Subcision- the best way to defeat acne scars

[OneTwoThree]

If you managed to defeat your active acne but scars remained then before you decide to do a laser, phenol treatment you should think about subcision.

Subcision is a minor surgical procedure used for treating depressed cutaneous scars and wrinkles. It is also called subcutaneous incisional surgery. Subcision is performed using a special hypodermic needle inserted through a puncture in the skin surface. The sharp edge of the needle is used to break fibrotic strands that are tethering the scar to the underlying tissue.

The release of the fibrotic strands and new collagen deposition caused by wound healing leads to cosmetic improvement of the scar. Subcision can be safely performed in the outpatient setting and is usually well tolerated.

After that your scars will be lifted. Hear it how does breaking fibres sound like.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

@AySab thoughts?

 

[Deleted member 23558]

fuckkk sounds so satisfyig

 

[AySab]

@AySab thoughts?

Yup, its really good, usually the approach for acne scars should be subscision, c02 laser, TCA and then some light microneedling for whatever reason.
Filler and PN (even maybe PDO) injections can be paired with this for giga results as they act like structural support as they further help with collagen production.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Yup, its really good, usually the approach for acne scars should be subscision, c02 laser, TCA and then some light microneedling for whatever reason.
Filler and PN (even maybe PDO) injections can be paired with this for giga results as they act like structural support as they further help with collagen production.

hylauronic filler? Dont they migrate? and fillers have risk of hitting artery right and causing occlusions

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Yup, its really good, usually the approach for acne scars should be subscision, c02 laser, TCA and then some light microneedling for whatever reason.
Filler and PN (even maybe PDO) injections can be paired with this for giga results as they act like structural support as they further help with collagen production.

nga how tf u have negative post rep when one of the most knowledgeable user on site

 

[AySab]

hylauronic filler? Dont they migrate? and fillers have risk of hitting artery right and causing occlusions

Yes, true, but if done properly it can grant good results, usually the filler wont go too deep as its going to be injected with the same needle chopping away at the tissues holding your scars down.

 

[AySab]

nga how tf u have negative post rep when one of the most knowledgeable user on site

honestly, idk, ive been on this site for a bit (lurking) but decided to make a account.
I was bullied for my looks for a long time which is what snapped me and probably motivated me to research on stuff relating to skin, hormones, diy procedures etc.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Yes, true, but if done properly it can grant good results, usually the filler wont go too deep as its going to be injected with the same needle chopping away at the tissues holding your scars down.

do u have any tips on weight loss? and any thoughts on tattoos?

 

[AySab]

do u have any tips on weight loss? and any thoughts on tattoos?

weight loss is kinda weird because it depends on your metabolic process, drink a energy drink and take adderall for appetite suppression.
Then right after your meals, go on a walk.
I was born naturally skinny so I dont really know too much when it comes to weight loss.
Tattoos are cool, definitely some niche appeal, but I usually migrate from that as I want to look somewhat professional as I grow older

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Yup, its really good, usually the approach for acne scars should be subscision, c02 laser, TCA and then some light microneedling for whatever reason.
Filler and PN (even maybe PDO) injections can be paired with this for giga results as they act like structural support as they further help with collagen production.

is it counter intuitive to do TCA before subcision/ co2? Bcos tca i have it at hand while i havent even had a consult for subcision

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

@AySab thoughts?

Yup, its really good, usually the approach for acne scars should be subscision, c02 laser, TCA and then some light microneedling for whatever reason.
Filler and PN (even maybe PDO) injections can be paired with this for giga results as they act like structural support as they further help with collagen production.

Doesn't subcision cause facial sagging? This side effect was reported a lot on the forums. Also it is used for untethering scars, and they can retether after a few months so it isn't really permament unless you do a few treatments.

Once i'll get rid of all acne and PIE i'll try to find a better solution

 

[AySab]

Doesn't subcision cause facial sagging? This side effect was reported a lot on the forums. Also it is used for untethering scars, and they can retether after a few months so it isn't really permament unless you do a few treatments.

Once i'll get rid of all acne and PIE i'll try to find a better solution

Yes, thats true, it does cause facial sagging but thats because many people dont do fillers/pn injections to act as structural support while their body produces collagen.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Doesn't subcision cause facial sagging? This side effect was reported a lot on the forums. Also it is used for untethering scars, and they can retether after a few months so it isn't really permament unless you do a few treatments.

Once i'll get rid of all acne and PIE i'll try to find a better solution

How would the fibres retether in the exact same way as before and create scarring again . Sounds not well thought out

 

[AySab]

is it counter intuitive to do TCA before subcision/ co2? Bcos tca i have it at hand while i havent even had a consult for subcision

Subcision should be definitely the first thing you should do, especially with deep acne scars.
Then CO2 and then TCA or microneedling.
Subcision is expensive, and will only be handed down to others who have deep acne scarring, also known as tethered scars.

 

[AySab]

How would the fibres retether in the exact same way as before and create scarring again . Sounds not well thought out

it can only happen during the healing process, this is why optimal collagen production is needed. (Like Filler)

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Subcision should be definitely the first thing you should do, especially with deep acne scars.
Then CO2 and then TCA or microneedling.
Subcision is expensive, and will only be handed down to others who have deep acne scarring, also known as tethered scars.

Wb mild atrophic scars like Chris pine ? Would tca help him without subcision?

 

[AySab]

Wb mild atrophic scars like Chris pine ? Would tca help him without subcision?

Cant really see a picture of his skin without makeup, mind sharing one?

 

[AySab]

Wb mild atrophic scars like Chris pine ? Would tca help him without subcision?

Cant really see a picture of his skin without makeup, mind sharing one?

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Cant really see a picture of his skin without makeup, mind sharing one?

Here?

 

[AySab]

Here?

View attachment 2873581

it seems fine, i see nothing, so probably grade 2 acne scars which can easily be treated with microneedling + stack.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

it seems fine, i see nothing, so probably grade 2 acne scars which can easily be treated with microneedling + stack.

For me tca cheaper than microneedling wdid? I also have some residual PIH as I have said

 

[AySab]

For me tca cheaper than microneedling wdid? I also have some residual PIH as I have said

if the TCA is cheaper, sure go ahead.
but follow those instructions to avoid melasma.
I would definitely try injectable peptides for better wound healing. (If you can afford it)
If not, look for some oral vitamin C.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

if the TCA is cheaper, sure go ahead.
but follow those instructions to avoid melasma.
I would definitely try injectable peptides for better wound healing. (If you can afford it)
If not, look for some oral vitamin C.

Oral vitamin c liposomal best? I thought serum vit c better if I couldn’t get injectable

 

[AySab]

Oral vitamin c liposomal best? I thought serum vit c better if I couldn’t get injectable

liposomal is good, you can def pair up with vit c serum + liposomal. Usually Vitamin C serums arent strong enough to penetrate through the barrier and even become weaker each time its exposed to oxygen.
Just make sure to take it 30minutes before you eat anything on an empty stomach (preferably in the morning).

 

[RealSurgerymax]

In theory

 

[Deleted member 23558]

In theory

What’s best don’t blueball

 

[Deleted member 23558]

liposomal is good, you can def pair up with vit c serum + liposomal. Usually Vitamin C serums arent strong enough to penetrate through the barrier and even become weaker each time its exposed to oxygen.
Just make sure to take it 30minutes before you eat anything on an empty stomach (preferably in the morning).

Any thoughts on silicone sheets for keloid

 

[AySab]

Any thoughts on silicone sheets for keloid

havent done too much research on that, I had burn scars which were I tried a silicone gel which barely worked (guessing cause it wasnt raised).
Try silicone gels and if it doesn’t work, youll probably need some corticosteroid.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

havent done too much research on that, I had burn scars which were I tried a silicone gel which barely worked (guessing cause it wasnt raised).
Try silicone gels and if it doesn’t work, youll probably need some corticosteroid.

these sheets are supposed to be on for 12 hours it seems , so may have higher efficacy than gel. I’m scared of corticosteroids don’t they cause darkening if skin? @vinn98 had bad experience w them

 

[AySab]

these sheets are supposed to be on for 12 hours it seems , so may have higher efficacy than gel. I’m scared of corticosteroids don’t they cause darkening if skin? @vinn98 had bad experience w them

corticosteroids is usually used for treating hyperpigmentation, usually they are paired with other lightening ingredients like tretinoin and hydroquinone.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

corticosteroids is usually used for treating hyperpigmentation, usually they are paired with other lightening ingredients like tretinoin and hydroquinone.

The keloid is on my nose tip do I put corticosteroids there?

 

[AySab]

The keloid is on my nose tip do I put corticosteroids there?

View attachment 2873599

yes.
if you like experimenting on your self,
try the LZ1 peptide for acne.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

yes.
if you like experimenting on your self,
try the LZ1 peptide for acne.

Just took closeups so much PIH and huge open pores. I hope glycolic closes the pores and smooths skin texture atleast brutll

 

[AySab]

Just took closeups so much PIH and huge open pores. I hope glycolic closes the pores and smooths skin texture atleast brutll

have you experimented with isotretinoin or dutasteride for closing sebaceous gland to get rid of open pores?

 

[Deleted member 23558]

have you experimented with isotretinoin or dutasteride for closing sebaceous gland to get rid of open pores?

Dutasteride topical ? No , I’ve heard of micro Botox for closing up pores tho but I’d prefer natural trials first

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

try the LZ1 peptide for acne.

Can u blackpill me on this?

 

[AySab]

Dutasteride topical ? No , I’ve heard of micro Botox for closing up pores tho but I’d prefer natural trials first

Sebaceous Gland Ablation (SGA) should be something to consider as well. Good luck bro.

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

Dutasteride topical ? No , I’ve heard of micro Botox for closing up pores tho but I’d prefer natural trials first

Oral duta decreases sebum production due to inhibiting the 1st 5AR isoenzyme

 

[AySab]

Can u blackpill me on this?

LZ1 with 15 amino acid residues containing strong antimicrobial activity against bacteria pathogens of acne vulgaris including Propionibacterium acnes Staphylococcus epidermidis and S. aureus.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3755965/#:~:text=A designed peptide named LZ1,acnes ability.

 

[Deleted member 23558]

Oral duta decreases sebum production due to inhibiting the 1st 5AR isoenzyme

Not keen on the dht suppression, I’ll try some other stuff first ; will let uk if glycolic acif worked

 

[AySab]

Oral duta decreases sebum production due to inhibiting the 1st 5AR isoenzyme

yes, nuking your DHT is probably the fastest way to clear skin apart from LZ1 and isotretinoin.

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

LZ1 with 15 amino acid residues containing strong antimicrobial activity against bacteria pathogens of acne vulgaris including Propionibacterium acnes Staphylococcus epidermidis and S. aureus.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3755965/#:~:text=A designed peptide named LZ1,acnes ability.

Do you think it mogs using a BP 10% cleanser? That's what i do now.

Also mirin your knowledge boyo

 

[AySab]

Do you think it mogs using a BP 10% cleanser? That's what i do now.

Also mirin your knowledge boyo

yes, it giga-mogs benzoyl peroxide, in the study it was compared to clindamycin and showed better results at 4 times less the dosage.
It completely inhibited three types of acne at 0.6µg/ml (minimum intake).
It also has anti-inflammatory properties and was very easily bindable in human plasma.
So it could mog a isotretinion and anti-histamine stack.

 

[Saisei]

good thread

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

yes, it giga-mogs benzoyl peroxide, in the study it was compared to clindamycin and showed better results at 4 times less the dosage.
It completely inhibited three types of acne at 0.6µg/ml (minimum intake).
It also has anti-inflammatory properties and was very easily bindable in human plasma.
So it could mog a isotretinion and anti-histamine stack.

I'll def try to buy it since am still getting breakouts even with taz, b5 megadose, BP, azelaic acid etc.

And i want to buy duta, but it's kinda an experimental treatment. In theory it should work since the people with a 5AR deficiency don't have acne but for some reason we don't have high quality studies on actual treatment with duta/fin and the ones we have don't show a huge improvement.

Perhaps it's because of the T increase and that still contributes to acne. Or DHT is only one of the culprits and not treating the other causes (igf-1, bacteria, lack of exfoliating the clogger hair follicle via tret or AHA/BHA? did i miss some cause that we need to adress?) will not show significant results in studies.

And the igf-1 part of the equation is a problem. AFAIK you can't really reduce igf-1 in the skin only and reducing it systemically is bad for growth prior to reaching full maturation. How do you think it should be adressed? Or maybe if we take care of the other causes this one could be left alone

Also what is the reason for pairing isotret with antihistamines?

 

[AySab]

I'll def try to buy it since am still getting breakouts even with taz, b5 megadose, BP, azelaic acid etc.

And i want to buy duta, but it's kinda an experimental treatment. In theory it should work since the people with a 5AR deficiency don't have acne but for some reason we don't have high quality studies on actual treatment with duta/fin and the ones we have don't show a huge improvement.

Perhaps it's because of the T increase and that still contributes to acne. Or DHT is only one of the culprits and not treating the other causes (igf-1, bacteria, lack of exfoliating the clogger hair follicle via tret or AHA/BHA? did i miss some cause that we need to adress?) will not show significant results in studies.

And the igf-1 part of the equation is a problem. AFAIK you can't really reduce igf-1 in the skin only and reducing it systemically is bad for growth prior to reaching full maturation. How do you think it should be adressed? Or maybe if we take care of the other causes this one could be left alone

Also what is the reason for pairing isotret with antihistamines?

Isotretinion will actually slow down most of those hormones that you have mentioned because its related to the pathogenesis of acne.
You can try Dut to stop type 1 and 2 5ar but you need dht in puberty, especially if you want to have sex.
There are a lot of causes of acne, its a rabbit hole and its very easy to fall into and you realise how incurable it actually is.
Best bet is isotretinoin, but without proper discipline, itll come back.
Anti-histamines reduce the inflammation caused by acne, most acne is inflamed, which is why anti-histamines are used with isotretinoin.
This will also help reducing the visibility of acne.

This is what I recommend for getting rid of acne forever (hopefully),
Isotretinoin, anti-histamine and for after care, tretinoin 0.1.
Dutasteride.
LZ1.

 

[AySab]

I'll def try to buy it since am still getting breakouts even with taz, b5 megadose, BP, azelaic acid etc.

And i want to buy duta, but it's kinda an experimental treatment. In theory it should work since the people with a 5AR deficiency don't have acne but for some reason we don't have high quality studies on actual treatment with duta/fin and the ones we have don't show a huge improvement.

Perhaps it's because of the T increase and that still contributes to acne. Or DHT is only one of the culprits and not treating the other causes (igf-1, bacteria, lack of exfoliating the clogger hair follicle via tret or AHA/BHA? did i miss some cause that we need to adress?) will not show significant results in studies.

And the igf-1 part of the equation is a problem. AFAIK you can't really reduce igf-1 in the skin only and reducing it systemically is bad for growth prior to reaching full maturation. How do you think it should be adressed? Or maybe if we take care of the other causes this one could be left alone

Also what is the reason for pairing isotret with antihistamines?

and of course, dont eat sugar, or limit the amount youre taking at one time because itll cause a spike of insulin which will definitely spike a breakout (if youre sensitive to it).

 

[AySab]

I'll def try to buy it since am still getting breakouts even with taz, b5 megadose, BP, azelaic acid etc.

And i want to buy duta, but it's kinda an experimental treatment. In theory it should work since the people with a 5AR deficiency don't have acne but for some reason we don't have high quality studies on actual treatment with duta/fin and the ones we have don't show a huge improvement.

Perhaps it's because of the T increase and that still contributes to acne. Or DHT is only one of the culprits and not treating the other causes (igf-1, bacteria, lack of exfoliating the clogger hair follicle via tret or AHA/BHA? did i miss some cause that we need to adress?) will not show significant results in studies.

And the igf-1 part of the equation is a problem. AFAIK you can't really reduce igf-1 in the skin only and reducing it systemically is bad for growth prior to reaching full maturation. How do you think it should be adressed? Or maybe if we take care of the other causes this one could be left alone

Also what is the reason for pairing isotret with antihistamines?

B5 overdose was a interesting study, but there are other supplements that you can take instead, although B5 shouldn’t cause any insane health concerns.

 

[cyprian_tomaszewski]

Isotretinion will actually slow down most of those hormones that you have mentioned because its related to the pathogenesis of acne.
You can try Dut to stop type 1 and 2 5ar but you need dht in puberty, especially if you want to have sex.
There are a lot of causes of acne, its a rabbit hole and its very easy to fall into and you realise how incurable it actually is.
Best bet is isotretinoin, but without proper discipline, itll come back.
Anti-histamines reduce the inflammation caused by acne, most acne is inflamed, which is why anti-histamines are used with isotretinoin.
This will also help reducing the visibility of acne.

This is what I recommend for getting rid of acne forever (hopefully),
Isotretinoin, anti-histamine and for after care, tretinoin 0.1.
Dutasteride.
LZ1.

Yes accutane is of course the best treatment but it reduces igf-1 by 20-50%. Igf-1 is partly responsible for acne but it's also responsible for growth.

Hgh along with insulin,thyroid hormones and protein creates igf-1 which is responsible for bone growth related to height (the correlation between igf-1 and height was like 0.9 iirc) frame and your face.

Which is why i think reducing DHT is a better approach, the sexual sides affect 2-4% (from the original FDA approval studies) as long as you are tanner stage 5 you shouldn't experience any stunted development since DHT only works in the areas it is produced ( skin, hair and prostate) where it only does bad things and induce hair growth on your beard and body which i consider bad

Do you think taking anti histamines with treatments other than accutane is legit?