Where someone should place the MSE device in order to maximize IPD gains ?

[Deleted member 19878]

Simple curiosity, should the MSE device be installed more anteriorely in the palate or more posterioly (in the back of the palate) ?

The orbital surface is around the back of the palate but the internasal suture is around the foreground, so where the expansion should focus ?

 

[Deleted member 19878]

Bump

 

[gribsufer1]

you have an mse expander?

 

[Deleted member 19878]

you have an mse expander?

No i don't it's more theoretical but i only want which place on the palate should any expansion method focus in order to maximize ipd gains.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

Bump

 

[Deleted member 19878]

Bump

 

[Deleted member 19878]

Bump

 

[jfbjfb]

I honestly do not expect much difference considering MSE is said to achieve parallel expansion.

My ortho showed me some images where he expanded 1 mm more in the front than in the posterior region, but it is mostly anecdotal.

Another thing would be to compare MSE with other MARPE techniques, which expand in a v shape. As far as I can tell MSE is the only expansion device that widens the cheekbones, so by this logic you would be better off expanding more the posterior region.

All in all I would not anticipate significant differences.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

I honestly do not expect much difference considering MSE is said to achieve parallel expansion.

My ortho showed me some images where he expanded 1 mm more in the front than in the posterior region, but it is mostly anecdotal.

Another thing would be to compare MSE with other MARPE techniques, which expand in a v shape. As far as I can tell MSE is the only expansion device that widens the cheekbones, so by this logic you would be better off expanding more the posterior region.

All in all I would not anticipate significant differences.

Thanks for your answer
Wdym by parralel expansion ?

I know that mse and palatal expansion doesn't increase ipd by much but 1-2mm gains in IPD is still significant (few milimeters of bones..)
Yes this is what i thought since the back part of the maxilla is the orbital region maybe expanding here would result in a bigger increase in IPD ?

 

[jfbjfb]

Thanks for your answer
Wdym by parralel expansion ?

I know that mse and palatal expansion doesn't increase ipd by much but 1-2mm gains in IPD is still significant (few milimeters of bones..)
Yes this is what i thought since the back part of the maxilla is the orbital region maybe expanding here would result in a bigger increase in IPD ?

By parallel expansion I mean that the maxilla increases its width equally over the whole longitudinal plane. In other words, both the anterior and the posterior region are widen roughly the same. Hence, the position of the device should not have a large influence on your IPD gains.

Anyway, tomorrow I have a consultation with an MSE provider and the bimax surgeon. I may very well ask this same question to them.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

By parallel expansion I mean that the maxilla increases its width equally over the whole longitudinal plane. In other words, both the anterior and the posterior region are widen roughly the same. Hence, the position of the device should not have a large influence on your IPD gains.

Anyway, tomorrow I have a consultation with an MSE provider and the bimax surgeon. I may very well ask this same question to them.

But theoretically, if the posterior region was somehow widened more than the anterior region, would it result in an increase in IPD ?
Thanks you if you ask this question, about which placement is more relevant even if the influence is tiny.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

Bump

 

[noprogressno]

You can't place it anteriorly anyways

 

[Deleted member 19878]

You can't place it anteriorly anyways

Why ?
And if it was the case, would it affect more or less the orbitals ?

 

[PURE ARYAN GENETICS]

By parallel expansion I mean that the maxilla increases its width equally over the whole longitudinal plane. In other words, both the anterior and the posterior region are widen roughly the same. Hence, the position of the device should not have a large influence on your IPD gains.

Anyway, tomorrow I have a consultation with an MSE provider and the bimax surgeon. I may very well ask this same question to them.

really? afaik MSE expands more anteriorly

overall not the best solution but better than rotting I guess

 

[PURE ARYAN GENETICS]

Why ?
And if it was the case, would it affect more or less the orbitals ?

I'd assume more posterior expansion is ideal for ipd. but how much can you vary the placement really? wouldn't there be one placement recommended by won moon?

 

[Deleted member 19878]

I'd assume more posterior expansion is ideal for ipd. but how much can you vary the placement really? wouldn't there be one placement recommended by won moon?

Idk tbh if there is one recommend placement
Yes this is what i thought but the nasomaxillary sutures are around the first molars/last premolars and i guess that inducing sutural growth here would be the only way to get ipd gains..
What do you think ?

 

[coolguy1]

MSE isn't really worth it imo

 

[Deleted member 19878]

MSE isn't really worth it imo

Why ?

 

[2d v2]

Why ?

it can cause a poop to all out of your nose.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

it can cause a poop to all out of your nose.

Sure but a wider maxilla can really add to one aesthetic.

 

[jfbjfb]

My ortho talked me out of MSE and recommended a new MARPE variation that is superior (gonna write a post soon to discuss it).

To answer the comments above, the MSE case I saw expanded more in the anterior region, although not by much (6 mm vs 5 mm in the posterior region). Its placement would have a minimal effect, but keep in mind that MSE is subjected to the first molars through the arms in the beginning. You do not really have room of options here if you tie it to these teeth.

 

[Deleted member 19878]

My ortho talked me out of MSE and recommended a new MARPE variation that is superior (gonna write a post soon to discuss it).

To answer the comments above, the MSE case I saw expanded more in the anterior region, although not by much (6 mm vs 5 mm in the posterior region). Its placement would have a minimal effect, but keep in mind that MSE is subjected to the first molars through the arms in the beginning. You do not really have room of options here if you tie it to these teeth.

Thanks for your help bro
Even if the location doesn't seem to have a lot of impact it makes sense that the anterior region produced more ipd gains.
Why isn't it possible to tie it to the first premolars for example ?

 

[jfbjfb]

Yes, it is possible. However, the device is preferably installed in the mid region because the bone is thicker there. Check this out: paper

 

[noprogressno]

Why ?
And if it was the case, would it affect more or less the orbitals ?

Place it too anteriorly and you risk damaging the nerves and vessels there. Mse screws are long unlike some other types of marpe

 

[noprogressno]

Why ?
And if it was the case, would it affect more or less the orbitals ?

MSE doesn't affect IPD that much anyways but on an unrelated side; solely anterior expansion isn't the goal, instead parallel expansion is