My surgery with Defrancq: Custom PEEK Jaw/chin wrap + Special Genioplasty

Adrenochrome

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READ IT IN ITS ENTIRETY

As I wrote from previous thread: I got a custom Peek jaw and chin wraparound with a specialized genioplasty that fits within the chin portion of the peek to make a natural mentolabial fold by Dr. Defrancq.

Essential background that led to my choice of Dr. Defrancq:
If you’re familiar with my
situation, then you know that previously, I had a custom silicone jaw/chin wraparound designed by and surgery with Dr. Y that did not go as planned: I incurred infection and everything had to be removed.

Regarding Dr. Y. There are two important distinctions that I wish to make:

1. Dr. Y. as an individual, I liked (even though he was NOT transparent with me: more on that later).

Nobody can beat his design aesthetic: I prepared for months with drafts and photos of the exact aesthetic I wanted. We worked together and he nailed it! Yes, I was able to model and yes I was breaking f*cking necks whenever I went out (night and day difference).

However... and to my second point

2. The overall service was garbage and I would not go back for the life of me.

Really, just outstandingly incompetent staff (desk bimbos) who should be serving fries at McDonald’s instead of handling clients large money transfers or trying to coordinate patients surgical plans (dates, times, medications, proper instruction) you know ... the stuff you actually need to have a successful surgical outcome! (Ridiculously low IQ) although there was one office girl I liked.

Infection period:
To make a long story short, Dr. Y. Stood by me and his word... to an extent.

He removed the infected implant ”free” less the cost of the anesthesiologist (read that as $4,000 usd + cost of operating theatre $800) However, the issue is that I had to do this twice because the first time was for a culture sample to see if it was an actual infection (sounds good right? But wait a minute) it was actually really stupid because I was taking antibiotics at that time which would have and did skew the test to read negative (no infection) when there actually WAS an infection in the end.

So... two procedures for removal that had a nice price tag of $8000 for the anesthesiologist + cost of using the operating theater twice $1600 for a whopping total of $8,800 (no I didn’t mess that up as Dr. Y. Comped me on the last theater use -nice I guess?) but I want you guys to understand the total cost of our endeavors:

original surgery with Y. was 19k (custom cheeks, jaw/chin) and then add on the removal cost of 8k and this isn’t counting travel logistics (I had to fly back and forth about 6 times and 2 of those times were from across the other part of the world I.e. my plane tickets were averaging $1200) and then you have to factor in hotels (my original procedure I stayed about 1 week in Boston for $800 a night) .... you see where I’m going with this....

You really need to prepare for every possible scenario and have a financial contingency plan in place.

Now ...

With everything removed, I was on the road to recovery (read that as 6 months down time) which actually turned into 2 years for the following reasons:

In short, that infection ruined everything: place I was living in abroad (had to come home), opportunities (documentary I was going to be featured in), my own projects, financials obviously, time and my health (physical and emotional well-being) -terrible experience -you never want to go through something like this EVER.

I could have gone back to Dr. Y. after 6 months to try again for the cost of the anesthesiologist and operating theater again: $4800 but...

I knew there had to be a better way and my intent was to minimize as much risk as possible. Silicone had mentally scarred me and was off my list for the jaw/chin area. 6 months of research on implant materials and surgeons turned into 2 years; spanning from the most invasive of jaw surgery with Gunson from Arnett and Gunson to the least invasive (fillers - you’ve all seen those Dr’s who are like wizards with that stuff, insane).

I went on consults to Zarrinbal in Berlin (complete waste of time for me personally) to multiple Skype consults with different surgeons all over the world.

At one point, I even thought “fuck it” I’m just going to get my eye area done with Taban and forget about the chin/jaw because eye area is just as, if not more important than jaw (I know highly debatable) and I wouldn’t have to worry about infection but... I knew what that jaw implant had got me (endless opportunities) and I’ve never forgotten that ... EVER... I tasted my dream and it was snatched away from me in an instant but I’m getting it back no matter what!


That brings me to Defrancq ... the best source of reliable information comes from first hand accounts and I’m across many different surgical forums. My one friend had a disastrous surgery with Dr. Brusco from Switzerland (yeah the guy who uses Titanium for jaw implants and learned how to do chin wings from Triaca).

Well Brusco obliterated his jaw bone (literally leaving pieces of it “floating“ around) and aesthetically ruined him .... I’m thinking fuck man, this is it ... he might actually rope (it was his 3rd or 4th revision) and at that time I was saturated with too many options (overloaded).

So... My friends saving grace? You guessed it, Defrancq. Defrancq pieced him up and got him level again. I’m thinking if this guy can turn my friend around proper then at least I have a chance.

Checked out his website and saw that he uses PEEK (check mark), see that he’s a maxillofacial surgeon and not a plastic surgeon (check mark and read that), see that he’s done many decent cases and has some age on him but not too much where it’s concerning to me (check mark) *everyone asking me about his age, yes he’s older but quite cognitively adept with acute surgical dexterity to match (I would not trust my face to him otherwise)

I contacted him and we talked for about a month discussing my situation (his proposals and my thoughts: only implants or only bone cuts or implants + bone cuts) and what could be done to correct it safely. In the end he suggested peek implants for the jaw/chin combined with a special geniolasty that would augment the labiomental fold naturally within the chin part of the peek implant. Also, this would greatly expand my airway and reduce the chance for developing sleep apnea in the future.

So... you see, form and function (beautiful). Now, design-wise (this is where Y. Comes in again) because I knew exactly what I wanted (partly my former design as I already knew how I would look) and showed Defrancq my original Silicone implant draft -he was able to draft his own version of it but changed the taper of the gonial angles to be more natural (which is what I wanted) so it was perfect for me.

However, (someone else mentioned he’s stubborn and a little tricky to deal with -I can confirm both) he tried to change my mind on the implant design like 2 weeks before surgery, after I already told him that I wanted design A back in November and we both agreed upon it... (he wanted to rework the gonial angles again and initially I agreed) but it was just dragging on (4 days before surgery! Can you believe that? Stressed me the FO) and didn’t meet my aesthetic standards, so I told him directly to go back to design A (which he did without problem). Although the whole thing was a little strange.

A pre-surgical consult is required the day before your surgery or he will not operate on you (it is an hour long minimum).
We went through all the details of how the surgery was going to be executed (poor choice of words ha).

I was even shown my PEEK implants and got to hold each piece while we discussed them (I’m kicking myself for not taking photos!)
The PEEK is SUPER lightweight and the material looks very cool in person. I was surprised by literally how small each piece is.

My experience so far has been superior (metaphorically mogs America in service... HARD) in fact, I would say America (from my personal experience) has thee lowest service standard, it’s disgusting really (feel like I got scammed at one of “top docs” in America with that silicone wraparound).

*will detail moments before surgery (morning of and talking with anesthesiologist etc...) to the post surgery care and my current state of care later (way too tired now and need to rest). Ask any questions relating to this thread that haven’t already been discussed above and I’ll answer each one of them when I’ve the time.
 
Almu

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Just came for the pics

Got disappointed
 
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Dr Shekelberg

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Take a screenshot of your CT and send a picture how you looked like before and after (can be other persons, I just want somethingt to compare)


Otherwise, appreciated
should I call it stubborn or driven that you got implants again after infection ? lol
 
SHARK

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So have you had the surgery yet or no
 
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Dr Shekelberg said:
Take a screenshot of your CT and send a picture how you looked like before and after (can be other persons, I just want somethingt to compare)


Otherwise, appreciated
should I call it stubborn or driven that you got implants again after infection ? lol
of you Y implants
 
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Adrenochrome said:
Almu @Almu .... so/so disappointed

My supplements for healing
Damn
But I think Mouth wash without alcohol is better
 
Adrenochrome

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Dr Shekelberg said:
of you Y implants

No CT on my phone but I’ll post implant design scans (you can see just how deficient I was)

As to your last statement ha ha both brother... both ( :
 
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Adrenochrome

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Almu said:
Europe best tbh ngl

EXACTLY
Almu said:
Damn
But I think Mouth wash without alcohol is better

You’re correct, this was just for traveling and the day before. The morning of and currently now, I’ve a special rinse given by the surgeon.
 
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Dr Shekelberg

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Adrenochrome said:
No CT on my phone but I’ll post implant design scans (you can see just how deficient I was)

As to your last statement ha ha both brother... both ( :
your inned supra-orbitals look DOM, but could it be that you have NCT?
 
Adrenochrome

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Dr Shekelberg said:
your inned supra-orbitals look DOM, but could it be that you have NCT?

You’re quite perceptive .... indeed I’ve a negative tilt BUT... it works with my phenotype.

I won’t lie and say I don’t want positive tilt because I do (with Taban) but this bastion of snobbery against ALL negative tilt is wild. I agree that most negative tilt isn’t advantageous BUT it always depends on the phenotype.
 
MogTheMogger

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by the pics i've see from his surgeries, i havent see anything interesing, i can be wrong tbqh. but congrats
 
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Adrenochrome said:
You’re quite perceptive .... indeed I’ve a negative tilt BUT... it works with my phenotype.

I won’t lie and say I don’t want positive tilt because I do (with Taban) but this bastion of snobbery against ALL negative tilt is wild. I agree that most negative tilt isn’t advantageous BUT it always depends on the phenotype.
you also have a hooked nose?

are you bit dinaric or SEEurope ? Black Hair?
Dr Shekelberg said:
you also have a hooked nose?

are you bit dinaric or SEEurope ? Black Hair?
and bushy thick eyebrows ? low-trust face ?

You have to be a turk lol
shouldnt be an insult
 
Adrenochrome

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MogTheMogger said:
by the pics i've see from his surgeries, i havent see anything interesing, i can be wrong tbqh. but congrats
Thanks brother and I would actually tend to agree with you but ... in my situation, I used my original design from Y and slightly tweaked the taper of the gonial angles ... so, you might see something interesting soon ( :

Time will tell -first issue of utmost importance is making sure I’ve no infection or else its all in vain.
 
Cody

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He does zygo and infraorbital implants too?
 
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Dr Shekelberg said:
you also have a hooked nose?

are you bit dinaric or SEEurope ? Black Hair?

and bushy thick eyebrows ? low-trust face ?

You have to be a turk lol
shouldnt be an insult

Detective Shekelberg you’re making me regret posting those scans haha but... actually I’m something quite more interesting friend ( :

I don’t think you’ll pin point it but anything’s possible no? ( :
Cody said:
He does zygo and infraorbital implants too?
He does Zygos with peek, not sure about infraorbital.

Y. did my cheeks and Defrancq has complimented them many times... seems he quite admires them (design and the work done)
 
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Adrenochrome said:
Detective Shekelberg you’re making me regret posting those scans haha but... actually I’m something quite more interesting friend ( :

I don’t think you’ll pin point it but anything’s possible no? ( :
didnt want to derail your thread tho
 
Adrenochrome

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Dr Shekelberg said:
didnt want to derail your thread tho
It’s all good brother ... I’m enjoying the cat/mouse aspect ha
 
MogTheMogger

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Adrenochrome said:
Thanks brother and I would actually tend to agree with you but ... in my situation, I used my original design from Y and slightly tweaked the taper of the gonial angles ... so, you might see something interesting soon ( :

Time will tell -first issue of utmost importance is making sure I’ve no infection or else its all in vain.

im proud of you king, i hope you show pics of the result so i can have more lifefuel in my life, godspeed fam
 
Adrenochrome

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Random rage @ mod knajjd for killing my AVI -reason NSFW??? Really ....

Maybe I need to nuke this thread in honor of knajjd - give me my AVI back you dog!
Dr Shekelberg said:
Super no haha
 
Adrenochrome

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MogTheMogger said:
im proud of you king, i hope you show pics of the result so i can have more lifefuel in my life, godspeed fam

The world needs more like you brother - true looksmaxxing thoroughbreds supporting others!

Thank you for the kind words and if everything works out, maybe I will fam ( :

- LMS Thoroughbred Gang
SirGey said:
Ascension via bones > Ascension via implants.
I’ve got the best of both worlds, fix your equation ( :
 
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Adrenochrome said:
READ IT IN ITS ENTIRETY

As I wrote from previous thread: I got a custom Peek jaw and chin wraparound with a specialized genioplasty that fits within the chin portion of the peek to make a natural mentolabial fold by Dr. Defrancq.

Essential background that led to my choice of Dr. Defrancq:
If you’re familiar with my
situation, then you know that previously, I had a custom silicone jaw/chin wraparound designed by and surgery with Dr. Y that did not go as planned: I incurred infection and everything had to be removed.

Regarding Dr. Y. There are two important distinctions that I wish to make:

1. Dr. Y. as an individual, I liked (even though he was NOT transparent with me: more on that later).

Nobody can beat his design aesthetic: I prepared for months with drafts and photos of the exact aesthetic I wanted. We worked together and he nailed it! Yes, I was able to model and yes I was breaking f*cking necks whenever I went out (night and day difference).

However... and to my second point

2. The overall service was garbage and I would not go back for the life of me.

Really, just outstandingly incompetent staff (desk bimbos) who should be serving fries at McDonald’s instead of handling clients large money transfers or trying to coordinate patients surgical plans (dates, times, medications, proper instruction) you know ... the stuff you actually need to have a successful surgical outcome! (Ridiculously low IQ) although there was one office girl I liked.

Infection period:
To make a long story short, Dr. Y. Stood by me and his word... to an extent.

He removed the infected implant ”free” less the cost of the anesthesiologist (read that as $4,000 usd + cost of operating theatre $800) However, the issue is that I had to do this twice because the first time was for a culture sample to see if it was an actual infection (sounds good right? But wait a minute) it was actually really stupid because I was taking antibiotics at that time which would have and did skew the test to read negative (no infection) when there actually WAS an infection in the end.

So... two procedures for removal that had a nice price tag of $8000 for the anesthesiologist + cost of using the operating theater twice $1600 for a whopping total of $8,800 (no I didn’t mess that up as Dr. Y. Comped me on the last theater use -nice I guess?) but I want you guys to understand the total cost of our endeavors:

original surgery with Y. was 19k (custom cheeks, jaw/chin) and then add on the removal cost of 8k and this isn’t counting travel logistics (I had to fly back and forth about 6 times and 2 of those times were from across the other part of the world I.e. my plane tickets were averaging $1200) and then you have to factor in hotels (my original procedure I stayed about 1 week in Boston for $800 a night) .... you see where I’m going with this....

You really need to prepare for every possible scenario and have a financial contingency plan in place.

Now ...

With everything removed, I was on the road to recovery (read that as 6 months down time) which actually turned into 2 years for the following reasons:

In short, that infection ruined everything: place I was living in abroad (had to come home), opportunities (documentary I was going to be featured in), my own projects, financials obviously, time and my health (physical and emotional well-being) -terrible experience -you never want to go through something like this EVER.

I could have gone back to Dr. Y. after 6 months to try again for the cost of the anesthesiologist and operating theater again: $4800 but...

I knew there had to be a better way and my intent was to minimize as much risk as possible. Silicone had mentally scarred me and was off my list for the jaw/chin area. 6 months of research on implant materials and surgeons turned into 2 years; spanning from the most invasive of jaw surgery with Gunson from Arnett and Gunson to the least invasive (fillers - you’ve all seen those Dr’s who are like wizards with that stuff, insane).

I went on consults to Zarrinbal in Berlin (complete waste of time for me personally) to multiple Skype consults with different surgeons all over the world.

At one point, I even thought “fuck it” I’m just going to get my eye area done with Taban and forget about the chin/jaw because eye area is just as, if not more important than jaw (I know highly debatable) and I wouldn’t have to worry about infection but... I knew what that jaw implant had got me (endless opportunities) and I’ve never forgotten that ... EVER... I tasted my dream and it was snatched away from me in an instant but I’m getting it back no matter what!


That brings me to Defrancq ... the best source of reliable information comes from first hand accounts and I’m across many different surgical forums. My one friend had a disastrous surgery with Dr. Brusco from Switzerland (yeah the guy who uses Titanium for jaw implants and learned how to do chin wings from Triaca).

Well Brusco obliterated his jaw bone (literally leaving pieces of it “floating“ around) and aesthetically ruined him .... I’m thinking fuck man, this is it ... he might actually rope (it was his 3rd or 4th revision) and at that time I was saturated with too many options (overloaded).

So... My friends saving grace? You guessed it, Defrancq. Defrancq pieced him up and got him level again. I’m thinking if this guy can turn my friend around proper then at least I have a chance.

Checked out his website and saw that he uses PEEK (check mark), see that he’s a maxillofacial surgeon and not a plastic surgeon (check mark and read that), see that he’s done many decent cases and has some age on him but not too much where it’s concerning to me (check mark) *everyone asking me about his age, yes he’s older but quite cognitively adept with acute surgical dexterity to match (I would not trust my face to him otherwise)

I contacted him and we talked for about a month discussing my situation (his proposals and my thoughts: only implants or only bone cuts or implants + bone cuts) and what could be done to correct it safely. In the end he suggested peek implants for the jaw/chin combined with a special geniolasty that would augment the labiomental fold naturally within the chin part of the peek implant. Also, this would greatly expand my airway and reduce the chance for developing sleep apnea in the future.

So... you see, form and function (beautiful). Now, design-wise (this is where Y. Comes in again) because I knew exactly what I wanted (partly my former design as I already knew how I would look) and showed Defrancq my original Silicone implant draft -he was able to draft his own version of it but changed the taper of the gonial angles to be more natural (which is what I wanted) so it was perfect for me.

However, (someone else mentioned he’s stubborn and a little tricky to deal with -I can confirm both) he tried to change my mind on the implant design like 2 weeks before surgery, after I already told him that I wanted design A back in November and we both agreed upon it... (he wanted to rework the gonial angles again and initially I agreed) but it was just dragging on (4 days before surgery! Can you believe that? Stressed me the FO) and didn’t meet my aesthetic standards, so I told him directly to go back to design A (which he did without problem). Although the whole thing was a little strange.

A pre-surgical consult is required the day before your surgery or he will not operate on you (it is an hour long minimum).
We went through all the details of how the surgery was going to be executed (poor choice of words ha).

I was even shown my PEEK implants and got to hold each piece while we discussed them (I’m kicking myself for not taking photos!)
The PEEK is SUPER lightweight and the material looks very cool in person. I was surprised by literally how small each piece is.

My experience so far has been superior (metaphorically mogs America in service... HARD) in fact, I would say America (from my personal experience) has thee lowest service standard, it’s disgusting really (feel like I got scammed at one of “top docs” in America with that silicone wraparound).

*will detail moments before surgery (morning of and talking with anesthesiologist etc...) to the post surgery care and my current state of care later (way too tired now and need to rest). Ask any questions relating to this thread that haven’t already been discussed above and I’ll answer each one of them when I’ve the time.
Are you the guy from the Cut article?The one who was of mixed ancestry?
 
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Implants are too risky in my opinion. I would be worried about it getting misplaced or getting an infection but I suppose that’s the risk your have to take.

I find it hard to believe a foreign material will remain perfect for fifty plus years. At some point nature will take its course and fuck you up.

Imagine being a grown man with a wife and kids, and all of a sudden your implant fucks up and you have to explain that shit to everyone.
 
AlexChase89

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I had a feeling Brusco was incompetent, glad to know my instincts were right.

Hope you avoid infection this time, or at the very least are able to salvage the implant with antibiotic irrigation in the event it happens.
 
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Hey man. A few questions.
Can you explain the thought process behind designing the implant? What did you look for? How much was it you and how much was it Y? Why did it take so long?
what do you mean by model? Did you manage to get into modeling with the implants? Did it look real?
What about E for implants? Why not him?
 
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Some good shit
 
Adrenochrome

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Random rage @ mod knajjd for killing my AVI -reason NSFW??? Really ....

Maybe I need to nuke this thread in honor of knajjd - give me my AVI back you dog!
tryingtofindsolution said:
Are you the guy from the Cut article?The one who was of mixed ancestry?
Cut article!? Link please brother ...
eetfuk said:
Implants are too risky in my opinion. I would be worried about it getting misplaced or getting an infection but I suppose that’s the risk your have to take.

I find it hard to believe a foreign material will remain perfect for fifty plus years. At some point nature will take its course and fuck you up.

Imagine being a grown man with a wife and kids, and all of a sudden your implant fucks up and you have to explain that shit to everyone.
Honestly I agree with you ... I’ve thought about that end scenario too -that would be SO twisted.
AlexChase89 said:
I had a feeling Brusco was incompetent, glad to know my instincts were right.

Hope you avoid infection this time, or at the very least are able to salvage the implant with antibiotic irrigation in the event it happens.

Yes... Brusco almost got me too because of his use of Titanium -insider talk but word on a different forum was that Triaca and another surgeon told other people who were considering going to Brusco, to steer clear of him because he has no idea what he’s doing (the crazy part is that Brusco trained under Triaca!)
 
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Adrenochrome said:
Random rage @ mod knajjd for killing my AVI -reason NSFW??? Really ....

Maybe I need to nuke this thread in honor of knajjd - give me my AVI back you dog!

Cut article!? Link please brother ...

Honestly I agree with you ... I’ve thought about that end scenario too -that would be SO twisted.


Yes... Brusco almost got me too because of his use of Titanium -insider talk but word on a different forum was that Triaca and another surgeon told others people who were considering going to Brusco, to steer clear of him because he has no idea what he’s doing (the crazy part is that Brusco trained under Triaca!)

3d printed Titanium is a great material for the mandible, I hope more surgeons start incorporating it

And that's wild. I suspected he sucked because his osteotomies at a skeletal level on the post op cbct scans he posts on his IG all look like dogshit. But yeah, the only people who know for certain which surgeons are good and which suck are other surgeons who have logged time in the OR with them. That's why when I consider a surgeon I always try to consult with someone who trained under them (or trained them) and ask their candid opinion. They'll usually be honest, and won't sing the other guy's praises unless they mean it.
 
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Dutcher said:
Hey man. A few questions.
Can you explain the thought process behind designing the implant? What did you look for? How much was it you and how much was it Y? Why did it take so long?
what do you mean by model? Did you manage to get into modeling with the implants? Did it look real?
What about E for implants? Why not him?

My thought process behind designing my implant was intense and highly personal: I chose around 8 different individuals faces who I admired aesthetically and in the first process of elimination literally superimposed their jaw/chin onto mine using photoshop.

It did not matter whose face I admired the most as I was looking for which features fit my face best (looked natural as my own). As it so happened, my highest regarded individual, aesthetically speaking, matched my lower third in all respects (it was beautiful) and at that point; I knew I had the foundational framework to begin designing my implant the way I wanted.

I used that framework and slightly fine tuned all aspects of the design to my own visage (gonial angle degree, Ramus length, horizontal width, vertical drop and projection length of chin etc...) *i could have left all the aforesaid variables alone and used the superimposed model by itself but it’s not how I operate (everything in my life is highly personalized).

it turned out really good too... so good in fact, that I tried to use the same technique with my eye area! It was much more difficult than my lower third and there were some grotesque mockups looking back at them (if someone saw those work ups without a frame of reference, I’m sure their first thought would be this person is mentally ill). Digressing a bit but, after about 30 trial and errors, I found one that was a decent match (eye area) but in the end I binned it and designed a completely custom eye area via photoshop using just my face (this version is perfect for me and is the one I used in my Taban consult -He said he can get me 75% there) and if this jaw endeavor goes well then we shall see what Taban can do (that will be it for me - no more surgery after eyes).

Back to your queries: price for Y was already mentioned above -honestly just read the whole thing, it might save you many lost years brother.... I don’t want you or anyone else to have to go through what I did -God ... it affects me in so many different ways now (research, research, research) that’s why I’m writing all of this -it’s free first hand information (invaluable!)

Price for Defrancq: I want to say this first, I still stand by my statement that we shouldn’t be posting prices on here... if you’ve been in this game long enough, then you understand and know that posted prices affect future markets (I’ve seen it before many times). However, (and very unfortunately) it seems this forum doesn’t care... so I’ll post it: all my procedures with Defrancq were 13k Euro (this included the surgeons fee of course) but also: staying in a private room at the clinic for 1 week with in house food service catered to you (I’ll take some photos of the meals if people are interested?) *you can literally ask for anything to be prepared for you and it’ll be done or bought at a local restaurant (phenomenal service) and food is delicious. You also get a private nurse the first two days/nights and then rotating nurses after that but there is also one individual assigned to you specifically from the get go (think of them as your patient coordinator and person who oversees each patient on the floor) -To me, these individuals are invaluable resources if you’re concerned about safety and also expect excellent service like myself. Also included was the cost for the implant fabrication/production.

So... all in all, I was very satisfied with my proposal.

Yes, I did local modeling (in East Asia) and the only reason I didn’t push further was because of my infection (sky was the limit). I was also casted for a documentary about foreigners living abroad 1 week before I had to fly back home for removal because of infection (shit crushed me). That was me tasting 15 minutes of fame at that point (I literally had a TV crew jump me as I walked off my flight. It was the most intense experience ever - 2 TV cameras surrounding you, big production lights, mic booms and I was tag teamed by 2 presenters!) -everything was being recorded live -can you imagine that scenario walking off your flight and totally ambushed (literally I was in a daze but it came natural after a few minutes) - everyone in that part of the airport stopped and started surrounding us (me and this TV crew) for sure I saw people taking photos and the group gradually got bigger -THAT is when I KNEW (just reconfirmed) that this look was going to get me where I wanted to be! I’ll never forget it.
AlexChase89 said:
3d printed Titanium is a great material for the mandible, I hope more surgeons start incorporating it

And that's wild. I suspected he sucked because his osteotomies at a skeletal level on the post op cbct scans he posts on his IG all look like dogshit. But yeah, the only people who know for certain which surgeons are good and which suck are other surgeons who have logged time in the OR with them. That's why when I consider a surgeon I always try to consult with someone who trained under them (or trained them) and ask their candid opinion. They'll usually be honest, and won't sing the other guy's praises unless they mean it.

Smart moves friend, seems you’re another LMS thoroughbred.

Cheers,
Fuk said:
Good thread but a picture is worth a thousand words.

show us a before and after (u can blur the eyes if u wanna be anonymous) and tell us the cost of everything from defranq

You’re absolutely right but I’m sorry brother, I can’t post any of my photos here. It’s too early for one (I’m SUPER swollen) with lips like IG whores and two, it’s really about privacy... this is a PSL forum. I think a lot of you guys are legit (people like me who just want to be the best physical version of themselves, who will do anything to attain it) but ... there’s unfortunately a lot of mental illness that runs rampant here too (doxxers, twisted people who just want to be malicious because they have larceny in their hearts etc...) so I don’t trust it. Sorry that those few ruined it for the majority of legit thoroughbreds here.

My suggestion is to look at SAL123’s thread again (shout out to Sal123 @Sal123 who had phenomenal results and was part of the inspiration for choosing Defrancq) and use it as a frame of reference with the information I’ve provided here. These two threads should provide a powerful lens into what you could expect if you chose our surgeon.
 
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Congrats bro, hopefully this time you can avoid infection!

What is your opinion about silicone in cheek?is it less risky than jaw?can you sleep on the side with silicone cheek implant?are you recommend custom silicone implant in cheek/zygo area?

And are you also posting in jawsurgeryforum?i think i read your thread there and also your friend who got chin wing with dr brusco.
 
Adrenochrome

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AlexChase89 said:
I learned the hard way like your friend did. A+ thread man
I’m very sorry to hear what happened to you brother -hope you are healing in all respects: no doubt we walk a difficult path friend.

Currently spitting up blood so I’m freaking out a bit -will see what Defrancq says and how the situation is handled.
 
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Adrenochrome said:
I’m very sorry to hear what happened to you brother -hope you are healing in all respects: no doubt we walk a difficult path friend.

Currently spitting up blood so I’m freaking out a bit -will see what Defrancq says and how the situation is handled.

It's alright, but yeah I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Took multiple surgeries over a few years to fix most of the damage.

Don't freak about spitting blood, but you can gently massage any stagnant fluid through the sutures if you're able to, as doing so will reduce the likelihood of infection. The doctors call it expressing the area. Also ask for a syringe (with no needle) so you can directly irrigate the suture line with the chlorhexidine rinse if you're not doing so already
 
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Adrenochrome

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AlexChase89 said:
It's alright, but yeah I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Took multiple surgeries over a few years to fix most of the damage.

Don't freak about spitting blood, but you can gently massage any stagnant fluid through the sutures if you're able to, as doing so will reduce the likelihood of infection. The doctors call it expressing the area. Also ask for a syringe (with no needle) so you can directly irrigate the suture line with the chlorhexidine rinse if you're not doing so already

Glad you’re better man and thank you very much for that syringe irrigation tip! (very valuable)

I want to see where Defrancq says the blood is coming from -the other reason I’m not freaking too much is because I had that genio too (I’ve no experience with bone cuts until now -perhaps it’s not too bad -will update when I get the word)
 
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any reason why u didnt even consider DR. Epelley
 
CopingCel

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Thanks for your detailed report.
Looks huge on the scans, I can imagine the fucking difference that thing brought in your life.

Adrenochrome said:
I went on consults to Z in Berlin (complete waste of time for me personally) to multiple Skype consults with different surgeons all over the world.

What didn't you like about dr Z?

I was consulting with him as well, he is definitely against implants, cause he finds the risk of infection too high.

Also told me peek would be even worse as removing it later would be more difficult due to Bone ingrowth. Aren't you afraid of that?

Also would love some before afters of your original implant via pm if you want to. Posted quite quite a few pics of myself here: https://looksmax.org/threads/need-s...on-troll-answers-how-over-is-it-for-me.85773/
I have no interest in doxxing anyone.
 
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eetfuk said:
Imagine being a grown man with a wife and kids, and all of a sudden your implant fucks up and you have to explain that shit to everyone.

Thats why subhuman people (male and female) should not reproduce. That only will pass down your suffering to your children.
If you are ugly, get implants live a nice live, have fun, but DON'T FUCKING REPRODUCE. Youre a horrible and cruel person if you do so.
Especially when knowing about the black pill.
 
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noped said:
any reason why u didnt even consider DR. Epelley

Numerous, honestly just google: one account I distinctly remember (as I talked to the patient directly) was that Eppley ran out of skull paste in the middle of his procedure and just left it as was ... he just left it ..... the patient incurred multiple serious issues -it’s on realself, search it.

The most well known:Lucille Lacovelli suffered with “neck gridlock” after a botched facelift by Dr. Barry Eppley. She could no longer close her mouth and had trouble breathing. Not long after Dr. Eppley sued Lacovelli for $40k in defamation damages, she took her own life.

There are many others but as always, the choice is your’s.
 
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Adrenochrome said:
Numerous, honestly just google: one account I distinctly remember (as I talked to the patient directly) was that Eppley ran out of skull paste in the middle of his procedure and just left it as was ... he just left it ..... the patient incurred multiple serious issues -it’s on realself, search it.

The most well known:Lucille Lacovelli suffered with “neck gridlock” after a botched facelift by Dr. Barry Eppley. She could no longer close her mouth and had trouble breathing. Not long after Dr. Eppley sued Lacovelli for $40k in defamation damages, she took her own life.

There are many others but as always, the choice is your’s.

brutal
 
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CopingCel said:
Thanks for your detailed report.
Looks huge on the scans, I can imagine the fucking difference that thing brought in your life.



What didn't you like about dr Z?

I was consulting with him as well, he is definitely against implants, cause he finds the risk of infection too high.

Also told me peek would be even worse as removing it later would be more difficult due to Bone ingrowth. Aren't you afraid of that?

Also would love some before afters of your original implant via pm if you want to. Posted quite quite a few pics of myself here: https://looksmax.org/threads/need-s...on-troll-answers-how-over-is-it-for-me.85773/
I have no interest in doxxing anyone.

You’re very welcome brother and yes, it was a game changer for me in many respects.

Z ... ahh Z was an interesting person but he wasted my time and was dishonest -actually he eventually ghosted me (which did me a huge favor because I may have very well went to him) if it wasn’t for Brusco of all people telling me that my mandible was not optimal for a chinwing.

Z said I was candidate for the CW when I was in Berlin and had nothing but positive things to say but when I returned home, sent me a message saying he saw pieces of silicone left over from my previous implant and that he would have to charge me extra for this but eventually ghosted me as I inquired further (fucking thief) I KNOW for a fact that this wasn’t true as I asked Defrancq if he saw any silicone left over during my surgery and on all the different types of scans we took; he said absolutely not!

Zarrinbal is a piece of human debris. He lied twice to me so I don’t trust nor care what he says and he’s biased against osteonomies just as strictly implant surgeons are biased against bone cuts. The truth always lies somewhere in the middle and the appropriate procedure is different for each individual.

Not afraid of anything friend as I’ve been to my own hell and back -do what’s best for you brother and hope you make it (for real).

Don’t have the original on phone but as stated my current version is a slightly enhanced rendition of my original silicone - the original had sharper gonial angles.

Are you humanix?
 
CopingCel

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Adrenochrome said:
Are you humanix?

No idea what, or who that is. This is my only account on this site.

Interesting. My experience was way more positive. Was there because of nose and jaw. He did take lots of time, was quite positive of dealing with insurance (there is a good chance insurance will pay a part of my nosejob for better breathing). Other doctors just wanted me pay 100% myself. He explained in detail how everything would go, etc.
Even told me to go home, sleep a few nights over my plans and come back to another visit if I wanted to proceed.(Did not do anything yet due to money)

Not sure why he was so strange with you as I overall have seen way more positive than negative experiences from him.

I guess it might be due to his huge bias against implants.
 
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Adrenochrome said:
You’re very welcome brother and yes, it was a game changer for me in many respects.

Z ... ahh Z was an interesting person but he wasted my time and was dishonest -actually he eventually ghosted me (which did me a huge favor because I may have very well went to him) if it wasn’t for Brusco of all people telling me that my mandible was not optimal for a chinwing.

Z said I was candidate for the CW when I was in Berlin and had nothing but positive things to say but when I returned home, sent me a message saying he saw pieces of silicone left over from my previous implant and that he would have to charge me extra for this but eventually ghosted me as I inquired further (fucking thief) I KNOW for a fact that this wasn’t true as I asked Defrancq if he saw any silicone left over during my surgery and on all the different types of scans we took; he said absolutely not!

Zarrinbal is a piece of human debris. He lied twice to me so I don’t trust nor care what he says and he’s biased against osteonomies just as strictly implant surgeons are biased against bone cuts. The truth always lies somewhere in the middle and the appropriate procedure is different for each individual.

Not afraid of anything friend as I’ve been to my own hell and back -do what’s best for you brother and hope you make it (for real).

Don’t have the original on phone but as stated my current version is a slightly enhanced rendition of my original silicone - the original had sharper gonial angles.

Are you humanix?

Zarrinbal became prominent on these boards because of one kid pushing him under multiple screen names, who also ran a phony facial analysis website claiming to be a team of physicians. Presumably to make money for his own surgeries. He did actually have multiple surgeries with Z himself and had good outcomes, but there's no question the hype around Zarrinbal was generated almost entirely from this one kid. I also know for a fact (from another private board) that when someone complained about their result on one of the forums, within days Zarrinbal himself contacted the moderators to try and have it taken down. The guy takes weeks to reply to an email but was all over a negative forum review within a few days. Make of that what you will.
 
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The amount of dedication, pain and money you spent is commendable. The looksmaxxing journey is not an easy one... it is a strenuous one, but we do it because we know that all this effort to change mm of our face will significantly improve the quality of our lives.
 
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AlexChase89 said:
Zarrinbal became prominent on these boards because of one kid pushing him under multiple screen names, who also ran a phony facial analysis website claiming to be a team of physicians. Presumably to make money for his own surgeries. He did actually have multiple surgeries with Z himself and had good outcomes, but there's no question the hype around Zarrinbal was generated almost entirely from this one kid. I also know for a fact (from another private board) that when someone complained about their result on one of the forums, within days Zarrinbal himself contacted the moderators to try and have it taken down. The guy takes weeks to reply to an email but was all over a negative forum review within a few days. Make of that what you will.

Can confirm that this is known across another authoritative forum too and what’s funny is that I actually used that kids photos as a source of contact for Zarrinbal -he responded to me in 2 days time.
diggbicc said:
The amount of dedication, pain and money you spent is commendable. The looksmaxxing journey is not an easy one... it is a strenuous one, but we do it because we know that all this effort to change mm of our face will significantly improve the quality of our lives.

Good to see another thoroughbred on this forum. You nailed it and thank you brother. I hope your journey is a positive and successful one (keep me updated).
 

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