Im looking for surgeries to improve the maxilla region.
Is there a threshold that orthodontists will consider to give MSE, or will they give it anyone who comesnin with breathing problems and has the money?
I'd be interested about how much can the bone borne bollard plates move the bone in adults. Has any surgeon ever given any information about that?
There was a study that included teenagers, and they got abysmal results, however there is a high chance of bias since the result complimented their hypothesis (they measured the amount of sutural maturation)
Could you link them? Sounds interesting.
Well wide palate an aesthetic improvement is self explanatory
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Thanks I saw this one already actually. I was more interested in the ones which used adults since I have never been able to find anything about that. Even Derek Mahony uses bollards on children only (but for some weird reason uses MSE+FM on adults). @Sergio-OMS seems to have used bollards on adults though hasn't commented on how much protraction is possible.Zygomaticomaxillary suture maturation: Part II—The influence of sutural maturation on the response to maxillary protraction
To evaluate the influence of the maturational stages of zygomaticomaxillary sutures (ZMS) on the response to maxillary protraction.A total of 40 Class III patients were treated retrospectively with either a combination of rapid maxillary expansion and ...
ah, here are the studies https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3970075/ https://www.google.com/search?q=max...rome..69i57.5709j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
First study is FM not BAMP. Second study is SARPE + hyrax + FM.
ye there are no studies for adult with bamp, and ah i didnt even know the second included sarpe its been a while since i read it
is 17 considered as adult?
from an orthodontic standpoint, yes
over
Invisalign brings the face back and down as Professor John Mew explained.
Lol at trusting John Mew
Lol at trusting orthodontists
It's a hyrax inspired expander that they screw into your palate it's a combination of both but since the teeth don't move much relative to other RPE devices i'd consider it more bone borne, are you saying it's not because you experienced pressure on the teeth more than bone or is this what your ortho told you? it could be yours was poorly designed if so.
Google CBCT scan Marpe or for MSE etc. you will see what it does to the bone, it will make the maxilla wider and because it's connected to the zygos they will flare out from where they hinge at the fusions at the nose and side of the skull. It does expand midface which can be good for 3/4 profile. But if u want significant results for the zygo u will have to expand allot, the expansion at the zygos is less than at the palate obviously since it works like a lever the distance traveled by the expansion will be less than half at the zygos since they are further up than halfway where the expansion is occurring, Ronald ead expanded about 10 mm and got what looks to be 5 ish mm zygo expansion quite allot since cheek implants are usually 2 ish mm, if u have higher cheeks u will get less expansion and vice versa for lower.
but i dont think it would fit the same category as a 27 yr old would u agree
MSE is bone borne but maybe he spoke of the FM protraction, that is more tooth borne.
It's literally described as bone anchored in studies
Did he get CT scans?
it’s wrong, the metal wire attaching the molar band to mse is of a comparable strength to a thicker paper clip, meaning all the force goes into the molar not the mse
It's a functional procedure that should only a looksmax if your starting point is a medically deficient palate/maxilla. If you are trying to do anything other than correct deficiencies then it is cope, I say this as an MSE patient.
you retard it the combination of both,hooks are connected to the teeth part
If you have an average maxilla and get it to expand it to get better breathing would it be worth it? Or would it be pointless because your maxilla is average and expanding it wont open the nasal passage any significant amount to justify mse?
@Agendum Would you agree with this? If you are gl you would probably have a decent maxilla but would expanding it more help with breathing or cope?
Depends what you mean by average maxilla, Id like to make the classification of average as something normal, like attaining what your genes intended your maxilla to be. Relatively few people meet this so it muddies the discussion at bit as the reference is hard to agree on. Id say a good point of reference is a maxilla that allows for a decent arch with no dental crowding. A good maxilla would be the caveman maxilla which is hard to attain and might be unrealistic for many of us depending on our age (for me I might be SOL.)
ye definitely, they base the age group standard more for moving the teeth not orthopedic movements
depends on the provider, ting is 6500, same with @Aeons ortho
This study is basically comparing mse fm (uses a modified hyrax instead) and regular tooth borne fm
i havent read the full thing but it says bone anchored hybrid hyrax, so surely it isnt as effective as MSE?
Tbh, if I can get 3mm I'll be happy, with higher force and keeping suture open longer. Maybe even more. Plus breathing benefits of mse and maybe cheekbones
When r u actually gonna get mse? U told me 6 months ago that u were getting it soon
i doubt i said soon 6 months ago, but im taking a gap year, so i should get it then, my gap year is starting next september so hopefully before december
they were 10 years old in the study btw
it’s basically the exact same thing, it’s a hyrax that has 4 micro implants u screw in
