What is the reason rap COMPLETELY took over rock. Not just in 1990 but 2010.

[güss]

Your whole argument is calling me a barking dog buddy.
I asked for a list, you dodged and asked the same, I did it and you didn't
You admitted to be wrong about crust with a shitty half assed excuse (I don't care) while trying to act like an expert
You went into trolling mode after getting brutally humiliated
And since trolling mode includes always wanting the last word (which is usually done random ad hominem) ill give it to ya

Remember next time don't bring objective points to a subjective discussion, if someone talks about which man looks better and someone says that 5'6" is a good height because it's average height in the west he's gone get clowned like you

imagine if you spent more time trying to actually refute what I said than listing whatever it is you typed.

better luck next time, lad.

 

[Racky]

Rap "styles" are all the same in every meaningful sense. There is no musical intricacy or depth to any of it. There is no education or learning to it, it is just pure instinct, like a toddler banging blocks together.* It is the quintessence of low-IQ music. I'm not in love with traditional rock music, but rock musicians are actual musicians. There is a reason that many rappers have "borrowed" pieces of rock and pop songs, but rock and pop musicians never try to borrow the shitty electronic beats that rappers use. Rap is just shallow, simple, disposable music.

*Don't even try to deny this. I have seen people try their hand at rapping. They just do it, like speaking. It's not anything like picking up an instrument and actually learning about real music.

This argument is annoying.
Yes people can instinctively try their hand at rapping, because rapping is done with the voice and we are used to using our voices.
However, that doesn't mean they will be GOOD at rapping.

"Anyone" can sing too, because singing uses the voice and everyone is used to using his voice, but that doesn't mean they will be GOOD at singing. There are a lot of both glaring and subtle things that come into making singing actually good singing, and same with rapping.

Anything that uses the voice in music will be more instinctive than an instrument simply because as humans we are already used to using our voices in kind of a musical way, often varying our cadence when talking and changing our pitch etc... while an instrument isn't as natural. But that doesn't mean that any vocal form of art can be dismissed as "easy" and "simple" for that reason, nor does it mean that it can't be practiced and refined.

Oh an "anyone" can "dance", but there is obviously a difference in skills and abilities between a professional dancer and an average person. muh instinctive. And the practice is what makes the professional dancer "good" and "interesting". Many forms of dancing are not learned in professional institutions or academia and typically people learn them through individual practice and figuring things out themselves, but that does not mean "there is no learning to it" and it's "just pure instinct"

You have disordered thinking. You don't understand the difference in things that define individual rappers and subgenres, and things that define rap as a whole.

The very things that make rap rap are inherently anti-musical. I am not saying that rap is not music. Obviously it is music, as a category. It just fails to express nearly everything that music is capable of expressing. It doesn't just happen to be shallow, its shallowness is and always has been the appeal of it.

What does "anti-musical" even mean lol?
If rap(rap referring to vocals) is inherently anti-musical then what rap is, outside of what rappers do or what the culture surrounding rap encourages, is anti-musical.
Which is not the case.
Rap can be very simply thoughts as the vocal equivalent of drumming with rhymes.
How is that "anti-musical"?

Let's have a thought experiment to test if rap is "inherently anti-musical".
There is a tradition in India called "Konnakol" where you basically voice drum sounds with your mouth, while clapping the meter with your hands

Now let's imagine we have this exact konnakol performance, but instead of percussion syllables, we have words that rhyme or have matching sounds. Let's assume for the sake of argument that we end up with lyrics that make some sense. Hummm what would that be considered? Rapping.

Would that be "inherently anti-musical"?
If you respond "yes" then the konnakol would inherently be anti-musical too, and then tabla drumming it's derived from would inherently be anti-musical too.
Can you stand behind such claims?

If a rapper plays an instrument, it is inherently irrelevant to his rap.

That's not true at all.
For example many rappers who play drums have spoken about how their experience with drums influenced their rapping and contributed to their skills

Some examples I found on Google Books :

You have to think about what you are actually saying.
Saying "If a rapper plays an instrument, it is inherently irrelevant to his rap" is not so different from saying "If a singer plays an instrument, it is inherently irrelevant to his singing". When in reality a rapper's rapping can learn a lot from experience with instrument just like a singer's singing can learn a lot from his experience with instruments. Your use of the word "inherently" is not helping your argument. If instead you said that it's not common or not really part of the culture it would make more sense although still quite irrelevant.

Rap is not about skill or discipline or education, it is about "keeping it real" and living in the moment. See the asterisk comment on my first response to you.

You have no say in what rap is about, and what a rapper purports to achieve with his rap regards no one but himself.
What you are saying might be true for many rappers but it's not for all of them nor is it an "inherent" issue.
There is a difference between what the culture surrounding popular rap may encourage, and what rap "inherently" is or can be.

 

[Deleted member 19944]

Jews

Explain lol

 

[Deleted member 19944]

bump

 

[Deleted member 13710]

I've responded to your points below, but I can summarize your position like this: You do not understand rap as an actual style of music with specific characteristics, and instead, you are just treating it as some big amorphous thing that could mean anything. That's why you have all these pointles "wElL aCkShUalLy" responses to me pointing out the most basic traits about rap.

its shallowness is and always has been the appeal of it? is that why the greatest selling rappers illustrated vivid scenes in their lyrics, taking from personal experiences? you’re just being lazy at this point. nearly all the information in the world is at your fingertips, yet you choose to remain ignorant. that’s sad.

What if I told you...

...that personal experiences are not necessarily deep?

Would that blow your mind?

What if I told you that the shallowest artists tend to be the ones who are obsessed with their own personal experiences?

Could you handle that?

anyways, "everything that music is capable of expressing" is vague (you seem to like speaking in vagueness, probably because of your lack of deeper understanding of what you’re talking about) but, i’ll assume you’re referring to emotions in music. there are rap songs about sadness, joy, triumph, hope, anger, and everything in between. so, how does it fail to express everything music is capable of expressing?

You are making this assumption because you are trying to argue a musical topic but don't actually know anything about music. I'm talking about music, not emotions. Chord progressions, scale modulation, the modes of the major scale, the use of the leading tone in the harmonic minor scale, tempo changes, alternative time signatures, harmonies, dissonance, I could go on. These are things that real musicians learn, which have no use in rap. Rap is just a beat with some mumbling on top.

rap is about skill, hence why just not anyone can do it without practice.

This is just a blatant lie. You can rap without practice. Plenty of people do it. People who want to rap don't look for a "RAP FOR BEGINNERS" textbook, they don't seek a professional teacher, they just pick up a microphone and do it. The contrast I am making is with playing instruments. You cannot just pick up a violin and play Vivaldi, period. No matter how gifted you are, you cannot do it without extensive learning and practice. It's not a matter of doing it well vs. doing it poorly, it's a matter of whether you can do it at all.

and yeah, some get them from studios. i’m sorry, are they supposed to synthesize them from thin air? is that the proper way to do it?

It's not "some" that get music from studios. It is the norm for rappers to get their music from studios. I'm sure a handful of obscure rappers will program their own beats, but the majority have always just taken music from other people.

"is that the proper way to do it?"

Do I honestly have to answer this question? Even for you, a person who clearly doesn't know anything about music, this strikes me as an obtuse question.

The "proper way" is to make your own music. To make your own "art" rather than taking it from a nameless studio guy and making millions off it. That is what makes you a musician. Get it?

your argument is weak here. it is not difficult to play a single note, unless you’re genuinely retarded. anyone can do it. just as anyone can string together a basic rap.

This is an assumption you're making out of ignorance, which is incorrect. No, "anyone" cannot play a not on the violin, much less play it in a musical way (with decent sustain and control over dynamics). On the other hand, everyone has a voice. Everyone knows how to use their voice, so they can rap.

I'll make it simpler for you: Learning to sing is dramatically easier than learning to play an instrument. Rap music is not even singing: By definition, it is more or less monotonal, more of a speaking-style than a dynamic range. Don't even try to deny this.

how about you step up your intellectual efforts, kid? alternatively, you can just concede that rap has musical depth and intricacy, and that it is in fact high IQ music.

>rap
>high IQ music



"On the other extreme, as suspected, preference for rap music is significantly negatively correlated with intelligence."

Study

 

[Meteor21]

Personally, rock is generally not fast paced or aggressive enough for me. Rock ironically lacks energy and a good hook.

Metal is but it's generally cringe unharmonious ear rape, also repetitive.

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Let's have a thought experiment to test if rap is "inherently anti-musical".
There is a tradition in India called "Konnakol" where you basically voice drum sounds with your mouth, while clapping the meter with your hands

Now let's imagine we have this exact konnakol performance, but instead of percussion syllables, we have words that rhyme or have matching sounds. Let's assume for the sake of argument that we end up with lyrics that make some sense. Hummm what would that be considered? Rapping.

Would that be "inherently anti-musical"?
If you respond "yes" then the konnakol would inherently be anti-musical too, and then tabla drumming it's derived from would inherently be anti-musical too.
Can you stand behind such claims?

What is the point of this argument? I do not have any opinion on "konnakol," it is an exotic practice from a foreign civilization. I don't know anything about the role this plays in their society, the subject matter of their songs, etc. Making some kind of judgment on whether it's "musical" or not is irrelevant to my comments on rap, which is a style of music from my own society that I grew up with.

For example many rappers who play drums have spoken about how their experience with drums influenced their rapping and contributed to their skills

Some examples I found on Google Books :
View attachment 1871130
View attachment 1871131

Drums are the least musical instrument you could play. Drums incorporate rhythm, but not any of the other concepts within music. Drums, like vocals, are the only instrument you can play in a completely intuitive way, without any actual learning or practice. I've seen numerous guys who have never played drums get on a drum set and immediately start drumming in basic patterns. This actually supports the point I was trying to make perfectly.

You have no say in what rap is about, and what a rapper purports to achieve with his rap regards no one but himself.
What you are saying might be true for many rappers but it's not for all of them nor is it an "inherent" issue.
There is a difference between what the culture surrounding popular rap may encourage, and what rap "inherently" is or can be.

This just a NAXALT argument.

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Personally, rock is generally not fast paced or aggressive enough for me. Rock ironically lacks energy and a good hook.

Metal is but it's generally cringe unharmonious ear rape, also repetitive.

So what do you listen to?

 

[Deleted member 21597]

Jew record companies promoted the shit out of it. If you make music degenerate, the young kids who listen to it will start acting that way.

 

[Deleted member 19576]

Rap dies also if its stick to mumbble shit forever. The rock died with kurt cobain. After that. There has not been real innovations.

 

[Meteor21]

So what do you listen to?

Vaporwave kinda genres, a lot of video game music, etc

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Vaporwave kinda genres, a lot of video game music, etc

That's a lot more dorky that heavy metal.

 

[Meteor21]

That's a lot more dorky that heavy metal.

Heavy metal is hella autistic, and metal heads are sensitive little bitches with depression

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Heavy metal is hella autistic, and metal heads are sensitive little bitches with depression

You know what they say about internet tough guys?

 

[Meteor21]

You know what they say about internet tough guys?

Lol keep coping, there's data on this

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Lol keep coping, there's data on this

What are the chances that a chad is on this forum with this avatar?



You sound like every high school loser who joined the "manosphere" and now wants to imitate the kids who used to bully him.

 

[Meteor21]

What are the chances that a chad is on this forum with this avatar?

View attachment 1891568

You sound like every high school loser who joined the "manosphere" and now wants to imitate the kids who used to bully him.

You're having a tantrum cause I said metal heads are autistic and sensitive (which they are) after you called my taste in music dorky. Get off this forum, you clearly can't handle it

 

[Deleted member 13710]

You're having a tantrum cause I said metal heads are autistic and sensitive (which they are) after you called my taste in music dorky. Get off this forum, you clearly can't handle it

You listen to video game soundtracks, you have an anime avatar, and you're trying to dunk on people who can tie their own shoes. Do you actually need me to explain why your original comment was stupid, or could you just quietly find a stick to play with instead of derailing this thread?

 

[Meteor21]

You listen to video game soundtracks, you have an anime avatar, and you're trying to dunk on people who can tie their own shoes. Do you actually need me to explain why your original comment was stupid, or could you just quietly find a stick to play with instead of derailing this thread?

I don't base my whole identity on the music I like, unlike you. Are you going to fucking kill yourself right now? You asked me what I like, get a fucking grip

 

[Deleted member 13710]

I don't base my whole identity on the music I like, unlike you.

You have no basis for saying anything about my "whole identity." If you're going to talk trash like this, you can't just make irrelevant shit up.

I got curious because you said something stupid. Are you aware of what that was?

 

[Meteor21]

You have no basis for saying anything about my "whole identity." If you're going to talk trash like this, you can't just make irrelevant shit up.

I got curious because you said something stupid. Are you aware of what that was?

I said something that upset you, and you are proving everything I said about metalheads, you exemplify it

 

[Deleted member 13710]

I said something that upset you, and you are proving everything I said about metalheads, you exemplify it

What if I told you...


...I'm not a metalhead?



Would you be able to reread the conversation and figure it out?

 

[Meteor21]

What if I told you...


...I'm not a metalhead?

View attachment 1891598

Would you be able to reread the conversation and figure it out?

Congrats, then you're even dumber than I thought

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Congrats, then you're even dumber than I thought

You just had to respond, didn't you? You had to feel like you were in control by responding.

 

[Meteor21]

You just had to respond, didn't you? You had to feel like you were in control by responding.

I control your emotions

 

[Deleted member 13710]

I control your emotions

Is it true that you have a character called Black Sperm as your avatar? Is that some weird Freudian shit or do you just like the dorky character design?

 

[Meteor21]

Is it true that you have a character called Black Sperm as your avatar? Is that some weird Freudian shit or do you just like the dorky character design?

No

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

In the United States, young people are more minority-heavy than previous generations. White people were always the main audience for rock music. That partially explains it.

I think I read a statistic that on Spotify, the share of people listening to rock and heavy metal music has stayed the same for years and years, but despite that, the mainstream refuses to promote new rock and metal music. I don't think this is just market forces at work. I think (((producers))) basically murdered the emo/scene subculture in particular.

Rock used to be a black genre as well but blacks moved on and found one much better its common sense. Black I vented rock and abandoned it cos it was shit @Cynic4life

 

[Racky]

What is the point of this argument?

Your argument on "inherent nature".
Which does not depend on any cultural context as already explained.

Drums are the least musical instrument you could play.

JFL

Drums incorporate rhythm, but not any of the other concepts within music.

Drums are mostly used for rhythm in popular Western music but using them for other "concepts within music" isn't impossible(see drum chimes found in parts of Africa and SEA). And that does not make them "less musical", that is just something you have arbitrarily decided yourself that is irrelevant to artists. Ambient or drone music that is lacking in rhythm isn't any less music either because it focuses less on rhythm.

Drums, like vocals, are the only instrument you can play in a completely intuitive way, without any actual learning or practice. I've seen numerous guys who have never played drums get on a drum set and immediately start drumming in basic patterns. This actually supports the point I was trying to make perfectly.

This does not support your point and is irrelevant. Something being more intuitive and something being "more musical" are two very unrelated things. And just because something can be picked up intuitively at first more easily, does not mean that it is easier to become high level or proficient at.
It's more about something already being familiar because of its use in everyday bodily function
The reason singing with your voice is more intuitive (at first) than a piano is because we are already familiar with using our vocal cords to produce different pitches. While producing sounds by touching with your fingers a bunch of white & black keys is not familiar compared to your own vocal cords.
The reason "drums" could be more intuitive is because we are already used to moving our body at different paces. But that's irreleveant, and in both cases that does not mean someone is going to be GOOD at either. You need practice to truly be good. Most people who sing or do drums for the first time are mediocre without practice.

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Rock used to be a black genre as well but blacks moved on and found one much better its common sense. Black I vented rock and abandoned it cos it was shit @Cynic4life

Unsubstantiated opinion.

It is kind of sad that American blacks, who are responsible for creating so many different kinds of music, now seem to listen overwhelmingly to rap and hip-hop, and maybe a bit of R&B (nothing wrong with R&B musically, but it seems to be less popular). What happened to jazz, soul, etc. All of those genres were much more musical than rap.

Your argument on "inherent nature".
Which does not depend on any cultural context as already explained.

What I meant by "inherent nature" is the defining traits of rap music. Guys like @güss like to argue that rap could be anything, as if he doesn't know anything about rap music and its culture, and just hides behind meaningless, vague statements. I don't know anything about the culture of "konnakol," what it's supposed to achieve, what variation exists within that type of music, and so on. I'm not particularly interested, either. If konnakol is or isn't "less musical" than other forms of music, that does nothing to absolve rap of the criticisms I've leveled against it.

JFL

Drums are mostly used for rhythm in popular Western music but using them for other "concepts within music" isn't impossible(see drum chimes found in parts of Africa and SEA). And that does not make them "less musical", that is just something you have arbitrarily decided yourself that is irrelevant to artists. Ambient or drone music that is lacking in rhythm isn't any less music either because it focuses less on rhythm.

Chimes are not drums. You are getting the category (percussion) mixed up with the particular thing (drums) we're discussing.

Drums are less musical because most of the concepts associated with music, especially the most technical and difficult concepts, don't apply to drums. There are no melodies, harmonies, chord progressions, tonal and atonal sounds, or modulation associated with drums. Those are central concepts for instruments that actually need to be tuned.

This does not support your point and is irrelevant. Something being more intuitive and something being "more musical" are two very unrelated things. And just because something can be picked up intuitively at first more easily, does not mean that it is easier to become high level or proficient at.
It's more about something already being familiar because of its use in everyday bodily function

You're taking my statement out of context. I don't mean that more skill always means something is "more musical." I'm talking about the attitude of rap music and its fans. It is not a genre that emphasizes things like skill and virtuosity, it's about "keeping it real." For rap fans, if it feels good, it is good. My experience with rap fans is that to be analytical about music in any way is irritating to them. It's 100% feels. They hate creativity and that dreamy, imaginative type of mindset that all great artists have. Rap is obsessed with the mundane, from materialism to sex to social issues, obsessed with the "here and now" rather than things with a broader and more universal significance. This has always been considered the hallmark of low-quality art.

It's more about something already being familiar because of its use in everyday bodily function
The reason singing with your voice is more intuitive (at first) than a piano is because we are already familiar with using our vocal cords to produce different pitches. While producing sounds by touching with your fingers a bunch of white & black keys is not familiar compared to your own vocal cords.

Singing can be musical, regardless of the fact that it is much easier than learning an instrument. Yet, that difficulty of learning an instrument is also valuable, and ends up producing much higher-quality artists. The humility and openness you get from starting an instrument, not being able to do anything on it, and learning--truly learning, not trying to intuitively or instinctually play something--is what can create a paradigm shift in a person's sense of music.

 

[Deleted member 13710]

No

Excuse me, "Platinum Sperm"

Platinum Sperm

This article is about Platinum Sperm. Not to be confused with Black Sperm and Golden Sperm. Platinum Sperm (白プラテ金ィナム精せい子し, Puratinamu Seishi; Viz: Platinum Spermatozoon) is the ultimate fusion of Black Sperm,[2] and a member of the Monster Association. He was killed by Garou. Platinum Sperm is a...

onepunchman.fandom.com

Please tell me about your interest in Mr. Platinum Sperm...

 

[Deleted member 21052]

typical .org autism turning everything into a essay paragraph battle LMAO.

tldr rap is trash and people are retarded

 

[Deleted member 21620]

You're having a tantrum cause I said metal heads are autistic and sensitive (which they are) after you called my taste in music dorky. Get off this forum, you clearly can't handle it

being a metal fan is pretty non nt nowadays but nothing wrong with listening to it. not everyone is meant to be nt.

yeah but why did rap become so appealing that people would never pursue rock?

probably because you have so many ugly nonwhties in it you can be an average white and get into it.

Most rockstars are so white circle based you NEED to be in the elite white osmosis.

the elite people also control the record labels that publish rap music. they all have to do some weird shit to get famous

 

[Deleted member 21620]

In the United States, young people are more minority-heavy than previous generations. White people were always the main audience for rock music. That partially explains it.

yup

 

[Deleted member 21620]

gen z in the united states is basically half nonwhite. and gen z has a surplus of young males. many of them are nonwhite young males. so they probably like listening to rap music where many of the rappers are nonwhite or act nonwhite. they also like to larp as the rappers they listen to. listening to other rappers rapping about getting laid with fat single moms and shooting people is like some sort of power fantasy for zoomers. and an escape from their depressing sausage fest reality. and another reason is that we all know that the jew music industry like promoting degenerate music like rap and technically old rock. dont forget current "woke" people in power (jews, self hating whites) shaming "white culture" (includes all the jew artists larping as white) due to that blm woke leftist shit.

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Excuse me, "Platinum Sperm"

Platinum Sperm

This article is about Platinum Sperm. Not to be confused with Black Sperm and Golden Sperm. Platinum Sperm (白プラテ金ィナム精せい子し, Puratinamu Seishi; Viz: Platinum Spermatozoon) is the ultimate fusion of Black Sperm,[2] and a member of the Monster Association. He was killed by Garou. Platinum Sperm is a...

onepunchman.fandom.com

Please tell me about your interest in Mr. Platinum Sperm...

Platinum sperm is a mogger beyond moggers stronger than all S class hero’s I’m sure @Username Required agrees

 

[Deleted member 13710]

gen z in the united states is basically half nonwhite. and gen z has a surplus of young males. many of them are nonwhite young males. so they probably like listening to rap music where many of the rappers are nonwhite or act nonwhite.

So is it all demographic, or have preferences changed within races? I'm not sure TBH, but it seems to me like almost every zoomer likes rap. The Hispanic and Asian populations are higher in Gen Z, do they like rap?

 

[Deleted member 21620]

The Hispanic and Asian populations are higher in Gen Z, do they like rap?

they do @Cheesyrumble

 

[Cheesyrumble]

they do @Cheesyrumble

Asians probably like rap the least in america

 

[Deleted member 21620]

Asians probably like rap the least in america

you sure? maybe not the low iq braindead drill rappers. but maybe the rap music made for sneakerheadcel copers like kanye. maybe its a good thing they're not listening to rap.

 

[Meteor21]

Excuse me, "Platinum Sperm"

Platinum Sperm

This article is about Platinum Sperm. Not to be confused with Black Sperm and Golden Sperm. Platinum Sperm (白プラテ金ィナム精せい子し, Puratinamu Seishi; Viz: Platinum Spermatozoon) is the ultimate fusion of Black Sperm,[2] and a member of the Monster Association. He was killed by Garou. Platinum Sperm is a...

onepunchman.fandom.com

Please tell me about your interest in Mr. Platinum Sperm...

He is the goat, the ultimate chad

 

[Meteor21]

being a metal fan is pretty non nt nowadays but nothing wrong with listening to it. not everyone is meant to be nt.

the elite people also control the record labels that publish rap music. they all have to do some weird shit to get famous

Idc, I listen to some of it. But full on metalheads tend to be cringelords

 

[Deleted member 21620]

Idc, I listen to some of it. But full on metalheads tend to be cringelords

yeah i meant the full on metalheads are non nt. the balding long hair bearded 32 year olds

 

[Deleted member 21620]

So is it all demographic, or have preferences changed within races? I'm not sure TBH, but it seems to me like almost every zoomer likes rap.

I believe it's both demographics and the culture that's being pushed onto the youth. let me explain at a later time

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Asians probably like rap the least in america

Cap. Gooks online are obessed with rap even K-pop faggots try to copy rap shit all the time. Asians love rap more than whites

 

[Racky]

What I meant by "inherent nature" is the defining traits of rap music

Guys like @

@güss like to argue that rap could be anything, as if he doesn't know anything about rap music and its culture, and just hides behind meaningless, vague statements. I don't know anything about the culture of "konnakol," what it's supposed to achieve, what variation exists within that type of music, and so on. I'm not particularly interested, either. If konnakol is or isn't "less musical" than other forms of music, that does nothing to absolve rap of the criticisms I've leveled against it.

The culture that may surround rap and the defining traits of rap are different things.
As I said earlier Rap can be very simply thoughts as the vocal equivalent of drumming with rhymes. This is a definition. Now what a culture surrounding it promotes are not defining traits, but the direction in which it can be or is taken.
You are not using your terms correctly otherwise you wouldn't use "inherent nature" to talk about cultural context.

Chimes are not drums. You are getting the category (percussion) mixed up with the particular thing (drums) we're discussing.

I'm not talking about chimes, I'm talking about drum-chimes.

Those are chimes :

Those are drum-chimes(you may skip to 1:00) :

Drums are less musical because most of the concepts associated with music, especially the most technical and difficult concepts, don't apply to drums. There are no melodies, harmonies, chord progressions, tonal and atonal sounds, or modulation associated with drums. Those are central concepts for instruments that actually need to be tuned.

Those are just descriptive concepts. Something incorporating all of them and something only incorporating one does not make one more or less "musical".

there is ambient/drone songs with little to no rhythm but it's not any less "musical" than songs that incorporate more rhythm. It simply chooses to focus on other aspects and concepts to express whatever it is that the artist purports to express with his art.

You're taking my statement out of context. I don't mean that more skill always means something is "more musical."

Fair enough. Apologies.

I'm talking about the attitude of rap music and its fans. It is not a genre that emphasizes things like skill and virtuosity, it's about "keeping it real." For rap fans, if it feels good, it is good. My experience with rap fans is that to be analytical about music in any way is irritating to them. It's 100% feels.

You are generalizing based on your experience with casual listeners. Plenty of people are interested in talking about rap analytically and have more requirements than just "feels good". There are even expressions for such people i.e "backpackers".

With any genre that is very popular most people listening to it will only be interested in the "feel". It's to be expected if something is mainstream.

 

[Deleted member 12002]

always wondering

Because it's content is more explicit.

 

[Yuhbwoynadia]

the music scene in the US is very politicized. Your skin color largely reflects your cultural tastes.

A lot of funk music sounds exactly like rock music to mi idk how they got classified into
different genres


Blacks in the 1970s would listen to dis song but say they dont fw rock music honestly strange

 

[Deleted member 13710]

The culture that may surround rap and the defining traits of rap are different things.

This is reasonable, but I think it's missing the bigger picture. When I talk about the culture of rap, I'm not talking just about the listeners, but the rappers themselves. What inspires them to make songs? Do they spend a few years making an epic statement piece, or do they hammer out a few minutes at the end of the week, as soon as they get a chance to visit the studio? Did they have their training in an ensemble or alone (if they even trained at all)? The attitude towards music is what shapes what the music ends up sounding like.

You can incorporate a rap style of vocals into music that sounds like jazz, or classical, or polka or whatever else. 99.99% of rappers have no interest in that kind of thing. It's that kind of attitude, just "keeping it real," that makes rap completely dull and boring to people who know and listen to creative music. Rap is dull and flat and repetitive and boring, and the rappers and their fans wouldn't have it any other way.

I'm not talking about chimes, I'm talking about drum-chimes.

Those are chimes :

Those are drum-chimes(you may skip to 1:00) :

I know what you mean. You mean pitched percussion.

there is ambient/drone songs with little to no rhythm but it's not any less "musical" than songs that incorporate more rhythm. It simply chooses to focus on other aspects and concepts to express whatever it is that the artist purports to express with his art.

This is a bias that fans of rap have towards other forms of music. There's no such thing as music without rhythm. (Maybe complete noise improvisation, but nothing we would consider normal music.) This whole "it doesn't have rhythm" is an ignorant cliche among rap fans. That is exactly the kind of ignorant statement that rap culture gives rise to.

You are generalizing based on your experience with casual listeners. Plenty of people are interested in talking about rap analytically and have more requirements than just "feels good". There are even expressions for such people i.e "backpackers".

They might talk about the lyrics, but lyrics aren't music. They can't really talk about the music analytically because there's nothing to say. If they're actually talking about the music, what are they gonna say? "Here are some eighth notes...some more eighth notes...here, they repeated the beat for the 114th time in a row, very interesting..."

 

[Deleted member 13710]

Asians probably like rap the least in america

Not surprised, Asians always seemed like the least degenerate group of people in the USA. Maybe that's why white women dislike them so much.