Possible cure for hair loss - why hormones do not matter

Bewusst

Bewusst

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I mentioned it already but I decided to make a thread about this. I hope you guys appreciate what I‘m about to share with you. I‘m tired of garbage threads.

Hair loss, androgenetic alopecia or male pattern baldness, is not caused by DHT. DHT triggers it but only under a certain circumstance. This circumstance being the loss of androgen receptor gene methylation in hair follicles (study).

What is AR gene methylation?
-> DNA methylation is a biological process of adding a methyl group to DNA.
In this case, adding a methyl group to the CpG island in the promoter region of the androgen receptor gene in hair follicles will reduce its expression. Think of it as an on/off switch and methylation turns gene expression off.

A common characteristic of MPB (male pattern baldness) is that it affects the top of the head (vertex) much more than the back of the head (occiput). This is because vertex hair follicles have much lower levels of methylation than occipital hair follicles and thus are a lot more sensitive to DHT. Occipital hair follicles have twice the amount of methylation, on average. Hence, the occiput is not affected as much from MPB.

If hormones really were to blame (they are not), you‘d see androgenetic alopecia begin in puberty and improve with the decline of men‘s T levels as they age and gain weight. But this isn‘t the case. It usually begins in one‘s mid- to late twenties or later in life and does not resolve on its own.
The real cause of AGA is a gradual decline in DNA methylation, which is also heavily involved in aging and the onset of diseases and cancer in general. So, instead of removing the signal (DHT) from the overactive androgen receptors, we should normalize their expression. If it works in puberty - lots of androgens but healthy levels of methylation = no hair loss - it‘ll work at any age. DHT does not matter. You need it for well-being. No more jewtasteride.

The solution?
-> Increase overall methylation in your body. The methylation cycle requires vitamin B2 (riboflavin), B6 (pyridoxine), B9 (folate) and B12 (cobalamin), methionine and choline. Deficiencies in dietary methyl donors can result in global hypomethylation and accelerate hair loss or the onset thereof.
Make sure to get plenty of all of the above every single day. If you already suffer from hair loss, take supplements. For B6, get pyridoxal-5-phosphate, for B9 L-5-methyltetrahydrofolate and for B12 methylcobalamin.
Make sure to eat enough protein as a source for methionine and to consume enough choline and minerals. Good mineral and trace element sources are unprocessed sugar cane syrup, fruits such as bananas and dates, leafy greens and whole grains.
You can add trimethylglycine (betaine) and S-Adenosylmethionine (SAMe) for a 100% guaranteed increase in methylation. Just make sure not to overdo the SAM, since hypermethylation isn’t your goal either.

Other things apart from methylation support you should be taking are vitamin C (read my guide) and D with its cofactors (A, K2, magnesium).


Tl;dr: If you want to keep your hair, increase methylation.
How? Take:

• riboflavin
• vitamin B6 as P-5-P
• vitamin B9 as L-5-MTHF
• vitamin B12 as methylcobalamin
• vitamin C
• vitamin A, D, K2 + magnesium
(• SAMe)
(• TMG (betaine))
• diet rich in (trace) minerals and with plenty of protein and choline.
 
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@Lifeisgood72
 
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Do you have MBP? Have you tried this "stack"?
 
Do you have MBP? Have you tried this "stack"?
I have hair loss. I haven’t bothered enough yet to follow my own advice 100% since it isn’t that bad but I’ve started taking only B2+6+9 and instead of losing several handfuls of hair when I shower, I now only lose about one. It has definitely improved already.
 
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I mentioned it already but I decided to make a thread about this. I hope you guys appreciate what I‘m about to share with you. I‘m tired of garbage threads.

Hair loss, androgenetic alopecia or male pattern baldness, is not caused by DHT. DHT triggers it but only under a certain circumstance. This circumstance being the loss of androgen receptor gene methylation in hair follicles (study).

What is AR gene methylation?
-> DNA methylation is a biological process of adding a methyl group to DNA.
In this case, adding a methyl group to the CpG island in the promoter region of the androgen receptor gene in hair follicles will reduce its expression. Think of it as an on/off switch and methylation turns gene expression off.

A common characteristic of MPB (male pattern baldness) is that it affects the top of the head (vertex) much more than the back of the head (occiput). This is because vertex hair follicles have much lower levels of methylation than occipital hair follicles and thus are a lot more sensitive to DHT. Occipital hair follicles have twice the amount of methylation, on average. Hence, the occiput is not affected as much from MPB.

If hormones really were to blame (they are not), you‘d see androgenetic alopecia begin in puberty and improve with the decline of men‘s T levels as they age and gain weight. But this isn‘t the case. It usually begins in one‘s mid- to late twenties or later in life and does not resolve on its own.
The real cause of AGA is a gradual decline in DNA methylation, which is also heavily involved in aging and the onset of diseases and cancer in general. So, instead of removing the signal (DHT) from the overactive androgen receptors, we should normalize their expression. If it works in puberty - lots of androgens but healthy levels of methylation = no hair loss - it‘ll work at any age. DHT does not matter. You need it for well-being. No more jewtasteride.

The solution?
-> Increase overall methylation in your body. The methylation cycle requires vitamin B2 (riboflavin), B6 (pyridoxine), B9 (folate) and B12 (cobalamin), methionine and choline. Deficiencies in dietary methyl donors can result in global hypomethylation and accelerate hair loss or the onset thereof.
Make sure to get plenty of all of the above every single day. If you already suffer from hair loss, take supplements. For B6, get pyridoxal-5-phosphate, for B9 L-5-methyltetrahydrofolate and for B12 methylcobalamin.
Make sure to eat enough protein as a source for methionine and to consume enough choline and minerals. Good mineral and trace element sources are unprocessed sugar cane syrup, fruits such as bananas and dates, leafy greens and whole grains.
You can add trimethylglycine (betaine) and S-Adenosylmethionine (SAMe) for a 100% guaranteed increase in methylation. Just make sure not to overdo the SAM, since hypermethylation isn’t your goal either.

Other things apart from methylation support you should be taking are vitamin C (read my guide) and D with its cofactors (A, K2, magnesium).


Tl;dr: If you want to keep your hair, increase methylation.
How? Take:

• riboflavin
• vitamin B6 as P-5-P
• vitamin B9 as L-5-MTHF
• vitamin B12 as methylcobalamin
• vitamin C
• vitamin A, D, K2 + magnesium
(• SAMe)
(• TMG (betaine))
• diet rich in (trace) minerals and with plenty of protein and choline.
fuckin great thread bro.


Now i can keep pumping proviron and not feel guilty about it
 
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Very interesting thread. Thanks.
 
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fuckin great thread bro.


Now i can keep pumping proviron and not feel guilty about it
Well, just because physiological levels of DHT won’t cause hair loss if you have high AR gene methylation in hair follicles, this doesn’t necessarily mean that supraphysiological amounts of exogenous DHT derivatives wouldn’t. No free ride here, sorry
 
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Well, just because physiological levels of DHT won’t cause hair loss if you have high AR gene methylation in hair follicles, this doesn’t necessarily mean that supraphysiological amounts of exogenous DHT derivatives wouldn’t. No free ride here, sorry
one thing though: If DHT is not involved in the balding process, how do you explain the efficacy of fin for example?
 
one thing though: If DHT is not involved in the balding process, how do you explain the efficacy of fin for example?
5-AR inhibitors simply remove the signal (DHT) from the androgen receptor, by reducing DHT synthesis. It’s just symptomatic therapy. Of course it works. The root issue however is not excessive DHT levels but insufficient methylation of the androgen receptor gene. Symptomatic treatment of this kind of hypomethylation requires creating low (unhealthy) levels of DHT, to make up for the increased expression of the receptor. My approach targets the root cause and normalizes receptor function, while leaving DHT levels alone.
 
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My approach targets the root cause and normalizes receptor function, while leaving DHT levels alone.
Has this worked for you, or anyone you know?
 
Cope
 
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Very high iq post. I am a long time member of hlt (more than 10 years of research in forums). I keep all my hair thanks to dermarrolling and iodine. I did the hair gains approach which includes this protocol and my hair improved a lot. This is legit.
 
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DNA Methylation, the forerunner of all looksmaxxing endeavors.
 
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good thread
but wouldn't taking all these be overkill?

• riboflavin
• vitamin B6 as P-5-P
• vitamin B9 as L-5-MTHF
• vitamin B12 as methylcobalamin
• vitamin C
• vitamin A, D, K2 + magnesium
(• SAMe)
(• TMG (betaine))
 
good thread
but wouldn't taking all these be overkill?

• riboflavin
• vitamin B6 as P-5-P
• vitamin B9 as L-5-MTHF
• vitamin B12 as methylcobalamin
• vitamin C
• vitamin A, D, K2 + magnesium
(• SAMe)
(• TMG (betaine))
No. I’d rather take a bunch of B vitamins and methyl donors than nuke my DHT levels and boost my estradiol. Many of them can be taken together and are quite cheap to source. All of them all essential for methylation (except the ones in brackets, since your body can synthesize them).
 
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No. I’d rather take a bunch of B vitamins and methyl donors than nuke my DHT levels and boost my estradiol. Many of them can be taken together and are quite cheap to source. All of them all essential for methylation (except the ones in brackets, since your body can synthesize them).
Yeah ok fella. You’re not losing much hair so of course you can cope with muh vitaminz stopped hairloss. You probably aren’t even a MPB case.


When your hairline approaches NW3 come back and tell the legit norwoodcels how some b6 vitamin stopped your MPB

Fucking retarded cucks
 
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I actually was assembling material about dna methylation rn
 
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Yeah ok fella. You’re not losing much hair so of course you can cope with muh vitaminz stopped hairloss. You probably aren’t even a MPB case.


When your hairline approaches NW3 come back and tell the legit norwoodcels how some b6 vitamin stopped your MPB

Fucking retarded cucks
There’s a lot of people who have reported hair regrowth from increased methylation. Try it yourself before you judge or just leave the thread and keep doing whatever you’re doing. Insulting people won’t regrow your hair, if anything, the increase in cortisol will only accelerate your misery
 
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There’s a lot of people who have reported hair regrowth from increased methylation. Try it yourself before you judge or just leave the thread and keep doing whatever you’re doing. Insulting people won’t regrow your hair, if anything, the increase in cortisol will only accelerate your misery
This guys should check the hair gains protocol posted on the misc at the bodybuilding forum.
The op went frol nw3 to nw0. 10 years ago i was losing 300 to 400 hairs per day. With a protocol similar to yours and dermapem i have this hair now:
 

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Just take a multivitamin theory
 
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This guys should check the hair gains protocol posted on the misc at the bodybuilding forum.
The op went frol nw3 to nw0. 10 years ago i was losing 300 to 400 hairs per day. With a protocol similar to yours and dermapem i have this hair now:
Whats ur protocall bro
 
Whats ur protocall bro
Dermapen once a week. Msm, glucosamine, b complex, zinc, chondroitin, colagen, iodine after dermapen, vitamin c, vitamin e, l-carnitine, astaxantin, omega complex, probiotics, vitamin k, vitamin d.
 
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the methylation has to be carried out by an enzyme though (DNMT family). what happens if there is also a reduced expression of those genes in balding areas, you can throw all the cosubstrates and nothing will happen.

A for effort nevertheless, well-thought threads are a rarity
 
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Dermapen once a week. Msm, glucosamine, b complex, zinc, chondroitin, colagen, iodine after dermapen, vitamin c, vitamin e, l-carnitine, astaxantin, omega complex, probiotics, vitamin k, vitamin d.
jfl ive never heard of these lmao
I thought it was only fin min and cb0301 or ru
where is your source?
very curious
 
lots of androgens but healthy levels of methylation = no hair loss
forgive me if I'm wrong but you want to return your levels of dna methylation to that of a teenager?
Are you sure this is healthy long term for adult males?
 
No. I’d rather take a bunch of B vitamins and methyl donors than nuke my DHT levels and boost my estradiol. Many of them can be taken together and are quite cheap to source. All of them all essential for methylation (except the ones in brackets, since your body can synthesize them).
any reccs for a multivitamin that has all or most of those?
 
forgive me if I'm wrong but you want to return your levels of dna methylation to that of a teenager?
Are you sure this is healthy long term for adult males?
As long as you don’t ingest retarded doses of SAMe, yes. Methylation is incredibly important since it regulates gene expression and is involved in homocysteine metabolism. Prolonged hyperhomocysteinemia is a significant risk factor for cardiovascular disease and deficiency of bioactive B6 and B12 can lead to HHCys. Also, if you have a MTHFR polymorphism, you can’t process synthetic folic acid efficiently. In this case you’d benefit a lot in general from taking this stack.
 
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the methylation has to be carried out by an enzyme though (DNMT family). what happens if there is also a reduced expression of those genes in balding areas, you can throw all the cosubstrates and nothing will happen.

A for effort nevertheless, well-thought threads are a rarity

is there a way to upregulate activity of the enzyme family? or is it impossible and the only way to "fix" balding areas is further downstream in AR pathways?
 
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any reccs for a multivitamin that has all or most of those?
No, you should just get the B vitamins separately, since most B complex formulas don’t contain the right (bioactive) forms and if they do, they’re often underdosed. For A+D, cod liver oil might be enough, depending on your blood levels. Everything else, also separately.
 
This guys should check the hair gains protocol posted on the misc at the bodybuilding forum.
The op went frol nw3 to nw0. 10 years ago i was losing 300 to 400 hairs per day. With a protocol similar to yours and dermapem i have this hair now:

Link to the bb.com thread please
 
@Bewusst

is it possible to get methylation tested by having genome sequenced? then it may be possible to see if there are issues w MTHFR, then taking SAMe alongside B vitamins would be necessary. or is there another way to know?
 
Last edited:
nice so my heightmaxxing stack should prevent mpb?
 
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I mentioned it already but I decided to make a thread about this. I hope you guys appreciate what I‘m about to share with you. I‘m tired of garbage threads.

Hair loss, androgenetic alopecia or male pattern baldness, is not caused by DHT. DHT triggers it but only under a certain circumstance. This circumstance being the loss of androgen receptor gene methylation in hair follicles (study).

What is AR gene methylation?
-> DNA methylation is a biological process of adding a methyl group to DNA.
In this case, adding a methyl group to the CpG island in the promoter region of the androgen receptor gene in hair follicles will reduce its expression. Think of it as an on/off switch and methylation turns gene expression off.

A common characteristic of MPB (male pattern baldness) is that it affects the top of the head (vertex) much more than the back of the head (occiput). This is because vertex hair follicles have much lower levels of methylation than occipital hair follicles and thus are a lot more sensitive to DHT. Occipital hair follicles have twice the amount of methylation, on average. Hence, the occiput is not affected as much from MPB.

If hormones really were to blame (they are not), you‘d see androgenetic alopecia begin in puberty and improve with the decline of men‘s T levels as they age and gain weight. But this isn‘t the case. It usually begins in one‘s mid- to late twenties or later in life and does not resolve on its own.
The real cause of AGA is a gradual decline in DNA methylation, which is also heavily involved in aging and the onset of diseases and cancer in general. So, instead of removing the signal (DHT) from the overactive androgen receptors, we should normalize their expression. If it works in puberty - lots of androgens but healthy levels of methylation = no hair loss - it‘ll work at any age. DHT does not matter. You need it for well-being. No more jewtasteride.

The solution?
-> Increase overall methylation in your body. The methylation cycle requires vitamin B2 (riboflavin), B6 (pyridoxine), B9 (folate) and B12 (cobalamin), methionine and choline. Deficiencies in dietary methyl donors can result in global hypomethylation and accelerate hair loss or the onset thereof.
Make sure to get plenty of all of the above every single day. If you already suffer from hair loss, take supplements. For B6, get pyridoxal-5-phosphate, for B9 L-5-methyltetrahydrofolate and for B12 methylcobalamin.
Make sure to eat enough protein as a source for methionine and to consume enough choline and minerals. Good mineral and trace element sources are unprocessed sugar cane syrup, fruits such as bananas and dates, leafy greens and whole grains.
You can add trimethylglycine (betaine) and S-Adenosylmethionine (SAMe) for a 100% guaranteed increase in methylation. Just make sure not to overdo the SAM, since hypermethylation isn’t your goal either.

Other things apart from methylation support you should be taking are vitamin C (read my guide) and D with its cofactors (A, K2, magnesium).


Tl;dr: If you want to keep your hair, increase methylation.
How? Take:

• riboflavin
• vitamin B6 as P-5-P
• vitamin B9 as L-5-MTHF
• vitamin B12 as methylcobalamin
• vitamin C
• vitamin A, D, K2 + magnesium
(• SAMe)
(• TMG (betaine))
• diet rich in (trace) minerals and with plenty of protein and choline.
Does IGF-1 increases DNA methylation, as it is mentioned in my thread to prevent balding?
 
the methylation has to be carried out by an enzyme though (DNMT family). what happens if there is also a reduced expression of those genes in balding areas, you can throw all the cosubstrates and nothing will happen.

A for effort nevertheless, well-thought threads are a rarity
Do you really believe that reduced DNA MTase activity is the cause for local hypomethylation in hair follicles? Also, Idk which genes you‘re referring to, but if anything, in AGA, the AR gene is overexpressed, not underexpressed.

Even if DNA MTase activity was reduced in people with MPB, the condition still DEVELOPS at some point in one‘s life, often well after puberty is over. Imo, a progressive aging-related decline in overall DNA methylation is more likely to be the issue here and not (exclusively) an inherited variation in DNA MTase activity/synthesis or AR gene expression.

This is all broscience theory at this point but it doesn‘t hurt to try increasing methyl donor count in the body. There‘s lots of anecdotal evidence of people who reported hair regrowth from bioactive folate alone even.
 
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further downstream in AR pathways?

the further downstream, the better. it's a rule of thumb. thaht's why an AR antagonist is better than a 5ARI, which is better than a 17B-HSD inhibitor
 
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nice so my heightmaxxing stack should prevent mpb?
Possibly, but you should replace synthetic folic acid with L-5-MTHF and add the other things as well, since they’re all needed for the methylation cycle
 
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No, you should just get the B vitamins separately, since most B complex formulas don’t contain the right (bioactive) forms and if they do, they’re often underdosed. For A+D, cod liver oil might be enough, depending on your blood levels. Everything else, also separately.
Thorne Basic Nutrients has all the supplements you listed (minus the SAM-e and TMG) all in the correct and active form dosed above the daily value.
 
Thorne Basic Nutrients has all the supplements you listed (minus the SAM-e and TMG) all in the correct and active form dosed above the daily value.
The dosages are still quite low for this purpose. It would be much cheaper to buy them separately. I’d also avoid nicotinamide in supplements, since there are assumptions that high doses of it can deplete methyl donors (especially betaine) and raise homocysteine levels.
 
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Dermapen once a week. Msm, glucosamine, b complex, zinc, chondroitin, colagen, iodine after dermapen, vitamin c, vitamin e, l-carnitine, astaxantin, omega complex, probiotics, vitamin k, vitamin d.
"Iodine after dermapen" - Topical? You happen to know why?

Maybe share the thread that you referred to?
 
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why is every nigga here obsessed with methylation?

good thread nonetheless, the finasteride copers are evidently against your information though, they'll do anything to convince themselves that partial castration is the definitive solution to hair loss.
 
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jfl ive never heard of these lmao
I thought it was only fin min and cb0301 or ru
where is your source?
very curious
Hair gains, bodybuilding forum was my source of info. I but the products on amazon
 
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