Roidmaxxing 101™ - How to get a physique halo

this thread should be deleted. women can literally clock when youre roidceling and it gives them the ick. ask yourself this. if more muscle = better then why arent bodybuilders all actors/supermodels who slay and fuck all day? bc roidcelling looks like absolute dog shit jfl. again, the amount of muscle mass needed for you to mog is achievable naturally bc it comes down to your bones and ratios and muscle bellies. argue with a wall im right:lul:
 
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( ( ( d[-_-]b ) ) ) said:
this thread should be deleted. women can literally clock when youre roidceling and it gives them the ick. ask yourself this. if more muscle = better then why arent bodybuilders all actors/supermodels who slay and fuck all day? bc roidcelling looks like absolute dog shit jfl. again, the amount of muscle mass needed for you to mog is achievable naturally bc it comes down to your bones and ratios and muscle bellies. argue with a wall im right:lul:
Click to expand...
Facts, sadly many retards on here think roids will ascend them and make them attractive
 
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AryanSchizo said:
Facts, sadly many retards on here think roids will ascend them and make them attractive
Click to expand...
Ikr why ugh reacted me :feelswat: i said on different contex :lasereyes:
why ugh dude :lasereyes::lasereyes:
 
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SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...

SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
do you know of good aromatase inhib source , and fgfr3 inhibs?
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
how much on average would this cycle be with the test and all things that mitigate side effects money wise
 
Dnr, you have to take multiple other things to mitigate the sides and still age like a faggot. Both of their physiques are easily obtainable being natty with 4 years of proper lifting assuming you go in with all the proper knowledge. PCT in of itself is harmful. Taking roids for some muscle gain if you’re not a body builder is retarded and low ROI and this is a convo most of you retards who can’t produce a single thought for themselves aren’t ready for. To add on to this everyone reacts extremely different to roids.
 
  • +1
Reactions: It'snotover
mirin high effort
 
Arrlo said:
nah i do actually wanna hit 100 bench naturally icl :owo::owo:

then im hopping on because i dont care

it would just be gay as fuck not hitting the milestone beforehand
Click to expand...
jus say u scared to pin 😂😂😂😂😂
 
Thanks life saver, what’s ur thoughts on SUBQ instead of IM for the AAS cycle
 
( ( ( d[-_-]b ) ) ) said:
this thread should be deleted. women can literally clock when youre roidceling and it gives them the ick. ask yourself this. if more muscle = better then why arent bodybuilders all actors/supermodels who slay and fuck all day? bc roidcelling looks like absolute dog shit jfl. again, the amount of muscle mass needed for you to mog is achievable naturally bc it comes down to your bones and ratios and muscle bellies. argue with a wall im right:lul:
Click to expand...
In the context of muscles, all roids do is speed up the rate at which you build muscle and the total amount of muscle you can build.
Whatever ideal muscle mass one desire, one can achieve significantly faster with roids with a tenth of the effort if one had done so naturally. With the right ancillaries, one can do so without harming your health
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
high iq
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
high IQ thread
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
Bump
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
fire bro much love great post reminds me of bb
 
( ( ( d[-_-]b ) ) ) said:
this thread should be deleted. women can literally clock when youre roidceling and it gives them the ick. ask yourself this. if more muscle = better then why arent bodybuilders all actors/supermodels who slay and fuck all day? bc roidcelling looks like absolute dog shit jfl. again, the amount of muscle mass needed for you to mog is achievable naturally bc it comes down to your bones and ratios and muscle bellies. argue with a wall im right:lul:
Click to expand...
What do i do then motherfucker?
 
So i should run 500mg test E or c with GH? as my first cycle, how about start low like 125mg and go up from their also how does test + EQ sound for begineer
 
SlayerJonas said:
Natty lifting is cope. JFL at spending a decade training optimally to end up as looking like someone that has just ended his first cycle. If you're serious about Looksmaxing, you're going to take every shortcut to achieve your goal.

Why should I give a shit about roiding? A body halo is required for both female attention and male respect. If you have the body of a prepubescent boy, no one will take you seriously. You'll be the "friend", but never the guy she's looking for.

However, that doesn't mean a roided physique is able to compensate for a bad face. It is merely a multiplicator of your current looks level and adds few SMV points.

View attachment 4859439View attachment 4859449

After years of experience and research, the only three steroids you'll ever need are testosterone, boldenone, and trenbolone. Every other steroid, SARM, and prohormone is utter garbage and not worth it. Another compound that belongs into every stack is GH. Insulin isn't required for most people, but if you have a good source you might as well match the GH dose for optimal muscle accrual.


Every steroid is structurally derived from either testosterone, 19-nortestosterone, or dihydrotestosterone. These structural differences determine the interaction with the enzymes 5α-reductase and aromatase, the oestrogen and progesterone receptor, and other mechanisms of action.

View attachment 4866695

I will go over a few androgens.

Nandrolone: harsh on hair as it isn't able to be converted into a more tolerable metabolite (5α-dihydronandrolone) in androgenic tissues like skin when using using a 5α-reductase inhibitor. Redundant once you decide to use a topical anti-androgen like RU58841, as you could use stronger and better androgens instead. Nandrolone is also a ligand of the progesterone receptor.

17α-alkylated oral steroids: hepatotoxic in nature due to needing to be metabolised by the liver, which occurs independent of oral or injectable administration. Orals like Halotestin and Superdrol are known for acute strength gains and are used by powerlifters, whilst orals like Anavar are completely redundant.

DHT derivates: rape your hair follicles with the promise of looking drier temporarily. You can counteract this with RU58841, but as with nandrolone, you might as well just use trenbolone instead. They don't interact with aromatase and antagonise the oestrogen receptor, meaning they can be used to control E2 levels.

Exotic androgens: compounds like "The Clear", methyltrienolone, and norboletone are mostly rubbish. There aren't many studies and anecdotal evidence on them, which reduces our harm-reduction capabilities quite a bit. They are very rare and hard to synthesise, leading to these compounds being bunk in most cases.

#1: Testosterone is the main pillar of every steroid cycle and should be your main compound. It is a bioidentical hormone responsible for muscle accrual, bone remodelling, fat distribution, voice deepening, erythropoiesis, sexual wellness including libido, and mental drive. It undergoes 5α-reduction into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and aromatises into oestradiol (E2). E2 is anabolic especially in conjunction with trenbolone, whereas DHT's existence is redundant.

Testosterone is typically administered with an ester that determines the pharmacokinetics of the compound. They most notably determine the half-life of the androgen. The ideal administration route is an intramuscular injection, but on TRT you may do subcutaneous injections for the sake of simplicity.

This is what you need for an injection:
  • 22G needles for drawing the oil
  • 25-27G (higher gauge -> smaller needle) needles to inject the oil
  • Alcohol wipes
  • 2-3mL syringes
  • Optional: 29-31G needles for TRT
You can buy everything on Amazon or even in your local pharmacy for a total of 30usd. It is legal to buy injecting equipment. You prepare the injection by disinfecting the injection site and the top of the vial with an alcohol wipe. Ideal injection spots are the ventrogluteal, deltoid, and the vastus lateralis site.

View attachment 4866575

After preparing the injection site, you assemble the syringe by attaching the 22G needle to it and draw the oil. Then you add the 25-27G needle on top of the syringe and inject the oil into your preferred injection site (e.g. the ventrogluteal site). Aspirating (trying to draw blood with a needle) a needle is cope. However, it can get dangerous if you hit a major blood vessel and inject straight into it. This is extremely uncommon and chances are the needle will go through the blood vessel, which does eliminate any risks. Once you have pushed all of the oil in, throw the needle into a sharps container or into your regular rubbish bin and you're done. Here is also a video.

Contrary to popular belief, the added ester group doesn't have an impact on the pharmacodynamics of the steroid. It is argued that a longer ester is more anabolic, whereas a shorter one causes less aromatisation and concurrent bloat. A proposed mechanism for that is the increasing lipophilicity of longer esters. However, the ester is cleaved off before the testosterone is able to be aromatised, making this a baseless claim. The only thing that matters is the relative injection frequency.

The average male produces around 7mg of testosterone per day (=49mg per week). You would have to inject 66mg of testosterone propionate (relatively short ester weight) per week to match that dose. However, that range is still far from being supraphysiological. You would have to inject 200mg+ to notice supraphysiological effects.

According to this study, injecting 600mg of testosterone whilst training 3 times per week can result in a ~6kg fat-free mass gain within 10 weeks whilst the placebo group gains merely ~2kg of fat-free mass.

#2: Boldenone is a steroid that you can add to your cycle to control your E2 levels. It doesn't cause hair loss, thus making it a better option compared to exemestane, which has the androgenic metabolite 17ß-Hydroxyexemestane, that will rape your hair. Non-steroidal aromatase inhibitors like anastrozole and letrozole are harsh on your lipids, making them unideal to use.

Oestradiol is crucial for most neurotransmitters like serotonin and GABA. To acutely treat an E2 crash, you can use the oral dianabol, which has the metabolite methyloestradiol, that is much stronger than regular oestradiol. Alternatively, you can use exogenous E2 or HCG, which would take a few days to work.

The optimal testosterone-to-boldenone ratio is completely individual and depends on your own aromatisation rate. For most people a ratio of 3:1 to 2:1 is ideal, but measuring your E2 levels on each dose will give you clarity. Boldenone also increases appetite in most individuals due to the increased red blood cell count.

#3: Trenbolone is highly androgenic (and obviously anabolic) meaning it will completely eviscerate your skin and hair if you aren't using the appropiate ancillaries. The synergy of tren is very high with E2 and GH; it is the best steroid for gaining muscle mass, whilst simultaneously dropping bodyfat.

The effects of trenbolone like nutrition partitioning and glucocorticoid receptor antagonism are dose-dependent like with any other pathway in the body, which means "microdosing tren" in the double digits is nonsense. Take a higher dose or go home.

#4: Growth hormone (GH), besides being anabolic if coupled with other compounds, is more of a quality of life drug. It improves REM sleep, synergises with tren and E2, improves joint, bone, and soft tissue health, with some recognised cognitive benefits, making it a favourable compound.

The first cycle:

Your first steroid cycle should consist of 500mg testosterone and 6-8IU of GH. It will be the first time you are experiencing supraphysiological effects of androgens and is more than enough in the beginning. The cycle should last 20-25+ weeks and should be followed by a cruising phase of a few months, ideally matching the cycle length. After the cruise you may start blasting again and titrating the dosage up according to your personal needs.

Intermediate steroid cycles:

Once you're at the point where you're blasting 700-800mg+ of testosterone, you should throw in boldenone following your personal test-to-bold ratio. Thereafter, following the test-to-bold ratio, increase doses accordingly. Alternatively, you may decrease the test to 500mg and throw in tren whilst titrating up to the maximum amount you want to run. This cycle is going to be way harsher on your blood markers and hair, but if you're using the correct ancillaries you are going to make the most gains you have ever made while recomp'ing.


To reduce and/or completely eliminate most side effects and cover all pathways steroids negatively impact, we're going to discuss a handful of ancillaries.

#1: Skin and hair

Dutasteride: nukes an enzyme (5α-reductase) that converts testosterone into the metabolite dihydrotestosterone. 5α-reductase interacts with other androgens like nandrolone, converting them into their 5α-reduced forms. It is also responsible for the synthesis of allopregnanolone, a neurosteroid that acts as a positive allosteric modulator of the GABAA receptor.

A lack of that neurosteroid is the proposed mechanism of the Post-Finasteride syndrome, which only affects 0.1% of individuals. If you want to stay on the safe side, test your brain's genotype (your GABAergic architecture) with a single dose of finasteride, which has a half-life of 6-8 hours, meaning all side effects would be resolved within 1-2 days.

DHT is primarely an intracrine hormone, meaning it exerts its effects in the tissue it is produced in. The tissues in question are mostly the skin, hair follicles, and the penis. DHT is responsible for upregulating sebaceous gland activity, miniaturising hair follicles, and growing the penis during puberty, respectively. I would only recommend using a 5α-reductase inhibitor during puberty, if you are blasting gear. Take atleast 2.5mg daily.

View attachment 4859548

RU-58841: a topical nonsteroidal anti-androgen that didn't pass clinical trials. Its purpose is to reduce the effects of androgens on your skin and scalp by antagonising the androgen receptor (AR). RU-58841 (1-2nM) has a lower binding affinity than testosterone (0.5-1nM) and DHT (0.2-0.3nM), but overpowers them by occupying the receptor site. Apply it daily.

I make my own DIY RU solution:
  • 50mL glass dropper bottle
  • 2-4g of RU58841 powder
  • 5-8mL of DMSO
  • Rest is pure ethanol

Isotretinoin: a retinoid that atrophies sebaceous glands i.e. reduces acne and is decent for anti-aging purposes. It is commonly prescribed by dermatologists for treating persistent cystic acne and is well-studied, with the most notable downsides being mild hepatotoxicity, dry lips and skin, and worsening of your lipid profile.

If you have done a few courses of isotretinoin, downregulation of the sebaceous glands tends to be permanent, meaning you won't get acne after coming off. Taking 10-20mg long-term is well tolerated, but I prefer the approach of reaching a specific cumulative dose over months and never having to worry about acne again.

#2: Blood pressure and left ventricular hypertrophy

Nebivolol: a highly selective ß1-adrenergic receptor blocker that is commonly used to treat high blood pressure (BP). It has vasodilatory proporties and reduces the heart rate. Side effects include hypotension and fatigue, which normally don't occur when used and dosed correctly. Take it outside of your workout window, because a high heart rate is ideal for training. Take up to 5mg daily, any higher than that and it loses its selectivity.

Telmisartan: an Angiotensin II receptor blocker that lowers your BP and is nephroprotective (=protects your kidneys) whilst countering aldosterone-induced bloat. Research suggests partial PPARγ agonistic effects including reducing inflammation, enhanced insulin sensitivity etc. Take 40-80mg daily.

Only combine both beta-blockers and ARBs if your blood pressure and heart rate is too high (Stage 1+ on one of the ancillaries).

View attachment 4859674

#3: Cholesterol

Statins: work by inhibiting HMG-CoA reductase, an enzyme involved in a key step of the cholesterol synthesis pathway. They also increase LDL receptors in the liver meaning more LDL can be removed from the bloodstream. They cause a reduction in C-Reactive protein, tumornecrosis factor alpha and interleukins. Statins also slightly activate PPARα via an overexpression of COX-2.

Statins have a ±10% risk of causing diabetes in men. They also seem to have a negative impact on mitochondrial health, which includes reduced coQ10 levels. You can counteract this by supplementing it additionally, which I personally do at high doses.

There are two major groups of statins: hydrophilic and lipophilic statins. Hydrophilic statins (e.g. rosuvasatin and pravastatin) don't cross the BBB and cause more inflammation, whereas lipohilic statins (e.g. pitavastatin, atorvastatin, and simvastatin) cross the BBB and cause less inflammation.

The best statins by far are pitavastatin and rosuvastatin as they have the best side effect profile. A study shows that pitavastatin reduces total cholesterol by 21%, LDL-C by 31% and increases HDL-C by 14% and 25% at 12 and 104 weeks. Dosage: Take 1-4mg daily.

Rosuvastatin is just as good as seen below. You can take anything from 5 to 40mg. Even a low dosage of 5mg seems to be quite effective.

View attachment 4867229

Ezetimibe: inhibits the absorption of dietary cholesterol. You can expect a reduction of around 30% in total cholesterol. It can improve nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Besides that ezetimibe reduces c-reactive protein. It doesn't affect the absorption of fat-soluble vitamins. Take 5-10mg daily.

Bemdedoic acid: an oral prodrug that inhibits ATP citrate lyase, which is involved in the liver's biosynthesis of cholesterol upstream of HMG-CoA reductase, the enzyme that is blocked by statins. Take 180mg daily.

Bempedoic acid significantly reduces LDL cholesterol levels according to this study.



SR9009: an agonist of Rev-Erbα/ß along with SR9011 and other synthetic Rev-Erbα/ß ligands. SR9009 has multiple benefits like boosting mitochondrial activity, fat metabolism, improving your circadian rhythm, endurance, and inflammation, along with other benefits of you can see below. It also improves the lipid profile.


View attachment 4867256

#4: Oxidative stress and organ health

NAC: a precursor to L-glutathione, that reduces oxidative stress, protects the liver, and organs in general. Is frequently used in clinical settings. Take 2-3g daily, ~1g if you are using a liposomal formulation.

Injectable L-glutathione: as mentioned, a very strong antioxidant that reduces inflammatory markers like TNF-α and IL-6 directly. It is mainly mito-, hepato-, and neuroprotective, making it a nice all-rounder to keep your organs healthy on-cycle. It is also used for skin lightening. Inject 500mg every day.

TUDCA: mainly used as liver support, although NAC/L-glutathione would be more than enough. Liver support is only required on compounds like tren and 17α-alkylated (=orally bioavailable) steroids.

Retatrutide: an agonist of the GLP-1, GIP, and glucagon receptor. You can expect an inprovement in insulin sensitivity, increased energy expenditure, reduced inflammation, and appetite suppression, whilst experiencing only limited side effects like GI irritation and skin sensitivity. It is also a godsent drug to improve your lipid profile significantly, as seen in this study.



View attachment 4872339

#5: Neuroprotection (including modulation of serotonin and oxytocin)

Neurotoxicity mostly occurs on compounds like tren and if you have raped your E2 levels too hard, which you shouldn't since oestrogen is anabolic, keeps your joints healthy, and is neuroprotective. Contrary to popular belief, oxytocin doesn't appear to be impaired on trenbolone. Rather the opposite occurs.

Besides that, oxytocin doesn't appear to be the muh social hormone after all according to this study:



N-Acetyl Semax: modulates BDNF and neurotransmitters like dopamine and serotonin. The acetylation makes BBB penetration easier (it is normally advised to take semax intranasally to bypass the BBB) and causes a higher receptor saturation whilst prolonging the half-life. Dihexa and cerebrolysin may be used alternatively. However, NA-Semax alone will do the job. Taking higher dosages up to 1-2mg is fully tolerated.

Escitalopram: an SSRI. A pure SERT blocker with only minimal secondary receptor interactions and comes with many benefits like being anxiolytic, improving depression and OCD, all whilst being neuroprotective.

Vortioxetine: an even better SSRI that isn't only a SERT blocker, but also a serotonin receptor modulator. It increases BDNF, dopamine, and norepinephrine in the frontal cortex leading to improved neuroplasticity and overall cognition. It doesn't cause any emotional bluntness, but rather lifts you up, and has low sexual side effects.

Rasagiline: a MAO-B inhibitor, which means it nukes the enzyme that normally metabolises dopamine, phenethylamine, and some trace amines, causing an excess of availability. MAO-A stays intact, resulting in normal serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Rasagiline is also slightly mitoprotective due to reducing oxidative stress in dopaminergic neurons.

LIT-001: an agonist of the oxytocin receptor that is able to pass the BBB and doesn't interact with the vasopressin receptor (=agonism would cause bloat). At higher doses it can even be an antagonist of the vasopressin receptor.

#6: Suppression of HPG-axis

HMG and HCG: these two compounds, even moreso the latter, are all you need to keep your HPG-axis intact. HCG imitates LH, whereas HMG imitates FSH, both stimulating your testes. Inject 100-250IU of HCG every other day (EOD) and take a break every 4-5 months (in case you are permablasting) to reset desensitisation of the Leydig cells. Even for people that plan to blast the next few years, it is recommended to do a HCG cycle 1-2x per year.

View attachment 4860270

Taurine: has antioxidant properties. It protects Leydig cells by reducing ROS and improves mitochondrial function. It is naturally abundant in seminal fluid, which means supplementing taurine results in improved sperm quality. take 1-3g daily.

#7: Prolactin management

Liposomal Pyridoxal-5-Phosphat (P-5-P): a good option to control your prolactin levels and to prevent lactation on low to moderate doses of tren. This should be your go-to compound for prolactin management. It also assists the production of neurotransmitters like dopamine, serotonin, and GABA. It is also a cofactor in many enzymes, supporting various processes in the body. Neuropathy is from high dose pyridoxine, not P-5-P. I'd recommend taking 100-200mg daily.

Cabergoline: binds selectively to dopamine D2 receptors and has a long half-life of roughly 2-3 days. It is primarely used to reduce hyperprolactinemia. Cabergoline reduces GH and IGF-1 levels. Take 0.125-0.25mg every 3 days, but only if you are actively experiencing side effects on high dose tren.

#8: Other safety measures, habits, and general advice
  • Donate blood to keep your haematocrit (and red blood cell count) low, especially on boldenone and tren.
  • Get full blood work before, during, and after a blasting phase. This way you can verify whether your gear is dosed correctly, how certain blood markers are affected etc.
  • Locked in with diet and training. If you aren't doing this, NGMI.
  • Do cardio. It improves lipids, heart health, insulin sensitivity, and so much more. It is one of the core pillar "ancillaries" that keeps you healthy.
  • Good sleep with melatonin, DSIP, dual orexin receptor antagonists, magnesium l-threonate, maintaining the same sleeping/waking up time. Only take benzos and other sedatives if completely required.
  • Keep fat intake low, carbs and protein high. 200-300g protein is ideal daily.
  • Stay below 15-20% all throughout the cycle. Start the cycle at a very low bodyfat %.
  • In the very rare case that you end up getting puffy and sensitive nipples, use topical raloxifene.
  • To decrease bloating on-cycle use amiloride or eplerenone.
Click to expand...
" 200-300g protein is ideal daily." jfl at this
 
Lonely said:
yeah, 1.25g/lb is the absolute max

The excess protein is literally useless lmao

The carbs are going to cause way more growth, especially on Tren (using that as a main compound in high doses is fucking stupid but that’s another story lol)

High Test and High Tren lmfao 😂
Click to expand...
Hey bro, do you reckon one can just run a short cycle of TRT and then hop off no issues?
 
GoodLookingAthlete said:
300mg is good for first cycle, I would start with that. Gh is overpriced for the additional marginal gains you get and should be only considered when using such high doses of roids that it’s worth it to add GH instead of simply increasing dosages of roids for health purposes (if you want to become a bb mass monster).

Again I will repeat myself, if you want to get an aesthetic body that girls like, hopping on test is not a good move, better to stay natty and sprinkle a few mild sarm cycles for quicker results.

By doing so I build 13kg of muscle in the first 8 months of lifting and was already more jacked than the vast majority of guys in my gym
Click to expand...
Hey there bro, you seem to know a lot. I was looking to run a short cycle of test, just to get some more muscle, just become bigger, and then take Reta. However, do you think that maybe I would be better off just taking SARMs, like Ostarine?
 
norwyx said:
Hey there bro, you seem to know a lot. I was looking to run a short cycle of test, just to get some more muscle, just become bigger, and then take Reta. However, do you think that maybe I would be better off just taking SARMs, like Ostarine?
Click to expand...
If you could do a few 6 to 8 week cycles per year of 5 to 10mg of osta per week, you could probably end up with an additional 3 to 5kg of additionnal muscle mass compared to what you would have put on if natty without running into suppression issues etc.

I would recommend it instead of blasting test where you have to deal with pinning stuff, learning to manage estrogen, potentially pct etc.

Also if you plan on becoming a Sarm goblin, you will be "half natty" so to see good results you will have to train very hard in the gym and bulk properly (where you will end up with some chunk at the end)
 
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GoodLookingAthlete said:
If you could do a few 6 to 8 week cycles per year of 5 to 10mg of osta per week, you could probably end up with an additional 3 to 5kg of additionnal muscle mass compared to what you would have put on if natty without running into suppression issues etc.

I would recommend it instead of blasting test where you have to deal with pinning stuff, learning to manage estrogen, potentially pct etc.

Also if you plan on becoming a Sarm goblin, you will be "half natty" so to see good results you will have to train very hard in the gym and bulk properly (where you will end up with some chunk at the end)
Click to expand...
Extremely high IQ reply from you, bro. Thank you so much.

And just super quickly. I just Googled and read a little bit about it (Ostarine). What do you think about hepatic failure? Is it common?

Because I googled, and since you're not pinning it (rather, you are taking the pills), it goes through your stomach and all of that, so is that not dangerous? Have you done Ostarine?
 
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