Ultimate veneers guide [High effort]

[Recopilating this info took me a month of reading papers and studies done for dentists, coupled with very thorough Instagram searches and watching seminars from top tier ceramists. There's nothing wrote in depth about veneers and the market itself is shady af, I hope this helps you to ascend].

First of all, if you have a malocclusion, a narrow smile, crowded teeth, etc, you have to fix it first, non negotiable. There are plenty of threads here that have everything you need with regards to jaw surgery, palate widening or even surgically assisted orthodontics. This guide is only useful if you already have a class 1 occlusion, non recessed jaw and adequate palate width, but not good tooth enamel and as such need veneers or crowns (or you only need braces to straighten your teeth and widen your dental arch a little bit, and also contemplate veneers to improve your teeth's appeareance, but you don't have jaw recession or a narrow palate as mentioned before).

IMPORTANT: veneers are made by ceramists, not dentists, and the ceramist skills trumps the material used. A top tier ceramist can make EMAX or even indirect composite veneers look much better than porcelain made by a mediocre ceramist.


What type of veneer/crown materials exist?

- Metal made crowns: this look like shit and are obsolete, avoid at all costs.

- Zirconia made crowns and veeners: this are the highest strenght available and replaced metal made crowns. They are more suitable for molars, their strenght is twice as much as the natural tooth enamel. So, why not do a full mouth restoration out of zirconia? Because it has the lowest translucency and looks very artificial, so it is the worst looking material possible. The typical Hollywood/Instagram artificial smile is made with zirconia most of the time:

dis-kaplamasi.jpeg


- Lithium disilicate veneers and crowns (EMAX): this is very popular and has the same strenght as tooth enamel in monolithic form. It looks better than zirconia but not as good as natural teeth. It is the best material for molars, because it is more aesthetic than zirconia and matches the natural enamel strenght. It can be stratified with porcelain on top to look better and resemble natural teeth a lot more. The downside is that it looses strenght and is not suitable for back molars like before. The higher the translucency and aesthetics, the lower the strenght, this is a consistent tradeoff. The norm with EMAX restorations usually is to have monolithic, non stratified crowns on molars, and stratified, higher aesthetics but lower strenght veneers/crowns in the front.
EMAX veneers stratified with porcelain on top:

a30.jpg


- Composite veneers (direct and indirect): this are the cheapest possible veneer, and can be done direct (the dentist does it in the same visit) or indirect (a mold of your teeth is send to a lab where they make the veneers). The very best option, of course, is to have a top tier ceramist make you indirect composite veneers. Don't be fooled by their price, for the right patient, they mog EMAX. Downside is that they last half as much as EMAX or Porcelain, and stain with tobacco or tea (not that you should be smoking but is good to know) and have a very low strenght. This is an example of indirect composite veneers done by a great ceramist:

13-a530d596.png

29-df201b76.png


As you can see, he already have very good tooth enamel and color, but weird central incisors. Indirect composite can give high translucency and mimic natural enamel to a large degree, and because he already had a great starting point, he saved lots of money and got a mogger result.

- Off the shelf porcelain veneers (Lumineers, Empress): Don't get me wrong, this are still custom made to fit your teeth, but not as much as other alternatives that I'll mention. This type of porcelain veneer has higher translucency and aesthetics than EMAX (monolithic or stratified), but is not as strong, so they can't be used for molars. They are sold as no prep veneers, but you have to be careful with this, because most veneers normally need some take some teeth away to look natural and avoid a bulky look. While we should strive to preserve as much teeth as possible, we shouldn't fall for the always minimally invasive meme and get a subpar result too. This is one example I found, as you can see, it looks good but not much better than EMAX. IMO well done composite mogs this, and if you have cash, you should avoid it and skip to the next two alternatives I'm going to talk about.

lumineers-veneers.jpg


- Fully custom feldspathic porcelain veneers (CAD/CAM made): OK, as the name implies, this are fully custom made for you. Feldspathic porcelain is the material most similar to teeth enamel and the one with the highest aesthetics, period. CAD/CAM veneers and crowns designed with software using a microcamera to take thousands of pictures of your mouth, print a realistic mold and send it to a lab, where a technician CNC mills a block of porcelain until it obtains the desired shape, and a ceramist hand paints it to obtain a natural result. With softwares like Smile Cloud, you can even see how the smile will look on you, both static and in motion (!). The same technique can be used for EMAX and Zirconia too, in fact, is much more common to have fully custom EMAX veneers with this method, but you can get feldspathic porcelain too.

biometric_design_tab_ok.7235e777.jpg


So, this mogs brutally and that's it? Not so fast, being milled from a single block, they still lack translucency and aesthetics compared to this alternative, which mogs so hard it will shock you.

- Fully custom, hand made on platinum foil or refractory method feldspathic porcelain veneers: this methods are the old school way of doing porcelain veneers, and by far the most aesthetic if done by a good ceramist. The porcelain, in powder state, is layered by hand by the ceramist until the desired shape and color is obtained. The only con is that they are weaker than tooth enamel, so they are not good for the molars. You can still get the 10 anterior teeth and the sides of your molars veneered (if you have a true 12 tooth smile) with it.

Words don't describe how hard this mogs, so I'm going to leave you with this instead:





We haven't touched on inlays and outlays, which are like partial crowns. If your teeth is not that damaged to warrant a crown, you can (and should) have an inlay or outlay, made with EMAX if it's in the molars, or with indirect composite or hand made porcelain if you want if it is in the front teeth. These are also cheaper than veneers and crowns by around 30%.

Normally, in Spain, this would be the prices per tooth:

- Indirect composite: 200-300€
- EMAX: 500-700€ (CAD-CAM, stratified or not)
- Lumineers/Empress: 500-700€
- CAD/CAM Porcelain: 500-700€
- Hand made Porcelain: 700-1000€

Hand made porcelain by a world class ceramist can cost up to 2000-2500€ per tooth (see Dr_Averin recent IG posts :feelswhy:).

TL;DR:
you either have this smile or nothing, no excuses other than money:

5-castano-mechas-rubias-naturales-1666349823.jpg
 
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[Recopilating this info took me a month of reading papers and studies done for dentists, coupled with very thorough Instagram searches and watching seminars from top tier ceramists. There's nothing wrote in depth about veneers and the market itself is shady af, I hope this helps you to ascend].

First of all, if you have a malocclusion, a narrow smile, crowded teeth, etc, you have to fix it first, non negotiable. There are plenty of threads here that have everything you need with regards to jaw surgery, palate widening or even surgically assisted orthodontics. This guide is only useful if you already have a class 1 occlusion, non recessed jaw and adequate palate width, but not good tooth enamel and as such need veneers or crowns (or you only need braces to straighten your teeth and widen your dental arch a little bit, and also contemplate veneers to improve your teeth's appeareance, but you don't have jaw recession or a narrow palate as mentioned before).

IMPORTANT: veneers are made by ceramists, not dentists, and the ceramist skills trumps the material used. A top tier ceramist can make EMAX or even indirect composite veneers look much better than porcelain made by a mediocre ceramist.


What type of veneer/crown materials exist?

- Metal made crowns: this look like shit and are obsolete, avoid at all costs.

- Zirconia made crowns and veeners: this are the highest strenght available and replaced metal made crowns. They are more suitable for molars, their strenght is twice as much as the natural tooth enamel. So, why not do a full mouth restoration out of zirconia? Because it has the lowest translucency and looks very artificial, so it is the worst looking material possible. The typical Hollywood/Instagram artificial smile is made with zirconia most of the time:

dis-kaplamasi.jpeg


- Lithium disilicate veneers and crowns (EMAX): this is very popular and has the same strenght as tooth enamel in monolithic form. It looks better than zirconia but not as good as natural teeth. It is the best material for molars, because it is more aesthetic than zirconia and matches the natural enamel strenght. It can be stratified with porcelain on top to look better and resemble natural teeth a lot more. The downside is that it looses strenght and is not suitable for back molars like before. The higher the translucency and aesthetics, the lower the strenght, this is a consistent tradeoff. The norm with EMAX restorations usually is to have monolithic, non stratified crowns on molars, and stratified, higher aesthetics but lower strenght veneers/crowns in the front.
EMAX veneers stratified with porcelain on top:

a30.jpg


- Composite veneers (direct and indirect): this are the cheapest possible veneer, and can be done direct (the dentist does it in the same visit) or indirect (a mold of your teeth is send to a lab where they make the veneers). The very best option, of course, is to have a top tier ceramist make you indirect composite veneers. Don't be fooled by their price, for the right patient, they mog EMAX. Downside is that they last half as much as EMAX or Porcelain, and stain with tobacco or tea (not that you should be smoking but is good to know) and have a very low strenght. This is an example of indirect composite veneers done by a great ceramist:

13-a530d596.png

29-df201b76.png


As you can see, he already have very good tooth enamel and color, but weird central incisors. Indirect composite can give high translucency and mimic natural enamel to a large degree, and because he already had a great starting point, he saved lots of money and got a mogger result.

- Off the shelf porcelain veneers (Lumineers, Empress): Don't get me wrong, this are still custom made to fit your teeth, but not as much as other alternatives that I'll mention. This type of porcelain veneer has higher translucency and aesthetics than EMAX (monolithic or stratified), but is not as strong, so they can't be used for molars. They are sold as no prep veneers, but you have to be careful with this, because most veneers normally need some take some teeth away to look natural and avoid a bulky look. While we should strive to preserve as much teeth as possible, we shouldn't fall for the always minimally invasive meme and get a subpar result too. This is one example I found, as you can see, it looks good but not much better than EMAX. IMO well done composite mogs this, and if you have cash, you should avoid it and skip to the next two alternatives I'm going to talk about.

lumineers-veneers.jpg


- Fully custom feldspathic porcelain veneers (CAD/CAM made): OK, as the name implies, this are fully custom made for you. Feldspathic porcelain is the material most similar to teeth enamel and the one with the highest aesthetics, period. CAD/CAM veneers and crowns designed with software using a microcamera to take thousands of pictures of your mouth, print a realistic mold and send it to a lab, where a technician CNC mills a block of porcelain until it obtains the desired shape, and a ceramist hand paints it to obtain a natural result. With softwares like Smile Cloud, you can even see how the smile will look on you, both static and in motion (!). The same technique can be used for EMAX and Zirconia too, in fact, is much more common to have fully custom EMAX veneers with this method, but you can get feldspathic porcelain too.

biometric_design_tab_ok.7235e777.jpg


So, this mogs brutally and that's it? Not so fast, being milled from a single block, they still lack translucency and aesthetics compared to this alternative, which mogs so hard it will shock you.

- Fully custom, hand made on platinum foil or refractory method feldspathic porcelain veneers: this methods are the old school way of doing porcelain veneers, and by far the most aesthetic if done by a good ceramist. The porcelain, in powder state, is layered by hand by the ceramist until the desired shape and color is obtained. The only con is that they are weaker than tooth enamel, so they are not good for the molars. You can still get the 10 anterior teeth and the sides of your molars veneered (if you have a true 12 tooth smile) with it.

Words don't describe how hard this mogs, so I'm going to leave you with this instead:





We haven't touched on inlays and outlays, which are like partial crowns. If your teeth is not that damaged to warrant a crown, you can (and should) have an inlay or outlay, made with EMAX if it's in the molars, or with indirect composite or hand made porcelain if you want if it is in the front teeth. These are also cheaper than veneers and crowns by around 30%.

Normally, in Spain, this would be the prices per tooth:

- Indirect composite: 200-300€
- EMAX: 500-700€ (CAD-CAM, stratified or not)
- Lumineers/Empress: 500-700€
- CAD/CAM Porcelain: 500-700€
- Hand made Porcelain: 700-1000€

Hand made porcelain by a world class ceramist can cost up to 2000-2500€ per tooth (see Dr_Averin recent IG posts :feelswhy:).

TL;DR:
you either have this smile or nothing, no excuses other than money:

5-castano-mechas-rubias-naturales-1666349823.jpg


Updating this as I've made a typo.
Dr averin is a dentist, not a ceramist.
His ceramist has an IG account called Dental Necro.

The dentists are the ones who decide the final prices. For example, a veneer made by Dental Necro and placed/designed by Dr Averin costs around 2500$.
I spoke to another dentist that works with Dental Necro (Pierre Layan, from Paris) and said that a veneer designed by him and made by Dental Necro costs 1250$ (half of what Dr Averin charges).
Dental Necro charges 500$ per veneer to the dentists btw.

What I'm trying to say is: find a good dentist, look what ceramists he works with and ask prices. I suppose one can even talk to his local dentist about working with one of those great ceramists, and end up with fair priced but awesome veneers.
 
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Are you saying I have too little gum? I always imagined the problem was the opposite.

I'll be oldcel by the time palate widening and braces are finished, so it's not happening anyway 🤷‍♂️
 
Got back from the dentist today. I was told there's no way to restore gum on my right incisor and right front tooth, because they're fake, and he was sceptical about re-veneering them for reasons reasons. He insisted my palate wasn't narrow - which he might or might not be correct about - and motherfucker insisted there's nothing wrong with my smile.
 
Got back from the dentist today. I was told there's no way to restore gum on my right incisor and right front tooth, because they're fake, and he was sceptical about re-veneering them for reasons reasons. He insisted my palate wasn't narrow - which he might or might not be correct about - and motherfucker insisted there's nothing wrong with my smile.

Visit a different dentist ASAP. Search for dentists that perform expansion orthodontics, in addition to MARPE and SARPE. Sounds like your ortho is one of those cucks that do extractions all the time and thinks a 6 tooth smile is good. Avoid like the plague.
 
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Visit a different dentist ASAP. Search for dentists that perform expansion orthodontics, in addition to MARPE and SARPE. Sounds like your ortho is one of those cucks that do extractions all the time and thinks a 6 tooth smile is good. Avoid like the plague.

He was mildly optimistic about invisalign for making my smile wider, and I'll get images to show what the results might look like. However, I barely see the point if he thinks my right front tooth and right incisor are beyond hope.
 
my enamel is fucked and it hurts to know that the only way I’m getting a white smile is a veneer

It’s so fucking over man
 
If anything you want your teeth to be slightly yellow from smoking to give you that rugged, gritty look.

A pale being too polished with perfect teeth, perfect cut at all times, perfect tretitonin glowing "healthy" shrinkwrap faggot skin with zero fine-lines or wrinkles IS NOT SEXY.

Only BONE matters.

Unironically you want to look more like him for maximum masc sex appeal:
Aragorn.jpg
 
Does someone know a dentist with good cost/benefit in Europe?

I’d be willing to pay at maximum €800-1000 per tooth, no more than that
 
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Does someone know a dentist with good cost/benefit in Europe?

I’d be willing to pay at maximum €800-1000 per tooth, no more than that

There are plenty of them in Spain. Look for clínica Friedlander in Barcelona, they charge in between 600-800€ per tooth for feldspathic veneers and the few results on their IG are excellent. They also have very blackpilled orthos. This is one result of Invisalign + 6 feldspathic veneers:

 
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There are plenty of them in Spain. Look for clínica Friedlander in Barcelona, they charge in between 600-800€ per tooth for feldspathic veneers and the few results on their IG are excellent. They also have very blackpilled orthos. This is one result of Invisalign + 6 feldspathic veneers:


Thanks a lot for the reply and suggestion, these are the best, right? I should go there end of the year, that I will finish my alligners treatment

Do you know someone that went there already?
 
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Thanks a lot for the reply and suggestion, these are the best, right? I should go there end of the year, that I will finish my alligners treatment

Do you know someone that went there already?

I don't know of anyone that went there, just saw their website, results and followed the orthos too on IG. Was very impressed with what I saw.

I plan to go to a different, local ortho for accelerated orthodontics + 2 molar implants (I live 1000km away from Barcelona, so it is infinitely more convenient) and try to get him to work with a ceramist of my choice. If working with a ceramist of my choice isn't an option, my first choice for veneers and cosmetic dentistry after having the orthodontics + implants done would be Friedlander.
 
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Reactions: looksseg
IMG 1759

What about colors? This guide doesn’t even mention it jfl. Should you go for the whitest possible?
IMG 1760
 
[Recopilating this info took me a month of reading papers and studies done for dentists, coupled with very thorough Instagram searches and watching seminars from top tier ceramists. There's nothing wrote in depth about veneers and the market itself is shady af, I hope this helps you to ascend].

First of all, if you have a malocclusion, a narrow smile, crowded teeth, etc, you have to fix it first, non negotiable. There are plenty of threads here that have everything you need with regards to jaw surgery, palate widening or even surgically assisted orthodontics. This guide is only useful if you already have a class 1 occlusion, non recessed jaw and adequate palate width, but not good tooth enamel and as such need veneers or crowns (or you only need braces to straighten your teeth and widen your dental arch a little bit, and also contemplate veneers to improve your teeth's appeareance, but you don't have jaw recession or a narrow palate as mentioned before).

IMPORTANT: veneers are made by ceramists, not dentists, and the ceramist skills trumps the material used. A top tier ceramist can make EMAX or even indirect composite veneers look much better than porcelain made by a mediocre ceramist.


What type of veneer/crown materials exist?

- Metal made crowns: this look like shit and are obsolete, avoid at all costs.

- Zirconia made crowns and veeners: this are the highest strenght available and replaced metal made crowns. They are more suitable for molars, their strenght is twice as much as the natural tooth enamel. So, why not do a full mouth restoration out of zirconia? Because it has the lowest translucency and looks very artificial, so it is the worst looking material possible. The typical Hollywood/Instagram artificial smile is made with zirconia most of the time:

dis-kaplamasi.jpeg


- Lithium disilicate veneers and crowns (EMAX): this is very popular and has the same strenght as tooth enamel in monolithic form. It looks better than zirconia but not as good as natural teeth. It is the best material for molars, because it is more aesthetic than zirconia and matches the natural enamel strenght. It can be stratified with porcelain on top to look better and resemble natural teeth a lot more. The downside is that it looses strenght and is not suitable for back molars like before. The higher the translucency and aesthetics, the lower the strenght, this is a consistent tradeoff. The norm with EMAX restorations usually is to have monolithic, non stratified crowns on molars, and stratified, higher aesthetics but lower strenght veneers/crowns in the front.
EMAX veneers stratified with porcelain on top:

a30.jpg


- Composite veneers (direct and indirect): this are the cheapest possible veneer, and can be done direct (the dentist does it in the same visit) or indirect (a mold of your teeth is send to a lab where they make the veneers). The very best option, of course, is to have a top tier ceramist make you indirect composite veneers. Don't be fooled by their price, for the right patient, they mog EMAX. Downside is that they last half as much as EMAX or Porcelain, and stain with tobacco or tea (not that you should be smoking but is good to know) and have a very low strenght. This is an example of indirect composite veneers done by a great ceramist:

13-a530d596.png

29-df201b76.png


As you can see, he already have very good tooth enamel and color, but weird central incisors. Indirect composite can give high translucency and mimic natural enamel to a large degree, and because he already had a great starting point, he saved lots of money and got a mogger result.

- Off the shelf porcelain veneers (Lumineers, Empress): Don't get me wrong, this are still custom made to fit your teeth, but not as much as other alternatives that I'll mention. This type of porcelain veneer has higher translucency and aesthetics than EMAX (monolithic or stratified), but is not as strong, so they can't be used for molars. They are sold as no prep veneers, but you have to be careful with this, because most veneers normally need some take some teeth away to look natural and avoid a bulky look. While we should strive to preserve as much teeth as possible, we shouldn't fall for the always minimally invasive meme and get a subpar result too. This is one example I found, as you can see, it looks good but not much better than EMAX. IMO well done composite mogs this, and if you have cash, you should avoid it and skip to the next two alternatives I'm going to talk about.

lumineers-veneers.jpg


- Fully custom feldspathic porcelain veneers (CAD/CAM made): OK, as the name implies, this are fully custom made for you. Feldspathic porcelain is the material most similar to teeth enamel and the one with the highest aesthetics, period. CAD/CAM veneers and crowns designed with software using a microcamera to take thousands of pictures of your mouth, print a realistic mold and send it to a lab, where a technician CNC mills a block of porcelain until it obtains the desired shape, and a ceramist hand paints it to obtain a natural result. With softwares like Smile Cloud, you can even see how the smile will look on you, both static and in motion (!). The same technique can be used for EMAX and Zirconia too, in fact, is much more common to have fully custom EMAX veneers with this method, but you can get feldspathic porcelain too.

biometric_design_tab_ok.7235e777.jpg


So, this mogs brutally and that's it? Not so fast, being milled from a single block, they still lack translucency and aesthetics compared to this alternative, which mogs so hard it will shock you.

- Fully custom, hand made on platinum foil or refractory method feldspathic porcelain veneers: this methods are the old school way of doing porcelain veneers, and by far the most aesthetic if done by a good ceramist. The porcelain, in powder state, is layered by hand by the ceramist until the desired shape and color is obtained. The only con is that they are weaker than tooth enamel, so they are not good for the molars. You can still get the 10 anterior teeth and the sides of your molars veneered (if you have a true 12 tooth smile) with it.

Words don't describe how hard this mogs, so I'm going to leave you with this instead:





We haven't touched on inlays and outlays, which are like partial crowns. If your teeth is not that damaged to warrant a crown, you can (and should) have an inlay or outlay, made with EMAX if it's in the molars, or with indirect composite or hand made porcelain if you want if it is in the front teeth. These are also cheaper than veneers and crowns by around 30%.

Normally, in Spain, this would be the prices per tooth:

- Indirect composite: 200-300€
- EMAX: 500-700€ (CAD-CAM, stratified or not)
- Lumineers/Empress: 500-700€
- CAD/CAM Porcelain: 500-700€
- Hand made Porcelain: 700-1000€

Hand made porcelain by a world class ceramist can cost up to 2000-2500€ per tooth (see Dr_Averin recent IG posts :feelswhy:).

TL;DR:
you either have this smile or nothing, no excuses other than money:

5-castano-mechas-rubias-naturales-1666349823.jpg

Help me king lookmaxxer
 
View attachment 2354537
What about colors? This guide doesn’t even mention it jfl. Should you go for the whitest possible?
View attachment 2354539

The thing is, that shades are a very rough estimate. The last type of veneers (feldspathic and platinum foil) have hand made colors that do not fit the shade guides exactly. For example, a feldspathic veneer may have a color "in between A and B" and 1.75 instead of 1 or 2.
It's true that they use the shades list as a guide but not as gospel.
The only ones that follow the shade guides to a t are the milled ones that look like shit, like the ones you posted. Very artificial morphology and comically white, opaque teeth.

Translucency is another huge factor too, a hand made veneer made to resemble the A1 shade looks different than a milled one due to the much higher translucency.

Screenshot from Dr Averin's IG stories

Screenshot 2023 07 25 16 31 53 44 1c337646f29875672b5a61192b9010f9


Another Averin post, he really posts great info on IG


Use the translate function for the description, basically says that the resulting color is not from a standard shade guide, more translucent and custom made.

I personally like a color like this the most:



Not overly white (but still white) and very translucent. I've been analyzing lots of smiles and noticed that all my favourite ones were of a color similar to that.
 
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The thing is, that shades are a very rough estimate. The last type of veneers (feldspathic and platinum foil) have hand made colors that do not fit the shade guides exactly. For example, a feldspathic veneer may have a color "in between A and B" and 1.75 instead of 1 or 2.
It's true that they use the shades list as a guide but not as gospel.
The only ones that follow the shade guides to a t are the milled ones that look like shit, like the ones you posted. Very artificial morphology and comically white, opaque teeth.

Translucency is another huge factor too, a hand made veneer made to resemble the A1 shade looks different than a milled one due to the much higher translucency.

Screenshot from Dr Averin's IG stories

View attachment 2354544

Another Averin post, he really posts great info on IG


Use the translate function for the description, basically says that the resulting color is not from a standard shade guide, more translucent and custom made.

I personally like a color like this the most:



Not overly white (but still white) and very translucent. I've been analyzing lots of smiles and noticed that all my favourite ones were of a color similar to that.

High iq reply, averin is definition of oofy doofy btw :lul:
IMG 1763
 
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High iq reply, averin is definition of oofy doofy btw :lul:
View attachment 2354551

True lmao
Mirin' his IQ and Hot girlfriend tho, dude is winning at life

PS: he is ukranian IIRC so Chad there cuz status=everything and looksmaxxer=gay in EE jfl
 
Last edited:
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True lmao
Mirin' his IQ and Hot girlfriend tho, dude is winning at life

PS: he is ukranian IIRC so Chad there cuz status=everything and looksmaxxer=gay in EE jfl
I’m Polish and I wish status was everything in EE lmao. Well I’ll be having my custom veneers in 1 month, I’ll share the results here ofc.
 
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I’m Polish and I wish status was everything in EE lmao. Well I’ll be having my custom veneers in 1 month, I’ll share the results here ofc.

Lol
Love to read that, best luck and can't wait to see that mogger smile!
 
I don't know of anyone that went there, just saw their website, results and followed the orthos too on IG. Was very impressed with what I saw.

I plan to go to a different, local ortho for accelerated orthodontics + 2 molar implants (I live 1000km away from Barcelona, so it is infinitely more convenient) and try to get him to work with a ceramist of my choice. If working with a ceramist of my choice isn't an option, my first choice for veneers and cosmetic dentistry after having the orthodontics + implants done would be Friedlander.
Where do you live? I also live +- 1.000 km for that. More specifically in Germany, but I don’t know who are good and “cheap” here, so might be better to just go for one in another European city, but that I can rely more
 
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View attachment 2354537
What about colors? This guide doesn’t even mention it jfl. Should you go for the whitest possible?
View attachment 2354539
Just to be aware
A shades are natural Adult colors
B shades are natural baby colors
BL shades are artificial shades that are whiter than the whitest natural

For all of them The Lower the number the whiter, and BL4 (darkest of the artificials) is whiter than A1 and B1
B1 is also a bit whiter than A1

You should aim for A1, B1 or BL4 at maximum, if you have these shades as references
 
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Where do you live? I also live +- 1.000 km for that. More specifically in Germany, but I don’t know who are good and “cheap” here, so might be better to just go for one in another European city, but that I can rely more

I live in Spain but in Galicia, basically at the other side of the country.

Germany usually is much more expensive. I asked a german based dentist for the price of veneers and said 1650€ per tooth (Richard Kleinsman).
France is also on the expensive side, if you can pony up 1250€ per tooth, Pierre Layan is a top choice.
The spanish ones I saw on IG usually charge 600-800€ per tooth for the same veneers (handmade feldspathic porcelain), like Friedlander.
I suspect that italian dentists may have similar prices to the spanish ones.

With regards to quality, compare this Friedlander result:



With this one from Michael Apa, one of the most prestiguous dentists in the entire world, who also works with hand made feldspathic veneers and reportedly charges 3k usd per tooth or more IIRC



Other than the resolution of the picture, the one from Friedlander looks on the same level to me. That girl paid for 6 veneers and probably teeth whitening (apart from the aligners) and got a very similar result paying several times less. IMO paying more than 1000€ per veneer is not worth it, maybe 1250€ for Pierre Layan but that would be the reasonable limit for me, more than that is paying for the dentist caché
 
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Celebrities usually have shit jobs done smh, normal people that research a little bit and have some money usually have way better surgery outcomes.
its a general fallacy of wealthy people. Instead of doing their own research they just pick the most expensive option assuming it must be the best one.
 
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Hello again,

I’m finishing treatment with aligners, I suppose, and soon after finished I’ll go with veneers.

Do you still think that Clinica friedlander is the best option in Europe as far you know (cost/benefit)? Or is there another better?
 
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My upper front teeth are worn down due to bruxism.

Would it be sufficient to place 4 or maybe 6 veneers onto them? Which veneers are the strongest ones to withstand potential bruxism?

I killed my bruxism with Botox. (At least for some time)
 
Does someone know a dentist with good cost/benefit in Europe?

I’d be willing to pay at maximum €800-1000 per tooth, no more than that
Poland
 
True, forgot about it. It's zirconia reinforced lithium disilicate, so good for molars only. Not a big miss. Looks bad compared to well done indirect composites, let alone hand made refractory veneers.
Is Bonding technique an alternative to Veneers ...?

 

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