Just came from a consultation for bimax. Surgeon told me Raffaini is a god

[Deleted member 5799]

Hey guys, as i posted before i first went for a consultation with Joel Defrancq. Today i went to a local surgeon with good comments for a second opinion. Joel just told me about expanding my upper maxila.

So this one knew about Joel and many others that you guys usually mention. He knew a lot about Joel and had only good words about him, but we didnt spoke about his aesthetic views.

He told me Raffaini is a god that focuses heavily on aesthetics. He also said next to him is Alfaro here in Spain. He spoke to me about these two like if they were superior beings on a different level. The problem is that due to their high volume of work its likely that the adjustments are set up in the computer by an assistant, they are there just to execute the surgery.

Anyways about me: We agreed on expanding my upper maxila and also on doing a bimax with lefort, all done in the same surgery. Still dont know if they'll do rotation, still need to make tests.

I try hard to breath with my nose and dont have a perfect bite (alignment problems, one side slightly longer than other) so with bimax ill improve in many ways: better aesthetics, better breathing, better bite and better smile. As i said, all-in-one.

The thing i still dont know is if i can apply to "surgery first", i need to do the scans and bla bla and it will depend on results. I understand i have to wear bracers after, but also having to do before for like a year sounds fucking annoying. So fingers crossed.

Insurance wont cover anything so it will be 15k -closed price- for everything: surgery, hospital, physiotherapy...

I have the cash available, of course it hurts to pay such amount but at the same time im excited to finally go through it and fix my flaws.

 

[Deleted member 4430]

hail to the king, baby

 

[Darkstrand]

So with which surgeon are you going now?
And did he listen to any of your wishes and input?

 

[homo_faber]

15k for surgery in spain? usacels on suicide watch @Benjibanks

 

[Deleted member 5799]

So with which surgeon are you going now?
And did he listen to any of your wishes and input?

I prefer to not say the name yet. When this thing goes forward i will give more info, do not worry.

We spent one hour (compared to the 10 minutes with joel) speaking, he showed me with a lot of detail how things are done, showing me scans of people after surgery, i felt very comfortable with him, he didnt rush, even when i was about to leave he made me come back to explain more stuff.

I didnt really ask for my wishes yet, first we need to have the scans and then we will see what can be done. He is the expert so its not only about what i want but also about his expertise says. Like with my rhino i try to find common ground and go safe. Im 34 and married, im not looking to ascend (thats for you guys) but of course i will try to have the more realistic improvement possible.

 

[.👽.]

Hey guys, as i posted before i first went for a consultation with Joel Defrancq. Today i went to a local surgeon with good comments for a second opinion. Joel just told me about expanding my upper maxila.

So this one knew about Joel and many others that you guys usually mention. He knew a lot about Joel and had only good words about him, but we didnt spoke about his aesthetic views.

He told me Raffaini is a god that focuses heavily on aesthetics. He also said next to him is Alfaro here in Spain. He spoke to me about these two like if they were superior beings on a different level. The problem is that due to their high volume of work its likely that the adjustments are set up in the computer by an assistant, they are there just to execute the surgery.

Anyways about me: We agreed on expanding my upper maxila and also on doing a bimax with lefort, all done in the same surgery. Still dont know if they'll do rotation, still need to make tests.

I try hard to breath with my nose and dont have a perfect bite (alignment problems, one side slightly longer than other) so with bimax ill improve in many ways: better aesthetics, better breathing, better bite and better smile. As i said, all-in-one.

The thing i still dont know is if i can apply to "surgery first", i need to do the scans and bla bla and it will depend on results. I understand i have to wear bracers after, but also having to do before for like a year sounds fucking annoying. So fingers crossed.

Insurance wont cover anything so it will be 15k -closed price- for everything: surgery, hospital, physiotherapy...

I have the cash available, of course it hurts to pay such amount but at the same time im excited to finally go through it and fix my flaws.

Wait, insurance covers price in other Countrys too? So i can Switch my german surgeon for an italian etc??

 

[homo_faber]

Wait, insurance covers price in other Countrys too? So i can Switch my german surgeon for an italian etc??

he specifically said insurance doesnt cover anything no? he is paying 15k out of his own pocket

 

[.👽.]

he specifically said insurance doesnt cover anything no? he is paying 15k out of his own pocket

Oh my bad, misread it..

 

[Deleted member 12218]

Woah a 34 y/o, that’s got to be an all time record for this forum

 

[Darkstrand]

I prefer to not say the name yet. When this thing goes forward i will give more info, do not worry.

We spent one hour (compared to the 10 minutes with joel) speaking, he showed me with a lot of detail how things are done, showing me scans of people after surgery, i felt very comfortable with him, he didnt rush, even when i was about to leave he made me come back to explain more stuff.

I didnt really ask for my wishes yet, first we need to have the scans and then we will see what can be done. He is the expert so its not only about what i want but also about his expertise says. Like with my rhino i try to find common ground and go safe. Im 34 and married, im not looking to ascend (thats for you guys) but of course i will try to have the more realistic improvement possible.

Kudos for being the only person with a stable relationship on here

Considering he praises aesthetics-focused doctors he probably is well aware of how important that is too, but imagine you got a doctor that completely ignores some aspects, its probably a good idea to recognise early and find a new one

 

[Darkstrand]

Woah a 34 y/o, that’s got to be an all time record for this forum

We also have @RichmondBread

 

[BUY$DRUGS]

Hey man wish you luck in this. I too am getting Bimax soon and yes you need the braces to be on for around a year if you have even a minor shit bite/slightly fucked teeth before you can get the surgery done. Its not a big deal for me .. Im getting my braces next month and surgery a year out... sadly by some local surgeon but it is what it is.

 

[freeone12]

Woah a 34 y/o, that’s got to be an all time record for this forum

Most ppl who asscend here are 25-35,

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Hey man wish you luck in this. I too am getting Bimax soon and yes you need the braces to be on for around a year if you have even a minor shit bite/slightly fucked teeth before you can get the surgery done. Its not a big deal for me .. Im getting my braces next month and surgery a year out... sadly by some local surgeon but it is what it is.

Thanks. Theres something called "surgery first" that lets you skip the pre-surgery part.

Doc couldnt say if i was a candidate, it depends on scans that i will have done first week of march with a dentist.

The place i go is some kind of dentist/maxillofacial clinic, so communication between both will be better.

I have to take a look at this about "surgery first", taken from Alfaro's site. According to him it has potential to become the new standard.

https://www.institutomaxilofacial.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Surgery-What-have-we.pdf

 

[Mysticcc]

@DatGuyYouLike

 

[Mysticcc]

The surgery may be covered by insurance if you have sleep apnea?

 

[Deleted member 5799]

The surgery may be covered by insurance if you have sleep apnea?

I have no idea, but i dont have sleep apnea.
Not even mouth breathers are covered.
They perceive it like a cosmetic surgery.

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Well i just went to the dentist that works with my maxfac and it was suifuel to the point im starting to have doubts and think of giving up.

My main worry today was knowing if i could just have the "surgery first" or not. After waiting one month i thought i would finally know.

We have a brief interview about my goals and so on, she proceeded to explain a bit about the preparation part, surgery and post-op just to confirm that i was aware about everything. Basically it was just a way to break the ice.

After an inspection of my mouth she told me my molar teeth are a bit flat and this would be an issue, so its possible that i need to "reconstruct" them for surgery. The problem here is that its fucking expensive, she didnt know about the prices but a few more thousand. Just maybe, and only maybe, i wont need to do this.

She still couldnt tell me if i can go straight to surgery, but suspected that i would have to. Final answer to everything would be after studying my case. They made photos of my front, 2/3 and profile, mouth mold and some scans.

So now i have to wait another 3-4 weeks, i think i will get a final quote including bimax, addons (for example if i wanted implants), braces and whatever else. Nothing covered by insurance yayy

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Well i just went to the dentist that works with my maxfac and it was suifuel to the point im starting to have doubts and think of giving up.

My main worry today was knowing if i could just have the "surgery first" or not. After waiting one month i thought i would finally know.

We have a brief interview about my goals and so on, she proceeded to explain a bit about the preparation part, surgery and post-op just to confirm that i was aware about everything. Basically it was just a way to break the ice.

After an inspection of my mouth she told me my molar teeth are a bit flat and this would be an issue, so its possible that i need to "reconstruct" them for surgery. The problem here is that its fucking expensive, she didnt know about the prices but a few more thousand. Just maybe, and only maybe, i wont need to do this.

She still couldnt tell me if i can go straight to surgery, but suspected that i would have to. Final answer to everything would be after studying my case. They made photos of my front, 2/3 and profile, mouth mold and some scans.

So now i have to wait another 3-4 weeks, i think i will get a final quote including bimax, addons (for example if i wanted implants), braces and whatever else. Nothing covered by insurance yayy

Cannot edit anymore. Want to correct something:
She still couldnt tell me if i can go straight to surgery, but suspected that i would have to wear braces before

 

[Deleted member 10172]

Well i just went to the dentist that works with my maxfac and it was suifuel to the point im starting to have doubts and think of giving up.

My main worry today was knowing if i could just have the "surgery first" or not. After waiting one month i thought i would finally know.

We have a brief interview about my goals and so on, she proceeded to explain a bit about the preparation part, surgery and post-op just to confirm that i was aware about everything. Basically it was just a way to break the ice.

After an inspection of my mouth she told me my molar teeth are a bit flat and this would be an issue, so its possible that i need to "reconstruct" them for surgery. The problem here is that its fucking expensive, she didnt know about the prices but a few more thousand. Just maybe, and only maybe, i wont need to do this.

She still couldnt tell me if i can go straight to surgery, but suspected that i would have to. Final answer to everything would be after studying my case. They made photos of my front, 2/3 and profile, mouth mold and some scans.

So now i have to wait another 3-4 weeks, i think i will get a final quote including bimax, addons (for example if i wanted implants), braces and whatever else. Nothing covered by insurance yayy

Do they allow monthly installments?

 

[Deleted member 10172]

Hey guys, as i posted before i first went for a consultation with Joel Defrancq. Today i went to a local surgeon with good comments for a second opinion. Joel just told me about expanding my upper maxila.

So this one knew about Joel and many others that you guys usually mention. He knew a lot about Joel and had only good words about him, but we didnt spoke about his aesthetic views.

He told me Raffaini is a god that focuses heavily on aesthetics. He also said next to him is Alfaro here in Spain. He spoke to me about these two like if they were superior beings on a different level. The problem is that due to their high volume of work its likely that the adjustments are set up in the computer by an assistant, they are there just to execute the surgery.

Anyways about me: We agreed on expanding my upper maxila and also on doing a bimax with lefort, all done in the same surgery. Still dont know if they'll do rotation, still need to make tests.

I try hard to breath with my nose and dont have a perfect bite (alignment problems, one side slightly longer than other) so with bimax ill improve in many ways: better aesthetics, better breathing, better bite and better smile. As i said, all-in-one.

The thing i still dont know is if i can apply to "surgery first", i need to do the scans and bla bla and it will depend on results. I understand i have to wear bracers after, but also having to do before for like a year sounds fucking annoying. So fingers crossed.

Insurance wont cover anything so it will be 15k -closed price- for everything: surgery, hospital, physiotherapy...

I have the cash available, of course it hurts to pay such amount but at the same time im excited to finally go through it and fix my flaws.

15k is legit, does he add jaw angle implants like sailer?

 

[randomvanish]

raffiani writes articles on Comic Sans jfl wtf

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Do they allow monthly installments?

I suppose, but normally if you go that way the final price is higher. But this is the same when you buy a car or ask for a loan.

15k is legit, does he add jaw angle implants like sailer?

I think so but i dont know about the prices for any addons, he will tell me later when we make the final arrangements

Im guessing if you do together it will be cheaper than having separate surgeries.

 

[Deleted member 10172]

I suppose, but normally if you go that way the final price is higher. But this is the same when you buy a car or ask for a loan.

I think so but i dont know about the prices for any addons

Im guessing if you do together it will be cheaper than having separate surgeries.

i thought they would do 0% interest rate on monthly installments

 

[Deleted member 5799]

i thought they would do 0% interest rate on monthly installments

Oh just checked their site and they say 0% interest, no fees at all

 

[Deleted member 10172]

Oh just checked their site and they say 0% interest, no fees at all

I heard hes racist so idk if I should go to him :/

 

[Deleted member 5799]

I heard hes racist so idk if I should go to him :/

dude im not going to raffaini

 

[Deleted member 7399]

dude im not going to raffaini

How come? You’re already dropping 15k + which is around what Raffaini charges. He might be able to do surgery first too

 

[Deleted member 5799]

April 27 update

Had appointment by the end of march but surgeon had a motorbike accident and waited another month for appointment.

I met the dentist today as surgeon wasnt still working and she explained me about the procedure in my case. The good news were that i can do surgery first and dont need to fix my flat molars.

The bad (not so bad) is that i have some wisdom teeth that didnt come out and need to extract them first.

One thing she said, but admitting she is not a surgeon and could be wrong, is that she isnt sure if the forward advance can be very big. Going too far can make me look bad because of my upper lip, but surgeon has the last word. Made me doubt about a life changing "ascension" but okay i would have the surgery anyways... right now i just want to see the morphs of expected results and understand if all this will be worth it.


So yeah, in general im having good vibes again knowing that i can have surgery straight away and will save a good few thousand €

I go for a head scan next week and then have a consultation with surgeon on the week after that should be one of the latest if not the last.

By the way i look like a fucking ogre on my photos

 

[Artemide]

elab on upper lip please

 

[one job away]

Hey man wish you luck in this. I too am getting Bimax soon and yes you need the braces to be on for around a year if you have even a minor shit bite/slightly fucked teeth before you can get the surgery done. Its not a big deal for me .. Im getting my braces next month and surgery a year out... sadly by some local surgeon but it is what it is.

can you pay for invisible ones?

 

[Germania]

I will visit spain for a whole month this year, in which region do the stacys live? I need a spanish GF. I speak spanish by the way

 

[one job away]

Hey guys, as i posted before i first went for a consultation with Joel Defrancq. Today i went to a local surgeon with good comments for a second opinion. Joel just told me about expanding my upper maxila.

So this one knew about Joel and many others that you guys usually mention. He knew a lot about Joel and had only good words about him, but we didnt spoke about his aesthetic views.

He told me Raffaini is a god that focuses heavily on aesthetics. He also said next to him is Alfaro here in Spain. He spoke to me about these two like if they were superior beings on a different level. The problem is that due to their high volume of work its likely that the adjustments are set up in the computer by an assistant, they are there just to execute the surgery.

Anyways about me: We agreed on expanding my upper maxila and also on doing a bimax with lefort, all done in the same surgery. Still dont know if they'll do rotation, still need to make tests.

I try hard to breath with my nose and dont have a perfect bite (alignment problems, one side slightly longer than other) so with bimax ill improve in many ways: better aesthetics, better breathing, better bite and better smile. As i said, all-in-one.

The thing i still dont know is if i can apply to "surgery first", i need to do the scans and bla bla and it will depend on results. I understand i have to wear bracers after, but also having to do before for like a year sounds fucking annoying. So fingers crossed.

Insurance wont cover anything so it will be 15k -closed price- for everything: surgery, hospital, physiotherapy...

I have the cash available, of course it hurts to pay such amount but at the same time im excited to finally go through it and fix my flaws.

good luck. keep us updated

 

[Deleted member 5799]

elab on upper lip please

With bimax your mouth becomes wider. She told me something about a girl in particular who wanted too extreme forward and looked fucking weird. Dond mind that comment.

can you pay for invisible ones?

yes, you can have anything if you pay
invisible ones are slower i think

i prefer braces if they are faster, its covid time so with mask most people wont notice

 

[Deleted member 5799]

I will visit spain for a whole month this year, in which region do the stacys live? I need a spanish GF. I speak spanish by the way

Spain is a bad place for dating, girls are too much over their heads.

I would get a traditional woman from poland, ukraine, russia... slavic basically. Slavic women are still oldschool (good housewife, not feminist...) Mine is ukrainian.

 

[Germania]

Spain is a bad place for dating, girls are too much over their heads.

I am blonde.
Is the north fine? I will go to the Ebro to fish and will travel around aswell.

 

[Deleted member 5799]

I am blonde.
Is the north fine? I will go to the Ebro to fish and will travel around aswell.

The north is beautiful, you will like it

 

[Deleted member 5799]

May 3rd update

Just had the scans done. Had some trouble as insurance wouldnt cover this particular kind of scan on the place i went, it was either paying 150€ or finding some place where my insurance would cover it. They gave me a list of 5 hospitals and 4 of them didnt have any appointments until 2 or even 3 weeks later, that would mean delaying the surgeon consultation again.

Last place i called were so kind.. they let me go right away without appointment.

So if everything goes well i will have the surgery arrangements next monday, like specifics on what will be done and i guess surgery date.

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Wtf i think the radiology team messed up.

I just downloaded the scans and its like a black and white thing showing in a lot of photos my head layer by layer... shouldnt it be a scan showing my skull in 3D?

Its something similar to this

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Just came from surgeon again.

· He first told me i could just do palate expansion and fix my bite but since im focused on aesthetics, second option is indeed bimax.

· Need to take my hidden molars out and i cannot have surgery until 6 months after this totally fucks up timings of my plan for this year, since i was expecting to get hired in a new job in about 3-4 months and i cant just start somewhere new and suddenly ask for some free days. They can also be taken out same day as surgery but if i understood correctly, the risk of losing sensitivity on the lips is higher, one of the molars is veeery close to a nerve.

· Had small talk about other surgeons and their techniques (Zailer, Raffaini...).

· I stated my goals: as much forward growth as possible within aesthetic limits, wider jaw, better chin (projection and square), good jaw corners (dont remember the technical name).

He will discuss with his team what can realistically be done and prices (for implants) and we meet again next week.
If i knew how much Raffaini's bimax cost i would go to him, but theres 0 flights to his city and consultation is like 300€. Considering Alfaro as second option right now.

 

[uranio]

Raffaini’s bimax costs 20k-25k

 

[Deleted member 5799]

Raffaini’s bimax costs 20k-25k

No flights from here to any airports in Parma, Italy.

Barcelona, where Alfaro is, is just 20 minutes flight away from me.

 

[bysontallou]

Just came from surgeon again.

· He first told me i could just do palate expansion and fix my bite but since im focused on aesthetics, second option is indeed bimax.

· Need to take my hidden molars out and i cannot have surgery until 6 months after this totally fucks up timings of my plan for this year, since i was expecting to get hired in a new job in about 3-4 months and i cant just start somewhere new and suddenly ask for some free days. They can also be taken out same day as surgery but if i understood correctly, the risk of losing sensitivity on the lips is higher, one of the molars is veeery close to a nerve.

· Had small talk about other surgeons and their techniques (Zailer, Raffaini...).

· I stated my goals: as much forward growth as possible within aesthetic limits, wider jaw, better chin (projection and square), good jaw corners (dont remember the technical name).

He will discuss with his team what can realistically be done and prices (for implants) and we meet again next week.
If i knew how much Raffaini's bimax cost i would go to him, but theres 0 flights to his city and consultation is like 300€. Considering Alfaro as second option right now.

How are you going to get a wider jaw from bimax?

 

[freeone12]

If remember correctly (but check me)alfaro and raff dont perform chin wing

 

[Deleted member 5799]

How are you going to get a wider jaw from bimax?

Implants and bimax on same procedure.

The ideal, if possible, would be custom wraparound plus bimax together.

 

[bysontallou]

Implants and bimax on same procedure.

The ideal, if possible, would be custom wraparound plus bimax together.

Could you PM me the surgeon? It's very rare for surgeons to combine jaw implants in the same procedure as bimax.

 

[Lars]

Does raffaini also do genio?

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Ok so here are my two cents on this one.

WHAT the fuck are these bluepilled orthos doing to you? Seriously orthos are the worst, fuck them. Just go straight for the surgery with a blackpilled surgeon.

Consult Sailer, Gunson, Sinn, Zarrinbal or Dr Kater in Germany and they won't ask shit about your bite. You'll get a 10mm advancement and ascend hard afterwards.

I wouldn't go with a local maxfac in spain. Clearly he can do the job but I'd be concerned about aesthetics..

My tip for you: skip the ortho bullshit, get your molars out, and one year after that you go to a blackpilled surgeon for bimax. I've chatted with so many post surgery patients that I can tell you that usually you can go back to work after 3 weeks, so just use your holidays for it.

Also, another side note: who was that retarded to send you in for a full head CT scan instead of a digital volume tomography (DVT) ? Conventional CT scans cause 10 - 20 times more radiation exposure and the effective dosis is even higher since sensitive areas such as the brain are being fully exposed. JFL at exponentially increasing your brain cancer risk without any reason.

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Does raffaini also do genio?

He does so called trimax (bimax + genio) but just genio probably not because it would be a waste of time.

Seriously a genio is so simple you could perform it on your own if you have strong enough local anaesthesia and have the balls tobutcher yourself in front of the mirror

 

[Descartes]

If i knew how much Raffaini's bimax cost i would go to him

Is Raffaini still a good choice? The pictures in his website are veeery old, I want to go to him too but I'm scared his prime has passed or something