question to religioncels

[ltn gooner]

what %?

Histroically and logically catholicism is right what don't you get ?

 

[william.]

Technically I dont have a zero percent chance of being wrong, because reality could be an illusion, or we could be being deceived by a malevolent being, but I dont view reality, and my belief in God as something that is "there is a 30 percent change of being wrong" or smth.

everyone has to accept basic premises of reality, and God follows from mine.

Everyone has to accept some basic premises about reality, and from the premises I accept, belief in God follows. I think my reasoning for this is sound. I’ve experienced God and I love God. I used to get caught up in debating atheists, Muslims, and others, but I find those debates mostly redundant now.

would u go into a debate with someone willing to come out saying "jesus is not god"?

 

[topology]

i typed the currency u retard

Nopeee. It could represent many things.

not one

Because no one cares to be on your thread iqlet.

u still look gay

This is your best argument btw. Mirin.



I have intellectually molested you. I'm going to stop responding now as you're just spewing garbage.

 

[william.]

Histroically and logically catholicism is right what don't you get ?

U said yeah to my question which was "do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? " what % is there that u are wrong would u say?

 

[owlofathena]

can u answer the yes or no question in the post?

If I was born a Sikh for example. I would definitely question why I am following this religion as I wouldn't be able to cut my hair. A lot of the times it's cultural and they are that way because they were brought up that way in that culture and they never broke away from it.

 

[exkira]

would u go into a debate with someone willing to come out saying "jesus is not god"?

yes

 

[william.]

Nopeee. It could represent many things.

no it could not in this context

Because no one cares to be on your thread iqlet.

you do

This is your best argument btw. Mirin.

lol gaylord

I have intellectually molested you. I'm going to stop responding now as you're just spewing garbage.

lol defend your first claim i said i pay u

 

[william.]

If I was born a Sikh for example. I would definitely question why I am following this religion as I wouldn't be able to cut my hair. A lot of the times it's cultural and they are that way because they were brought up that way in that culture and they never broke away from it.

can you answer the question?

 

[william.]

yes

I find the concept of an all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing to not be in any way a reflection of the world we live in.


For example, if someone had a USB that could delete all CP on Earth and didn’t do it, could he really be considered all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing?


I think you know where I’m going with this.

 

[william.]

I find the concept of an all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing to not be in any way a reflection of the world we live in.


For example, if someone had a USB that could delete all CP on Earth and didn’t do it, could he really be considered all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing?


I think you know where I’m going with this.

Im sure u have heard argument like this 100 times, but yeah yeah

 

[ltn gooner]

U said yeah to my question which was "do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? " what % is there that u are wrong would u say?

0 because logically, a religion where you can fuck children but you can't eat pork ain't right. Buddism, Hinduism make no sense. Those pagan believes from around the world were all just wiped out with the time and i think we don't have to talk about the ... So we Land at christianity. A church which was founded by a german heretic who just made the faith like he wanted aint right. So we're at the orthodox. They don't believe in the filioque, which makes the son and the holy ghost practically twins because there is no diffrence between them, which is heretical. So were at the true religion and at the true church.

 

[owlofathena]

Early Christianity believed in a real, institutional church. The Orthodox Church is that church.

Orthodox Church is definitely the closest to early Christianity no question. I know that the Catholic Church for example doesn't have the Gospel of Thomas as canon. I don't know if it's canon in Orthodox. Its one of the things I questioned the Catholic Church on.

 

[william.]

0 because logically, a religion where you can fuck children but you can't eat pork ain't right. Buddism, Hinduism make no sense. Those pagan believes from around the world were all just wiped out with the time and i think we don't have to talk about the ... So we Land at christianity. A church which was founded by a german heretic who just made the faith like he wanted aint right. So we're at the orthodox. They don't believe in the filioque, which makes the son and the holy ghost practically twins because there is no diffrence between them, which is heretical. So were at the true religion and at the true church.

so there is 0% chance that ur religion is wrong? and 0% chance that any other is right? isn't it just very fortunate for u that u where born right geographically to have a 100%success

do you really wanna get into how logical christianity

Orthodox Church is definitely the closest to early Christianity no question. I know that the Catholic Church for example doesn't have the Gospel of Thomas as canon. I don't know if it's canon in Orthodox. Its one of the things I questioned the Catholic Church on.

bro is there any possibility that you belive in the wrong religion

 

[exkira]

I find the concept of an all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing to not be in any way a reflection of the world we live in.


For example, if someone had a USB that could delete all CP on Earth and didn’t do it, could he really be considered all-loving, all-powerful, and all-knowing?


I think you know where I’m going with this.

Its a compelling argument, and looking around at the worlds evils always shakes peoples faith.

In Christianity God is the ground of being itself, sustaining creation and human freedom at every moment. If God were to remove every instance of grave evil by direct intervention, that would also mean removing the conditions that make genuine moral freedom possible.

Many Christians have this lovey dovey notion of what God is, and what Christianity is (often influenced by American protestantism) which gets conflated with materialism and "Americanism" where the goal of Christianity is to live a good life, with kids and a wife etc.

But this isn't Christianity, Christianity demands union with God through suffering, and cultivating virtue despite a world that wants to drag us down. Obviously evil is bad, but there is something so compelling and beautiful about this life when we understand that our suffering isn't meaningless. (I understand why many might say its cope)

Of coarse there are many philosophical theodicys against the problem of evil, but I'm going to assume you have already seen those, and are just not convinced.

 

[ltn gooner]

so there is 0% chance that ur religion is wrong? and 0% chance that any other is right? isn't it just very fortunate for u that u where born right geographically to have a 100%success

do you really wanna get into how logical christianity

It's like a pretty low chance that you can't go to church anywhere in your region and if you can't reject Christ you can still go to haven. And why would christianity not be logical ?

 

[exkira]

Orthodox Church is definitely the closest to early Christianity no question. I know that the Catholic Church for example doesn't have the Gospel of Thomas as canon. I don't know if it's canon in Orthodox. Its one of the things I questioned the Catholic Church on.

its not Canon in the Orthodox church either.

 

[Gamerspyy786]

Statistically, Christians who become muslims end up reverting to Christianity or becoming athiest within a couple years.

Show me the stat

 

[Gamerspyy786]

Isn't it crazy that U yes U were born into/chose the right religion and that other guy is clearly an idiot

Im not calling anyone an idiot

I’m just saying that Islam is the most logical and structured religion out of any religion there is. I believe in God, I believe he sent prophets, the bible has been corrupted so that’s a no go, I can’t be Jewish because they believe in racial supremacy which doesn’t align with what I believe God intended, the only logical conclusion is Islam.

Out of the “thousands” of religions although saying thousands is mostly cope since religions are being created each and everyday with no proofs that the scripture was from God

 

[owlofathena]

its not Canon in the Orthodox church either.

It probably is not Canon because it does not mention or describe Jesus life in detail. I think it has sayings of Jesus in it. The Quran has sayings of Jesus for example but the quran completely rejects the Resurrection of Jesus Christ which is the core belief in Jesus Christ. I find it crazy to believe that Muslims would trust the Quran a book written 600 years after Christ died on the life of Jesus.

 

[william.]

Its a compelling argument, and looking around at the worlds evils always shakes peoples faith.

for good reason

In Christianity God is the ground of being itself, sustaining creation and human freedom at every moment. If God were to remove every instance of grave evil by direct intervention, that would also mean removing the conditions that make genuine moral freedom possible.

• If God knows with certainty what you will choose, then you cannot choose otherwise
• If you cannot choose otherwise, free will isn’t real (you’re following a fixed outcome)
• Saying “you choose willingly” doesn’t help — willing ≠ free
• God’s infallible knowledge locks the future
• A locked future means no real alternatives
• No real alternatives = no genuine free will

this is something I haven't concluded on myself, but I think the fact his all-knowing creates this chain which makes free will Ingenuine

Many Christians have this lovey dovey notion of what God is, and what Christianity is (often influenced by American protestantism) which gets conflated with materialism and "Americanism" where the goal of Christianity is to live a good life, with kids and a wife etc.

sure, to me that seems like a control mechanism made to keep people working for the rich

But this isn't Christianity, Christianity demands union with God through suffering, and cultivating virtue despite a world that wants to drag us down. Obviously evil is bad, but there is something so compelling and beautiful about this life when we understand that our suffering isn't meaningless. (I understand why many might say its cope)

The suffering literally is meaningless tho, he could just put us in heaven right away. I know this goes against "free will", but the same goes for being born in the first place. And the fact that he has provided this little evidence and still expect people to follow is absurd, juts as absurd as infinite suffering for being wrong or unable to belive

Of coarse there are many philosophical theodicys against the problem of evil, but I'm going to assume you have already seen those, and are just not convinced.

yes

 

[Gamerspyy786]

Islam is the most retarded of all religions.

Atheism is way more legitimate than Islam because there’s no way a God (if he was real) would make some pedophile mass-murdering, slave owing, child rapist his perfect moral example to follow.


View attachment 4425048

Jfl using edited pictures to make a point

The topic of evil is something many atheist struggle with. From the Islamic perspective this life is a test and God has given us free will to do right / wrong. For a test to be in place there has to be options for you to chose otherwise it wouldn’t be a test.

Everybody will reap what they sow either in this life or on the day of judgement. So these so called evil “pedophiles” etc will see to what they did in this life some day or another, unless they sincerely repent and believe in Allah.

Still, somebody who harms another could take the other persons good deeds on the day of judgement. Evil does not go uncounted for, same with good. Even doing something as little as giving half a date in charity will go a long way.

Sahih al-Bukhari 1417, 6023, states: "Protect yourselves from the Hellfire, even if by giving half a date in charity, and if you cannot find that, then with a kind word,"

Anyways if you wanna just keep insulting Islam i don’t wanna talk to u. Just refuting what u said because you clearly were unaware but I don’t blame you, because we all learn at different paces

 

[william.]

It's like a pretty low chance that you can't go to church anywhere in your region and if you can't reject Christ you can still go to haven. And why would christianity not be logical ?

u seem pretty young or perhaps a female(same thing in a debate basically), id rather not waste my time. How old are u?

Show me the stat

thats pretty well-known

Im not calling anyone an idiot

sure

I’m just saying that Islam is the most logical and structured religion out of any religion there is. I believe in God, I believe he sent prophets, the bible has been corrupted so that’s a no go, I can’t be Jewish because they believe in racial supremacy which doesn’t align with what I believe God intended, the only logical conclusion is Islam.

can u answer the original question of the thread

 

[owlofathena]

bro is there any possibility that you belive in the wrong religion

My religion is not wrong. I believe in the lord Jesus Christ. Could the interpretation of said religion be wrong, yes absolutely. Catholicism and Orthodox are the basis of early Christianity. Islam is a heresy on its interpretation of Christ. If you use common sense its pretty clear why.

 

[william.]

Jfl using edited pictures to make a point

lol

The topic of evil is something many atheist struggle with. From the Islamic perspective this life is a test and God has given us free will to do right / wrong. For a test to be in place there has to be options for you to chose otherwise it wouldn’t be a test.

its pretty similar to christianity from an atheist perspective

Everybody will reap what they sow either in this life or on the day of judgement. So these so called evil “pedophiles” etc will see to what they did in this life some day or another, unless they sincerely repent and believe in Allah.

I know

Still, somebody who harms another could take the other persons good deeds on the day of judgement. Evil does not go uncounted for, same with good. Even doing something as little as giving half a date in charity will go a long way.

more logical the christianity in that regard

I know you replied to that other guy but yeah yeah

My religion is not wrong. I believe in the lord Jesus Christ. Could the interpretation of said religion be wrong, yes absolutely. Catholicism and Orthodox are the basis of early Christianity. Islam is a heresy on its interpretation of Christ. If you use common sense its pretty clear why.

stop dodging bro idc about islam btw

 

[Gamerspyy786]

thats pretty well-known

u can’t just say “statistically” and when I ask for the stat u don’t provide it

Tbf It was another guy who said it so I’ll wait

 

[nuisance]

The truth is the truth regardless of if you were born into it or not.

I was born a Muslim and I’m still Muslim.

If I was born Christian and I actually did research on God and the scriptures and the prophets I would come to the conclusion that Christianity is false and Islam is the truth.

Of course in rehtrospect things might not sound like it. So I suggest you look up Christians who became Muslims to see their side of their own story.

seems like you don't know anything about your own religion. I know a lot about both religions, and islam is alot less convincing. Not saying either is though, they are both just faith-based.

 

[ltn gooner]

u seem pretty young or perhaps a female(same thing in a debate basically), id rather not waste my time. How old are u?

Im 16, why tf wouldn't you wanna debate me ?

 

[looks>books]

do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? or are you just lucky enough to have been born into the right one whereas the other guy down the street was born into the wrong one? or may u be wrong and he right?

Ive looked at the evidence for others Christ is king

 

[nuisance]

do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? or are you just lucky enough to have been born into the right one whereas the other guy down the street was born into the wrong one? or may u be wrong and he right?

Yes, there is a possibility my religion is wrong and anyone else's, anyone who says otherwise is lying or delusional.

But technically its bad to think this way, if you're religious. I keep my opinions to myself when im with my peers.

 

[william.]

u can’t just say “statistically” and when I ask for the stat u don’t provide it

Tbf It was another guy who said it so I’ll wait

I agree with u, but its actually pretty well known

 

[Gamerspyy786]

can u answer the original question of the thread

I already answered it bro. I have no other way of putting it.

To say it again I’ll just say this.

The truth is the truth. Whether it’s 1+1=2 or the sky being blue.

Islam has to be true because by default every other religion has flaws and inconsistencies. Show me another religious scripture that has not been tampered with, that is above the linguistic eloquence of the time it was sent along with today’s time, and show me a man who claimed to be a prophet of God with as many prophecies coming true as the prophet Muhammad. You just wouldn’t be able to.

My basis belief even when I was kinda not serious about religion / looking into other religions was that I always believed in God, and knew I had a purpose. Islam just made more confident in my beliefs that this life is a test and that God is real

 

[william.]

Im 16, why tf wouldn't you wanna debate me ?

because u seem pretty immature, and Im starting to suspect that u are a female

and the last thing I want to do is talk to a female on looksmax.org

 

[Gamerspyy786]

seems like you don't know anything about your own religion. I know a lot about both religions, and islam is alot less convincing. Not saying either is though, they are both just faith-based.

Islam isn’t “faith” based only.

You’ll never hear a scholar say “just have faith” when you ask a question.

You’ll only ever hear that in churches or from other Christian’s

 

[Noesis]

Yes

 

[exkira]

If God knows with certainty what you will choose, then you cannot choose otherwise

Why? Why cant Gods plan include free will?

free will isn’t real (you’re following a fixed outcome)

God’s knowledge is like seeing your choice from outside time it doesn’t cause it. You still freely decide. the outcome is “fixed” only in God’s eternal vision, not in your lived experience.

Saying “you choose willingly” doesn’t help — willing ≠ free

God’s foreknowledge doesn’t take freedom away; you still freely will your actions, even if God already sees them. God doesn't
will your will, he willed your existence, and allows that will to be part of the plan of salvation, which he already foresees.

No real alternatives = no genuine free will

There are real alternatives from our perspective. Ultimately, you are trying to appeal to Gods state of knowledge, and using that to destroy our free will which is self evident. Its important to understand that many smart people debate over this stuff, but ultimately it is a mystery. We cannot fully grasp what it means for God to see our futures, so any inference that this ‘locks’ our choices misunderstands the depth of that divine mystery.

 

[william.]

I already answered it bro. I have no other way of putting it.

To say it again I’ll just say this.

The truth is the truth. Whether it’s 1+1=2 or the sky being blue.

its a yes or no question, u dont need to "put it"

Islam has to be true because by default every other religion has flaws and inconsistencies. Show me another religious scripture that has not been tampered with, that is above the linguistic eloquence of the time it was sent along with today’s time, and show me a man who claimed to be a prophet of God with as many prophecies coming true as the prophet Muhammad. You just wouldn’t be able to.

islam has tons of logical fallacies btw, and send me examples of prophecies coming true, they are mostly altered stories to fit the narrative

My basis belief even when I was kinda not serious about religion / looking into other religions was that I always believed in God, and knew I had a purpose. Islam just made more confident in my beliefs that this life is a test and that God is real

How can u just "know u have purpose" thats an assumption based on no logic

 

[william.]

Yes

religion? possibility % wise?

 

[Noesis]

religion? possibility % wise?

Islam , 2%

 

[nuisance]

Islam isn’t “faith” based only.

You’ll never hear a scholar say “just have faith” when you ask a question.

You’ll only ever hear that in churches or from other Christian’s

It's faith-based, you dont understand what that means

Allah didn't come down and reveal himself personally to you, you just believe he exists, that's faith based on a book and tradition. Same with Christianity.

So you can choose your opinion on it as I did with Christianity, but that doesn't change the fact you can be wrong, or I can be. There are holes in Christianity, as there is with islam. Me Personally I just see fewer holes and more benefits for society with Christianity.

We'll know when we close our eyes for the last time, or we'll just cease to exist.

 

[william.]

Why? Why cant Gods plan include free will?

God’s knowledge is like seeing your choice from outside time it doesn’t cause it. You still freely decide. the outcome is “fixed” only in God’s eternal vision, not in your lived experience.

God’s foreknowledge doesn’t take freedom away; you still freely will your actions, even if God already sees them. God doesn't
will your will, he willed your existence, and allows that will to be part of the plan of salvation, which he already foresees.

There are real alternatives from our perspective. Ultimately, you are trying to appeal to Gods state of knowledge, and using that to destroy our free will which is self evident. Its important to understand that many smart people debate over this stuff, but ultimately it is a mystery. We cannot fully grasp what it means for God to see our futures, so any inference that this ‘locks’ our choices misunderstands the depth of that divine mystery.

I said i haven't come to an conclusion about this, but I see.

 

[exkira]

Show me the stat

Confessions of an ex-Muslim

Over 100,000 people in Britain converted to Islam between 2001-2011, yet it is believed that up to 75 per cent may have since lost their faith. Who are they - and how do they feel about the way of life they embraced then quickly abandoned?

www.newstatesman.com

This isnt the best most reliable stat ngl, but peoples testimonials seem to match up.

 

[william.]

Confessions of an ex-Muslim

Over 100,000 people in Britain converted to Islam between 2001-2011, yet it is believed that up to 75 per cent may have since lost their faith. Who are they - and how do they feel about the way of life they embraced then quickly abandoned?

www.newstatesman.com

This isnt the best most reliable stat ngl, but peoples testimonials seem to match up.

about free will

if an alternative of a choice Im making tomorrow became impossible since the dawn of time how is that genuine free will

 

[iblamexyz]

do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? or are you just lucky enough to have been born into the right one whereas the other guy down the street was born into the wrong one? or may u be wrong and he right?

Never

 

[exkira]

yo I forgot to reply to the second part

The suffering literally is meaningless tho, he could just put us in heaven right away.

There are certain goods that cannot exist without certain evils (for example, courage cannot exist without danger), therefore some suffering is necessary for the realization of higher virtues and the formation of virtue. Assuming God is infinitely good then, it logically follows that evils and suffering must exist for the formation of these higher goods.

Why God willed this to be the way we find him? ultimately it is a mystery, in the same way that God chose to become man and suffer with us. I do not believe it is indefensible or logically contradictory, but I try not to pry my finite human mind too deeply into these divine mysteries.

 

[try2beme]

No
Im stubborn

 

[exkira]

about free will

if an alternative of a choice Im making tomorrow became impossible since the dawn of time how is that genuine free will

It wasnt "impossible since the dawn of time". It just isn't what you chose, and time isn't something God is constrained by in the same way our choices are.

 

[ConfusedBolivian]

do you see any possibility that your religion is wrong and another being right? or are you just lucky enough to have been born into the right one whereas the other guy down the street was born into the wrong one? or may u be wrong and he right?

It is about acknowledging the way God expressed himself with his creation, like the proverb says: God hides the knowledge and Kings find it

 

[ngannou]

Early Christianity believed in a real, institutional church. The Orthodox Church is that church.

Cope

 

[william.]

Never

high iq asf

No
Im stubborn

high iq asf

It is about acknowledging the way God expressed himself with his creation, like the proverb says: God hides the knowledge and Kings find it

can you answer the question

It wasnt "impossible since the dawn of time". It just isn't what you chose, and time isn't something God is constrained by in the same way our choices are.

sure , but is the free-will really genuine tho

yo I forgot to reply to the second part

There are certain goods that cannot exist without certain evils (for example, courage cannot exist without danger), therefore some suffering is necessary for the realization of higher virtues and the formation of virtue. Assuming God is infinitely good then, it logically follows that evils and suffering must exist for the formation of these higher goods.

he made that system, we dont need danger or courage, and there is no need to be in that system when we all could have been in heaven( following up to this)

Why God willed this to be the way we find him? ultimately it is a mystery, in the same way that God chose to become man and suffer with us. I do not believe it is indefensible or logically contradictory, but I try not to pry my finite human mind too deeply into these divine mysteries.

well I think it is logically contradictory, guess we are not coming further on that end

 

[ngannou]

I am certainly sure Jesus is the truth
first of all it is impossible for a mere human being to achieve hundred of prophecies in the old testament which was written hundred and thousands of years ago.
So I believe Jesus is the messiah, the Son of God, The God that came as flesh.

Second of all, the whole world are filled with satanic agenda,

the freemasons, poliitcians, medias, cartoons, the jews worship satan Everything in the world is filled with satanic symbols.

If the whole world is controlled by the satanists that means satan is real then if satan is real Jesus Christ is the truth inevitably.

Look at bradd pitt explicity says he tried satanism and it worked seriously.