Is free will real with this logic

[poreskin]

If we can’t predict our thoughts then we don’t have free will we’re just the observer of our thoughts

but we can still choose to act on our thoughts

but acting on your thoughts still stems from a thought

the same way observing your thoughts and
thinking about observing your thoughts is also a thought within itself



Maybe some thoughts and actions have higher and lower levels of consciousness behind them, maybe your actual actions stem from a thoughts behind higher or maximal level of consciousness and others stem from your subconscious/monkey brain

 

[Scars]

If we can’t predict our thoughts then we don’t have free will we’re just the observer of our thoughts

but we can still choose to act on our thoughts

but acting on your thoughts still stems from a thought

the same way observing your thoughts and
thinking about observing your thoughts is also a thought within itself



Maybe some thoughts and actions have higher and lower levels of consciousness behind them, maybe your actual actions stem from a thoughts behind higher or maximal level of consciousness and others stem from your subconscious/monkey brain

just do what you wanna do this is too much thinking

 

[Tenres]

Not following

 

[yushmaxx]

Not following

same, theres many arguments as to why we dont have free will but i can’t quite understand this one

 

[killcry]

Except you can predict your thoughts & behaviors by thinking about them

 

[hollowed]

same, theres many arguments as to why we dont have free will but i can’t quite understand this one

I understand but doesn’t seem like a great argument to me

 

[Tenres]

same, theres many arguments as to why we dont have free will but i can’t quite understand this one

I think he might just be trying to say that every thought is determined by a previous thought, but that first of all seems incorrect, and secondly I'm not sure how this directly means you can't have free will. You could of course be a compatibilist Chad

 

[Tenres]

I understand but doesn’t seem like a great argument to me

What did you get out of it?

 

[killcry]

I think he might just be trying to say that every thought is determined by a previous thought, but that first of all seems incorrect, and secondly I'm not sure how this directly means you can't have free will. You could of course be a compatibilist Chad

i guess he means our internal mechanisms and means of subsisting like thinking and behaving and intrinsically eating and shitting and pissing are things we're not in control of and more like we're just spectators to because we can't explain these things or predict these behaviors but i don't understand because we literally can

we can actively predict our animalistic propensities and retard instincts by simply being cognizant about our own behaviors and we can change our trajectories for the better by channeling these monkey instincts

 

[hollowed]

What did you get out of it?

You do not choose your thoughts, actions you take come from these thoughts you did not choose, therefore free will does not exist.

 

[poreskin]

i guess he means our internal mechanisms and means of subsisting like thinking and behaving and intrinsically eating and shitting and pissing are things we're not in control of and more like we're just spectators to because we can't explain these things or predict these behaviors but i don't understand because we literally can

we can actively predict our animalistic propensities and retard instincts by simply being cognizant about our own behaviors and we can change our trajectories for the better by channeling these monkey instincts

Yeah but even more advanced thoughts are uncontrollable and only observed by a deeper soul and action thats active right now, and that deeper soul is unexplained and could possibly or possibly not be another thought we can’t control, or something deeper the human mind can’t comprehend but sorta get the idea of based on feel that can’t be put into language

 

[Tenres]

i guess he means our internal mechanisms and means of subsisting like thinking and behaving and intrinsically eating and shitting and pissing are things we're not in control of and more like we're just spectators to because we can't explain these things or predict these behaviors but i don't understand because we literally can

we can actively predict our animalistic propensities and retard instincts by simply being cognizant about our own behaviors and we can change our trajectories for the better by channeling these monkey instincts

Yeah I kinda get that, I think. One problem is just going to be a proponent of free will doesn't have to believe we have complete control of our thoughts, just that there's at least some actions we take that are free.

 

[poreskin]

Yeah I kinda get that, I think. One problem is just going to be a proponent of free will doesn't have to believe we have complete control of our thoughts, just that there's at least some actions we take that are free.

Read my edits

 

[poreskin]

Yeah I kinda get that, I think. One problem is just going to be a proponent of free will doesn't have to believe we have complete control of our thoughts, just that there's at least some actions we take that are free.

Free will is a mystery we can’t put into words

 

[Tenres]

You do not choose your thoughts, actions you take come from these thoughts you did not choose, therefore free will does not exist.

I personally don't believe in libertarian free will but I think they can accept the first part, and just deny the second part. If you're right, and like many people who intense meditation describe, thoughts really are these uncontrollable fleeting activations of mental states, then your consciousness is in a way separated from your thoughts. So at the very least it's possible for them to say you have a selective capacity over your thoughts and that is free.

Edit: For example it could be an intuition-like process, so it doesn't contain mental content itself.

 

[killcry]

Yeah but even more advanced thoughts are uncontrollable and only observed by a deeper soul and action thats active right now, and that deeper soul is unexplained and could possibly or possibly not be another thought we can’t control, or something deeper the human mind can’t comprehend but sorta get the idea of based on feel that can’t be put into language

that higher dimension of thinking is purposeful and intentional rather than instinctive, if anything that's what would allow us to act with freedom according to our own purposes and intentions, why would it matter if we can't explain its origins?

 

[i cant rate]

If we can’t predict our thoughts then we don’t have free will we’re just the observer of our thoughts

but we can still choose to act on our thoughts

but acting on your thoughts still stems from a thought

the same way observing your thoughts and
thinking about observing your thoughts is also a thought within itself



Maybe some thoughts and actions have higher and lower levels of consciousness behind them, maybe your actual actions stem from a thoughts behind higher or maximal level of consciousness and others stem from your subconscious/monkey brain

 

[i cant rate]

Metacognition i guess

If we can’t predict our thoughts then we don’t have free will we’re just the observer of our thoughts

but we can still choose to act on our thoughts

but acting on your thoughts still stems from a thought

the same way observing your thoughts and
thinking about observing your thoughts is also a thought within itself



Maybe some thoughts and actions have higher and lower levels of consciousness behind them, maybe your actual actions stem from a thoughts behind higher or maximal level of consciousness and others stem from your subconscious/monkey brain

 

[iblamechico]

Thoughts are not something you predict. Thoughts are simply your brain processing the real world in real time.