The surgeries I'm about to get

[Acromegaly_Chad]

I'm about to get the following surgeries with Triaca, all covered by insurance because I have sleep apnea:

- Lefort 1 advancement by 6mm
- Mandibular distraction Osteogenesis by 10mm
- Septoplasty
- Wisdom teeth removal
- Side Wing Osteotomy

Ascencion is right around the corner buddyboyos

 

[.👽.]

careful with 6mm LF1

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

careful with 6mm LF1

Yes it's not the definite number yet but my maxilla is hardcore recessed and my philtrum hangs totally lose so I'm not in danger of getting a chimp lip by a 6mm advancement.

 

[StrangerDanger]

what happens with the ramus' in your avi

 

[.👽.]

what happens with the ramus' in your avi

ccw rotation

 

[StrangerDanger]

ccw rotation

does it widen the bigonial width

 

[JosephGarrot123]

ccw rotation

does this help with my vertically short maxilla? i have SFS

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

does it widen the bigonial width

Yes this is an animation from alfaro but triaca and obwegeser said widening like this fucks your TMJ so I wouldnt do it

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

does this help with my vertically short maxilla? i have SFS

You need CW Rotation or maxillary downgrafting

 

[JosephGarrot123]

You need CW Rotation or maxillary downgrafting

ty im probably gonna get it free cuz im deformed af my ahi is 100 jfl

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

ty im probably gonna get it free cuz im deformed af my ahi is 100 jfl

Can you pm some pics?

 

[JosephGarrot123]

Can you pm some pics?

im getting a ceph before august 15 which im gonna post

 

[.👽.]

does this help with my vertically short maxilla? i have SFS

ccw makes your face shorter tbh

 

[.👽.]

does it widen the bigonial width

not sure about ccw i guess not but a bsso with the obwegeser technique does widen it

 

[lilhorizontal32]

Yes it's not the definite number yet but my maxilla is hardcore recessed and my philtrum hangs totally lose so I'm not in danger of getting a chimp lip by a 6mm advancement.

can you pm your side profile bro? I got recommended 6mm of lefort 1 by a few surgeons and I'm worried I might get chimp lip

 

[Rej0]

Why do you want to remove your Wisdom teeth?

 

[Deusmaximus]

I would never let this geriatric grandpa touch my face. Would not even trust him with my wisdom teeth.
Had consulting with him, and he gave me a bad impression.

 

[Chadakin]

Triaca is still doing surgeries? Can you tell me more about the side wing cut?

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

I would never let this geriatric grandpa touch my face. Would not even trust him with my wisdom teeth.
Had consulting with him, and he gave me a bad impression.

View attachment 1240546View attachment 1240548View attachment 1240549View attachment 1240547

I am aware of these.
But where are the other 1000 patients who had chin wing? Where are the other 900 patients who had distraction osteogenesis?

Many surgeons have fake reviews if you take a close look at the reviews. Also, what is the alternative?

I've heard shit about Zarrinbal (a dude from the Benelux states sent me x rays and he got FUCKED UP BADLY with a bimax). Another chin wing doc already cut into my nerve and damaged it forever and didn't even perform the whole chin wing cut, he lied to me about it and I had to figure it out myself when I got the x ray.

I read tons of shit about Sailer, Kater and Ramieri. Raffaini doesn't work anymore. I've heard of cases that got VERY badly fucked up by Alfaro, who needed new TMJs and were left DEFORMED with severe functional issues. A guy from Jawsurgeryforums apparently almost roped after Brusco fucked him up.

I'm basically left with triaca (whom I've NEVER heard of functional issues, only aesthetic concerns by the patients, but these cases are always debatable, maybe the are BDD candidates or didn't communicate their desires properly) and Obwegeser whom I will have to consult with during the next months. He's my only alternative, and maybe Zarrinbal.

Also, during the consultation I've found Triaca MUCH better than Brusco or Zarrinbal. It took him 5 minutes to make the same diagnosis Zarrinbal almost needed an hour for and he explained everything very well.

 

[SixCRY]

are you getting ccw?
Lot of surgeon cope the ccw by doing chin wing instead

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

are you getting ccw?
Lot of surgeon cope the ccw by doing chin wing instead

I will not, Triaca said even though my TMJs look very good he wouldn't dare to do it on my since statistically almost 50% of patients who have had CCW will need to get their TMJs replaced and since I'm very young it would be irresponsible.

I will consult with Obwegeser and talk about this. He performs lefort3 so if anyone knows then he does.

 

[Chadakin]

What did Triaca say could be achieved with side wing?

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

What did Triaca say could be achieved with side wing?

Symmetrization of my Jaw angles because my previous doc left them pretty fucked up/asymmetric.

They can be pushed out a little, with more lateral projection. Zarrinbal agreed on that.

Triaca and Zarrinbal made the same diagnosis (the surgeries listed above).

 

[Chadakin]

Symmetrization of my Jaw angles because my previous doc left them pretty fucked up/asymmetric.

They can be pushed out a little, with more lateral projection. Zarrinbal agreed on that.

Triaca and Zarrinbal made the same diagnosis (the surgeries listed above).

Ah I see. I'm consulting with Zarrinbal in Berlin next month regarding possible bimax (although I don't think I will be a candidate), and chin wing/side wing. You have to get a chin wing and side wing in two separate procedures, right? I'm curious what did you think of the before and afters Zarrinbal showed you in person (if you met with him).

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Ah I see. I'm consulting with Zarrinbal in Berlin next month regarding possible bimax (although I don't think I will be a candidate), and chin wing/side wing. You have to get a chin wing and side wing in two separate procedures, right? I'm curious what did you think of the before and afters Zarrinbal showed you in person (if you met with him).

Maybe he agrees on a segmented chin wing, depends.
Zarrinbal showed me some pretty interesting cases, several of them underwent bimax + chin wing + ZSO + rhino and went from deformed truecels to high tier normies.

Z is a good doc and man I wish I could see him again because he really was the first surgeon to diagnose my problems through a holistic approach after I had been through a years long SHIT SHOW with some QUACKS in Switzerland.

 

[lasthope]

I will not, Triaca said even though my TMJs look very good he wouldn't dare to do it on my since statistically almost 50% of patients who have had CCW will need to get their TMJs replaced and since I'm very young it would be irresponsible.

I will consult with Obwegeser and talk about this. He performs lefort3 so if anyone knows then he does.

Wait you need to replace your tmj when you get ccw ?
How the fuck you do it?

 

[lasthope]

Maybe he agrees on a segmented chin wing, depends.
Zarrinbal showed me some pretty interesting cases, several of them underwent bimax + chin wing + ZSO + rhino and went from deformed truecels to high tier normies.

Z is a good doc and man I wish I could see him again because he really was the first surgeon to diagnose my problems through a holistic approach after I had been through a years long SHIT SHOW with some QUACKS in Switzerland.

Why you don’t visit him again?

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Why you don’t visit him again?

Well I was there on June 8th so would be a little strange haha. Also, I have to travel almost 1000kilometers to Berlin which is a torture during covid.

Wait you need to replace your tmj when you get ccw ?
How the fuck you do it?

Yes, Triaca said he has had debates with Alfaro during congresses for decades because the ramus widening and CCW fuck your TMJs up. Triaca knew a girl who has had to get new TMJs at the age of 20 after a CCW.
He said docs like Alfaro think ITS FINE to do this and they don't tell the patients this risk beforehand. He wasn't disrespectful about Alfaro or CCW though he just said he believes it's unethical to do on such young patients.

 

[SixCRY]

Well I was there on June 8th so would be a little strange haha. Also, I have to travel almost 1000kilometers to Berlin which is a torture during covid.

Yes, Triaca said he has had debates with Alfaro during congresses for decades because the ramus widening and CCW fuck your TMJs up. Triaca knew a girl who has had to get new TMJs at the age of 20 after a CCW.
He said docs like Alfaro think ITS FINE to do this and they don't tell the patients this risk beforehand. He wasn't disrespectful about Alfaro or CCW though he just said he believes it's unethical to do on such young patients.

Arnett think CCW do 0 damage to tmj and even release stress off TMJ

 

[lasthope]

Well I was there on June 8th so would be a little strange haha. Also, I have to travel almost 1000kilometers to Berlin which is a torture during covid.

Yes, Triaca said he has had debates with Alfaro during congresses for decades because the ramus widening and CCW fuck your TMJs up. Triaca knew a girl who has had to get new TMJs at the age of 20 after a CCW.
He said docs like Alfaro think ITS FINE to do this and they don't tell the patients this risk beforehand. He wasn't disrespectful about Alfaro or CCW though he just said he believes it's unethical to do on such young patients.

I thought the consensus was that ccw was stable and safe
So every ccw come with a risk of fucking up tmj?
Does it matter if the ccw was performed trough impaction or posterior downgraft?

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

I thought the consensus was that ccw was stable and safe
So every ccw come with a risk of fucking up tmj?

It's dependent on how strong and healthy your TMJs are. T quoted me around 50% that get fucked up at some point in time after a CCW and/or Ramus widening.

Does it matter if the ccw was performed trough impaction or posterior downgraft?

We didn't go this much into details.

 

[Pumanator]

I am aware of these.
But where are the other 1000 patients who had chin wing? Where are the other 900 patients who had distraction osteogenesis?

Many surgeons have fake reviews if you take a close look at the reviews. Also, what is the alternative?

I've heard shit about Zarrinbal (a dude from the Benelux states sent me x rays and he got FUCKED UP BADLY with a bimax). Another chin wing doc already cut into my nerve and damaged it forever and didn't even perform the whole chin wing cut, he lied to me about it and I had to figure it out myself when I got the x ray.

I read tons of shit about Sailer, Kater and Ramieri. Raffaini doesn't work anymore. I've heard of cases that got VERY badly fucked up by Alfaro, who needed new TMJs and were left DEFORMED with severe functional issues. A guy from Jawsurgeryforums apparently almost roped after Brusco fucked him up.

I'm basically left with triaca (whom I've NEVER heard of functional issues, only aesthetic concerns by the patients, but these cases are always debatable, maybe the are BDD candidates or didn't communicate their desires properly) and Obwegeser whom I will have to consult with during the next months. He's my only alternative, and maybe Zarrinbal.

Also, during the consultation I've found Triaca MUCH better than Brusco or Zarrinbal. It took him 5 minutes to make the same diagnosis Zarrinbal almost needed an hour for and he explained everything very well.

Holy shit that's insane that so many surgereon got bad results while beiing legendary here. That make me wonder, is it so easy to fuck surgery up or are they taking that much risk. If those surgeon you called got a few bad cases, it makes me wonder how the average surgeon botched results are.
@mamacookoil

 

[lasthope]

It's dependent on how strong and healthy your TMJs are. T quoted me around 50% that get fucked up at some point in time after a CCW and/or Ramus widening.

We didn't go this much into details.

Okay so even 50% get fucked up even with only ccw without widening?

how you get new tmj? It’s not that easy to replace right

 

[Chadakin]

Holy shit that's insane that so many surgereon got bad results while beiing legendary here. That make me wonder, is it so easy to fuck surgery up or are they taking that much risk. If those surgeon you called got a few bad cases, it makes me wonder how the average surgeon botched results are.
@mamacookoil

There are many botched cases. I got botched a while back by a very well regarded surgeon on here and it's taken 14 months and 4 revisions so far to try to undo the damage.

 

[coolguy1]

careful with 6mm LF1

Is bigger advancement more dangerous or just bigger risk of being botched?

 

[lasthope]

There are many botched cases. I got botched a while back by a very well regarded surgeon on here and it's taken 14 months and 4 revisions so far to try to undo the damage.

Did you make a thread about it?

 

[Pumanator]

There are many botched cases. I got botched a while back by a very well regarded surgeon on here and it's taken 14 months and 4 revisions so far to try to undo the damage.

Can you elaborate more on your case. What surgery did you have, why , tell me more about the revision and if you feel comfortable to say, what surgery did you have? Would you say its worth to get surgery or is to too much risk in hindsight?

 

[Xangsane]

I'm about to get the following surgeries with Triaca, all covered by insurance because I have sleep apnea:

- Lefort 1 advancement by 6mm
- Mandibular distraction Osteogenesis by 10mm
- Septoplasty
- Wisdom teeth removal
- Side Wing Osteotomy

Ascencion is right around the corner buddyboyos

Good luck with your ascension!

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Arnett think CCW do 0 damage to tmj and even release stress off TMJ

Introduction: The possible effects of orthognathic surgery on signs and symptoms of temporomandibular disorder (TMD) are still controversial. We prospectively investigated the association between the amount of advancement and rotation of the mandible during bilateral sagittal split osteotomy (BSSO) and the development of TMD signs and symptoms. Methods: Class II patients (n = 127) received mandibular advancement with BSSO. We used factorial analysis of covariance to assess whether the magnitude (< or ≥7 mm) and the direction (clockwise or counterclockwise) of the movement were associated with the onset or worsening of TMD signs and symptoms during 2 years of follow-up. Results: Counterclockwise rotation of the mandible was associated with more muscle tenderness, especially in patients receiving long advancements. The combination of long advancement with counterclockwise rotation was also associated with increased joint symptoms. All symptoms declined over the 2-year follow-up period. Conclusions: Counterclockwise rotation of the mandible is related to a slight increase in muscle symptoms after BSSO. The combination of counterclockwise rotation with long advancement also might increase joint signs and symptoms. All symptomatology tended to decline over time, suggesting that the amount of advancement and mandibular rotation should not be considered as risk factors for the development of TMD in patients without preexisting conditions.

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.ajodo.2007.10.033

A total of 148 articles were considered for this overview and, although methodological troubles were common, this review identified relevant findings which the practitioner can take into consideration during treatment planning: 1- Surgery was unable to influence TMJ with preexisting displaced disc and crepitus; 2- Clicking and arthralgia were not predictable after surgery, although there was greater likelihood of improvement rather than deterioration; 3- The amount of mandibular advancement and counterclockwise rotation, and the rigidity of the fixation technique seemed to influence TMJ position and health; 4- The risk of CR increased, especially in identified high-risk cases.

DOI: 10.1590/1678-775720130056


Studies seem to slightly contradict, but I wouldn't take the risk tbh

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Holy shit that's insane that so many surgereon got bad results while beiing legendary here. That make me wonder, is it so easy to fuck surgery up or are they taking that much risk. If those surgeon you called got a few bad cases, it makes me wonder how the average surgeon botched results are.
@mamacookoil

Hard to say. I have to be fair with Zarrinbal here, he does SO MANY surgeries on INCELS and I've heard of only 1 bad case so far, so Zarrinbal seems to be really good.

The guy got a 4mm overimpaction of the maxilla so he didn't show teeth when smiling and almost couldn't breath through his nose anymore. But apart from that, I only heard of 1 case that was asymmetrical after a chin wing but this is an acceptable mistake.


And yeah I don't even want to imagine the sort of fuck ups some no name surgeons have. Must be terrifying.

 

[Chadakin]

Did you make a thread about it?

Nah, it's been a sore subject. I'm hopeful this last revision I'm currently healing from can restore my old face and I can move on and forget about the last year of my life being wasted.

Can you elaborate more on your case. What surgery did you have, why , tell me more about the revision and if you feel comfortable to say, what surgery did you have? Would you say its worth to get surgery or is to too much risk in hindsight?

It wasn't a bone procedure or anything like that, it was a canthoplasty and lower lid retraction, which produced a very uncanny and unnatural result. Doctor gaslights and says it's good despite refunding me part of the procedure price because he knows it looked like shit, had to go to 3 more doctors to finally get the full extent of the damage undone.

I guess it's a good thing to go through situations like this as you can properly evaluate the risk/benefit of additional procedures. I was planning bimax but given I'm a borderline case and that there are so many horrific results and complications from it, I think I will pass given my prior experiences being botched and look into something less invasive like a chin wing and side wing.

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Nah, it's been a sore subject. I'm hopeful this last revision I'm currently healing from can restore my old face and I can move on and forget about the last year of my life being wasted.


It wasn't a bone procedure or anything like that, it was a canthoplasty and lower lid retraction, which produced a very uncanny and unnatural result. Doctor gaslights and says it's good, had to go to 3 more doctors to finally get the full extent of the damage undone. I guess it's a good thing to go through situations like this as you can properly evaluate the risk/benefit of additional procedures. I was planning bimax but given I'm a borderline case and that there are so many horrific results and complications from it, I think I will pass given my prior experiences being botched.

I'm really not trying to advertise Obwegeser here but I think if you want a SUPER SAFE bimax, he is THE MAN himself.

Dude does lefort3 apparently

 

[Chadakin]

I'm really not trying to advertise Obwegeser here but I think if you want a SUPER SAFE bimax, he is THE MAN himself.

Dude does lefort3 apparently

Yeah idk, my profile is already pretty good (because I got a genioplasty), and my maxilla isn't really recessed so I don't think I'd benefit much from bimax. I was looking more forward to the illusion of width a BSSO can add to the jawline when the mandible is moved forward. My main aesthetic concern rn is my jaw looking narrow from the front, but hopefully with a side wing and chin wing this can be corrected.

 

[Pumanator]

Nah, it's been a sore subject. I'm hopeful this last revision I'm currently healing from can restore my old face and I can move on and forget about the last year of my life being wasted.


It wasn't a bone procedure or anything like that, it was a canthoplasty and lower lid retraction, which produced a very uncanny and unnatural result. Doctor gaslights and says it's good despite refunding me part of the procedure price because he knows it looked like shit, had to go to 3 more doctors to finally get the full extent of the damage undone.

I guess it's a good thing to go through situations like this as you can properly evaluate the risk/benefit of additional procedures. I was planning bimax but given I'm a borderline case and that there are so many horrific results and complications from it, I think I will pass given my prior experiences being botched and look into something less invasive like a chin wing and side wing.

Yeah eye surgery as a male is the most risky surgery there is and I haven't seen many good results unless the eye area was really bad and had really bad nct, needed undereye implant badly or orbital decompression. Most time the eye area posted here is average, or slightly below so surgery isn't needed. I have seen jaw transformation from below average or average to Chad so jaw is safer to do. Was your baseline for eye area that bad or did you try to go from (below) average to Chad?

 

[coolguy1]

There are many botched cases. I got botched a while back by a very well regarded surgeon on here and it's taken 14 months and 4 revisions so far to try to undo the damage.

4 revisions brooo make a thread about it

 

[Jason Voorhees]

Do u mind pming me more info on the side wing osteotomy. There are no good articles available online

 

[Chadakin]

Yeah eye surgery as a male is the most risky surgery there is and I haven't seen many good results unless the eye area was really bad and had really bad nct, needed undereye implant badly or orbital decompression. Most time the eye area posted here is average, or slightly below so surgery isn't needed. I have seen jaw transformation from below average or average to Chad so jaw is safer to do. Was your baseline for eye area that bad or did you try to go from (below) average to Chad?

Yeah, my eye shape wasn't bad, I just had lack of bony support in my under eyes and fell for the striking eyes meme.

 

[Chadakin]

4 revisions brooo make a thread about it

Nahh, it's not really interesting, 1st revision doctor was a retard and did nothing really, 2nd one did a good job but it still wasn't 100% right (asymmetry) and now the last one has gotten it at least 85% back to normal so far, but it's still healing.

 

[Acromegaly_Chad]

Do u mind pming me more info on the side wing osteotomy. There are no good articles available online

Very similar to the chin wing, but the cut usually starts BEHIND the foramen mentale and goes all the way back to the jaw angle

 

[Jason Voorhees]

Very similar to the chin wing, but the cut usually starts BEHIND the foramen mentale and goes all the way back to the jaw angle

I see and why is it better than a chin wing?