Upper eyelid exposure - round 2 - UEE 1 ME 0

[Foreverbrad]

So the forehead Botox thing didn’t give me a good result - I’ve still unacceptably large UEE.
I am squinching my lower eyelid in the photos.



I already know I need a bimax, down graft genio, and midface implants with a saddle for the lower orbital rim.

Based on these photos, for the supra orbital area do I need to focus on hard tissue augmentation (implants, high viscosity fillers) or soft tissue augmentation (fat grafts, low viscosity fillers)?

Do I need to do anything about my lateral orbital rims while I’m addressing the area?

 

[FBl]

what eye colour is that?

 

[Foreverbrad]

what eye colour is that?

D30 or A30 maybe. Doesn’t match the chart well and tends to change a lot with lighting.

 

[12PSLsubhuman]

So the forehead Botox thing didn’t give me a good result - I’ve still unacceptably large UEE.
I am squinching my lower eyelid in the photos.



I already know I need a bimax, down graft genio, and midface implants with a saddle for the lower orbital rim.

Based on these photos, for the supra orbital area do I need to focus on hard tissue augmentation (implants, high viscosity fillers) or soft tissue augmentation (fat grafts, low viscosity fillers)?

Do I need to do anything about my lateral orbital rims while I’m addressing the area?

I don't think urs is bad enough to get Supra implants tbh. U have protruding supras. Try uee filler and if u like it do fat graft

 

[Foreverbrad]

I don't think urs is bad enough to get Supra implants tbh. U have protruding supras. Try uee filler and if u like it do fat graft

Do you think my supras are a weird shape viewed from the front? Looks like an M. Most people seem to have a straight brow ridge.

I had massive troubles finding anyone who would do UEE filler, the doctor who did my Botox said it was a dangerous area due to high number of nerves and blood vessels.

Still haven’t found anyone who will agree to do it.

The other option is to just leave it alone as a “feminine” feature that will balance the dimorphism I’ll get from the other surgeries.

 

[VenatorLuparius]

A good eye area is really a combination of both bones and fat.

You have a pretty good browridge and supras but you are certainly cucked by the fat in this area that gives you bug eyes.

Only fat graft can save your case.

 

[St.TikTokcel]

So the forehead Botox thing didn’t give me a good result - I’ve still unacceptably large UEE.
I am squinching my lower eyelid in the photos.



I already know I need a bimax, down graft genio, and midface implants with a saddle for the lower orbital rim.

Based on these photos, for the supra orbital area do I need to focus on hard tissue augmentation (implants, high viscosity fillers) or soft tissue augmentation (fat grafts, low viscosity fillers)?

Do I need to do anything about my lateral orbital rims while I’m addressing the area?

PCT mogger

 

[Foreverbrad]

A good eye area is really a combination of both bones and fat.

You have a pretty good browridge and supras but you are certainly cucked by the fat in this area that gives you bug eyes.

Only fat graft can save your case.

My orbitals are not vertically compact which is why I was thinking some kind of supra implant with primarily vertical rather than horizontal projection.

I need to assess the relative risks for fat grafting and fillers in the supraorbital region as they seem to provide similar outcome. Fat grafting seems to have more frequent and dangerous complications but filler has to be done repeatedly, so you roll dice every time.

Fat Embolism After Autologous Facial Fat Grafting

AbstractBackground. Autologous facial fat grafting has gained popularity in recent years and is considered to be safe. This paper presents the case of a patient

academic.oup.com

Yikes.

 

[nissan]

ur almost a wizard

 

[kingofkings]

I think you should prioritize eye surgeries over jaw surgery. You've fallen for the meme here that bimax is the answer to everything

In positive news though you have great hair genetics

 

[Foreverbrad]

I think you should prioritize eye surgeries over jaw surgery. You've fallen for the meme here that bimax is the answer to everything

In positive news though you have great hair genetics

I do need (tri)max, I’ve not fallen for any memes. You can see in image below without my beard that there’s aesthetic issues - what you can’t see is that my airway is only about 3-5mm wide at the back of the soft palate, which is only going to get worse with aging.

The reason I prioritised the trimax is that it’s an annoying as fuck process with orthodontics and an insane recovery period whereas eye area surgeries I can basically get at any time.

.

I had already planned saddled infras for scleral show reduction and then either fat grafts or filler to fill the UEE. Are there other eye surgeries you think I need?

I am not getting orbital decompression or supraorbital implants or orbital box osteotomy. These are too risky.

 

[kingofkings]

I do need (tri)max, I’ve not fallen for any memes. You can see in image below without my beard that there’s aesthetic issues - what you can’t see is that my airway is only about 3-5mm wide at the back of the soft palate, which is only going to get worse with aging.

. View attachment 4012142

I had already planned saddled infras for scleral show reduction and then either fat grafts or filler to fill the UEE. Are there other eye surgeries you think I need?

I am not getting orbital decompression or supraorbital implants or orbital box osteotomy. These are too risky.

What I'm trying to say is fixing your eye area should be your number 1 priority imo, aesthetically it's a much bigger flaw than your jaws. With the beard it masks the jaws anyway. I'm not saying jaw surgery has no aesthetic benefit.

Rather than waiting a long time for jaw surgery, if I was you I'd immediately start fixing up your eye area, even if it means delaying the jaw surgery. I think this is a more efficient use of your time and money. Plus you can fraud with your beard in the meantime anyway.

It's not just the UEE, your eyes also look cross-eyed and you seem to have quite noticeable vertical orbital dystopia. You also say you're squinching your lower lids and mention scleral show reduction.

I don't know a lot about eye surgeries compared to some here but I would say you don't look like you'd be a good candidate for orbital decompression anyway as your eyes don't look bulgy at all. I'd also rate supras as being a low ROI surgery. However I don't know how effective infras are at actually reducing scleral show and you might need an additional surgery for that. Fat grafts are a must.

Another positive is you have a pleasing eye shape.

Anyway just me trying to help

 

[Foreverbrad]

What I'm trying to say is fixing your eye area should be your number 1 priority imo, aesthetically it's a much bigger flaw than your jaws. With the beard it masks the jaws anyway. I'm not saying jaw surgery has no aesthetic benefit.

You are right but I will explain further down.

Rather than waiting a long time for jaw surgery, if I was you I'd immediately start fixing up your eye area, even if it means delaying the jaw surgery. I think this is a more efficient use of your time and money. Plus you can fraud with your beard in the meantime anyway.

I already committed to jaw surgery braces a year ago. At 31 there is no real time pressure. I will have my eye area surgeries during the postoperative braces period so overall shouldn’t impact the timeline. I am content to be volcel for the moment. I did consider getting temporary fillers for eye area but I would rather just save money for after my full ascension.

It's not just the UEE, your eyes also look cross-eyed and you seem to have quite noticeable vertical orbital dystopia. You also say you're squinching your lower lids and mention scleral show reduction.

I think just cross eyed from looking at camera too close.

The vertical orbital dystopia is a good spot, but is not real. My nose (and whole maxilla) is actually twisted by around 3 degrees around a point originating at the nasion. If I keep my nose vertical, my eyes end up at different heights. This influences my mandible position too.

Hoping this will be mostly resolved by moving the lefort-1 segment sideways a bit. If not, rhinoplasty.

I don't know a lot about eye surgeries compared to some here but I would say you don't look like you'd be a good candidate for orbital decompression anyway as your eyes don't look bulgy at all. I'd also rate supras as being a low ROI surgery. However I don't know how effective infras are at actually reducing scleral show and you might need an additional surgery for that. Fat grafts are a must.

It’s why I’m planning on fat grafting after my trimax+infras - so that if the infras are not sufficient on their own additional fat grafting could be applied. If that’s still not enough, I will evaluate options at that point.

Another positive is you have a pleasing eye shape.

Yes, the shape and colour are ideal, I need to sort the orbits and I will have mogger eyes.

Anyway just me trying to help

Thank you!

 

[Foreverbrad]

MIt's not just the UEE, your eyes also look cross-eyed and you seem to have quite noticeable vertical orbital dystopia.

This is the asymmetry at a skeletal level, do you think it’s cope to think the standard lefort cut (red line) and a sideways movement to bring it across to the true centre could leave me with anything except a twisted nose needing rhinoplasty?

 

[Arzenic]

So the forehead Botox thing didn’t give me a good result - I’ve still unacceptably large UEE.
I am squinching my lower eyelid in the photos.



I already know I need a bimax, down graft genio, and midface implants with a saddle for the lower orbital rim.

Based on these photos, for the supra orbital area do I need to focus on hard tissue augmentation (implants, high viscosity fillers) or soft tissue augmentation (fat grafts, low viscosity fillers)?

Do I need to do anything about my lateral orbital rims while I’m addressing the area?

based on your photos you should softmaxx before hardmaxxing

 

[kingofkings]

View attachment 4015881

This is the asymmetry at a skeletal level, do you think it’s cope to think the standard lefort cut (red line) and a sideways movement to bring it across to the true centre could leave me with anything except a twisted nose needing rhinoplasty?

The skeletal orbitals don't look noticeably asymmetric to me. They look perfectly horizontally aligned. Pretty interesting because in your photo the vertical orbital dystopia jumps out at you. Is the issue present in other photos? If yeah then I'm guessing it's a soft tissue problem.

That said, just consult with a top eye surgeon and you'll get real advice. I'm actually interested in what they will tell you.

This is how I rate your problems from biggest to smallest

1. Eyes
2. Bad malar fat pad distribution
3. Long mid face
4. Jaw

 

[Foreverbrad]

The skeletal orbitals don't look noticeably asymmetric to me. They look perfectly horizontally aligned. Pretty interesting because in your photo the vertical orbital dystopia jumps out at you. Is the issue present in other photos? If yeah then I'm guessing it's a soft tissue problem.

If you were to turn the image so that the light blue line, which is the centreline of my nose and maxilla, is vertical, the orbits end up at noticeably different heights. My head is turned this way in the original photo.

My orbits, zygos, temples, nose bridge align nicely.
My maxilla is twisted to one side.
My mandible moves on the TMJ to match the maxilla defect (otherwise I’d have crossbite.

I am thinking about just going to Giant for Lefort-II which could just re-align the entire defective maxilla piece to true vertical…