15y | Last update on my stack

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

shut up bitch

if your that concerned about your health then don’t even go near drugs in the first place

no shit if you wanna actually grow taller your gonna have to deal with the sides. men absence of estrogen or problems with aromatizatiom have abnormally tall stature

and nigga you aren’t gonna fucking turn into a skeleton from letrozole, bone loss side effects are heavily overestimated

if your getting all the proper bone supplements it’s not that deep, it’s only brutal if you have a vitamin d deficiency or sum shit

You're making false claims and ignoring basic endocrinology

1. "men absence of estrogen or problems with aromatizatiom have abnormally tall stature" this only applies to cases of complete estrogen receptor dysfunction like aromatase deficiency or estrogen receptor mutations which is a rare genetic disorder. for someone in late puberty estrogen is important for proper growth plate function. nuking estrogen completely with high dose letrozole will not magically extend growth its more likely to accelerate plate fusion

2. "bone loss side effects are overestimated" no they arent?? estrogen is important for bone remodeling thats why men with low estrogen from ai overuse develop osteopenia, osteoporosis and increased fracture risk. you think "taking bone supplements" is enough but calcium and vit d dont replace estrogens role in regulating osteoblast and osteoclast activity. bone loss isnt instant its gradual but by the time you feel it the damage is already done

3. "if your that concerned about your health then don’t even go near drugs in the first place" this is a cope argument the point is to use peds intelligently by understanding their risks and not just blindly maxing doses and hoping for the best. even bodybuilders who use ais monitor their estrogen levels because too much suppression leads to joint pain, weak bones, and bad cardiovasular health

4. "if you wanna actually grow taller your gonna have to deal with the sides." theres a difference between calculated risk and autism. moderate estrogen suppression makes sense but nuking it with 2.5mg letrozole ed is unnecessary and retarded. heightmaxxing isnt just about killing estrogen its about optimizing gh, igf-1 and keeping estrogen in a controlled range

if you really understood how hormone modulation works you wouldnt be saying that boneloss from ai overloss is "not that deep" you dont feel osteoporosis in 3 months but when ur joints start degenerating in a few years ur gonna be wishing you didnt nuke ur estrogen for a few extra millimeters

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

You're making false claims and ignoring basic endocrinology

1. "men absence of estrogen or problems with aromatizatiom have abnormally tall stature" this only applies to cases of complete estrogen receptor dysfunction like aromatase deficiency or estrogen receptor mutations which is a rare genetic disorder. for someone in late puberty estrogen is important for proper growth plate function. nuking estrogen completely with high dose letrozole will not magically extend growth its more likely to accelerate plate fusion

2. "bone loss side effects are overestimated" no they arent?? estrogen is important for bone remodeling thats why men with low estrogen from ai overuse develop osteopenia, osteoporosis and increased fracture risk. you think "taking bone supplements" is enough but calcium and vit d dont replace estrogens role in regulating osteoblast and osteoclast activity. bone loss isnt instant its gradual but by the time you feel it the damage is already done

3. "if your that concerned about your health then don’t even go near drugs in the first place" this is a cope argument the point is to use peds intelligently by understanding their risks and not just blindly maxing doses and hoping for the best. even bodybuilders who use ais monitor their estrogen levels because too much suppression leads to joint pain, weak bones, and bad cardiovasular health

4. "if you wanna actually grow taller your gonna have to deal with the sides." theres a difference between calculated risk and autism. moderate estrogen suppression makes sense but nuking it with 2.5mg letrozole ed is unnecessary and retarded. heightmaxxing isnt just about killing estrogen its about optimizing gh, igf-1 and keeping estrogen in a controlled range

if you really understood how hormone modulation works you wouldnt be saying that boneloss from ai overloss is "not that deep" you dont feel osteoporosis in 3 months but when ur joints start degenerating in a few years ur gonna be wishing you didnt nuke ur estrogen for a few extra millimeters

you cannot possibly expect me to read allat at 11 pm

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

nobody healthy has ever had brutal bone loss sides from lack of estrogen

saying "nobody healthy has had bone loss from lack of estrogen" is pure cope and the scientific reality is that excessive ai use leads to weaker bones, worse joint health, and higher injury risk. if you retard understood endocrinology you wouldnt be claiming shit like this

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

you cannot possibly expect me to read allat at 11 pm

if you can spam letrozole studies like an autistic cunt without understanding them then your ass can read a basic explanation on why you're wrong and retarded. the fact that you refuse to read counterarguments but still push misinformation shows that you're just coping and dont really care about the science.

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

if you can spam letrozole studies like an autistic cunt without understanding them then your ass can read a basic explanation on why you're wrong and retarded. the fact that you refuse to read counterarguments but still push misinformation shows that you're just coping and dont really care about the science.

nigga im sorry i want to go to fucking sleep instead of arguring about the same topic for the 29th time

debate about it with @JCaesar

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

nigga im sorry i want to go to fucking sleep instead of arguring about the same topic for the 29th time

debate about it with @JCaesar

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

your obviously retarded

grey color
absolutely retarded name
and your pfp


im not listening to shit you say

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

and I hope you know the women who actually noticed bone loss has been blasting letrozole for 5+ fucking years

most height protocols last for 1-3 years

 

[JCaesar]

nigga im sorry i want to go to fucking sleep instead of arguring about the same topic for the 29th time

debate about it with @JCaesar

Hello saar indian tech support called what seems to be ze problem

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

Hello saar indian tech support called what seems to be ze problem

this grey keeps yapping about muhh letrozole sides

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

your obviously retarded

grey color
absolutely retarded name
and your pfp


im not listening to shit you say

ruh roh!!!

 

[JCaesar]

this grey keeps yapping about muhh letrozole sides

Mmm smells like ze cope yes saar @sharpnimbustoilet98 have you ever used letrozole yourself saar?

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

ruh roh!!!

AIs were previously reported to be associated with vertebral irregularities in a group of boys with ISS or constitutional growth delay treated with letrozole (17, 18, 27). We therefore carefully assessed vertebral changes focusing on the thoracic spine. We found no differences in the three groups for disc space narrowing, wedging, compression, and overall vertebral irregularities during the 24-month treatment. Actually, some of these findings were present at baseline, and some were no longer detected (such as compression) as treatment progressed. The extent of these abnormalities was indeed very mild and was similar to those commonly seen in short adolescents (28, 29). Bone pain questionnaires did not reveal any differences between groups (data not shown). Overall, the use of AIs, either alone or in combination, was not detrimental to bone health when used for up to 3 years.

Overall, the use of AIs, either alone or in combination, was not detrimental to bone health when used for up to 3 years.

stupid faggot you happy now?

i hope you know were not women who are gonna blast AI for more then 5+ years jfl

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

Mmm smells like ze cope yes saar @sharpnimbustoilet98 have you ever used letrozole yourself saar?

sarrr my bones disentregated after taking 6.25 mg of aromasin

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

and I hope you know the women who actually noticed bone loss has been blasting letrozole for 5+ fucking years

most height protocols last for 1-3 years

ur acting like bone loss only happens after 5+ years but the reality is bmd decline starts much sooner when estrogen is suppressed too hard. a 1-3 year height protocol doesnt make 2.5 mg letrozole magically safe.

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

ur acting like bone loss only happens after 5+ years but the reality is bmd decline starts much sooner when estrogen is suppressed too hard. a 1-3 year height protocol doesnt make 2.5 mg letrozole magically safe.

keep coping

actually LOl at your subhuman genes if you actually face severe bone loss side effects from AI

 

[JCaesar]

ur acting like bone loss only happens after 5+ years but the reality is bmd decline starts much sooner when estrogen is suppressed too hard. a 1-3 year height protocol doesnt make 2.5 mg letrozole magically safe.

Is 10mg of letrozole every day safe saar?

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

AIs were previously reported to be associated with vertebral irregularities in a group of boys with ISS or constitutional growth delay treated with letrozole (17, 18, 27). We therefore carefully assessed vertebral changes focusing on the thoracic spine. We found no differences in the three groups for disc space narrowing, wedging, compression, and overall vertebral irregularities during the 24-month treatment. Actually, some of these findings were present at baseline, and some were no longer detected (such as compression) as treatment progressed. The extent of these abnormalities was indeed very mild and was similar to those commonly seen in short adolescents (28, 29). Bone pain questionnaires did not reveal any differences between groups (data not shown). Overall, the use of AIs, either alone or in combination, was not detrimental to bone health when used for up to 3 years.

Overall, the use of AIs, either alone or in combination, was not detrimental to bone health when used for up to 3 years.

stupid faggot you happy now?

i hope you know were not women who are gonna blast AI for more then 5+ years jfl

ur cherry picking and misinterpreting the study

1. the study only assessed vertebral abnormalities not full bone density loss (just because it specifically looked at vertebral irregularities (disc narrowing, wedging, compression) in boys with iss and found no issues in 24 months doesnt mean ai use has no effect on bmd those are two different things

2. multiple studies still show reduced bmd from ai use even in short term protocols. the same studies on letrozole for height mention that bone density should be monitored because estrogen suppresion increases fracture risk over time. thats why patients on ai protocols for height are given calcium, vitamin d and sometimes bisphosphonates.

3. the thing about women blasting ais for 5 years is irrelevant. men also rely on estrogen for bone health even short term supression has been linked to weaker bones, joint pain and higher fracture risk. just because women experience more severe long term effects doesnt mean men are immune the reason ai heightmaxxing protocols are limited to a few years is because of these risks.

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

keep coping

actually LOl at your subhuman genes if you actually face severe bone loss side effects from AI

imagine thinking bone metabolism is based on genetics alone and not basic endocrinology. you're trying to meme ur way out of this reality. letrozole at 2.5 mg ed is very aggressive and pretending bone loss is just bad genetics is peak delusion

 

[Deleted member 77820]

if you think basic endocrinology and clinical research is tiktokcel knowledge then you clearly dont get how letrozole and estrogen regulation work

Nigga Sartan blocks Mtor and lower igf-1 wdymn basic knowledge wheoyou don’t even know that

 

[stefthetics]

This is the stack i will use, so last time that i will bother any of you. What do y’all think? Right now i’m busy with making a crypto account to buy these everything else is already ready.

Roid / Peptide / Sarm stack :

6iu hgh ed
6.25mg aromasin ed
t4 100mcg
2x250mg test e weekly
2x150mg masteron weekly
2x250iu hcg weekly
Anadrol 100mg eod

Vitamins / Minerals / Acids stack :

Cod liver oil 1g
Vitamine D 5000iu
Vitamine K 200mcg
Magnesium 300mg
MSM 750mg
TUDCA 250mg
Berberine 500mg

pros and cons ?

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

ur cherry picking and misinterpreting the study

1. the study only assessed vertebral abnormalities not full bone density loss (just because it specifically looked at vertebral irregularities (disc narrowing, wedging, compression) in boys with iss and found no issues in 24 months doesnt mean ai use has no effect on bmd those are two different things

2. multiple studies still show reduced bmd from ai use even in short term protocols. the same studies on letrozole for height mention that bone density should be monitored because estrogen suppresion increases fracture risk over time. thats why patients on ai protocols for height are given calcium, vitamin d and sometimes bisphosphonates.

3. the thing about women blasting ais for 5 years is irrelevant. men also rely on estrogen for bone health even short term supression has been linked to weaker bones, joint pain and higher fracture risk. just because women experience more severe long term effects doesnt mean men are immune the reason ai heightmaxxing protocols are limited to a few years is because of these risks.

nigga i never said it doesnt reduce bmd, im talking about the fact you think it "disintegrates your bones and joints", my point is that the sides from it arent as severe as you make it out to be

your mixing up risk and causation too much

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Is 10mg of letrozole every day safe saar?

strawman detected!!

i never said "any ai dose is dangerous no matter what" i said 2.5mg letrozole ed for 1-3 years isnt magically safe just because its not 5+ years

1. 10mg letrozole ed is mega retarded and non comparable. thats basically body builder tier ai abuse used to completely shut down estrogen in steroid cycles. you're trying to mock the argument by exaggerating to an extreme that nobody suggested

2. 2.5mg ed letrozole is still way too much for height maxxing protocols. even in clinical studies ai dosing is monitored and adjusted not blindly maxed out. bmd decline has been observed within a year in letrozole height maxxing studies which is why bone scans, vit d, and calcium support are included

try harder next time

 

[Deleted member 102846]

Im shocked at how many 15 year olds use this site

It's around the age where you start worrying about your looks + tiktok is making blackpill mainstream and sucking in new youngin greys

 

[MyDreamIsToBe183CM]

imagine thinking bone metabolism is based on genetics alone and not basic endocrinology. you're trying to meme ur way out of this reality. letrozole at 2.5 mg ed is very aggressive and pretending bone loss is just bad genetics is peak delusion

anywayas dnrd nigga

goting to sleep mate im tired of argurinig with you, debate with the other guy

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

nigga i never said it doesnt reduce bmd, im talking about the fact you think it "disintegrates your bones and joints", my point is that the sides from it arent as severe as you make it out to be

your mixing up risk and causation too much

i never said ai use instantly "disintegrates" bones and joints. my point is that letrozole at 2.5mg ed for years aint risk free and bmd loss is gradual but a real problem

1. bmd decline = higher fracture risk even if you dont feel it immediately. you legit admit that letrozole reduces bmd so you're alr conceding the risk. bone loss isnt something you "feel" until its too late osteopenia and osteoporosis develop silently and by the time fractures occur the damage is done

2. the severity depends on the dose and duration but the risk is real. clinical studies dont track letrozole heightmaxxing for decades so there isnt any long term data but even short term ai use is monitored because of potential harm. thats why doctors prescribe bone support, monitor bmd and dont just blindly max out the dose.

3. risk = probability of an event happening. causation = directly making an event happen. suppressing estrogen too hard increases the probability of bone loss but it doesnt mean everyone immediately gets osteoporosis however it does mean theres a higher likelihood of weak bones and fractures later.

ur backpedaling now pretending you never downplayed bone loss but you literally said "nobody healthy has ever had brutal bone loss sides from lack of estrogen" now you admit bmd reduction happens but wait for it... suddenly its "not that severe"??? so which is it? either ai use affects bone health (which it does ) or it doesnt. you cant move the goalpost just to avoid admitting ur wrong.

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

anywayas dnrd nigga

goting to sleep mate im tired of argurinig with you, debate with the other guy

classic cope exit

 

[JCaesar]

strawman detected!!

i never said "any ai dose is dangerous no matter what" i said 2.5mg letrozole ed for 1-3 years isnt magically safe just because its not 5+ years

1. 10mg letrozole ed is mega retarded and non comparable. thats basically body builder tier ai abuse used to completely shut down estrogen in steroid cycles. you're trying to mock the argument by exaggerating to an extreme that nobody suggested

2. 2.5mg ed letrozole is still way too much for height maxxing protocols. even in clinical studies ai dosing is monitored and adjusted not blindly maxed out. bmd decline has been observed within a year in letrozole height maxxing studies which is why bone scans, vit d, and calcium support are included

try harder next time

I think my point got misinterpreted, 10mg letrozole ED was what I used and felt perfectly fine with, while fellow sharpnimbustoilet98 here says a dosage 4x smaller than that is le extremely bone-shattering fear-inducing dangerous for you. My question still stands: Have you ever used it yourself?

Funny how people like you are so into the fear mongering of low estrogen causing bone problems, while aromatase deficient men who had near-zero e2 levels all their lives are doing great out there.

Also,

try harder next time

This made you look like this:

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Nigga Sartan blocks Mtor and lower igf-1 wdymn basic knowledge wheoyou don’t even know that

your taking a half truth (telmisartan has some mtor inhibition and igf-1 lowering effects) and misapplying it as if it cancels out the effects of high dose testosterone, which isnt how it works

 

[Deleted member 77820]

your taking a half truth (telmisartan has some mtor inhibition and igf-1 lowering effects) and misapplying it as if it cancels out the effects of high dose testosterone, which isnt how it works

Yes it lowers the effects
If you took 100 mg of test with sartan its like you did nothing

A lot of people get oestroposis when they run sartan in high doses while natty

basically just don’t be tiktokcell and spam nebivol ezitimbe and sartam thinking your actually knowledgeable bio hacker

I mean the only time ill ise those is for prep (basically bodybuilding purposes OR Trt)
If your taking them for lookmaxxing your retarded

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

I think my point got misinterpreted, 10mg letrozole ED was what I used and felt perfectly fine with, while fellow sharpnimbustoilet98 here says a dosage 4x smaller than that is le extremely bone-shattering fear-inducing dangerous for you. My question still stands: Have you ever used it yourself?

Funny how people like you are so into the fear mongering of low estrogen causing bone problems, while aromatase deficient men who had near-zero e2 levels all their lives are doing great out there.

Also,

This made you look like this:

View attachment 3562217

personal anecdotes ≠ scientific evidence

1. using 10mg letrozole ed and claiming that you felt fine is not proof that its safe. just because you didnt feel bone loss doesnt mean it didnt happen. osteopenia and osteoporosis develop silently you dont "feel" your bones weakening until fractures happen. short term well being ≠ long term safety. many people on steroids feel great until they suddenly drop dead from a heart attack

2. aromatase deficient men are not proof that low estrogen is harmless. men born with aromatase deficiency suffer from osteoporosis, stunted bone maturation, and joint problems which in fact has been documented in multiple case studies. their bones are only "doing great" if they're put on estrogen replacement therapy cause without it they develop severe skeletal issues.

3. your trying to turn this into a "have you ever used it?" argument instead of actually addressing the science. whether or not i have used letrozole has nothing to do with the biological reality of estrogens role in bone health. you wouldnt say "have you ever had a heart attack? no? then you cant talk about cardiovascular disease" thats just not how logic works.

your entire response is just "brah i took it and im fine" + a meme instead of engaging with actual endocrinology. if your going to argue then atleast bring scientific evidence not just your personal experience and an attempt at a reddit tier roast.

 

[soggra]

Im shocked at how many 15 year olds use this site

I used to use it when i was 15 i am 18 now. Ascended a lot since then

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Yes it lowers the effects
If you took 100 mg of test with sartan its like you did nothing

A lot of people get oestroposis when they run sartan in high doses while natty

basically just don’t be tiktokcell and spam nebivol ezitimbe and sartam thinking your actually knowledgeable bio hacker

I mean the only time ill ise those is for prep (basically bodybuilding purposes OR Trt)
If your taking them for lookmaxxing your retarded

this is blatantly false.

1. telmisartan does not cancel out testosterones anabolic effects. if telmisartan completely neutralized testosterone then trt patients using telmisartan wouldnt see any androgenic effects... yet they do??? even at high doses telmisartans mtor inhibition is nowhere near strong enough to erase the muscle building effects of exogenous testosterone.

2. osteoporosis from sartans??? source? show me one study proving that properly dosed telmisartan causes osteoporosis in healthy men. sartans dont suppress estrogen instead they regulate bp, inflammation and oxidative stress. they actually have bone protective effects in certain cases.

"basically just don’t be tiktokcell and spam nebivol ezitimbe and sartam thinking your actually knowledgeable bio hacker"

so now using cardioprotective compounds makes you a "tiktokcell"??? nebivolol = selective beta blocker that improves endothelial function and reduces heart strain. ezetimibe = reduces ldl cholesterol helping to counteract steroid induced lipid crashes. telmisartan = lowers bp, reduces arterial stiffness, and has protective metabolic effects. these are medically proven drugs for preventing steroid induced damage. body builders use them not because they are "tiktok biohackers" but because peds wreck cardiovascular health

"I mean the only time ill ise those is for prep (basically bodybuilding purposes OR Trt) If your taking them for lookmaxxing your retarded"

so you admit they have a use in trt and bodybuilding but somehow think they're useless for looksmaxxxing? cardiovascular health is a part of longevity and aesthetics. nobody looks good when they're bloated, inflamed, or dealing with high bp. running gear without lipid and bp management is actually whats retarded your just setting yourself up for an early heart attack.

ur lit rejecting proven cardioprotective drugs based on zero evidence while pushing the idea that sartans erase test which isnt true.. maybe read an actual study on androgen metabolism and cardio vascular health

 

[JCaesar]

1. using 10mg letrozole ed and claiming that you felt fine is not proof that its safe. just because you didnt feel bone loss doesnt mean it didnt happen. osteopenia and osteoporosis develop silently you dont "feel" your bones weakening until fractures happen. short term well being ≠ long term safety. many people on steroids feel great until they suddenly drop dead from a heart attack

Sigh, are you really gonna use the same old boomer argument of comparing bodybuilders who use grams of gear combined with insulin, diuretics and stimulants to any other type of drug? I'm not gonna call you low IQ for that, but it shows you're either willingly being ignorant or severely misinformed.

2. aromatase deficient men are not proof that low estrogen is harmless. men born with aromatase deficiency suffer from osteoporosis, stunted bone maturation, and joint problems which in fact has been documented in multiple case studies. their bones are only "doing great" if they're put on estrogen replacement therapy cause without it they develop severe skeletal issues.

Yup, and stunted bone maturation is what we want to achieve, if you even know what that meant before pasting it onto your text.

3. your trying to turn this into a "have you ever used it?" argument instead of actually addressing the science. whether or not i have used letrozole has nothing to do with the biological reality of estrogens role in bone health. you wouldnt say "have you ever had a heart attack? no? then you cant talk about cardiovascular disease" thats just not how logic works.

Just say you haven't touched any of the compounds you talk about man. You're making an obviously unjust comparison, again, you're probably being willingly ignorant with your points.

If someone wants to bake a specific kind of cake, wouldn't it be much more helpful to talk with someone who has made that recipe multiple times before, rather than with a chef that has never heard of it?

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Sigh, are you really gonna use the same old boomer argument of comparing bodybuilders who use grams of gear combined with insulin, diuretics and stimulants to any other type of drug? I'm not gonna call you low IQ for that, but it shows you're either willingly being ignorant or severely misinformed.


Yup, and stunted bone maturation is what we want to achieve, if you even know what that meant before pasting it onto your text.


Just say you haven't touched any of the compounds you talk about man. You're making an obviously unjust comparison, again, you're probably being willingly ignorant with your points.

If someone wants to bake a specific kind of cake, wouldn't it be much more helpful to talk with someone who has made that recipe multiple times before, rather than with a chef that has never heard of it?

you completely missed the point


1. the comparison wasnt about bodybuilders vs letrozole users it was about how short term "feeling fine" ≠ long term safety. people feel fine on steroids until they suddenly dont. the absence of immediate side effects doesnt mean a drug is harmless. bone loss happens gradually by the time you feel it the damage is already done </3

Yup, and stunted bone maturation is what we want to achieve, if you even know what that meant before pasting it onto your text.

2. you dont understand what stunted bone maturation actually means. stunted bone maturation in aromatase deficient men is NOT the same as extending growth plate activity for height. their bones dont mature properly because they LACK estrogen entirely. they end up with osteoporosis, weak bone structure, and joint issues not just extra height. if your argument is gonna be "aromatase deficient men have stunted bone maturation so lets replicate that by nuking estrogen " then your fundamentally misunderstanding their condition.

Just say you haven't touched any of the compounds you talk about man. You're making an obviously unjust comparison, again, you're probably being willingly ignorant with your points.

3. this is just another attempt to dodge the actual argument. whether or not i've used letrozole doesnt change how estrogen works in the body. you wouldnt say "you cant talk about heart disease unless you had one" so why apply that logic here??

If someone wants to bake a specific kind of cake, wouldn't it be much more helpful to talk with someone who has made that recipe multiple times before, rather than with a chef that has never heard of it?

4. thats just a bad analogy lmfao. a better analogy would be "just because someone has eaten a cake 100 times doesnt mean they understand the nutritional science behind it". experience ≠ scientific understanding just cause you ran 10mg letrozole without noticing immediate issues doesnt mean it's safe long term.

your entire response is just an appeal to personal experience + dodging actual endocrinology. if you actually wanna argue then address the biological mechanisms of estrogen in bone health instead of repeating "b-b-but i felt fine :3"

 

[JCaesar]

1. the comparison wasnt about bodybuilders vs letrozole users it was about how short term "feeling fine" ≠ long term safety. people feel fine on steroids until they suddenly dont. the absence of immediate side effects doesnt mean a drug is harmless. bone loss happens gradually by the time you feel it the damage is already done </3

Nigga what "damage" are you talking about? Bone density reduction on AIs is minimal even when it happens, WOMEN who have less bone density than males tend to have their bone density reduced by 2-3% per YEAR of use. That's simple to recover and if you're not retarded you can manipulate it to be even less. And again, most people probably won't even get it or barely get any at all.

Also holy shit stop using those stupid ass emoticons you fucking nigger, you're not on twitter and you're not a cute anime girl to be writing like that you're an unlovable arab truecel. Sorry but you actually managed to pmo with that congrats.

2. you dont understand what stunted bone maturation actually means. stunted bone maturation in aromatase deficient men is NOT the same as extending growth plate activity for height. their bones dont mature properly because they LACK estrogen entirely. they end up with osteoporosis, weak bone structure, and joint issues not just extra height. if your argument is gonna be "aromatase deficient men have stunted bone maturation so lets replicate that by nuking estrogen " then your fundamentally misunderstanding their condition.

Good thing you'd have to use aromatase inhibitors for years on end to have a chance of suffering anything like that as I said above!

3. this is just another attempt to dodge the actual argument. whether or not i've used letrozole doesnt change how estrogen works in the body. you wouldnt say "you cant talk about heart disease unless you had one" so why apply that logic here??

Mate it just contributes to showing how unknowledgeable you are on the subject, to the point you're basing yourself on specific studies and manipulating their extremity to try and induce fear on aromatase inhibitors for some reason.

4. thats just a bad analogy lmfao. a better analogy would be "just because someone has eaten a cake 100 times doesnt mean they understand the nutritional science behind it". experience ≠ scientific understanding just cause you ran 10mg letrozole without noticing immediate issues doesnt mean it's safe long term.

your entire response is just an appeal to personal experience + dodging actual endocrinology. if you actually wanna argue then address the biological mechanisms of estrogen in bone health instead of repeating "b-b-but i felt fine :3"

Except that analogy is wrong, because you're talking to someone who has both eaten the cake 100 times and studied the nutritional science behind it, while you yourself has only read about it on surface-level while never knowing how it tastes.

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Nigga what "damage" are you talking about? Bone density reduction on AIs is minimal even when it happens, WOMEN who have less bone density than males tend to have their bone density reduced by 2-3% per YEAR of use. That's simple to recover and if you're not retarded you can manipulate it to be even less. And again, most people probably won't even get it or barely get any at all.

Also holy shit stop using those stupid ass emoticons you fucking nigger, you're not on twitter and you're not a cute anime girl to be writing like that you're an unlovable arab truecel. Sorry but you actually managed to pmo with that congrats.


Good thing you'd have to use aromatase inhibitors for years on end to have a chance of suffering anything like that as I said above!


Mate it just contributes to showing how unknowledgeable you are on the subject, to the point you're basing yourself on specific studies and manipulating their extremity to try and induce fear on aromatase inhibitors for some reason.


Except that analogy is wrong, because you're talking to someone who has both eaten the cake 100 times and studied the nutritional science behind it, while you yourself has only read about it on surface-level while never knowing how it tastes.

okay now thats outta the way

1. 2-3% bone loss per year is NOT minimal. losing 2-3% annualy is significant especially for adolescents whose peak bone mass is still developing. even a small reduction in bone density increases fracture risk and weakens long term skeletal integrity. recovery isnt guaranteed because bone loss isnt like muscle loss wherfe you just train it back. once its lost its much harder to regain.

2. "Most people wont even get it" is pure cope. clinical studies show that ai use reduces bone mineral density PERIOD individual variability exists but the risk is real not hypothetical

3. resorting to racist insults means you already lost the argument. if you had a real counterpoint you wouldnt need to seethe this hard.

4. no even short term ai use can cause problems. bone loss starts within months not years on end. thats why ai height protocols require bone monitoring and supplementation because the risk is already there.

5. LMAO imagine calling peer reviewed studies "manipulating extremity" just because they dont fit ur narrative. this is literally how science works its data not "bro!! trust me!! please! " anecdotes. ur dismissing actual research because you dont like what it says.

6. your analogy is still garbage. you "eating the cake" (using letrozole) doesnt mean you understand how it works biologically. a researcher studying the cake's ingredients, effects, and interactions knows more than the guy who just eats it. ur literally using "i took it and im fine" as your entire argument which is not scientific proof of safety.

this response was 90% cope and 10% racism. you still havent disproven the basic fact that ais reduce bmd and come with risks. instead of addressing the science you just went full ad hominem and tried to gaslight your way out of a losing argument.

 

[Sadist]

aromasin at 12.5 ed is way too much

eod

 

[Deleted member 77820]

Why dont you check vigorous steves channel and see that they will not effect growth. Also I wrote a list of some ancillaries i didn't sit there and think of every ancillary that exists. Do you think I cba doing that?

This is what I mean by your annoying and try and split hairs and nitpick over peoples posts. You are 100 percent the kid in school that got bullied for being an annoying prick. I would of smacked you in the face for sure.

Im gang affiliated nigga

 

[TitusA]

Im gang affiliated nigga

Lets just agree to stop arguing now. We agree on the majority of things steroid related but disagree on some which is normal.

 

[Deleted member 77820]

this is blatantly false.

1. telmisartan does not cancel out testosterones anabolic effects. if telmisartan completely neutralized testosterone then trt patients using telmisartan wouldnt see any androgenic effects... yet they do??? even at high doses telmisartans mtor inhibition is nowhere near strong enough to erase the muscle building effects of exogenous testosterone.

2. osteoporosis from sartans??? source? show me one study proving that properly dosed telmisartan causes osteoporosis in healthy men. sartans dont suppress estrogen instead they regulate bp, inflammation and oxidative stress. they actually have bone protective effects in certain cases.

"basically just don’t be tiktokcell and spam nebivol ezitimbe and sartam thinking your actually knowledgeable bio hacker"

so now using cardioprotective compounds makes you a "tiktokcell"??? nebivolol = selective beta blocker that improves endothelial function and reduces heart strain. ezetimibe = reduces ldl cholesterol helping to counteract steroid induced lipid crashes. telmisartan = lowers bp, reduces arterial stiffness, and has protective metabolic effects. these are medically proven drugs for preventing steroid induced damage. body builders use them not because they are "tiktok biohackers" but because peds wreck cardiovascular health

"I mean the only time ill ise those is for prep (basically bodybuilding purposes OR Trt) If your taking them for lookmaxxing your retarded"

so you admit they have a use in trt and bodybuilding but somehow think they're useless for looksmaxxxing? cardiovascular health is a part of longevity and aesthetics. nobody looks good when they're bloated, inflamed, or dealing with high bp. running gear without lipid and bp management is actually whats retarded your just setting yourself up for an early heart attack.

ur lit rejecting proven cardioprotective drugs based on zero evidence while pushing the idea that sartans erase test which isnt true.. maybe read an actual study on androgen metabolism and cardio vascular health

1) bro your retarded jfl wtf You confused androgenicity of a compound with anabolism of a compound jfl + when did i say it cancel out testosterone i said it lower its anabolism

2)your retarded they cause oestroposis in antty old men with already high Bo because they already have fckd hormones low igf-1 low T low E2 and poor Mtor signaling because of age lack of exercise and low protein diet so when you add sartan they get oestroposis
If sartan had no effect on anabolism then it wouldn’t have cause oestroposis in men

Nigga yiur a tiktok cell if yiu were actually browsing pubmed you’ll know you could run gear without ever using sartan ezitimbe or nebivolol
Bro its your running a Sprint and you have a rock attached to your legs and you are like uhm should i run like this with my elbows flat or like that with my elbows to the side nigga you should remove the rock
Same thing with roids you should fix the core problem not start using ancillaries

Im gonna finish of with the word “androgen metabolism”

Jfl look at the iq of this retard

@org3cel.RR
@halloweed

 

[Deleted member 77820]

personal anecdotes ≠ scientific evidence

1. using 10mg letrozole ed and claiming that you felt fine is not proof that its safe. just because you didnt feel bone loss doesnt mean it didnt happen. osteopenia and osteoporosis develop silently you dont "feel" your bones weakening until fractures happen. short term well being ≠ long term safety. many people on steroids feel great until they suddenly drop dead from a heart attack

2. aromatase deficient men are not proof that low estrogen is harmless. men born with aromatase deficiency suffer from osteoporosis, stunted bone maturation, and joint problems which in fact has been documented in multiple case studies. their bones are only "doing great" if they're put on estrogen replacement therapy cause without it they develop severe skeletal issues.

3. your trying to turn this into a "have you ever used it?" argument instead of actually addressing the science. whether or not i have used letrozole has nothing to do with the biological reality of estrogens role in bone health. you wouldnt say "have you ever had a heart attack? no? then you cant talk about cardiovascular disease" thats just not how logic works.

your entire response is just "brah i took it and im fine" + a meme instead of engaging with actual endocrinology. if your going to argue then atleast bring scientific evidence not just your personal experience and an attempt at a reddit tier roast.

Estrogen isn’t fckn cardio protective retard
If its too low you have sides
If its too high you have sides

So i cringe when people say muhh i keep my estrogen high for protection Copium

 

[Deleted member 77820]

you completely missed the point


1. the comparison wasnt about bodybuilders vs letrozole users it was about how short term "feeling fine" ≠ long term safety. people feel fine on steroids until they suddenly dont. the absence of immediate side effects doesnt mean a drug is harmless. bone loss happens gradually by the time you feel it the damage is already done </3



2. you dont understand what stunted bone maturation actually means. stunted bone maturation in aromatase deficient men is NOT the same as extending growth plate activity for height. their bones dont mature properly because they LACK estrogen entirely. they end up with osteoporosis, weak bone structure, and joint issues not just extra height. if your argument is gonna be "aromatase deficient men have stunted bone maturation so lets replicate that by nuking estrogen " then your fundamentally misunderstanding their condition.



3. this is just another attempt to dodge the actual argument. whether or not i've used letrozole doesnt change how estrogen works in the body. you wouldnt say "you cant talk about heart disease unless you had one" so why apply that logic here??



4. thats just a bad analogy lmfao. a better analogy would be "just because someone has eaten a cake 100 times doesnt mean they understand the nutritional science behind it". experience ≠ scientific understanding just cause you ran 10mg letrozole without noticing immediate issues doesnt mean it's safe long term.

your entire response is just an appeal to personal experience + dodging actual endocrinology. if you actually wanna argue then address the biological mechanisms of estrogen in bone health instead of repeating "b-b-but i felt fine :3"

Well their is studies on people using 2.5 mg women and men longterm so its kinda safe
So I don’t see a problem seeing someone running 1 mg of letro in puberty to grow taller

If it wasn’t for heightmaxxing purposes i would never use Letro i would just use dht derivatives like primo and masteron to control my E2

Ill argue with you nigga your acting like letrozole gonna kill you or smth jfl this shit is prescribed to women with breast cancer imagine a women going through chemi therapy using letrozole and your here muhh muhh go fuck yourself

 

[Deleted member 77820]

Lets just agree to stop arguing now. We agree on the majority of things steroid related but disagree on some which is normal.

Btw is this a good source ???

 

[TitusA]

View attachment 3562936

Btw is this a good source ???

Never used it so cant say. Quick google search shows mixed reviews and some counterfeit which always happens when you have a steroid maker or drug maker with good reviews.

 

[Deleted member 77820]

Never used it so cant say. Quick google search shows mixed reviews and some counterfeit which always happens when you have a steroid maker or drug maker with good reviews.

Just gonna stick to testoviron then

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

1) bro your retarded jfl wtf You confused androgenicity of a compound with anabolism of a compound jfl + when did i say it cancel out testosterone i said it lower its anabolism

2)your retarded they cause oestroposis in antty old men with already high Bo because they already have fckd hormones low igf-1 low T low E2 and poor Mtor signaling because of age lack of exercise and low protein diet so when you add sartan they get oestroposis
If sartan had no effect on anabolism then it wouldn’t have cause oestroposis in men

Nigga yiur a tiktok cell if yiu were actually browsing pubmed you’ll know you could run gear without ever using sartan ezitimbe or nebivolol
Bro its your running a Sprint and you have a rock attached to your legs and you are like uhm should i run like this with my elbows flat or like that with my elbows to the side nigga you should remove the rock
Same thing with roids you should fix the core problem not start using ancillaries

Im gonna finish of with the word “androgen metabolism”

Jfl look at the iq of this retard

@org3cel.RR
@halloweed

1) bro your retarded jfl wtf You confused androgenicity of a compound with anabolism of a compound jfl + when did i say it cancel out testosterone i said it lower its anabolism

Strawman. i never claimed you said telmisartan cancels testosterone. my point is telmisartans mild mtor inhib is not strong enough to erase the anabolic effects of 500mg+ test. if it did then trt patients using telmisartan would struggle to gain muscle yet they dont. no studies show telmisartan significantly reducing muscle growth in those using supraphysiological test doses. if telmisartan truly made test ineffective then body builders wouldnt be using it yet guess what.. they do

2)your retarded they cause oestroposis in antty old men with already high Bo because they already have fckd hormones low igf-1 low T low E2 and poor Mtor signaling because of age lack of exercise and low protein diet so when you add sartan they get oestroposis
If sartan had no effect on anabolism then it wouldn’t have cause oestroposis in men

misleading. yes elderly men with already low compromised hormones (low igf-1, low t, low e2) may develop osteoporosis. that doesnt mean telmisartan causes osteoporosis in healthy individuals with normal hormone levels. wheres your study showing telmisartan directly causing osteoporosis in young hormonally balanced men?? telmisartan has anti inflammatory and endothelial protective properties. it actually has bone protective effects in certain cases. ur completely ignoring the context of those osteoporosis cases.

Nigga yiur a tiktok cell if yiu were actually browsing pubmed you’ll know you could run gear without ever using sartan ezitimbe or nebivolol

"you can run gear without health management " isnt a flex its just autism. yeah you can run gear without protecting your bp and lipids but youll just accelerate cardiovascular damage. just because some people dont use protective drugs doesnt mean they are unnecessary. this is the "i dont use a seatbelt because ive never crashed" argument. risk management matters.

Bro its your running a Sprint and you have a rock attached to your legs and you are like uhm should i run like this with my elbows flat or like that with my elbows to the side nigga you should remove the rock

bad take. telsmisartan is not a "rock" holding you back its a seatbelt preventing a crash. if you think the "rock" is steroids themselves then your logic would say just dont use peds at all. you cant just "fix the core problem" when the problem itself is using peds.

Same thing with roids you should fix the core problem not start using ancillaries

fixing te core problem = not using gear at all. the core problem is that peds wreck cardiovascular health. protective drugs exist to mitigate that risk while still allowing ped use. nobody is taking telmisartan, ezetimibe, or nebivolol "for fun"

stay mad stay misinformed

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Estrogen isn’t fckn cardio protective retard
If its too low you have sides
If its too high you have sides

So i cringe when people say muhh i keep my estrogen high for protection Copium

Estrogen isn’t fckn cardio protective retard

estrogen plays a key role in vascular function, cholesterol metabolism, and endothelial health. multiple studies confirmed that low estrogen is associated with higher cardiovascular disease risk in men. ai overuse leading to excessively low estrogen is linked to increased arterial stiffness and poor lipid profiles.

sources:
low estrogen in men = higher ldl, lower hdl, increased arterial plaque formation. estrogen helps maintain nitric oxide levels which reduces bp and vascular stress.

If its too low you have sides
If its too high you have sides

yeah no shit thats why blindly nuking estrogen is retarded. nobody said "keep estrogen high for protection" the point is balance. too low = increased bone loss, joint pain, cardiovascular risks. too high = water retention, gyno, mood swings. thats why ai doses need to be based on bloodwork and not brah science!!

So i cringe when people say muhh i keep my estrogen high for protection Copium

whats actually cringe is dismissing endocrinology because it doesnt fit your narrative nobody is saying "keep estrogen high" the goal is optimal levels. you are mocking a basic medical principle that even ped using body builders understand

 

[sharpnimbustoilet98]

Well their is studies on people using 2.5 mg women and men longterm so its kinda safe
So I don’t see a problem seeing someone running 1 mg of letro in puberty to grow taller

If it wasn’t for heightmaxxing purposes i would never use Letro i would just use dht derivatives like primo and masteron to control my E2

Ill argue with you nigga your acting like letrozole gonna kill you or smth jfl this shit is prescribed to women with breast cancer imagine a women going through chemi therapy using letrozole and your here muhh muhh go fuck yourself

Well their is studies on people using 2.5 mg women and men longterm so its kinda safe

studies monitor bone density and hormone levels closely when ais are used in medical cases. "kinda safe" doesnt mean risk free bcus bone loss still happens which is why calcium, vit d, bisphosphonates are often prescribed alongside ais. also women are not men their baseline estrogen levels and bone metabolism are different.

So I don’t see a problem seeing someone running 1 mg of letro in puberty to grow taller

growth plate closure is regulated by estrogen.. DUNN DUNN DUNNNN!!! nuking estrogen can actually accelerate fusion not delay it. ai protocols for height are carefully dosed based on bloodwork not blindly dosing. letrozole is a blunt tool compared to milder ais like anastrozole which is why its not the go to choice.

If it wasn’t for heightmaxxing purposes i would never use Letro i would just use dht derivatives like primo and masteron to control my E2

finally you are being reasonable but still for height protocols the goal isnt just crushing estrogen its regulating it within an optimal range.

Ill argue with you nigga your acting like letrozole gonna kill you or smth jfl this shit is prescribed to women with breast cancer imagine a women going through chemi therapy using letrozole and your here muhh muhh go fuck yourself

your "its prescribed to cancer patients" argument is irrelevant. chemotherapy patients take it to suppress estrogen for medical reasons not to grow taller. side effects still exist like bone loss, joint pain, cardiovascular impact. thats why cancer patients on ais are monitored and given bone protective treatments. your argument is basically "well ermm cancer patients use it so why worry" thats like saying "people take chemotherapy drugs so its fine for general use. you are completely missing context.

 

[Mike141]

Go for SARM cycle ( which has 1/10 of the side effects and will give you very good results).

JFL sarm only goblin spotted. sarms shut down ur test as much as taking exogenous test and they have the same side effects of roids for a fraction of the benefit