Who are the pure Slavs

[PubertyMaxxer]

Russians are either russified Uralic, Turkic, Mongoloid peoples or heavy mixed with those groups.

Likewise South Slavic people are hardly Slavic anymore despite speaking a slavic language and larping as Christian Slavs they're in reality very ethnic.

Austrians are Germanized Slavs. Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

So who is really Slavic?

Imo people from around this area :

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

@TsarTsar444 @PolishNegro @thereallegend

 

[pardocel]

Austrians are Germanized Slavs

 

[Prettyboy]

Austrians are Germanized Slavs.

Austrians don’t have ties to Slavs but Czechs can be viewed as Germanized slavs. Their language and culture has a great amount of German influence

Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

They didn’t, that’s a myth @TsarTsar444 could elab on that one

South Slavs don’t look ethnic (certainly not Croats). Maybe in the southernmost parts of the peninsula, like in Thrace people can look a bit Turkish but thats it

 

[Marsiere214]

Austrians don’t have ties to Slavs but Czechs can be viewed as Germanized slavs. Their language and culture has a great amount of German influence


They didn’t, that’s a myth @TsarTsar444 could elab on that one

I can post genetic studies on bulgars
The italian one took 2-3 yrs to make

 

[spark]

Austrians don’t have ties to Slavs but Czechs can be viewed as Germanized slavs. Their language and culture has a great amount of German influence


They didn’t, that’s a myth @TsarTsar444 could elab on that one

South Slavs don’t look ethnic (certainly not Croats). Maybe in the southernmost parts of the peninsula, like in Thrace people can look a bit Turkish but thats it

not much german influence in the czech language tbh

 

[TsarTsar444]

Austrians don’t have ties to Slavs but Czechs can be viewed as Germanized slavs. Their language and culture has a great amount of German influence


They didn’t, that’s a myth @TsarTsar444 could elab on that one

South Slavs don’t look ethnic (certainly not Croats). Maybe in the southernmost parts of the peninsula, like in Thrace people can look a bit Turkish but thats it

Yes the Turks didn't mix with the native people at all jfl, the Ottomans didn't like and trust the turkic anatolian tribes so they designed the Balkans to be their heartland and ruled by the local muslim sipahi nobles, pashas and volunteer bosnian jannisaries

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

Yes the Turks didn't mix with the native people at all jfl, the Ottomans didn't like and trust the turkic anatolian tribes so they designed the Balkans to be their heartland and ruled by the local muslim sipahi nobles, pashas and volunteer bosnian jannisaries

Tldr: Bulgarians are slavicized Thracians while Romanians are latinized Dacians. Both together with Albanians (Illyrians) form the Paleo Balkanic peoples.

And i think 500 years under Ottoman rule does lead to brownening of your population.

 

[Prettyboy]

not much german influence in the czech language tbh

Czech has an enormous German influence though, ton of German loanwords. So much so this is what differentiates it from Slovak for the most part as otherwise their base would be practically the same

But this isnt surprising considering Bohemia was part of the Holy Roman Empire for centuries then the Habsburg Empire

Even after Czechoslovakia was formed Sudeten Germans were overrepresented in culture up until their forced removal after WWII

Yes the Turks didn't mix with the native people at all jfl, the Ottomans didn't like and trust the turkic anatolian tribes so they designed the Balkans to be their heartland and ruled by the local muslim sipahi nobles, pashas and volunteer bosnian jannisaries

Also a common misconception I keep seeing about outsiders is the notion that Bosniaks are genetically related to Turks because they are Muslims. Which is not the case, they had their reasons for conversion to Islam during Ottoman rule but it wasn’t due to intermixing

And i think 500 years under Ottoman rule does lead to brownening of your population.

Not really. Half of Hungary was also under Ottoman rule for more than 150 years yet it had near zero effects on the local populance’s gene pool. Instead what happened is the occupied land depopulated

 

[spark]

Czech has an enormous German influence though, ton of German loanwords. So much so this is what it differentiates it from Slovak for the most part as otherwise their base would be practically the same

Dude this is such nonsense. Slovak is basically just a dialect of Czech. The influence of the German language is minimal.

 

[TsarTsar444]

Tldr: Bulgarians are slavicized Thracians while Romanians are latinized Dacians. Both together with Albanians (Illyrians) form the Paleo Balkanic peoples.

And i think 500 years under Ottoman rule does lead to brownening of your population.

Im the most knowledgeable person on ottoman history on this forum, you know very little about the Ottoman Empire, one of the most misunderstood states in history by far.

When you look at the Ottoman Empire first thing you need to do is just look at the Balkans and Anatolia, these were the Empire proper territories. The Levant, Egypt, Hejaz were decentralized and ruled by local mamluk nobles and Jannisary corps, with almost no investment in these regions. People in these places didn't even see Europe cause arabs weren't in the Ottoman armies in Anatolia and Europe.

Turks onlt settled Bulgaria and Thrace in considerable numbers, Albania, most og Greece and former Yugoslavia had no turks. The Balkans were ruled by local balkan muslim families, who were the most loyal people to the Sultan, he trusted us the most and sent Balkan armies to crush the revolts from Turkic tribes in Eastern Anatolia that were simphatethic to the Shia Persians.

The Sultants themselves spoke persian in court as well

 

[TsarTsar444]

Czech has an enormous German influence though, ton of German loanwords. So much so this is what differentiates it from Slovak for the most part as otherwise their base would be practically the same

But this isnt surprising considering Bohemia was part of the Holy Roman Empire for centuries then the Habsburg Empire

Even after Czechoslovakia was formed Sudeten Germans were overrepresented in culture up until their forced removal after WWII


Also a common misconception I keep seeing about outsiders is the notion that Bosniaks are genetically related to Turks because they are Muslims. Which is not the case, they had their reasons for conversion to Islam during Ottoman rule but it wasn’t due to intermixing


Not really. Half of Hungary was also under Ottoman rule for more than 150 years yet it had near zero effects on the local populance’s gene pool. Instead what happened is the occupied land depopulat

Makes me blood boil, turks weren't in charge of the Balkans, Bosnia was its own Eyelet with its own flag standard, ruled by dozens of muslim Bosniak familes.

Another huuge misconception is that Jannisaries were what balkan muslims were in the Ottoman Armies, this is far from the truth. Most of Bosniaks (basically bosniak = west south slavic muslims), Pomaks, Albanians, Greek muslims were Sipahi calavlry, as muslim landlords in the Empire

 

[Lonenely sigma]

Tldr: Bulgarians are slavicized Thracians while Romanians are latinized Dacians. Both together with Albanians (Illyrians) form the Paleo Balkanic peoples.

And i think 500 years under Ottoman rule does lead to brownening of your population.

Turks didn't mix with native populations that much except for maybe in albania or bosnia bc they had large muslim populations. If you look at genetic story of other christian slavic lands that were occupied, they have almost no genetic ties at all. Turks were viewed as inferior and barbaric in those lands and hated by most. That being said, Turks themselves brought many people from occupied lands in Turkey itself, either good looking future wives or young boys who were then used as soldiers for turkish army

 

[Lonenely sigma]

Russians are either russified Uralic, Turkic, Mongoloid peoples or heavy mixed with those groups.

Likewise South Slavic people are hardly Slavic anymore despite speaking a slavic language and larping as Christian Slavs they're in reality very ethnic.

Austrians are Germanized Slavs. Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

So who is really Slavic?

Imo people from around this area :

View attachment 2074151

And as who is the most pure, that would be a bit harder to say. Its definitely not anyone in southern europe, and russia itself is very diverse, so based on genes alone its weird how they are even considered one nation. Slavs most certainly came from the territory of modern poland but poles also mixed with everyone. I'd probably say either slovaks (except for the big hungarian population) or western ukrainians, which is very ironic considering that they have a big problem with neo nazis jfl

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

And as who is the most pure, that would be a bit harder to say. Its definitely not anyone in southern europe, and russia itself is very diverse, so based on genes alone its weird how they are even considered one nation. Slavs most certainly came from the territory of modern poland but poles also mixed with everyone. I'd probably say either slovaks (except for the big hungarian population) or western ukrainians, which is very ironic considering that they have a big problem with neo nazis jfl

Yeah most scholars agree the proto slavic homeland lies between Belarus and Ukraine and East Poland

 

[Deleted member 26015]

There is no true “Pure Slav”, but Polish people from Eastern border are probably the closest you’ll get. Or maybe some western Ukrainians if they never mixed with Russian or Ashkenazi Jews.

 

[Marsiere214]

Im the most knowledgeable person on ottoman history on this forum, you know very little about the Ottoman Empire, one of the most misunderstood states in history by far.

When you look at the Ottoman Empire first thing you need to do is just look at the Balkans and Anatolia, these were the Empire proper territories. The Levant, Egypt, Hejaz were decentralized and ruled by local mamluk nobles and Jannisary corps, with almost no investment in these regions. People in these places didn't even see Europe cause arabs weren't in the Ottoman armies in Anatolia and Europe.

Turks onlt settled Bulgaria and Thrace in considerable numbers, Albania, most og Greece and former Yugoslavia had no turks. The Balkans were ruled by local balkan muslim families, who were the most loyal people to the Sultan, he trusted us the most and sent Balkan armies to crush the revolts from Turkic tribes in Eastern Anatolia that were simphatethic to the Shia Persians.

The Sultants themselves spoke persian in court as well

The ottomans are turks no? Why didnt they trust their fellow tribesmen?

Also arent the pomaks and catholic bulgars descendants of the paulicians?

 

[TsarTsar444]

The ottomans are turks no? Why didnt they trust their fellow tribesmen?

Also arent the pomaks and catholic bulgars descendants of the paulicians?

Because they weren't their fellow tribesmen, their tribesman were the ones from the original tribe of Osman, nationalism is a modern concept. The Ottoman family just became the most powerful and got to conquering all of the other tribes in Anatolia. But because of the rivalry and hatred between the rulers of all of these tribes and their nobility, they could never be trusted to be close to the Ottoman court, it would be incredibly easy to kill of the Osmanoglu family in a scheme and install some of their own on the throne. The Ottomans tried to distance themselves from the turks as much as possible, even speaking Persian in their court, and the reason why they married foreign women, if they married a women from one of the other powerful turk nobles like the Karamanli famaily for example, there could be a big civil war after the death of the Sultan with the Karamanli claiming the throne and worst the majority of other turkmen supporting them. Thats why the Jannisaries were also created, the Pashas, Aghas, the military officers, the merchants, thr Admirals, the Ottoman Palace guardians, all of these people were Bosniaks, Albanians, Pomaks, Greeks, Romanians etc, cause the Sultan considered thr balkan muslims to be his most loyal subjects.

During the battle of Ankara in 1402 the turkmen tribes betrayed Sultan Bayezid in the battle switching to Timur because they considered him to be a more powerful Turkic leader, while the only ones to remain loyal to the Sultan in that battle to the end were the Serbian knights, and the muslim slavic jannisaries

 

[Prettyboy]

Makes me blood boil, turks weren't in charge of the Balkans, Bosnia was its own Eyelet with its own flag standard, ruled by dozens of muslim Bosniak familes.

Another huuge misconception is that Jannisaries were what balkan muslims were in the Ottoman Armies, this is far from the truth. Most of Bosniaks (basically bosniak = west south slavic muslims), Pomaks, Albanians, Greek muslims were Sipahi calavlry, as muslim landlords in the Empire

Tbh people don’t understand Ottomans motives when talking about the Balkans

Rumelia was the most important elayet of the empire, Egypt and Hejaz were lot more far from the Ottoman heartland

Because they weren't their fellow tribesmen, their tribesman were the ones from the original tribe of Osman, nationalism is a modern concept. The Ottoman family just became the most powerful and got to conquering all of the other tribes in Anatolia. But because of the rivalry and hatred between the rulers of all of these tribes and their nobility, they could never be trusted to be close to the Ottoman court, it would be incredibly easy to kill of the Osmanoglu family in a scheme and install some of their own on the throne. The Ottomans tried to distance themselves from the turks as much as possible, even speaking Persian in their court, and the reason why they married foreign women, if they married a women from one of the other powerful turk nobles like the Karamanli famaily for example, there could be a big civil war after the death of the Sultan with the Karamanli claiming the throne and worst the majority of other turkmen supporting them. Thats why the Jannisaries were also created, the Pashas, Aghas, the military officers, the merchants, thr Admirals, the Ottoman Palace guardians, all of these people were Bosniaks, Albanians, Pomaks, Greeks, Romanians etc, cause the Sultan considered thr balkan muslims to be his most loyal subjects.

During the battle of Ankara in 1402 the turkmen tribes betrayed Sultan Bayezid in the battle switching to Timur because they considered him to be a more powerful Turkic leader, while the only ones to remain loyal to the Sultan in that battle to the end were the Serbian knights, and the muslim slavic jannisaries

Ngl mirin hard your Ottoman Empire aspie niche, I have the same enthusiasm for the Habsburg Empire’s history

 

[TsarTsar444]

Tbh people don’t understand Ottomans motives when talking about the Balkans

Rumelia was the most important elayet of the empire, Egypt and Hejaz were lot more far from the Ottoman heartland

Ngl mirin hard your Ottoman Empire aspie niche, I have the same enthusiasm for the Habsburg Empire’s history

The Ottoman Empire is arguably the most multicultural empire in history, i can't think of something that comes close to it. Its so misunderstood its insane. All of the elite other then the Sultan of the empire were the Balkan muslims, the most Ottoman era architecture was built in the Balkans, just Bosnia alone has more ottoman architecture then the whole of Anatolia. Something very important as well is that the Ottomans didn't have an official language until 1870 where it was barely the Ottoman Empire anymore instead of a Turkish one after the reforms of 1826. The most common languages spoken on the Ottoman court were Persian, Arabic, Slavic, Turkish, with no clear dominance, but depending on the court members. Turkish was compulsory to know though if you wanted to be in the high military rank, which is logical, imagine an army from muslim balkancels from bulgaria, bosnia, hungary and turkic anatolians not understanding eachother jflll.

In fact Bosnia was so special to the Ottoman Empire that muslim Slavs in the Bosnian Eyalet had their own flag, which was different from the same flags on the rest of the provinces of the Empire.

And this was the flag for all the other Eyalets in the Empire

 

[Deleted member 24167]

Lithuanians.Central Europeans are not pure since they mixed with italians.
For Balkans they are the biggest joke.

 

[Marsiere214]

Because they weren't their fellow tribesmen, their tribesman were the ones from the original tribe of Osman, nationalism is a modern concept. The Ottoman family just became the most powerful and got to conquering all of the other tribes in Anatolia. But because of the rivalry and hatred between the rulers of all of these tribes and their nobility, they could never be trusted to be close to the Ottoman court, it would be incredibly easy to kill of the Osmanoglu family in a scheme and install some of their own on the throne. The Ottomans tried to distance themselves from the turks as much as possible, even speaking Persian in their court, and the reason why they married foreign women, if they married a women from one of the other powerful turk nobles like the Karamanli famaily for example, there could be a big civil war after the death of the Sultan with the Karamanli claiming the throne and worst the majority of other turkmen supporting them. Thats why the Jannisaries were also created, the Pashas, Aghas, the military officers, the merchants, thr Admirals, the Ottoman Palace guardians, all of these people were Bosniaks, Albanians, Pomaks, Greeks, Romanians etc, cause the Sultan considered thr balkan muslims to be his most loyal subjects.

During the battle of Ankara in 1402 the turkmen tribes betrayed Sultan Bayezid in the battle switching to Timur because they considered him to be a more powerful Turkic leader, while the only ones to remain loyal to the Sultan in that battle to the end were the Serbian knights, and the muslim slavic jannisaries

Are modern day turks really turks? Or do they descend from the natives of anatolia?

 

[TsarTsar444]

Are modern day turks really turks? Or do they descend from the natives of anatolia?

More then 20% of modern turks are balkan muslims that escaped to Turkey when the Ottoman Empire fell for a starter, they mostly settled in the western coast and Istanbul. The other 70-80% are by autosomal dna mostly native anatolians but with definitely considerable real turkic component of about 25% on average. And the other parts of autosomal dna is made up from the greeks who already lived with the anatolians, and the Caucasus people on the Black Sea coast

 

[Marsiere214]

More then 20% of modern turks are balkan muslims that escaped to Turkey when the Ottoman Empire fell for a starter, they mostly settled in the western coast and Istanbul. The other 70-80% are by autosomal dna mostly native anatolians but with definitely considerable real turkic component of about 25% on average. And the other parts of autosomal dna is made up from the greeks who already lived with the anatolians, and the Caucasus people on the Black Sea coast

Do the eastern turks have more turkic than the western?

 

[Prettyboy]

More then 20% of modern turks are balkan muslims that escaped to Turkey when the Ottoman Empire fell for a starter, they mostly settled in the western coast and Istanbul. The other 70-80% are by autosomal dna mostly native anatolians but with definitely considerable real turkic component of about 25% on average. And the other parts of autosomal dna is made up from the greeks who already lived with the anatolians, and the Caucasus people on the Black Sea coast

Tbh once there were many Greeks living in Anatolia

 

[Deleted member 24167]

Are modern day turks really turks? Or do they descend from the natives of anatolia?

Modern Turks are 25-40% oghuz turk and the rest is anatolian and caucasus..Unlike others know Proto turks weren't fully mongoloid but mixed and sometimes more caucasoid than mongoloid.

 

[TsarTsar444]

Do the eastern turks have more turkic than the western?

No they have one of the least turkic dna actually, the highest amount is unironically in western parts of turkey, more accurately western central turkish places. So this is quite interesting, the western turkish Aegan cities and Istanbul are the places where you are most likely to see lots of both European looking turks (balkan refugees from 1700-1960) and asiatic looking turks from a good part turkic dna. Because of urbanization and migration that happened after the 1950's alot of kurds and more anatolian genetic turks settled in the rich western regions so now those places are quite mixed.

 

[Deleted member 24167]

Do the eastern turks have more turkic than the western?

Western Turks are average 40% Oghuz turkic.Eastern turks have less oghuz than Westerns.Ottomans setlead turkomans into Western Turkey.I am telling this from Western Turkey.Almost everyone is mixed and have turanid eyes in here

 

[Deleted member 21700]

This guy:

 

[TsarTsar444]

Tbh once there were many Greeks living in Anatolia

Yeah this is just a plus, but majority of the greeks that lived in Anatolia were assimilated into muslim turkish culture long before 1900. If there were somehow technically included as well, this map would be much more purple.

One of the best ottoman generals in the early yesrs of the Beylik was Evrenoz, a greek muslim byzantine convert for example, and most of the foot soldiers of Osman and Orhan were muslim converted Greeks

 

[Deleted member 24167]

Yeah this is just a plus, but majority of the greeks that lived in Anatolia were assimilated into muslim turkish culture long before 1900. If there were somehow technically included as well, this map would be much more purple.

One of the best ottoman generals in the early yesrs of the Beylik was Evrenoz, a greek muslim byzantine convert for example, and most of the foot soldiers of Osman and Orhan were muslim converted Greeks

Those people assimilated into Greek culture and then Turkish Culture.
They weren't greek.

 

[TsarTsar444]

Western Turks are average 40% Oghuz turkic.Eastern turks have less oghuz than Westerns.Ottomans setlead turkomans into Western Turkey.I am telling this from Western Turkey.Almost everyone is mixed and have turanid eyes in here

Yup, nomadic people always tried to move the most west they could to the most lush and rich regions, people have this misconception that fhe more east you go the more turkic the turks are, but the most eastern ones are quite low autosomally turkic.

My university has a huge percentage of turks in it from Anatolia, most of them come from Izmir, Bursa and the other western coat cities, and 60% maybe have that turkic slight asian eyed look, with pale to olive skin and black hair, 30% look straight up slavic and greek and 10% look like arabs

 

[St.TikTokcel]

Russians are either russified Uralic, Turkic, Mongoloid peoples or heavy mixed with those groups.

Likewise South Slavic people are hardly Slavic anymore despite speaking a slavic language and larping as Christian Slavs they're in reality very ethnic.

Austrians are Germanized Slavs. Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

So who is really Slavic?

Imo people from around this area :

View attachment 2074151

Balkans = arab/gyspy/turk rapebabies. Eastern slavcels = mongoloids. That's all you need to know. Pure mongolian/arab genes.

 

[TsarTsar444]

Those people assimilated into Greek culture and then Turkish Culture.
They weren't greek.

Somewhat true and not, after Alexander took Anatolia that place was ruled for over 1500 by greeks, and alot of greeks settled all over them together with the native anatolians. And originally even before Alexander the western coasts were made up of Ionian Greeks

 

[Deleted member 24167]

Somewhat true and not, after Alexander took Anatolia that place was ruled for over 1500 by greeks, and alot of greeks settled all over them together with the native anatolians. And originally even before Alexander the western coasts were made up of Ionian Greeks

Here is the comparison of Modern Greeks and Turks.Modern Greeks have less ancient greek admixture than turks have turkic admixture.

 

[ripcordgod1]

Russians are either russified Uralic, Turkic, Mongoloid peoples or heavy mixed with those groups.

Likewise South Slavic people are hardly Slavic anymore despite speaking a slavic language and larping as Christian Slavs they're in reality very ethnic.

Austrians are Germanized Slavs. Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

So who is really Slavic?

Imo people from around this area :

View attachment 2074151

slavs all look mena af theyre def just turks that evolved white features

 

[TsarTsar444]

Here is the comparison of Modern Greeks and Turks.Modern Greeks have less ancient greek admixture than turks have turkic admixture.

Yeah I know, greeks like to cry alot how they are muh 90%+ like ancient greeks, when in reality slavic tribes settled all the way to the southern tip of greece and lived there for hundreds of years mixing with them

 

[TsarTsar444]

Also you posted a video once about Macedonia and the Alexander thing. Its scary how big of a lobby the greeks have on the internet, people think that Macedonians from North Macedonia are a meme that they claim Alexander as theirs, even though they would be more correct if anyone actually hears what macedonian historians actually thing about it.

Basically greeks like to cope how when Macedonians were called barbaric by the other greeks it was a normal practise and all greeks said that to eachother, but this is far from true. Macedonian people were exceptionally thought to be a foreign people who were just ruled by the greek family of Philip and Alexander who come from Argos. There was an original macedonian language as well, there are literal proofs of this with some words that survived from those days, it was basically thracian in sound with some wierd greek loanwords

@PubertyMaxxer

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Russians are either russified Uralic, Turkic, Mongoloid peoples or heavy mixed with those groups.

Likewise South Slavic people are hardly Slavic anymore despite speaking a slavic language and larping as Christian Slavs they're in reality very ethnic.

Austrians are Germanized Slavs. Serbs, Croatians, Bulgarians are Slavizided Paleo-Balkanic peoples mixed with Ottoman Invaders.

So who is really Slavic?

Imo people from around this area :

View attachment 2074151

So hitler was a Slav lol

 

[Prettyboy]

Also you posted a video once about Macedonia and the Alexander thing. Its scary how big of a lobby the greeks have on the internet, people think that Macedonians from North Macedonia are a meme that they claim Alexander as theirs, even though they would be more correct if anyone actually hears what macedonian historians actually thing about it.

Basically greeks like to cope how when Macedonians were called barbaric by the other greeks it was a normal practise and all greeks said that to eachother, but this is far from true. Macedonian people were exceptionally thought to be a foreign people who were just ruled by the greek family of Philip and Alexander who come from Argos. There was an original macedonian language as well, there are literal proofs of this with some words that survived from those days, it was basically thracian in sound with some wierd greek loanwords

@PubertyMaxxer

Ngl Macedonia’s naming dispute was very cucked

 

[TsarTsar444]

Ngl Macedonia’s naming dispute was very cucked

What Greek propaganda did to the world is disgusting and i can write a huge thread on explaining the macedonian side of these things, its one of the saddest things in European history.

To not make it too long but basically Macedonia wasn't mentioned as part of the greek world until around the 8th century where the greek family from Argos where Alexander comes from came there and conqured the small area in modern Salonica, over the hundred of years the Greek Kings of Macedonia expanded more and more snd by the time of Philip the Macedonian Kingdom was made from todays Greek Macedonia, North Macedonia and parts of modern Bulgaria, this was considered Macedonia proper. Greek like to tell how North Macedonians were Panonian tribes when in fact the whole of the land were made up from these native thracian-illyrian tribes, with thr elite being mostly Greek.

Greeks thought of Macedonians as being foreigners, even not allowing them to participate in the Olympics. And Greek historians did write about the native language of there being mostly different from all other greek areas.

North Macedonians also didn't just make up thise Macedonian identity from Tito, the first Macedonian official nationalist guidline was written in 1903 and before this in the 19th century the people did refer to the place they live in as Macedonia.

Something also completely unknown to people is that Aegean Macedonia before being captured by the Greeks in 1912 was mostly populated with slavic speaking people as well that between 1912 and 1970 were either completely assimilated, expelled or even murdered, and these people always said they are Macedonians as well.

Now you got some "real macedonian" whos great grandparents migrated to Aegean Macedonia from Athens writtinf on his Keyboard how he is proud of his Greek Macedonian ancestors and insulting the North Macedonian on his keyboard who actually descends from the people who made up the Macedonian culture in the time of Alexander, just with some slavic mixing (max 20%) and speakinf slavic. The reason for slavic is a whole topic on its own right for a different time

 

[St.TikTokcel]

What Greek propaganda did to the world is disgusting and i can write a huge thread on explaining the macedonian side of these things, its one of the saddest things in European history.

To not make it too long but basically Macedonia wasn't mentioned as part of the greek world until around the 8th century where the greek family from Argos where Alexander comes from came there and conqured the small area in modern Salonica, over the hundred of years the Greek Kings of Macedonia expanded more and more snd by the time of Philip the Macedonian Kingdom was made from todays Greek Macedonia, North Macedonia and parts of modern Bulgaria, this was considered Macedonia proper. Greek like to tell how North Macedonians were Panonian tribes when in fact the whole of the land were made up from these native thracian-illyrian tribes, with thr elite being mostly Greek.

Greeks thought of Macedonians as being foreigners, even not allowing them to participate in the Olympics. And Greek historians did write about the native language of there being mostly different from all other greek areas.

North Macedonians also didn't just make up thise Macedonian identity from Tito, the first Macedonian official nationalist guidline was written in 1903 and before this in the 19th century the people did refer to the place they live in as Macedonia.

Something also completely unknown to people is that Aegean Macedonia before being captured by the Greeks in 1912 was mostly populated with slavic speaking people as well that between 1912 and 1970 were either completely assimilated, expelled or even murdered, and these people always said they are Macedonians as well.

Now you got some "real macedonian" whos great grandparents migrated to Aegean Macedonia from Athens writtinf on his Keyboard how he is proud of his Greek Macedonian ancestors and insulting the North Macedonian on his keyboard who actually descends from the people who made up the Macedonian culture in the time of Alexander, just with some slavic mixing (max 20%) and speakinf slavic. The reason for slavic is a whole topic on its own right for a different time

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

Yeah I know, greeks like to cry alot how they are muh 90%+ like ancient greeks, when in reality slavic tribes settled all the way to the southern tip of greece and lived there for hundreds of years mixing with them

All good looking white passing greeks probably have some slavic dna

 

[Marsiere214]

What Greek propaganda did to the world is disgusting and i can write a huge thread on explaining the macedonian side of these things, its one of the saddest things in European history.

To not make it too long but basically Macedonia wasn't mentioned as part of the greek world until around the 8th century where the greek family from Argos where Alexander comes from came there and conqured the small area in modern Salonica, over the hundred of years the Greek Kings of Macedonia expanded more and more snd by the time of Philip the Macedonian Kingdom was made from todays Greek Macedonia, North Macedonia and parts of modern Bulgaria, this was considered Macedonia proper. Greek like to tell how North Macedonians were Panonian tribes when in fact the whole of the land were made up from these native thracian-illyrian tribes, with thr elite being mostly Greek.

Greeks thought of Macedonians as being foreigners, even not allowing them to participate in the Olympics. And Greek historians did write about the native language of there being mostly different from all other greek areas.

North Macedonians also didn't just make up thise Macedonian identity from Tito, the first Macedonian official nationalist guidline was written in 1903 and before this in the 19th century the people did refer to the place they live in as Macedonia.

Something also completely unknown to people is that Aegean Macedonia before being captured by the Greeks in 1912 was mostly populated with slavic speaking people as well that between 1912 and 1970 were either completely assimilated, expelled or even murdered, and these people always said they are Macedonians as well.

Now you got some "real macedonian" whos great grandparents migrated to Aegean Macedonia from Athens writtinf on his Keyboard how he is proud of his Greek Macedonian ancestors and insulting the North Macedonian on his keyboard who actually descends from the people who made up the Macedonian culture in the time of Alexander, just with some slavic mixing (max 20%) and speakinf slavic. The reason for slavic is a whole topic on its own right for a different time

Do u think pontic greeks are hittites?

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

What Greek propaganda did to the world is disgusting and i can write a huge thread on explaining the macedonian side of these things, its one of the saddest things in European history.

To not make it too long but basically Macedonia wasn't mentioned as part of the greek world until around the 8th century where the greek family from Argos where Alexander comes from came there and conqured the small area in modern Salonica, over the hundred of years the Greek Kings of Macedonia expanded more and more snd by the time of Philip the Macedonian Kingdom was made from todays Greek Macedonia, North Macedonia and parts of modern Bulgaria, this was considered Macedonia proper. Greek like to tell how North Macedonians were Panonian tribes when in fact the whole of the land were made up from these native thracian-illyrian tribes, with thr elite being mostly Greek.

Greeks thought of Macedonians as being foreigners, even not allowing them to participate in the Olympics. And Greek historians did write about the native language of there being mostly different from all other greek areas.

North Macedonians also didn't just make up thise Macedonian identity from Tito, the first Macedonian official nationalist guidline was written in 1903 and before this in the 19th century the people did refer to the place they live in as Macedonia.

Something also completely unknown to people is that Aegean Macedonia before being captured by the Greeks in 1912 was mostly populated with slavic speaking people as well that between 1912 and 1970 were either completely assimilated, expelled or even murdered, and these people always said they are Macedonians as well.

Now you got some "real macedonian" whos great grandparents migrated to Aegean Macedonia from Athens writtinf on his Keyboard how he is proud of his Greek Macedonian ancestors and insulting the North Macedonian on his keyboard who actually descends from the people who made up the Macedonian culture in the time of Alexander, just with some slavic mixing (max 20%) and speakinf slavic. The reason for slavic is a whole topic on its own right for a different time

Ngl you should make a more elaborate thread on this, would definitely read it.

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

What Greek propaganda did to the world is disgusting and i can write a huge thread on explaining the macedonian side of these things, its one of the saddest things in European history.

To not make it too long but basically Macedonia wasn't mentioned as part of the greek world until around the 8th century where the greek family from Argos where Alexander comes from came there and conqured the small area in modern Salonica, over the hundred of years the Greek Kings of Macedonia expanded more and more snd by the time of Philip the Macedonian Kingdom was made from todays Greek Macedonia, North Macedonia and parts of modern Bulgaria, this was considered Macedonia proper. Greek like to tell how North Macedonians were Panonian tribes when in fact the whole of the land were made up from these native thracian-illyrian tribes, with thr elite being mostly Greek.

Greeks thought of Macedonians as being foreigners, even not allowing them to participate in the Olympics. And Greek historians did write about the native language of there being mostly different from all other greek areas.

North Macedonians also didn't just make up thise Macedonian identity from Tito, the first Macedonian official nationalist guidline was written in 1903 and before this in the 19th century the people did refer to the place they live in as Macedonia.

Something also completely unknown to people is that Aegean Macedonia before being captured by the Greeks in 1912 was mostly populated with slavic speaking people as well that between 1912 and 1970 were either completely assimilated, expelled or even murdered, and these people always said they are Macedonians as well.

Now you got some "real macedonian" whos great grandparents migrated to Aegean Macedonia from Athens writtinf on his Keyboard how he is proud of his Greek Macedonian ancestors and insulting the North Macedonian on his keyboard who actually descends from the people who made up the Macedonian culture in the time of Alexander, just with some slavic mixing (max 20%) and speakinf slavic. The reason for slavic is a whole topic on its own right for a different time

What would you say about Bulgarian origin? Turkic volga bulgars, Slavs or majority assimilated Thracians?

 

[TsarTsar444]

Ngl you should make a more elaborate thread on this, would definitely read it.

I will in the future, there is alot to write about this in detail, it would look like a short book if i tried jfl.

Macedonia is without a doubt the most complex Frankenstein creation in Europe, all of the other questionable countries have some more straight forward reason, people of North Macedonia are very misunderstood.

Some fun fact btw, Greece originally wanted to take almost all of modern North Macedonia, the original greek lands in their irredintism during the 19th and 20th century encompassed half of Albania, 2/3 of modern North Macedonia as well as western coast of Turkey. During the 1800's they led a large campaign of hellenization of the slavic speaking macedonian natives in modern Aegean Greece AND North Macedonia. In thr 19th century the biggest city in Macedonia was Bitola, Skopje back then was one of the smaller towns, and mostly populated by Albanians and Turks. Greeks considered modern North Macedonians to have been bastardized with slavic influence and tried to hellenize them, they did this through the church and had moderate success in this, as the educated north macedonians did speak greek in the south of our country. The Serbian and Bulgarian churches also tried doing this, and all of them had some success. But during the Balkan wars Greek army did mediocre compared to the much better performance of Bulgaria and Serbia and they lost the race for North Macedonia particularly the cities of Ohrid and Bitola to the Serbian army. So modern greeks calling people from North Macedonia Vardar slavs is a good example of sour grapes

 

[PubertyMaxxer]

I will in the future, there is alot to write about this in detail, it would look like a short book if i tried jfl.

Macedonia is without a doubt the most complex Frankenstein creation in Europe, all of the other questionable countries have some more straight forward reason, people of North Macedonia are very misunderstood.

Some fun fact btw, Greece originally wanted to take almost all of modern North Macedonia, the original greek lands in their irredintism during the 19th and 20th century encompassed half of Albania, 2/3 of modern North Macedonia as well as western coast of Turkey. During the 1800's they led a large campaign of hellenization of the slavic speaking macedonian natives in modern Aegean Greece AND North Macedonia. In thr 19th century the biggest city in Macedonia was Bitola, Skopje back then was one of the smaller towns, and mostly populated by Albanians and Turks. Greeks considered modern North Macedonians to have been bastardized with slavic influence and tried to hellenize them, they did this through the church and had moderate success in this, as the educated north macedonians did speak greek in the south of our country. The Serbian and Bulgarian churches also tried doing this, and all of them had some success. But during the Balkan wars Greek army did mediocre compared to the much better performance of Bulgaria and Serbia and they lost the race for North Macedonia particularly the cities of Ohrid and Bitola to the Serbian army. So modern greeks calling people from North Macedonia Vardar slavs is a good example of sour grapes

Brainwashed Western Sheeps will always side with Greeks rather than Macedonians cuz they are considered less White and muh ancient civilization

 

[TsarTsar444]

Brainwashed Western Sheeps will always side with Greeks rather than Macedonians cuz they are considered less White and muh ancient civilization

Whats absolutely ironic is that the original west/east divide in Europe started with the split from the Roman Empire, the west being the roots of a future latin catholic europe and the east a greek orthodox europe. Majority of the slavs themselves who speak in Cyrillic do so because of the students of Cyril and Methodius who invented the language, and the letters themselves are modified from glagolic which was inspired by the greek alphabet. The unique style of churches in Bulgaria, Macedonia, Serbia, Bosnia, Romania, Ukraine are all Byzantine Greek inspired architecture, the orthodox clergy learns greek on top of church slavonic.

Its bonkers when you go somewhere like r/Greece and ask who do you feel closer to, Bulgaria or Serbia, and majority would say neither, we are closest to Italy and Spain, and half at least would say we are western Europeans the insane irony here, Greeks the ones who shaped balkan cultures today would claim Spaniards being closer to them kekekek.

Don't get me started on the Greeks saying they aren't Balkan. I can see this one somewhat more logically at least. The islands and Peloponnese and maybeee Athens is south European, but the other half of Greece is definitely Balkan, you couldn't tell you are in Epirus or Albania if you randomly got teleported in the country side there, or rural North Macedonia and Aegean Macedonia.

Tbh im going to make a map of which places i believe are actually Balkans, i dont even mean like just coloring the whole country, but will put different shades of the same color fading out to white when it reaches a non Balkan country