E moment
brruh
- Joined
- Dec 10, 2025
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Ok so I've never made a detailed thread and this one isn't gonna be detailed but you can ask me about this. I just want people to know about this, especially those with marpe and headgear
Song:
READ THIS: All results differentiate based on person's suture stage and there resistance based on their cbct scans, I just want people who have marpe or are interested in it to see this. Please consult a airway specialist to see if these devices will actually work on you.
Also go for a airway ortho or a specialist as standard ortho's just care about straight teeth fuck them.
ALT RAMEC IS A TECHNIQUE USING MSE NOT ITS OWN DEVICE, INSTEAD OF JUST DOING THE NORMAL MSE PROTOCOL ASK YOUR SPECIALIST ABOUT ALT RAMEC.
Alt ramec is basically just turning your MSE back and fourth everyday, instead of just going 1-2 turns outwards everyday. This is way better than normal mse protocols. This increases the chances of your marpe actually splitting the palate, along with weakening your circumaxilary sutures significantly more than normal mse protocol. This will also give more unintentional forward movement of landmark A of the maxilla. Most of normal mse protocols at a late age will give around 1mm maxilla growth from the suture whilst Alt ramec will give up to 2mm of landmark A.
If normal marpe isn't splitting your midpalate suture then alt ramec is your last hope before turning to surgical expansion.
WHY DON'T ALL ORTHO'S JUST DO ALT RAMEC INSTEAD OF THE STANDERD EXPANSION?
Not all orthodontists are trained in this specific protocol. It requires precise timing, and many prefer the easy standard protocol or traditional surgery. That's why you should go to a specialist.
If you guys already have marpe you can always switch, its just a change in how and when you turn the screw of your expander.
Head gears/ face masks are kind of stupid do not expect big results from them, if you are really going for a protraction device with mse at a older age (assuming you are older adolescent) as face mask is only good if you are young. Bamp (bone anchored maxillary protraction) is superior even if its for younger adolescents still. But realise, this is the most and is the limit of what you can get at your age without surgeries. (SURGERIES WILL GIVE MORE FORWARD MOVEMENT THAN ANY ORTHOPAEDIC DEVICE)
But nonetheless, I suggest dropping the head gear, its stupid. Bamp is made up of 4 mini plates 2 in your maxilla and 2 holding your jaw. It is a minor surgery and is pulled by bands. BAMP gives 5x more protraction on the circumaxillary sutures than face mask so if you want barely any zygo movement than use bamp or otherwise don't expect more than a mm from face mask (not including marpe projection) and the bands are pulling on the bone 24/7 unlike the headgear where you have to put that shit on.
BAMP also has superior vertical control so it can stop the marpe drop down effect and is superior to face masks as they have poor vertical control and may give undesirable vertical effects rather than managing them.
Even if you don't get your desired facial aesthetics from these orthopaedic devices just be happy as BAMP helps with your whole midface, even if its really minimal atleast its a area where something like a lefort-1 can't change. These devices are just last chances before surgery or to avoid minor surgeries. Or to atleast compensate for a complicated surgery that you don't want to risk. Anything counts. Be happy you got accepted to do these devices because its better than nothing.
How can I avoid asymmetry with marpe?
Corticopuncture can be used to make one side of the suture less dense so the sutures can split evenly and your expansion will be symmetric. Ask your specialist about your cbct scan and if there any denser sides on the suture to avoid asymmetry.
I still look asymmetric?
Marpe expansion can enhance already existing asymmetries and its based on where it is on your face if marpe can actually fix it. Marpe can actually fix your asymmetries.
How can I speed this procedure?
Piezosicions is a minimally invasive procedure that weakens bone density causing it to heal really fast, allowing for bamp/marpe to heal and finish faster.
HOW CAN I AVOID THE MAXILLA DROP EFFECT FROM MARPE?
Make sure your expander is placed at the back of your palate the furthest it can go, if you want absolute minimal dropdown, then use TADS which are screws, in the back of palate to hold the back of your maxilla up.
You can use TADS (temporary anchorage devices) to get ccw of gonial angle, like 2-4 degrees, ask your specialist for molar intrusion via TADS
How can I get the most bone movement?
Corticomy is a surgery that shaves away most of your bones but leaving the inner part, avoiding any nerve damage. This makes the bamp and marpe faster but you might aswell just get a lefort surgery, thing is corticomy can work in the upper maxilla whilst lefort-1 is just landmark A and its harder to get lefort-2 or lefort -3 but its really up to you and your specialist. Also try getting the most heavy bands your bone density can hold, if its too hard than it can lead to bamp miniplates falling out because you lack the bone density.
I lit wasted my time on ts so im tagging deadass anyone, also ask me anything tbh. i formatted pretty bad but idrc fuck this i can't believe i actually made this
Song:
READ THIS: All results differentiate based on person's suture stage and there resistance based on their cbct scans, I just want people who have marpe or are interested in it to see this. Please consult a airway specialist to see if these devices will actually work on you.
Also go for a airway ortho or a specialist as standard ortho's just care about straight teeth fuck them.
ALT RAMEC IS A TECHNIQUE USING MSE NOT ITS OWN DEVICE, INSTEAD OF JUST DOING THE NORMAL MSE PROTOCOL ASK YOUR SPECIALIST ABOUT ALT RAMEC.
Alt ramec is basically just turning your MSE back and fourth everyday, instead of just going 1-2 turns outwards everyday. This is way better than normal mse protocols. This increases the chances of your marpe actually splitting the palate, along with weakening your circumaxilary sutures significantly more than normal mse protocol. This will also give more unintentional forward movement of landmark A of the maxilla. Most of normal mse protocols at a late age will give around 1mm maxilla growth from the suture whilst Alt ramec will give up to 2mm of landmark A.
If normal marpe isn't splitting your midpalate suture then alt ramec is your last hope before turning to surgical expansion.
WHY DON'T ALL ORTHO'S JUST DO ALT RAMEC INSTEAD OF THE STANDERD EXPANSION?
Not all orthodontists are trained in this specific protocol. It requires precise timing, and many prefer the easy standard protocol or traditional surgery. That's why you should go to a specialist.
If you guys already have marpe you can always switch, its just a change in how and when you turn the screw of your expander.
Head gears/ face masks are kind of stupid do not expect big results from them, if you are really going for a protraction device with mse at a older age (assuming you are older adolescent) as face mask is only good if you are young. Bamp (bone anchored maxillary protraction) is superior even if its for younger adolescents still. But realise, this is the most and is the limit of what you can get at your age without surgeries. (SURGERIES WILL GIVE MORE FORWARD MOVEMENT THAN ANY ORTHOPAEDIC DEVICE)
But nonetheless, I suggest dropping the head gear, its stupid. Bamp is made up of 4 mini plates 2 in your maxilla and 2 holding your jaw. It is a minor surgery and is pulled by bands. BAMP gives 5x more protraction on the circumaxillary sutures than face mask so if you want barely any zygo movement than use bamp or otherwise don't expect more than a mm from face mask (not including marpe projection) and the bands are pulling on the bone 24/7 unlike the headgear where you have to put that shit on.
BAMP also has superior vertical control so it can stop the marpe drop down effect and is superior to face masks as they have poor vertical control and may give undesirable vertical effects rather than managing them.
Even if you don't get your desired facial aesthetics from these orthopaedic devices just be happy as BAMP helps with your whole midface, even if its really minimal atleast its a area where something like a lefort-1 can't change. These devices are just last chances before surgery or to avoid minor surgeries. Or to atleast compensate for a complicated surgery that you don't want to risk. Anything counts. Be happy you got accepted to do these devices because its better than nothing.
How can I avoid asymmetry with marpe?
Corticopuncture can be used to make one side of the suture less dense so the sutures can split evenly and your expansion will be symmetric. Ask your specialist about your cbct scan and if there any denser sides on the suture to avoid asymmetry.
I still look asymmetric?
Marpe expansion can enhance already existing asymmetries and its based on where it is on your face if marpe can actually fix it. Marpe can actually fix your asymmetries.
How can I speed this procedure?
Piezosicions is a minimally invasive procedure that weakens bone density causing it to heal really fast, allowing for bamp/marpe to heal and finish faster.
HOW CAN I AVOID THE MAXILLA DROP EFFECT FROM MARPE?
Make sure your expander is placed at the back of your palate the furthest it can go, if you want absolute minimal dropdown, then use TADS which are screws, in the back of palate to hold the back of your maxilla up.
You can use TADS (temporary anchorage devices) to get ccw of gonial angle, like 2-4 degrees, ask your specialist for molar intrusion via TADS
How can I get the most bone movement?
Corticomy is a surgery that shaves away most of your bones but leaving the inner part, avoiding any nerve damage. This makes the bamp and marpe faster but you might aswell just get a lefort surgery, thing is corticomy can work in the upper maxilla whilst lefort-1 is just landmark A and its harder to get lefort-2 or lefort -3 but its really up to you and your specialist. Also try getting the most heavy bands your bone density can hold, if its too hard than it can lead to bamp miniplates falling out because you lack the bone density.
I lit wasted my time on ts so im tagging deadass anyone, also ask me anything tbh. i formatted pretty bad but idrc fuck this i can't believe i actually made this
@GUMMIKZKDI @5'7 ltn @overcooked @Elias1253 @Renophobeadoobe @voliamo @CopeMoreHopeLess @Rachet @pio
Sorry for tagging i just do not want this shit to go ignored and i dont want to explain everything to one guys post. and i see u guys talking abt marpe so i just fucking tagged u all. ha
Sorry for tagging i just do not want this shit to go ignored and i dont want to explain everything to one guys post. and i see u guys talking abt marpe so i just fucking tagged u all. ha
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