Why MSE sucks, and turns you into a definitionless ape (better MSE theory)

[Deleted member 38639]

Drawbacks of segmental lefort?

Potentially unstable but I believe it can be avoided with proper use of splint and custom plate fixation

 

[mvp2v1]

With surgical assist to weaken the suture + a much more powerful expander. That makes even, parallel expansion possible.
This is the MSE expander:

This is the Power Expander:

It doesn't take a genius to see that the MSE device is cucked in comparison.
MSE expands in a cone shaped pattern because of lack of surgical assist + weak, cucked expander. Power Expander/DS Xpander + surgical assist = even, parallel expansion, no need for anything else.

I think you may find this thread insteresting, read from this post onwards:

12 tooth smile is an unmoggable trait. Swallow the smilepill.

Meanwhile the guy who your crush rubs herself to at night (I count 6) 8, and would look even better with a wider palate and less visible buccal corridors, like everyone else.

looksmax.org

Looking at these faces, it seems a lot more is going on then what RPEcels think. you can see how the face looks all melted, deformed. Its like this fluid thing, not just a simple narrowness, or recession. I highly doubt anything from the RPE school of thought will truly ascend someone. Also EASE, achieves great maxilla expansion, and often does it with no diastema (mostly posterior) Yet you look at their before and afters and you dont see people ascending... FME is just now out and being run in irl cases, so that will be interesting to see but i'm assuming it will be more of the same.

 

[idkwhattoputhere]

Because an evenly split expansion of the palate will give you an uncanny and unaesthetic maxilla. It expands the front of the palate too much which widens the pyriform aperture unnaturally and gives you a monkey nose. Let's look at the conebeams of some MSE patients, shall we?

View attachment 2169928
View attachment 2169929
View attachment 2169930
View attachment 2169934

These do not look like normal skulls, the pyriform aperture becomes like a gaped asshole!!!


A naturally wide palate is not as wide towards the front which is why I prepared this illustration:

View attachment 2169959
Ignore the position of the teeth and look at the actual bone. The MSE expands too much near the anterior nasal spine which is not how a naturally wide and well-developed palate is. This causes the aperture to widen and for the cheekbones to not get pushed forward much if at all. To get a naturally looking harmonious result you would need to expand more near the POSTERIOR NASAL SPINE than MSE. The problem is that you need something more like THIS:

View attachment 2169970

This modified MSE would also be superior because it would push the cheekbones FORWARD more rather than just widening them and would push the pyriform aperture OUTWARD but not widen it, leading to better paranasal support. You'd need 2 expanders placed, one at the front of the mouth, and one at the back, or an expander which flanged and rotated outward.

almost every mse b4 and after ive seen has the "natural" palate. i do agree with the expansion ratio at the back though, would be much more effective. doesn't EASE do something like this?

 

[SeriousAscension]

almost every mse b4 and after ive seen has the "natural" palate. i do agree with the expansion ratio at the back though, would be much more effective. doesn't EASE do something like this?

Yes in some cases EASE achieves more posterior expansion

 

[strawberrymushroom]

Because an evenly split expansion of the palate will give you an uncanny and unaesthetic maxilla. It expands the front of the palate too much which widens the pyriform aperture unnaturally and gives you a monkey nose. Let's look at the conebeams of some MSE patients, shall we?

View attachment 2169928
View attachment 2169929
View attachment 2169930
View attachment 2169934

These do not look like normal skulls, the pyriform aperture becomes like a gaped asshole!!!


A naturally wide palate is not as wide towards the front which is why I prepared this illustration:

View attachment 2169959
Ignore the position of the teeth and look at the actual bone. The MSE expands too much near the anterior nasal spine which is not how a naturally wide and well-developed palate is. This causes the aperture to widen and for the cheekbones to not get pushed forward much if at all. To get a naturally looking harmonious result you would need to expand more near the POSTERIOR NASAL SPINE than MSE. The problem is that you need something more like THIS:

View attachment 2169970

This modified MSE would also be superior because it would push the cheekbones FORWARD more rather than just widening them and would push the pyriform aperture OUTWARD but not widen it, leading to better paranasal support. You'd need 2 expanders placed, one at the front of the mouth, and one at the back, or an expander which flanged and rotated outward.

High iq thread

 

[Deleted member 66574]

Because an evenly split expansion of the palate will give you an uncanny and unaesthetic maxilla. It expands the front of the palate too much which widens the pyriform aperture unnaturally and gives you a monkey nose. Let's look at the conebeams of some MSE patients, shall we?

View attachment 2169928
View attachment 2169929
View attachment 2169930
View attachment 2169934

These do not look like normal skulls, the pyriform aperture becomes like a gaped asshole!!!


A naturally wide palate is not as wide towards the front which is why I prepared this illustration:

View attachment 2169959
Ignore the position of the teeth and look at the actual bone. The MSE expands too much near the anterior nasal spine which is not how a naturally wide and well-developed palate is. This causes the aperture to widen and for the cheekbones to not get pushed forward much if at all. To get a naturally looking harmonious result you would need to expand more near the POSTERIOR NASAL SPINE than MSE. The problem is that you need something more like THIS:

View attachment 2169970

This modified MSE would also be superior because it would push the cheekbones FORWARD more rather than just widening them and would push the pyriform aperture OUTWARD but not widen it, leading to better paranasal support. You'd need 2 expanders placed, one at the front of the mouth, and one at the back, or an expander which flanged and rotated outward.

just push ur palate with ur thumb to make it wider lol

 

[Deleted member 66574]

thumb pull then

 

[ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOP]

True. Only surgically assisted BAME (Bone Anchored Maxillary Expanders) can achieve even expansion and avoid nose widening.
For those who already have decent palate width but narrow arches, SFOT/PAAO are very convenient and can give up to 10mm of stable dental arch expansion, with impeccable results (even expansion too).

10mm of stable arch expansion.

Can you expand on this? Tried having SFOT with some mentally deficient periodontist that couldn't even answer this about their own procedure

When this is done - you pack bone on the arches - and you "expand" the teeth due to there being more buccal bone are you just torquing the teeth outwards or moving them *laterally* into the new bone burning through the prior buccal bone

This is an important distinction.

 

[hahalol123]

water thread, that's just the shape that the tongue makes from mewing at an early age

 

[monecel]

Thinking partial MSE (3.5-4.5mm) + angled expansion with something like the Nitanium Palate Expander2 could improve aesthetics for a small palate. I think if the front of the palate is lacking width, then some MSE expansion could be useful, but a seperate device could be used afterwards for back-dominant expansion.