Surgeon Celal Candirli

[Snicket]

Giant for sure it's not a meme and he is the best of the best. I know him for years and he evolved drastically, knowledge wise.

Would you trust him and Celal with OBO and high level osteotomies?

 

[lurking truecel]

Giant for sure it's not a meme and he is the best of the best. I know him for years and he evolved drastically, knowledge wise. NO ONE can get on this level currently.

What surgery did you do ?

 

[RazerGlazer]

Would you trust him and Celal with OBO and high level osteotomies?

Yes, if Giant is there. Surgeons are kinda clueless without him.

Let's put it this way, Celal with Giant = good results, Celal without Giant = just don't go to him.

 

[RazerGlazer]

What surgery did you do ?

infras and jaw. Infras designed with Giant himself. I see that people compare Giant and Pagnoni design. Giant is more on the bigger implants and Pagnoni is conservative which I don't like.

 

[mrriceguyreturn]

@Lefor3Laser @Acne Victim @mightbecooked123

You have been summoned. Will you answer the call?

1)He is extremely shit without Giant
2)He has a 50 upcoming patients that want Giant's designs, Giant makes like 10-15 designs in a year so you will be lucky to get your surgery in 3-5 years

 

[Snicket]

Yes, if Giant is there. Surgeons are kinda clueless without him.

Let's put it this way, Celal with Giant = good results, Celal without Giant = just don't go to him.

You were very angry yesterday and you’ve completely mellowed today.

Since you've been promised a free revision, are you worried about jeopardizing that?

 

[tren_31]

Does Pagnoni have a shady reputation? He seems to be universally liked on here.

No he has not, he just has many clients and is a bit out of order sometimes in his head.

 

[mrriceguyreturn]

feel free to share and youre welcome

Thx for sharing the truth about him, I once tried to become his patient but gave up after 5 month and I have a friend with similar story to you(implants raped his eyelids and Giant gaslighted him that it's his previous surgery and he went to Turkey for nothing even tho Giant said his revisions are ready as well)

 

[lurking truecel]

infras and jaw. Infras designed with Giant himself. I see that people compare Giant and Pagnoni design. Giant is more on the bigger implants and Pagnoni is conservative which I don't like.

Before
View attachment 3635285

View attachment 3635290

View attachment 3635292


AFTER:

View attachment 3635286
View attachment 3635296

View attachment 3635298

Good result, looks like supras aswell ?

 

[RazerGlazer]

Good result, looks like supras aswell ?

yup

 

[sham66]

infras and jaw. Infras designed with Giant himself. I see that people compare Giant and Pagnoni design. Giant is more on the bigger implants and Pagnoni is conservative which I don't like.

Before
View attachment 3635285

View attachment 3635290

View attachment 3635292


AFTER:

View attachment 3635286
View attachment 3635296

View attachment 3635298

And no, I am not squinting. Relax pose

holy, u got saved

 

[RazerGlazer]

holy, u got saved

yes, it removed my eyebags completely which was my biggest flaw.

 

[sham66]

yes, it removed my eyebags completely which was my biggest flaw.

iirc u went to pagnoni right?

 

[RazerGlazer]

You were very angry yesterday and you’ve completely mellowed today.

Since you've been promised a free revision, are you worried about jeopardizing that?

I don't care, I just expressed my opinion, all facts. Nothing is fabricated. Sometimes, we overdramatize and don't think clear because we let our emotions take over. I am going with another surgeon who is more specialized in soft tissue work.

 

[Snicket]

I don't care, I just expressed my opinion, all facts. Nothing is fabricated. Sometimes, we overdramatize and don't think clear because we let our emotions take over. I am going with another surgeon who is more specialized in soft tissue work.

Fair enough but you can understand why I would ask. It's a natural question.
Hope all goes as planned.

 

[pat]

Thx for sharing the truth about him, I once tried to become his patient but gave up after 5 month and I have a friend with similar story to you(implants raped his eyelids and Giant gaslighted him that it's his previous surgery and he went to Turkey for nothing even tho Giant said his revisions are ready as well)

thankyou and consider yourself lucky. i will not be silent anymore. i will be as vocal as i can for eternity now that i have nothing to lose. i never wanted this. he created this clusterfuck.

 

[Lefor3Laser]

1)He is extremely shit without Giant
2)He has a 50 upcoming patients that want Giant's designs, Giant makes like 10-15 designs in a year so you will be lucky to get your surgery in 3-5 years

Welcome back @mrriceguyreturn ,i missed you, even with giant you would still end up with botches, what i realized is that going conservative is what gives those good results, watched his pattern with Pagnoni, when he works with Pagnoni i'd guess he takes Pagnoni's opinion rather than his.

By the way, do you have SurgeryEnjoyer results since i remember talking with him and he showed them to me, if you mind sharing ofc haha.

 

[RealSurgerymax]

@RealSurgerymax

not true. he changed the narrative every 3 weeks and delayed the revision to the point of no return because he was too lazy to do my case and didnt want to fork out the money to pay for revision. ask dr celal how angry he is at liam for not completing my revision and stringing me along. not to mention the botched implants and surgical error. classic narcisist. the revision never happened and never was going to as they were never interested in it and wanted me to disapear.

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story… We’re doing the best we can… You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled​

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

 

[Mr.Proper]

Posting timestamped conversations would let to the audience to have a better judgement.
In tonight news, surgeon vs patient, who would win? Was there a botch? Who exarragated more and who can't back up their claims? Grab some popcorn and join the org drama show on LooksmaxTV!

 

[Snicket]

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

View attachment 3639330View attachment 3639331

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story…… We’re doing the best we can…. You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

Thank you for replying and providing your side of the story.

 

[Snicket]

Posting timestamped conversations would let to the audience to have a better judgement.
In tonight news, surgeon vs patient, who would win? Was there a botch? Who exarragated more and who can't back up their claims? Grab some popcorn and join the org drama show on LooksmaxTV!

I didn't realize I was opening a big can of worms like this!
However it's certainly useful for us to hear both perspectives and form our own judgement.

 

[Lawton88]

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

View attachment 3639330View attachment 3639331

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story…… We’re doing the best we can…. You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled​

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

That wraparound looks like it would give a freak appearance if that image is representative of it. I hope someone isn't crazy enough to think that won't look uncanny as hell.

 

[Snicket]

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

View attachment 3639330View attachment 3639331

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story…… We’re doing the best we can…. You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled​

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

@pat
Respond when convenient.

 

[esoterik]

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

View attachment 3639330View attachment 3639331

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story…… We’re doing the best we can…. You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled​

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

tbh its just 2 people going back and forth claiming what happened, if u just posted screenshots of dms u could have saved a few paragraphs and make the story set in stone

 

[Snicket]

tbh its just 2 people going back and forth claiming what happened, if u just posted screenshots of dms u could have saved a few paragraphs and make the story set in stone

Yes, most of it is heresay but that's probably the best we're going to get.
It's still informative in its own right.

 

[esoterik]

Yes, most of it is heresay but that's probably the best we're going to get.
It's still informative in its own right.

mhm, although, it seems like rsm's version makes more sense, that + being able to admit fuck ups & how things like the missed surgery day line up is to pat is what makes rsm more believable

 

[Snicket]

mhm, although, it seems like rsm's version makes more sense, that + being able to admit fuck ups & how things like the missed surgery day line up is to pat is what makes rsm more believable

I have my own views but since this is my thread, I think it's moral for me to be a quiet intermediary.
As I said, it certainly gives us some insight into what may have happened.

 

[pat]

You left out some details that change the context a lot:

#1 – The main thing that matters: Your tissue quality due to previous infections​

First off, I explained to you numerous times that because you had a previous implant infection with prior surgeon you are high risk and the medical guidelines recommend a minimum of at least 12-18 months for replacement.

The standard replacement guidelines are 3-6 months after implant infection but with 2x implant infections 12-18. Look it up.

Every time I brought up the idea of waiting at least a year your reaction was so bad that I would say “maybe” and “we’ll see” if we can do it earlier but I always emphasized “that’s really pushing it.” I just wanted to get you through to the right time. Yes I was stalling you a little but every time I tried to tell you you’re not ready you just couldn’t take it. And I tried approaching the subject multiple times.

You had an area of skin so thin you could almost see through it, an area you had previously operated about 5 times. You thought we should operate ASAP but it’s the opposite. Against your demands, Dr Celal left it alone to heal and sure enough the skin quality has improved substantially over a year to the point it can withstand one more salvage operation. If we did surgery right when you demanded it that would have been the end of your jaw. That skin was on its last legs and you want us to put new implant that’s EVEN BIGGER. That would have busted open and exposed.



I really don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that but whenever I explained it you would accuse me of “gaslighting” and “changing the narrative.” I gave you all the logical reasons why and you rejected them all.

Now I admit that at first I was hoping we could do implant swap using the standard 3-6 months guidelines and that’s initially what I said but later I informed you that Dr Celal decided it wasn’t a good idea and he is absolutely right. For the reasons mentioned above.

#2 You were not left high and dry​

Your medical complications (infection) are completely resolved and we told you to come back for the immediate washout and implant removal surgery but you had it handled by your local hospital which is fine too.

For the secondary corrections you had to wait for the tissue quality to improve the medical reasons as mentioned above.

• You had a free revision surgery offered by Dr Celal and when our assistant doctor told you it would have a cost I stepped in to help you and made sure you wont have a cost.
• I offered you free implants replacement AND additional skull implants you wanted as a gift for what you’ve been through

I showed you the new implant design and had it ready since October or November. That’s not the issue. You are just not physically ready for surgery. There’s no way for me to help that. If I never planned on helping with your revision I wouldn’t have bothered:

View attachment 3639330View attachment 3639331

Our assistant doctor is supposed to be handling all the communication anyway but I even gave you my personal WhatsApp number and we have exchanged maybe 1000+ messages over the last year and response time is usually no more than a few days for you. I only ever stopped responding when you threatened me or told me to F off and you'd come back later shocked that I actually did.

You called the surgery off multiple times that I can remember:

• You would tell me to forget it and F off, block me on Instagram, and then come back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you would use a surgeon in (your home country) then came back surprised we weren’t expecting you.
• Then you told me you will just use a different designer and Celal will do it and then come back surprised I wasn’t expecting you.
• Most recently (about a week ago) I told you that I will get back to you after the weekend so you told me to just forget it because you’re full steam ahead on writing bad reviews. Then you texted me later that week shocked I never responded.

I see now all these were just threats in an attempt to get surgery sooner, just like everything else including the legal threats and bad reviews, but that's not helpful and has only made everything worse for us but especially you.

#3 The missed surgery day​

I told our asst doctor I won’t be back in Dec and to reschedule the surgeries. He rescheduled most of them but forgot to reschedule 2 of them. Yours and one other. Yep, huge fuckup.

When you texted me you’re in Istanbul I thought you were just rubbing in my face that you are going ahead with surgery anyway against all my advice with their other designer you told/threatened me about. That’s why I just answered “How’s that?”

Once you clarified what happened I really couldn’t believe it and I told you I’m sorry and will pay for your next flight back but that surgery needs to be at least 1yr after the infection.

#4 The aesthetic outcome: You are an extreme case​

• You admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.
• You had and have extremely unnatural implants. Plain and simple. You are not a normal case and your implants stick out like a sore thumb among all my other cases and for the next ones you want to go larger. Its cool, its interesting, but its high risk.

You don’t have natural aesthetic at all you have some surgeries that are borderline body modifications like the whole elf ears thing and the tattooed eyes, not to mention all the previous implants you came with already. I’m not saying this in a disrespectful way at all or even saying it looks bad but it's not natural and you know that. I’m saying this to point out you’re a big risk taker, and to come here as a quarternary or maybe quinary revision case (4x or 5x revision) and try to fear monger the average looksmax patient getting a more natural surgery or safe size implants will deal with these complications is misleading.

A normal patient getting an infection would have replacement in 3-6 months (its already happened, and we fixed it already) but someone who’s had 20 plastic surgeries, some of them complicated, is a different story… We’re doing the best we can… You don’t seem to understand the more surgeries & previous complications you had, the more risk and more careful we have to be.

And even with all that, I didn’t get defensive or make excuses or blame you in followup when you told me you didn’t like the look of the cheekbones. I just said okay that’s fine I’ll make new ones for you, and I did.

#5 You wanted more surgery not just revision surgery​

You also came to me about skull implants and I was happy to help you with that and I wasn’t even gonna charge anything for all you been through. But my terms were: Surgery needs to be in at least one year after infection.

It’s one thing if you just came back for the revision because you felt there was no other option to get it fixed.

But if I am so bad, as you said have "Negative 0 clue what I'm doing" why would you get additional major surgeries with us and designed by me?

You even admitted there are parts of the result you like and consider improvements but they have been understandably overshadowed by medical complications.

You have seen multiple of my results and showed me the awful design proposals by other services. You know I'm good at this. I cant help the medical complications or your tissue quality.

#6 Getting cancelled​

The first night I got back to Istanbul (a week ago) Dr Celal, Dr Serdar, and I went to dinner to talk about upcoming cases and I even sent you a friendly pic of all of us around the table and invited you to have a zoom with us about your upcoming revision.

You tried to SUE dr celal for medical complications and gave me no more than a week of being back in Istanbul to write in intentionally bad as possible horror story leaving out KEY details.

Your own lawyer told you that you can’t talk to dr celal anymore.

How are we able to help you now????????

Physically your body needed to wait for surgery, but emotionally/psychologically I guess you just couldn’t hold on any longer. Tricky situation…

i dont even know why i am writing this because you can never win an argument against a narcisist. but i will continue and try answeriing what i can.


this is the longest answer you have given me in the last two years combined. congratulations i truly wish you were like this the last two years.
so let me get this straight. i consulted with you 2 years ago with my previous jaw implant, asked for custom implants all over, you ACCEPTED the case with No qualms, poorly designed my implants citing that they look great and will look much better, even measuring out my previous jaw implant ( which you had option to leave in there as i said i love that side happy to leave it in as per zoom call), and then proceed to blame ME for your fuckup saying that what i wanted AFTER the surgery is too risky. dude i already had what i wanted in that area and you got it wrong and blamed your software for getting the measurements wrong. gee i wish i could blame my computer for real human problems in life. all this drama going on was me giving you a second chance to fix what you took from me and now youre saying what i want back in is too risky when this could have been avoided in the first place. you are in damage control because you cant put back what you took out and now blaming me for being too extreme or troublesome. wow

i gave you all the time in the world but you stalled it over and over. people already know this. i was respectful and gave you all the time in the world. your very own business partners ie the surgeon and surgical assistant have all expresed their anger towards you and your constant delays citing and i quote " we are very very angry with him, i cant believe he is doing this". to the point they even offered their very own implant designer because of your incompetance. maybe next time youre at dinner eating fortune cookies the cookie may tell you to "wake up and smell the coffee" or "get to work" . stop blaming me (the patient) for things that are your job. i had a previous implant in. you told me " dont worry your new implant will be much better contour and exactly the same size dont worry" and they wernt. heck i was happy to leave them in and work around them. my cheeks were disprotionate and gigantic and you admitted they did not look good in real life. you had no issue putting gigantic unsafe poorly designed cheeks in and then have the audacity to tell me what i want in revision which is a smaller design too risky?? its only risky because you guys botched me two years ago surgically and now to open it all up again its proving risky. why am i being blamed for decisions that a provider has to make. im a patient asking for a service and if something cant be done the patient will then accept it. dont make out that i am some difficult client wanting the extrodinary. on the contrary in saying that you even cite on you "surgery cfm" page and i quote " from ordinary to rare as rare can be". *insert unicorn emoji*

that picture of the renders shows EXACTLY what i am talking about. the jaw implant looks odd and strange. because you have constantly showed me that angle and that angle only. i asked you a million times of the dimensions and other angles and a super-imposed picture of the implants old and new so i can compare and we can deliberate what will be best on me. i was not convinced the new jaw looks good because it looked bizaar and when i asked to see other angles and exact dimensions you would leave me on read, change the subject and not continue on with the conversation. do i need to share the screenshots of the countless times i have asked this of you?! you knew exactly what you were doing and knew by deflecting it would warrant you more time to avoid what needed to be done. my point is proven again once and for all.

i put my trust in you after all you are the "expert" ( or are you?). its not up to me to decide what a design should look like. i gave you a brief and you in return you give renders and then we go back and fourth and come up with a plan. the planning phase is all i asked for for a whole year and confirmation of everything so they can be sent off to the lab when the TIME is right and safe to do so i can schedule flights surgery finances. ( cant be done in one day). Stringing me along making excuses, changing the narrative to make you look better everyday, months is not going to work.

when the emergancy room looked at me i was absolute mess, your implants were so bad i was forced to wear a mask months after the surgery and the whole time they were in. my face was destroyed from them having to remove these awful implants. my left eye was scarred and pulled down from the hideous infection that was out of ny control ( thats a whole new thread), my mid face sagged like a old man and i suffered and i never felt so ugly in my life. i couldnt just fly back 25 hours and pay more money can i. all while dr kept telling me to keep taking anti infamatorys everything is ok. yeah right!...

i even consulted with a occuloplastic surgeon soon after in turkey via zoom and they were basically like " what the hell did they do to you?" .

after the surgery in turkey i was left in bed post op for 3 days blind with no vision and not a single nurse dr or you thought to disinfect my mouth and you wonder why i had a infection which came back as ecoli YUCK. not to mention the same side being misplaced even though you bragged my implants were perfectly placed when you took a selfie in the OR with my head cut open. you apologised for that months later and said " next surgery i will wash your mouth out myself" . all you had to do was commit to your end of the deal and give me some HOPE after feeling so ugly and forgotten about. i lost trust in you after this but because i invested so much money into this i had to stick with you to fix it. after my explant you turned cold on me and didnt care at all. i dont even use these kind of forums but i had to be honest about my experiance. at the end of the day patients dont want to be spending thousands and being left high and dry.

in regards to communication. the whole time felt like i was walking on eggshells. dare i say something to upset you because you would easily cancel me. and the times i did you were punish me and threaten me. so at times i was forced against my will to be nice when deep down i was so angry at how you handle things. not to mention how i had to resend the same msg a million times so i could be bumped up" to get your attention..

you messeged me two weeks ago and coincedently i was in istanbul for 48 hours. you offered to meet me on zoom ( didnt happen) and then i suggested you uber 5 minutes to come see me at the lobby of my hotel and cancelled on me. and then we changed it to the next morning you said yes. and then surprise surprise you woke up sick. dont try and tell ppl i am difficult when you confirm all these things. even after that i said " i am free all day how about we zoom?" again you left me on read and stopped replying FFS.

showing a picture of rodrigo alvez is rather insulting because we are not alike.. infact now that we are on that lets talk about prior to my surgery i had one very major request and that was request was me showing you a picture of another human ken doll justin jedlica and i quote. " PLEASE DONT MAKE MY CHEEKS LOOK LIKE THIS" you replied " dont worry we actually get taught on what NOT to do and this is one of them". and voila i looked exactly like that. and then you proceed to blame me and say " well you wanted them BOLD". Bold does not mean ugly. you feminised my face, gave me apple cheek and pushed my infraorbitals so far up my eye that i looked chinese, gained 50 pounds and constantly looked like i had alergic reaction. thats like going to a hairstylist, telling them what you want and the stylist making the client mix up the colour.
no -the patient/client pays for a service and its up to you to bring it to life.

you were being told by others to finish my case and that i am ready and to stop dragging this along and you never listened. you totally let your god complex take over. you always do. the notion that i had to wait 12-18 months may be true but you are only saying that now because you dragged this clusterfuck on for 12- 18 months and now youre trying to make yourself look better because you still havnt produced anything from my case and this narrative is proving very convenient for you..


people dont take lawsuits lightly. i was driven to do this because i had no option and i have to fight for what is right. blaming my lawsuit is a poor effort at deflecting considering all your promises and deadlines were BEFORE it. i filed this lawsuit after you stood me up in istanbul,strung me along for over 12 months with no detail or commitment to my case ( everyone knows how bad you are at communicating) while you were partying away in thailand towards the end of the year while i was on a airplane,( not to mention those holidays to japan and egypt while you were supposed to work on my case). and because of surgical errors that ofcourse some are out of your control because youre not a dr right? this whole thing was never going to happen and you were never interested. dont try and make out that you were ever going to pay for this revision and get it done. just dont. that ship has sailed. and i am glad because it would be dangerous for me to trust you, the dr and hospital again. again this is my opinion.
i gave you a chance to do these implants so i could potentially go elsewhere to a reputable dr who will look after me. that ship has clearly also sailed.

you.not taking accountability is exactly what the silent minority are going through. and i have people inboxing me who are scared to talk. i have nothing to lose anymore so i will advocate for whoever wants to listen. people certainly have a choice and the choice is ultimately theirs. i can only speak of my experiance.

yes i did ask you to create a skull implant for me to compensate for the fuck up of my original surgery and you accepted and had no issues with it. (and i appreciate that. ) you even showed me other cases you have done similar to mine.. " all will be fine, thats no problem at alll"

your views and the surgeon ( an actual surgeon) are constantly opposing and that is your problem not mine. you are not even a surgeon. ffs i had to hear it from someone else that you are still studying wtf. i am being too nice, giving something the benefit of the doubt a million times over when it was never going to happen. like i said. the writing was on the walls. i should have taken this as a red flag from the very beginning. i was dealing with a child on a computer who is only probably 27 and still studying who will never accept or hold any accountability.
when one pays so much money to a provider they are forced to stay with them because of the thousands spent.

ive even consulted with other drs and they have all confirmed that " he just takes it too far" and they will not do that on me. turning your faults onto patients is a red flag. not to mention that time you threatened to sue ME because we were wayy past the deadline you gave me all because i was repeatedly asking for my design. never in my life i have dealt with a person with such a short unhinged fuse.

are we going to talk about the fact that two weeks ago you posted on your stories of a image with someones facial implants and saying " this case was cancelled because the patient was sending sassy emails. dont do that". wow i feel sorry for that patient. let this be stern warning of how unhinged this so called provider is. imagine getting so far and getting cancelled on because how dare you question the greatest implant designer of all time. ive seen this all before, this sounds alot like " youre fired"....





good luck everyone. you will need it..

im out

 

[iseeblue9]

i dont even know why i am writing this because you can never win an argument against a narcisist. but i will continue and try answeriing what i can.


this is the longest answer you have given me in the last two years combined. congratulations i truly wish you were like this the last two years.
so let me get this straight. i consulted with you 2 years ago with my previous jaw implant, asked for custom implants all over, you ACCEPTED the case with No qualms, poorly designed my implants citing that they look great and will look much better, even measuring out my previous jaw implant ( which you had option to leave in there as i said i love that side happy to leave it in as per zoom call), and then proceed to blame ME for your fuckup saying that what i wanted AFTER the surgery is too risky. dude i already had what i wanted in that area and you got it wrong and blamed your software for getting the measurements wrong. gee i wish i could blame my computer for real human problems in life. all this drama going on was me giving you a second chance to fix what you took from me and now youre saying what i want back in is too risky when this could have been avoided in the first place. you are in damage control because you cant put back what you took out and now blaming me for being too extreme or troublesome. wow

i gave you all the time in the world but you stalled it over and over. people already know this. i was respectful and gave you all the time in the world. your very own business partners ie the surgeon and surgical assistant have all expresed their anger towards you and your constant delays citing and i quote " we are very very angry with him, i cant believe he is doing this". to the point they even offered their very own implant designer because of your incompetance. maybe next time youre at dinner eating fortune cookies the cookie may tell you to "wake up and smell the coffee" or "get to work" . stop blaming me (the patient) for things that are your job. i had a previous implant in. you told me " dont worry your new implant will be much better contour and exactly the same size dont worry" and they wernt. heck i was happy to leave them in and work around them. my cheeks were disprotionate and gigantic and you admitted they did not look good in real life. you had no issue putting gigantic unsafe poorly designed cheeks in and then have the audacity to tell me what i want in revision which is a smaller design too risky?? its only risky because you guys botched me two years ago surgically and now to open it all up again its proving risky. why am i being blamed for decisions that a provider has to make. im a patient asking for a service and if something cant be done the patient will then accept it. dont make out that i am some difficult client wanting the extrodinary. on the contrary in saying that you even cite on you "surgery cfm" page and i quote " from ordinary to rare as rare can be". *insert unicorn emoji*

that picture of the renders shows EXACTLY what i am talking about. the jaw implant looks odd and strange. because you have constantly showed me that angle and that angle only. i asked you a million times of the dimensions and other angles and a super-imposed picture of the implants old and new so i can compare and we can deliberate what will be best on me. i was not convinced the new jaw looks good because it looked bizaar and when i asked to see other angles and exact dimensions you would leave me on read, change the subject and not continue on with the conversation. do i need to share the screenshots of the countless times i have asked this of you?! you knew exactly what you were doing and knew by deflecting it would warrant you more time to avoid what needed to be done. my point is proven again once and for all.

i put my trust in you after all you are the "expert" ( or are you?). its not up to me to decide what a design should look like. i gave you a brief and you in return you give renders and then we go back and fourth and come up with a plan. the planning phase is all i asked for for a whole year and confirmation of everything so they can be sent off to the lab when the TIME is right and safe to do so i can schedule flights surgery finances. ( cant be done in one day). Stringing me along making excuses, changing the narrative to make you look better everyday, months is not going to work.

when the emergancy room looked at me i was absolute mess, your implants were so bad i was forced to wear a mask months after the surgery and the whole time they were in. my face was destroyed from them having to remove these awful implants. my left eye was scarred and pulled down from the hideous infection that was out of ny control ( thats a whole new thread), my mid face sagged like a old man and i suffered and i never felt so ugly in my life. i couldnt just fly back 25 hours and pay more money can i. all while dr kept telling me to keep taking anti infamatorys everything is ok. yeah right!...

i even consulted with a occuloplastic surgeon soon after in turkey via zoom and they were basically like " what the hell did they do to you?" .

after the surgery in turkey i was left in bed post op for 3 days blind with no vision and not a single nurse dr or you thought to disinfect my mouth and you wonder why i had a infection which came back as ecoli YUCK. not to mention the same side being misplaced even though you bragged my implants were perfectly placed when you took a selfie in the OR with my head cut open. you apologised for that months later and said " next surgery i will wash your mouth out myself" . all you had to do was commit to your end of the deal and give me some HOPE after feeling so ugly and forgotten about. i lost trust in you after this but because i invested so much money into this i had to stick with you to fix it. after my explant you turned cold on me and didnt care at all. i dont even use these kind of forums but i had to be honest about my experiance. at the end of the day patients dont want to be spending thousands and being left high and dry.

in regards to communication. the whole time felt like i was walking on eggshells. dare i say something to upset you because you would easily cancel me. and the times i did you were punish me and threaten me. so at times i was forced against my will to be nice when deep down i was so angry at how you handle things. not to mention how i had to resend the same msg a million times so i could be bumped up" to get your attention..

you messeged me two weeks ago and coincedently i was in istanbul for 48 hours. you offered to meet me on zoom ( didnt happen) and then i suggested you uber 5 minutes to come see me at the lobby of my hotel and cancelled on me. and then we changed it to the next morning you said yes. and then surprise surprise you woke up sick. dont try and tell ppl i am difficult when you confirm all these things. even after that i said " i am free all day how about we zoom?" again you left me on read and stopped replying FFS.

showing a picture of rodrigo alvez is rather insulting because we are not alike.. infact now that we are on that lets talk about prior to my surgery i had one very major request and that was request was me showing you a picture of another human ken doll justin jedlica and i quote. " PLEASE DONT MAKE MY CHEEKS LOOK LIKE THIS" you replied " dont worry we actually get taught on what NOT to do and this is one of them". and voila i looked exactly like that. and then you proceed to blame me and say " well you wanted them BOLD". Bold does not mean ugly. you feminised my face, gave me apple cheek and pushed my infraorbitals so far up my eye that i looked chinese, gained 50 pounds and constantly looked like i had alergic reaction. thats like going to a hairstylist, telling them what you want and the stylist making the client mix up the colour.
no -the patient/client pays for a service and its up to you to bring it to life.

you were being told by others to finish my case and that i am ready and to stop dragging this along and you never listened. you totally let your god complex take over. you always do. the notion that i had to wait 12-18 months may be true but you are only saying that now because you dragged this clusterfuck on for 12- 18 months and now youre trying to make yourself look better because you still havnt produced anything from my case and this narrative is proving very convenient for you..


people dont take lawsuits lightly. i was driven to do this because i had no option and i have to fight for what is right. blaming my lawsuit is a poor effort at deflecting considering all your promises and deadlines were BEFORE it. i filed this lawsuit after you stood me up in istanbul,strung me along for over 12 months with no detail or commitment to my case ( everyone knows how bad you are at communicating) while you were partying away in thailand towards the end of the year while i was on a airplane,( not to mention those holidays to japan and egypt while you were supposed to work on my case). and because of surgical errors that ofcourse some are out of your control because youre not a dr right? this whole thing was never going to happen and you were never interested. dont try and make out that you were ever going to pay for this revision and get it done. just dont. that ship has sailed. and i am glad because it would be dangerous for me to trust you, the dr and hospital again. again this is my opinion.
i gave you a chance to do these implants so i could potentially go elsewhere to a reputable dr who will look after me. that ship has clearly also sailed.

you.not taking accountability is exactly what the silent minority are going through. and i have people inboxing me who are scared to talk. i have nothing to lose anymore so i will advocate for whoever wants to listen. people certainly have a choice and the choice is ultimately theirs. i can only speak of my experiance.

yes i did ask you to create a skull implant for me to compensate for the fuck up of my original surgery and you accepted and had no issues with it. (and i appreciate that. ) you even showed me other cases you have done similar to mine.. " all will be fine, thats no problem at alll"

your views and the surgeon ( an actual surgeon) are constantly opposing and that is your problem not mine. you are not even a surgeon. ffs i had to hear it from someone else that you are still studying wtf. i am being too nice, giving something the benefit of the doubt a million times over when it was never going to happen. like i said. the writing was on the walls. i should have taken this as a red flag from the very beginning. i was dealing with a child on a computer who is only probably 27 and still studying who will never accept or hold any accountability.
when one pays so much money to a provider they are forced to stay with them because of the thousands spent.

ive even consulted with other drs and they have all confirmed that " he just takes it too far" and they will not do that on me. turning your faults onto patients is a red flag. not to mention that time you threatened to sue ME because we were wayy past the deadline you gave me all because i was repeatedly asking for my design. never in my life i have dealt with a person with such a short unhinged fuse.

are we going to talk about the fact that two weeks ago you posted on your stories of a image with someones facial implants and saying " this case was cancelled because the patient was sending sassy emails. dont do that". wow i feel sorry for that patient. let this be stern warning of how unhinged this so called provider is. imagine getting so far and getting cancelled on because how dare you question the greatest implant designer of all time. ive seen this all before, this sounds alot like " youre fired"....





good luck everyone. you will need it..

im out

@RealSurgerymax gotta respond to this one

 

[Radiantmetal]

i dont even know why i am writing this because you can never win an argument against a narcisist. but i will continue and try answeriing what i can.


this is the longest answer you have given me in the last two years combined. congratulations i truly wish you were like this the last two years.
so let me get this straight. i consulted with you 2 years ago with my previous jaw implant, asked for custom implants all over, you ACCEPTED the case with No qualms, poorly designed my implants citing that they look great and will look much better, even measuring out my previous jaw implant ( which you had option to leave in there as i said i love that side happy to leave it in as per zoom call), and then proceed to blame ME for your fuckup saying that what i wanted AFTER the surgery is too risky. dude i already had what i wanted in that area and you got it wrong and blamed your software for getting the measurements wrong. gee i wish i could blame my computer for real human problems in life. all this drama going on was me giving you a second chance to fix what you took from me and now youre saying what i want back in is too risky when this could have been avoided in the first place. you are in damage control because you cant put back what you took out and now blaming me for being too extreme or troublesome. wow

i gave you all the time in the world but you stalled it over and over. people already know this. i was respectful and gave you all the time in the world. your very own business partners ie the surgeon and surgical assistant have all expresed their anger towards you and your constant delays citing and i quote " we are very very angry with him, i cant believe he is doing this". to the point they even offered their very own implant designer because of your incompetance. maybe next time youre at dinner eating fortune cookies the cookie may tell you to "wake up and smell the coffee" or "get to work" . stop blaming me (the patient) for things that are your job. i had a previous implant in. you told me " dont worry your new implant will be much better contour and exactly the same size dont worry" and they wernt. heck i was happy to leave them in and work around them. my cheeks were disprotionate and gigantic and you admitted they did not look good in real life. you had no issue putting gigantic unsafe poorly designed cheeks in and then have the audacity to tell me what i want in revision which is a smaller design too risky?? its only risky because you guys botched me two years ago surgically and now to open it all up again its proving risky. why am i being blamed for decisions that a provider has to make. im a patient asking for a service and if something cant be done the patient will then accept it. dont make out that i am some difficult client wanting the extrodinary. on the contrary in saying that you even cite on you "surgery cfm" page and i quote " from ordinary to rare as rare can be". *insert unicorn emoji*

that picture of the renders shows EXACTLY what i am talking about. the jaw implant looks odd and strange. because you have constantly showed me that angle and that angle only. i asked you a million times of the dimensions and other angles and a super-imposed picture of the implants old and new so i can compare and we can deliberate what will be best on me. i was not convinced the new jaw looks good because it looked bizaar and when i asked to see other angles and exact dimensions you would leave me on read, change the subject and not continue on with the conversation. do i need to share the screenshots of the countless times i have asked this of you?! you knew exactly what you were doing and knew by deflecting it would warrant you more time to avoid what needed to be done. my point is proven again once and for all.

i put my trust in you after all you are the "expert" ( or are you?). its not up to me to decide what a design should look like. i gave you a brief and you in return you give renders and then we go back and fourth and come up with a plan. the planning phase is all i asked for for a whole year and confirmation of everything so they can be sent off to the lab when the TIME is right and safe to do so i can schedule flights surgery finances. ( cant be done in one day). Stringing me along making excuses, changing the narrative to make you look better everyday, months is not going to work.

when the emergancy room looked at me i was absolute mess, your implants were so bad i was forced to wear a mask months after the surgery and the whole time they were in. my face was destroyed from them having to remove these awful implants. my left eye was scarred and pulled down from the hideous infection that was out of ny control ( thats a whole new thread), my mid face sagged like a old man and i suffered and i never felt so ugly in my life. i couldnt just fly back 25 hours and pay more money can i. all while dr kept telling me to keep taking anti infamatorys everything is ok. yeah right!...

i even consulted with a occuloplastic surgeon soon after in turkey via zoom and they were basically like " what the hell did they do to you?" .

after the surgery in turkey i was left in bed post op for 3 days blind with no vision and not a single nurse dr or you thought to disinfect my mouth and you wonder why i had a infection which came back as ecoli YUCK. not to mention the same side being misplaced even though you bragged my implants were perfectly placed when you took a selfie in the OR with my head cut open. you apologised for that months later and said " next surgery i will wash your mouth out myself" . all you had to do was commit to your end of the deal and give me some HOPE after feeling so ugly and forgotten about. i lost trust in you after this but because i invested so much money into this i had to stick with you to fix it. after my explant you turned cold on me and didnt care at all. i dont even use these kind of forums but i had to be honest about my experiance. at the end of the day patients dont want to be spending thousands and being left high and dry.

in regards to communication. the whole time felt like i was walking on eggshells. dare i say something to upset you because you would easily cancel me. and the times i did you were punish me and threaten me. so at times i was forced against my will to be nice when deep down i was so angry at how you handle things. not to mention how i had to resend the same msg a million times so i could be bumped up" to get your attention..

you messeged me two weeks ago and coincedently i was in istanbul for 48 hours. you offered to meet me on zoom ( didnt happen) and then i suggested you uber 5 minutes to come see me at the lobby of my hotel and cancelled on me. and then we changed it to the next morning you said yes. and then surprise surprise you woke up sick. dont try and tell ppl i am difficult when you confirm all these things. even after that i said " i am free all day how about we zoom?" again you left me on read and stopped replying FFS.

showing a picture of rodrigo alvez is rather insulting because we are not alike.. infact now that we are on that lets talk about prior to my surgery i had one very major request and that was request was me showing you a picture of another human ken doll justin jedlica and i quote. " PLEASE DONT MAKE MY CHEEKS LOOK LIKE THIS" you replied " dont worry we actually get taught on what NOT to do and this is one of them". and voila i looked exactly like that. and then you proceed to blame me and say " well you wanted them BOLD". Bold does not mean ugly. you feminised my face, gave me apple cheek and pushed my infraorbitals so far up my eye that i looked chinese, gained 50 pounds and constantly looked like i had alergic reaction. thats like going to a hairstylist, telling them what you want and the stylist making the client mix up the colour.
no -the patient/client pays for a service and its up to you to bring it to life.

you were being told by others to finish my case and that i am ready and to stop dragging this along and you never listened. you totally let your god complex take over. you always do. the notion that i had to wait 12-18 months may be true but you are only saying that now because you dragged this clusterfuck on for 12- 18 months and now youre trying to make yourself look better because you still havnt produced anything from my case and this narrative is proving very convenient for you..


people dont take lawsuits lightly. i was driven to do this because i had no option and i have to fight for what is right. blaming my lawsuit is a poor effort at deflecting considering all your promises and deadlines were BEFORE it. i filed this lawsuit after you stood me up in istanbul,strung me along for over 12 months with no detail or commitment to my case ( everyone knows how bad you are at communicating) while you were partying away in thailand towards the end of the year while i was on a airplane,( not to mention those holidays to japan and egypt while you were supposed to work on my case). and because of surgical errors that ofcourse some are out of your control because youre not a dr right? this whole thing was never going to happen and you were never interested. dont try and make out that you were ever going to pay for this revision and get it done. just dont. that ship has sailed. and i am glad because it would be dangerous for me to trust you, the dr and hospital again. again this is my opinion.
i gave you a chance to do these implants so i could potentially go elsewhere to a reputable dr who will look after me. that ship has clearly also sailed.

you.not taking accountability is exactly what the silent minority are going through. and i have people inboxing me who are scared to talk. i have nothing to lose anymore so i will advocate for whoever wants to listen. people certainly have a choice and the choice is ultimately theirs. i can only speak of my experiance.

yes i did ask you to create a skull implant for me to compensate for the fuck up of my original surgery and you accepted and had no issues with it. (and i appreciate that. ) you even showed me other cases you have done similar to mine.. " all will be fine, thats no problem at alll"

your views and the surgeon ( an actual surgeon) are constantly opposing and that is your problem not mine. you are not even a surgeon. ffs i had to hear it from someone else that you are still studying wtf. i am being too nice, giving something the benefit of the doubt a million times over when it was never going to happen. like i said. the writing was on the walls. i should have taken this as a red flag from the very beginning. i was dealing with a child on a computer who is only probably 27 and still studying who will never accept or hold any accountability.
when one pays so much money to a provider they are forced to stay with them because of the thousands spent.

ive even consulted with other drs and they have all confirmed that " he just takes it too far" and they will not do that on me. turning your faults onto patients is a red flag. not to mention that time you threatened to sue ME because we were wayy past the deadline you gave me all because i was repeatedly asking for my design. never in my life i have dealt with a person with such a short unhinged fuse.

are we going to talk about the fact that two weeks ago you posted on your stories of a image with someones facial implants and saying " this case was cancelled because the patient was sending sassy emails. dont do that". wow i feel sorry for that patient. let this be stern warning of how unhinged this so called provider is. imagine getting so far and getting cancelled on because how dare you question the greatest implant designer of all time. ive seen this all before, this sounds alot like " youre fired"....





good luck everyone. you will need it..

im out

Pat, I say this kindly, but why are you trying to get additional skull implants while the rest of your face got botched by implants? Its a terrible fucking idea.

You also need to take accountability of addiction to surgery. You’ve already had tons of infections, your body doesn’t like implants. Yes you got botched, and it’s soul wrenching and difficult. There might be a solution, and I truly hope there is because you don’t deserve the suffering you are undergoing. But getting more crazy implants is not it. I’m not saying Giant is right, but it does seem you got an addiction to this, and wanting skull implants after all that is a sign of that. You’re going to fuck up your whole cranium pursuing something not meant for you. I don’t know the truth between you and Giant, both seem convincing in your own way, and there is probably some degree of truth to both narratives. Sharing screenshots of whole conversations (not cherry picked responses) would be more useful.

Obviously Giant has more to lose in this debacle. Not necessarily his response here, but overall his persona is that of a man child and truly needs to grow up. There’s a reason almost no surgeon or those involved in aesthetic medicine are out there talking about mogging and slaying, it’s unprofessional and even if one is really blackpilled one doesn’t voice that. It’s obviously a marketing gimmick, meant to attract the susceptible and insecure, which most of us in this forum who are considering surgery or have done surgery for cosmetic reasons are.

Obviously you need surgery again to repair your face to something that isn’t blatantly botched, but after that seriously consider moving on from hardmaxxing trying to chadify yourself. Your going to reach of point of no return bro, there might be a solution yet and Giant might not be it.

Maybe get a bimax or a facelift, something where they can repair your tissues. Just my two cents. Also I know a lot about hardmaxxing, I’ve done more than most people here, real world experience.

 

[Xx_gloomy_bison_xX]

@RealSurgerymax
Is it possible that some human bodies simply reject all implants? I mean is it possible that some faces are simply not meant for implants biologically?

 

[pat]

Pat, I say this kindly, but why are you trying to get additional skull implants while the rest of your face got botched by implants? Its a terrible fucking idea.

You also need to take accountability of addiction to surgery. You’ve already had tons of infections, your body doesn’t like implants. Yes you got botched, and it’s soul wrenching and difficult. There might be a solution but more crazy implants is not it. I’m not saying Giant is right, but it does seem you got an addiction to this, and wanting skull implants after all that is a sign of that. You’re going to fuck up your whole cranium pursuing something not meant for you. I don’t know the truth between youn and Giant, both seem convincing in your own way, and there is probably some degree of truth to both narratives. Obviously Giant has more to lose in this debacle. Obviously you need surgery again to repair your face to something that isn’t blatantly botched, but after that seriously consider moving on from hardmaxxing trying to chadify yourself. Your going to reach of point of no return bro, there might be a solution yet and Giant might not be it.

Maybe get a bimax or a facelift, something where they can repair your tissues. Just my two cents. Also I know a lot about hardmaxxing, I’ve done more than most people here, real world experience.

firstly i can only speak on my experience. i am not here for people to pick sides or sound more convincing than the other. people keep inboxing me asking me to talk and i did. re skull implants. that is the least of my issues. it was to conservatively balance out face. did i think it was gunna happen? looking back. probably not. and i was right. again, if i ask all someone has to say is no.

beyond any surgery im also highliting the morels and ethics of a provider and how people deal with things when issues arise good and bad. i dont need to delve into it again its all there. my experience was far from good and i lost even more money in the process not to mention my time ( something you cant get back). im sorry who confirms a surgery and leaves someone stranded in another country waiting hopelesly?

ive given this thread more than enough info

anyone who needs to talk free free to inbox me. ill try to get back to everyone in time.

 

[iseeblue9]

Thx for sharing the truth about him, I once tried to become his patient but gave up after 5 month and I have a friend with similar story to you(implants raped his eyelids and Giant gaslighted him that it's his previous surgery and he went to Turkey for nothing even tho Giant said his revisions are ready as well)

Are u talking about gui?

 

[pat]

Thx for sharing the truth about him, I once tried to become his patient but gave up after 5 month and I have a friend with similar story to you(implants raped his eyelids and Giant gaslighted him that it's his previous surgery and he went to Turkey for nothing even tho Giant said his revisions are ready as well)

im sorry about your experience and for your friends. it seems like we both have had similar experiences..

 

[Xx_gloomy_bison_xX]

Thx for sharing the truth about him, I once tried to become his patient but gave up after 5 month and I have a friend with similar story to you(implants raped his eyelids and Giant gaslighted him that it's his previous surgery and he went to Turkey for nothing even tho Giant said his revisions are ready as well)

Can you elaborate more?

 

[Radiantmetal]

I’ll be curious to hear from his Lefort 2 and Lefort 3 patients themselves. I’m surprised none of them have came out to share their experiences. Its sketchy.

 

[mrriceguyreturn]

Can you elaborate more?

In my case I just consulted Celal, he told me to get a ct scan, I got it like 3 days after the consult then tried to make giant to at least hear me out and maybe start my plan but it was just completely fruitless activity

I’ll be curious to hear from his Lefort 2 and Lefort 3 patients themselves. I’m surprised none of them have came out to share their experiences. Its sketchy.

A bird whispered to my ear that the guy who got LF3 got serious complications post op(he couldn't close his eyes and skull implants nuked his temporal muscles and they looked extremely hollow in the end), he got a revision immediately after

 

[Radiantmetal]

In my case I just consulted Celal, he told me to get a ct scan, I got it like 3 days after the consult then tried to make giant to at least hear me out and maybe start my plan but it was just completely fruitless activity

A bird whispered to my ear that the guy who got LF3 got serious complications post op(he couldn't close his eyes and skull implants nuked his temporal muscles and they looked extremely hollow in the end), he got a revision immediately after

Damn, I can’t say I’m surprised, but still feel bad for the dude for volunteering to be a live specimen experiment. Do you know if the revision helped? Of which type of revision, like another Lefort or revised the implants?

Thanks for sharing

 

[mrriceguyreturn]

Damn, I can’t say I’m surprised, but still feel bad for the dude for volunteering to be a live specimen experiment

Bird also whispered to my ear that he was 1PSL curry wanting to do whatever it takes

Do you know if the revision helped? Of which type of revision, like another Lefort or revised the implants?

No info abt this, I think it did

 

[iseeblue9]

In my case I just consulted Celal, he told me to get a ct scan, I got it like 3 days after the consult then tried to make giant to at least hear me out and maybe start my plan but it was just completely fruitless activity

A bird whispered to my ear that the guy who got LF3 got serious complications post op(he couldn't close his eyes and skull implants nuked his temporal muscles and they looked extremely hollow in the end), he got a revision immediately after

bird isn’t authentic no curry got that

 

[Snicket]

A bird whispered to my ear that the guy who got LF3 got serious complications post op(he couldn't close his eyes and skull implants nuked his temporal muscles and they looked extremely hollow in the end), he got a revision immediately after

Can you tell us anymore about the LF3 case?
Or is this all you know?

I noticed he had a shit tonne of skull implants and I was thinking Murphy’s law when I saw them.

 

[mrriceguyreturn]

bird isn’t authentic no curry got that

Well he was the first one, A small step for subhuman, big step for subhumanity

Can you tell us anymore about the LF3 case?
Or is this all you know?

I noticed he had a shit tonne of skull implants and I was thinking Murphy’s law when I saw them.

All I know is that he got huge problems after the surgery but think they got fixed after his immediate revision

 

[iseeblue9]

Well he was the first one, A small step for subhuman, big step for subhumanity

All I know is that he got huge problems after the surgery but think they got fixed after his immediate revision

Giant told me it was a success thats why he will be performing another this year but he is leaning more towards le fort 2 for aesthetics
i really need to know about the tripod/obo case no info about it anywhere

 

[Lefor3Laser]

In my case I just consulted Celal, he told me to get a ct scan, I got it like 3 days after the consult then tried to make giant to at least hear me out and maybe start my plan but it was just completely fruitless activity

A bird whispered to my ear that the guy who got LF3 got serious complications post op(he couldn't close his eyes and skull implants nuked his temporal muscles and they looked extremely hollow in the end), he got a revision immediately after

Well, it isn't a easy surgery after all, people really think that even a normal bimax is risk free, when in reality it is also very risky.

I feel bad for people who actually believed him.

 

[Xx_gloomy_bison_xX]

Well he was the first one, A small step for subhuman, big step for subhumanity

All I know is that he got huge problems after the surgery but think they got fixed after his immediate revision

Well, there will be casualties and sacrifices on this path. Giants has more experience now and future surgeries will presumably be safer and yield better result thanks to that currys sacrifice. PSL Gods always demand blood for ascension!

 

[Snicket]

All I know is that he got huge problems after the surgery but think they got fixed after his immediate revision

Well, it's a risky game.

 

[normie_joe]

i dont even know why i am writing this because you can never win an argument against a narcisist. but i will continue and try answeriing what i can.


this is the longest answer you have given me in the last two years combined. congratulations i truly wish you were like this the last two years.
so let me get this straight. i consulted with you 2 years ago with my previous jaw implant, asked for custom implants all over, you ACCEPTED the case with No qualms, poorly designed my implants citing that they look great and will look much better, even measuring out my previous jaw implant ( which you had option to leave in there as i said i love that side happy to leave it in as per zoom call), and then proceed to blame ME for your fuckup saying that what i wanted AFTER the surgery is too risky. dude i already had what i wanted in that area and you got it wrong and blamed your software for getting the measurements wrong. gee i wish i could blame my computer for real human problems in life. all this drama going on was me giving you a second chance to fix what you took from me and now youre saying what i want back in is too risky when this could have been avoided in the first place. you are in damage control because you cant put back what you took out and now blaming me for being too extreme or troublesome. wow

i gave you all the time in the world but you stalled it over and over. people already know this. i was respectful and gave you all the time in the world. your very own business partners ie the surgeon and surgical assistant have all expresed their anger towards you and your constant delays citing and i quote " we are very very angry with him, i cant believe he is doing this". to the point they even offered their very own implant designer because of your incompetance. maybe next time youre at dinner eating fortune cookies the cookie may tell you to "wake up and smell the coffee" or "get to work" . stop blaming me (the patient) for things that are your job. i had a previous implant in. you told me " dont worry your new implant will be much better contour and exactly the same size dont worry" and they wernt. heck i was happy to leave them in and work around them. my cheeks were disprotionate and gigantic and you admitted they did not look good in real life. you had no issue putting gigantic unsafe poorly designed cheeks in and then have the audacity to tell me what i want in revision which is a smaller design too risky?? its only risky because you guys botched me two years ago surgically and now to open it all up again its proving risky. why am i being blamed for decisions that a provider has to make. im a patient asking for a service and if something cant be done the patient will then accept it. dont make out that i am some difficult client wanting the extrodinary. on the contrary in saying that you even cite on you "surgery cfm" page and i quote " from ordinary to rare as rare can be". *insert unicorn emoji*

that picture of the renders shows EXACTLY what i am talking about. the jaw implant looks odd and strange. because you have constantly showed me that angle and that angle only. i asked you a million times of the dimensions and other angles and a super-imposed picture of the implants old and new so i can compare and we can deliberate what will be best on me. i was not convinced the new jaw looks good because it looked bizaar and when i asked to see other angles and exact dimensions you would leave me on read, change the subject and not continue on with the conversation. do i need to share the screenshots of the countless times i have asked this of you?! you knew exactly what you were doing and knew by deflecting it would warrant you more time to avoid what needed to be done. my point is proven again once and for all.

i put my trust in you after all you are the "expert" ( or are you?). its not up to me to decide what a design should look like. i gave you a brief and you in return you give renders and then we go back and fourth and come up with a plan. the planning phase is all i asked for for a whole year and confirmation of everything so they can be sent off to the lab when the TIME is right and safe to do so i can schedule flights surgery finances. ( cant be done in one day). Stringing me along making excuses, changing the narrative to make you look better everyday, months is not going to work.

when the emergancy room looked at me i was absolute mess, your implants were so bad i was forced to wear a mask months after the surgery and the whole time they were in. my face was destroyed from them having to remove these awful implants. my left eye was scarred and pulled down from the hideous infection that was out of ny control ( thats a whole new thread), my mid face sagged like a old man and i suffered and i never felt so ugly in my life. i couldnt just fly back 25 hours and pay more money can i. all while dr kept telling me to keep taking anti infamatorys everything is ok. yeah right!...

i even consulted with a occuloplastic surgeon soon after in turkey via zoom and they were basically like " what the hell did they do to you?" .

after the surgery in turkey i was left in bed post op for 3 days blind with no vision and not a single nurse dr or you thought to disinfect my mouth and you wonder why i had a infection which came back as ecoli YUCK. not to mention the same side being misplaced even though you bragged my implants were perfectly placed when you took a selfie in the OR with my head cut open. you apologised for that months later and said " next surgery i will wash your mouth out myself" . all you had to do was commit to your end of the deal and give me some HOPE after feeling so ugly and forgotten about. i lost trust in you after this but because i invested so much money into this i had to stick with you to fix it. after my explant you turned cold on me and didnt care at all. i dont even use these kind of forums but i had to be honest about my experiance. at the end of the day patients dont want to be spending thousands and being left high and dry.

in regards to communication. the whole time felt like i was walking on eggshells. dare i say something to upset you because you would easily cancel me. and the times i did you were punish me and threaten me. so at times i was forced against my will to be nice when deep down i was so angry at how you handle things. not to mention how i had to resend the same msg a million times so i could be bumped up" to get your attention..

you messeged me two weeks ago and coincedently i was in istanbul for 48 hours. you offered to meet me on zoom ( didnt happen) and then i suggested you uber 5 minutes to come see me at the lobby of my hotel and cancelled on me. and then we changed it to the next morning you said yes. and then surprise surprise you woke up sick. dont try and tell ppl i am difficult when you confirm all these things. even after that i said " i am free all day how about we zoom?" again you left me on read and stopped replying FFS.

showing a picture of rodrigo alvez is rather insulting because we are not alike.. infact now that we are on that lets talk about prior to my surgery i had one very major request and that was request was me showing you a picture of another human ken doll justin jedlica and i quote. " PLEASE DONT MAKE MY CHEEKS LOOK LIKE THIS" you replied " dont worry we actually get taught on what NOT to do and this is one of them". and voila i looked exactly like that. and then you proceed to blame me and say " well you wanted them BOLD". Bold does not mean ugly. you feminised my face, gave me apple cheek and pushed my infraorbitals so far up my eye that i looked chinese, gained 50 pounds and constantly looked like i had alergic reaction. thats like going to a hairstylist, telling them what you want and the stylist making the client mix up the colour.
no -the patient/client pays for a service and its up to you to bring it to life.

you were being told by others to finish my case and that i am ready and to stop dragging this along and you never listened. you totally let your god complex take over. you always do. the notion that i had to wait 12-18 months may be true but you are only saying that now because you dragged this clusterfuck on for 12- 18 months and now youre trying to make yourself look better because you still havnt produced anything from my case and this narrative is proving very convenient for you..


people dont take lawsuits lightly. i was driven to do this because i had no option and i have to fight for what is right. blaming my lawsuit is a poor effort at deflecting considering all your promises and deadlines were BEFORE it. i filed this lawsuit after you stood me up in istanbul,strung me along for over 12 months with no detail or commitment to my case ( everyone knows how bad you are at communicating) while you were partying away in thailand towards the end of the year while i was on a airplane,( not to mention those holidays to japan and egypt while you were supposed to work on my case). and because of surgical errors that ofcourse some are out of your control because youre not a dr right? this whole thing was never going to happen and you were never interested. dont try and make out that you were ever going to pay for this revision and get it done. just dont. that ship has sailed. and i am glad because it would be dangerous for me to trust you, the dr and hospital again. again this is my opinion.
i gave you a chance to do these implants so i could potentially go elsewhere to a reputable dr who will look after me. that ship has clearly also sailed.

you.not taking accountability is exactly what the silent minority are going through. and i have people inboxing me who are scared to talk. i have nothing to lose anymore so i will advocate for whoever wants to listen. people certainly have a choice and the choice is ultimately theirs. i can only speak of my experiance.

yes i did ask you to create a skull implant for me to compensate for the fuck up of my original surgery and you accepted and had no issues with it. (and i appreciate that. ) you even showed me other cases you have done similar to mine.. " all will be fine, thats no problem at alll"

your views and the surgeon ( an actual surgeon) are constantly opposing and that is your problem not mine. you are not even a surgeon. ffs i had to hear it from someone else that you are still studying wtf. i am being too nice, giving something the benefit of the doubt a million times over when it was never going to happen. like i said. the writing was on the walls. i should have taken this as a red flag from the very beginning. i was dealing with a child on a computer who is only probably 27 and still studying who will never accept or hold any accountability.
when one pays so much money to a provider they are forced to stay with them because of the thousands spent.

ive even consulted with other drs and they have all confirmed that " he just takes it too far" and they will not do that on me. turning your faults onto patients is a red flag. not to mention that time you threatened to sue ME because we were wayy past the deadline you gave me all because i was repeatedly asking for my design. never in my life i have dealt with a person with such a short unhinged fuse.

are we going to talk about the fact that two weeks ago you posted on your stories of a image with someones facial implants and saying " this case was cancelled because the patient was sending sassy emails. dont do that". wow i feel sorry for that patient. let this be stern warning of how unhinged this so called provider is. imagine getting so far and getting cancelled on because how dare you question the greatest implant designer of all time. ive seen this all before, this sounds alot like " youre fired"....





good luck everyone. you will need it..

im out

Everything you said about Giant and him barely answering your questions adds up. That's what @optimisticzoomer said as well. He was waiting ages, and no response.

Consider it a blessing @optimisticzoomer

 

[normie_joe]

june/july 2024 was the revision date ( there were many more changes before that but lets keep at june/july) but due to his constant delays ,excuses,setbacks, lack of replying ( you all know what im talking about) it went to august, then september, then october, then november. and i told him MULTIPLE times throught the year that i had important life events and i need this delay in revision sorted and i cant do december due to it being busy and xmas. he would be like " i understand " and that it will be done before all of that. ( liar). . he would feed me things throughout the year such as " youre so close, youre next on the case, there is noone before you, you are so close, hold onnnnnn while also telling me things like ive been busy, i had a emergancy, i had exams , something has come up, i have to leave the country and come back etc). he even left voice note one time in october while he was out on a saturday night saying " you. know normally i dont work weekends but for YOU I will work this weekend and get it done" another lie. in october after months of begging he threatened d to sue ME, his very own paying patient who he screwed up, simply because i was begging for my designs to be done because he has fed me lies all year long, halting any other thing i could do in life because every day i would wake up thinking it is time to go.

fast forward it is now late november. the deadline was up and told him i cant do december due to it being xmas. so i gave him more time and asked would december 27th work for him? he replied with " yes we will be ready". i said no i want you to 100 percent confirm december 27th because i will sacrifice xmas and catch a non refundable flight on xmas eve and get my surgery in december 27th. he replied with " yes go for it we will be ready for your surgery, all will be fine you can book your ticket". as it was leading up to december the math just wasnt adding up. he still refused to show me any designs for me to confirm and by the time he made the order and got them sent to france ( he said he has to make a special trip to france to pick up the implants and then fly back to turkey, really wierd ). i was getting very anxious because i had booked a plane ticket and took time off work prepared my self for surgery. also apparently if im lying then ask the medical coordinater dr serder. they took my payment for the hospital in october and i asked liam that " serder is asking for money for my hospital should i pay him ? he confirmed that i can pay him as my surgery is coming up. because i didnt want to pay 4000 dollars of my own money for hospital expenses if i surgery was not coming up. and i did.

throught this. time liam would often gaslight and say things like " you need to calm down, its not a race, why would you call me at this hour? im sleeping, youre stressing me out and to add fuel to the fire he would send me fortune cookies and it would say things like " everything will be fiine". he knew it would irritate me because everything WASNT fine. he would downplay my needs and feelings any chance he got.

back to december. leading up to december 24th which was my flight time. i was getting very anxious. liam stopped replying back to me and enjoyed watching me spiral on the chat logs. he knew i had surgery coming up and wouldnt even acknowlegde how stressed i was because it was 2 weeks out and he still refused to show me my designs or send them off to the lab. the gatekeeping of my very own design was horrendous and cruel.

he enjoyed every minute of this torment and control. he stopped replying and get this he RESTRICTED my access to view his instagram stories and on the surgery cmf page so i couldnt keep tabs on what he was up to. he was online but he thought he could fool me by pretending he was offline. i simply got on another instragram profile and saw ALL of his stories and what he was up to.. well let me tell you. it was pictures of him living his life in thailand on the beach and playing pool in a bar living his best life while i had a surgery with him booked within a matter of days...

he finally replied back to me 5 days before my flight and said " due to some issues we are delayed by 5 or 6 days, you can either cancel your flight or extend your stay" i was so fucking angry and dsgusted becuase HE KNEW i booked a non refundable flight that i couldnt cancel. he was playing this game and enjoying every minute of this.

i told him i have to get on this flight and that im pissed off he screwed me over. again he left me on read and stopped replying and i eventually got on the doomed flight and decided to extend my stay. when i arrived in istanbul i messeged liam telling him " hey i have landed in istanbul" he replied " hows that?". do you know how condescending and cruel that reply made me feel? again i gave this fraud the benefit of the doubt and stayed in turkey and voila,, 6 days had passed and no reply nothing. this con had stood me up and cost me thousands of dollars and he was still in thailand drinking beer and playing pool. he didnt even leave the country let alone finish my case or do a simple thing for a whole YEAR. this guy tormented me for a whole year like it was a game and enjoyed making me suffer while he was doing everyone elses case. he even told me last year around august that. " you. and the brazilian patient are in the same batch as you are the two revisions and that theres nothing to worry about. you are very close to surgery" he even commented that the brazilian patient " is wasting his time by flying over for a in person consult because he wont be getting his surgery done any faster by flying to me in person for a design consult" i said to myself wow how rude.

so back to my dreaded flight home. i was so let down and defeated that i messeged liam and told him how pissed off i was that he stood me up and that ill never forgive him for what he did. i want to also point out that i made a promise to myself that if this guy stands me up then i will be seeking a lawyer. theres only so much suffering a person can take, for someone to string me along for this long and play all these minds games and enjoy every minute of it. i had enough. liam finally responded with " omg im sorry will pay for your flight back" but it was a classic card from the giant playbook. it never happened, he never paid for my flight back let alone organise my revision. you would think that after all that he would be like " i better get this done this guy has suffered enough". no he further left me on read and stopped writing to me for about 2 months until he found out i had a lawyer.

fast forward to now. he has taken the easy way out, made himself out the victim and cancelled my case. and he has the audacity to lie and say " he had to wait 12 - 18 months for revision but he wouldnt listen". this guy makes stuff up as he goes, honestly its laughable how many lies he comes up with and thinks people believe him.

noone should ever go through this,, ever. a warning to future patients. your money will be taken, things will look great.. wheels are in motion and then bam. something will come up and the days will lead to months and the months will lead to years and then you will be cancelled. god forbid you have a slither of a complication because it will be turned around and it will be YOUR fault.

you are dealing with a narcisist. its never his fault, ALWAYS someone elses. at the end of the day i had a surgery, was offered a complete revision and it never happend. and because i decided to speak up ( my inbox is flooded with people wanting me to talk), advocate for patients and suddenly i get punished and cancelled.

i dont care anymore. maybe this was meant to be. the writing must have been on the walls.

i hope this helps some of you.

Goat for posting these, read every single word.

I knew something was off with that fucker.

I hope things resolve for the better.

 

[normie_joe]

Okay, I think I was a bit overdramatic, sarcastic(because everyone is calling him a butcher these days, even on reddit) , emotional and talked trash without giving context - sorry for that, don't want to confuse people here, I was drunk when I wrote that post yesterday and I was really frustrated that some people with him got mogger results and me.. on the other side not so much and it's about the money also(I'm not rich at all, went to bank, I'm in debt, worked 3 jobs just to save for this surgery, wasted time planning.. etc) - so you could understand my frustration. but what I'm trying to say is that people should be aware that in every surgery there is a risk and doesn't matter if the surgeon is trash or not, you are still exposed to these risks.

He is GOOD technically, he did come out with some nice ideas.... He also have some good results - I've seen it! Perfect placement of implants.. etc. He was a dentist yes, but now he does hardcore surgeries, OBO, implants, LF1,2,3 so he might improve in that regard.

I don't know I guess I was just unlucky. Dehiscence repair is fucking difficult if not impossible.

He actually did wanted to give me a revision for FREE and he actually cares about patients, I know he did about me when I got the infection. When I had the infection which happened at 4AM, I immediately flew to turkey and Celal canceled surgery(not sure if that part is true) just to treat me asap with antibiotic injection, which is nice. My face was a disaster on that time.

Conclusion, he is a decent surgeon who I think he still have a LOT to learn, still learning, you must have Giant with him when doing the surgeries on you. While he is still learning obviously will be people who don't like the result, like and some people who get really lucky and get very good results. It's just the way how it is. Nothing is guaranteed.

Motherfuckers are willing to let a surgeon do a lefort 2 on them for practice.

 

[normie_joe]

Yes, if Giant is there. Surgeons are kinda clueless without him.

Let's put it this way, Celal with Giant = good results, Celal without Giant = just don't go to him.

How is someone that spent years in residency incapable of doing the surgeries they were trained for, without an amateur implant designer who took a udemy course on AutoCAD?

If he's shit without Giant, then he's shit with him, because he's the one doing all the cutting.

How about don't go to Turkish back alley clinics to get your face rearranged at all?