Consultation with Dr Defrancq regarding cheek and mid face

[Sal123]

so i started off with the masseter problem, and he said botox can help loosen the muscle - stretchen it so it will reach the gonial. secondly i asked for hollow cheeks and he said a little bit of buccal fat removal. NOW THE IMPLANT SHIT!!!! so he designs cheek implant a particular way that would give a superior aestetic result compared to standards, he also ensures the implant goes below the eyes reducing hollo eyes, this might interetes u guys, a way to advance an average maxilla like myself would be to place an implant - this would further improve my facial harmony. SADLY NOTHING CAN BE DONE TO WIDEN EYES. not even a mse. if an mse DOES exapd the eyes then they bone in the middle will start to open up

 

[Vermilioncore]

Consult a different doctor and see what that guy has to say

 

[Sal123]

Consult a different doctor and see what that guy has to say

who do u suggest

 

[Vermilioncore]

who do u suggest

Idk bro. You're asking a subhuman rotting piece of dog shit. Hopefully someone can help you though so you can become gigachad

 

[Deleted member 4054]

When he says botox can stretch the masseter, does he mean botox will make it easier for him to stretch during the surgery to repair it, or that botox on its own may fix the problem?

 

[Sal123]

When he says botox can stretch the masseter, does he mean botox will make it easier for him to stretch during the surgery to repair it, or that botox on its own may fix the problem?

botox will fix the probelm on its own, he says surgery is bad, botox should be placed in the right position, 30ml each side , but i rememebr u said yours was really bad so i dont know

 

[Deleted member 3702]

seems good wait for the results

 

[RecessedPrettyboy]

So botox on its own would make the gonial angle better wtf?

 

[Golden Glass]

so i started off with the masseter problem, and he said botox can help loosen the muscle - stretchen it so it will reach the gonial. secondly i asked for hollow cheeks and he said a little bit of buccal fat removal. NOW THE IMPLANT SHIT!!!! so he designs cheek implant a particular way that would give a superior aestetic result compared to standards, he also ensures the implant goes below the eyes reducing hollo eyes, this might interetes u guys, a way to advance an average maxilla like myself would be to place an implant - this would further improve my facial harmony. SADLY NOTHING CAN BE DONE TO WIDEN EYES. not even a mse. if an mse DOES exapd the eyes then they bone in the middle will start to open up

1. He doesn’t understand MSE then. It does have the capability to widen the space between the eyes, and the bone in the middle doesn’t “open up”, it’s replaced with new bone.
2. Paranasal implants to mimic a forward maxilla exist, but a. you shouldn’t want to mimic one, especially with a truly forward maxilla improving your airway, among other things, and b. the results for paranasal implants are pretty underwhelming compared to getting true maxillary protraction.

 

[curryslayerordeath]

1. He doesn’t understand MSE then. It does have the capability to widen the space between the eyes, and the bone in the middle doesn’t “open up”, it’s replaced with new bone.
2. Paranasal implants to mimic a forward maxilla exist, but a. you shouldn’t want to mimic one, especially with a truly forward maxilla improving your airway, among other things, and b. the results for paranasal implants are pretty underwhelming compared to getting true maxillary protraction.

Didn't you show that regular amount of maxillary expansion don't have any effect on the ipd (as in Ronald Ead's case)?

 

[Golden Glass]

Didn't you show that regular amount of maxillary expansion don't have any effect on the ipd (as in Ronald Ead's case)?

• It has the capability to do so.
• Ron is much older than most of us here are.
• I’ve now seen some results in younger people where IPD seems to increase.

 

[curryslayerordeath]

• It has the capability to do so.
• Ron is much older than most of us here are.
• I’ve now seen some results in younger people where IPD seems to increase.

Do you have a link to results of some younger people (I'm assuming around the early adult age)? I'd like to take a look at that.

 

[Golden Glass]

Do you have a link to results of some younger people (I'm assuming around the early adult age)? I'd like to take a look at that.

I’m going to make a quick thread with one ofthem.

According to @retard, this was a teenage girl who got MSE.

Note that according to someone who measured her eyes using pixel count, she only really hit around 1mm, but that it looks like more because of her incredibly small PFL (around 24 mm).

I will be using another before and after for the thread.

 

[curryslayerordeath]

I’m going to make a quick thread with one ofthem.

According to @retard, this was a teenage girl who got MSE.
View attachment 251884
Note that according to someone who measured her eyes using pixel count, she only really hit around 1mm, but that it looks like more because of her incredibly small PFL (around 24 mm).

I will be using another before and after for the thread.

Hmm yea I can obviously see the ipd difference here but doesn't it look a significant amount worse now? It may just be my opinion but her face looks very "off" now and doesn't really look any wider. It seemingly ruined her harmony.

 

[Golden Glass]

Hmm yea I can obviously see the ipd difference here but doesn't it look a significant amount worse now? It may just be my opinion but her face looks very "off" now and doesn't really look any wider.

Yes, but there’s so many things you’d need to take into account. She did something with her eyebrows that ironically seems to make the GAO between her eyes even more stark. And having her hair go down and cover one side of her Face ID very bad for people who look like they have very wide set eyes, because it makes her face look even narrower (look at how close her right eye—on our left—is to her hair in the after, and compare it to the before, where there’s more space since the lateral hairline is visible).

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

1. He doesn’t understand MSE then. It does have the capability to widen the space between the eyes, and the bone in the middle doesn’t “open up”, it’s replaced with new bone.
2. Paranasal implants to mimic a forward maxilla exist, but a. you shouldn’t want to mimic one, especially with a truly forward maxilla improving your airway, among other things, and b. the results for paranasal implants are pretty underwhelming compared to getting true maxillary protraction.

2. You need both to achieve chad forward growth tbh

Also how many cm can a bsso usually lenghten my mandible?

 

[Sal123]

I’m going to make a quick thread with one ofthem.

According to @retard, this was a teenage girl who got MSE.
View attachment 251884
Note that according to someone who measured her eyes using pixel count, she only really hit around 1mm, but that it looks like more because of her incredibly small PFL (around 24 mm).

I will be using another before and after for the thread.

Who was the surgeon

So botox on its own would make the gonial angle better wtf?

Noo, just if the masseter. Didn’t stretch up to the gonial Botox can stretch it

 

[Golden Glass]

Who was the surgeon

Not sure. But you don’t need any “special” surgeon to do MSE. You can get it with an orthodontist.

 

[kota]

I’m going to make a quick thread with one ofthem.

According to @retard, this was a teenage girl who got MSE.
View attachment 251884
Note that according to someone who measured her eyes using pixel count, she only really hit around 1mm, but that it looks like more because of her incredibly small PFL (around 24 mm).

I will be using another before and after for the thread.

I posted that. She is 16 btw. Agreed that IPD probably won't change as much / at all on older males.

Who was the surgeon

Richard Ting.

 

[Golden Glass]

I posted that. She is 16 btw. Agreed that IPD probably won't change as much / at all on older males.

Richard Ting.

you have the original study?

 

[kota]

you have the original study?

Sorry, usually I save all material but just spent 20 mins looking for the origin of the pics and couldn't find it. I do have a few more pics of the same girl though.

Pre treatment:

During treatment with hooks for facemask:

Post treatment:

 

[Golden Glass]

Sorry, usually I save all material but just spent 20 mins looking for the origin of the pics and couldn't find it. I do have a few more pics of the same girl though.

Pre treatment:

View attachment 254267

During treatment with hooks for facemask:


View attachment 254268

Post treatment:

View attachment 254269

It’s fine.
she definitely got improvement, but her eyebrows and hairstyle in the after really make her eye area look much wider set. Tough to make a true comparison.

 

[livelaughlooksmax]

It’s fine.
she definitely got improvement, but her eyebrows and hairstyle in the after really make her eye area look much wider set. Tough to make a true comparison.

she needed bimax. MSE by itself is cope

 

[Golden Glass]

she needed bimax. MSE by itself is cope

MSE by itself is perfect for someone with good forward growth and facial height ratios, but lacks facial width.

 

[livelaughlooksmax]

MSE by itself is perfect for someone with good forward growth and facial height ratios, but lacks facial width.

MSE results are extremely subtle, it will not deliver even .25 of an increase in looks

 

[Golden Glass]

MSE results are extremely subtle, it will not deliver even .25 of an increase in looks

Define subtle

 

[GetThatBread]

Sorry, usually I save all material but just spent 20 mins looking for the origin of the pics and couldn't find it. I do have a few more pics of the same girl though.

Pre treatment:
View attachment 254267

During treatment with hooks for facemask:
View attachment 254268

Post treatment:
View attachment 254269

You can have braces on during MSE??

MSE results are extremely subtle, it will not deliver even .25 of an increase in looks

The only before and after we have is from Ronald Ead; his mid face and ogee curve has significantly increased with just 1cm of expansion. Originally he was supposed to do 1.2cms. I’m aiming for 1.4cms for midface expansion. FaceMask has been proven to give 5mms of Sagittal growth with only 1 KG of force. If you want to truly ascend; I think it’s best to get MSE + MSDO ~1.2cm, FacePull > FaceMask, supplement and hard Mew during the entire process.

 

[Barbarossa_]

Whats your ethnicity OP?

 

[GetThatBread]

Sorry, usually I save all material but just spent 20 mins looking for the origin of the pics and couldn't find it. I do have a few more pics of the same girl though.

Pre treatment:
View attachment 254267

During treatment with hooks for facemask:
View attachment 254268

Post treatment:
View attachment 254269

@Golden Glass so you can have MSE on with braces? That would be ultra-lifeFuel because you can lessen the diastema while expanding. My question is does it hinder with expansion?

 

[Golden Glass]

@Golden Glass so you can have MSE on with braces? That would be ultra-lifeFuel because you can lessen the diastema while expanding. My question is does it hinder with expansion?

I personally think it does hinder expansion but I’m not totally sure. Best to ask your ortho