in this generation don’t be surprised when ur 5’2 and ur buddies r 6’5 from all the estrogen raping ur growth plates.

Pharma side

Instead of supplementing supraphysiological testosterone spend every dime and nickel on hgh and ai, possibly var although it’s too complicated for normies to understand how to supplement var into height stacks,

you have to mediate every single maturation gene like estrogen from all the fat ur fat ass has and aim for a more sox9 expressed environment, hgh, igf1r lock sensitization through mediocre dose androgens ex;Anavar

There r more methods and ways to increase sox9 expression through mitigating inflammation pathways that I wish to gatekeep for now

There is absolutely no reason to take high dose androgens whilst ur growth plates r open if ur facial sutures close a lot later than ur spine I have already debunked a million times how androgens make ur growth plates close prematurely

Be patient

 

[infrainfra]

Normie side
I found this out the hard way but whether or not u look shittier when ur leaner or not, you should always aim to be very lean, why?

Most kids in this generation r already expressing very low runx2 and more sox9 and downstream growth genes due to the goyim invasion (https://looksmax.org/threads/there-...t-high-iq-thread-gtfih.2177690/#post-29928026) if ur fat as shit in this generation don’t be surprised when ur 5’2 and ur buddies r 6’5 from all the estrogen raping ur growth plates.

Pharma side

Instead of supplementing supraphysiological testosterone spend every dime and nickel on hgh and ai, possibly var although it’s too complicated for normies to understand how to supplement var into height stacks,

you have to mediate every single maturation gene like estrogen from all the fat ur fat ass has and aim for a more sox9 expressed environment, hgh, igf1r lock sensitization through mediocre dose androgens ex;Anavar

There r more methods and ways to increase sox9 expression through mitigating inflammation pathways that I wish to gatekeep for now

There is absolutely no reason to take high dose androgens whilst ur growth plates r open if ur facial sutures close a lot later than ur spine I have already debunked a million times how androgens make ur growth plates close prematurely

Be patient

as u age your cells are way less responsive to growth factors because of certain markers like p16/21 so the same bone growth you would get from pharmas at 16 is different then you would at 20

 

[AtrophicPyra]

as u age your cells are way less responsive to growth factors because of certain markers like p16/21 so the same bone growth you would get from pharmas at 16 is different then you would at 20

By 20 it’s almost over for dimo from gear

18 is probably the latest before u would have to take insane supraphysiological doses of gear to compensate for the lack of responsiveness to the receptors as u said

 

[infrainfra]

By 20 it’s almost over for dimo from gear

18 is probably the latest before u would have to take insane supraphysiological doses of gear to compensate for the lack of responsiveness to the receptors as u said

we plan to be on protocols which allow us to keep our plates open until 20. at least me

androgens aint bad ALL androgens upregulate your igf-1 mRNA and shit so if u see a particular study that anavar does this and that just know


dont go too much with them like a gram of deca or 70mg anavar and shit just be smart w it

 

[AtrophicPyra]

we plan to be on protocols which allow us to keep our plates open until 20. at least me

androgens aint bad ALL androgens upregulate your igf-1 mRNA and shit so if u see a particular study that anavar does this and that just know


dont go too much with them like a gram of deca or 70mg anavar and shit just be smart w it

In the Anavar studies higher arm doses decreased FAH by 1.5-7.5cm, if Anavar the mildest androgen at that low of a medical dose, lowers ur FAH think abt what 50mg of tren e could do

I also make threads all the time abt studies with rats and how the tren group in those studies r always shorter in length compared to the control group

But ye ur right androgens increase igf1r sensitivity, thats the good abt them and why they can be used to increase FAH only
If u take it for a limited amount of time with gh

For ex; u need to take more gh after the Anavar is over to compensate to actually get an increase FAH due to anavars maturation to the gp.

 

[infrainfra]

I also make threads all the time abt studies with rats and how the tren group in those studies r always shorter in length compared to the control group

all androgens do that bro. find me an androgen that used alone increases femur length or FAH wtv related to longitudinal growth.

( as far as i remember) if the 61g rats received 500mcg of tren enanthate once per week and they ended up shorter it’s because of the ER sensitivity since tren increases ER sensitivity via its progesterone interactions and the normal androgenic pathway.

calculating for a 75kg human its like he received 79mg of tren E weekly which IN MY OPINION is not enough to nuke endogenous test to assure „nuked e2” but instead it just increases ER sensitivity and on top of that as i said ANDROGENS ALONE aren’t good for longitudinal growth


i don’t really know how we can calculate that X amounts of androgen X is enough to nuke endogenous test enough to assure us that „e2 was nuked”



ALSO rodents aren’t skeletally timed by estrogen. their growth plates do not fuse. they just simply run out of stem cells. estrogen just classically ages the plate if anything


idk what to say from here maybe @Zagro knows

 

[AtrophicPyra]

all androgens do that bro. find me an androgen that used alone increases femur length or FAH wtv related to longitudinal growth.

( as far as i remember) if the 61g rats received 500mcg of tren enanthate once per week and they ended up shorter it’s because of the ER sensitivity since tren increases ER sensitivity via its progesterone interactions and the normal androgenic pathway.

calculating for a 75kg human its like he received 79mg of tren E weekly which IN MY OPINION is not enough to nuke endogenous test to assure „nuked e2” but instead it just increases ER sensitivity and on top of that as i said ANDROGENS ALONE aren’t good for longitudinal growth


i don’t really know how we can calculate that X amounts of androgen X is enough to nuke endogenous test enough to assure us that „e2 was nuked”



ALSO rodents aren’t skeletally timed by estrogen. their growth plates do not fuse. they just simply run out of stem cells. estrogen just classically ages the plate if anything


idk what to say from here maybe @Zagro knows

Progesterone doesn’t rlly increase estrogen receptor sensitivity to my knowledge

But tren e at like 50mg crashes test so hard

 

[infrainfra]

But tren e at like 50mg crashes test so hard

have u got proof?

 

[AtrophicPyra]

have u got proof?

What I usually do if I want anecdotes on bloodwork etc. is to go on Reddit or Quora or smth and search up for ex, “tren bloodwork before and after” and u will prob get ur answer,

I saw one thread where some guy tried tren e without test base, he had it on hand he just wanted to see if he needed it and he crashed badly

 

[Zagro]

Send the evidence behind how you came up to this conclusion on androgens increasing RUNX2 in every possible scenario/it being guaranteed

A little thing for you to research and think about is the diets before being high in cholesterol which can increase steroidogenesis thus local synthesis of estrogen/de novo synthesis of estrogen directly in the growth plates aswell.

So it's not just:
slop=low t
good food= high t

You can have high cholesterol (so also high t) with slop and still end up short + underdeveloped overall

 

[Zagro]

all androgens do that bro. find me an androgen that used alone increases femur length or FAH wtv related to longitudinal growth.

( as far as i remember) if the 61g rats received 500mcg of tren enanthate once per week and they ended up shorter it’s because of the ER sensitivity since tren increases ER sensitivity via its progesterone interactions and the normal androgenic pathway.

calculating for a 75kg human its like he received 79mg of tren E weekly which IN MY OPINION is not enough to nuke endogenous test to assure „nuked e2” but instead it just increases ER sensitivity and on top of that as i said ANDROGENS ALONE aren’t good for longitudinal growth


i don’t really know how we can calculate that X amounts of androgen X is enough to nuke endogenous test enough to assure us that „e2 was nuked”



ALSO rodents aren’t skeletally timed by estrogen. their growth plates do not fuse. they just simply run out of stem cells. estrogen just classically ages the plate if anything


idk what to say from here maybe @Zagro knows

It's a shit study and there's not enough research on any AAS and longitudinal growth that will guarantee our theories which are mostly based on mechanistical reasoning

Him saying muhh random got nuked T from microdosing tren is also anecdotal so proves nothing once again and calculating the rat dose to human is also different but meh 80mg would suppress your endogenous T pretty heavily

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Send the evidence behind how you came up to this conclusion on androgens increasing RUNX2 in every possible scenario/it being guaranteed

A little thing for you to research and think about is the diets before being high in cholesterol which can increase steroidogenesis thus local synthesis of estrogen/de novo synthesis of estrogen directly in the growth plates aswell.

So it's not just:
slop=low t
good food= high t

You can have high cholesterol (so also high t) with slop and still end up short + underdeveloped overall

Cholesterol inducing steroid genesis amounts almost nothing to the amount of damage u can do to ur gp by having high estrogen raping ur gp constantly from having high bf %

 

[Zagro]

Cholesterol inducing steroid genesis amounts almost nothing to the amount of damage u can do to ur gp by having high estrogen raping ur gp constantly from having high bf %

Literally one of the most important aspects but i guess bro, you pretty much said more testosterone thus also downstream conversion so more estrogen overall/locally doesn't matter

Both are important, but you can be lean and still have high cholesterol on the contrary if you're high bf you're pretty much guaranteed to have problems with your cholesterol, so cholesterol is always an issue

 

[AtrophicPyra]

I mean u can have like 500-1000ng of test in ur blood, if ur bf% is below 10 you could have as little as 25-30ng of e2 in ur body ur bf% is what makes u aromatize like crazy

 

[infrainfra]

once again and calculating the rat dose to human is also different

i did it classically 6/37 the FDA thing. what would be a good conversion in your opinion to get the most equivalent human dose of what these animals got to kinda extrapolate

also we know the negative effects on androgenicity like stem cell depletion and pushing cells into hypertrophy faster so if rats aren’t skeletally timed by estrogen (their plates dont fuse) the lower femur or wtv they saw could be just depletion + super fast differentiation because e2 isnt FULLY nuked so its just adding on more pressure


taking amounts of androgens that barely exceed the threshold of reducing estrogen to zero doesnt sit right with me idk why


also stuck in a loop bc idk how much androgenic load do i supply to fully nuke substrate + actually get dick growth and at the same time not rape my growth


what you think?

 

[AtrophicPyra]

i did it classically 6/37 the FDA thing. what would be a good conversion in your opinion to get the most equivalent human dose of what these animals got to kinda extrapolate

also we know the negative effects on androgenicity like stem cell depletion and pushing cells into hypertrophy faster so if rats aren’t skeletally timed by estrogen (their plates dont fuse) the lower femur or wtv they saw could be just depletion + super fast differentiation because e2 isnt FULLY nuked so its just adding on more pressure


taking amounts of androgens that barely exceed the threshold of reducing estrogen to zero doesnt sit right with me idk why


also stuck in a loop bc idk how much androgenic load do i supply to fully nuke substrate + actually get dick growth and at the same time not rape my growth


what you think?

Well my dick is getting girthier and bigger on 10mg of Anavar esp girthier so the threshold is pretty low

Although I can’t even get hard anymore and get a real measurement when it’s fully hard bec I got no test base I haven’t jerked off in days

#nofappingstreak

 

[infrainfra]

Well my dick is getting girthier and bigger on 10mg of Anavar esp girthier so the threshold is pretty low

Although I can’t even get hard anymore and get a real measurement when it’s fully hard bec I got no test base I haven’t jerked off in days

#nofappingstreak

yeah well im talking about craniofacial bones , dick , voice etc

and afaik u still get hard on no T if ur using androgens so u prob raped e2 with ais

 

[AtrophicPyra]

yeah well im talking about craniofacial bones , dick , voice etc

and afaik u still get hard on no T if ur using androgens so u prob raped e2 with ais

Ya am also on 12.5mg ed aromasin

My bones r the same slight mid face projection and downward growth of the mid face, and my chin is a lot more forward, my eye area is better etc.

My voice is the same

Safe to say the threshold is unbelievably low, it’s just the duration of which ur using the androgens that determine how much male dimo u get,

there is a reason why ur face changes more dimo when ur 20 even though ur peak test is around 15-16 it’s because the duration of ur high test period morphed ur face not bec test is powerful at 1,000nl in ur blood (not considering free test)