The Big Vitamin D Mistake

[Deleted member 3990]

The Big Vitamin D Mistake - PubMed

Since 2006, type 1 diabetes in Finland has plateaued and then decreased after the authorities' decision to fortify dietary milk products with cholecalciferol. The role of vitamin D in innate and adaptive immunity is critical. A statistical error in the estimation of the recommended dietary...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Abstract
Since 2006, type 1 diabetes in Finland has plateaued and then decreased after the authorities' decision to fortify dietary milk products with cholecalciferol. The role of vitamin D in innate and adaptive immunity is critical. A statistical error in the estimation of the recommended dietary allowance (RDA) for vitamin D was recently discovered; in a correct analysis of the data used by the Institute of Medicine, it was found that 8895 IU/d was needed for 97.5% of individuals to achieve values ≥50 nmol/L. Another study confirmed that 6201 IU/d was needed to achieve 75 nmol/L and 9122 IU/d was needed to reach 100 nmol/L. The largest meta-analysis ever conducted of studies published between 1966 and 2013 showed that 25-hydroxyvitamin D levels <75 nmol/L may be too low for safety and associated with higher all-cause mortality, demolishing the previously presumed U-shape curve of mortality associated with vitamin D levels. Since all-disease mortality is reduced to 1.0 with serum vitamin D levels ≥100 nmol/L, we call public health authorities to consider designating as the RDA at least three-fourths of the levels proposed by the Endocrine Society Expert Committee as safe upper tolerable daily intake doses. This could lead to a recommendation of 1000 IU for children <1 year on enriched formula and 1500 IU for breastfed children older than 6 months, 3000 IU for children >1 year of age, and around 8000 IU for young adults and thereafter. Actions are urgently needed to protect the global population from vitamin D deficiency."

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Effect of vitamin D supplementation on cardiovascular risk factors and exercise performance in healthy subjects; a randomised placebo controlled pilot study | SFEBES2015 | Society for Endocrinology BES 2015 | Endocrine Abstracts

www.endocrine-abstracts.org

"...Methods: A randomised placebo controlled single-blinded parallel trial was conducted in healthy subjects. They received 2000 IU vitamin D3 per day (n=8) or placebo (n=5) for 14 days. Body composition, BP and arterial elasticity (PWV) were recorded at baseline, day 7 and day 14 of intervention. Two 24 h urine samples were collected to estimate free cortisol and cortisone levels. Exercise performance was assessed at baseline and day 14 of intervention using a bike ergometer in which BP and PWV were measured before and after exercise. The distance cycled in 20 min and Borg rate of exertion scale were recorded.
Results: In the intervention arm, vitamin D supplementation significantly reduced systolic and diastolic BP; from 114.65±16.41 and 78.58±12.65 to 105.41±11.12 (P=0.022) and 66.25±11.69 mmHg (P=0.014) respectively. However, PWV was only reduced slightly (P=0.085). Urinary free cortisol levels were significantly reduced from 162.59±58.9 to 96.4±37.25 nmol/day (P=0.044), and cortisol/cortisone ratio from 2.22±0.7 to 1.04±0.42 (P=0.017). Exercise-induced systolic and diastolic BP were significantly reduced post vitamin D intake from 128.2±14.67 to 117.45±8.6 (P=0.049) and from 75.20±8.35 to 70.12±7.28 mmHg (P=0.045) respectively. The distance cycled in 20 min significantly increased from 4.98±2.65 to 6.51±2.28 km (P=0.020), whilst the Borg rate of exertion scale reduced from 5.13±1.36 to 4.25±0.71 RPE (P=0.021). In the placebo arm, no significant effects on CVD risk factors and exercise performance were observed. Conclusions: These results suggest that daily vitamin D supplementation may ameliorate CVD risk factors including a decrease in 11β-HSD 1 activity and improve exercise performance in healthy individuals. However, large scale studies are required to verify our findings."

 

[Deleted member 7192]

TLR
Vitamin D and shieeett

 

[WadlowMaxxing]

how much do you reccomend/take daily btw?

 

[Deleted member 3990]

On the Trail of the Elusive X-Factor: A Sixty-Two-Year-Old Mystery Finally Solved

🖨️ Print post Translations: Dutch Contents Article Summary On the Trail of the Elusive X-Factor (Main Article) A Sixty-Year Mystery Vitamin K: Three Discoveries Converge Perfect Correspondence Synergy […]

www.westonaprice.org

"Interaction between vitamins A D K (Synergy)
Vitamin K2 is the substance that makes the vitamin A- and vitamin D-dependent proteins come to life. While vitamins A and D act as signalling molecules, telling cells to make certain proteins, vitamin K2 activates these proteins by conferring upon them the physical ability to bind calcium. In some cases these proteins directly coordinate the movement or organization of calcium themselves; in other cases the calcium acts as a glue to hold the protein in a certain shape. In all such cases, the proteins are only functional once they have been activated by vitamin K.
Osteocalcin, for example, is a protein responsible for organizing the deposition of calcium and phosphorus salts in bones and teeth. Cells only produce this protein in the presence of both vitamins A and D; it will only accumulate in the extracellular matrix and facilitate the deposition of calcium salts, however, once it has been activated by vitamin K2. Vitamins A and D regulate the expression of matrix Gla protein (MGP), which is responsible for mineralizing bone and protecting the arteries from calcification; like osteocalcin, however, MGP can only fulfil its function once it has been activated by vitamin K2. While vitamins A and D contribute to growth by stimulating growth factors and promoting the absorption of minerals, vitamin K2 makes its own essential contribution to growth by preventing the premature calcification of the cartilaginous growth zones of bones." - Masterjohn

 

[SkinjobCatastrophe]

Thats interesting. But in america pretty much all milk already has vitamin D, as well as a million other products at just about every grocery store, and most americans consume enough vitamin D but are still deficient, probably because their diet is shit and they get no exercise or sunlight, especially for the 6 months a year where most american cities are dead and gray

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Osteoporosis, aging, tissue renewal, and product science

With the incidence of hip fractures increasing while the percentage of women using estrogen was increasing, it seems likely that there is something wrong with the theory that osteoporosis is caused by an estrogen deficiency.

raypeat.com

"...While lactic acidosis causes bone loss, acidosis caused by increased carbonic acid doesn't; low bicarbonate in the body fluids seems to remove carbonate from the bone (Bushinsky, et al., 1993), and also mineral phosphates (Bushinsky, et al., 2003). The parathyroid hormone, which removes calcium from bone, causes lactic acid to be formed by bone cells (Nijweide, et al., 1981; Lafeber, et al., 1986). Lactic acid produced by intense exercise causes calcium loss from bone (Ashizawa, et al., 1997), and sodium bicarbonate increases calcium retention by bone. Vitamin K2 (Yamaguchi, et al., 2003) blocks the removal of calcium from bone caused by parathyroid hormone and prostaglandin E2, by completely blocking their stimulation of lactic acid production by bone tissues. Aspirin, which, like vitamin K, supports cell respiration and inhibits lactic acid formation, also favors bone calcification. Vitamin K2 stimulates the formation of two important bone proteins, osteocalcin and osteonectin (Bunyaratavej, et al., 2009), and reduces the activity of estrogen by oxidizing estradiol (Otsuka, et al, 2005)."

Osteocalcin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

"...Osteocalcin is secreted solely by osteoblasts and thought to play a role in the body's metabolic regulation and is pro-osteoblastic, or bone-building, by nature. It is also implicated in bone mineralization and calcium ion homeostasis. Osteocalcin acts as a hormone in the body, causing beta cells in the pancreas to release more insulin, and at the same time directing fat cells to release the hormone adiponectin, which increases sensitivity to insulin. Osteocalcin acts on Leydig cells of the testis to stimulate testosterone biosynthesis and therefore affect male fertility."

Plausible ergogenic effects of vitamin D on athletic performance and recovery

"...In summary, an interesting theme has emerged from animal studies that supraphysiological dosages of vitamin D3 have potential ergogenic effects on the human metabolic system and lead to multiple physiological enhancements. These dosages could increase aerobic capacity, muscle growth, force and power production, and a decreased recovery time from exercise. These dosages could also improve bone density. However, both deficiency (12.5 to 50 nmol/L) and high levels of vitamin D (>125 nmol/L) can have negative side effects, with the potential for an increased mortality [121]. Thus, maintenance of optimal serum levels between 75 to 100 nmol/L [11, 86] and ensuring adequate amounts of other essential nutrients including vitamin K are consumed, is key to health and performance. Coaches, medical practitioners, and athletic personnel should recommend their patients and athletes to have their plasma 25(OH)D measured, in order to determine if supplementation is needed. Based on the research presented on recovery, force and power production, 4000-5000 IU/day of vitamin D3 in conjunction with a mixture of 50 mcg/day to 1000 mcg/day of vitamin K1 and K2 seems to be a safe dose and has the potential to aid athletic performance. Lastly, no study in the athletic population has increased serum 25(OH)D levels past 100 nmol/L, (the optimal range for skeletal muscle function) using doses of 1000 to 5000 IU/day. Thus, future studies should test the physiological effects of higher dosages (5000 IU to 10,000 IU/day or more) of vitamin D3 in combination with varying dosages of vitamin K1 and vitamin K2 in the athletic population to determine optimal dosages needed to maximize performance."

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Tissue-selective regulation of aromatase expression by calcitriol: implications for breast cancer therapy - PubMed

Aromatase, the enzyme that catalyzes estrogen synthesis, is critical for the progression of estrogen receptor-positive breast cancer (BCa) in postmenopausal women. We show that calcitriol, the hormonally active form of vitamin D, regulates the expression of aromatase in a tissue-selective...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Private Site

"Decreasing aromatization of steroids with vitamin D

Aromatization, in simple terms, is the process by which androgens (e.g. testosterone) are converted to estrogens (e.g. β-estradiol) by the action of the enzyme aromatase.

The aromatization of androgens to estrogens in the testes and extra glandular tissues of man is realized by the same enzyme complex present in the ovary and placenta, CYP19. The aromatization of androgens involves sequentially: hydroxylation, oxidation and removal of the C(19) with the aromatization of the A ring of the steroid.

3 mole of NADPH and 3 mole of oxygen are needed to convert 1 mole of testosterone or androstenedione to estrone and estradiol, respectively. The oxidation in this process, involves a specific cytochrome P450 (CYP 19). Enzymes involved appear to be linked to a microsomal complex that includes the NADPH-cytochrome P450 reductase and cytochrome itself.

From about 45 mg daily of estradiol produced in the body of a young male, only about 10 to 15% comes directly from testicular secretion, the remaining 85 to 90% are derived from peripheral aromatization of androstenedione (for estrone) and testosterone. The formation of estrogens in the testes appears to be influenced by the levels of luteinizing hormone (LH) and human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG). Aromatization in peripheral tissues, although it does not seem to be affected by gonadotropins, increases with age.

Vitamin D has demonstrated the ability to reduce the expression of the enzyme aromatase, primarily in adipocytes and estrogen-sensitive breast carcinoma. Moreover, in this type of cancers, Vitamin D decreases the action of prostaglandins in the breast tissue by suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2 ), elevating simultaneously 15-hydroxyprostaglandin dehydrogenase (which catalyzes prostaglandin degradation.) Prostaglandins stimulate aromatization, so they are major players in estrogen dependent diseases.

Although this study was done in rats, the effect of the inhibition of aromatase in human seems a very plausible hypothesis with vitamin D. This work also showed an increase on the effect of aromatase inhibitors (anastrozole, letrozole and exemestane), when administered with vitamin D."

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Vitamin D decreases the action of prostaglandins in the breast tissue by suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2 ), elevating simultaneously 15-hydroxyprostaglandin dehydrogenase (which catalyzes prostaglandin degradation.) Prostaglandins stimulate aromatization, so they are major players in estrogen dependent diseases.

PUFA pill

 

[vLotus]

Bro stop posting walls of text and just give us a tldr FS

 

[Deleted member 4612]

OP give us some tips on how we can improve our life with this

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Bro stop posting walls of text and just give us a tldr FS

I am literally posting the abstracts and conclusions and also highlight the interesting parts, can not do it much easier

 

[Deleted member 4464]

bro Its good you give a legit study proving something but most people wont read it jfl

 

[WadlowMaxxing]

Bro stop posting walls of text and just give us a tldr FS

OP give us some tips on how we can improve our life with this

tldr: vitamin d good for bones. k2 allows it have full effect. lowers aromatization. reduces stress and helps performance. vitamin d is good take some

 

[JamesWilken3]

good shit, this whole thread is awesome

Tissue-selective regulation of aromatase expression by calcitriol: implications for breast cancer therapy - PubMed

Aromatase, the enzyme that catalyzes estrogen synthesis, is critical for the progression of estrogen receptor-positive breast cancer (BCa) in postmenopausal women. We show that calcitriol, the hormonally active form of vitamin D, regulates the expression of aromatase in a tissue-selective...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Private Site

"Decreasing aromatization of steroids with vitamin D

Aromatization, in simple terms, is the process by which androgens (e.g. testosterone) are converted to estrogens (e.g. β-estradiol) by the action of the enzyme aromatase.

The aromatization of androgens to estrogens in the testes and extra glandular tissues of man is realized by the same enzyme complex present in the ovary and placenta, CYP19. The aromatization of androgens involves sequentially: hydroxylation, oxidation and removal of the C(19) with the aromatization of the A ring of the steroid.

3 mole of NADPH and 3 mole of oxygen are needed to convert 1 mole of testosterone or androstenedione to estrone and estradiol, respectively. The oxidation in this process, involves a specific cytochrome P450 (CYP 19). Enzymes involved appear to be linked to a microsomal complex that includes the NADPH-cytochrome P450 reductase and cytochrome itself.

From about 45 mg daily of estradiol produced in the body of a young male, only about 10 to 15% comes directly from testicular secretion, the remaining 85 to 90% are derived from peripheral aromatization of androstenedione (for estrone) and testosterone. The formation of estrogens in the testes appears to be influenced by the levels of luteinizing hormone (LH) and human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG). Aromatization in peripheral tissues, although it does not seem to be affected by gonadotropins, increases with age.

Vitamin D has demonstrated the ability to reduce the expression of the enzyme aromatase, primarily in adipocytes and estrogen-sensitive breast carcinoma. Moreover, in this type of cancers, Vitamin D decreases the action of prostaglandins in the breast tissue by suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2 ), elevating simultaneously 15-hydroxyprostaglandin dehydrogenase (which catalyzes prostaglandin degradation.) Prostaglandins stimulate aromatization, so they are major players in estrogen dependent diseases.

Although this study was done in rats, the effect of the inhibition of aromatase in human seems a very plausible hypothesis with vitamin D. This work also showed an increase on the effect of aromatase inhibitors (anastrozole, letrozole and exemestane), when administered with vitamin D."

Also, from this I suspect a lot of dudes are getting gyno cause lack of test + vitamin d deficiency

 

[mgtowmadness]

I can sum this all up..Take 5,000 IU to 10,000 IU daily..That will be $100.00..thank you

 

[vLotus]

Fi

tldr: vitamin d good for bones. k2 allows it have full effect. lowers aromatization. reduces stress and helps performance. vitamin d is good take some

Finally something you’ve said is useful

 

[mgtowmadness]

75 to 100 nmol/L

To get to that level you have to take 10,000IU for a person who gets little sun..I have upped mine to 30,000 IU Iam 43 and don't get alot of sun and I am also gymmaxing

 

[Uglyandfat]

I can sum this all up..Take 5,000 IU to 10,000 IU daily..That will be $100.00..thank you

how do u measure if u get powder form?

 

[St. Wristcel]

Comer vitamin d pendejo

 

[mgtowmadness]

how do you convert IU to mg (for powder form)

Don't take powder..

I can't see the link..I use NOW foods 5,000 IU

 

[Uglyandfat]

Don't take powder..here this is a good

Amazon product ASIN B002EA99HE

bought softgels from bulksuplements i thought it was powder i was confused JFL

 

[mgtowmadness]

bought softgels from bulksuplements i thought it was powder i was confused JFL

Bulk Supplements is good..I use their L-citrulline

 

[EasternRightWinger15]

so it seems that my megadosing 10k IU wasn't that bad of idea after all

 

[mgtowmadness]

so it seems that my megadosing 10k IU wasn't that bad of idea after all

No..actually that should be the normal dose

 

[EasternRightWinger15]

No..actually that should be the normal dose

yeah, but I know many med school students and they all call me crazy for doing that

 

[mgtowmadness]

The member

Xulane has a thread he is taking 50,000 IU along Tongat to boost T..It's no joke it does work​

 

[thecaste]

@Dr Shekelberg how many IU do you recommend per day doc?

 

[mgtowmadness]

yeah, but I know many med school students and they all call me crazy for doing that

Med students are morons when it comes to supplements..They are like walking NPCs..I got in a argument with a MD over Vitamin D

 

[Deleted member 9090]

10k iu per day

but 12k iu is probably best for most people living in west europe

 

[EasternRightWinger15]

Med students are morons when it comes to supplements..They are like walking NPCs..I got in a argument with a MD over Vitamin D

not only when it comes to supplements, but man, discussing about diet with them (especially when it comes to protein) is crazy

 

[Deleted member 6382]

Take vitamin S

 

[Deleted member 3990]

so it seems that my megadosing 10k IU wasn't that bad of idea after all

2g Calcium for >10k IU vitamin D3
too low Calcium and too much D3, these are likely the studies which report problems or toxicity with high D3 dosage

 

[ifyouwannabemylover]

legit common supplements here only have 1k iu per tablet, I have to take 3-4 a day

 

[TITUS]

Can someone do a tl dr?

 

[Deleted member 5048]

I was taking 8k IU per day but after this thread I'll be taking 10k

 

[Deleted member 3990]

I was taking 8k IU per day but after this thread I'll be taking 10k

Speedy change of mind

 

[Deleted member 3323]

Grass is green.


The sun is the mother of more than 90 percent of life on this planet, before we became humans bacteria in the water used the sun for photosynthesis (inb4 creationists come at me), it is the most crucial aspect for almost all of life except for those that live in the deep trenches of the ocean. This is why vitamin d is one of the most important vitamins you need.

 

[kubo]

I tried to make the info a little easier to skim through.
(I know with all the horseshit posted it's hard to sift through a wall of text, however @Dr Shekelberg has posted excellent info and it's worth reading through his posts above as well.)

Spoiler: (Vitamin D)

(Benefits of Vitamin D)

• Vitamins A and D regulate the expression of matrix Gla protein (MGP), which is responsible for mineralizing bone and protecting the arteries from calcification.
• Vitamin D supplementation significantly reduced systolic diastolic BP (blood pressure).
• PWV was only reduced slightly "arterial elasticity (PWV)".
• Urinary free cortisol levels were significantly reduced and cortisol/cortisone ratio.
• Exercise-induced systolic and diastolic BP were significantly reduced post vitamin D intake.
• The distance cycled in 20 min significantly increased.
• Borg rate of exertion scale reduced.
• Vitamin D decreases the action of prostaglandins in the breast tissue by suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2 ) "PUFA pill"
• This work also showed an increase on the effect of aromatase inhibitors (anastrozole, letrozole and exemestane), when administered with vitamin D.
• Supraphysiological dosages of vitamin D3 have potential ergogenic effects on the human metabolic system and lead to multiple physiological enhancements. These dosages could increase aerobic capacity, muscle growth, force and power production, and a decreased recovery time from exercise. These dosages could also improve bone density.

Spoiler: (Vitamin K)

(Benefits of Vitamin K)

• Vitamins A and D act as signalling molecules, telling cells to make certain proteins, in all such cases, the proteins are only functional once they have been activated by vitamin K.
• Vitamin K2 Prevents the premature calcification of the cartilaginous growth zones of bones.
• Blocks the removal of calcium from bone caused by parathyroid hormone and prostaglandin E2, by completely blocking their stimulation of lactic acid production by bone tissues.
• Stimulates the formation of two important bone proteins, osteocalcin and osteonectin, and reduces the activity of estrogen by oxidizing estradiol.

(Dosage)
Based on the research presented on recovery, force and power production,
4000-5000 IU/day of vitamin D3 in conjunction with a mixture of (Other users above are reporting higher Vit. D IU however)
50 mcg/day to 1000 mcg/day of vitamin K1 and K2
seems to be a safe dose and has the potential to aid athletic performance.

(Important)
Both deficiency (12.5 to 50 nmol/L) and high levels of vitamin D (>125 nmol/L) can have negative side effects, with the potential for an increased mortality. Thus, maintenance of optimal serum levels between 75 to 100 nmol/L and ensuring adequate amounts of other essential nutrients including vitamin K are consumed.


Time to take the D+K pill

 

[Deleted member 3990]

I tried to make the info a little easier to skim through.
(I know with all the horseshit posted it's hard to sift through a wall of text, however @Dr Shekelberg has posted excellent info and it's worth reading through his posts above as well.)

Spoiler: (Vitamin D)

(Benefits of Vitamin D)

• Vitamins A and D regulate the expression of matrix Gla protein (MGP), which is responsible for mineralizing bone and protecting the arteries from calcification.
• Vitamin D supplementation significantly reduced systolic diastolic BP (blood pressure).
• PWV was only reduced slightly "arterial elasticity (PWV)".
• Urinary free cortisol levels were significantly reduced and cortisol/cortisone ratio.
• Exercise-induced systolic and diastolic BP were significantly reduced post vitamin D intake.
• The distance cycled in 20 min significantly increased.
• Borg rate of exertion scale reduced.
• Vitamin D decreases the action of prostaglandins in the breast tissue by suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 (COX-2 ) "PUFA pill"
• This work also showed an increase on the effect of aromatase inhibitors (anastrozole, letrozole and exemestane), when administered with vitamin D.
• Supraphysiological dosages of vitamin D3 have potential ergogenic effects on the human metabolic system and lead to multiple physiological enhancements. These dosages could increase aerobic capacity, muscle growth, force and power production, and a decreased recovery time from exercise. These dosages could also improve bone density.

Spoiler: (Vitamin K)

(Benefits of Vitamin K)

• Vitamins A and D act as signalling molecules, telling cells to make certain proteins, in all such cases, the proteins are only functional once they have been activated by vitamin K.
• Vitamin K2 Prevents the premature calcification of the cartilaginous growth zones of bones.
• Blocks the removal of calcium from bone caused by parathyroid hormone and prostaglandin E2, by completely blocking their stimulation of lactic acid production by bone tissues.
• Stimulates the formation of two important bone proteins, osteocalcin and osteonectin, and reduces the activity of estrogen by oxidizing estradiol.

(Dosage)
Based on the research presented on recovery, force and power production,
4000-5000 IU/day of vitamin D3 in conjunction with a mixture of (Other users above are reporting higher Vit. D IU however)
50 mcg/day to 1000 mcg/day of vitamin K1 and K2
seems to be a safe dose and has the potential to aid athletic performance.

(Important)
Both deficiency (12.5 to 50 nmol/L) and high levels of vitamin D (>125 nmol/L) can have negative side effects, with the potential for an increased mortality. Thus, maintenance of optimal serum levels between 75 to 100 nmol/L and ensuring adequate amounts of other essential nutrients including vitamin K are consumed.


Time to take the D+K pill

The moment when I need a personal assistant to summarise my posts

 

[Deleted member 5634]

Bumping my vit d and K2 intake, ty op

 

[Deleted member 5634]

The moment when I need a personal assistant to summarise my posts

Lazy cels must die

 

[Deleted member 6475]

If you need supplements ur diet is just shit

 

[Deleted member 4612]

I can sum this all up..Take 5,000 IU to 10,000 IU daily..That will be $100.00..thank you

10k iu per day

but 12k iu is probably best for most people living in west europe

how much vitamin k2 should one take?

 

[Deleted member 6475]

how much vitamin k2 should one take?

lol at taking supplements just fix ur shit diet

 

[Deleted member 9090]

how much vitamin k2 should one take?

honestly dont know lol. could do some research though

 

[Deleted member 9090]

Im on 24k IU per day now

will update how i feel

 

[Deleted member 3990]

Im on 24k IU per day now

will update how i feel

Atleast long enough until the Parathyroid gland atrophies, thats the sign that the vitamin D is truly beneficial

 

[Lasko123]

 

[sandcelmuttcel]

rip