You get male dimo even when ur near ur 30’s and the threshold for male dimo is EXTREMELY low

[AtrophicPyra]

Tons of trans FTM people hop on trt and get transformations like these, why can’t you?

They are actually at a disadvantage for being in a high estrogen environment for a very long time, making their sutures supposedly “fused”

But as we can see here in this TikTok it’s not actually true, male dimo threshold is extremely low, and you don’t need tren, moderate-high dose test is all u need




Part 1, will make part 2 talking abt another FTM TikTok transition and how male dimo threshold is extremely low

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Tons of trans FTM people hop on trt and get transformations like these, why can’t you?

They are actually at a disadvantage for being in a high estrogen environment for a very long time, making their sutures supposedly “fused”

But as we can see here in this TikTok it’s not actually true, male dimo threshold is extremely low, and you don’t need tren, moderate-high dose test is all u need




Part 1, will make part 2 talking abt another FTM TikTok transition and how male dimo threshold is extremely low

“Muh u need 10 grams of tren to ascend”

 

[Matt_r7x]

need this bad, tag me when u make part 2

 

[Zeylet]

lmk if there is more info about this, and also u gotta define it more properly, since issue is to get certain male features u need to have certain bone remodelling like great zygo definition, ramus, maxilla and so on and for these u need to have open face bones( dunno what uc all them i forgot) and these close at the end of puberty age 19-22

 

[Idontknow-]

Nice post to rep ratio

 

[AtrophicPyra]

lmk if there is more info about this, and also u gotta define it more properly, since issue is to get certain male features u need to have certain bone remodelling like great zygo definition, ramus, maxilla and so on and for these u need to have open face bones( dunno what uc all them i forgot) and these close at the end of puberty age 19-22

Well as u can see that’s not true otherwise she wouldn’t be this dimorphic at 27

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Nice post to rep ratio

Oh my goodness bro did u bot ur org account how is that possible

 

[Zeylet]

Well as u can see that’s not true otherwise she wouldn’t be this dimorphic at 27

true true, but for certain dimo features u still need great bone structure

 

[Idontknow-]

Oh my goodness bro did u bot ur org account how is that possible

People just rep amigo

 

[Idontknow-]

Yeah roids are law.

 

[Kojo]

Tons of trans FTM people hop on trt and get transformations like these, why can’t you?

They are actually at a disadvantage for being in a high estrogen environment for a very long time, making their sutures supposedly “fused”

But as we can see here in this TikTok it’s not actually true, male dimo threshold is extremely low, and you don’t need tren, moderate-high dose test is all u need




Part 1, will make part 2 talking abt another FTM TikTok transition and how male dimo threshold is extremely low

Yeah but something I think we should stop doing in this community is equalising effect with people who aren't equal to us in variables..

This simply happens due to homologous regulation, which simply put, the androgen receptors in certain areas of the body desensitise and degrade over time through the stimulus of being exposed to androgens.

This is why your dick grows in puberty when it finally gets the hormonal push it needs, then it stops from the negative feedback loop of AR downregulation in that region. This applies to the Larynx (voicebox), Dick, and Cranofacial Bones.

So trannies that have never had high exposure to Androgens wouldn't have degraded receptors to androgens and still would be sensitive to them if they hopped on even as an adult. If you're 18+ thinking roids will help masculinisation you're likely wrong

Feel free to prove me wrong. @Paul.jnxy @avgsub5human @nwed

 

[prolarper]

kinda seems like cope

 

[Kojo]

Yeah but something I think we should stop doing in this community is equalising effect with people who aren't equal to us in variables..

This simply happens due to homologous regulation, which simply put, the androgen receptors in certain areas of the body desensitise and degrade over time through the stimulus of being exposed to androgens.

This is why your dick grows in puberty when it finally gets the hormonal push it needs, then it stops from the negative feedback loop of AR downregulation in that region. This applies to the Larynx (voicebox), Dick, and Cranofacial Bones.

So trannies that have never had high exposure to Androgens wouldn't have degraded receptors to androgens and still would be sensitive to them if they hopped on even as an adult. If you're 18+ thinking roids will help masculinisation you're likely wrong

Feel free to prove me wrong. @Paul.jnxy @avgsub5human @nwed

@Zeylet Read this

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Yeah but something I think we should stop doing in this community is equalising effect with people who aren't equal to us in variables..

This simply happens due to homologous regulation, which simply put, the androgen receptors in certain areas of the body desensitise and degrade over time through the stimulus of being exposed to androgens.

This is why your dick grows in puberty when it finally gets the hormonal push it needs, then it stops from the negative feedback loop of AR downregulation in that region. This applies to the Larynx (voicebox), Dick, and Cranofacial Bones.

So trannies that have never had high exposure to Androgens wouldn't have degraded receptors to androgens and still would be sensitive to them if they hopped on even as an adult. If you're 18+ thinking roids will help masculinisation you're likely wrong

Feel free to prove me wrong. @Paul.jnxy @avgsub5human @nwed

Degraded receptors happen more when ur using extremely potent androgens for long periods of time, test doesn’t really down regulate AR

They were women meaning they r supposed to have very fused facial and cranial facial sutures etc. from the very high estrogen they had, so if anything they r in a disadvantage.

Plus that just means u gotta use more androgens to compensate which we already would do if we r using supraphysiological amounts of testosterone

 

[Zeylet]

@Zeylet Read this

i never knew about this, thanks for thatreally helped

 

[Zeylet]

@Zeylet Read this

yk ways to find some loophole throughout? Like yea for most men with whose androgen receptors are already desensitized and dont work functionally as they used to?

 

[Kojo]

Degraded receptors happen more when ur using extremely potent androgens for long periods of time, test doesn’t really down regulate AR

Receptors degrade regardless through pubertal androgen levels, otherwise your dick would just keep growing like I said

They were women meaning they r supposed to have very fused facial and cranial facial sutures etc. from the very high estrogen they had, so if anything they r in a disadvantage.

Also are we talking about periosteal appositioning in terms of dimo gain? Nothing really changes in her dormant facial structure to indicate suture manipulation. It just seems like the bones she already had have more presence/projection. She also lost the E2 cheek fat that women and high e2 naturally produces.

Also gained a moustache, there's really not much dimo gain at all outside of angularity

Plus that just means u gotta use more androgens to compensate which we already would do if we r using supraphysiological amounts of testosterone

Also true in theory, but I just doubt big changes into adulthood. This is something we can only test in practice, If this really were true I think everyone blasting would have the deepest voice with a lot of projection and the biggest dick.

it's also really hard to gauge how degraded the receptors are in these regions. If anyone can post an 18+ roid masculinisation example I'd be willing to concede

 

[Kojo]

i never knew about this, thanks for thatreally helped

yk ways to find some loophole throughout? Like yea for most men with whose androgen receptors are already desensitized and dont work functionally as they used to?

Not yet afaik

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Receptors degrade regardless through pubertal androgen levels, otherwise your dick would just keep growing like I said

Also are we talking about periosteal appositioning in terms of dimo gain? Nothing really changes in her dormant facial structure to indicate suture manipulation. It just seems like the bones she already had have more presence/projection. She also lost the E2 cheek fat that women and high e2 naturally produces.

Also gained a moustache, there's really not much dimo gain at all outside of angularity

Also true in theory, but I just doubt big changes into adulthood. This is something we can only test in practice, If this really were true I think everyone blasting would have the deepest voice with a lot of projection and the biggest dick.

it's also really hard to gauge how degraded the receptors are in these regions. If anyone can post an 18+ roid masculinisation example I'd be willing to concede

Well look at this Guys natty vs enhanced obvious the affect of androgen exposure is linear

Also when was the last time u saw a lean woman that dimorphic, the aspect of, “ she just lost fat” can’t be applied to women, this is what women r supposed to look like if they lost face fat

This is 100% not what that FTM girl even remotely looks like, his features r masculine

 

[Kojo]

View attachment 5275025
Well look at this Guys natty vs enhanced obvious the affect of androgen exposure is linear

Honestly need a clearer and up close image comparison like the foid one used below for his face

Also when was the last time u saw a lean woman that dimorphic, the aspect of, “ she just lost fat” can’t be applied to women, this is what women r supposed to look like if they lost face fat
View attachment 5275028
This is 100% not what that FTM girl even remotely looks like, his features r masculine

Females naturally have more essential fat than males, so even a lean women wouldn't have the most visible bones.

Also the tranny does have masculine features, But you're not understanding what I'm trying to say. Test in males redestributes fat pads and fat in general away from the cheek area. This is literally why volumptuous cheeks are a dimorphic feature for females.

Hopping on test completely changes the architecture of your face as an FTM even outside of bone changes.

Also grew facial hair which adds to dimo a lot

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Honestly need a clearer and up close image comparison like the foid one used below for his face

Females naturally have more essential fat than males, so even a lean women wouldn't have the most visible bones.

Also the tranny does have masculine features, But you're not understanding what I'm trying to say. Test in males redestributes fat pads and fat in general away from the cheek area. This is literally why volumptuous cheeks are a dimorphic feature for females.

Hopping on test completely changes the architecture of your face as an FTM even outside of bone changes.

Also grew facial hair which adds to dimo a lot

Kind of corny but look at androgenics transformation, he took test and a bit of tren he said.

Ye ur right tho the fat gets redistributed but still the bones account a lot of value since u can see skinny malnourished homeless women, they look very different from a malnourished homeless man

 

[Kojo]

Kind of corny but look at androgenics transformation, he took test and a bit of tren he said.

I actually haven't seen his, a lot of people talk about him specifically. I'll have a look at it but people have said he was a late bloomer so I don't know his background there

Ye ur right tho the fat gets redistributed but still the bones account a lot of value since u can see skinny malnourished homeless women, they look very different from a malnourished homeless man

I don't want to be nitpicky but it's just true, if you really look at the bone structures of the people you're showing their cheeks go from rounded to hollow, when you can see there's barely a bone difference. The cheeks just lose a lot of fat honestly.

And again I'm not saying roids don't work, but I am saying the reason they do work in specific instances is simply ar sens. Even by you saying our sutures don't actually fuse that fast pretty much helps what I'm saying. If the sutures are still open into adulthood for females, they'd be very responsive to androgens that would drive change.

Now for the average male, we'd have to look into insane blasts and B&A's from it.

 

[Paul.jnxy]

Receptors degrade regardless through pubertal androgen levels, otherwise your dick would just keep growing like I said

Also are we talking about periosteal appositioning in terms of dimo gain? Nothing really changes in her dormant facial structure to indicate suture manipulation. It just seems like the bones she already had have more presence/projection. She also lost the E2 cheek fat that women and high e2 naturally produces.

Also gained a moustache, there's really not much dimo gain at all outside of angularity

Also true in theory, but I just doubt big changes into adulthood. This is something we can only test in practice, If this really were true I think everyone blasting would have the deepest voice with a lot of projection and the biggest dick.

it's also really hard to gauge how degraded the receptors are in these regions. If anyone can post an 18+ roid masculinisation example I'd be willing to concede

You can not get any Periosteal apposition after puberty. Anything else is basically cope or minimal. Roids = no benefit for bones outside of puberty.

 

[Kojo]

You can not get any Periosteal apposition after puberty. Anything else is basically cope or minimal. Roids = no benefit for bones outside of puberty.

Well said

 

[Paul.jnxy]

Well said

Kojo what do you think. Ive been arguing with a guy on .gg if activation of the androgen receptor (completely independant from other pathways) leads to fusion in the gp.

 

[Kojo]

Kojo what do you think. Ive been arguing with a guy on .gg if activation of the androgen receptor (completely independant from other pathways) leads to fusion in the gp.

It does not no, Alexander already got raped on this topic i believe

There's no such thing as "androgenic fusion" (outside of e2 pathway)

Let me know if I comprehended the convo properly

Edit: I had a debate with someone in a "heightmaxxing" server recently about this and they banned me after getting shit on lol

 

[Paul.jnxy]

It does not no, Alexander already got raped on this topic i believe

There's no such thing as "androgenic fusion" (outside of e2 pathway)

Let me know if I comprehended the convo properly

Edit: I had a debate with someone in a "heightmaxxing" server recently about this and they banned me after getting shit lol

100%. I thought id make a thread on this but probs enough threads tho not sure. Who is alexander?

 

[Kojo]

100%. I thought id make a thread on this but probs enough threads tho not sure. Who is alexander?

There's no threads on androgenic fusion I believe

Alexander is this dude https://looksmax.org/threads/good-threads-you-mightve-missed-megathread.647312/unread

 

[Paul.jnxy]

There's no threads on androgenic fusion I believe

Alexander is this dude https://looksmax.org/threads/good-threads-you-mightve-missed-megathread.647312/unread

Interesting. Do you recommend I make one? Also if you remember do you mind sending the thread where he was destroyed in.

 

[Kojo]

100%. I thought id make a thread on this but probs enough threads tho not sure. Who is alexander?

What argument were they using for plate fusion?

Often times what these retards say is things like "androgens bind to ar and go through this pathway" blah blah mechanism nonsense.

They never actually explain how the mechanism shuts plates. I literally asked the dude like 15x no kidding, to simply explain how the pathway he's describing actually fuses growth plates without the interference of estradiol and he just dodged the question.

It's all jargon bullshit

 

[Kojo]

Interesting. Do you recommend I make one? Also if you remember do you mind sending the thread where he was destroyed in.

It was on discord.

Edit: I had a debate with someone in a "heightmaxxing" server recently about this and they banned me after getting shit on lol

 

[Paul.jnxy]

What argument were they using for plate fusion?

Often times what these retards say is things like "androgens bind to ar and go through this pathway" blah blah mechanism nonsense.

They never actually explain how the mechanism shuts plates. I literally asked the dude like 15x no kidding, to simply explain how the pathway he's describing actually fuses growth plates without the interference of estradiol and he just dodged the question.

It's all jargon bullshit

None. They wanted me to proove that Androgen receptor activation does not lead to fusion or NAAAS in general.

 

[Paul.jnxy]

It was on discord.

Ah yes mb

 

[AtrophicPyra]

What argument were they using for plate fusion?

Often times what these retards say is things like "androgens bind to ar and go through this pathway" blah blah mechanism nonsense.

They never actually explain how the mechanism shuts plates. I literally asked the dude like 15x no kidding, to simply explain how the pathway he's describing actually fuses growth plates without the interference of estradiol and he just dodged the question.

It's all jargon bullshit

Androgens express maturation genes in the gp g is a known phenomenon and multiple studies showing androgens like tren can make u significantly shorter skeletally wise

 

[Paul.jnxy]

It was on discord.

Do you recommend I put blood sweat and tears into a thread or just let the people suffer

 

[Paul.jnxy]

Androgens express maturation genes in the gp g is a known phenomenon and multiple studies showing androgens like tren can make u significantly shorter skeletally wise

I don't see how this leads to fusion also zagro completely debunked your claim on tren tbh.

 

[AtrophicPyra]

What argument were they using for plate fusion?

Often times what these retards say is things like "androgens bind to ar and go through this pathway" blah blah mechanism nonsense.

They never actually explain how the mechanism shuts plates. I literally asked the dude like 15x no kidding, to simply explain how the pathway he's describing actually fuses growth plates without the interference of estradiol and he just dodged the question.

It's all jargon bullshit

Runx2 expression is massively upregulated in cartilage cells and some other downpath genes that’s also regulate differentiation

 

[Kojo]

None. They wanted me to proove that Androgen receptor activation does not lead to fusion or NAAAS in general.

What? that would literally be shifting the burden of proof onto the negative position

 

[AtrophicPyra]

I don't see how this leads to fusion also zagro completely debunked your claim on tren tbh.

Where did he debunk it

Literally showed like 3 studies of androgens making animals and humans smaller and u still think they r harmless to the gp

 

[Paul.jnxy]

What? that would literally be shifting the burden of proof onto the negative position
View attachment 5275359

Exactly like tf.

 

[Kojo]

Do you recommend I put blood sweat and tears into a thread or just let the people suffer

Do it

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Do you recommend I put blood sweat and tears into a thread or just let the people suffer

What thread

 

[Paul.jnxy]

Do it

Bet

 

[Paul.jnxy]

What thread

A thread on androgens not leading to hypertrophy

 

[Kojo]

Androgens express maturation genes in the gp g is a known phenomenon and multiple studies showing androgens like tren can make u significantly shorter skeletally wise

Show any study that shows this.

Also firstly before you show that rat tren study i just remembered to respond to it.

When you look at the C group and the T group, the bones in length are barely different. Reread the studies final results and comparison in the different groups

Tren also produces progestogenic effects in tissues which leads to estrogenic activity. Even then when they megadosed rats with tren the bones were not much different, I'm too lazy to go back and show you it on the study but you can go look at the ending graph

 

[Kojo]

Where did he debunk it

Literally showed like 3 studies of androgens making animals and humans smaller and u still think they r harmless to the gp

I've only seen one of yours and it was shit

 

[AtrophicPyra]

A thread on androgens not leading to hypertrophy

They do u would just be misleading the masses

Literally every single chrondrocyte cell when it takes in an androgen, it will express maturation genes and downstream maturation genes, the main one is runx2, this will lead to premature closure.

This ain’t really seen much in androgens like test however for more potent ones like tren, the maturation genes get expressed more strongly

I have made multiple threads talking abt studies abt how androgens and trenbolone specifically makes u shorter

 

[AtrophicPyra]

I've only seen one of yours and it was shit

There r 2 more keep searching, one of them directly says that androgens made them shorter textbook quotes

 

[AtrophicPyra]

Show any study that shows this.

Also firstly before you show that rat tren study i just remembered to respond to it.

When you look at the C group and the T group, the bones in length are barely different. Reread the studies final results and comparison in the different groups

Tren also produces progestogenic effects in tissues which leads to estrogenic activity. Even then when they megadosed rats with tren the bones were not much different, I'm too lazy to go back and show you it on the study but you can go look at the ending graph

I read the study up and down, if u actually saw the conclusion u would see that trenbolone group were smaller skeletally?

 

[Paul.jnxy]

They do u would just be misleading the masses

Literally every single chrondrocyte cell when it takes in an androgen, it will express maturation genes and downstream maturation genes, the main one is runx2, this will lead to premature closure.

This ain’t really seen much in androgens like test however for more potent ones like tren, the maturation genes get expressed more strongly

I have made multiple threads talking abt studies abt how androgens and trenbolone specifically makes u shorter

Back up your claims then.

RUNX2 is regulated by many pathways not soley by androgens + 0 evidence androgen receptor agonism leads to upregulated RUNX2.

Again back up your claims.

Most of the studies you linked are flawed. @Zagro debunked you on the tren one.