New surgery: Mini T-wing

[mvp2v1]

They call it a surgery for masculinization.

@RealSurgerymax thoughts?

 

[dad]

interesting, writing it down on my todo list

 

[bossman]

Safi is a salesman, not a surgeon

 

[Dropdown666]

Looks like a chin-widening version of the Mini Chin Wing (and also not very natural but idk)

 

[RealSurgerymax]

They call it a surgery for masculinization.

@RealSurgerymax thoughts?
View attachment 2751874

interesting, writing it down on my todo list

Safi is a salesman, not a surgeon

Looks like a chin-widening version of the Mini Chin Wing (and also not very natural but idk)

Appears he plagiarized me and is taking the credit without any acknowledgement of where he got that idea, again.

• Giant Invented the concept and you can read about it from the original source here:

• Giant did it FIRST (Several Times Over)

• Giant does it better.

That will be the second time he has done that. The first being a poor attempt at a drop-down supraorbital implant crediting (associating himself with) E & Y, who have never done that (I have seen them tell patients its not possible before they came to me.) He proceeded to do this even after he good & well saw me promising to bust anyone who takes credit for my work:

 

[Fairytale]

Appears he plagiarized me and is taking the credit without any acknowledgement of where he got that idea, again.

• Giant Invented the concept and you can read about it from the original source here:

View attachment 2752586

• Giant did it FIRST (Several Times Over)

View attachment 2752576View attachment 2752579

• Giant does it better.

View attachment 2752564View attachment 2752565View attachment 2752570View attachment 2752572View attachment 2752472

That will be the second time he has done that. The first being a poor attempt at a drop-down supraorbital implant crediting (associating himself with) E & Y, who have never done that (I have seen them tell patients its not possible before they came to me.) He proceeded to do this even after he good & well saw me promising to bust anyone who takes credit for my work:
View attachment 2752587View attachment 2752588View attachment 2752589

You can sue him

If some users here (including me) were interested in Safi its because of how dramatic some of his bimax cases were like this f.e

But I don't see why you wouldn't be able to design 30+mm bimax and get even more dramatic results.
I think people are just dissapointed after seeing that brazilian kid bimax result (while forehead implants were on fleek).

 

[RealSurgerymax]

You can sue him

If some users here (including me) were interested in Safi its because of how dramatic some of his bimax cases were like this f.e
View attachment 2753002
But I don't see why you wouldn't be able to design 30+mm bimax and get even more dramatic results.
I think people are just dissapointed after seeing that brazilian kid bimax result (while forehead implants were on fleek).

Did you know that we have a long list of people for revision of over-advanced bimaxes? Some looking great on the operating table in Barcelona but in real life not so much.

Yes we can do them with even less relapse risk with out precision system (a patent pending system a step above the custom system) but actually most people who think they want a hyper-ante face will change their mind after getting it.

Sailer is cool. I used to be really impressed with the interface concept but I think that's the tip of the iceberg. Once people get deeper they realize over advancement is almost as bad as under advancement. In the last 3 years of doing implants on multiple people post-barcelona I noticed huge Counterclockwise Rotations can make nasolabial folds worse from folding the face. I unfold the face with paranasal implants.

Lately I have been mirin and taking more inspiration from Raffaini. Just trying to do the custom version.

Rhinoplasty done in Brazil 3 months after.
Bimax and implants planned & designed by me & performed by Dr Celal where I also assisted.
Patient still getting eyelid surgery & some other refinements with us in a month.

Incel to Chad transition is staged and mileage will vary. Staged surgery is always talked about in our planning - it's not a surprise for anyone we work with (although some act like it is even after being grounded about their expectations 10X). Same as gender affirming surgery. Trans community understands this as a given. Hardmax community still needs to mature and realize this.

Softmaxxing (being lean and taking care of your skin) is a prerequisite to hardmaxxing. Surgery by anyone, anywhere always has risks and causes some degree of irreversible harm. Get only what you need.

 

[Deleted member 32196]

Appears he plagiarized me and is taking the credit without any acknowledgement of where he got that idea, again.

• Giant Invented the concept and you can read about it from the original source here:

View attachment 2752586

• Giant did it FIRST (Several Times Over)

View attachment 2752576View attachment 2752579

• Giant does it better.

View attachment 2752564View attachment 2752565View attachment 2752570View attachment 2752572View attachment 2752472

That will be the second time he has done that. The first being a poor attempt at a drop-down supraorbital implant crediting (associating himself with) E & Y, who have never done that (I have seen them tell patients its not possible before they came to me.) He proceeded to do this even after he good & well saw me promising to bust anyone who takes credit for my work:
View attachment 2752587View attachment 2752588View attachment 2752589

Does geniogiant mogg a regular 2 piece/T split Genioplasty if so, why?

 

[RealSurgerymax]

Does geniogiant mogg a regular 2 piece/T split Genioplasty if so, why?

 

[Deleted member 32196]

View attachment 2753185

I saw your other post and the pic however based on the pic(s) I still dont get WHY it would mogg. Because there is no "stepp off" on the mandible body to chin transition?

 

[RealSurgerymax]

I saw your other post and the pic however based on the pic(s) I still dont get WHY it would mogg. Because there is no "stepp off" on the mandible body to chin transition?

It's because of the CONTOUR that the CONCAVITY creates.

 

[Deleted member 32196]

It's because of the CONTOUR that the CONCAVITY creates.

So basically based on experience? Have you created mogger results? How can I see

 

[Fairytale]

Did you know that we have a long list of people for revision of over-advanced bimaxes? Some looking great on the operating table in Barcelona but in real life not so much.

Yes I heard that "Barcelona line" is not the best thing obviously since midface and upper third are left untouched.

Yes we can do them with even less relapse risk with out precision system (a patent pending system a step above the custom system) but actually most people who think they want a hyper-ante face will change their mind after getting it.

The obvious thing that everybody knows here is that you can't get hyperante face with just bimax- first you are limited by your upper and middle third projection so someone with flat face cant just get 30mm bimax and get mind blowing facial depth. I am actually suprised about this that most people don't want it.

Like hello? (To be honest guy above could have stronger forehead tho)

But I guess this is the reason why you perform Lefort 2+1 and Lefort 3+1; to get hyperante face that actually is hyperante.
face and not dog face.

Sailer is cool. I used to be really impressed with the interface concept but I think that's the tip of the iceberg. Once people get deeper they realize over advancement is almost as bad as under advancement. In the last 3 years of doing implants on multiple people post-barcelona I noticed huge Counterclockwise Rotations can make nasolabial folds worse from folding the face. I unfold the face with paranasal implants.

No doubt about it- but again people thought to get anteface you just have to bring lower jaws as forward and parallel to the ground as possible.
Genuine anteface/hyperante face is one of the best things that you can have- I saw quite a bit of guys in real life who have genuine anteface and their profiles looks so striking.

Incel to Chad transition is staged and mileage will vary. Staged surgery is always talked about in our planning - it's not a surprise for anyone we work with (although some act like it is even after being grounded about their expectations 10X). Same as gender affirming surgery. Trans community understands this as a given. Hardmax community still needs to mature and realize this.

True- people just cant wait to "slay" when they are still in their early 20s- its understandable.

 

[Meister!]

Did you know that we have a long list of people for revision of over-advanced bimaxes? Some looking great on the operating table in Barcelona but in real life not so much.

Yes we can do them with even less relapse risk with out precision system (a patent pending system a step above the custom system) but actually most people who think they want a hyper-ante face will change their mind after getting it.

Sailer is cool. I used to be really impressed with the interface concept but I think that's the tip of the iceberg. Once people get deeper they realize over advancement is almost as bad as under advancement. In the last 3 years of doing implants on multiple people post-barcelona I noticed huge Counterclockwise Rotations can make nasolabial folds worse from folding the face. I unfold the face with paranasal implants.

Lately I have been mirin and taking more inspiration from Raffaini. Just trying to do the custom version.

View attachment 2753119
Rhinoplasty done in Brazil 3 months after.
Bimax and implants planned & designed by me & performed by Dr Celal where I also assisted.
Patient still getting eyelid surgery & some other refinements with us in a month.

Incel to Chad transition is staged and mileage will vary. Staged surgery is always talked about in our planning - it's not a surprise for anyone we work with (although some act like it is even after being grounded about their expectations 10X). Same as gender affirming surgery. Trans community understands this as a given. Hardmax community still needs to mature and realize this.

Softmaxxing (being lean and taking care of your skin) is a prerequisite to hardmaxxing. Surgery by anyone, anywhere always has risks and causes some degree of irreversible harm. Get only what you need.

Did he get surgery on the chin? The lower third is holding him back, the chin kind of looks like it hasn't been touched that much and overall his lower third development and ramus height do not match his midface and browridge. You said the surgeon opted out of jaw implants, right? By the way are you working on your much needed LF2 and LF3 innovations? You brought in fresh wind into the whole community and maxillofacial surgery in general - I remember back in 2020/2021 to early 2022 nobody was talking about custom implants, especially with the dimensions you're pushing out on the regular. Please update us on your new osteotomy techniques and let us know if there will ever be the possibility to get LF2 in Europe (not counting Turkey or Eastern Europe).

 

[RealSurgerymax]

Did he get surgery on the chin? The lower third is holding him back, the chin kind of looks like it hasn't been touched that much and overall his lower third development and ramus height do not match his midface and browridge. You said the surgeon opted out of jaw implants, right? By the way are you working on your much needed LF2 and LF3 innovations? You brought in fresh wind into the whole community and maxillofacial surgery in general - I remember back in 2020/2021 to early 2022 nobody was talking about custom implants, especially with the dimensions you're pushing out on the regular. Please update us on your new osteotomy techniques and let us know if there will ever be the possibility to get LF2 in Europe (not counting Turkey or Eastern Europe).

He asked for a more pretty boy look originally, now he is wanting a more masculine look so we are placing the jaw angles and a wider chin.

On the LF2/3 stuff -
Is paying double to triple to have it in the european union or quadruple to have it in the USA really worth it?
I'm kind of tired of getting this question because I think people assume it will be same or similar price, just in Europe.
Sorry but healthcare costs are too high there to do it affordably for most normal people.

The hospital in turkey feels the same as the hospital in Virginia

 

[Meister!]

He asked for a more pretty boy look originally, now he is wanting a more masculine look so we are placing the jaw angles and a wider chin.

On the LF2/3 stuff -
Is paying double to triple to have it in the european union or quadruple to have it in the USA really worth it?
I'm kind of tired of getting this question because I think people assume it will be same or similar price, just in Europe.
Sorry but healthcare costs are too high there to do it affordably for most normal people.

The hospital in turkey feels the same as the hospital in Virginia

Maybe that's just stigma, right now LF2/3 is a rarity, I think in the future with more successful cases people would be more open to get it done wherever it is done, but for now having a partner in Central Europe or wherever could really help push the legitimacy of this procedure for cosmetic reasons. I heard rumours of a small German maxillofacial practice performing LF2 for cosmetic reasons, and I'd say from what I've gathered German healthcare is quite affordable for EU patients.

 

[RealSurgerymax]

Maybe that's just stigma, right now LF2/3 is a rarity, I think in the future with more successful cases people would be more open to get it done wherever it is done, but for now having a partner in Central Europe or wherever could really help push the legitimacy of this procedure for cosmetic reasons. I heard rumours of a small German maxillofacial practice performing LF2 for cosmetic reasons, and I'd say from what I've gathered German healthcare is quite affordable for EU patients.

I think 95% of people asking for major aesthetic craniofacial surgery in the US/EU like they can afford it are mentally masturbating

 

[anticel]

View attachment 2753119

just 5-7° more of ccw and he will look amazing imo

 

[longjohnmong]

looks

Looks like a chin-widening version of the Mini Chin Wing (and also not very natural but idk)

that's exactly what it is

 

[Foreverbrad]

Pagnoni showed me this in September as an example of cutting edge new surgery designs but might have been in collaboration with RSM.

 

[HerpDerpson]

being lean is a prerequisite to hardmaxxing.

Aesthetics aside, it's better to gain weight before any surgery. You'd have easier time recovering due to being starved at the hospital afterwards. Especially if you get a jaw surgery, which prevents you from eating properly.

 

[RealSurgerymax]

Aesthetics aside, it's better to gain weight before any surgery. You'd have easier time recovering due to being starved at the hospital afterwards. Especially if you get a jaw surgery, which prevents you from eating properly.

Yea and makes for better b/a transformation

Pagnoni showed me this in September as an example of cutting edge new surgery designs but might have been in collaboration with RSM.

Yes he performed the first geniogiant designed be me in 2022.

 

[tragic]

Yea and makes for better b/a transformation


Yes he performed the first geniogiant designed be me in 2022.

View attachment 2757137

if I consult pagnoni and ask /.him about u getting on my case would that secure a spot of u guys working together on my case or should i consult with u firstt

 

[Meister!]

I think 95% of people asking for major aesthetic craniofacial surgery in the US/EU like they can afford it are mentally masturbating

Yeah, and honestly even Turkey, which is quite affordable at around 30 thousand is still out of reach for most, but there truly are some exceptions.

EDIT: I also read that Pagnoni performed the first GenioGiant in 2022, have you designed implants for him since then too? I remember consulting with him and his implant design looked very similar to yours.

 

[RealSurgerymax]

Yeah, and honestly even Turkey, which is quite affordable at around 30 thousand is still out of reach for most, but there truly are some exceptions.

EDIT: I also read that Pagnoni performed the first GenioGiant in 2022, have you designed implants for him since then too? I remember consulting with him and his implant design looked very similar to yours.

Yes he is still my busiest partner and I see it staying that way for a long time. He is very good. It probably was mine

 

[Chris2001]

Maybe that's just stigma, right now LF2/3 is a rarity, I think in the future with more successful cases people would be more open to get it done wherever it is done, but for now having a partner in Central Europe or wherever could really help push the legitimacy of this procedure for cosmetic reasons. I heard rumours of a small German maxillofacial practice performing LF2 for cosmetic reasons, and I'd say from what I've gathered German healthcare is quite affordable for EU patients.

@Meister! can you pls tell me the name of the German maxillofacial practice?

 

[mlffff]

Stay away from Safi at all costs.
He is master manipulator who is amazing at gaining your trust during the consultation. He will make you feel relaxed as if your in good hands but will ruin you on the opersti g table. He will leave you with a poor aesthetic result and severe nerve damage. He messed up my friend badly.

I suggest these surgeons:

For jaw surgery alone: Raffaini.
Raffaini is the #1 for jaw surgery in the world. He will analyse your case like no other surgeon and he has the skill to influence your soft tissue which will leave you with the best aesthetic result. Raffaini is #1 no doubt.

For jaw surgery and implants or implants alone: Pagnoni.

I suggest consulting with Raffaini. Pay the 500 euros for the consult. Get the plan with the movements from Raffaini then go to Pagnoni and request those movements if you want to combine the jaw surgery with implants.

Ramieri is a safe middle ground option.

Whatever you do, stay away from Ali Farid Safi. My friend now has a severe lisp and can't taste anymore. Safi drilled into his lingual nerves during the bimax. This has been proven with a 3 tesla MRI scan.
His little implant company FaceXImplants is a scam, it's his own company and he has his brother in law as a designer who has no experience. Dont be naive and get conned into having surgery with Safi. Beware.

You have Raffaini, Ramieri, Pagnoni.. look no further

 

[mvp2v1]

Stay away from Safi at all costs.
He is master manipulator who is amazing at gaining your trust during the consultation. He will make you feel relaxed as if your in good hands but will ruin you on the opersti g table. He will leave you with a poor aesthetic result and severe nerve damage. He messed up my friend badly.

I suggest these surgeons:

For jaw surgery alone: Raffaini.
Raffaini is the #1 for jaw surgery in the world. He will analyse your case like no other surgeon and he has the skill to influence your soft tissue which will leave you with the best aesthetic result. Raffaini is #1 no doubt.

For jaw surgery and implants or implants alone: Pagnoni.

I suggest consulting with Raffaini. Pay the 500 euros for the consult. Get the plan with the movements from Raffaini then go to Pagnoni and request those movements if you want to combine the jaw surgery with implants.

Ramieri is a safe middle ground option.

Whatever you do, stay away from Ali Farid Safi. My friend now has a severe lisp and can't taste anymore. Safi drilled into his lingual nerves during the bimax. This has been proven with a 3 tesla MRI scan.
His little implant company FaceXImplants is a scam, it's his own company and he has his brother in law as a designer who has no experience. Dont be naive and get conned into having surgery with Safi. Beware.

You have Raffaini, Ramieri, Pagnoni.. look no further

 

[DavidWho]

Did you know that we have a long list of people for revision of over-advanced bimaxes? Some looking great on the operating table in Barcelona but in real life not so much.

Yes we can do them with even less relapse risk with out precision system (a patent pending system a step above the custom system) but actually most people who think they want a hyper-ante face will change their mind after getting it.

Sailer is cool. I used to be really impressed with the interface concept but I think that's the tip of the iceberg. Once people get deeper they realize over advancement is almost as bad as under advancement. In the last 3 years of doing implants on multiple people post-barcelona I noticed huge Counterclockwise Rotations can make nasolabial folds worse from folding the face. I unfold the face with paranasal implants.

Lately I have been mirin and taking more inspiration from Raffaini. Just trying to do the custom version.

View attachment 2753119
Rhinoplasty done in Brazil 3 months after.
Bimax and implants planned & designed by me & performed by Dr Celal where I also assisted.
Patient still getting eyelid surgery & some other refinements with us in a month.

Incel to Chad transition is staged and mileage will vary. Staged surgery is always talked about in our planning - it's not a surprise for anyone we work with (although some act like it is even after being grounded about their expectations 10X). Same as gender affirming surgery. Trans community understands this as a given. Hardmax community still needs to mature and realize this.

Softmaxxing (being lean and taking care of your skin) is a prerequisite to hardmaxxing. Surgery by anyone, anywhere always has risks and causes some degree of irreversible harm. Get only what you need.

Is incel to chad transition even possible?