Debunking the myth of Aisha being 9 (Muslims GTFIH)

[Ghoulish]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

 

[lordgandy2000]

Dnrd

 

[Ghoulish]

Dnrd

 

[Hide]

Read it all

 

[FiendFiend]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

dude if aisha was 9 that would make me convert to islam but now nvm. fucking pussy faith cant even admit whats only NAATURAL

 

[Hide]

Dnrd

Wtf is memritv even about

 

[Ghoulish]

dude if aisha was 9 that would make me convert to islam but now nvm. fucking pussy faith cant even admit whats only NAATURAL

Nigga thinks he’s getting prime jbs jfl that shits chad 9 year old only

 

[Adonis123]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

 

[Old Büll]

Isn’t it better to buy a woman young and then wait until she’s ready, than to marry her after she’s been raped by her uncles and brothers?

I’m speaking back then ofc

 

[Kurdishcoper]

read all of this, nice

 

[Ghoulish]

Wtf is memritv even about

Israeli propaganda btw

“U.S.-based non-profit organization with offices in Washington, D.C., London, Berlin, and Jerusalem, and is subsidized by U.S. taxpayers under American law as an independent, non-partisan, non-profit entity.”

 

[Hide]

Israeli propaganda btw

“U.S.-based non-profit organization with offices in Washington, D.C., London, Berlin, and Jerusalem, and is subsidized by U.S. taxpayers under American law as an independent, non-partisan, non-profit entity.”

We know its jewish

Rhetorical question

 

[FiendFiend]

Nigga thinks he’s getting prime jbs jfl that shits chad 9 year old only

wrong. Anyways now im not converting fuck u nigga ruined my year

 

[FiendFiend]

View attachment 4092619

ima convert to mormonism instead seems way more based and atleast the niggas there are white, it being a non white faith isnt an issue if they can actually stando n bussiness and just admit aisha was 9 and theres nothing wrong with it. pussy ass manmade faith

 

[Ghoulish]

Isn’t it better to buy a woman young and then wait until she’s ready, than to marry her after she’s been raped by her uncles and brothers?

I’m speaking back then ofc

Getting raped by uncles is a euro trait, not for saudicels

Narrated by julius Caesar, about the Britons when he first arrived.

“Ten or even twelves have wives in common, especially between brothers, fathers and son. Furthermore when these have children, they're considering being those of the first that espoused her when still virgin.”

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

@Copercel Put your amalek dogs to sleep already.

 

[Ghoulish]

ima convert to mormonism instead seems way more based and atleast the niggas there are white, it being a non white faith isnt an issue if they can actually stando n bussiness and just admit aisha was 9 and theres nothing wrong with it. pussy ass manmade faith

“At least the niggas there are white”

-posted from ghandpoori village or slavistakotograd

 

[Old Büll]

View attachment 4092619

Pig skins

Getting raped by uncles is a euro trait, not for saudicels

Narrated by julius Caesar, about the Britons when he first arrived.

“Ten or even twelves have wives in common, especially between brothers, fathers and son. Furthermore when these have children, they're considering being those of the first that espoused her when still virgin.”

It’s just human nature tbh stop with the race cope

 

[Copercel]

@Copercel Put your amalek dogs to sleep already.

I’m retired bro

I had enough debates with people here about shit like that

 

[Ghoulish]

@Copercel Put your amalek dogs to sleep already.

 

[FiendFiend]

Getting raped by uncles is a euro trait, not for saudicels

Narrated by julius Caesar, about the Britons when he first arrived.

“Ten or even twelves have wives in common, especially between brothers, fathers and son. Furthermore when these have children, they're considering being those of the first that espoused her when still virgin.”

thats true why do people associate a 9 yr old and muhammed how old he ever was and aishas parents consenting to marriage as if he raped her. Bro she could have said no, and he would have found another JB. such fucking cope when niggas say muh he raped her. No muhammed was statusmaxxed he didnt need to do that and if he wanted to get a kick out of doing some sick shit he would torture someone or kill them in war. I dont see why he would even rape.

 

[FiendFiend]

“At least the niggas there are white”

-posted from ghandpoori village or slavistakotograd

im half slav half nordic mutt.

Anyways russians were chads when they raped 2mil women in berlin (it was not a warcrime it was payback)

 

[Ghoulish]

I’m retired bro

I had enough debates with people here about shit like that

 

[KeepCopingLads]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

tag the kaffirs instead, most of us should already know this (and yes i already knew this)

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

thats true why do people associate a 9 yr old and muhammed how old he ever was and aishas parents consenting to marriage as if he raped her. Bro she could have said no, and he would have found another JB. such fucking cope when niggas say muh he raped her. No muhammed was statusmaxxed he didnt need to do that and if he wanted to get a kick out of doing some sick shit he would torture someone or kill them in war. I dont see why he would even rape.

The islamic world by then had a long history of child rape, most common with little boys.

Skip to 5:00 You cannot undo history goyim.

 

[Mitläufer]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

Pls not the retarded muslims in this forum ...

 

[FiendFiend]

View attachment 4092638

Old testament is zio occupied book. Atleast mormons were based and wrote their own version

 

[Ghoulish]

thats true why do people associate a 9 yr old and muhammed how old he ever was and aishas parents consenting to marriage as if he raped her. Bro she could have said no, and he would have found another JB. such fucking cope when niggas say muh he raped her. No muhammed was statusmaxxed he didnt need to do that and if he wanted to get a kick out of doing some sick shit he would torture someone or kill them in war. I dont see why he would even rape.

He was described as being more beautiful than the moon by his own enemies btw. He was a chadlite minimum.

 

[Ghoulish]

Pls not the retarded muslims in this forum ...

“Retarded Muslims”
- is a Christian.

 

[FiendFiend]

d

The islamic world by then had a long history of child rape, most common with little boys.

Skip to 5:00 You cannot undo history goyim.

dude imagine watching this israel shill and cuck who hangs out with atheists and is defo an intilligence asset for info on islam. smh. im white and im saying this

 

[Mitläufer]

The islamic world by then had a long history of child rape, most common with little boys.

Skip to 5:00 You cannot undo history goyim.

Every religion is retarded
nature is the true religion

 

[FiendFiend]

He was described as being more beautiful than the moon by his own enemies btw. He was a chadlite minimum.

i think muhammed may have been white ngl

 

[Mitläufer]

“Retarded Muslims”
- is a Christian.

Average muslim iq is 90 faggot
and no im not christian retard hahahaha

Every religion is retarded in my eyes

 

[Ghoulish]

The islamic world by then had a long history of child rape, most common with little boys.

Skip to 5:00 You cannot undo history goyim.

Jfl nigga thats based on a weak Hadith that no one accepts as real. It’s as reliable as some nigga saying some nigga saidx50 that some nigga got beat to death by Jesus

 

[PermaBluePilled]

I keep seeing it all the time here, and I don’t know how this hasn’t been debunked on this forum yet given how comically broken it is. You guys need to stop getting information off of muslim apologetics on YouTube as no respectable non-schizo traditionalist scholar upholds this narrative (if they even bothered to research it) given it’s MANY great flaws. This will be a wall of text, but read the entire thing if you are misinformed. It’s better to not be ignorant in the face of all this hate, you would want the same to be done to you if you were being falsely accused.

firstly, it’s a Hadith not a quranic verse, Hadith were originally circulated via oral transmission for 200 years. The hadith is narrated by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, from his father, from Aisha. The chain for the hadith is graded hasan, which is somewhat reliable. Not concrete. But this isn’t the point of mine.

the guy who narrated it, Hisham ibn urwa, narrated this verse when he was 71 in Iraq. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with memory problems, and he was said to have NEVER narrated this verse prior to this. None of his past students ever mentioned this verse. But this isn’t the point either, this just shows that the verse is volatile. It’s extremely suspicious.

Here is the verse

”that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.”

this brings the largest problem with this verse. The idea of 6 years old being sufficient for marriage is completely against quranic teachings of the age of consent, which highlights that mental maturity (described as being able to handle ownership of property and rational thought) , physical maturity (post pubescent) and clear consent Is extremely important and the baseline.

so, according to the Quran, the marriage is completely impermissible since Aisha would be a child at 6. Definitely not mature, mentally or physically. And according to ALL scholars, quranic text is taken over ANY other scripture.

Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya (d. 751 AH), a renowned Hanbali scholar, wrote in I'lam al-Muwaqqi'in:

"The Sunnah does not contradict the sound, clear Quran. If a hadith is found to be in contradiction, then efforts must be made to reconcile them. If reconciliation is impossible, then the Quran is given precedence, and the hadith is rejected... for the Quran is the foundation, and the Sunnah is the building."

this is only the first problem with this Hadith. The second problem is that it goes against many historical accounts of the events that took place in Islamic history, which are deemed much more reliable than a Hadith graded Hasan. For example, Aisha is said to have taken an active role in the battles of Uhud and the battle of badr. The battle of badr took place before her marriage was consummated, putting her age during the battle as 8-8 years old. And her age at uhud at 10.

now this bring a problem, how the hell would a literal child (who must have been deemed an adult to even take part in these battles as children were not allowed) be able to actively drag wounded soldiers off battlefields? Never seen a 9 year old able to pull a 70kg man across an entire battlefield hundreds of times over (the battle was a route, the location to treat them was constantly changing, meaning she would have had to help carry them.) This is why many scholars and historians heavily doubt the authenticity of this hadith.

Then, you have the problem of her prior engagement. Aisha was due to be married to another man (Mutʿim ibn ʿAdiyy) before muhammad (peace be upon him) however, this would have put her age at 3 YEARS OLD when she was engaged. This brings ANOTHER problem as child marriages were completely outlawed in post Islamic Arabia, and the man would have been punished for this. However, he is described as an honourable man (there are many details on his life.)

Now here’s the fourth major issue with this Hadith. It goes against other accounts aswell. Aishas sister, asma is narrated to have been 27 during aishas marriage, and Aisha to be 10 years younger putting aishas age at a more reliable, islamically, historically, rationally and culturally, at 17 years old. The account of asmas age is more reliable than the Hadith aswell, given it is a well recorded historical fact, rather than something narrated by some old guy with Alzheimer’s. The age hadith is a solitary report (khabar al-wahid) with a specific criticism of its narrator. The evidence from Asma's age and the battles is based on well-established history (almost mutawatir in historical terms). In Islamic jurisprudence, stronger evidence outweighs weaker evidence.

so, in conclusion, due to the Hadith being not only completely useless to most Muslims while it was circulating orally for centuries as it has no religious value (why would bedouin arabs care about how old some girl was) making it prone to errors in transmission, it is also completely against the quranic teachings, against many historical evidences, and against logic itself. It is also narrated by an old man with memory issues.

and if anyone is to bring the verse about Aisha playing with dolls, there are also MANY refutations for that Hadith too. Firstly, Aisha was a scholar by the time that Hadith was said to have taken place. A woman like Aisha playing with dolls, then going out to debate idol worshippers about religion and save lives in extremely devastating battles?

secondly, the verse describes her playing with ”dolls” which is also problematic, since dolls fall under idols, which are completely forbidden in households and Aisha would NOT been allowed to play with dolls. The prophet wouldn’t have made exceptions, as this would be hypocritical and would have been brought up. Along with these two points, the word “dolls” in Arabic (لَعِبٌ - La'ib**)** can also mean mean "playthings" or "amusement." It may not refer to literal child's dolls but perhaps to decorative figurines or cherished keepsakes, which adult woman did own as a symbol of wealth In pre-Islamic Arabia. Such objects were common.

never believe everything you see online, always check it With a reliable source.

Spoiler: Tagging Muslims

@Gengar @Old Büll @KeepCopingLads @Hide @SecularIslamist @pashtunnigga1 @Ralix @SyrianPsycho @afghanincel

Very good thread unfortunatley i don t think many people here can escape the brainwashing

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

tag the kaffirs instead, most of us should already know this (and yes i already knew this)

Old testament is zio occupied book. Atleast mormons were based and wrote their own version

New Test was a punishment against the Jews. Jacobs troubles, the third of all trees burning, oceans turning to blood and work slavation returnings with the lord's new kingdom.

d

dude imagine watching this israel shill and cuck who hangs out with atheists and is defo an intilligence asset for info on islam. smh. im white and im saying this

Islam is the very BLOOD of Jews, where do you think half of your traditions came from? Kissing the black rock? Classic pagan ritual, praying to Baal. All of it is not original.

Every religion is retarded
nature is the true religion

Nature is god.

 

[FiendFiend]

The islamic world by then had a long history of child rape, most common with little boys.

Skip to 5:00 You cannot undo history goyim.

every empie had faggot and sex slaves and gay niggas sucking cock ngl. that shit was just normal in the med them med boys wilding, italians and muslims included

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

Jfl nigga thats based on a weak Hadith that no one accepts as real. It’s as reliable as some nigga saying some nigga saidx50 that some nigga got beat to death by Jesus

The bible is the true word. Even in other translations the original message is only changed by old or new english. The fact you believe in a god is pathetic.

 

[NotAMogger]

People don’t realize that sandniggers hit puberty at the age of 5, so Aisha was already an adult by the time Muhammad clapped her cheeks.

 

[FiendFiend]

New Test was a punishment against the Jews. Jacobs troubles, the third of all trees burning, oceans turning to blood and work slavation returnings with the lord's new kingdom.

Islam is the very BLOOD of Jews, where do you think half of your traditions came from? Kissing the black rock? Classic pagan ritual, praying to Baal. All of it is not original.

Nature is god.

ok but still think about it. as a christian ur justifying slaughtering amalek children for the jews not a good look. If that part wasnt in it lowkey would not even be that horrible.

 

[Ghoulish]

Average muslim iq is 90 faggot
and no im not christian retard hahahaha

Every religion is retarded in my eyes

Nigga talking like his iq isnt 93

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

every empie had faggot and sex slaves and gay niggas sucking cock ngl. that shit was just normal in the med them med boys wilding, italians and muslims included

The middle east was known for it, was the worst of it. Why do you think Bachi Bazi is still a thing?

 

[FiendFiend]

People don’t realize that sandniggers hit puberty at the age of 5, so Aisha was already an adult by the time Muhammad clapped her cheeks.

muhammed was just a rebel imo

high t, rebelled against the pagan religio nat the time, and christianity.

 

[InanimatePragmatist]

ok but still think about it. as a christian ur justifying slaughtering amalek children for the jews not a good look. If that part wasnt in it lowkey would not even be that horrible.

I am no believer by any mean greycel. Have you not seen my writings? I strip all beliefs, Islam is just the most easy one to do so. I only like the Jews as they get rid of worthless drone like humanimals.

 

[Ghoulish]

People don’t realize that sandniggers hit puberty at the age of 5, so Aisha was already an adult by the time Muhammad clapped her cheeks.

Yeah bro she was able to carry 70kg niggas across battlefields and handle property at age 6

Insanely retarded take, and no nigga average in Saudi is 8

 

[FiendFiend]

Nigga talking like his iq isnt 93

View attachment 4092659

am i the only one who just feels sympathy for sub5s like this. like bruh he just look cute he aint hurt nobody

 

[Mitläufer]

Nigga talking like his iq isnt 93

View attachment 4092659

You have vril as pfp and you are muslim
Who is the retard here

 

[Mumbai_HTN]

im not even muslim or religious but i dont like that the only argument people bring up against islam is aishas age, even tho its a moral matter which in of itself doesnt have a objective good or truth to it

 

[FiendFiend]

Yeah bro she was able to carry 70kg niggas across battlefields and handle property at age 6

Insanely retarded take, and no nigga average in Saudi is 8

they marry 8 year olds in saudi?

 

[FiendFiend]

im not even muslim or religious but i dont like that the only argument people bring up against islam is aishas age, even tho its a moral matter which in of itself doesnt have a objective good or truth to it

if he did crack a 9 year old it isnt even wrong imo he married