The Cure For Hair Loss - The Truth About 5α-Reductase Inhibitors and Topical Anti-Androgens

[chadisbeingmade]

Also I did some searching on this and found a comment on reddit which mentions the MPMD thing you mentioned. Lemme post it right starting after the colon:

Good posts and I agree there is no real evidence that Test causes hair loss. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t. There is a lack of evidence.

He also says “a foolish conclusion” when referencing MPMDs conclusion of Test causing loss yet says “normal physiological levels is not associated with hair loss”. Normal levels sure, maybe, again, lack of evidence, even if slight. MPMD didn’t have normal levels, and neither do I (I roid).

Regardless of that, I don’t see how it makes any practice difference, do you? How does he suppose you deal with said “5ar activity in the dermal papilla”? You have 3 options. Dut (or Fin), RU and potentially topical Dut. I see Dut and RU as the ideal solution regardless especially when you do have supraphysiological test levels. Or fuck it and run all 3.

Again, if that’s the case, then why does finasteride/dutasteride only cycles work?

Fin/dut ONLY stops DHT, not test. In fact, like you said, they increase test since there’s less test converting to DHT. Every study and every doctor says DHT is the culprit for hair loss, not test. Even chad gpt agrees.

Despite above, I do still believe DHT is the MAIN culprit of hair loss. There is no denying that. I still think scalp T will play a part, even if small. I don’t believe what doctors say nor chatgpt. chatgpt tells me a vegan diet is healthy also.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

Good posts and I agree there is no real evidence that Test causes hair loss. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t. There is a lack of evidence.

He also says “a foolish conclusion” when referencing MPMDs conclusion of Test causing loss yet says “normal physiological levels is not associated with hair loss”. Normal levels sure, maybe, again, lack of evidence, even if slight. MPMD didn’t have normal levels, and neither do I (I roid).

Regardless of that, I don’t see how it makes any practice difference, do you? How does he suppose you deal with said “5ar activity in the dermal papilla”? You have 3 options. Dut (or Fin), RU and potentially topical Dut. I see Dut and RU as the ideal solution regardless especially when you do have supraphysiological test levels. Or fuck it and run all 3.

Despite above, I do still believe DHT is the MAIN culprit of hair loss. There is no denying that. I still think scalp T will play a part, even if small. I don’t believe what doctors say nor chatgpt. chatgpt tells me a vegan diet is healthy also.

The importance of dual 5alpha-reductase inhibition in the treatment of male pattern hair loss: results of a randomized placebo-controlled study of dutasteride versus finasteride - PubMed

Dutasteride increases scalp hair growth in men with MPHL. Type 1 and type 2 5alpha-reductase may be important in the pathogenesis and treatment of MPHL.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

1. This Study comparing fin and dut at different doses shows that 2.5 mg of dut increases scalp testosterone by a whopping 222% while 5 mg of fin increases scalp testosterone by only 23%. So if we were to assume testosterone is bad for hair then the 222% increase in scalp T must be terrible. Well turns out despite all that 2.5 mg of dut showed by far the best result out of all treatments and dosages.

All the evidence he provided seems to showcase T has nothing to do with it.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

Good posts and I agree there is no real evidence that Test causes hair loss. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t. There is a lack of evidence.

He also says “a foolish conclusion” when referencing MPMDs conclusion of Test causing loss yet says “normal physiological levels is not associated with hair loss”. Normal levels sure, maybe, again, lack of evidence, even if slight. MPMD didn’t have normal levels, and neither do I (I roid).

Regardless of that, I don’t see how it makes any practice difference, do you? How does he suppose you deal with said “5ar activity in the dermal papilla”? You have 3 options. Dut (or Fin), RU and potentially topical Dut. I see Dut and RU as the ideal solution regardless especially when you do have supraphysiological test levels. Or fuck it and run all 3.

Despite above, I do still believe DHT is the MAIN culprit of hair loss. There is no denying that. I still think scalp T will play a part, even if small. I don’t believe what doctors say nor chatgpt. chatgpt tells me a vegan diet is healthy also.

And again. If T played a role, then why does hair loss medication only lower dht and not T?

It wouldn’t be good if T was a culprit too. DHT may be utter trash, but we definitely need T in our bodies

 

[chadisbeingmade]

And again. If T played a role, then why does hair loss medication only lower dht and not T?

I don’t understand this question, it makes no sense what so ever. They are 5AR inhibitors. Are you trying to say that Fin and Dut are pointless because it causes hair loss anyway due to T? It’s a comical argument. DHT is the main androgen causing hair loss without question, maybe not the only, there’s a lack of evidence as I said, but it’s the main one and it has no purpose in the body. They deal with the main problem. At physiological T levels it’s likely enough. Dut is also not even prescribed for hair loss, it’s off label.

It wouldn’t be good if T was a culprit too. DHT may be utter trash, but we definitely need T in our bodies

Hence the existence of topical anti androgens.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

I don’t understand this question, it makes no sense what so ever. They are 5AR inhibitors. Are you trying to say that Fin and Dut are pointless because it causes hair loss anyway due to T? It’s a comical argument. DHT is the main androgen causing hair loss without question, maybe not the only, there’s a lack of evidence as I said, but it’s the main one and it has no purpose in the body. They deal with the main problem. At physiological T levels it’s likely enough. Dut is also not even prescribed for hair loss, it’s off label

It’s not comical. Why are those two prescribed as hair loss meds if T were also a culprit? Shouldn’t they give you something that lowers T too? Judging by your argument, even if I take a 5AR inhibitor orally by itself, I’m still gonna lose hair since the T is still at play. But the comment showed 5 studies which logically showcase T has nothing to do with it. Like one of those studies said, dut increased scalp T by 200%, yet none of the researchers or anyone using dut report extra hair loss. Anyone who uses fin/dut orally notice hair loss stopping as well as reversing, this just showcases that DHT is the only culprit, testosterone is innocent. Hair loss is studied extensively by scientists, if T was actually a culprit, don’t you think at least one study would mention that?

 

[chadisbeingmade]

Why are those two prescribed as hair loss meds if T were also a culprit?

Maybe because systematically nuking T is retarded asf and not an option what so ever and RU is a research chemical (that showed better results than fin IIRC).

Judging by your argument, even if I take a 5AR inhibitor orally by itself, I’m still gonna lose hair since the T is still at play

Indeed. That is exactly what I believe, especially if you have supraphysiological Test levels.

With your logic eveyone should be 100% safe from the reaper with just Dut, that’s not the case. I’ve read about multiple people progressing on just Dut.

Like one of those studies said, dut increased scalp T by 200%, yet none of the researchers or anyone using dut report extra hair loss.

200% on natty T levels.

Anyone who uses fin/dut orally notice hair loss stopping as well as reversing, this just showcases that DHT is the only culprit, testosterone is innocent.

Definitely not. I have read multiple cases of hair loss progressing while on Dut, normal T.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

200% on natty T levels.

Yeah that’s still a big increase and they didn’t lose hair. Can you explain why?

Definitely not. I have read multiple cases of hair loss progressing while on Dut, normal T.

Then that means they’re losing hair due to telogen efflevium, not AGA lol. The overwhelming majority of people stop hair loss with fin alone. No evidence whatsoever T does anything.

 

[chadisbeingmade]

Yeah that’s still a big increase and they didn’t lose hair. Can you explain why?

Less androgenic.

Then that means they’re losing hair due to telogen efflevium, not AGA lol.

JFL which means they would lose hair on the sides of their head as well. They don’t.

The overwhelming majority of people stop hair loss with fin alone.

Complete cope. Most people maybe halt it for some time on fin but they WILL continue to progress on Fin.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

JFL which means they would lose hair on the sides of their head as well. They don’t.

They prolly do and you just don’t notice. look man, no study or evidence showcases that T is a culprit as well, it’s just fear mongering. You’re dodging so hard. Dutasteride (which you practically worship) increases scalp T by 222%.

Complete cope. Most people maybe halt it for some time on fin but they WILL continue to progress on Fin

Not really since studies show it works + plus. people literally stop hair loss and reverse it even. Anyway, you’ve been on dut right? How do you prevent gyno,

 

[chadisbeingmade]

no study or evidence showcases that T is a culprit as well

I never denied that.

people literally stop hair loss and reverse it even.

yes, and some people continue progress.

Anyway, you’ve been on dut right?

Yes, 2.5mg.

How do you prevent gyno

Never had issues.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

Less androgenic.


JFL which means they would lose hair on the sides of their head as well. They don’t.


Complete cope. Most people maybe halt it for some time on fin but they WILL continue to progress on Fin.

I never denied that.


yes, and some people continue progress.


Yes, 2.5mg.


Never had issues.

What do you think I should do for my case?

 

[chadisbeingmade]

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What do you think I should do for my case?

Just take Dut. If you use steroids I would still 100% use RU as well.

 

[AbuSdanteet]

Just take Dut. If you use steroids I would still 100% use RU as well.

Hmm, well my plan was to start with topical ru only first. What do you think?

 

[chadisbeingmade]

Hmm, well my plan was to start with topical ru only first. What do you think?

RU is best when used with a 5ARi. 5ARi is first line of defence and deals with most of the DHT, then RU deals with any scalp DHT remaining (and any other androgens at the scalp).

 

[AbuSdanteet]

RU is best when used with a 5ARi. 5ARi is first line of defence and deals with most of the DHT, then RU deals with any scalp DHT remaining (and any other androgens at the scalp).

Yeah my plan as a beginner was oral fin + ru and then later on move on to dut if necessary