Double Jaw Surgery Morph with Dr. Walline (LACOMS)

[Roan]

Realized I didn't post to this one, and it would make more sense to do so.

Can anybody give their thoughts on my morphs from Dr. Walline and whether the advancements are enough? I got some people saying forward advancement should be more.

From what he told me the movements would be:

- 5 MM with CW Rotation of maxilla and high cut Lefort

- 5 MM back with BSSO, 6 MM forward with Genioplasty for total advancement of 1 MM

After my consultation, the suggestions were a Maxilla CW to bring it forward, a Bilateral Sagittal Split Osteotomy to bring my lower jack back, and then a sliding Genioplasty to bring my chin back forward.

I did ask if the lower jaw really needed to be moved back, and he said yes because both jaws needed to be moved in tandem.

He also agreed to a High Cut Lefort 1/Quadrangular Osteotomy, but that's not included in this morph. He said he wasn't able to add it to the morph movements. It's a 3 piece, so just imagine it same as the maxilla movement.

Yes, this is mainly cosmetic. My main concern is the lack of projection in the midface, which was why I pushed for a high cut Lefort from him.

 

[LackEmpathyTherefor]

Is there a reason why he chose CW ?
The after looks good but not life changing as your profile isn't the worst, he's retracting the mandible because you don't want to project the maxilla too much and therefore mandible needs to follow maxilla so you compensate with advancing the chin ?
or am i missing something

 

[Roan]

Is there a reason why he chose CW ?
The after looks good but not life changing as your profile isn't the worst, he's retracting the mandible because you don't want to project the maxilla too much and therefore mandible needs to follow maxilla so you compensate with advancing the chin ?
or am i missing something

No you're right. CW is because CCW would recess me even more. My lower jaw/mandible isn't visibly recessed, so counter clockwise rotation would jut it forward too much and my maxilla would need to follow it, making my cheekbones (one of the parts im worried about) become even worse.

Also besides the need to move them together, retracting the jaw and keeping the chin forward may make my midface be more pronounced. Since while my side profile isn't deformed or anything, it's visibly flat and from other angles it's clear my cheekbones are pretty much non existent

 

[johncorn]

I feel like a genio and midface implants would be less of a pain in the ass and also cheaper

 

[Roan]

Ok but

I feel like a genio and midface implants would be less of a pain in the ass and also cheaper

Ok but lets say money wasn't a problem, wouldn't this be better? It also comes with the genio anyways and the other surgeon I sussed out for midface implants costs like 30-40k, and another said he can't do it

 

[Roan]

I feel like a genio and midface implants would be less of a pain in the ass and also cheaper

Also nothing is better than bone, especially since I could always get implants later

 

[kingofkings]

Can you ask him to draw a diagram of the high lefort 1 cut he'll be doing? They vary a lot and I'm very interested.

Did he show you any results using this cut?

 

[AustrianMogger]

Realized I didn't post to this one, and it would make more sense to do so.

Can anybody give their thoughts on my morphs from Dr. Walline and whether the advancements are enough? I got some people saying forward advancement should be more.

From what he told me the movements would be:

- 5 MM with CW Rotation of maxilla and high cut Lefort

- 5 MM back with BSSO, 6 MM forward with Genioplasty for total advancement of 1 MM

After my consultation, the suggestions were a Maxilla CW to bring it forward, a Bilateral Sagittal Split Osteotomy to bring my lower jack back, and then a sliding Genioplasty to bring my chin back forward.

I did ask if the lower jaw really needed to be moved back, and he said yes because both jaws needed to be moved in tandem.

He also agreed to a High Cut Lefort 1/Quadrangular Osteotomy, but that's not included in this morph. He said he wasn't able to add it to the morph movements. It's a 3 piece, so just imagine it same as the maxilla movement.

Yes, this is mainly cosmetic. My main concern is the lack of projection in the midface, which was why I pushed for a high cut Lefort from him.

View attachment 4167848View attachment 4167855View attachment 4167856

bad. you need more advanement in madible not less and evenmore in maxilla

 

[AustrianMogger]

Realized I didn't post to this one, and it would make more sense to do so.

Can anybody give their thoughts on my morphs from Dr. Walline and whether the advancements are enough? I got some people saying forward advancement should be more.

From what he told me the movements would be:

- 5 MM with CW Rotation of maxilla and high cut Lefort

- 5 MM back with BSSO, 6 MM forward with Genioplasty for total advancement of 1 MM

After my consultation, the suggestions were a Maxilla CW to bring it forward, a Bilateral Sagittal Split Osteotomy to bring my lower jack back, and then a sliding Genioplasty to bring my chin back forward.

I did ask if the lower jaw really needed to be moved back, and he said yes because both jaws needed to be moved in tandem.

He also agreed to a High Cut Lefort 1/Quadrangular Osteotomy, but that's not included in this morph. He said he wasn't able to add it to the morph movements. It's a 3 piece, so just imagine it same as the maxilla movement.

Yes, this is mainly cosmetic. My main concern is the lack of projection in the midface, which was why I pushed for a high cut Lefort from him.

View attachment 4167848View attachment 4167855View attachment 4167856

idk how much you are spending on this, but consider different surgeon.
YOu need gonial implants, much more movement of upper jaw (maxilla) and bsso advancement not deuction and ofc genio. and rhinoplasty even if you get best maxilla movement with high cut cause the nose is over.

 

[Roan]

bad. you need more advanement in madible not less and evenmore in maxilla

Trust me, I do not need advancement in my mandible and surgeons have said so. Picture this, you know how people jut their jaw to make it seem better? When I jut my jaw, I look like a sped so more advancement would ruin it. The problem is that my chin is weak, which is what the genio is for.

I'm going to push for more maxilla advancement, but Walline's reasoning it's like that is to not go past the ideal nasolabial angle, which I understand because my philtrum is already long. So it's based on aesthetics

 

[AustrianMogger]

Trust me, I do not need advancement in my mandible and surgeons have said so. Picture this, you know how people jut their jaw to make it seem better? When I jut my jaw, I look like a sped so more advancement would ruin it. The problem is that my chin is weak, which is what the genio is for.

I'm going to push for more maxilla advancement, but Walline's reasoning it's like that is to not go past the ideal nasolabial angle, which I understand because my philtrum is already long. So it's based on aesthetics

Philtrum is cope as you can get lipp lift.

 

[Roan]

Philtrum is cope as you can get lipp lift.

I think a lip lift will only help so much if your philtrum gets too long

 

[LackEmpathyTherefor]

I think a lip lift will only help so much if your philtrum gets too long

and lip lift leaves a scar
but you can't really predict soft tissue, and i guess you're never sure if the maxillar advancement will really make philtrum area worse?

 

[Roan]

and lip lift leaves a scar
but you can't really predict soft tissue, and i guess you're never sure if the maxillar advancement will really make philtrum area worse?

Yes, because advancing it too much can make your philtrum longer. Their software is always weird with soft tissue

 

[AustrianMogger]

and lip lift leaves a scar
but you can't really predict soft tissue, and i guess you're never sure if the maxillar advancement will really make philtrum area worse?

still beliving in scars.
yes you get scar but
their is scar cream, you can laser it after some months and put concelar on in meantime.
Truth is scars are mostly cope and can be revisioned away by scar revision through survery and laser.

 

[Roan]

still beliving in scars.
yes you get scar but
their is scar cream, you can laser it after some months and put concelar on in meantime.
Truth is scars are mostly cope and can be revisioned away by scar revision through survery and laser.

I agree, unless you get absolutely butchered by some maniac in Turkey you won't really need to worry about scars

 

[LEFORT17]

still beliving in scars.
yes you get scar but
their is scar cream, you can laser it after some months and put concelar on in meantime.
Truth is scars are mostly cope and can be revisioned away by scar revision through survery and laser.

based

 

[johncorn]

Ok but

Ok but lets say money wasn't a problem, wouldn't this be better? It also comes with the genio anyways and the other surgeon I sussed out for midface implants costs like 30-40k, and another said he can't do it

So much investment into side profile is just a waste, genio is responsible for 90% of the asthetik result of a trimax,

Don't waste so much time and money, get the Genio and Rhino, and enjoy life

 

[Roan]

So much investment into side profile is just a waste, genio is responsible for 90% of the asthetik result of a trimax,

Don't waste so much time and money, get the Genio and Rhino, and enjoy life

I have over 300k to blow on hardmaxxing. I've calculated everything and the stuff I want right now is about 110-120k total. It's worth it for me, and I think everything will also affect my front profile.

 

[lurking truecel]

I have over 300k to blow on hardmaxxing. I've calculated everything and the stuff I want right now is about 110-120k total. It's worth it for me, and I think everything will also affect my front profile.

Jaw surgery is not only about price of surgery, the time in braces before and after + recovery is long. Also the amount of risks are crazy aswell and more common thar people think

 

[Roan]

Jaw surgery is not only about price of surgery, the time in braces before and after + recovery is long. Also the amount of risks are crazy aswell and more common thar people think

At least for me, there is no braces needed beforehand. know the recovery and a few weeks off of work with liquid diet is fine with me. From when I spoke to Dr. Walline, the recovery is actually kind of overblown from what I've seen on reddit and the first few weeks are the worst.

For me, it's essentially a trade off of some money I can afford to lose and some short term suffering (I could get every surgery done this year) in order to be happy for the rest of my life. It's a no brainer and I actually agonize over having not done it sooner.

 

[Roan]

Jaw surgery is not only about price of surgery, the time in braces before and after + recovery is long. Also the amount of risks are crazy aswell and more common thar people think

At least for me, there is no braces needed beforehand. know the recovery and a few weeks off of work with liquid diet is fine with me. From when I spoke to Dr. Walline, the recovery is actually kind of overblown from what I've seen on reddit and the first few weeks are the worst.

For me, it's essentially a trade off of some money I can afford to lose and some short term suffering (I could get every surgery done this year) in order to be happy for the rest of my life. It's a no brainer and I actually agonize over having not done it sooner.

 

[Roan]

Jaw surgery is not only about price of surgery, the time in braces before and after + recovery is long. Also the amount of risks are crazy aswell and more common thar people think

At least for me, there is no braces needed beforehand. I know the recovery and a few weeks off of work with liquid diet is fine with me. From when I spoke to Dr. Walline, the recovery is actually kind of overblown from what I've seen on reddit and the first few weeks are the worst.

For me, it's essentially a trade off of some money I can afford to lose and some short term suffering (I could get every surgery done this year) in order to be happy for the rest of my life. It's a no brainer and I actually agonize over having not done it sooner.

 

[lurking truecel]

At least for me, there is no braces needed beforehand. I know the recovery and a few weeks off of work with liquid diet is fine with me. From when I spoke to Dr. Walline, the recovery is actually kind of overblown from what I've seen on reddit and the first few weeks are the worst.

For me, it's essentially a trade off of some money I can afford to lose and some short term suffering (I could get every surgery done this year) in order to be happy for the rest of my life. It's a no brainer and I actually agonize over having not done it sooner.

Yea listen to the doctor that get paid 80k to operate you, nah the recovery is longer than that. Atleast in downtime, also you might end up needing braces for sometime after either way

 

[Roan]

Yea listen to the doctor that get paid 80k to operate you, nah the recovery is longer than that. Atleast in downtime, also you might end up needing braces for sometime after either way

I mean Walline is literally one of the best in the world, so I would def listen to him as long as it doesn't conflict too much with what I think. I can handle being uncomfortable/in pain for a few weeks and swelling, even from people who get the surgery, they are presentable after a month or 2 which is ok with me.

I know I'll need braces or invisalign after, but it's worth it. I've had Invisalign before for unrelated stuff, so if I can get that again it's actually really easy.

 

[lurking truecel]

I mean Walline is literally one of the best in the world, so I would def listen to him as long as it doesn't conflict too much with what I think. I can handle being uncomfortable/in pain for a few weeks and swelling, even from people who get the surgery, they are presentable after a month or 2 which is ok with me.

I know I'll need braces or invisalign after, but it's worth it. I've had Invisalign before for unrelated stuff, so if I can get that again it's actually really easy.

Join some discord

 

[Roan]

Join some discord

You mean the org discord?

 

[bosskingemmy]

Orthognathic surgery isn't like swapping lego blocks. You're literally cutting the jaws, moving them a few millimetres and hoping the soft tissues behave the way the morph shows. For a guy with no malocclusion or airway issues, the risk‑reward of a full trimax is pretty bad: nerve damage, permanent numbness, TMJ pain, relapse, months of braces/invisalign and liquid diet, scars etc. Soft tissue simulations lie – a 5 mm CW rotation can actually lengthen the philtrum or make the nose look droopy.

If your only problem is a weak chin or short upper jaw, a simple genio/implant/rhino/liplift will give you 90 % of the aesthetics at a fraction of the cost and risk. Hardmaxxing is not a magic pill, it's major surgery with long recovery. Get at least two or three consults, understand the functional indications and don't let "hardmaxx now, cope later" memes push you into spending 6 figures and gambling your bite for a few millimetres.

 

[Roan]

Orthognathic surgery isn't like swapping lego blocks. You're literally cutting the jaws, moving them a few millimetres and hoping the soft tissues behave the way the morph shows. For a guy with no malocclusion or airway issues, the risk‑reward of a full trimax is pretty bad: nerve damage, permanent numbness, TMJ pain, relapse, months of braces/invisalign and liquid diet, scars etc. Soft tissue simulations lie – a 5 mm CW rotation can actually lengthen the philtrum or make the nose look droopy.

If your only problem is a weak chin or short upper jaw, a simple genio/implant/rhino/liplift will give you 90 % of the aesthetics at a fraction of the cost and risk. Hardmaxxing is not a magic pill, it's major surgery with long recovery. Get at least two or three consults, understand the functional indications and don't let "hardmaxx now, cope later" memes push you into spending 6 figures and gambling your bite for a few millimetres.

erm no. I've now been diagnosed with maxillary hypoplasia by 3 different surgeons so it's either this or I kill myself by 30