New thread just for serious LLers

[QuestForChad]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

 

[wollet2]

giotikas is one of the best. too expensive for europe tho

 

[QuestForChad]

giotikas is one of the best. too expensive for europe tho

I don’t know what to do, I’m in a bind here. The STRYDE nail hasn’t been available and it’s not known either when it will return to the market. I wanna do internals because you can return to your life quicker, very slim odds of developing an infection and also less chance of blood clots because the nail is weight bearing and you’re expected to resume walking straight after surgery. Problem is that I am quite active and internals on tibias lead to permanent knee problems and you may get deep vein thrombosis after surgery.

 

[count copula]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

Not worth, just live with 5'8. It's acceptable more or less brother.

 

[wollet2]

I don’t know what to do, I’m in a bind here. The STRYDE nail hasn’t been available and it’s not known either when it will return to the market. I wanna do internals because you can return to your life quicker, very slim odds of developing an infection and also less chance of blood clots because the nail is weight bearing and you’re expected to resume walking straight after surgery. Problem is that I am quite active and internals on tibias lead to permanent knee problems and you may get deep vein thrombosis after surgery.

discuss this with him

i havent involved in ll for years

 

[Anchor_Ship]

Thoughts on geomaxxing?

 

[FinasterideAt17]

Ll doesn't help, you will still get heightmogged after Ll and feel inferior

 

[QuestForChad]

Not worth, just live with 5'8. It's acceptable more or less brother.

Actually I’d like to go for the full 5 inches and get to 6’1 which would be feasible in theory. However if I got to 5’10, looked and felt nice I’d just call it a day and stop there.

 

[QuestForChad]

Ll doesn't help, you will still get heightmogged after Ll and feel inferior

True, there’s always someone taller and that will make me look and feel small in comparison. I just don’t wanna be a small guy and provided you have other things going for you such as decent face, moneymaxxing, gymcelling, hairmaxxing, teethmaxxing, skinmaxxing and fashionmaxxing that should be enough to make you feel confident in general and do well.

 

[looksforlife]

Thoughts about live life taller in turkey?

 

[FinasterideAt17]

Actually I’d like to go for the full 5 inches and get to 6’1 which would be feasible in theory. However if I got to 5’10, looked and felt nice I’d just call it a day and stop there.

Even then - I am 6"0 and get mogged everywhere I go it really does not matter if it's about feeling inferior unless you can get to 6"4 + get clavicle lengthening surgery

 

[joseph]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

Wanna do 3 inches on femurs but didn’t know about the potential knee issues. There’s precise and STRYDE right? And stryde isn’t available right now from what I remember.

 

[Realism]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

I was your height and did it.
It was the toughest thing I've ever done in my life but it was definitely worth it in the end.

 

[QuestForChad]

Even then - I am 6"0 and get mogged everywhere I go it really does not matter if it's about feeling inferior unless you can get to 6"4 + get clavicle lengthening surgery

I don't mind being mogged, even a 6'4 guy gets mogged in the big cities or towns notorious for having tall people, like some rural villages in the Netherlands or Scandinavia. A guy who's 6'4 or 6'5 will still have to tilt his head up to talk to someone 6'7 and taller. The problem isn't so much being mogged but being tall enough that your masculinity isn't called into question, your confidence isn't affected nor your dating life. At 6'0 no one will call you short, girls will not reject you and you can look great with the right frame, physique and outfits. At 5'8 I get mogged by teenage girls man lol, that's the most humiliating thing ever.

 

[QuestForChad]

I was your height and did it.
It was the toughest thing I've ever done in my life but it was definitely worth it in the end.

can you walk me through the method you went for, distraction amount, location and so on. Thanks

 

[Realism]

can you walk me through the method you went for, distraction amount, location and so on. Thanks

LoN femur, 6.6cm, turkey

 

[QuestForChad]

Wanna do 3 inches on femurs but didn’t know about the potential knee issues. There’s precise and STRYDE right? And stryde isn’t available right now from what I remember.

The knee issues only concern tibia lengthening. I can't exactly explain why but my best guess is because they drill through your knee during surgery to insert the rod in your tibia. I have looked at videos and it looks barbaric lol

 

[Gaygymmaxx]

What are his prices?

 

[QuestForChad]

LoN femur, 6.6cm, turkey

Was it THAT painful? Did it traumatise you for life? All the pain and feeling miserable for months. How is your health? Did you take so much medication you ended up burdening your organs too much?

 

[QuestForChad]

What are his prices?

Giotikas wants 93k euros to lengthen TIBIA + FEMURS with the STRYDE nail and 50k ish for one segment only, also with the STRYDE nail

 

[Gaygymmaxx]

Giotikas wants 93k euros to lengthen TIBIA + FEMURS with the STRYDE nail and 50k ish for one segment only, also with the STRYDE nail

What is stryde bruh

And holy shit that'll take years of wagecucking

 

[Realism]

Was it THAT painful? Did it traumatise you for life? All the pain and feeling miserable for months. How is your health? Did you do take so much medication your ended burdening your organs too much?

Before the surgery, my legs were quite massive (you're better off not having muscular legs, lengthening the bone is easy, the soft tissue is what's tough, I wasn't aware that this was a disadvantage before I had the surgery though), hence I probably had more pain than the average patient.
It's tough, sleeping on my back during the lengthening period was what I found most annoying though.
It did not traumatize me for life, I knew it would be tough, and I knew it would be temporarily. I probably was underestimating the pain however.
I was taking up to 200mg voltaren a day split in 2 doses, on top of that I added 100mg tramadol as well during the last month on top of that.
My health is good, the pain killers obviously put a strain on your organs, but if you have no medical issues and are young and healthy going into this, I wouldn't worry about it. Your organs are resilient are you're being monitored with regular blood samples as well.
I'm overall happy I did it, walking normal now, taking the rods out hopefully in 8 months or so.

 

[QuestForChad]

What is stryde bruh

And holy shit that'll take years of wagecucking

man i've read your posts and I know you're passionate about boxing. This procedure isn't for you, you'd have to let go of your boxing aspirations for this.

 

[QuestForChad]

Before the surgery, my legs were quite massive (you're better off not having muscular legs, lengthening the bone is easy, the soft tissue is what's tough, I wasn't aware that this was a disadvantage before I had the surgery though), hence I probably had more pain than the average patient.
It's tough, sleeping on my back during the lengthening period was what I found most annoying though.
It did not traumatize me for life, I knew it would be tough, and I knew it would be temporarily. I probably was underestimating the pain however.
I was taking up to 200mg voltaren a day split in 2 doses, on top of that I added 100mg tramadol as well during the last month on top of that.
My health is good, the pain killers obviously put a strain on your organs, but if you have no medical issues and are young and healthy going into this, I wouldn't worry about it. Your organs are resilient are you're being monitored with regular blood samples as well.
I'm overall happy I did it, walking normal now, taking the rods out hopefully in 8 months or so.

Mine are muscular too, product of years coping at the gym. How long did you feel pain for? Can you walk and do sports like you used to? Does it feel weird knowing you got a piece of metal inside your bone? Does it hurt? Do you ever forget the rod is even there?

 

[Gaygymmaxx]

man i've read your posts and I know you're passionate about boxing. This procedure isn't for you, you'd have to let go of your boxing aspirations for this.

ok yakhi

i pray my GH works and i make it to 5"7

 

[Realism]

Mine are muscular too, product of years coping at the gym. How long did you feel pain for? Can you walk and do sports like you used to? Does it feel weird knowing you got a piece of metal inside your bone? Does it hurt? Do you ever forget the rod is even there?

You might have some increased pain as well then.
The pain was during the lengthening, especially the proximal pin site where the fixator is attached on your hip, this was most painful after 5cm or so, the pain killers take care of it though, but Voltaren works for about 8 hours, the effects seems to extend to perhaps 10-12 hours if you combine it with Tramadol as well, this leaves a few hours during the day where you don't have pain relief and I was pretty adamant on not taking more than 200mg voltaren a day (this is a lot).
After the fixators was removed, the pain basically dissapeared pretty damn fast.

I can walk, I'm still in consolidation phase, I cannot run or do anything in regards to sports yet, I'm slowly building my legs back up in the gym though.
You don't feel the rods inside no, but you need to get them removed to get back into sports. Bones naturally have some elasticity, the rod inside is completely solid. Running with solid rods fixed to elastic bones could probably damage them doing something like running which would put repeated stress on your bones.
Oh, there's no pain now.

Also, individual patient experiences vary *wildly*, some get through it with absolute no problem. Some are more prone to pain etc

 

[QuestForChad]

You might have some increased pain as well then.
The pain was during the lengthening, especially the proximal pin site where the fixator is attached on your hip, this was most painful after 5cm or so, the pain killers take care of it though, but Voltaren works for about 8 hours, the effects seems to extend to perhaps 10-12 hours if you combine it with Tramadol as well, this leaves a few hours during the day where you don't have pain relief and I was pretty adamant on not taking more than 200mg voltaren a day (this is a lot).
After the fixators was removed, the pain basically dissapeared pretty damn fast.

I can walk, I'm still in consolidation phase, I cannot run or do anything in regards to sports yet, I'm slowly building my legs back up in the gym though.
You don't feel the rods inside no, but you need to get them removed to get back into sports. Bones naturally have some elasticity, the rod inside is completely solid. Running with solid rods fixed to elastic bones could probably damage them doing something like running which would put repeated stress on your bones.
Oh, there's no pain now.

Also, individual patient experiences vary *wildly*, some get through it with absolute no problem. Some are more prone to pain etc

You say you're slowly building your legs back up in the gym. What does this mean in more practical terms? Are you still being overseen by PTs and so on? Or are you working on your legs by yourself? I plan on doing STRYDE which is a weight bearing nail, is it reasonable to assume a weight bearing nail will make the entire process easier? You mention the pain vanishing as soon as you got rid of the fixators, someone who does internals will not even have to deal with the fixators.
Something that concerns me is taking too much medication during the process, for example, if you do externals, you're considerably more prone to an infection and will have to take antibiotics for that. Coupled with the unbearable pain and the high dosages of painkillers, taking antibiotics as well can become quite dangerous I think. High dosages of painkillers mixed with antibiotics can lead to kidney and liver failure I believe. As far as returning to running and sports, it's like 2 years in total refraining from those activities right? Sounds like a really long time.

 

[MEGA CHAD]

I am 1.76 cm tall, I would like to apply 4 cm to the femur and 3.5 to the tibia, I would reach 1.84 cm or 6'1, is this possible? would you know if the recovery would be easier than that of an average patient?

 

[QuestForChad]

I am 1.76 cm tall, I would like to apply 4 cm to the femur and 3.5 to the tibia, I would reach 1.84 cm or 6'1, is this possible? would you know if the recovery would be easier than that of an average patient?

you should just go for 3 inches on your femurs. It's not practical paying for 2 rods and 2 surgeries and breaking both bones for an amount you can get in one surgery.

 

[Realism]

You say you're slowly building your legs back up in the gym. What does this mean in more practical terms? Are you still being overseen by PTs and so on? Or are you working on your legs by yourself? I plan on doing STRYDE which is a weight bearing nail, is it reasonable to assume a weight bearing nail will make the entire process easier? You mention the pain vanishing as soon as you got rid of the fixators, someone who does internals will not even have to deal with the fixators.
Something that concerns me is taking too much medication during the process, for example, if you do externals, you're considerably more prone to an infection and will have to take antibiotics for that. Coupled with the unbearable pain and the high dosages of painkillers, taking antibiotics as well can become quite dangerous I think. High dosages of painkillers mixed with antibiotics can lead to kidney and liver failure I believe. As far as returning to running and sports, it's like 2 years in total refraining from those activities right? Sounds like a really long time.

Not being overseen by PTs anymore no.
Just slowly building them back up in the gym by myself.
Stryde isn't available as far as I'm aware, heard it might come back in 2023 though, and yes, Stryde would make your whole process a fuckton easier.

Pin site infections are pretty normal, their treated easily though.
And yeah, pain killers and antibiotics essentially go together with leg lengthening, especially doing externals.
During my stay I never saw someone having any organ trouble due to the medication though.
As I said, being young and healthy before going into this, and you'll be fine. Probably a good idea to stay off alcohol for a decent amount of time after finishing this process though. Again, you're monitored during the process.

I'd say at least 2 years probably yeah, and you're probably never going to get back to 100% of your athletic abilities before doing this, that's a trade off you should ask yourself if you're fine with.
I could be wrong though, again, it's 8 months since I did this surgery now, I'm still pretty early in my recovery so I can't speak from personal experience on that.

 

[QuestForChad]

Not being overseen by PTs anymore no.
Just slowly building them back up in the gym by myself.
Stryde isn't available as far as I'm aware, heard it might come back in 2023 though, and yes, Stryde would make your whole process a fuckton easier.

Pin site infections are pretty normal, their treated easily though.
And yeah, pain killers and antibiotics essentially go together with leg lengthening, especially doing externals.
During my stay I never saw someone having any organ trouble due to the medication though.
As I said, being young and healthy before going into this, and you'll be fine. Probably a good idea to stay off alcohol for a decent amount of time after finishing this process though. Again, you're monitored during the process.

I'd say at least 2 years probably yeah, and you're probably never going to get back to 100% of your athletic abilities before doing this, that's a trade off you should ask yourself if you're fine with.
I could be wrong though, again, it's 8 months since I did this surgery now, I'm still pretty early in my recovery so I can't speak from personal experience on that.

I have tried to find as much information as possible about patients who have done LL and are now fully recovered and consolidated but, curiously, most people just disappear from online forums after being done with distraction and never come to report back on how their life has changed etc. I also don't understand why people claim returning to your previous athletic abilities is not possible. I mean I get that for a relatively long time your legs will not feel right and there will be little you can do with them but I can't see why you cannot perform well athletically after your legs fully consolidate, you get rid of the rods and you get used to the longer legs and different centre of gravity.

 

[MEGA CHAD]

you should just go for 3 inches on your femurs. It's not practical paying for 2 rods and 2 surgeries and breaking both bones for an amount you can get in one surgery.

the proportions brother

 

[QuestForChad]

the proportions brother

I know... I know that spreading 8cm across both limbs would look better but 2 surgeries is hard trust me, not to mention the financial setback. These are all details you must research beforehand

 

[Stoicism0]

Would be curious to know the future advancements. Might save up to eventually get one in late 30s as is too expensive currently.

Hoping gets much, much cheaper. What's the best value vs safe option atm?

 

[QuestForChad]

Would be curious to know the future advancements. Might save up to eventually get one in late 30s as is too expensive currently.

Hoping gets much, much cheaper. What's the best value vs safe option atm?

Doubt this will ever get cheaper, in fact it’ll get more expensive and you’ll find yourself regretting you hadn’t done it sooner. The methods shouldn’t get much better than what is possible with the STRYDE nail and this surgery is growing in popularity. With the greater demand will come greater prices for sure.

 

[Stoicism0]

Doubt this will ever get cheaper, in fact it’ll get more expensive and you’ll find yourself regretting you hadn’t done it sooner. The methods shouldn’t get much better than what is possible with the STRYDE nail and this surgery is growing in popularity. With the greater demand will come greater prices for sure.

Can't afford for a while. I would get right now if could afford it. Need much cheaper accessibility in Australia or nearby. It's super unaffordable atm. Don't exactly have a spare 60-100k lying around.

 

[Deleted member 8869]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

if you consider ll and arent going to the us or germany its over man

 

[Deleted member 8869]

So as an aspiring LL patient I decided to create this thread just for people serious about this procedure so we can discuss surgeons, lengthening amounts depending on our own proportions, resources available to spend etc.

As a blonde white guy with blue eyes, nice beard and smile being 5’8 is the biggest let down I have. Limb lengthening is definitely risky but being height mogged in Europe has made me depressed and insecure for too long. I am tired of being drained emotionally and mentally from this.

The biggest humiliation a man can endure is being shorter than girls and kids which at a height of 5’8 it is something I am often subject to. What’s the point anyway of being otherwise decent looking if you’re fucking small? How can you even call yourself a man if you are the size of a kid?

Height is so damn important, much more than face, it is so common to see hot women dating fat and ugly guys just because they have the height and a good frame.

With that said, I will soon have a consultation with Dr. Giotikas from Greece and I will endeavour to ask him as many questions as possible. Even though femurs are safer and you can do 3 inches as opposed to 2, my tibias are quite stubby and I am convinced that adding 6cm to them would make me look not only taller but much more elegant.

So who else wants to jump on this bandwagon and become a height mogger?

i consider ll unironically aswell will probably go to ZEM germany

 

[QuestForChad]

i consider ll unironically aswell will probably go to ZEM germany

What’s ZEM? I only know of the Betz Institute

 

[Deleted member 8869]

What’s ZEM? I only know of the Betz Institute

its in munich the leading doctor there is also really accredited he does ll arm lengthening and even clavicles

 

[QuestForChad]

its in munich the leading doctor there is also really accredited he does ll arm lengthening and even clavicles

I’ll research him thanks

 

[Deleted member 1901]

Ll doesn't help, you will still get heightmogged after Ll and feel inferior

"looksmaxxing doesn't help you, you will still get mogged" The point it TO MOG obviously you will always get mogged by someone.

 

[QuestForChad]

"looksmaxxing doesn't help you, you will still get mogged" The point it TO MOG obviously you will always get mogged by

Even Gandy and Chico get mogged

 

[Deleted member 1901]

I plan on 7 cm on tibia and 8 cm on femur. Or would 6 cm/9 cm be better?

 

[QuestForChad]

I plan on 7 cm on tibia and 8 cm on femur. Or would 6 cm/9 cm be better?

Former is better although above 6cm on tibia may be difficult

 

[Deleted member 1901]

Former is better although above 6cm on tibia may be difficult

I am ignorant to rely on muscular/ligament stretching to an extreme level to mitigate the risks involved in a relative high amount of lengthening? Do you think the the nerves could be a problem?

 

[FinasterideAt17]

"looksmaxxing doesn't help you, you will still get mogged" The point it TO MOG obviously you will always get mogged by someone.

you are right, i should have said LL is often disappointing because you will still feel like you are being mogged constantly

 

[OldestDream]

No, the point of being 6 ft 1 or as close as possible is to not get mogged for your height as often I know people that are 5'6'' in the US (looks wise they are 6.5/10, with a 9.5+ being Drago or hexxum and a 5 being your normiecell) that can sleep with 100+ women (varying from 5s to 7.5/10 face wise) a year through tinder and game so its definetly possible to have a rather succesful life being a normie cell through softmaxxing and gamemaxxing.

This is the best diary of LL surgery that i have seen 20 cm+ 3 surgeries just by doing things right 1st surgery was lizarovv so external and still fully recovered (fully recovered means not long term health problems) from (159 cm to 181), remember that science and procedures keep advancing: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=65933.0

 

[OldestDream]

I am ignorant to rely on muscular/ligament stretching to an extreme level to mitigate the risks involved in a relative high amount of lengthening? Do you think the the nerves could be a problem?

In the thread that I posted, the dude did ATL (Achilles Tendon Ligament) for the tibia 8 cm surgery you only needed if you are doing that much on the tibias or if the doc believes its best (Ext post OP Docs were Doc Pili and Doc Catagni for the tibias, according to OP this are the best) they seem to be best for using this method (ATL well-timed after the surgery, not after or before recovery very important) that according to OP has no case of permanent damage.

 

[fruitgunpop]

No, the point of being 6 ft 1 or as close as possible is to not get mogged for your height as often I know people that are 5'6'' in the US (looks wise they are 6.5/10, with a 9.5+ being Drago or hexxum and a 5 being your normiecell) that can sleep with 100+ women (varying from 5s to 7.5/10 face wise) a year through tinder and game so its definetly possible to have a rather succesful life being a normie cell through softmaxxing and gamemaxxing.

This is the best diary of LL surgery that i have seen 20 cm+ 3 surgeries just by doing things right 1st surgery was lizarovv so external and still fully recovered (fully recovered means not long term health problems) from (159 cm to 181), remember that science and procedures keep advancing: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=65933.0

What a mad lad