Novel Theory of Ani-Aging

[Youㅤ]

i concede on saying ur perspective is the same as SENS

yes , they do believe damage can be slowed modestly but they discourage this approach without their damage repair technology .

the fundamental program for ageing IMO is the telomeres . single celled eukaryotes called paramecium can reproduce sexually and asexually . but asexually their telomeres shorten , and thus they have limited divisions they can make without finding a mate to sex and restore the offspring's telomeres . therefore paramecium that only reproduce asexually will die out .

i am speculateing that telomeric ageing evolved when single cells were given the option to reproduce sexually . u can think of the human body of a very large clump of human cells in symbiosis divideing (akin to asexual reproduction) with the goal of sexual reproduction , because the telomeres shorten with divisions .

telomeric ageing is IMO the most primitive aspect of programmed ageing , but in animals the program is much more complex . gene expression changes with age , part of this is programmed (self destructive) and part of this is adaptive ; the body is at war with itself until it dies . i dont believe this is an accident but it was beneficial for evolution .

ur say that ageing is programmed in shorter lived species . this is definitely true , a mouse clearly is programmed to not live long , its not some accident , there no real benefit for antagonistic pleiotropy alone to cause this .

u brought up greenland shark as a neglible senescence animal . well , first of all , ill mention their body temperature is around 1 degree celsius (extreeeemly cold) , which could be important mechanistically . but my main point is that their ancestors have probably had extreme longevity since ancient times (i did not check this yet) . well what were *our* ancestors ? the answer is monkeys , a short lived species . so if ageing is programmed for short lived species due to evolutionary pressure , then i would say that we have been evolveing to resist and undo this program since our livespan has been increaseing , but human lifespan is very recent in evolution unlike (presumeably) greenland sharks . so maybe we arent benefited much by the program of ageing , but our ancestors were . and the selection shadow and antagonistic pleiotropic genes would make the trend toward longevity a slow one (although it seems to have been gradually lengthening) .

so we still do have a program for ageing . the telomere shortening limits our lifespan at a predicted age of 125 years . well , certain damages can also shorten telomeres , and we can mitigate this to prevent accelerated ageing , but replicative senesensce can only be slowed by slowing cell division . i think we have a program for ageing because , as u yourself said , shorter lived species do , and i think at best this ancient program has a lingering effect in us today , and at worse there is still pressure to age in modern humans . but if u look at what happens during ageing , it is hard not to conclude that the body seems to *destroy itself* with age , people think of these destructive processes as dysfunctions but these "dysfunctions" seem to be deliberately hostile IMO . damage accumulation is accelerated in many lethal ways and endogenous antioxidants dangerously fall . also , take DNA methylation , DNA methylation is said to function as a way of gene expression control for organisms to "adapt" during their lifespan . if this is so , then reverseing DNAm age would *hasten* death . and now some aspects do seem to be adaptive to age but others not . it could still be reasoned that these harmful DNAm changes are dysfunctions , but i disagree . i find it interesting that OSKM expression can de-age cells , but too much OSKM expression and the cell is an induced pluripotent stem cell . this shows that DNAm ageing and developmental DNAm are connected . and development is a program . FSH and LH increase in specific times in development to modulate development . they also increase multi-fold in midlife during the time of female menopause (in both men and women) . this suspiciously seems like part of the ageing/death program . in salmon , the fish die shortly after reproduction and coincidently get a massive surge of of FSH increased by 4500% .


well i do think u may be onto something . there are things that can induce telomerase in somatic cells to lengthen telomeres (currently nothing proven to lengthen telomeres even close to enough to counter shortening) . telomere shortening IMO is the most ancient program for ageing , and we have the genes to lengthen them (obv all animals lengthen the germline cells , suspicious how they shut off telomerase in somatic cells . the cancer trade off perspective is weak IMO , and actually short telomeres are damageing to DNA and can induce cancer . also , i dont believe in trade offs as biological limits , but they are just lazy evolution when there is insuffienct evolutionary pressure )



sounds like ur describeing hormesis . well , i assure u that the majority of the damage that accumulates with age comes from metabolic processes essential to basic normal human functioning . it is perplexing , the phenomenon how increased damage can lead to overcompensation in stress resistance .

@autistic_tendencies thoughts ?

 

[autistic_tendencies]

@autistic_tendencies thoughts ?

Really complicated explanation
For me to reduce aging :
Body repair must exceed damage
eliminate toxins from the diet and environment
Lower stress and over breathing

 

[Youㅤ]

Body repair must exceed damage

u need some way to counter telomere shortening or u will age

 

[autistic_tendencies]

u need some way to counter telomere shortening or u will age

Yeah obviously

 

[the_bubble_dox]

nice try , but this is incorrect . its also not a novel theory , this is the SENS perspective .

ageing is programmed . damage accumulation is the result of ageing not the cause .

Aging isn't programmed, it's just a problem that evolution doesn't care about. Reproduction is good enough to keep our species alive without having to fix aging, there's no need for our bodies to not age when we can reproduce.

 

[the_bubble_dox]

Yeah obviously

Telomere length is mostly genetic, and long telomeres can add a good ten years to your slaying window (if you ever looksmax to that point). A good sign of telomere is acne even though it'll be a huge failo in your teenage years. Dermatologists have known for a long time that patients with acne age slower, and researchers have discovered it's because acne is in part caused by longer telomeres.

 

[Youㅤ]

Aging isn't programmed, it's just a problem that evolution doesn't care about. Reproduction is good enough to keep our species alive without having to fix aging, there's no need for our bodies to not age when we can reproduce.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306987798900792

 

[Nowiff.Belgrade]

Many centenarians eat a diet based on mostly animal products. People who live in Sardinia are mostly fish and eat cheese with maggots on them and live around 90 years. The japanese and koreans consume a lot of fish too and live a lot. The jews want you to eat oatmeal and vegetables so you starve and get cucked by big pharma

Asians eat alot of veges

 

[Nowiff.Belgrade]

Good thread, will follow this advice after J do a bit more research

Sending you wealth and prosperity, $$$$$$$$ incoming !!!!

 

[the_bubble_dox]

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306987798900792

Oh nice, I stand corrected

 

[autistic_tendencies]

Telomere length is mostly genetic, and long telomeres can add a good ten years to your slaying window (if you ever looksmax to that point). A good sign of telomere is acne even though it'll be a huge failo in your teenage years. Dermatologists have known for a long time that patients with acne age slower, and researchers have discovered it's because acne is in part caused by longer telomeres.

The excess oils on the face which produce acne also keep the skin lubricated so it doesn’t dry out and age

 

[(In)CelibatePsycho2]

I'm going to propose a new theory of biological age reversal here.

Why not publish this in some academic journal you might ask? The answer is simple, I have no relevant credentials.

So let's start with the basics:

• Aging is Damage
• Repair Damage faster than damage occurs, and your biological age decreases.

There are various kinds of damage, such as glycation, DNA mutation, and oxidation.
For every type of damage, the human body has evolved one or more repair mechanisms.

Both the damage and the repair mechanisms are chemical reactions. A chemical reaction requires energy and specific chemicals to occur.

So it’s simple, increase the rate of repair, and decrease the rate of damage, for each type of damage, and corresponding repair chemical reactions, to the point where repair becomes greater than damage and you get full biological age reversal.

So how can you do this?

Again, not that complicated at least at a high level. You want to decrease the quantity of chemicals involved in the damage process, decrease the energy involved in the damage process, while increasing the quantity of chemicals involved in the repair process (with their required proportions for repair chemical reactions), while also increasing the energy available for the repair processes.

Let's look at a couple examples, of damage chemical reactions, and the evolved repair chemical reactions and interventions to increase the rate of repair, while decreasing the rate of damage.

Atherosclerosis

Atherosclerosis is the build up of fat cholesterol and other substances on the vein walls. These then they break off and clog your heart valves and you die, or break off and get stuck in a vein in your brain and a big chunk of your brain dies.

Once you understand this as a mechanical thing, you realize that each type of damage, and damage repair is relatively simple.

Every now and then you'll read papers or here doctors and scientists say that this is an irreversible process and all you can do slow the pace. Doctor's and scientists are ignorant, so you need to do more digging and not take anything they say as gospel.

But ok, we want to reverse this type of aging damage.

First we decrease rate of damage. This can be done by decreasing the consumption and absorption of chemicals that get stuck to the exterior of our veins. We don't have to get these chemicals down to zero, we only have to decrease them and increase the rate of repair until repair rate is greater than damage rate.

So high level, easy, we decrease meat consumption and increase vegetable consumption (this alone reverses atherosclerosis), and supplement with berberine (also reverses atherosclerosis).

What is the appropriate balance? We can look at diets of long lived people, and people who die of heart attacks, and see getting the balance isn't that hard. Eating mostly vegetables, and some meat and you'll be fine for atherosclerosis. Throw in some berberine supplementation, and periodic fasting, and your blood vessels will be clean.

Berberine alone as an intervention has been shown to decrease atherosclerosis, and post world war two concentration camp victims were shown to have COMPLETELY clear arteries and blood vessels right after the war. Later on, there atherosclerosis reformed. What this means is that the human body possesses the repair mechanisms to completely reverse all atherosclerosis. All we have to do is fuel those mechanisms, while reducing rate of damage.

DNA Damage

Your body has repair processes for DNA damage.

So again, we want to increase repair rate, and decrease damage rate, so that damage is greater than repair, and then we get biological age reversal within each category of damage and corresponding repair chemical reactions.

Decreasing damage rate for DNA is such things such as decreasing toxic exposure, avoiding alcohol, avoiding smoking, avoiding pollution or filtering it out, and decreasing sun exposure (while also finding ways to get the maximum benefits such as increased energy production in cell mitochondria, Vitamin-D synthesis, improved circadian rhythm, and improved mood hormonal regulation that would normally be received from the sun).

Increasing repair rate is also straight forward. We look at all the chemicals involved in the repair process (such as we do with each repair process and corresponding damage type) and we increase the quantity of those chemicals, while ALSO increasing the energy supplied for those chemical reactions.

So DNA Repair: NAD, ZINC, IRON, TTQ, FAD.
You can get these though food, but NAD is the molecule that's primarily used up and is the bottle neck in the process so supplementing should be done. NMN is heavily marketed online, and many guru's fall for this. NMN is effective for boosting NAD levels, but Niacin is a much cheaper option. If you take the more expensive option, you are throwing money in the drain that could have been used for other lookmaxing endeavors. Ensure to avoid slow release niacin. That specific form of niacin will cause problems.

Great, we increased the chemical part of the repair equation. The second half of the equation is increasing energy production. Energy is charged ions consumed as part of food. The food comes from plants, or animals, and animals eat plants. So when you trace it all back, all of the ion charging was done by the sun originally. It is the source of all energy.

So when we are thinking about the energy side of the equation, we need to realize it all comes from light. Now we could eat more food, to speed up the energy part of the equation, but that's also causing more metabolic damage in the process. For many foods (you need to research every food), the damage is minimal and you can scale up the repair process by increasing metabolic rate (exercise/cold exposure/etc.) while increasing food consumption (not so much you get fat, because that acerates aging, and avoiding blood sugar spikes with plenty of fiber, and the right nutrient dense foods that cause minimal damage). People have written books are this subject. I recommend the book, "how not to die."

That's all well and good. But what if there was a perfectly clean way to increase energy for repair mechanisms on-top of this, that caused no metabolic damage? Sound too good to be true?

We skip the food process entirely and deliver energy directly to the mitochondria of the cell. We can charge up the ions in the mitochondria directly with red spectrum light. While this only effects the area that the light is hitting, and only to the depth it is capable of hitting (Longer wavelengths have greater penetration), it does free up energy that can then be used for other more deeper repair processes.

Think about it. Even if your in a fasted state, and your body is pumping keytones through your bloodstream rather than glucose or fructose, there's only so much energy that can be delivered so quickly. This is why fat loss tends to cap off at around one pound a day, when doing long term fasting.

But if you deliverer more energy to the body in the form of red spectrum light, you get more repair. When it comes to this, from my knowledge so far, you want to maximize irradiance, surface area, and duration while not causing damage to yourself.

Now you can get this from the sun, especially during the morning and evening. Long wavelengths have deeper penetration, both to your body and the earth's atmosphere. Which means in the early morning and evening when the suns rays have to penetrate much more atmosphere to get to you, many more short wavelengths are filtered out and you get more long wave lengths. Short Wave lengths such as UVB cause DNA damage. Not a big problem because you're body can repair it, but you don't want to waste metabolic energy on repair that you don't have too, because that's energy that won't be used for other repair processes leading to overall faster biological aging.

So that brings us right back to red light devices. We want to penetrate the maximum depth into our body, so again we want very long wave lengths. So near infrared is ideal (950nm - 1050 nm) for penetration but then again the total charge is going to be lower, so combining that with an infrared and red spectrum, and maximizing irradiance is ideal. You just don't want any light with less than 600 nm wavelengths because those short wave lengths will cause DNA damage.

If you charge up certain ions in the body too much, you get all kinds of aging damage. So there's more research you may want to do if you are thinking about being under red light all day or using extremely powerful devices.

So breaking down the damage, and repair processes into their component parts, we've found a complete wholistic solution for DNA repair. Do this, for each type of damage and you age in reverse.

Fasting and IGF-1

There's a lot of disinformation online about fasting and it's effect on aging. Longer fasts will slow or reverse aging by shifting metabolic resources (energy, organ functions, etc.) from the breakdown and processing of food towards repair.

This is why in all animals studies the animals that did fasting live considerable longer, and are healthier in old age. The problem is with how some researchers and scientists convert this to apply to humans.

You HAVE to adjust for metabolic rate. A mouse fasting for a day is a human fasting for a week or two. You're not going to get significant anti-aging effects with time restricted eating. All your going to do in that case is spike and crash your blood sugar which could result in increased aging damage by way of glycation.

You need to burn all the food in your stomach, a day or two (depends on how much fiber you ate and your metabolic rate), before you can start re-utilizing significant metabolic resources for repair. Also your body's ability to switch to these repair processes depends on a number of factors, which can be trained with regular fasting.

So how does IGF-1 play a role in all of this? IGF-1 and other hormones control to what degree the body is in repair or build mode. For optimal physic you want to toggle between full repair mode and full growth mode. Most body builders do a bulk/cut cycle for this.

Bulk/Fasting Cycles are more optimized for antiaging, and if you want to be immortal, this fasting three times a year for a couple weeks isn't going to cut it. You want to maximize repair, and minimize damage. Two weeks on, Two weeks off (as a rough ball park) is going to be optimal. During the transition time between metabolic processes, neither process is going to be optimal, and the sum effect of both processes is going to be less than toggling the processes while minimizing transition time. An example would be eating for one week, fasting for one week is going to be far better than eating for a day, fasting for a day in repeated cycles.

Food vs Supplements

For each of these repair processes we are increasing the chemicals within their required ratio ranges, required for the repair while increasing the total energy available for the chemical reactions to occur.

So we can get these chemicals from food or supplements, and absorb them through our digestive system or skin.

Because many of these chemical reactions require specific ratios, many of those ratios may not be known, nutrient rich food is the optimal method.

Supplements should only be used when it's clear the effect in the body was not the result of a placebo effect, and the data supporting this effect is not correlation data but the result of a controlled study. For example, Vitamin-E supplementation and multi-vitamin supplementation both lower expected life span when in taken in double blind placebo controlled studies.

These reason people take these supplement is because they are looking at population level correlation data. Its' what's called the "healthy user bias". Healthy people make different decisions than the average person, and sometimes those decisions are harmful to the healthy persons health, because most healthy people are doing what they have read or heard makes them healthy. This is why you can't take correlations or population data seriously.

But you also don't want to over generalize and never use supplements. Because that is also sub-optimal. Again, look for placebo-controlled double blinded studies.

Meditation

Stress converts energy from repair to fight or flight response. Like we do with everything else, when we shift metabolic energy from other unneeded processes towards repair, we get more repair, and reverse more biological aging. When this repair becomes greater than damage we age in reverse. Sustain this balance and we do not grow older.

Meditation lowers overall-stress which shifts the balance from fight or flight to repair. This is why meditation measurably increases telomere length and other signs of aging. Twenty minutes a day is effective. You can combine it with redlight therapy.

One way meditation shifts this energy balance is by improving sleep quality which improves repair capacity.

Another is that meditation trains your limbic system to automatically do slow deep breaths. These fuller breaths deliver more oxygen to your blood stream. This oxygen is then used to carry away used up ions, after the cells mitochondria has drained them of energy. This is why oxygen intake is a bottleneck for metabolism, and ALL of the energy that that metabolism uses for repair.

So oxygen intake is a bottleneck for antiaging. This is why oxygen therapy is used and slows down aging, and some people sleep in hyperbaric oxygen chambers every night.

The ultimate anti-aging setup might be breathing straight oxygen, all day long from oxygen tanks while exposed to full infrared and near infrared light spectrum at a very high irradiance from all angles (wearing eye protection).

Other things such as avoiding or having minimal exposure to information systems that put your body into states of anger/fear/fight or flight even on a small subtle level.

What's Possible?

Once you understand this paradigm you can begin optimizing each part of the equation one by one. You may think of technological or methodological solutions that take things further than these small examples here.

Li Ching-Yuen was able to make it 250, with far less knowledge and technology than we have today. There were many witnesses and documents confirming this. Much of what he learned, he learned from a much older man who was over 500 when he met him. There were other reports of much older individuals throughout history. While these could all be hoaxes, hopefully you see that with a greater understanding of chemistry, these may not be hoaxes.

Buy why aren't more people regularly living past 120? Look at the people that live to 120. Many of them are doctors or nutritionists, and they are smart but they're not that smart. They are not optimizing this equation fully. Look at the smartest people, scientists, and influencers advocating for various anti-aging strategies. They're all idiots. No one is optimizing anything.

There is nothing in any of these repair mechanisms that requires specific genetics, while some genes may increase the default rate of the repair mechanisms, as you can see, you can easily increase them in other ways.

I generally skip breakfast each day and don’t go on long fasts. Is this bad, should I stop skipping breakfast? Is extremely short interment fasts actually harmful Or are they just not as good as extended fasts.
Also I’m 17, almost 18, and I’m worried that several day fasts may stunt what little remaining growth I may have. What do you think about that? I heard fasting doesn’t stunt growth but I’m confident that’s true.

 

[Deleted member 81734]

It could be that eating more meat means less anti-oxidants generally, so you get more plaque build up.

Either way, people who eat lots of meat get plaque and have heart issues which eventually kills them.

Meat has all the nutrients required to make the most potent antioxidant, glutathionine(blueberry antioxidants dont do shit), and meat is high in selenium which also has antoxidant properties.
Meat is really only bad if you cook it, since it creates a lot of AGEs and carcinogenic compounds.

 

[enchanted_elixir]

Yes, I've done many multi week fasts for many years. And no, it doesn't take 5+ years to notice anti-aging/aging effects. Models have to be re-assessed every six months to see if they've aged out of the profession. If you are aging forward at a normal pace, you will notice a difference in six months, if you are aging backwards you can notice a difference in one day, such as after a fast when your growth hormones and stem cell levels are high and your skin and other tissues are rebuilt.

Look at Jared Leto, who has done multi-week fasts.

I don't think you could find me any example of some one who does regular multi-week fasts, that doesn't look good for their age.

Fasting increases life span in all animals. There's no reason to believe it wouldn't apply to humans.

Starvemaxing ages your skin, take it from me.

 

[noodlelover]

Starvemaxing ages your skin, take it from me.

were you fasting or in a caloric deficit? And how long? Were you eating clean afterwards?

I believe fasting breaks down your skin, but you have to eat in a surplus afterwards and eat healthy to rebuild it with stem cells. I think the optimal fasting time is between 5 and 20 days.

 

[enchanted_elixir]

were you fasting or in a caloric deficit? And how long? Were you eating clean afterwards?

I believe fasting breaks down your skin, but you have to eat in a surplus afterwards and eat healthy to rebuild it with stem cells. I think the optimal fasting time is between 5 and 20 days.

caloric deficit, 1-2 months.

 

[Akatlyn]

"
So high level, easy, we decrease meat consumption and increase vegetable consumption (this alone reverses atherosclerosis), and supplement with berberine (also reverses atherosclerosis)."

Nope. Meat is good for anti anti agin
Vegans vegetariens people always look older