Are soy products overly criticised?

[Cayde1428F]

So i’ve done a bit of research on soy products and i realised that inflammation from soy usually happens when you’re allergic to it, you eat soy as part of a highly processed diet or your overall fat intake is extremely unbalanced(10:20-1 omega 6-omega 3 fatty acids, healthy range should be minimum 4-1). So this unbalance can happen because u eat a lot of seed oils like soybean oil etc., or u have too little omega 3 intake.

A myth is that soy mimics estrogen and lowers testosterone but soy products are actually phytoestrogens that contain isaflavones that weakly mimic estrogen. They are very weak compared to estrogen and studies show that they do not reduce testosterone when taken in normal amounts and do not feminize men. In fact they can actually improve skin health and heart health.

I think what people call inflammation(puffy face, water retention, acne, sluggish recovery) is rarely from soy alone but because of ultra processed foods containing soy, omega imbalances or gut irritation.

I believe that soy only hurts if it replaces nutrient dense foods like fish, eggs and/or paired with ultra processed foods. If balanced with omega-3, kept simple and clean, i think its a good plant protein with some healthy fats that can support collagen and muscle. Currently i take about 475ml of nutri soy no sugar soya milk five times a week and around 50g of tofu per day. Do you all think this amount of soy is ok or if my opinions on soy are correct?

 

[Pearlhtn]

DNR soy products are under criticized in mainstream media which is why it’s such a problem

 

[81xa]

 

[Cayde1428F]

DNR soy products are under criticized in mainstream media which is why it’s such a problem

Sorry i’m a grey doesn’t dnr stand for do not reproduce

 

[Pearlhtn]

Sorry i’m a grey doesn’t dnr stand for do not reproduce

it means different things depending on context, in this case it’s ‘did not read’ sometimes means do not reply

 

[Cayde1428F]

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Sorry whatever niche reference that was i did NOT get it would appreciate it explained

 

[Cayde1428F]

it means different things depending on context, in this case it’s ‘did not read’ sometimes means do not reply

Thanks senior

 

[81xa]

Sorry whatever niche reference that was i did NOT get it would appreciate it explained

Soylent is a soy protein drink

He drank so much soylent and as a result his testosterone became so low and his estrogen became so high that he couldn't open the bottle himself

 

[Cayde1428F]

Soylent is a soy protein drink

He drank so much soylent and as a result his testosterone became so low and his estrogen became so high that he couldn't open the bottle himself

Oh aight its a joke right im kinda autistic Currently i take about 475ml of nutri soy no sugar soya milk five times a week and around 50g of tofu per day. Do you all think this amount of soy is ok or if my opinions on soy are correct?
I think i’m screwed if i continue with this

 

[81xa]

Oh aight its a joke right im kinda autistic

Yeah so like how can you defend soy when it feminises you and turns you into a pathetic beta male that cant accomplish anything and gets bitched?

 

[Cayde1428F]

Yeah so like how can you defend soy when it feminises you and turns you into a pathetic beta male that cant accomplish anything and gets bitched?

I’m not defending it i’m just asking for advice and maybe pointing out the more overlooked parts of it. Do u have concrete evidence on why soy feminises males? No answer i’ll take it that you don’t(just asking for learning not trying to provoke or aggravate anyone)

 

[seer☦︎]

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Soylent was advertised as a healthy meal replacement, which op wasn't advocating for, more as an additional add on.

 

[81xa]

I’m not defending it i’m just asking for advice and maybe pointing out the more overlooked parts of it. Do u have concrete evidence on why soy feminises males? No answer i’ll take it that you don’t(just asking for learning not trying to provoke or aggravate anyone)

its extremely well documented that soy contains phytoestrogens, also soy isoflavones can preferentially bind to and activate oestrogen receptors they essentially exert estrogenic activity by interacting with oestrogen receptors

 

[Cayde1428F]

its extremely well documented that soy contains phytoestrogens, also soy isoflavones can preferentially bind to and activate oestrogen receptors they essentially exert estrogenic activity by interacting with oestrogen

Soy isoflavones usually bind to the beta estrogen receptors that are more balancing and anti inflammatory which counters the alpha estrogen receptors which causes the estrogen effects u see in women. It prefers the beta receptors much more and even when it does bind its about around 100x weaker than traditional estrogen and even when it DOES bind it partially activates. So in normal male hormone levels it can actually reduce overall stimulation at the alpha receptors because it competes with natural estrogen. In low estrogen environments it increases estrogen but very slightly

 

[81xa]

Soy isoflavones usually bind to the beta estrogen receptors that are more balancing and anti inflammatory which counters the alpha estrogen receptors which causes the estrogen effects u see in women. It prefers the beta receptors much more and even when it does bind its about around 100x weaker than traditional estrogen and even when it DOES bind it partially activates. So in normal male hormone levels it can actually reduce overall stimulation at the alpha receptors because it competes with natural estrogen. In low estrogen environments it increases estrogen but very slightly

beta receptor preference is overstated genistein shows preference sure but daidzein barely does, soy gives you both so the whole beta preference argument falls apart at the first compound

100x weaker means nothing if youre consuming enough volume, dose compensates for potency

partial activation is not the same as blocking, a partial agonist adds signal it doesnt remove it, calling partial activation a net reduction in estrogen stimulation is flat out wrong mechanistically

you just admitted soy increases estrogenic activity in low estrogen environments, most males have relatively low estrogen compared to females, so by your own logic soy is estrogenic in the exact population youre defending

competitive antagonism at alpha receptors requires serum isoflavone concentrations high enough to actually displace endogenous estradiol, theres no evidence normal dietary intake achieves that in humans