How princeluenleoncur Got Cooked by Basic Logic

[kurd]

TL;DR of this entire exchange:

1. Dude claimed Eastern Orthodoxy is the only true form of Christianity and everyone else (including Catholics) are basically heretics or “innovators.”
2. Tried to "own" atheism by spamming the Transcendental Argument for God (TAG), saying logic, morality, and abstract truths can’t exist without the Christian God.
3. Said I was strawmanning, but then completely ignored what I actually said and went off on rants assuming stuff I never claimed.
4. Pulled out cherry-picked history and theology to “prove” Christianity > Rabbinic Judaism and that Isaiah 53 = Jesus, even though it’s just his interpretation.
5. Ended up calling me a “GAYtheist” like 5 times, claimed victory, and then rage quit while still replying like 4 more times
6. Whole convo boiled down to: “You can’t use logic unless you believe in my God,” which is just nonsense dressed up in philosophy lingo.

@PrinceLuenLeoncur

 

[kurd]

Cage

 

[highinhibcel]

Send link to the thread

 

[VV62]

His only arguments are muh christianity is right because i said so

 

[kurd]

Send link to the thread

If atheism is true why do elites worship satan

Why do they go to bohemian grove Its just a frat for old rich farts bud

looksmax.org

 

[highinhibcel]

If atheism is true why do elites worship satan

Why do they go to bohemian grove Its just a frat for old rich farts bud

looksmax.org

Okay I read all of it

You did pull a quite few of the “straw mans”

I’m also not a fan of the TAG argument because as you said there is a big leap in logic there, it’s literally almost the same as saying “muh nature is beautiful so god made it”

I’m not an expert of theology nor history, but my argument for god is just look at what Christianity does to people and to societies vs atheism

And there isn’t really a super solid argument for atheism either besides “muh bad things happen so god doesn’t exist”

That’s all I have to say lol

 

[Duke Archer]

I remember when princeluenlancour told me average black guy is 5’9 and average white guy is 5’10 according to stats

Then I said yeah average white guy is taller than average black guy

Then he got really mad and told me to follow the stats instead of being a retard

Interesting user

 

[widdi]

I remember when princeluenlacour told me average black guy is 5’9 and average white guy is 5’10 according to stats

Then I said yeah average white guy is taller than average black guy

Then he got really mad and told me to follow the stats instead of being a retard

Interesting user

The 2-repeat allele of the MAOA gene confers an increased risk for shooting and stabbing behaviors - PubMed

There has been a great deal of research examining the link between a polymorphism in the promoter region of the MAOA gene and antisocial phenotypes. The results of these studies have consistently revealed that low activity MAOA alleles are related to antisocial behaviors for males who were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

When you get into an argument with him you activate something primal

Deep inside his DNA

 

[flippasav]

Who

 

[Duke Archer]

When you get into an argument with him you activate something primal

Deep inside his DNA

He's the most high cortisol user I've ever seen

 

[chadhamed]

His only arguments are muh christianity is right because i said so

Fr islam is the real truth

 

[ascension]

View attachment 3956446
View attachment 3956447

Cage

This guy can't keep his job for more than a few months but has the time to write up all this nonsense about his God up there in the sky, sitting on the clouds doing random shit. Cage

 

[Hernan]

@PrinceLuenLeoncur take him down uncle dont give up.

 

[greycel]

The 2-repeat allele of the MAOA gene confers an increased risk for shooting and stabbing behaviors - PubMed

There has been a great deal of research examining the link between a polymorphism in the promoter region of the MAOA gene and antisocial phenotypes. The results of these studies have consistently revealed that low activity MAOA alleles are related to antisocial behaviors for males who were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

When you get into an argument with him you activate something primal

Deep inside his DNA

Race isn't why people break laws

Whatever genetic predisposition you might have towards not being able to contain your actions within the bounds society has set (laws), will be heavily overshadowed by how much your actions have been influenced by environment in past. Genetics only matter when you're in competition with others...

looksmax.org

 

[kurd]

Okay I read all of it

You did pull a quite few of the “straw mans”

I’m also not a fan of the TAG argument because as you said there is a big leap in logic there, it’s literally almost the same as saying “muh nature is beautiful so god made it”

I’m not an expert of theology nor history, but my argument for god is just look at what Christianity does to people and to societies vs atheism

And there isn’t really a super solid argument for atheism either besides “muh bad things happen so god doesn’t exist”

That’s all I have to say lol

Appreciate you actually reading it lol

Yeah, I get your point but let’s be real: saying “look what Christianity does to people” isn’t really an argument either. That’s vibes, not evidence. People in every religion and none have done both amazing and horrible things.

And I never said “bad things happen so no God that’s not my position at all. Atheism isn’t some reverse religion; it's just a lack of belief in gods until good reason is shown. That’s it.

The bar shouldn’t be “which system makes people behave better,” it should be “which one is true.” Otherwise we’re just picking worldviews like favorite football teams.

 

[widdi]

Race isn't why people break laws

Whatever genetic predisposition you might have towards not being able to contain your actions within the bounds society has set (laws), will be heavily overshadowed by how much your actions have been influenced by environment in past. Genetics only matter when you're in competition with others...

looksmax.org

I broadly agree with this. I would not be surprised if the crime rate of african americans is a lot higher than africans in africa because the legal order here is much more focus on rehabilitation. In africa if you chimped out there's a good chance you would be shot on the first infraction.

But obviously this poses a problem for anyone who is a fan of liberalism and liberal institutions (like I am). How can we have presumption of innocence, miranda rights, no legal discrimination based on protected characteristics, and a rehabilitation focused justice system when certain populations abuse this to the fullest? Why should white people give up liberalism to accomodate these populations? And if white people aren't giving up liberalism, should they just tolerate what happens in Rotherham, Cologne, or Detroit?

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

TL;DR of this entire exchange:

1. Dude claimed Eastern Orthodoxy is the only true form of Christianity and everyone else (including Catholics) are basically heretics or “innovators.”
2. Tried to "own" atheism by spamming the Transcendental Argument for God (TAG), saying logic, morality, and abstract truths can’t exist without the Christian God.
3. Said I was strawmanning, but then completely ignored what I actually said and went off on rants assuming stuff I never claimed.
4. Pulled out cherry-picked history and theology to “prove” Christianity > Rabbinic Judaism and that Isaiah 53 = Jesus, even though it’s just his interpretation.
5. Ended up calling me a “GAYtheist” like 5 times, claimed victory, and then rage quit while still replying like 4 more times
6. Whole convo boiled down to: “You can’t use logic unless you believe in my God,” which is just nonsense dressed up in philosophy lingo.

@PrinceLuenLeoncur

View attachment 3956436

Dude still hasn’t given me an account for “logic” before making such a thread provide an account or forever hold your peace. An atheist using Logic is like a child waiting for Christmas presents to come from a chimney then saying Santa isn’t real.

What is its state, why does it exist, how does it exist, how does an invariant universal unchanging immaterial abstract thing exist in a supposed materialistic world.


Do this before running your fucking mouth

@Kayra139 @Xangsane is SHIT @isis_Bleach @ascension @VV62 @Hernan @highinhibcel you can all go to the thread and watch this coward idiot get fucking mopped like a bitch and humiliated into literal SILENCE he has been up all day crying like a girl from the brutal philosophical, historical and religious spanking I gave him. IF ANY OF YOU VALUE TRUTH INSTEAD OF TAKING THIS KURDISH GAYTHEIST WORD GO CHECK IT OUT AND YOULL SEE WHG HES CRASHING OUT he’s so low IQ he’s literally not worth my time and was bodied on that thread for the whole forum to see now he’s doing damage control

If atheism is true why do elites worship satan

Why do they go to bohemian grove Its just a frat for old rich farts bud

looksmax.org

Here’s the actual thread go read it and he runs away from me and then has the nerve to make this thread

 

[highinhibcel]

Appreciate you actually reading it lol

no problem

Yeah, I get your point but let’s be real: saying “look what Christianity does to people” isn’t really an argument either. That’s vibes, not evidence. People in every religion and none have done both amazing and horrible things.

Yeah each one has it's pros and cons obviously, but the effects of christianity are overwhelmingly positive, and the effects of atheism are overwhelmingly negative. If you look at a lot of European countries that have implemented atheism as their main "belief system" or whatever you would call it, they all end up turning to shit with all the degeneracy and stealing and whatever else they do, and those who truly follow the teaching of christianity usually don't do horrible things.

And I never said “bad things happen so no God that’s not my position at all. Atheism isn’t some reverse religion; it's just a lack of belief in gods until good reason is shown. That’s it.

I was just using the "bad things happen so there's no god" as a common atheist argument.

The bar shouldn’t be “which system makes people behave better,” it should be “which one is true.” Otherwise we’re just picking worldviews like favorite football teams.

If a worldview consistently leads to harm, irrationality, or widespread dysfunction when people genuinely live by it, that might be a sign it's missing something fundamental about reality. In other words, how a belief works in practice can reveal whether it’s aligned with how the world really is.

For example, imagine a moral system that claims humans are purely selfish and should act only in their own interest. If, when applied, this leads to widespread breakdown of trust, cooperation, and well-being, that result could suggest the system is based on a false or incomplete understanding of human nature and ethics.

So yes, truth is the goal — but consequences and practical outcomes are often part of how we measure whether a belief reflects truth in a lived, human context. (I had chatgpt write the last one, but I changed different parts of it.)

You can make an argument back, but that's just my perspective on it lol, like I said I don't research history or theology or anything like that so i'm sure there are some logical fallacies here or something

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

I remember when princeluenlancour told me average black guy is 5’9 and average white guy is 5’10 according to stats

Then I said yeah average white guy is taller than average black guy

Then he got really mad and told me to follow the stats instead of being a retard

Interesting user

Not at all what happened you said avg white guy js MUCH taller than avg black guy


How is one inch difference “much taller” wow a lot of haters being put in my ignore here today

 

[VV62]

What is its state, why does it exist, how does it exist, how does an invariant universal unchanging immaterial abstract thing exist in a supposed materialistic world.

Christianity is not the only answer to that abstract thing bud

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

The 2-repeat allele of the MAOA gene confers an increased risk for shooting and stabbing behaviors - PubMed

There has been a great deal of research examining the link between a polymorphism in the promoter region of the MAOA gene and antisocial phenotypes. The results of these studies have consistently revealed that low activity MAOA alleles are related to antisocial behaviors for males who were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

When you get into an argument with him you activate something primal

Deep inside his DNA

No I just don’t like retards.

What @Duke Archer the faggot lying son of a birch neglected to tell you gullible idiots is that he said “WHITES ARE A LOT TALLER THAN BLACKS” now group of hating retards is 1 inch difference a MASSIVE difference srs IS IT ?


@JasGews69x @kurd @highinhibcel @greycel @widdi @Xangsane is SHIT


All of you idiots who make these threads and posts on me get exposed for the idiots you are especially OP who it took an whole entire day of crying like a bitch to make this thread instead of carrying on the debate on the other thread because he lost like a bitch. He is a coward a pussy

 

[widdi]

Dude still hasn’t given me an account for “logic” before making such a thread provide an account or forever hold your peace. An atheist using Logic is like a child waiting for Christmas presents to come from a chimney then saying Santa isn’t real.

What is its state, why does it exist, how does it exist, how does an invariant universal unchanging immaterial abstract thing exist in a supposed materialistic world.


Do this before running your fucking mouth

@Kayra139 @Xangsane is SHIT @isis_Bleach @ascension @VV62 @Hernan @highinhibcel you can all go to the thread and watch this coward idiot get fucking mopped like a bitch and humiliated into literal SILENCE he has been up all day crying like a girl from the brutal philosophical, historical and religious spanking I gave him. IF ANY OF YOU VALUE TRUTH INSTEAD OF TAKING THIS KURDISH GAYTHEIST WORD GO CHECK IT OUT AND YOULL SEE WHG HES CRASHING OUT he’s so low IQ he’s literally not worth my time and was bodied on that thread for the whole forum to see now he’s doing damage control

If atheism is true why do elites worship satan

Why do they go to bohemian grove Its just a frat for old rich farts bud

looksmax.org

Here’s the actual thread go read it and he runs away from me and then has the nerve to make this thread

TAG is begging the question

If god is omnipotent, can he create a stone he can't lift?

You may say that we cannot comprehend god's actions through human logic to get past this

But then you can't use logic and reason god's existence through first principles then

God simultaneously has to be omnipotent enough to break the law of non contradiction

but somehow the law of non contradiction always being true proves god

JFL its incoherent

 

[widdi]

No I just don’t like retards.

What @Duke Archer the faggot lying son of a birch neglected to tell you gullible idiots is that he said “WHITES ARE A LOT TALLER THAN BLACKS” now group of hating retards is 1 inch difference a MASSIVE difference srs IS IT ?


@JasGews69x @kurd @highinhibcel @greycel @widdi @Xangsane is SHIT


All of you idiots who make these threads and posts on me get exposed for the idiots you are especially OP who it took an whole entire day of crying like a bitch to make this thread instead of carrying on the debate on the other thread because he lost like a bitch. He is a coward a pussy

I honestly don't remember the argument. I just know you constantly chimp out mass tagging people and typing in all caps

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Christianity is not the only answer to that abstract thing bud

In philosophy this is called the issue of identity thesis aka multiple data sets can answer the same question

But the argument I’m making is they YOUR GAYTHEISTIC worldview cannot answer for abstract truths and things. I’m not arguing against every worldview rn. I can and I have but I’m specificing it to OPs ludicrous idiocy of utilising other answers from other paradigms. Other worldview give an account for some things but none can give an coherent consistent account of the entire trancendentals without falling into absurdities that the point I made

Atheism has an illogical belief in such things and cannot give an account (justified true belief) in the “logic” they claim exists it’s literally ILLOGICAL.

Your low IQ though so your going on my ignore I forgot to place you there last time you still haven’t accounted for what “conciousness” is

Just like OP answer the question I gave you or forever hold your peace in my ignore

 

[Node]

Okay GAYTHEIST

 

[VV62]

you still haven’t accounted for what “conciousness” is

Conciousness is the core of existence and i believe that all beings are interconnected through conciousness

 

[greycel]

instead of carrying on the debate on the other thread because he lost like a bitch. He is a coward a pussy

Isn't this what you did to me?

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

TAG is begging the question

If god is omnipotent, can he create a stone he can't lift?

You may say that we cannot comprehend god's actions through human logic to get past this

But then you can't use logic and reason god's existence through first principles then

God simultaneously has to be omnipotent enough to break the law of non contradiction

but somehow the law of non contradiction always being true proves god

JFL its incoherent

Not at all what TAG is once again your a idiot who can’t fucking go to the original thread and see your hero (OP the faggot Kurd) getting washed on this I explain it all there @highinhibcel

TAG (Transcendental Argument for God) is not saying “God exists, therefore God exists.” It’s saying, In order for you to reason, argue, use logic, or talk about truth at all God must exist as the necessary precondition of intelligibility.

That’s not vicious circularity it’s a transcendental necessity. You’re trying to use logic, truth, and objectivity while denying the preconditions that make those concepts coherent. That’s epistemic parasitism.

A circular argument is framing the premise as the conclusion. I’m not doing that, TAG isn’t the conclusion ITS A PRECONDITION

I’m not gonna answer the rock question you can google search that yourslef it’s not worth my time

Again strawman. We’re not saying “God transcends logic” in the sense that He’s illogical or irrational.

We’re saying logic is grounded in the mind of God — and logic reflects His nature as rational, coherent, unchanging. You can’t say, “You can’t use logic to prove God,” while literally using logic to argue that God doesn’t exist. You’re sawing off the epistemic branch you’re sitting on.

If logic is not grounded in a personal, eternal mind, then:

• It has no ontological status (i.e., it’s just a social convention),
• You can’t say it’s always true (because you deny universals), and
• You can’t say contradictions are necessarily false.

Which means You can’t even argue without assuming the Christian framework you’re trying to critique.


And your silly attempt to have a gotcha “god breaks law of non contradiction” No this is entirely backwards. Christianity doesn’t say God breaks the law of non-contradiction. It says the law of non-contradiction exists because God is who He is pure being, not arbitrary chaos. You think God “transcending” logic makes Him incoherent — but He’s the ground of coherence itself.

You are literally using tools from the Christian metaphysical toolbox while denying the Builder exists. That’s not intellectual honesty that’s borrowing capital from the very worldview you’re trying to critique.

And this was my point to that idiot @VV62 until you ground logic, truth, and being in the Triune God, you’re just hurling bricks from inside a house you insist was never built.

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Isn't this what you did to me?

I never ran from you. Or anybody

I make the determination that the indivisible I’m dealing with is mentally inept and thus I close down the debate but you’ll realise I only do this once your unable to answer a question and start crashing out.

As Einstein said “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I am not yet completely sure about the universe” why waste my time with morons who are too low IQ to know the difference between a meta level argument and a circular argument why would I fucking waste my time with such an moron

 

[widdi]

Not at all what TAG is once again your a idiot who can’t fucking go to the original thread and see your hero (OP the faggot Kurd) getting washed on this I explain it all there @highinhibcel

TAG (Transcendental Argument for God) is not saying “God exists, therefore God exists.” It’s saying, In order for you to reason, argue, use logic, or talk about truth at all God must exist as the necessary precondition of intelligibility.

That’s not vicious circularity it’s a transcendental necessity. You’re trying to use logic, truth, and objectivity while denying the preconditions that make those concepts coherent. That’s epistemic parasitism.

A circular argument is framing the premise as the conclusion. I’m not doing that, TAG isn’t the conclusion ITS A PRECONDITION

I’m not gonna answer the rock question you can google search that yourslef it’s not worth my time

Again strawman. We’re not saying “God transcends logic” in the sense that He’s illogical or irrational.

We’re saying logic is grounded in the mind of God — and logic reflects His nature as rational, coherent, unchanging. You can’t say, “You can’t use logic to prove God,” while literally using logic to argue that God doesn’t exist. You’re sawing off the epistemic branch you’re sitting on.

If logic is not grounded in a personal, eternal mind, then:

• It has no ontological status (i.e., it’s just a social convention),
• You can’t say it’s always true (because you deny universals), and
• You can’t say contradictions are necessarily false.

Which means You can’t even argue without assuming the Christian framework you’re trying to critique.


And your silly attempt to have a gotcha “god breaks law of non contradiction” No this is entirely backwards. Christianity doesn’t say God breaks the law of non-contradiction. It says the law of non-contradiction exists because God is who He is pure being, not arbitrary chaos. You think God “transcending” logic makes Him incoherent — but He’s the ground of coherence itself.

You are literally using tools from the Christian metaphysical toolbox while denying the Builder exists. That’s not intellectual honesty that’s borrowing capital from the very worldview you’re trying to critique.

And this was my point to that idiot @VV62 until you ground logic, truth, and being in the Triune God, you’re just hurling bricks from inside a house you insist was never built.

I frankly am agnostic to whether god exists or not

But I don't think TAG is valid unless you think god is not omnipotent

For the simple reason that if god is the one guarantor of coherence for logical truths, he should be able to act outside the bounds of those logical truths

Otherwise, he is beholden to logic, not the other way around.

 

[kurd]

Dude still hasn’t given me an account for “logic” before making such a thread provide an account or forever hold your peace. An atheist using Logic is like a child waiting for Christmas presents to come from a chimney then saying Santa isn’t real.

What is its state, why does it exist, how does it exist, how does an invariant universal unchanging immaterial abstract thing exist in a supposed materialistic world.


Do this before running your fucking mouth

@Kayra139 @Xangsane is SHIT @isis_Bleach @ascension @VV62 @Hernan @highinhibcel you can all go to the thread and watch this coward idiot get fucking mopped like a bitch and humiliated into literal SILENCE he has been up all day crying like a girl from the brutal philosophical, historical and religious spanking I gave him. IF ANY OF YOU VALUE TRUTH INSTEAD OF TAKING THIS KURDISH GAYTHEIST WORD GO CHECK IT OUT AND YOULL SEE WHG HES CRASHING OUT he’s so low IQ he’s literally not worth my time and was bodied on that thread for the whole forum to see now he’s doing damage control

If atheism is true why do elites worship satan

Why do they go to bohemian grove Its just a frat for old rich farts bud

looksmax.org

Here’s the actual thread go read it and he runs away from me and then has the nerve to make this thread

Bro, logic isn't some floating entity it's a descriptive framework for how things relate, not a magical object. You're treating it like it's a Platonic being that needs a divine landlord.

It “exists” the same way math does as a tool we use to describe consistent patterns in reality. No divine middleman required. Materialism doesn’t need to “explain” logic like it’s a ghost it just needs to use it consistently, which we do.

You keep asking “how can logic exist without God”

but never show why it must come from one. You're begging the question with flair. LMAO

 

[kurd]

I frankly am agnostic to whether god exists or not

But I don't think TAG is valid unless you think god is not omnipotent

For the simple reason that if god is the one guarantor of coherence for logical truths, he should be able to act outside the bounds of those logical truths

Otherwise, he is beholden to logic, not the other way around.

TAG is the most RETARDED ABSURD argument used for proving God exists.

 

[VV62]

And this was my point to that idiot @

@VV62 until you ground logic, truth, and being in the Triune God, you’re just hurling bricks from inside a house you insist was never built.

You're presupposing God to prove God and calling it not circular just because you frame it differently
Logic doesn’t depend on a divine mind. It’s not a thing that needs grounding it’s a system of consistency. The law of non contradiction isn’t true because God enforces it it’s true because
contradictory things can’t exist in the same way at the same time, which we verify by observation and reason, not divine revelation
And logic is not exclusive to christianity so how are we borrowing from your worldview

 

[kurd]

You're presupposing God to prove God and calling it not circular just because you frame it differently
Logic doesn’t depend on a divine mind. It’s not a thing that needs grounding it’s a system of consistency. The law of non contradiction isn’t true because God enforces it it’s true because
contradictory things can’t exist in the same way at the same time, which we verify by observation and reason, not divine revelation
And logic is not exclusive to christianity so how are we borrowing from your worldview

Exactly this. You fucking nailed it.

Dude keeps acting like logic is some divine software you need a God subscription to run when it’s literally just how we describe consistent relationships in reality. You don’t need a “cosmic mind” to know a square can’t be a circle.

It’s not deep it’s desperate.

 

[LegendaryKennen]

this guy is a known retard dw

 

[Proex]

Dude claimed Eastern Orthodoxy is the only true form of Christianity and everyone else (including Catholics) are basically heretics or “innovators.”

some byzantine empire stuff

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Conciousness is the core of existence and i believe that all beings are interconnected through conciousness

At least you tried but you fell for the bait

This is a metaphysical assertion with no explanatory power unless you define what consciousness is and what existence means.

What is consciousness? Is it personal? Impersonal? Emergent? Eternal?

If it’s the “core” of being, then how do you explain non-conscious things — like rocks, numbers, or gravity?

Is consciousness being itself, or something that has being?

All beings being interconnected through consciousness… This is vague pantheistic or mysticism, not philosophy.
What does “interconnected” mean? Shared nature? Shared awareness? Causal link?

How do you know we are interconnected through consciousness?

Are murderers and their victims “connected” through this mystical awareness too?


Now I forgot your view of your even a GAYtheist I genuinely dont know but I have felt with spiritualists before. If consciousness is ultimate, then: Is your consciousness divine? Is Hitler’s? Is a mosquito’s? Is a corpse’s unconscious body still “connected”? Who or what determines the moral or ontological value of different levels of consciousness?

If everything is consciousness, then nothing is distinct, and all value judgments (good/evil, right/wrong) become subjective projections, not objective truths. So if you believe everything is One, then murder and love are both expressions of the same divine consciousness which is absurd and morally bankrupt.

But seeing as your trying I give you a detailed response as your acting like a good little girl

“Consciousness is the core of existence” is just a modern echo of Eastern monism and New Age mysticism but when pushed logically, it collapses into impersonal nihilism or moral relativism. Remember by point about Christianity being the only consistent coherent account of reality? Well this is why your worldview is false.

It provides:

• No basis for personhood
• No standard for truth or falsehood
• No grounding for love, evil, justice, or purpose

Meanwhile, Christian theism offers a clear metaphysical foundation:

Being grounded in God
Logic grounded in the Logos
Persons grounded in the Trinity
Morality grounded in divine nature

 

[kurd]

At least you tried but you fell for the bait

This is a metaphysical assertion with no explanatory power unless you define what consciousness is and what existence means.

What is consciousness? Is it personal? Impersonal? Emergent? Eternal?

If it’s the “core” of being, then how do you explain non-conscious things — like rocks, numbers, or gravity?

Is consciousness being itself, or something that has being?

All beings being interconnected through consciousness… This is vague pantheistic or mysticism, not philosophy.
What does “interconnected” mean? Shared nature? Shared awareness? Causal link?

How do you know we are interconnected through consciousness?

Are murderers and their victims “connected” through this mystical awareness too?


Now I forgot your view of your even a GAYtheist I genuinely dont know but I have felt with spiritualists before. If consciousness is ultimate, then: Is your consciousness divine? Is Hitler’s? Is a mosquito’s? Is a corpse’s unconscious body still “connected”? Who or what determines the moral or ontological value of different levels of consciousness?

If everything is consciousness, then nothing is distinct, and all value judgments (good/evil, right/wrong) become subjective projections, not objective truths. So if you believe everything is One, then murder and love are both expressions of the same divine consciousness which is absurd and morally bankrupt.

But seeing as your trying I give you a detailed response as your acting like a good little girl

“Consciousness is the core of existence” is just a modern echo of Eastern monism and New Age mysticism but when pushed logically, it collapses into impersonal nihilism or moral relativism. Remember by point about Christianity being the only consistent coherent account of reality? Well this is why your worldview is false.

It provides:

• No basis for personhood
• No standard for truth or falsehood
• No grounding for love, evil, justice, or purpose

Meanwhile, Christian theism offers a clear metaphysical foundation:

Being grounded in God
Logic grounded in the Logos
Persons grounded in the Trinity
Morality grounded in divine nature

@VV62 view might be vague, sure but at least it’s not pretending to be objective while begging the question from the start.

You keep acting like Christianity is the only metaphysically coherent system just because you say so, but all you’re doing is presupposing your entire framework, declaring it the foundation of reality, and then acting shocked when others don’t accept it. That’s not argument that’s theological cosplay.

Also: saying "everything reduces to God" isn't any less mystical than saying "everything is consciousness." You're just swapping robes.

 

[gemerald]

should they just tolerate what happens in Rotherham, Cologne, or Detroit?

Goodness it's the first time I see someone other than myself mention the mass foid caressing of Cologne and the paki elementary school summer camp of Rotherham in the same sentence. Never would I have thought of witnessing this
Those are usually what I mention in my (vain) attempts at convincing normies that poorly regulated mass immigration has inflicted unfathomable damage upon Europe and isn't just le based multiculturalism.

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Exactly this. You fucking nailed it.

Dude keeps acting like logic is some divine software you need a God subscription to run when it’s literally just how we describe consistent relationships in reality. You don’t need a “cosmic mind” to know a square can’t be a circle.

It’s not deep it’s desperate.

So you once again demonstrated that you don’t know the difference between circularity and “meta level arguments. The same way your dumbass doesn’t realise at its core every argument is ultimately recursive

Why do you even try debating me your not ready for this your a child playing in an adults arena. Go read philosophy books before you humiliate yourself further more than you already have


I mean your comment is literally identical to saying “Gravity just works bro no need to think about jt “

You’re pretending logic is just a convenient “description” of the world, like a physics cheat sheet but that’s a dodge, not an explanation. You have yet to give me one faggot.

1. Logic is just how we describe consistent relationships in reality.”

Wrong. That’s descriptivism, and it assumes what it needs to explain.

Ask yourself:
Why is reality “consistent” in the first place?
Why does every possible world you can imagine still obey the law of identity, non-contradiction, and excluded middle?

If logic were just a tool or just a description, then we’d expect it to change in different contexts. But logic is:

• Invariant (doesn’t change)
• Abstract (not material)
• Universal (applies everywhere)

So logic is not a thing in nature. It’s not something you find under a microscope. It’s ontologically real, yet immaterial — which your worldview can’t account for. You’re freeloading on Platonism without the metaphysical credentials.

And yes I agree logic isn’t run like software that’s the point I was making .




3. “You don’t need a cosmic mind to know a square can’t be a circle.”

You don’t know that because you saw it in the world. You know it because you assume the law of non-contradiction is universally and necessarily true. But in your naturalistic/materialist view

What is a “law” of logic?
Where does it “exist”?
How do immaterial, abstract, necessary truths arise from physical stuff?

If all you have is matter in motion, then “laws of logic” are just human mental patterns — and those change. So why can’t 2+2=5 in some other society? Why can’t contradiction be true somewhere else in the universe?

You’ve got no grounding for the necessity, universality, and immutability of logical laws but you use them anyway.

 

[widdi]

TAG is the most RETARDED ABSURD argument used for proving God exists.

especially the christian god.

If you narrowly define god as some entity that is a constant force that makes logical presuppositions true while not being able to infringe upon them, I guess it makes sense. But I would just define that as some sort of natural law of the universe tbh. I guess then it just boils down to an autistic semantics debate.

But the christian god has properties that go beyond this, and he isn't limited by the natural laws of the universe (at least that is my reading of the bible). If god can create the universe and its laws, why can he not break them? If he can break them, where is the evidence? If there is evidence, then the salience of those laws can't be used to prove his existence. Because then those laws are not always salient. Intuiting Christianity's truthfulness from 2 + 2 = 4 is quite comical tbh.

 

[gemerald]

You’re trying to use logic, truth, and objectivity while denying the preconditions that make those concepts coherent. That’s epistemic parasitism.

 

[widdi]

Goodness it's the first time I see someone other than myself mention the mass foid caressing of Cologne and the paki elementary school summer camp of Rotherham in the same sentence. Never would I have thought of witnessing this
Those are usually what I mention in my (vain) attempts at convincing normies that poorly regulated mass immigration has inflicted unfathomable damage upon Europe and isn't just le based multiculturalism.

Are you being sarcastic because people talk about this all the time lol

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

View attachment 3956944

Glad you are one of the non room temp IQ users here

I’m surrounded by morons. I won’t explain beyond this point some people are so intellectually stunted they cannot be helped they. You have witnessed none can provide an account for anything they belive in and yet they rage because they know they are intellectually beat

 

[gemerald]

Are you being sarcastic because people talk about this all the time lol

No, I'm serious. I never happen to see anyone mention Cologne in particular.

 

[VV62]

What is consciousness? Is it personal? Impersonal? Emergent? Eternal?

Consciousness doesn’t need to be fully defined in rigid terms to be acknowledged as the reality we experience directly It’s the subjective awarness behind all experience

If it’s the “core” of being, then how do you explain non-conscious things — like rocks, numbers, or gravity?

Without consciousness rocks or numbers have no meaning or existence in any experiential sense

How do you know we are interconnected through consciousness?

Im not claiming i know for sure this is what i believe in based on my experience with psychedelics and meditation

Are murderers and their victims “connected” through this mystical awareness too?

Yes even they are part of this interconnected awareness but that doesn’t erase moral distinctions rather morality arises as a pattern within consciousness aimed at harmony versus disharmony

Is your consciousness divine? Is Hitler’s? Is a mosquito’s? Is a corpse’s unconscious body still “connected”? Who or what determines the moral or ontological value of different levels of consciousness?

Divine here means fundamental not good or bad all individual consciousnesses are expressions of this universal awareness but how that awareness manifests differs widely moral value isn’t assigned by consciousness itself but emerges from how people align with the flow of life and compassion

everything is consciousness, then nothing is distinct, and all value judgments (good/evil, right/wrong) become subjective projections, not objective truths. So if you believe everything is One, then murder and love are both expressions of the same divine consciousness which is absurd and morally bankrupt.

Unity doesnt mean everything is good or bad

 

[gemerald]

Glad you are one of the non room temp IQ users here

I’m surrounded by morons. I won’t explain beyond this point some people are so intellectually stunted they cannot be helped they. You have witnessed none can provide an account for anything they belive in and yet they rage because they know they are intellectually beat

Also @kurd claimed you rage quit but you're very much participating jfl

 

[Marsiere214]

He’s a strange Christian ngl. His entire personality on the forum has been him circle jerking with bbc posters and porn addicts.

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

especially the christian god.

If you narrowly define god as some entity that is a constant force that makes logical presuppositions true while not being able to infringe upon them, I guess it makes sense. But I would just define that as some sort of natural law of the universe tbh. I guess then it just boils down to an autistic semantics debate.

But the christian god has properties that go beyond this, and he isn't limited by the natural laws of the universe (at least that is my reading of the bible). If god can create the universe and its laws, why can he not break them? If he can break them, where is the evidence? If there is evidence, then the salience of those laws can't be used to prove his existence. Because then those laws are not always salient. Intuiting Christianity's truthfulness from 2 + 2 = 4 is quite comical tbh.

Because the laws are made as a reflection of his divine mind. It’s not rocket science. God isn’t bound by them but it’s autinomy In philosophy that 2 conclusions can be true but also contradict one another.

Essentially god can “break” the rules of logic in our created sense because we are bound by different metaphysical rules so he can do things that would SEEM like he’s braking them but really he isn’t it’s just his position affords him the ability to do more.

Your arguments beyond this point are quite bad I’m done with you . You know nothing of the “Christian god” literally jack shit. You can’t account for these things and why 2+2 is always 4 you’ll never be able to say metaphysically why this is the case (I explained it In prev comments I won’t repeat it here) until then know all your beliefs are ILLOGICAL

 

[PrinceLuenLeoncur]

Also @kurd claimed you rage quit but you're very much participating jfl

He was the idiot who ran from the discussion on the other thread . He spent all day crying over the spanking I gave him so he made this thread