Why exactly is suicide seen as so evil? At least to some

[imontheloose]

I didn’t choose to be born, rhetorically granted as a right to life so surely it warrants a right to death too? At first, the connection seems rather childish, but seriously have a little think. I’m not trying to just say, if X, can I also not X?

Essentially, a right to freedom of speech also warrants a right to not speak at all. If I’m under compulsory (?) speech, that isn’t exactly respecting my freedom of speech. Just like how forcing (?) I, or anyone for the sake of argument, to stay alive isn’t respecting mine/their right to life.

Is it just religious doctrine which has borderline propagandised it? The utilitarian argument of it harming those around you seems rather odd when extrapolated. The core belief itself is absurd, anyway.

I’ve seen this spoken about before and people mostly agree, honestly. Initially, I saw this spoken about, and consequently taken inspiration from a video I watched about a year ago briefly mentioning this.

 

[guttedd]

Because death isn’t cool dude!

 

[ikramy]

Idk dude life isn’t that serious and you gonna die anyways so just live through it

 

[iblamemandible7]

Its not really seen as evil by normal people only a few religious copers think that

 

[sandro]

Probably because suicide will affect the people close to you, leading to their newly formed traumas. also a possibility of social death for some like your family, which will raise the suicide rate as people with social death want to kill themselves as well
Suicide is seen as evil apart from religious terms, in the way that you'll ruin others for the sake of your peace
No ones stopping you, just your empathy for others
main reason i don't kms either

 

[imontheloose]

Its not really seen as evil by normal people only a few religious copers think that

Do you think so? I feel like it’s quite looked down upon universally beyond it affecting the person sympathising. Perhaps religious influence on culture, I guess?

 

[neurosis]

if oga boga kill self then oga boga no do work for tribe

 

[imontheloose]

Probably because suicide will affect the people close to you, leading to their newly formed traumas. also a possibility of social death for some like your family, which will raise the suicide rate as people with social death want to kill themselves as well
Suicide is seen as evil apart from religious terms, in the way that you'll ruin others for the sake of your peace
No ones stopping you, just your empathy for others
main reason i don't kms either

Well, that’s the utilitarian argument which I think is rather silly granted utilitarianism is rather silly in its blanket form.

 

[VV62]

suicide scares them not because its wrong but cause it proves the lie doesnt work they build a world on meaning on god on love and you standing at the edge unmoved ruins the illusion you choose death you choose freedom real freedom not that polished lie they sell in ads and church pews they call it selfish because they cant bear the thought someone saw through it you didnt ask to be born but now youre expected to play the game like it matters existence is a joke told by biology to pass on genes and you the punchline but still you stare into the void and it stares back and maybe it doesnt blink but maybe you do maybe that blink is life clawing for one more breath not out of hope
just habit and habit is all thats left after god dies

 

[iblamemandible7]

Do you think so? I feel like it’s quite looked down upon universally beyond it affecting the person sympathising. Perhaps religious influence on culture, I guess?

Idk where youre at, im in the usa and its not really seen as something evil or malicious, maybe some of the older generation think that but theyre in the minority, people just see it as sad

 

[Samsepioler]

Well lets say ur parents csre about you(they dont) and THEY DEEPLY LOVE YOU(they dont) and one dsy u kil yourself and ur gone from their life.

 

[shia.jihadist]

the jew wants you for labour

 

[imontheloose]

suicide scares them not because its wrong but cause it proves the lie doesnt work they build a world on meaning on god on love and you standing at the edge unmoved ruins the illusion you choose death you choose freedom real freedom not that polished lie they sell in ads and church pews they call it selfish because they cant bear the thought someone saw through it you didnt ask to be born but now youre expected to play the game like it matters existence is a joke told by biology to pass on genes and you the punchline but still you stare into the void and it stares back and maybe it doesnt blink but maybe you do maybe that blink is life clawing for one more breath not out of hope
just habit and habit is all thats left after god dies

What is this lie? Are you speaking about religious folk? I don’t really see it as this miraculous freedom you say. I think it’s more so an easy escape. Or is that your definition of freedom here that I’m missing?

Some may view it as closeted cowardice?

 

[lastredeemer]

I didn’t choose to be born, rhetorically granted as a right to life so surely it warrants a right to death too? At first, the connection seems rather childish, but seriously have a little think. I’m not trying to just say, if X, can I also not X?

Essentially, a right to freedom of speech also warrants a right to not speak at all. If I’m under compulsory (?) speech, that isn’t exactly respecting my freedom of speech. Just like how forcing (?) I, or anyone for the sake of argument, to stay alive isn’t respecting mine/their right to life.

Is it just religious doctrine which has borderline propagandised it? The utilitarian argument of it harming those around you seems rather odd when extrapolated. The core belief itself is absurd, anyway.

I’ve seen this spoken about before and people mostly agree, honestly. Initially, I saw this spoken about, and consequently taken inspiration from a video I watched about a year ago briefly mentioning this.

Because killing yourself is for Low T sissy boys only sissies give up.

 

[imontheloose]

Idk where youre at, im in the usa and its not really seen as something evil or malicious, maybe some of the older generation think that but theyre in the minority, people just see it as sad

I’m in the UK!

the jew wants you for labour

Ali Ali Ali Ali Ali!!!

 

[sandro]

Well, that’s the utilitarian argument which I think is rather silly granted utilitarianism is rather silly in its blanket form.

not talking abt evil but you could also say that people argue for suicide not being actually 100% wanted by a person and its just an act of selfishness, that you can always overcome the mental illness, crisis or trauma, yeah life isn't always good but you shouldn't kill yourself cause thats what your brain thinks in that moment

but about evil: its probably cultural conditioning and the nurturing of suicide being recognized as evil, as gatis says "breinvashd"
and also social value of life, that you're gifted the chance of living and you're throwing it away, when people other than you dream of living another day

 

[JasGews69x]

less shekels from the goyim

 

[imontheloose]

not talking abt evil but you could also say that people argue for suicide not being actually 100% wanted by a person and its just an act of selfishness, that you can always overcome the mental illness, crisis or trauma, yeah life isn't always good but you shouldn't kill yourself cause thats what your brain thinks in that moment

but about evil: its probably cultural conditioning and the nurturing of suicide being recognized as evil, as gatis says "breinvashd"
and also social value of life, that you're gifted the chance of living and you're throwing it away, when people other than you dream of living another day

This value of life is similar to the right of life I mentioned. Also, I do think there is going to be cases, if not rather abundant, of people being as close to certain as possible.

Unless you claim not everyone can be totally certain, which is fair enough, but then the argument collapses.

 

[VV62]

What is this lie? Are you speaking about religious folk? I don’t really see it as this miraculous freedom you say. I think it’s more so an easy escape. Or is that your definition of freedom here that I’m missing?

Some may view it as closeted cowardice?

no the lie isnt just religion though religion is its oldest mask the lie is meaning the idea that life must be something that suffering is noble that love saves that success redeems they feed it to you in stories in schools in smiles from people who already gave up inside freedom in this sense isnt waving a flag or screaming your truth into a void
its the moment you see there is no grand design and still choose not out of fear not out of duty not to please or survive but to act on a truth so raw it burns your name off your skin
suicide
some call it cowardice but they mistake comfort for courage they kneel to routine call it strength
but a man staring into nothing
knowing it holds no reward no salvation and still choosing to step through that isnt cowardice that is something else entirely maybe the only real choice left in a world where everything else was made for you
but easy?no easy is lying to yourself easy is pretending the mask fits

 

[imontheloose]

less shekels from the goyim

I have to now tax their inheritance.

Boo-hoo to the Jew! He’ll always win!

 

[imontheloose]

no the lie isnt just religion though religion is its oldest mask the lie is meaning the idea that life must be something that suffering is noble that love saves that success redeems they feed it to you in stories in schools in smiles from people who already gave up inside freedom in this sense isnt waving a flag or screaming your truth into a void
its the moment you see there is no grand design and still choose not out of fear not out of duty not to please or survive but to act on a truth so raw it burns your name off your skin
suicide
some call it cowardice but they mistake comfort for courage they kneel to routine call it strength
but a man staring into nothing
knowing it holds no reward no salvation and still choosing to step through that isnt cowardice that is something else entirely maybe the only real choice left in a world where everything else was made for you
but easy?no easy is lying to yourself easy is pretending the mask fits

I feel like suffering being seen as noble is more a Christian doctrine. I get suffering, to an extent, can be poetically beautiful, but it gets rather odd and extreme. It’s why suicide even exists, or at least to the levels it’s at.

Point taken, however.

 

[wollet2]

i dont believe most people view it as evil atleast nowadays, more sad because of wasted potential, circumstances that lead to this and so on

 

[imontheloose]

i dont believe most people view it as evil atleast nowadays, more sad because of wasted potential/circumstances that lead to this and so on

I see. I understand the sympathy part. Perhaps I’m misrepresenting the true beliefs of people.

 

[imontheloose]

@wishIwasSalludon i imagine you agree with me here. This seems like something we would agree on.

 

[copercel123]

I didn’t choose to be born, rhetorically granted as a right to life so surely it warrants a right to death too? At first, the connection seems rather childish, but seriously have a little think. I’m not trying to just say, if X, can I also not X?

Essentially, a right to freedom of speech also warrants a right to not speak at all. If I’m under compulsory (?) speech, that isn’t exactly respecting my freedom of speech. Just like how forcing (?) I, or anyone for the sake of argument, to stay alive isn’t respecting mine/their right to life.

Is it just religious doctrine which has borderline propagandised it? The utilitarian argument of it harming those around you seems rather odd when extrapolated. The core belief itself is absurd, anyway.

I’ve seen this spoken about before and people mostly agree, honestly. Initially, I saw this spoken about, and consequently taken inspiration from a video I watched about a year ago briefly mentioning this.

Suicide is a good thing lowkey.

You can end this life whenever you want.

Better than not being able to.

 

[imontheloose]

Suicide is a good thing lowkey.

You can end this life whenever you want.

Better than not being able to.

Agreed! I do feel sorry for the one undergoing it in the sense that they almost always suffer before their end, but it isn’t evil at the very least.

 

[Andremln]

suicide is for the optimistic, i have nothing to live or die for

#cornball #sixseven #whatthehelly

 

[wishIwasSalludon]

@wishIwasSalludon i imagine you agree with me here. This seems like something we would agree on.

It’s seen as evil because dead people aren’t useful to society

You can’t be a worker drone if ur dead.

And it’s especially imperative now go demonize suicide considering how depressing society is in modern times

Personally I think suicide should be a human right, if you have a right to life that also means you have a right to death

 

[copercel123]

Agreed! I do feel sorry for the one undergoing it in the sense that they almost always suffer before their end, but it isn’t evil at the very least.

Why do you think “almost always”?
anyone who has the IQ of at least 100 will kill himslef with ways that won’t hurt him, like jumping off a building, or shooting himself either a shotgun etc.

Most of the people kill themself in ways that won’t make them feel any pain.

 

[imontheloose]

It’s seen as evil because dead people aren’t useful to society

You can’t be a worker drone if ur dead.

And it’s especially imperative now go demonize suicide considering how depressing society is in modern times

Personally I think suicide should be a human right, if you have a right to life that also means you have a right to death

Interesting. So, would you think suicide would be less demonised if, under a vacuum, birth rates were higher? Is the low birth rate making workers much more valuable considering a decline in population? They do just replace them with migrants, however.

Your last paragraph is verbatim to what I said! We agree! Alas.

 

[imontheloose]

Why do you think “almost always”?
anyone who has the IQ of at least 100 will kill himslef with ways that won’t hurt him, like jumping off a building, or shooting himself either a shotgun etc.

Most of the people kill themself in ways that aren’t really able to hurt them.

Nooo, I don’t mean physically. I’m referring to the actual desire for suicide requires a deep suffering, generally. The method can be easily figured out.

 

[copercel123]

Nooo, I don’t mean physically. I’m referring to the actual desire for suicide requires a deep suffering, generally. The method can be easily figured out.

Ohhhh!
Yeah if you talked mentally then yes, that’s the reason people kill themself… because they can’t take their suffer anymore.

I feel bad for these people aswell, and the worst part is they dont talk about their mental state in general.

 

[imontheloose]

Ohhhh!
Yeah if you talked mentally then yes, that’s the reason people kill themself… because they can’t take there suffer anymore.

Precisely. That’s where I sympathise. The utilitarian idea that it’s passed onto others is a doctrine which fails a lot if you take it black and white as your moral framework. If you concede either it isn’t applicable to all circumstances, or that there is grey area, you’ve essentially conceded the argument.

 

[wishIwasSalludon]

So, would you think suicide would be less demonised if, under a vacuum, birth rates were higher?

Possibly, I’m not sure

But there is a psyop to get people to work themselves as hard as they can

It’s to the point where we create useless jobs that literally do nothing just to get people to work

Like take the doorman at hotels, would society really be worse off if they didn’t exist?

Or even worse corporate lawyers, their entire job is to find legal loop holes in the law to insure monopolies can stay monopolies

Which stifles competition and kills progress, so some of these fake jobs aren’t just useless but actually harmful

 

[nobodylovesme]

I think it's part of the reversal of moral obligation. As everyone assumes you owe something to life, be it people close to you, or abstract ideas like "potential." But by suicide you reverse it that life owed something to you.

That reversal makes people uncomfortable, because itchallenges the structure they rely on to justify suffering.

Life failed the individual, not the other way around.

 

[copercel123]

Precisely. That’s where I sympathise. The utilitarian idea that it’s passed onto others is a doctrine which fails a lot if you take it black and white as your moral framework. If you concede either it isn’t applicable to all circumstances, or that there is grey area, you’ve essentially conceded the argument.

Yeah, it’s not really the suicide itself, but the pain that drives someone there. People usually don’t want to die, they just want the suffering to stop. And that whole “it hurts others so it’s wrong” argument feels kinda unfair, like telling someone to stay alive just for everyone else’s sake.
I think people get scared of suicide because it forces them to face that life isn’t always fair or meaningful, and that messes with their comfort more than anything else. So they judge it to protect themselves, not to help….

 

[imontheloose]

Possibly, I’m not sure

But there is a psyop to get people to work themselves as hard as they can

It’s to the point where we create useless jobs that literally do nothing just to get people to work

Like take the doorman at hotels, would society really be worse off if they didn’t exist?

Or even worse corporate lawyers, their entire job is to find legal loop holes in the law to insure monopolies can stay monopolies

Which stifles competition and kills progress, so some of these fake jobs aren’t just useless but actually harmful

I do notice this. Fair.

 

[registerfasterusing]

Cuz if ur dead u cant work

 

[imontheloose]

I think it's part of the reversal of moral obligation. As everyone assumes you owe something to life, be it people close to you, or abstract ideas like "potential." But by suicide you reverse it that life owed something to you.

That reversal makes people uncomfortable, because itchallenges the structure they rely on to justify suffering.

Life failed the individual, not the other way around.

This is quite the fair argument, honestly. I like this. I was going to interject and say that not everyone amongst those who committed suicide expected good from life, but upon some quick reflection, they actually did. Even ideas like “life is cruel”, “what did I do?”, “society is wicked”, you know what I’m getting at, all include the given that you expected it or at least feel like it’s wrong that it isn’t there.

 

[imontheloose]

Yeah, it’s not really the suicide itself, but the pain that drives someone there. People usually don’t want to die, they just want the suffering to stop. And that whole “it hurts others so it’s wrong” argument feels kinda unfair, like telling someone to stay alive just for everyone else’s sake.
I think people get scared of suicide because it forces them to face that life isn’t always fair or meaningful, and that messes with their comfort more than anything else. So they judge it to protect themselves, not to help….

Yeah, utilitarianism is silly to me.

 

[registerfasterusing]

I think it's part of the reversal of moral obligation. As everyone assumes you owe something to life, be it people close to you, or abstract ideas like "potential." But by suicide you reverse it that life owed something to you.

That reversal makes people uncomfortable, because itchallenges the structure they rely on to justify suffering.

Life failed the individual, not the other way around.

great point, ppl rely on concepts like potentiality to justify a linear progression of society

 

[svarddre]

You do your entire family lineage a disservice if you kill yourself before passing on the genes. Niggas survived wars, famines and plagues just for some sad sissy to end the family jfl

 

[Abdullahm06]

high iq
its possible suicide is just seen as evil so people dont kill themselves so they can still work and pay taxes innit

 

[imontheloose]

You do your entire family lineage a disservice if you kill yourself before passing on the genes. Niggas survived wars, famines and plagues just for some sad sissy to end the family jfl

Utilitarianism is a failed framework.

 

[imontheloose]

high iq
its possible suicide is just seen as evil so people dont kill themselves so they can still work and pay taxes innit

Seems probable to me after what everyone has said. @wishIwasSalludon and @nobodylovesme said this fantastically. Feel free to scroll up and read what they said. I’ll be honest, I initially didn’t believe it.

 

[superpsycho]

no clue, all sub 4 men in the west should have full access to euthanasia if they desire it

 

[imontheloose]

no clue, all sub 4 men in the west should have full access to euthanasia if they desire it

Everyone should. Not just the genetically doomed. Although the genetically doomed will be the ones using it primarily, point taken.

 

[superpsycho]

Everyone should. Not just the genetically doomed. Although the genetically doomed will be the ones using it primarily, point taken.

a futurama-esque society where they have random suicide booths open to the public would be ideal (peak show if you havent watched already btw

 

[imontheloose]

a futurama-esque society where they have random suicide booths open to the public would be ideal (peak show if you havent watched already btw

Oh dear. I remember watching that around a decade ago or so! Probably a bit longer.

 

[superpsycho]

Oh dear. I remember watching that around a decade ago or so! Probably a bit longer.

i watched that series from start to finish 7 times during covid

i was obsessed with that shit

non-NT incel show looking back on it tbh, those type of shows are still the most entertaining though