Vorinostat + Comprehensible Input = Native French Accent?

[Alexanderr]

Alright lads, logging my French-maxxing journey. I'm aiming to ascend into a true polyglot.

So, the method is basically Refold, or the Stephen Krashen model. The idea is you focus entirely on comprehensible input. You just consume tons of content you can mostly understand(shows, podcasts, books) without forcing yourself to speak until you're ready. You delay speech until you've built up a massive foundation of understanding first. It's how we all learned our first language, we listened for years before we started talking shit. I'm using Anki flashcards to get a base vocabulary, but the real meat is just hours and hours of listening and reading.

But here's the kicker: I'm stacking this with vorinostat. Why? Vorinostat is an HDAC inhibitor, and studies have shown these can literally re-open the critical period for learning things like perfect pitch. I'm using perfect pitch as a proxy here because if the drug can make your brain plastic enough to perceive and reproduce musical tones with perfect accuracy, it should do the same for language sounds.

The biggest reason most adult learners have a permanent accent is that their brain tries to cram new sounds into the phonetic boxes of their native language. For me, that's Dutch and English. This stops you from ever really hearing the language as natives do, which completely tanks your ability to pronounce things naturally. Vorinostat should make my brain more plastic (basically young again in terms of neuroplasticity) so it can build new phonetic boxes for French sounds instead of just filtering them through what I already know.

This all ties into the idea that language learning is mostly a subconscious process. Your conscious brain trying to micromanage grammar and translate in your head just gets in the way. You want your brain to just absorb the patterns naturally, like a kid. Vorinostat should help recreate the conditions where the brain is actually malleable enough to do that properly, instead of being locked into adult patterns where you're always filtering everything through existing knowledge.

Why bother with all this? Native-level pronunciation and fluency. Most adult learners never fully shake their accent. I feel like this combo gives me a legitimate shot at it, plus faster acquisition overall. I've already used it a few times while watching French shows, and while I don't comprehend everything, it's definitely habituated me to just hearing the language. You know that uncomfortable mental friction you get when you're listening to something you don't understand? I don't really have that anymore. Can't say for certain if it's the vorinostat or just getting used to it, but it feels like my brain can just more easily make sense of what it's hearing now.

Oh, one can obviously also try to acquire absolute pitch using this.

TLDR: Using vorinostat (an HDAC inhibitor that reopens critical period plasticity) alongside comprehensible input methods to actually acquire native-level French pronunciation and fluency instead of just learning it like a typical adult with a permanent accent.

Relevant studies:

1. Gervain J, Vines BW, Chen LM, Seo RJ, Hensch TK, Werker JF, Young AH. Valproate reopens critical-period learning of absolute pitch. Front Syst Neurosci. 2013 Dec 3;7:102. doi: 10.3389/fnsys.2013.00102. PMID: 24348349; PMCID: PMC3848041.
2. Krashen, Stephen. "Principles and practice in second language acquisition." (1982).
3. Bubna AK. Vorinostat-An Overview. Indian J Dermatol. 2015 Jul-Aug;60(4):419. doi: 10.4103/0019-5154.160511. PMID: 26288427; PMCID: PMC4533557.

 

[CheifCessation]

DNR

 

[Jager]

learning language and accent is boring but good thread

 

[Alexanderr]

DNR

 

[Finnishmogger]

Nice thread interesting

 

[Luca_.]

So, the method is basically Refold, or the Stephen Krashen model. The idea is you focus entirely on comprehensible input. You just consume tons of content you can mostly understand(shows, podcasts, books) without forcing yourself to speak until you're ready. You delay speech until you've built up a massive foundation of understanding first. It's how we all learned our first language, we listened for years before we started talking shit. I'm using Anki flashcards to get a base vocabulary, but the real meat is just hours and hours of listening and reading.

Easiest and most efficient way to learn a new language imo. I know people irl who have been taking English classes for 5 years and can barely form a sentence. Im planning to learn German this way as well

 

[Alexanderr]

learning language and accent is boring but good thread

Not boring at all.

Imagine if you only spoke your native language and not English (assuming English isn't your native language); think about how restricted you'd be in terms of information access. Speaking multiple languages is like having multiple entryways into entire cultures, with all the benefits attached. More likely to make social contacts, find jobs, access information that never gets translated, consume media in its original form, travel without being a tourist, etc.

Okay, maybe you meant to process to fluency. I agree, the starter stages where you don't comprehend much are the hardest. This is why it's wisest to start with shows you know you love.

 

[Jason Voorhees]

Damn that’s actually fascinating. I could probably use this myself I’ve got an Indian accent and attend voice coaching. I even made a thread about it.

My accent reduction classes start from next week

Finally booked it. I'm trying to get my accent to a Neutral British accent or the modern RP. Not as posh as regular RP but still good. I got a C1 and Band 8 in my overall assessment. More or less just as fluent as highly educated native speaker of English so they told I don't need to attend...

looksmax.org

For me it's mainly the retroflex consonants or lack of it and rhythm like English has all these subtle intonation shifts that just don't come naturally when you grow up speaking Indian English. L Even when I know how a word should sound. my mouth automatically defaults to the old patterns. So I have either talk slowly or think before I speak every word
there’s always that little trace I can’t shake. If vorinostat really does boost neuroplasticity like that, it could probably help rewire how I perceive and produce sounds too. Might finally be able to retrain my ear and tongue actually hear the subtle differences instead of forcing it through my native accent filter.

 

[Alexanderr]

Easiest and most efficient way to learn a new language imo. I know people irl who have been taking English classes for 5 years and can barely form a sentence. Im planning to learn German this way as well

I was considering German too. It's closest to Dutch, and me knowing Dutch along with English would mean it'd be really easy to learn, all things considered. I might still learn it in the future, but honestly, I don't have as much intrinsic motivation to learn it as I do French. German would be nice to have because I like history (especially combat history) and it's close to where I live, but Germany feels too similar to the Netherlands for me to feel like it opens many new doors. With French, I'd get access to a completely different culture, different media, different perspective; it feels like more of an expansion rather than just adding a closely related neighbor language.

 

[Jason Voorhees]

Easiest and most efficient way to learn a new language imo. I know people irl who have been taking English classes for 5 years and can barely form a sentence. Im planning to learn German this way as well

accent isn't something you can consciously "train" like memorizing vocabulary. It's mostly a subconscious process tied to auditory perception and motor mapping in the brain.

The auditory cortex handles how we perceive subtle sound distinctions this is what gets "tuned" to your native language early in life.

The easiest way of learning and accent is exposure and lot of immersion. When you're surrounded by the accent
your brain starts remapping those auditory and motor patterns naturally without you forcing it It's slow but the most authentic way to actually sound native. Many Immigrants even after years of spending time in their new countries often have an accent because they never exposed themselves to native speakers and only mingled with their own groups.

 

[Luca_.]

I was considering German too. It's closest to Dutch, and me knowing Dutch along with English would mean it'd be really easy to learn, all things considered. I might still learn it in the future, but honestly, I don't have as much intrinsic motivation to learn it as I do French. German would be nice to have because I like history (especially combat history) and it's close to where I live, but Germany feels too similar to the Netherlands for me to feel like it opens many new doors. With French, I'd get access to a completely different culture, different media, different perspective; it feels like more of an expansion rather than just adding a closely related neighbor language.

I want to learn German for the same reason. Im thinking of moving to the Netherlands sometime in the future and knowing German+English would make life there much easier. French is also a really fun language but it’s really hard imo. Pronunciation is sort of easy but the grammar is what throws me off

 

[pentamogged9000]

why would you want to be french?

i just played a game with 2 french, i had to ask if they were french and immediately leave voice chat
their accents are so despicable. i feel bad for immigrants who go to france and have to listen to retards with that accent

 

[Nebelix28]

When 2025 survey?

 

[LXR]

Have you mastered the IPA ? That would smoothen the journey with regards to the accent

 

[Luca_.]

accent isn't something you can consciously "train" like memorizing vocabulary. It's mostly a subconscious process tied to auditory perception and motor mapping in the brain.

The auditory cortex handles how we perceive subtle sound distinctions this is what gets "tuned" to your native language early in life.

The easiest way of learning and accent is exposure and lot of immersion. When you're surrounded by the accent
your brain starts remapping those auditory and motor patterns naturally without you forcing it It's slow but the most authentic way to actually sound native. Many Immigrants even after years of spending time in their new countries often have an accent because they never exposed themselves to native speakers and only mingled with their own groups.

Thanks for teaching me that I honestly never had a problem with my accent. If I hear a 10 minute audio of people speaking in X language I can replicate the accent really accurately

 

[Alexanderr]

why would you want to be french?

i just played a game with 2 french, i had to ask if they were french and immediately leave voice chat
their accents are so despicable. i feel bad for immigrants who go to france and have to listen to retards with that accent

I don't, but I like the language, and I'd like to learn it. I don't even wanna live in France, I don't think, but lots of great movies, shows, books and media are from France. Look at my avi, and you'll understand. Moreover, it's just cool to be able to surprise people you know with you speaking a completely different language.

 

[Alexanderr]

When 2025 survey?

December, probably.

 

[Debetro]

I was considering German too. It's closest to Dutch, and me knowing Dutch along with English would mean it'd be really easy to learn, all things considered. I might still learn it in the future, but honestly, I don't have as much intrinsic motivation to learn it as I do French. German would be nice to have because I like history (especially combat history) and it's close to where I live, but Germany feels too similar to the Netherlands for me to feel like it opens many new doors. With French, I'd get access to a completely different culture, different media, different perspective; it feels like more of an expansion rather than just adding a closely related neighbor language.

I'm on my way to understand and speak (to a lesser or greater extent) English, German, French, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Polish, Dutch, Norwegian and Serbo-Croatian.
I don't think I need much more, afterwards I'll focus in Baltics, Swedish, Danish, and maybe some niche ones like Icelandic.
Oh and Latin and Ancient Greek, I forgot them.

 

[Alexanderr]

accent isn't something you can consciously "train" like memorizing vocabulary. It's mostly a subconscious process tied to auditory perception and motor mapping in the brain.

The auditory cortex handles how we perceive subtle sound distinctions this is what gets "tuned" to your native language early in life.

The easiest way of learning and accent is exposure and lot of immersion. When you're surrounded by the accent
your brain starts remapping those auditory and motor patterns naturally without you forcing it It's slow but the most authentic way to actually sound native. Many Immigrants even after years of spending time in their new countries often have an accent because they never exposed themselves to native speakers and only mingled with their own groups.

Your case is actually a perfect example of exactly what I'm talking about in my thread. You've hit the wall that almost every adult language learner hits; the gap between conscious knowledge and subconscious execution.

What you're describing is the core problem: you know how the sounds should be produced, you've had professional coaching, but your mouth keeps defaulting to the deeply ingrained motor patterns from Indian English. That's because your brain isn't actually hearing British English sounds as distinct categories; it's filtering them through your existing phonetic inventory and mapping them to the closest Indian English equivalent. So when you try to reproduce them, you're not accessing a true native-like representation, you're accessing a "close enough" approximation that your brain filed away.

This is exactly why the CPH (critical period hypothesis) matters for accent. After the critical period closes, your brain loses the plasticity to form genuinely new phonetic categories and motor programs. You can learn the rules consciously (which you clearly have), but you can't easily acquire them subconsciously, which is what you need for automatic, effortless native-like speech.

The vorinostat approach is specifically aimed at reopening that plasticity window. It wouldn't magically give you the accent, but it should make your brain receptive enough that the practice you're already doing with your voice coach can actually rewire the subconscious patterns instead of just being something you consciously monitor and correct in real-time. Basically letting you perceive the subtle differences properly and build new motor programs that become automatic, rather than staying stuck in the "think before every word" mode.

If you're already doing the work with voice coaching, adding vorinostat might be the missing piece that actually lets that training stick at a subconscious level. Worth considering imo.

 

[Debetro]

I don't, but I like the language, and I'd like to learn it. I don't even wanna live in France, I don't think, but lots of great movies, shows, books and media are from France. Look at my avi, and you'll understand. Moreover, it's just cool to be able to surprise people you know with you speaking a completely different language.

Learn it. It's funny and understanding multiple languages gives you power and access to opportunities and things you could not achieve otherwise. And it's good for your brain.

 

[Alexanderr]

Have you mastered the IPA ? That would smoothen the journey with regards to the accent

Good shout, and I see the logic. But for this specific experiment, mastering the IPA is actually the opposite of what I'm trying to do.
The whole philosophy behind the Krashen/Refold method is that conscious interference is the enemy of natural acquisition. The IPA is a conscious, analytical tool. It's "learning" about the language, not "acquiring" it.

If I'm trying to speak and my brain is thinking "Okay, that's the voiceless postalveolar fricative /ʃ/," I'm using my analytical mind. That's the exact process that causes hesitation and prevents fluency. You want the sound to be linked to a feeling and a motor program, not a symbol on a chart.

The user who was talking about his Indian accent is a good example of this problem. He consciously knows how the words are supposed to sound, but his subconscious motor patterns haven't been rewired. Relying on the IPA for production just makes you a better conscious "Monitor," but it doesn't build the subconscious foundation.

My goal here, especially with the vorinostat, is to force my brain to do the work subconsciously by feeding it massive amounts of input and making it plastic enough to build new categories on its own. I want to bypass my conscious, analytical brain as much as possible.

Maybe once I'm further along and hitting specific pronunciation issues I'll use it as a diagnostic tool, but for now I'm betting on the combination of massive input + vorinostat to handle the phonetics naturally.

 

[LXR]

Good shout, and I see the logic. But for this specific experiment, mastering the IPA is actually the opposite of what I'm trying to do.
The whole philosophy behind the Krashen/Refold method is that conscious interference is the enemy of natural acquisition. The IPA is a conscious, analytical tool. It's "learning" about the language, not "acquiring" it.

If I'm trying to speak and my brain is thinking "Okay, that's the voiceless postalveolar fricative /ʃ/," I'm using my analytical mind. That's the exact process that causes hesitation and prevents fluency. You want the sound to be linked to a feeling and a motor program, not a symbol on a chart.

The user who was talking about his Indian accent is a good example of this problem. He consciously knows how the words are supposed to sound, but his subconscious motor patterns haven't been rewired. Relying on the IPA for production just makes you a better conscious "Monitor," but it doesn't build the subconscious foundation.

My goal here, especially with the vorinostat, is to force my brain to do the work subconsciously by feeding it massive amounts of input and making it plastic enough to build new categories on its own. I want to bypass my conscious, analytical brain as much as possible.

Maybe once I'm further along and hitting specific pronunciation issues I'll use it as a diagnostic tool, but for now I'm betting on the combination of massive input + vorinostat to handle the phonetics naturally.

Understood, you don't want to think twice before uttering a sound. I'll look more into this field then. I have trouble with my own native language since I am used to speaking English

 

[Jason Voorhees]

Your case is actually a perfect example of exactly what I'm talking about in my thread. You've hit the wall that almost every adult language learner hits; the gap between conscious knowledge and subconscious execution.

What you're describing is the core problem: you know how the sounds should be produced, you've had professional coaching, but your mouth keeps defaulting to the deeply ingrained motor patterns from Indian English. That's because your brain isn't actually hearing British English sounds as distinct categories; it's filtering them through your existing phonetic inventory and mapping them to the closest Indian English equivalent. So when you try to reproduce them, you're not accessing a true native-like representation, you're accessing a "close enough" approximation that your brain filed away.

This is exactly why the CPH (critical period hypothesis) matters for accent. After the critical period closes, your brain loses the plasticity to form genuinely new phonetic categories and motor programs. You can learn the rules consciously (which you clearly have), but you can't easily acquire them subconsciously, which is what you need for automatic, effortless native-like speech.

The vorinostat approach is specifically aimed at reopening that plasticity window. It wouldn't magically give you the accent, but it should make your brain receptive enough that the practice you're already doing with your voice coach can actually rewire the subconscious patterns instead of just being something you consciously monitor and correct in real-time. Basically letting you perceive the subtle differences properly and build new motor programs that become automatic, rather than staying stuck in the "think before every word" mode.

If you're already doing the work with voice coaching, adding vorinostat might be the missing piece that actually lets that training stick at a subconscious level. Worth considering imo.

Thx Chad

 

[Alexanderr]

Learn it. It's funny and understanding multiple languages gives you power and access to opportunities and things you could not achieve otherwise. And it's good for your brain.

This. Monolinguals genuinely can't comprehend what they're missing.

Learning a language isn't really just a skill; it's like unlocking a door to a completely different reality. As a Dutch speaker, even if I only spoke English, I'd be locked out of entire ecosystems of Dutch humor, political debate, online communities, and cultural perspectives that simply don't exist in English and can't be properly translated.

I learnt Norwegian for a few years, and the more languages you learn, the more you get the sense there's a lot of stuff you can't properly translate into another language.

It's really not about accessing raw information; it's about the unique way that information is framed, debated, and joked about. One might think of it like getting the raw, unfiltered source code of a culture.

 

[Alexanderr]

Understood, you don't want to think twice before uttering a sound. I'll look more into this field then. I have trouble with my own native language since I am used to speaking English

I had this problem for a little while, spoke so much English, and relatively less Dutch that I found myself forgetting a few words sometimes like 'microwave' (magnetron). The fix: Simply speaking more Dutch again. For the longest time that voice in my head was in English though, but now it's context-dependent. If I speak Dutch, I think in Dutch, and vice versa. Much better.